Is it bad when the FAA shows up for your checkride?

It's every pilot's nightmare: at the most challenging moment, the FAA shows up to add even more stress and scrutiny. It happened to me! On my instrument checkride, my designated pilot examiner was joined by an FAA representative who observed the entire process, both oral and flight.
It was nerve-wracking to say the least!

[@regionalflyer]

I can tell you from experience that it is, obviously, much more stressful with a fed observer. However, sometimes it works in your favor. My last fed observed ride (a Part 135 Falcon 2000 PIC type) was saved by the fed. The examiner was asking ridiculous questions regarding the temperature trip for every overheat and fire indication. The fed eventually stepped in and warned him to stop going down that line of questioning and that it was completely unnecessary to know those temperatures so long as I know what to do about them. Huge amount of respect for him for that. I don't know how many checkrides I have had at this point in my career, but that one was noticeably different from every other ride I've taken. My only other fed rides were from me myself getting check airman observations. Standardization is important, if you think you need to change the way you administer checkrides because someone is watching you then you shouldn't be administering them.

[@halb37]

Good point on standardization. When with AA I regularly flew F100 turnarounds to OKC (FAA hdqs) and it seemed like an Air Carrier Inspector was on every other leg, either going to DFW to start his checks or returning home. While I was technically not getting a check ride the Inspector had enforcement powers over my crew. I made a point to fly as routinely as I ever did. Did not change one item from when the jumpseat was empty. Even had Inspectors on board once for weather divert and an inflight emergency and didn't let their presence affect one decision. Do it correctly as possible...all the time.

[@squelchedotter]

Probably the guy himself got spooked by the FAA thinking he was going to be too lax

[@chucksherron]

@@squelchedotter agreed.

[@charleseinarson]

I was asked by my 141 school if I would be ok with the FAA riding along on my instrument ride. They said I was chosen because I was expected to do well and not get anxious. The weather was too bad to fly and the FAA rescheduled with a different student the next day. I was never so happy to be grounded!

[@joshmc]

If I had a choice I’d say no! Haha but in reality I was ok with it - has to happen to someone, better me than someone on a career track where a bust could affect them.

[@andrewj9831]

Why would you need to "ok" the FAA to come along? The FAA doesn't need your OK to ride along, they tell you what they want to do. I think if you say no, they can just cancel the ride. That would properly make the FAA go through everything with a fine tooth comb and a much deeper oral/practical exam. I had FAA ramp check me as he was just passing thru back to his office. My advice is don't give the FAA a reason to look further then they need to...

[@charleseinarson]

@@andrewj9831 simple. It is my check ride and if I don’t want the extra stress, I don’t need to allow it. I am not their employee and did not ask for them to be my examiner or participate in my flight. Why do you think I should simply accept them saying they are coming along?

[@andrewj9831]

@@charleseinarson so piss off the person who can decide if the DPE who's signing off your check ride can sign it off? The DPE gets their "designated" PE from the FAA Inspector/FSDO You could have a flawless check, and that FAA inspector says Charles did this wrong as he's watching you fly from the ground. He waits until the DPE sends in the paperwork, and he flags it, and decides not to approve it. That's why you get a temp certificate. Most FAA Inspectors are decent, but some are not.... they are there not to grade you directly, they are there to make sure the DPE are doing their roles correctly, as that inspector (or their co-worker) signed off on the DPE.

[@garyhallii61]

That’s not how that works lol

[@joshh2705]

Hey man, while you should always contact the tower after being switched, don't beat yourself up about it. I work at a busy airport where airline captains forget to check in fairly frequently. That's part of the reason why the tower is there, and it's our job to reach out if we don't hear from you. Realistically you were following your priorities and flying first. Congrats on the IFR rating.

[@joshmc]

Hey, thanks so much for the great encouragement! It’s great to hear from folks on the other end of the radio. You gave me a smile, have a great day!

[@joshmc]

Realizing I said “great” 3 times in one post ha

[@AndrewFlyGuy]

Like Josh said, sure you forgot to call tower, but at least you were doing things in order. Aviate, Navigate, then Communicate. Glad you got it on the 2nd time around. Congrats!!

[@andreinarangel6227]

If the pilot fails to check-in expeditiously give him the "Brasher" and slap him with a PD. I do - failure to maintain comm in Class B!!!

[@joshh2705]

@@andreinarangel6227 was the pilot in this case in a class B? I don’t think so. No need to get ahead of yourself.

[@grayvidz238]

Hi Josh. I’m a CFII and wanted to share that there is no ACS bullet for contacting tower within a specific time frame. In fact, the DPE is required to inform you the second you fail and provide you the option to continue or end. I would be calling the FSDO if a student of mine failed under those circumstances. Congrats on the rating!

[@s18thomas]

Sir, isn’t telling a person that he failed in the middle of the flight cause a few people to become so emotional that they may not be able to fly the plane? Wouldn’t it be better to wait to tell till they are on the ground and safe?

[@grayvidz238]

@@s18thomas there's an important distinction here. The examiner will typically inform the applicant they have failed and pose the question. If the student becomes emotional, the examiner will fly the plane to return to the airport. At the beginning of every check ride, the examiner will read a script that includes the possible outcomes for the ride: approved, discontinued, disapproved. Any student entering the exam knows that disapproval was possible. Thanks for the question!

