Intro to VNT Turbo Boost Control | Variable Nozzle Turbochargers [GOLD WEBINAR LESSON]

[@popomomo12]

Another reason I love HPA. I have a Garrett 6.7 vgt turbo that I've always wanted to put to use

[@ruudvisser720]

Again what is left out is the VNT turbo is there in support for the EGR system so the TVA valve in the inlet manifold dos not have to run overtime as closing the vanes on the VNT/turbine side will create exhaust manifold pressure able to push some exhaust gas to the engine inlet side still able to maintain wanted inlet manifold pressure as well. MAF is there in support to the EGR system and is NOT needed if the EGR system is not used and MAP can be used just as easy so if your VNT turbo affects volumetric efficiency you clearly did not set-up your activator travel correct. A VNT can have 3 running modes. Normal modus controlling manifold pressure. EGR modes control of EGR flow in combination with EGR valve and TVA valve and it can be used for engine breaking on some models as well and we for rally use, use it to keep the turbo on boost while breaking off power so in all better engine response just by closing the vanes on the VNT to a point that will make this possible. As last do not try to aim for manifold pressure targets that can not be supported by the fuel quantity injected on part load for example as this will be resulting in the VNT closing for the most part on mid to hi RPM. Less fuel makes less power less exhaust gas volume! General rule is if the VNT is open hitting set boost target it has to stay open while running more RPM. If the VNT start closing after this point your eider not running the fuel quantity to maintain your boost target or your setting you boost target to hi running your turbo off the flowmap unable to the deliver the air mass wanted.

[@MikeyAntonakakis]

Just got a VGT Holset HE351VE installed in my M20-powered 325i, electonically controlled over CAN using a boost target table... great timing for this video! One thing though, at the beginning of the video you mention that the vanes can be used to control boost, but also that this topic isn't diesel-specific; but with VNT on a gas engine, you most definitely need a wastegate for boost control once then engine is operating efficiently (on my M20, past about 4500rpm the wastegate is controlling boost even with the vanes fully open at supposedly 26cm^2!).

[@MikeyAntonakakis]

@7:45 since my engine is wildly more efficient when it comes on the cam (low compression, 2-valve single-cam, moderately aggressive cam 280/280 - AFR-corrected VE ranges from ~60% at idle to 110% at peak torque), it has a HUGE relative range of air flow compared to a diesel, I'd imagine - I am accounting for this by reading the ECU's boost duty cycle over CAN into a microcontroller, and using the microcontroller to modify the signal based on RPM. I treat the boost duty signal as a relative-to-rpm demand (from 0-100%), and I implemented a lookup table/map to limit the "most-closed" position of the vanes. In practice, with a realistic boost target map, tuning has been pretty straightforward - start conservative with the RPM-based minimum vane position map and target boost map - turn up the target boost if the engine hits the easy targets, and start decreasing the minimum-allowed vane position at that RPM (at lower RPM especially, once the engine comes onto the cam it'll boost to wastegate pressure with no problem). You pretty quickly hear/feel if you hit the surge limit, or if you start choking the engine. I've done zero tuning on the actual PID gains, and in fact I have the boost control set to "simple" mode which masks the individual gains behind a single "aggressiveness" slider. I imagine the "ideal" tuning would be heavily proportional - this would allow pretty aggressive minimum positions, but once the turbo begins to spool, it's easy to choke the engine (at low RPM WOT, lifting the throttle slightly with my current moderately-aggressive vane tuning decreases the boost target enough to start opening the vanes, and I get a sudden increase in torque). With the proportional tuning correct such that you get max demand at a little over atmospheric pressure, the vane position would hopefully edge along right next to that choke point...

[@jareknowak8712]

You have 110% VE on M20 head?

[@MikeyAntonakakis]

@@jareknowak8712 not sure how accurate the number is, but that's what in my fuel map at 160kPa MAP. I use Megasquirt, and compensate for AFR target in the fuel calculation, and the tune in that region is right on target AFR with open loop fueling. There's room for errors across the board especially with injector characterization. But M20 head is a pretty good design, and I have a good cam installed, and equal-length tubular turbo manifold (and with the VGT fully open, very little exhaust restriction). So it's not totally impossible. The point I was getting at though is the range from idle to peak torque under boost is HUGE.

[@incolink]

I've been able to control boost ok my SR20 TR3076 VGT with no wastgates infact I've found it easier with out one I have a flange welded but not drilled I suspect at higher boost it might run away I'm at about 26 psi so far..

[@incolink]

@@jareknowak8712 the lower exhaust pressure he is getting is probably to blame for that miracle..

[@JWorldAdventures]

Fantastic content once again guys!👍

[@rotort]

Excellent info as always man Thank you

[@hpa101]

Cheers for watching, hope it helps you out somewhere somehow one day =D - Taz.

[@forgottenknowledge8917]

For those in TDI cars, turn the EGR off. It messes with the map sensor and you lose boost.

[@boostaddict_]

Good video, always good to be able to find more information. I have a bit of an uncommon situation, I'm planning to build a compound setup with a VNT as the small/high pressure turbo and a wastegated turbo as the low pressure turbo. Was planning to figure out how to use stock management for the VNT and mechanical control for the wastegated turbo, but I'd be curious to see if you have any recommendations. I saw that GFB sells a mechanical VNT controller, would that be a good option?

[@Zionslayer1]

Thanks for the free, not free lesson. What is better, VNT or Quick Spool Valve?

[@danielmiller4385]

thx the 89 dodge shelby csx-vnt first use !

