Is THE BIG SLEEP the most confusing movie ever made? * FIRST TIME WATCHING * reaction & commentary

[@michaelbrennick]

Carmen is what was then called a "dope fiend". In the novel Marlowe mentions she was huffing ether from a bottle, and taking laudunum, which was an opiate pain killer. The Hayes production code forbade reference to drugs. So it had to be shown indirectly by her weird quirky behavior. And his later reference to her being "high as a kite", which could be booze or drugs. But she wasn't a "lush", a female drunk, she was a dope fiend.

[@Muck006]

Making references "indirect" increase the mystery of it and keep people guessing ... a.k.a. THINKING about it (if they "want to know"). That is actually a good thing. In a sense it is like the "and your father smelled of elderberries" taunt in Monty Python and the Holy Grail, which you only fully understand if you know that elderberries was a cheap source for making booze.

[@keithmays8076]

I always assumed that she was on opium since Geiger was into the whole Asian ambiance. And while she's kicking the gong around, Geiger takes some cheesecake shots, hence why her top was unbuttoned.

[@janibeg3247]

she was naked in the book at Geiger's house

[@ElliotNesterman]

A kibitzer is someone who offers usually uninvited advice, often at card games and other kinds of mind games, the sort of person who sits behind you and tells you which cards you should play. It's one of the many Yiddish words which have adopted into English.

[@yelena-pzychalska]

This is one of my favorite Bacall/Bogart flicks. For starters, Raymond Chandler wrote the novel but wanted nothing to do with the screen play. William Faulkner was hired to write the screenplay but the problem with the novel was it was about two sisters caught up in a life of vices (pornography, opium, gambling, and promiscuity) raised by an amoral playboy Father. Not exactly easy to transfer to the big screen with the Hayes code. Faulkner would end up needing help to adapt the novel to the silver screen and Leigh Bracket and Jules Furthman helped out on that. Howard Hawkes was the man hired to put this whole film together and liked Bracket for writing a lot of the dialogue. Another fan of Bracket was George Lucas who hired her for Star Wars "The Empire Strikes Back". She died of cancer writing the draft and Lucas ended up hiring Lawrence Kasdan to finish her work and Kasdan ended up rewriting it, but Lucas still gave her credit for the work. So the dialogue you find quick witted was mostly written by her. 🙂 Despite many attempts to have a clean easy to follow ending to the movie, the 3 writers had failed to do it. The premise of the movie is the younger sister was an easy mark for Eddie Mars to use for blackmail money. He owned the bookstore and hired Geiger to handle the blackmail racket he had going on, among his many illegal revenue streams. Joe Brody was Geiger's right hand man who got greedy and Mars wanted him taken care of. Carmen however took care of that detail for Eddie. She did it hoping it would wipe the slate clean and she could move on from Eddie's grip. Once the Father hired Marlowe to look into the blackmail racket, everything for Eddie Mars fell apart. Shawn Regan wasn't as lucky. Who killed Geiger is intentionally left unclear. You are given 3 suspects but I believe Carmen did it as she was also the one who killed Shawn Regan. Others always believed it was Joe Brody who did killed Geiger, or maybe the Chauffer and that cost him his life. If you ever want to read an intense novel about pre-war late 1930s Los Angeles, The Big Sleep is a must read! The book is much better and clearer to follow.

[@harryhowl2141]

Being the best thing you liked about The Big Sleep was the banter between Bogie and Bacall then you should definitely watch "To Have and Have Not". Their chemistry in that was electric.

[@MsWaif]

Yesss, love that one!

[@donnaholland1625]

To Have and To Have Not is one of my favorite movies. Ashley should have started with that movie.

[@marcus4039]

Was gonna suggest this, thanks for beating me to it!

[@sheilamyers1215]

​@@donnaholland1625😅pI😢🎉🎉8m

[@keithmays8076]

20 years old and, right out of the gate, she became a star. The Hawksian Woman that every woman wanted to be, and what every man wanted. But only Bogart got the golden rings.