[@s18thomas]

@@grayvidz238 Wow! In fact I should be the one thanking you , Sir for the answer!!! Truly appreciated....I forgot the fact that the examiner can always take over the controls.... Here's wishing you a lifetime of blue skies, tailwinds and happy landings!!

[@Khaled-ll9sd]

@@s18thomas Also, the student is paying for the flight. If they were disapproved, it might be best to tell them right away so they could at least save a little money.

[@MrXtachx]

He might have busted a delta by entering it without contacting the tower first. Thats the failure really but the mood of the checkride helps a lot with these kinds of things. If you know that your DPE is rooting for you to pass; its a different atmosphere than having the FAA observe and judge you and your DPE on the checkride.

[@propertymanagement7011]

The DPE failed too. He is supposed to inform you right away when you failed a task.

[@joshmc]

That’s what I’ve always heard, but it seems like that’s not always how it plays out.

[@propertymanagement7011]

@@joshmc He is supposed to give you the option of continuing the check ride or stopping. If you continue you can accomplish more and will make the re test shorter. You should complain. Your DPE failed!

[@blimpcommander1337]

This is correct and as far as I know it is in the rules. They are to inform you at the time of a failure. It can then be discussed if they are ending the ride or if they are going to allow you to continue with the rest of the ride. If he had to ask the ASI then the DPE should have also failed his check. I’m not against anyone, but rules are rules.

[@DarbyGBauer]

Sounds to me like the DPE was going to pass you but the FAA felt otherwise.

[@vgrof2315]

The FAA guy was more interested in the DPE's performance than in yours. I read recently that within the first 17 days of SEPT, 22, in the US, there were 18 fatal GA accidents/35 fatalities. Most of those accidents were the result of pilot error or bad judgement. GA aviation insurance has become more and more expensive lately because of claim payouts (rightfully so). The underlying problem is generally poor flight instruction and lax DPE performance. The FAA has little choice but to tighten up the whole system. I doubt that they will have much effect, however. How do you improve GA pilot judgement and reduce error rates? Somehow the insurance companies have to put the hammer down HARD, especially with young and low time pilots. Tough to do without shutting down GA which may result regardless. The GA community, government and civil/commercial groups, are in over their heads. Stay tuned. The unacceptable fatal accident rate, especially affecting innocent passengers and bystanders, is not going to change in spite of all the YT accident analysis. The whole thing is very disturbing to an old, retired aviator like me.

[@lynnew4111]

Thank you so much for your balanced, humble and calm presentation. I bet that’s how you fly, too. Congrats.

[@joshmc]

Thank you!

[@riccixjean]

Congrats on your instrument rating! Stay current and establish safe personal minimums and you will stay alive. The fact that you see the experience as a learning opportunity and have take aways to be more safe shows that you have a good mindset. You want to learn and get continuously better. That will serve you well in your many flying years to come! Congrats again and keep the blue side up!

[@joshmc]

I appreciate the comments and perspective, thank you!

[@CrosswindSurfer]

Hey, Josh I really reaaaaaally needed this video. I failed my private last Dec. For many reasons out of my control but it absolutely devastated me. I didnt quit... but I had to take a big breath and a bit of a break (my bank account literally kissed me) Im on the course to get back into the left seat, and complete my PPL check. The pain of a FAIL is indescribable, however, you get faced with 2 options. Push on, become stronger, and beat your fear, your pride, and love yourself for not giving up, or quitting....... OR, quit. Fuck quitting. :)

[@juarez456]

Hey Josh, Thanks for sharing your story, I do agree that having the FAA show up on your check ride can be nerve racking. I had the same thing happened on my Single engine Commercial check ride back in 2017 and happened to be the FIRST day when the ACS was implemented on checkrides from the PTS. It definitely got the mood shifted more on the serious for the check ride and I also got the same words as “The FAA guy and I will be inside talking and will be with you when we can” and that got me even more nervous but when I went back inside I was awaited by both the DPE and the FAA inspector to congratulate me and had my temp certificate waiting for me to sign. FAA inspectors always made me nervous and on this day was no exception but now flying for the airlines and being prone to having a FAA inspector on my jumpseat on random occasions to evaluate both my the pilot and I has gotten me not be nervous about them anymore. They are the same people as we all pilots are and at one point they also were being evaluated on Checkrides and such so they know what is the feeling of being evaluated. Mistakes happen to everyone and I could of easily been on your shoes making the same mistake but learning from them is what makes you a safer pilot. Congrats on your IR!!

[@joshmc]

Thank you, and thanks for sharing your story. I started learning to fly with the ACS firmly in place, but from what I hear the transition was choppy.

[@MarcPagan]

From a CFI/former airline pilot ...thanks for an interesting video. Many moons ago when I taught full-time, NY State and the DC area stopped letting DPEs do initial CFI checkrides. Result: I got quite a few new would-be CFI's as students here in Florida, traveling from the North. DPE 1 1/2 hour oral, and 2 hour max checkride. Direct with FAA 3 hour oral, 3 hour+ checkride.

