Interview with Eric "Rick" Abell - Former Chief Engineer for the YF-22, YF-23, and F-22 Programs

From his entry into the USAF as a Civil Servant in 1964 till his retirement in 1997, Mr. Eric "Rick" Abell worked on or led the development and fielding on almost every aircraft and related system in the USAF including the A-7, A-10, F-15, F-16, YF-17, F-117, YF-22, YF-23, F-22, B-1, B-2, and several classified programs. He has also worked extensively with the US Navy and US Army.
www.cwlemoine.com
#YF23
#YF22

[@LRRPFco52]

That was one of the best. There aren’t many guys with that kind of perspective on so many major programs. His ability to cut through the BS is extremely rare.

[@mxcollin95]

For sure!

[@legodragonxp]

I could listen to this guy all day.

[@gavinedgar9464]

instablaster.

[@RTC1655]

Sure, they're called engineers.

[@TorToroPorco]

What an incredibly accomplished and distinguished guest. Great guest Mover!

[@whitenoise509]

"Exploited some technology we found someplace". I can't imagine what it would be like to know the kinds of things this man knows. To be involved in that many bleeding edge projects must be incredible.

[@bernarddugas5251]

I was thinking the same thing What do you think he was taking about. It could the Russians.

[@whitenoise509]

Well since he's being slightly cryptic, the most logical answer is aliens. This is the internet after all.

[@SEA_Hiker]

@@whitenoise509 Agree, he said there were no aliens. He didn't say there was no alien technology :)

[@FirstDagger]

My mind instantly raced to Bob Lazar's Interview. Either way amazing.

[@TTVToxic-yu5ov]

I caught that too. Haha I was thinking alien tech too

[@therocinante3443]

"I make killing machines, and they're both damn fine killing machines."

[@88onewingangel]

As an engineer myself, this speaks to me hardcore. This is truly the life of an engineer, program managing and problem solving. I've always loved hearing the stories and experiences of the senior folks through my career. This is just fantastic.

[@DarrellHaase]

I can't like this enough. Could listen to his stories all day.

[@tomblack9401]

I worked for Rick on F-22 and he is truly one of the most brilliant engineers I have ever known. He and I have back-to-back hangars at I19 and I always enjoy spending time with him.

[@j.d.604]

Do you think Lockheed had Reverse-engineering Program of off-world technology? Hypothetically, if they did... In the early 1990s, is there anyone besides Dan Tellep or Sherman N. Mullin who would have ran the program without their knowing it?

[@TheJustinJ]

@@j.d.604unless that "off-world" is obsessed with Aluminum and Rivets with a smattering of Inconel and Epoxy/Carbon. And their technology is specifically designed to operate exclusively within earths atmosphere where air density is 0.0023769 slugs/ft3 (Air mass is 1.225kg/m3)... Why is it that Mankinds inventiveness is always under scrutiny by people to stupid to comprehend basic engineering principles?

[@jasonsellars8550]

This is may be my favorite interview. I sat here with a goofy grin on my face for 2.5 hours. I wish Ben Rich and Kelly Johnson were still around to talk with Mover. Pilot interviews are great, but adding things like this is awsome.

[@therocinante3443]

Man what a great conversation to listen to. This guy is a treasure trove of information and interesting stories.

[@Flipper-mno13]

"You can't fix that crap, heard a buzzing sound and the engine blew up, whatever you can get away with." I would love to be able to get Rick and Shoes together, throw some ribeyes on the grill and just listen to their stories. As I've said before, age like rank has it's privileges. Great interview Mover. Mondays are becoming my favorite day of the week.👍😉

[@julienvauxion4037]

Wow, that is a (3 decades) slice of US aircraft engineering history. Thank you for sharing this

[@friendofenkidu3391]

Please bring Rick Abell back, and ask him about Boeing's KC-46 tanker fiasco. I'd love to hear his comments. And ask him about his two call signs.

[@mchristr]

Don't believe everything you read in the media. The KC-46 engineering challenges are somewhat similar to those of the 787 in that someone has to pioneer the technology.

[@bradpittman5075]

I am glad Rick was on our team. I hope and pray that there are many more like Rick in there with their heads down. I truly enjoy his perspective. It’s refreshing. No bs.

[@GT-mq1dx]

That was an absolute killer interview, Rick is the kind of guy that I’d buy drinks for all night just to listen to those stories. What a life he’s lead. Thumbs up Mover for that interview.