[@RetroClassic66]

5:49 What you’re calling “wordy” is simply a reflection of the screenplay’s literary origins. It’s a great line too, very alliterative. The Big Sleep, by Raymond Chandler, is a very popular novel still to this day. The screenplay was written by William Faulkner (himself an extremely talented Southern author who not only won the Pulitzer Prize - twice - but also the National Book Award and the Nobel Prize), Jules Furthman (a longtime and very in-demand screenwriter whose work began in the early silent film era), and Leigh Brackett, who in addition to being a screenwriter was also a Hugo Award- winning science fiction author, and whose final work was an early draft of the screenplay for STAR WARS, EPISODE V: THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK (1980).

[@nightfall902]

The best part of comment sections is people trying to honestly explain things to people that already know, or, people who really don't care in the least. Especially when it comes to literature. Films are so much better than books. Easy to watch, much faster and none of that damn reading and page turning crap. Who needs classic literature when we have Disney and others to make pretty toons for us.

[@auapplemac2441]

If you grew up reading and enjoying books, your comments are off putting. Yes, you need patience in some cases, but that's what writing a book is all about. You can portray so much like what the characters are thinking. What their motivations are, etc. Also, until iPads, etc. books were the only portable method of learning. @@nightfall902

[@ohctascooby2]

Back in the early days of telephones you always went through a physical operator to make the final connection. They made a physical connection at a switchboard to connect you to your destination. For a cop to ‘trace’ a call all they had to do was talk to the same operator(s).

[@mainmac]

well, AND the operator had to remember all their calls. And of course by the time the cops actually start looking and talk to the operator, who knows what they'll remember.

[@melenatorr]

The ear thing is just something Bogie does, a little almost unconscious habit: it usually means his character's going over something in his mind.

[@keithmartin4670]

“Bogie and Bacall” were one of the most famous Hollywood couples of their era. They married when he was 45 and she was 20. You noticed how special her voice was from her first line. She was a major star in her own right and never really retired. Her finale role was on “Family Guy”!

[@dadoctah]

Ashleigh comments on Bacall's voice right before a scene that has her singing in some dive, and it's clearly not her real voice doing to song. Betty Jane Persky (Lauren Bacall's real name) was great at a lot of things, but she was never a singer.

[@keithmartin4670]

@@dadoctah Actually, I was talking about her speaking voice, which was amazing. I think Ashleigh commented on her voice before the song started.

[@alamc200]

@@dadoctah Ashleigh commented on her voice at the very beginning of the movie when Bacall first spoke.

[@splitimage137.]

It says in Wikipedia that she was trained to speak in a lower vocal register. It's not her normal speaking voice.

[@keithmartin4670]

If that’s true, it really worked. She kept that way for 72 years. @@splitimage137.

[@Mokkari77]

I could just watch a whole movie with Bogart and the bookstore girl played by Dorothy Malone.

[@ronbock8291]

Same.

[@geraldmcboingboing7401]

I agree. Dorothy Malone was great!! She won her Academy Award for Best Supporting Actress for Written on the Wind (1956), in which she starred with Lauren Bacall.

[@jasoncaldwell5627]

Dorothy was SO HAWT.

[@Carolacan]

I liked the chemistry between them two. I could watch that for an entire movie.

[@8967Logan]

Bogie and Bacall met while filming "To Have and Have Not", and it was love at first sight. Bogie was married at the time, and they were known in Hollywood as "the battling Bogarts" (not a happy marriage). Bogie and Bacall became a legendary couple. You obviously noticed their chemistry :). You may have noticed in this film that women at the time were not what women today are led to believe they were. Personally, I didn't really see an abundance of trad wives. It's something I like about the golden age of Hollywood, an accurate portrayal of women.

[@jakubfabisiak9810]

In case you need a breakdown: Carmen killed Shawn because he turned her down for Mars' wife. Mrs. Mars was in hiding, pretending like she ran away because reasons (but she was colluding with her husband on this). Geiger was a pornographer (couldn't show it in 1946), and he had nudes of Carmen. The Sternwood chauffeur was sweet on Carmen, so he killed Geiger over the photos, then Brody got the photos from him, and tried blackmailing Carmen with them. Agnes was just playing her angle trying to make some cash running with Geiger's buisness of dirty pictures (all those men going into the back room in Geiger's bookstore). IIRC, Mars knew who killed Shawn, and that's what he had on Vivian - he was using her sister being guilty of murder. Geiger's driver (and lover) - Carol killed Joe Brody thinking he was the one who killed Geiger, and Canino was sent to find Agnes because Mars didn't want his wife found. It is all pretty convoluted, but the flirty dialogue is worth watching. The Maltese Falcon is a better movie, with Bogart playing a great role, though his quick-witted Marlow isn't bad in this either (You take chances, Marlowe. I get paid to.)