[@Lincolnpark2735]

Hi Josh - congrats on passing your instrument. Lesson learned. I'm getting ready to do my ATP check and am very nervous - you actually helped me know that if I do fail it, I just get back in the plane and repeat what I missed. Lessons learned on a checkride so they don't have to be learned when more is at stake. Thanks

[@joshmc]

Thank you, and best of luck!

[@michaelcrawford4756]

My instrument and multi engine instrument were both done by a FAA inspector. I failed my first multi engine instrument but a week later redid my ride with same FAA inspector and passed. It was all a great learning experience

[@bubbaoriley7864]

When you're young you dread the checkrides and don't sweat the medicals. When you get older it works the other way.

[@kohersh]

Great video my man. I blew my ME checkride...at my home airport of 20+ years, by of all things- busting airspace that I know by heart. EGO DINGER! But as is your case and mine it improves us by leaving an indelible mark that we may share with others. Great job finishing strong and congratulations on obtaining your instrument rating. See you out there

[@joshmc]

You nailed it, an indelible mark we and others will learn from. Thanks!

[@davidrobins4025]

Congratulations on your success. Well done.

[@jmedlin6]

Congratulations! Of all the aviation videos I've watched on KZbin, I finally stumbled upon one at my local airport.

[@Jhardage62]

I had the FAA show up for my private oral and ride. I was told the night before and given the option to reschedule but I wanted to get it over with. The guy from the FAA was real nice and cut my DPE off at the three hour mark on the oral saying "He's fine, let's go fly". You will definitely get a thorough ride when the FAA is tagging along but if you are prepared and don't forget what you know due to the added stress then you will do just fine. I would say it's easier to pass without them in the back seat though. When I did my instrument ride with the same DPE it was much more relaxed sans the FAA watching.

[@allantotti]

We're always so hard on ourselves during these checkrides, aren't we? I have done plenty of them having failed one (busted my altitude, pressed the VS/Alt acquire but it didn't couple and I didn't check - tunnel vision just like you). When I am under pressure, especially during steep cockpit gradients like that, I get into my own cone of silence and fly as if there is no one with me. It works really well but experience is required to get to that point. Good on you mate, you took a good lesson out of it. Thanks for sharing your experience.

[@robertborchert932]

Congratulations, Josh! Just subscribed. It's always fun when a few wrenches are thrown into the situation, you handled it well. Get out there and have some happy flights!

[@joshmc]

Thank you!

[@rudyyarbrough5122]

I'm an old Marine F-4 pilot and then a career airline pilot, now retired and can attest to the pressure the FAA causes. But I also learned that pressure is a valuable tool in making pilots operate under pressure of any kind. As petty as this failure was, it will never be repeated by this young pilot again. With the airlines, the FAA can show up any time and they are a must-ride. I found that they generally are decent people and are not looking for trouble. Follow all preflight and checklist ops and then do what you have learned. With commercial carriers, they are not there to cause the airlines to lose money or ground pilots. I always found it helpful to introduce my crew to the inspector and carry on small talk at the appropriate time. They are human too. Congrats on your success!

[@joshmc]

Thanks, yes I see the positive side of this, though I’m not sure I qualify as “young” anymore! :)

[@babarkhan-zi3xo]

Hello, thanks for making video. I also had a FAA inspector in my private pilot checkride two weeks ago. Yes, I was also nervous, but I was also confident. in my case, the DPE also having a first checkride. Thank God I passed my checride on first attempt. Now I'm starting instrument rating. Thanks.

[@joshmc]

Congratulations!

[@bombsaway6340]

I’ve been an examiner and had you been only with the DPE you may have passed. But the FAA was checking your DPE, and the DPE had no choice but play by the letter of the law. Appears all worked out well. Congratulations.

[@bobninemire5154]

i red somewhere that the FAA is firing a lot of DPE's. So much so that there is now a shortage of them. Is this really happening ?

[@joshmc]

Yes it's all good and I'm happy to be done with the process. Thank you!

[@stratman50th]

I took my private (helicopter) back in 87 when all check rides were done by an FAA examiner. For those who know the area, my instruction was at Hyde field in MD. The inspector lived in VA near Dulles. He didn't want to fight the NOVA beltway traffic so he had me fly to Dulles. "Just log it as another solo cross country". This post could get long so I'll just say I got there. My first time ever in a major international airport TCA. I was in the air for about 3.5 hours. He was in a teaching mood and I'll say that even though I was nervous and sweating bullets, he taught me a lot. I got signed off and didn't get sucked into any large jet engines. I ended up getting back after dark and completely worn out. Interesting checkride.

[@johnschreiber1574]

You also will never forget the things you learned on that ride!

[@FamilyManMoving]

Crossing the Legion Bridge in 1987 is nothing like it is in 2022. I could totally see this as an option, were I the FAA rep.

[@AV8OR51]

Thanks for sharing! I would felt the same way if that happened to me.

[@jnothstine]

Congratulations! You have an instrument rating and you are much safer in the air because of you are.

[@pmason1234]

Aviate, Navigate, Communicate, words to fly by 😀

[@onethousandtwonortheast8848]

“After two hours of oral, the DPE said ‘we’re ready to fly’…” 😂😂

[@jc-hd3ih]

Dudes got stamina. Being able to fly under pressure after 2 hours of oral. Sorry G man. I need a nap first.