[@hpa101]

Think Honda might have been first in a production car, but no doubt in motorsports usage will go back earlier than both Honda and Dodge - Taz.

[@SayWhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat]

Never seen VNT values higher then 75%

[@Huskydog78]

Great vid as always. My gold membership has lapsed so cant ask on the HPA forum.. In the case of factory ECU tuning (specifically SID209 on Ford P5AT) and simple type actuator, is there a means of setting the minimum and maximum vane position? Or is that calibrated into the actuator relevant to turbo min/max flow? If EGR is disabled, would the increased exhaust flow to turbine mess with the back pressure if the actuator has a factory flow calibration? Cheers

[@incolink]

On a petrol VGT I've found EMap as a primary axis the easiest way to do it .. I'm also finding delta EMap and delta map as a third axis reduces the need for PID ..

[@MikeyAntonakakis]

"EMap" being boost target minus MAP? Or?

[@incolink]

@@MikeyAntonakakis EMAP being exhaust Manifold Absolute Pressure..as the rpm increases the engine is more tolerant of it ..and a given EMAP max has yielded a max IMAP if about 8psi more

[@stu962]

Great to see what can be done with a servo motor but if you simply have a solenoid, ie on off control what Tuning can be done!!?

[@highwaltage]

i tried doing this with emanage blue on jz back in 2011. lol. failed. couldnt use the vvti tables to do anything only pulling 7volts. instead of 12...

[@e.t.k10]

Awesome video as always. I Have a small question. Going from a Vacuum actuatored vnt turbo to a boost control actuator. In particular the zd30ddti vnt system on the y61 nissan patrol to help control the spiking boost curves.

[@bennyjahmin3953]

Check out the 'magic box' thread on the patrol4x4 forum. It is a stand alone unit that control the vacuum solenoid. The guy that developed it was designing for the 3.0l patrol but can be used for any vnt turbo controlled by a vac sol. He has just started selling them and is very helpful with questions. Unlike this approach his product is designed to maximise air into engine in all driving situations not just keep boost numbers on your gauge stable under full throttle so you think you have control.

[@rafailakos]

I've got a 2009 Nissan Navara D40 YD25 with the Garrett gt2056v turbo using pneumatic actuator.This runs a solenoid valve.Can I use the GFB VNT boost controller instead?

[@odnumreydulutan503]

I have toyota landcruiser 2011 model..i bought it without the two turbocharger..so i decided to buy two pcs. Of turbocharger assembly..after installing it, the vehicle did not start.. It has gas at the common rail, i found out that the 8 injectors didnot work.. P1259-P1262 vnt position sensor low bank 2 sensor 1 and 2 .. Is this trouble code related to the no start engine? Or it has deep trouble? Did i need to program the ecm after replacing the two turbocharger? Thanks in anvance for the answer... Godbless..pls. email your reply.

[@brymanable]

Good day mate 👍 like your videos Q: how can I DIY add & tune my 2KD with the VNT turbo ? Thanks 🙏🏽

[@kennethlomibao4045]

Can I use boost controller in vnt turbo? thank you

[@Akya2120]

Can a Haltech operate a VNT controller?

[@odnumreydulutan503]

Can i ask question sir about the vnt position sensor?

[@OcramArieiv]

Hi! I have a Nissan Patrol 2.8 TD and I adapted a VNT Turbo , and to control the pressure I applied a pressure actuator from a fixed geometry turbo. There is any way to control better a VNT turbo in an old car? Is there an ECU just to control the Turbo VNT? Thank you. By the way, excellent video.

[@BigGroupHug]

You could try a VW N57 valve off an older TDI to control the amount of vacuum applied to the VNT actuator.

[@hermanmartin4585]

marco what turbo did you use on your 2.8? and what actuator did you use? Im looking at putting a gtb2056v from an iveco on my rd28.

[@stevenleyson728]

our Fortuner have a VNT on the new 2KD-FTV KUN-60 2nd gen fortuner

[@Pjmperez01]

Are this turbo tech same as Porsche’s VTG?

[@manitoublack]

Sly snow board in the racks on the back

[@hpa101]

Good spotting. This is Ben's daily and in the winter he generally detours up the mountain to do some splitboarding on the way to work - Taz.

[@jareknowak8712]

Afair Porsche was the first manufacturer of petrol engines with VGT. And it was not so long ago, maybe 15 years or so.

[@jareknowak8712]

High EGT in petrol/gas engines was the reason why VGT was used first in TD engines and much later in gas engines.

[@lutherblissett9070]

@@jareknowak8712 The Peugeot 405 T16 had a VGT - gasoline engine.

[@jareknowak8712]

@@lutherblissett9070 i did not knew it. Thank You!

[@SoulEnlightt]

Is it me or those your voice sound hurt dude? Take care of it if thats the case talking non stop on these webinars will definetely tax your voice... I just started the efi fundamentals course thanks for that huge price you guys gave us :)

[@hpa101]

While he's never going to star in a musical, Andres vocals are all good. Cheers for asking :D He does his best to look after himself - Taz.

[@hpfza]

So that would mean intermittent turbo lag could be caused by sticky vains... Great.

[@HSKFabrications]

Croikey

[@hpa101]

Strewth!

[@d1zguy864]

I love how diesels sound like old pieces of crap

[@hpa101]

The 1KD is hardly cutting edge to be fair, but they do have their own unique sound. That said, our Duramax which probably puts out 6 times the power of the engine used here is very quiet, almost like someone forgot to fit a part specifically to just rattle around in it by comparison - Taz.