[@LauraCourtneyette]

I need a whiteboard

[@sandramiller1988]

Bull💩! The Maltese Falcon is a great film, but it is in no way better than this film. You have good taste, but mine is better!😉

[@light9999]

Yeah but you still didn't say who killed the chauffeur! No but really this is a pretty good rundown of the plot. A lot is made how the story is indecipherable because it's fun to talk about it that way. But it's not really, it's just very very complex for a 2 hour presentation. Oh and to top it off, there's 2 versions with slightly different plots elements. So it can be, as you did, "solved," but mostly it's just fun to wallow in its complexity. Who killed the chauffeur again?

[@sparky6086]

"The Big Sleep" was almost forgotten about because of it's convoluted plot, so don't feel bad. It's status as a worthwhile film, was retroactively raised because of the successful careers of it's stars, Bogart & Bacall, & the redeeming aspects of it, worthy of study.

[@salvationsplace]

@@sandramiller1988 double bull shite, Key Largo is better than both Maltese Falcon and this film

[@JeffKelly03]

Oh boy. From the way Ashleigh was confusing herself in the intro alone, I can already tell this is going to be PEAK confused Ashleigh.

[@kevenpinder7025]

The dialog style for these private detective stories used to be called "crackling." Hardbitten, direct, no nonsense, rude.

[@egk2584]

One of the most famous movies where the plot really makes no sense but nobody cares. :) It's all about the dialog and the characters.

[@michaelbrennick]

It's Raymond Chandler, that's why you have to watch, for the dialogue: "It was a blonde. A blonde to make a bishop kick a hole in a stained-glass window." Raymond Chandler, Farewell, My Lovely (Philip Marlowe).

[@jameswarkentin2798]

You're not wrong about this movie. A complex story is complicated by a rewrite and reshoot to give Lauren more scenes.

[@PaulMcMurray-q7j]

So true.

[@jvgreendarmok]

Also, Mrs Mars was re-cast for the reshoot because the original actress wasn't available - originally she looked a lot less like Carmen.

[@ThreadBomb]

Raymond Chandler (author of The Big Sleep) said that a lot of Martha Vickers' scenes were cut down because she was acting Lauren Bacall off the screen.

[@richardmark9161]

@@jvgreendarmok I personally felt like Pat Clark the original actress cast in 1944 as Eddie Mars’ wife was made-up to look a lot more glamorous than Peggy Knudsen the replacement actress in the1946 version. Peggy Knutson’s hair was sort of pulled back. Her wardrobe was more subdued. It is my feeling that the production didn’t want an actress to look more glamorous than Lauren Bacall in the scene. In my opinion, Pat Clark was very strikingly beautiful and had an unusual unique appearance. Peggy Knutson, who is also a lovely lady, was very toned down as far as hair make up and wardrobe.

[@jvgreendarmok]

@@richardmark9161 My main issue is Peggy Knudsen's resemblance to Martha Vickers, in a film full of dramatic reveals of who has a connection to whom.

[@jakubfabisiak9810]

In the book, Marlowe finds Carmen naked - they just couldn't show it in a movie in 1946. The explanation is that Geiger was a pornographer, and the driver who got arrested for killing Brody was his lover - another thing that wouldn't fly in 1946.

[@jakubfabisiak9810]

Don't feel bad about being confused - The Big Sleep is notorious for having a very convoluted plot. Even the filmmakers don't know who killed the Sternwood's Chauffeur. The flirty banter between Marlowe, and the ladies is one of the main selling points of this film.

[@botz77]

They asked the writer of the novel and he didn't know who killed the chauffeur either.

[@John-K638]

The filmakers called Chandler to ask who killed the chauffeur and he didn't know either.

[@davidkinsey8657]

Anyone who isn't confused doesn't really understand the situation. - Edward R Murrow.

[@kieronball8962]

Joe Brody killed the Sternwood's Chauffeur, for the photographs and negatives of Carmen.