[@redfire122]

I had the similar failure on my instrument airplane check ride. Nothing life threating but an error none the less. I learned and like you will never forget in the future. Yes there is a big difference when you have a FAA inspector along for the ride. On my commercial glider checkride I had a FAA examiner along for the ground portion (only two seats in the glider). I did not bust that one but got a discontinuance because the airworthiness certificate was legible but torn. The FAA inspector deemed the aircraft unairworthy on the preflight. When I went to the local FSDO to get a new AW certificate they could not believe that a DPE would discontinue the checkride. That is until I told them that an FAA inspector was involved. At that point they changed their story, issued me a new AW certificate and I passed the checkride the next weekend.

[@davidg1290]

Thanks for your perspective on this and congratulations on getting your instrument rating! I'm a cross country and a check ride away from my instrument rating. I've been a private pilot since 2009 and on the day of my check ride the FAA was there to evaluate the DPE. (I had no advance warning that he'd be there.) The FAA rep was very friendly and assured me up front that he was not there to add stress to my check ride and was not there to evaluate me, but to do a routine check on the DPE. (He and the DPE joked among themselves about how special it was for me to have two examiners on the check ride!) They appeared to have met in the past. Like your experience, the FAA rep sat in the back and said very little except to occasionally say something unrelated to the check ride. I got the impression he was trying to set me at ease somewhat as his comments were generally on the light-hearted side. Well, I did the oral (about 90 minutes) and I thought it was the most grueling part. It was just the DPE and I interacting over every aspect of private pilot aviation knowledge expectations. By the way, the DPE was very friendly and did his best to manage my expectations, not surprise me with things, and generally tried to make it a comfortable experience while still conducting a thorough examination. We went to the airplane, did the preflight, took off and did the expected maneuvers. I thought I did OK but realized at one point that I was having difficulty with tracking a VOR. Of course, I realized this after the fact when the DPE gave me a heading to fly to end it. Back at the FBO, still sitting in the shut down airplane, I asked the DPE how I did, to which he asked what did I think? I told him I thought I had passed. He said, you're right and continued to say that my check ride would have been better had I not chased the VOR needle. He then went on the explain what I had done wrong, but that, in general, I had demonstrated sufficient knowledge of flying to and from a VOR on a heading. The DPE suggested us taking pictures in front of the airplane, which we did, including the FAA rep. We went inside and finished the paperwork and other finish-up activities. Overall, the FAA examiner was very friendly, particularly after the check ride was done. I don't know if it would have been more stressful doing an instrument check ride or private check ride, but I hope I don't have to do that again!

[@joshmc]

Thank you, and thanks for sharing your experience. It's interesting how different some DPEs can be just in their demeanor. At the end of the day, one thing they're testing is our performance under pressure, and adding an FAA person just adds to that! So in a sense it's not a bad check, and if you perform well (as you did in your checkride) then you're definitely good to go. Best of luck on the rest of your instrument training!

[@matthew9285]

An FAA inspector showed up to my general and powerplant O&P when I was getting my A&P. Extra fun.

[@davealey7849]

I have a private LTA Balloon rating, and I had the FAA along on my first checkride (more on that later). The DPE called me a few days before and asked if I was OK with the FAA came along to recertify the DPE, and I told him that I was OK with it - being my first checkride I wasn't sure what to expect, but it's easier for an inexperienced pilot to prevent overburning and missing landings when the balloon is heavier, so I welcomed the extra weight. We did the oral the afternoon before the flight (balloons are usually flown early in the morning, so same-day oral exams are not that common), and it was grueling. I got grilled on visibility, cloud clearances, and navigation, which ironically are things that balloon pilots usually don't have to worry a great deal about. I struggled, but I passed. The flight was fairly uneventful - the DPE and FAA guy were clearly friends and we all had a nice chat, with the FAA guy giving me some useful information about what consitutes "congested" versus "other than congested" areas. I did great on the flight and passed the checkride. I also lost my wallet during the flight (kind of a unique hazard of ballooning - the basket rim hits me right in my back pocket), so when the DPE asked me for my temporary paper certificate (this was a few years ago, obviously) I didn't have it, so it ended up being handy to have the FAA right there to tell us how to handle the missing paperwork. The twist was that two months later Oklahoma City rejected my application, saying that I needed 1.4 more training hours (which I did not, according to the normal interpretation of the FARs). The easiest way to handle it was to get another 1.4 hours and redo the checkride, though, so I ended up getting to do it twice anyway. Congrats on your new rating!

[@billwilliams7970]

I didn't have a transport canada rep ride with me.. but when it came time to renew my instrument rating after several years.. the examiner was my boss. Made it way more stressful

[@CaptMikey-vc4ym]

In the DPE handbook it specifically states that an examiner responsibility is to put the applicant at ease and to relax the applicant. It sounds like your DPE did not do a very good job of this. Also, the FAA inspector should make an extra effort to put the applicant at ease. The words, FAA scares everybody. I have had check rides with FAA inspectors who went out of their way to make me comfortable, and this led to my performing actually better on the check. I say, "Humor is the lubrication of communication" Both of these guys need a refresher. We all have problems on check rides they are only steps along a road. Good job on hanging in there! Congrats, and now it's time for the commercial and CFI. Another goal always keeps you safer. Happy career!