[@idwalwilliams3713]

Was a top end listen, Hope that can be done again

[@billbrockman779]

So glad to hear him praise General Fogelman, a truly great CSAF. I wrote him a letter of thanks when he resigned over the Khobar Towers tragedy, and he graciously replied with a personal letter back. I was just an ANG NCO.

[@robertstibz9506]

Two and a half hours of entertainment, loved the stories. awesome guy.

[@windell0121]

He has earned the right and has enough experience to walk into any Shop and say "WTF are you doing? Are you nuts??"

[@Daytonaman675]

I couldn’t imagine the balls/ignorance it would take to question this guy in a professional setting.

[@rogerweber8194]

An 1.5 hr in and I can not get enough of this guy. What a treasure.

[@bigdpurser]

WOW. Mover, I love your channel and love when you interview pilots, but this dude takes the cake. This is great. I can tell that this is the type of guy that you would love to sit down and just listen to for hours at a time. Keep up the good work.

[@nuggetz9857]

A very wise man with buckets of style. I could listen to him all day. You can’t buy his sort of experience worth his weight in gold.

[@chm985]

I can't even put into words how much I enjoyed this. Followed the yf-22 and YF-23 from the 90's to the present. Any tidbit of info is just great. Just awesome to here new things 😀

[@SAV1ish]

I dont know if I said this. but Eric Abell has become my inspiration as an Engineer. He reminded me what it is to be an engineer and why I do what I do. I resonate with him that its not about the papers but it is about intuition and networking.

[@MojoKc2244]

"This Guy" , " This Guy." Wow Mover where did you find this Guy ? "This Rick Guy" hay. Is what my God Father said when we watched this interview . This was 3 life times rolled into 1. Rick should definitely write a book. Now that would be a great retirement plan. Thank you for sharing. This was awsome.

[@h2otek312]

One of the finest interviews I have ever seen.

[@radcliffw]

As a former defense contractor, I loved this video/interview. The stories are so true across the entire DoD/Federal government about how programs go wrong, how things go wrong, and how smart people can finally get it right.

[@Scoobydcs]

I would literally listen to this guy all day long and I'm not joking. Fantastic hearing guys like this

[@bsd107]

FANTASTIC podcast episode! I wish this could have gone for another 2.5 hours. THANK YOU for giving this guy all the time you did to tell these fascinating stories!

[@the_metalist2221]

Magnificent video! I could listen to Rick's experiences for days. It's difficult to wrap my head around what he's specifically looking for in aircraft development, but I see eye to eye with his functionality driven approach.

[@thatsworrisome]

My dad, godfather and father-in-law were all involved in the pre-design of the YF-22 so this was a very interesting interview for me Thanks 👍

[@bushyiscool2]

This has to be one of the BEST interviews I have ever seen! I am soo glad you were able get Rick on the channel. What stuff he must have seen or know about that he still can't say about just fascinates me.

[@moorera364]

That was absolutely incredible. Mr. Abell thank you very much for sharing, very engaging and inspiring career. It is so nice to hear another side of the story for legendary aircraft and engines. Thanks Mover for hosting the forum to allow us learn about this history we might not otherwise hear about!

[@mickeyargo]

Love hearing the old terms MAC, TAC, and SAC. Reminds me of how the different commands interpret regulations...in SAC, if the regs don't say you can, you can't; In TAC, if the regs don't say you can't, you can; In MAC, they really weren't sure what the regs said and just did what they wanted. I had to take over a former MAC office after a BRAC and was shocked at some of the things they were doing!

[@friendofenkidu3391]

I worked at Northrop’s Century City headquarters in Los Angeles back in the early 2000s. That was years after the USAF picked the YF-22, but many of my colleagues at work had been there during the competition with Lockheed. What I heard was that Northrop was confident they had the better airplane. The YF-23 was faster and more stealthy compared to the YF-22. The main advantage of the YF-22 was that it was more maneuverable in a close-in dogfight, which my Northrop colleagues felt was less important in modern air combat. When the announcement was made that Lockheed’s YF-22 had won the competition, the reaction at Northrop was stunned disbelief. They attributed the loss to a bunch of aging fighter jocks at the USAF who wanted to preserve their air-fighting heritage no matter what they had to sacrifice.

[@ThomisticAmerican13FOX]

This seems to have some weight to it. I have heard the same thing over the years.

[@deantait8326]

I’ve watched a couple of videos from the YF-23 Northrop’s perspective and they were understandably upset and disappointed. Like’Rick’ says in this interview, both are ‘Good’, each has it’s benefits and minuses. Pick-em. As he also mentioned, ‘They’ had to make sure both were acceptable and good. Unlike a time when the air force absolutely wanted a Boeing plane and were basically told, (no political pressure in the DOD/Pentagon ) says no you want the other plane, understand. At least both of these options were excellent. It’s a shame (politics dictated) the F-22 run was cut off cold.