[@pheer246]

Yeah, even the TCM intro for this is like 🤷

[@matthewjaco847]

The writing of the film must have been a fever dream. The censors forced the screenwriters (one of whom was William Faulkner) to omit key themes like pornography, drugs, and homosexuality, which were key factors in the book. Because of this, major plot threads were either unexplained or left out entirely. But kind of like the Big Lebowski (which took inspiration from this film), the movie became more about the process of a PI investigating a case then about the actual solution to the mystery.

[@rcrawford42]

Maltese Falcon managed to slip in a slang term for homosexual, because none of the censors knew what it meant, and assumed "gunsel" meant a gunman.

[@TheCastlepoet]

Indeed, the changes to which you refer were dictated by the Hays Code. In Chandler's novel, Carmen was drugged and naked when Marlowe found her at Geiger's place. Later, when Marlowe finds her waiting for him in his apartment, she's again naked and lying in his bed. Geiger was a pornographer, and his supposedly respectable bookstore was merely a front for an illegal pornography lending library that is run out of the back room. Carol Lundgren was Geiger's gay lover. Curiously enough, however, at the same time that those scenes/situations were toned down, several other suggestive scenes and situations did not occur in the book but were pure inventions by the screenwriters--e.g., Marlowe's flirtation (and, it's implied, more) with the Dorothy Malone character at the bookshop across the street from Geiger's shop, and his flirtatious banter with the female taxi driver. So, in a way, while the filmmakers adhered to the letter of the Hays Code, they pushed the envelope against it at the same time.

[@JayM409]

It was also common in Noir films for there to be no resolution.

[@Jessesgirl2013]

I grew up watching this, but was never quite certain of the plot points. Then I read the book as an adult. What a revelation! This movie makes so much more sense now…

[@illbebad]

Ashleigh, love that you are getting a chance to see these older films. And love that an awesome member keeps requesting them.

[@mwflanagan1]

“To Have and Have Not” is another great pairing of Bogie and Bacall - my favorite, although there were others.

[@lucindapick2986]

It's not just you, Ashleigh. The NY Times said, "The Big Sleep is one of those pictures in which so many cryptic things occur amid so much involved and devious plotting that the mind becomes utterly confused. And, to make it more aggravating, the brilliant detective in the case is continuously making shrewd deductions which he stubbornly keeps to himself. What with two interlocking mysteries and a great many characters involved, the complex of blackmail and murder soon becomes a web of utter bafflement. Unfortunately, the cunning script-writers have done little to clear it at the end."

[@V1DE0NASTY]

This is one of Ashleigh's all time best reactions. She's just so charming and funny in every moment here. She had me dying of laughter the whole time. Calling lauren bacall sassy with this shocked tone is hilarious Saying "we gotta little murder mystery up in this bitch" about The Big Sleep lmao And seeing how confused she is by a plot thats supposed to be insanely confusing as an object of art, she's a trooper

[@cwdkidman2266]

Are you insane? You gotta be trolling. Celebrating confusion is one thing; celebrating stupidity and a lack of intellectual curiosity is,another. This performer has it in spades. When this performer screened THE BIG SLEEP,, this reviewer probably,decided to get even with it because Marlowe imitated Nathan Lane. So she dumped on it. Things she didn't catch on just the half hour we saw': Old enough to be weaned...oral sex. Fellatio. A tail job? I'm your girl....anal sex which Hawks referred to in nearly every movie. About half of the horse racing comversation. Never asked what it was a picture of. In the context of the movie (not the book) she was fucking or blowing someone. Personally i,love this movie. It's,not yet in the National Film Registry but will be, and then join the 11 Hawks films already there, more than any other director. And Gentlemen Prefer Blondes isn't in there yet...but will be. Here in the South we celebrate our ignorance. Brain pronlems? Perfect time to review a, movie. If i don't like it I'll just blame it on my sludgy thinking. Win+win for me. Pinup girl for the MAGA crowd ..

[@ElliotNesterman]

I'm surprised that Chris sent you to _The Big Sleep_ before _The Maltese Falcon_ (1941), which is regarded as having one of the greatest screenplays ever written. It also stars Bogart and features Peter Lorre and Sydney Greenstreet (whom you met in _Casablanca_ ) and Elisha Cook, Jr. (who plays Harry Jones in this film). The line about wearing a white tie and carrying a tennis racket is a reference to Bogart's Broadway career where he was often cast as the juvenile in comedies of manners, the sort of character who bounds into the drawing room through french doors and says, "Tennis anyone?"