[@RusscanFLY]

Wait, I didn't get past the FAA showing up at your check ride! Thanks for the support with the shirt, but man that's crazy brother!

[@joshmc]

Yeah it was a roller coaster day. Proud to wear the logo!

[@raphaelchacon6996]

Congratulations, thanks for sharing. Im on my way to finish instruments now, pretty pretty nervous, feels like the Berlin Wall! ... This is definitely helpfull, wont forget the W/B and for sure...... The Tower thingy ;-P

[@davebollmann5292]

This video hit home to my private check ride. No DPE, i had the head of the abe FSDO (allentown pa), I passed. The only thing he said was didnt your instructor teach you how to fold a map!

[@jrow84]

Congrats on the rating! I failed my first IFR ride for continuing the approach below mins on a VOR app with full-scale deflection. Last approach, he told me if I had just gone around then we were done.

[@joshmc]

Thank you! It’s no fun to miss it the first time, but hey we keep moving forward.

[@leowiebe2101]

It's always the suspense of it all.

[@mrsaskriders]

Congrats!!!

[@joshmc]

Thanks!

[@deanc.5984]

Nice post, good info. Most times the second flight is a Pass. 1999 I had to retake a ADF approach and passed, instrument rated for 22 years and, no I never flew a ADF approach since then!🤣👍Lunken airport, Cincinnati.

[@joshmc]

We may be saying the same thing about VOR approaches before too long!

[@gregorygehrke1850]

I would have parked the Cirrus and rented a 152. Problem solved! FAA needs to work on their people skills. Thank you for sharing

[@paulcrumley9756]

When I walked into my designee's office to begin my oral and practical for my A&P certificates, who was waiting there with him but an FAA inspector whom I knew well. He quickly assured me, though, that he had nothing to do directly with whether or not I passed the tests, but rather how well the examiner administered them. At one point we were discussing the inspection of control cables, and I had related how you can flex a cable to discover broken strands. The examiner asked me what I could do if the cable wasn't situated to be flexed that way. I was not prepared for that question, but I noticed out of the corner of my eye that the FAA inspector had taken a shop towel and was pointedly rubbing it along his arm. . . When my demonstration weld burned through, he just chuckled and said something like "It's a good thing most A&P holders aren't expected to be professional welders" and suggested the reason for doing and examining the demonstration weld was to assure the examiner that I could judge a proper weld from an unairworthy one, which I clearly did.

[@earl81ful]

I've had FAA examiners ride along on 3 of my type rides. Its stressful but if it happens you need to try to forget he/she is there and do your best. I had an FAA examiner actually give me my type ride for my metro type. He passed me but failed the next guy. It sucks, no doubt about it, but sometimes it can't be helped. Your failure seems a little strange though. You should have been informed at the time of the "failure to meet" section and been asked if you wanted to continue the ride. Also calling anyone on the radio takes a back seat to the job at hand (aviate, navigate, communicate...). Not everyone contacts the controller right away. I routinely don't call ATC right away if I'm busy with a task. If they want to talk to you they will ask if you are on frequency. This should not have caused a failure, just my humble opinion. I'm glad you went back up and finished. Good luck in your pursuits and safe travels!!

[@collinreesejones5525]

Congratulations...Very Happy for You! 😎

[@joshmc]

Much appreciated!

[@collinreesejones5525]

@@joshmc when I taxied out at KMDD in Midland 2004 on my Instrument checkride with the coolest DPE I was so nervous, I didn't look (its a small west Texas town uncontrolled) and he hit the brakes. I almost pulled out in front of John and Martha King in their Falcon 20 taxiing! He died laughing and so did they, Martha said on CTAF you have gotten your mistake behind you, now go have fun! I did and it went flawless! Thought you might enjoy that story, I will NEVER forget it! 😂🤣😎

[@davidjackson7405]

I had the same thing happen on my Private checkride. The FAA guy was 240 pounds in the back of my 172. I had never had that much weight that far back in the plane. It was a totally different feel and was quite the challenge. I passed, but I think it was a miracle.

[@joshmc]

That’s a lot for a 172! Kudos to you for passing with all those added variables.

[@jrow84]

My pp ride was short because I was 240 + the DPE's weight meant we had 1.5hrs of burn before we went out of CG limits in the DA20. I didn't need the help but it was nice knowing that going in lol

[@dmmiles01]

Great job…

[@iridiumcaptain]

I did my CFI checkride with an FAA examiner. It was actually super relaxed and easy

[@FlyLeah]

Calling the tower is so easy to forget! Especially when you get a simulated engine failure or some sort of PFD failure

[@HoundDogMech]

My DPE for the Private & Instrument was Art Zander KMWC long ago before '75. anyway it was 45 minutes after getting back on the Instrument CR (Talking about his old Model T and his budy in my Home town) that I finally had to ask if I had passed. He said when Cafemeyer sends a student I know he is ready, Ya preictally have to crash to fail.