[@luztictv]

Hi Mover, a big thank you putting Light on Awsome Rick before we all lose opportunity to hear his Stories! This video is a great example that most talented engineers are still staying in the Shadow building the seats where only few others will reach Stars: every step is important in building History! Legendary Aircraft and Airplanes (B-52, A-10, F-14, F-15, F-16, F-117, A-12/SR-71, F-22, F-35, B-2...) are Legends not only because of test pilots who risked their lives running them (Chuck Yeager, Alan Shepard, Virgil Grissom, Edward White, Roger Chaffee, Michael Collins, Edwin "Buzz" Aldrin, Neil Armstrong...). Any pilot on Duty around the World are still sitting in Airplanes those engineers built! Fly safe

[@NightOwlModeler]

I prefer watching the full videos... even if they're 2.5 hours long! Thanks, this was GREAT!

[@kevinhedspeth4303]

Great guest!! I really enjoyed getting the "behind the scenes" perspective on these various programs.

[@needmofishin5765]

Brilliant interview... "Do I have to do that?"... "No."... "Well I ain't doin that."... "Well then I'll sign you off."

[@jjbloon]

As an aspiring aerospace engineer, it's awesome to hear from these guys. Can't wait to get on their level.

[@MikeJamesMedia]

I could listen to Mr. Abell, or others with similar experience, all day, anytime! What a great guy, and obviously a brilliant engineer. Thank you, thank you, thank you!

[@themisterXbr]

As an Engineering student, I would love to buy a book from Rick. Astonishing interview Mover.

[@JasperFromMS]

That was awesome!!! I learned a lot of the things he said the hard way over the years. "Do what you think is right. If you make a mistake, there is always someone around who will point it out to you."

[@paststeve1]

Thanks Mover and Rick! I had a blast listening to Rick's stories and watched the WHOLE episode in one sitting. GREAT INTERVIEW!

[@ryanchrch]

One of the best interviews ever on this or any other channel- thank you!! Incredible insights from an amazing career-

[@gumbomudderx7503]

I could listen to this guy talk all day long. Great guest Mover!

[@matkodoris9099]

Eric “Rick” E. Abell, Technical Director (Chief Engineer) of the Air Force ATF System Program Office (SPO). Wow!

[@aaronzeiger216]

I love this guy. BEST. INTERVIEW. EVER.

[@BuceGar]

"It's going to MAKE gas when it goes on a mission." ROFL!

[@byronmiller3877]

stfu pantheon

[@xprettylightsx]

ROFL! I died laughing

[@OpinionatedMatt]

Damn I would have loved for someone to ask what he thinks about the Su-57 and J-20, especially what does he think the role of the J-20 should be given what we know about the plane. And also what makes building engines so damn hard. Also what he thinks about the Su-27 and Mig-29 since he worked on the F-15 and F-16.

[@jmf5246]

Reminds me of my late father in law who led radar development at Rome Labs at Griffiss Air Force Base during the cold war. These engineers were outstanding in every way.

[@pete-m86]

Mentions anything related to military aircraft. "I'll tell you a funny story about that". This is GOLD

[@Sup3r6f0ur]

This guy is hilarious. I think I could listen to him tell stories all day 🤣🤣🤣

[@hawgbreath]

Massive props for Rick! Thanks for the work he’s done for keeping this country safe and and on the bleeding edge of aircraft technology!👍

[@panosgatsoulias5155]

This is an amazing interview, really one of a kind! Very difficult to find an engineer of this caliber of history and get him to tell his story.

[@SuperPress23]

2,5 hours flu by, awsome stories. Thanks alot.

[@daledassel5658]

One of the best interviews ever! From a retired AF jet technicianB52/F16 et al. Thanks Rick and Mover!!

[@dougstitt1652]

Mr Abell is a kick in the pant what a smart funny guy thx good interview. could listen to him for few more hours !

[@TylerLL2112]

This was a fantastic watch. I can't believe I've missed it for this long.

[@AcrodesignerLNSNI]

Omg, that was a golden episode. As an engineer and pilot myself that was a huge insight in how this programs and people work. Thanks Mover for getting Rick talking unrestricted for so long and getting the full story. Loved this episode 👍👍👍

[@mxcollin95]

This dude is a national treasure!

[@mikem.s.1183]

Stunning career with the sheer amount of a/c development he participated in. Amazing.