[@jenngray8769]

We need to get Ashleigh into the great noir films of which The Maltese Falcon is definitely one. She does need to be prepared that these films often don’t have satisfying (in a traditional moviegoing sense) conclusions as that was one of points that noir films were trying to make.

[@wesleyrodgers886]

Murder my sweet?. Dick Powell.

[@stephenriggs8177]

I love the falcon, but this is absolutely my favorite Bogie film.

[@JeffKelly03]

@@stephenriggs8177 I do agree that I enjoy it a lot more than Falcon (though Casablanca is without question my favorite Bogart film, because I'm one of those people who thinks it's the greatest movie in history). The plot makes absolutely zero sense but who cares? The dialogue absolutely crackles and I'm not sure Bogart has ever been more charming (I won't say "better" because his best performance was Treasure of the Sierra Madre, though I suppose an argument could be made for African Queen).

[@stephenriggs8177]

@@JeffKelly03 Yeah. I guess I'd call Casablanca/Big Sleep a tie. 😏

[@Lensmaster1]

The plot isn't as important as the interaction of the characters and the dialogue. It's just a joy to listen to this movie.

[@Jwhite1979]

Exactly. I gave this film 5 stars on Letterboxd, and I've seen it four times and still have no idea what it's about other than some pornographers and a rich dude with daughters.

[@saucermcfly]

For me too. I've seen it so many times and loved it with every viewing. I long ago let go of understanding who did what to whom. It's nearly a MacGuffin.

[@jakubfabisiak9810]

Soon as I saw the title I experienced a moment of panic, that you would watch the wrong version like with the 12 Angry Men.

[@YouLousyKids]

ACME. I think the words you're looking for are "the company Wile E. Coyote buys all his merchandise from".

[@RetroClassic66]

24:07 Good guess, Ashleigh! “Sapped” does refer to being hit, specifically with a sap, which is a type of baton weapon; given the time period and circumstances here, it more likely refers to a leather sap, which is a leather club filled with a metal rod or bar, lead, sand or other material that can deliver a crippling blow in a close-quarters fight. Typically, a sap is flat and looks a bit like a beavertail. It's made with heavy leather and is surprisingly easy to carry and deploy.

[@markh3271]

My take on the subject from my time of movie watching, 60+ years, saps were filled with a loose material, usually sand, while one with a rigid interior was a blackjack.

[@wendywoodruff2871]

Or a sock filled with quarters

[@miriam8376]

I watched this with my dad for the first time because he kept saying it was great even though he hadn’t seen it in three decades. When it was over, I said, “I’m confused.” And after a long pause, he said, “me too.”

[@denvan3143]

I think the dialogue about orchids was a dig at mystery writer Rex Stout, whose fictional detective Nero Wolfe had a rooftop greenhouse with a thousand orchids.

[@timjb19621]

Phillip Marlowe, Private Detective. A character created by Raymond Chandler. These classic detective stories are known for wordy banter and descriptions that like "keep your thoughts tumbling in your head like undies in a dryer"

[@waffleweave]

I saw the preview picture and quote and immediately thought, “Oh, Ashley hasn’t seen Mulholland Drive.” 😊

[@BossNerd]

You shouldn't feel bad about not understanding what's going on because nobody did! They adapted this from a book that was VERY explicit and it makes no sense because they couldn't go into details about what everybody was up to. I had to watch this movie 4 or 5 times to finally connect the dots. I still love the movie because of the actors and the banter and the crazy plot twists. It is very re-watchable - I know you only gave it a two but I bet if you watched it again your rating would go up - its one of those movies that grows on you. You just have to forget about the plot and sit back and enjoy the artistry of it.

[@jasonremy1627]

The insane plot of this film was one of the main inspirations for "The Big Lebowski". I actually love this movie. One of my all time favorites. Yes, it's completely nuts and incomprehensible, but it's such a vibe.

[@bryanalexander7571]

Personally, I think Bogie and Bacall are at their best together in the first film they co-starred in, To Have and Have Not.