[@n206ja]

The "formality" of the checkride certainly can play on your nerves! My DPE patted me on the back after my first approach and said, "That was great! Now you can relax since you know you can do it and you just need to do a couple more!" That did help me relax and boosted my confidence. I'm sure I would have felt just like you if the FAA was in the back seat!

[@1486230]

I failed my instrument check ride on the ground. I was wayyy too confident and didn’t properly prepare. Examiner let me know we could do the flight portion if I wanted to but would need to redo the ground portion another day. It was a great flight test because most of the pressure was off. This was in 1998 and I don’t fly anymore sadly. I learned from this experience though and have applied it in other areas of my life. Congrats on getting your instrument rating 🎉

[@pegballou9629]

The oral portion MUST be completed successfully before the flight as stated in the ACS.

[@1486230]

@@pegballou9629 I’m in Canada. It’s called a partial here

[@pegballou9629]

Ah, Canada, eh? In the US the oral must be completed first. That makes it hard when bad weather is approaching and there’s only time hit the oral. (Sad face) Thank you for adding another piece to my Canada understanding. Airspace is different… flight following/search and rescue is different.

[@Cosmonnor_]

I was told for my CFI ride that the FAA might be observing my checkride and the DPE, but if he ended up coming, the ride would be free. I was actually glad when the FAA showed up the morning of my CFI ride lol.

[@Cessna152ful]

Congrats on the Instrument rating, failed my first time on the ground, supremely underestimated how much i needed to study and learned that lesson, aced the flight the next day though

[@howardhall5191]

Josh, first congratulation on your new rating. Enjoy it, you are a better aviator than you were prior to the check. I more than understand the stress of an FAA observer. Some of them can be nothing but a pain in the arse. I have flown for better than 40 years and been a Designated Examiner. Your missed call to the tower is minor. The tower was expecting you and just seeing if you were on frequency. Kind of a curtesy call. Now, if you had continued with out making contact that would be harder to recover from. Rules of aviation, aviate, navigate and communicate that order. This all is also reconfirmed because of the very quick and easy recheck. Kind of like failing your first drivers check, after the redo, no body remembers the downer.

[@mouser485]

I had something equally stressing happen to me. I was injured years ago in an electrical accident and as a result I have to use a hand control unit attached to the rudder pedals as I can’t use my legs properly. I have to walk with forearm crutches. I was learning to fly in Huntsville, Al and because of this hand control unit, I was going to have to go to the nearest FSDO, which was in Birmingham, Alabama at the time, and get a Certificate of Demonstrated Ability. I believe that’s what it was called. Keep in mind, at this time a had soloed but I didn’t have my PPL yet. To get this cert I had to fly with an FAA examiner. Me and my instructor fly to B’ham and land and We were in a 172 and I’m just waiting for the examiner to come out to board the plane. However, I didn’t get 1 FAA examiner, I got 2, and the second examiner was 8 months pregnant ! Are you freaking kidding me ? I was a low time 22 y/o who can land and take off but I’m going to have to confidently fly 2, no 3, strangers and one hasn’t even been born yet. I think the guy in the front with me could sense I was nervous and he asked if “I needed a drink first ?” We all chuckled and this calmed me down a bit, just enough for me to remember to get out the pre takeoff checklist and get started. Anyway, this is getting a bit long but you could probably see how that situation might rattle a 25 hour or so newbie and it rattled me for a bit I assure you. Fortunately, the flight was fine and the examiners were cool. Certificate was achieved and a few months later I had my PPL.

[@joshmc]

Wow, that sounds like quite the pressure cooker, congrats on getting through that successfully!

[@MikeCnolan]

Were they small people or did you not have any fuel?

[@fishhisy]

I didn't have the feds ride along but I did have an instrument ride and commercial single ride in the same day back to back. Passed both but on the instrument ride I wasn't holding altitudes and was losing my composure, frustrated with my performance but fighting for the altitude at some points but still flew within standards.

[@annoyed707]

It certainly would be, as I am in Canada!

[@joshmc]

Ha!

[@vandalorian8777]

Aced my written and check ride for my private and aced the written for my instrument rating. Similar to you I had only one issue with my check ride. I was doing an ILS approach in a severe crosswind that blew me off the ILS. I was able to recover and made the landing but He made me come back a week later to shoot the ILS again

[@Krakaet]

Looking at the comments below about how it is extremely atypical to be failed at any point not during the flight itself, it sounds like FAA guy put his thumb on the scale. Sorry you were on the receiving end of this, but it's awesome that you took it in stride!

[@ke6lev]

OMG, this TOTALLY happened to me on my IFR checkride!

[@TobinTwinsHockey]

BVI! My dad had a 172 based out of there for years. I did my private with Airquest at BTP

[@joshmc]

I got my PPL at Butler, and my CFII is Airquest BVI!

[@thecorporatepilotdad]

Congrats on the instrument rating. Remember to fly the airplane first and then the radio. You were partial panel and tower did contact you. Were ATC communications as normal after tower contacted you? If so, the DPE should not have failed you. You got a raw deal in my opinion but you passed the recheck so congrats and be careful with that new instrument rating.