[@vitor2650]

Mover, this was one your best interviews and you hardly had to ask a question.

[@timb8095]

That was amazing, just when you think you’ve done a bit in your life, someone comes along and gives you some perspective.

[@robert273083]

I could listen to his stories all day. That was awesome. Thank you

[@kenhelmers2603]

Mr. Abell - thank you for spending this time and sharing with us!

[@johnb7490]

Wow!!!!!!!!! I just couldn't stop listening. The stories he couldn't tell.

[@mrstyle_67]

Outstanding video and story , thank You , Mr. "Rick" Abel and the others mentioned that were involved in all that secured our Country's Safety and Freedom!

[@do8472]

Pure gold. Thanks so much for preserving and sharing these stories.

[@Sidekick65]

I worked for NASA (as a contractor) for 25 years and for a national aerospace trade association for 6 more. I close my eyes when I listen to Rick and I hear every senior engineer I ever worked with. I did not work on any of these programs. But I fee like I worked on them all. What a treat! Thanks Mover !

[@RedShirt230]

That was one of the most amazing things I've heard. What a fascinating man.

[@sfv1001]

This had me hooked in the first 5 minutes listening to this guy. Awesome!

[@flypaddyo]

Never thought I would listen to entire 2:30 but just fascinating stories. Rick is a character!

[@chadharris7648]

Best series of these geniuses of aviation. Love it. This could be 5 hours and I’d listen.

[@ronneglia5164]

What an incredible and fascinating guy. Great interview Mover!

[@HKSTurboBRZ]

My favorite interview, I keep coming back to listen to this. So interesting and inspiring

[@Rapsaj]

This interview is riveting from the first second! I absolutely love it!!!!

[@robbinneymar2190]

this was a great listen, what an awesome guest!

[@terryboyer1342]

Could listen to Rick all day! Should write a book.

[@carlosniebla7534]

I love how he was so happy to tell us his storys. Hope he Will still ve around

[@beautoner]

Took 4 nights to watch it all. Really great interview! Mr. Abell's a treat to listen to. Thank you both!

[@jqmachgunner2577]

Mover, one of your best and riveting shows yet!!! Instead of fluff and nonsense found on other channels by former military pilots, you always bring meat to the table served on the bullseye.

[@Simon-Zephyr]

Very interesting to hear the perspective of an engineer behind these machines rather than the pilot’s Love it !

[@chrisperrine6905]

One of my favs so far. As an Air Force Fighter Acquisition and Engineering guy this was particularly interesting to me. I may cite this interview in future Acquisition training courses.

[@lynnecheermom]

Very impressive interview! Great memory recall! What life experiences! Entertaining and knows how to tell a life story.

[@race22crew4]

Amazing interview. As stated we were completely locking in listening to what he had to say, the time flew by. Rick you SHOULD write a book. Thank you sir. Great segment Mover!!

[@LetrflyAZ]

Rick was Awesome! Great interview!

[@fjb5894]

Watched this twice all the way through both times. Great stories!

[@talagompie]

What an awesome interview! Cheers from South Africa

[@joelzimmerman2462]

What a great interview! The J-85/CJ-610 was the best turbojet I’ve ever flown. Good move “Mover”!

[@BullittGT40]

What an incredible interview! A lot of great insight to our favorite aircraft and the challenges involved.

[@jeffnewman7587]

Love this interview! Absolute best. What a great story teller and experiences!

[@dadomma]

THIS WAS BRILLIANT!!! loved the interview, the stories and insight!! you don't have to be a piliot!! what an awsome guy and just amazing storyies!! would love more like it!! thanks Rick and Mover!

[@lonegunmanx1824]

As an engineer in aviation for 30 years I love this guy!!! Well in the major sub tier supplier to aviation at any rate

[@HilltopGardensMI]

What a story. I did not want this to end.

[@bernarddugas5251]

The best interview , it was great, loved it, this is the reson, I watch.

[@daledassel5658]

Retired Air Force here. Love this guy! Great stories. Could listen all day.

[@pongokamerat8601]

Really enjoyed listening to Rick!

[@Klyce]

Who the heck dislikes a video like this? This is amazing!

[@chrishoag9702]

Best interview yet, and you’ve had some good ones. His brilliance in seeing through all the red tape, and his willingness to keep such a calm attitude speaks volumes to his success amongst many other things. Could sit and listen to him speak all day. Thanks again! Just awesome!

[@jimbrown5268]

Hey Mover, saw you on aircrew interview. Love your work. This interview was awesome, I love hearing from the old school guys, it reminds me of how little I know, and to respect these guys.