[@sigmaballz1469]

I'm sorry that happened, I just passed my IFR checkride yesterday and I probably did way worse that you (the DPE was honestly pretty upset with my flying). No doubt I would've also failed if the FAA was there, and you definitely would've passed 1st try otherwise. The fact that the DPE only let you about the failure after the ride means that the FAA guy probably told him to do so, I thought that they would let you know as soon as you fail since your supposed to assume you're passing unless immediately told otherwise.

[@MrRaleighman123]

Oh man, what luck. Nothing like some pressure on due day. Congrats on passing. Woo hoo!

[@md4droid]

No pressure, right? Wow, I know that had to be the longest 30 minutes of your life, just sitting there waiting for your DPE to come back. Thanks for sharing, can't wait to see some IFR family adventures. :)

[@joshmc]

Thanks so much, hope we’ll have lots of adventures to share!

[@mazbaird]

I had the FAA sit in on my Practicals as I did my hands-on for my A&Ps….He never said a word.

[@justincmichael]

Love the shirt!

[@joshmc]

I love it too!

[@thomasmixson7064]

I was "ramp checked" once at Lakefront, New Orleans. Out of the blue! Checked my license ect.....never has happened again in over 2000 hrs ops....

[@andrewj9831]

Yes... They like to see your license. Make sure you update the FAA on any address change. You don't need to get a new card...just update them.

[@rn2811]

One word that I can think of if an FAA guy shows up at my checkride is discontinuance lol.

[@joshmc]

LOL

[@maxsmodels]

It happened to me on my II ride.

[@MalcolmRuthven]

I took my instrument checkride WITH an FAA examiner. It was early in the use of GPS for instrument approaches (our Bonanza had that) and he wanted to see how it worked. I was fine with that and he gave a very "fair" checkride, meaning that if I made a mistake but corrected it in time, he was OK with that. Yes, I passed :-)

[@westoneichner8089]

This failure is very odd. What the dpe needs to do is tell you in the air that you failed, and give you the option to either continue or go back to your original airport. Every single dpe in San Diego I've flown with has said that. I'm not 100% sure if it's a rule or not but if you shut the engine down and they haven't said you failed it's a pass in my book. Maybe they didn't want you to be stressed any more. Anyway, congrats on the instrument rating!

[@GeorgePetersIII]

As a former evaluator for USAF aircrew I can tell you evaluators (and wise instructors) choose the "student" for their own checkrides wisely. Completing your personal checkride with an evaluator getting his own checkride is always more stressful. I believe part of being a good evaluator is setting your student up for success. That includes a pep talk to set the evaluatee at ease!

[@multitieredinvestor183]

🎉Took my instrument Dec 10 1980. After landing we went into his office when a mutual friend called him. I heard him say I am giving Larry L a pre Christmas present.

[@rollingthunder277]

Good luck with your ATP check ride.

[@CommonCider]

DPE gave me a check ride with a FAA guy, and it was my 2nd check. I got almost everything but was deducted points ie: I had the power setting at 2350 whereas the checklist said 2400-2500rpm. I passed but i was lectured about not having checked the checklist during cruising flight(C172s 180hp)

[@wayneschenk5512]

Great outcome in the end you will forget this.

[@jessegarman7899]

You can always deny the FAA riding along. It is your plane, your gas. You are paying the DPE, not the other way around.

[@andrewj9831]

You can't deny the FAA if you are doing a check flight, it's there job to monitor it. You might be paying the DPE, but the FAA PI is signing off it. All the DPE is a middle person, that the FAA allows to test. Even if the DPE gives you a thumbs up, it's that PI that for the most part is signing you off.

[@K_Hansen]

i did all my check ride and bfrs with the FFA the guy was picky and i liked it

[@colonyresident7151]

FAA also showed up in mine!

[@jerrykinnin7941]

I'm a CDL A trucker. I haul intermodal Local. My boss has me show the new hires how to do the job. Railroads and depot's are "special places." The drivers I'm "training" already have 2 years minimum experience. I'm always looking at how to be a better trainer.

[@WarcraftPvPFilms]

The issue with the FAA riding along is that the standards for the checkride change. It says something to the tune of "consistently performs outside of standards". Sure sounds like you did fine and were nitpicked over a negligible mistake (I guess they expected Communicate THEN aviate????) This is not the first story I've heard where an FAA rep tagging along causes one little mistake that would just be a small mention in the debrief to turn into a checkride failure. Congratulations on a successful recheck and getting your instrument rating

[@joshmc]

Thank you!

[@timucinkose6918]

My dpe for private gave me a weight and balance scenario for himself and one other passenger and the whole time I was sure that it was going to be an faa rep but turns out it was just a scenario 😂

[@markmartin9346]

Pretty much all my rating rides has been with the FAA at the GADO(FSDO) back in the 70's and 80's and into my airline career. All my type ratings in the airlines were done with the FAA.I can tell you, most of them don't know much, especially the ones giving the type ratings. My ATP ride was done with the FAA who said if that engine fails it's for real and he's not pulling it. My 767 rating ride in the sim was a joke. The FAA guy probably just went thru AA's ground school on it and that's about it. I was doing a LOC BC to 27 at MCI. My instructor was monitoring raw data as I was LNAV/VNAV ing it on the approach with flight director. Broke out at MDA and continued the descent when the FAA told me to go around, which I did. He then said he doesn't like all that maneuvering close to the ground. I looked at my instructor dumbfounded like what maneuvering. The FAA was sitting behind me and couldn't see my instruments so he was watching the FO raw data. You know what happens on a back course when you get close to the LOC transmitter? The needle on raw data goes nuts. He thought that was me. What an idiot. He did pass me tho cautioning me about excess maneuvering.

[@captainrevolution5397]

Congrats on getting your IR. I failed mine because I got nervous and errored in programing my GPS. Do not let it beat down on you and keep focusing on it, I am now a CFII and teach all of my students to make sure their GPS is 100% right so they don't do what I did. I am also curious as to why the DPE didn't tell you of the disapproval on the spot of the error.

[@joshmc]

Great point on the GPS programming. I think the root cause of my failure was also nerves, which helps me realize that staying calm and in control is key. Thanks!

[@mikearakelian6368]

The big thing you need to be secure in is your documents,make sure that charts,apch.plates are all current,sectionals current dates; wt. Bal correct all recent matinance info current n correct etc. My 135 company was under hack; all of our pilots got letters of inforcment 90 day suspensions except me. I recived a no notice flt check at the airport.and could have lost it all!

[@sjones8738]

Great job. Unfamiliar people can sometime make an individual nervous during a test and you can forget the process. The best approach is to write down the procedures to follow.

[@harrisongould9460]

I bet the FAA guy planted a seed in the Check Ride guy's head. The 'seed' was that 'both of them' would be called to the table if anything in your future flying caused a problem. The FAA guy wanted to be protected and this caused your check ride guy to do the same. If there was no FAA guy, you would have passed.No worries...you made it. Congratulations.

[@ldoyle3rd]

Check rides are always stressful, I'm sure having the FAA ride along did not help any, congrats on pressing on and getting your instrument rating!

[@billbelanger6186]

Congratulations instrument pilot. Just to add to your anxiety, if you ever get your CFI rating, your initial check ride needs to be conducted by the FAA. What you experienced on your instrument ride was not an evaluation of your flying skills. It was an analysis of the DPE's skills. That time they took before you got your "bad news" wasn't about you. It was about the FAA's evaluation of the DPE. Did he conduct the proper check ride? Remember he needs FAA designation to continue giving check rides. He, like you, was on his best behavior and couldn't let anything slip. In fact, he is allowed to give you some leeway as long as you make a prompt correction without any prompting. My CFI ride was conducted by the FAA. The examiner was the FAA. There was no DPE. He was friendly and relaxed. I didn't feel like I was under a microscope. One interesting aspect of the ride was that he asked me to teach him a maneuver on the ground, than in the air. One CFI duties is to be able to identify common errors and to teach how to correct them. I did that on the ground. Then in the air I (inadvertently) made one of the errors I had described. Then I fixed it. He was happy. I passed the ride with no problem. He never knew my "mistake" was unintentional. A pass is a pass.

[@joshmc]

Thanks for the perspective. I'll keep that in mind if I ever go for CFI!

[@bradmarcum2927]

Not necessarily. There is a school in OK that has authority to give II check ride as the initial and the the I as an add on. No FAA examiner involved

[@billbelanger6186]

@@bradmarcum2927 The FAA always has the authority to do a check ride. But most are done by designated examiners. You refer to the II. That is not the initial CFI check ride. I was talking specifically about the initial CFI check ride, not the II. The FAA regards this as a gateway for aviation safety and wants to be sure the CFIs are on board with that.

[@GeneralChangFromDanang]

I guess that's one of the perks of a 2 seat rental plane.

[@DumbledoreMcCracken]

I would have preferred, but I only have a glider certificate

[@sparty837]

Wow, 25yrs ago when I did my check ride, the oral was 30min, no weight and balance required, check ride lasted about an hour.

[@gmugrumbach]

Don’t make me cry

[@bobmcgehee1749]

When I took all my check rides, I had the option of paying a DPE or taking the ride with the FAA, I chose the FAA because there was no cost. No idea if they still do that.

[@baconmcbacon62]

Don't worry! The FAA is always there to help! xD

[@tikkin11]

As others have said, you and your DPE were both getting a check ride here. Doesn't make things better, and you still got called out on a technicality. The only issue is now you have a pink slip on your record, which could be a detriment on an airline interview someday. My initial ATP ride had a Fed along and it was intense (although probably not any more so had he not been there).

[@androidphone1901]

How would this work in a C150 two seater? Strap to the top?

[@cooperparts]

Just remember the FAA is not happy until your not happy

[@ryanadams5244]

Did you do your training out of KBVI? I probably know who your DPE was, I got my private out of KLBE. If the FAA showed up for my private checkride with him I wouldn’t have been pleased.

[@FamilyManMoving]

So being a student in a PPL program, I might volunteer for the FAA rep to ride along for my checkride. I'm too old to change careers to aviation. If a DPE is going to nitpick, let it be me. It won't hurt my career - no pink slip a future employer will see. Nitpicking my performance - before I take my family in the air - is alright by me. So kids -- I'll take the next one for the team.