[@eknapp49]

The book The Big Sleep, by Raymond Chandler is a fabulous example of the “Hard Boiled” detective fiction of the ‘30s and ‘40s. Even down to the perfect setup in the opening paragraph. “It was about eleven o’clock in the morning, mid October, with the sun not shining and a look of hard wet rain in the clearness of the foothills. I was wearing my powder-blue suit, with dark blue shirt, tie and display handkerchief, black brogues, black wool socks with dark blue clocks on them. I was neat, clean, shaved and sober, and I didn’t care who knew it. I was everything the well-dressed private detective ought to be. I was calling on four million dollars.”

[@wendywoodruff2871]

To Have and Have Not was their first screen pairing. She was 19 and he was 40ish. Their chemistry was 🔥. They even made a cartoon of them called Bacall To Arms. When she walked, a trail of fire lit the carpet behind her. 😊

[@grimreaper-qh2zn]

You have to remember one fact. In the book Vivian is married to Shawn Reagan. Her part in the book is very small but Bogart and Bacall had become an item (and eventually married) after being in "To Have and Have Not" Together. Howard Hawks (the Director) wanted more to be made of the Bogart Bacall relationship in the film so extra scenes were written. The basic premise of the story is really that Eddie Mars persuaded Vivian that her sister had killed Shawn Reagan and was blackmailing her. In the book Geiger's business was selling pornographic photos. The Sternwood chauffer killed Geiger, not Carmen. The General has nothing to do with anything other than he was worried why Shawn had left him without telling why and was hurt by it. He didn't realise that Shawn was actually dead. Vivian made up the Mexico thing to get Marlowe to end the investigation as she was worried that he might find out that Carmen had murdered Reagan (though she almost certainly hadn't). Hope that helps.

[@noodle_fc]

Fun fact: In the book, Carmen's first words to Marlowe are, "Tall, aren't you?" to which he replies, "I didn't try to be." Humphrey Bogart was 5'8", so they changed it to, "Not very tall, are you?"

[@TheAbstruseOne]

Yeah, in the stories Marlowe is between 6 foot and 6 foot 1 1/2 inches (it varies between stories). At least it's not as bad as his casting in The Maltese Falcon, where Sam Spade is described in the novel as "a blond satan". Proof that it doesn't matter if the actor doesn't look the part if he can PLAY the part because he was a damn good Spade and Marlowe, THE iconic hardboiled detectives of the era. Would've been a hell of a thing if he could've played Travis McGee and Spenser too...

[@anath7589]

Oh, and while we didn’t get to watch an episode of “Watch Ashleigh’s hair dry” we did get to watch an episode of “A Day in the Life of Ashleigh’s Frustrations.”

[@sparky6086]

"The Big Sleep" is known for it's innuendos or otherwise talking around things. It was reality back then, because many subjects were taboo to speak about in a direct manner.

[@stratiogesdux]

It's better that way. One has to work for it. When one does, one enjoys it more. It's how adults should work.

[@nationaltrails9585]

The book (The Big Sleep, 1939, by Raymond Chandler) that this movie is based on is called Hard-Boiled Crime Fiction, it is described as having tough, unsentimental, earthy or natural realism, graphic sex, violence, sordid urban backgrounds and fast-paced, slangy language. Many will point out numerous interesting facts about the movie and its notoriously convoluted screenplay, many films since have incorporated elements from this movie. The Maltese Falcon has been suggested for reaction, for me, I'll suggest Key Largo for more Bogart and Bacall and Edward G. Robinson. :)

[@Chou-seh-fu]

You think you were confused? At a certain point, the screenwriters called the author of the book to ask who killed an obscure character on a certain page. He nonchalantly told them he didn't know. (Trivia: One of the screenwriters of this was Leigh Brackett, who wrote the first draft of "Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back". But she died of cancer before polishing the script.)

[@thomastimlin1724]

Butler: "May I call you a cab?" Bogart "Yes." Butler: "You're a cab." Oldest vaudeville joke in the book lol. I "so" wanted the butler to say that! hahahha

[@Cheryworld]

Film Noir - a mystery, usually a private detective, snappy dialogue , stark black and white filming. Great genre. Bogart in great ones. The best is probably the Maltese Falcon.

[@dadoctah]

And of course in noir you have to figure out the truth along with the detective in a world where *everybody* is lying most of the time.

[@ThreadBomb]

Film noir is usually _not_ about a detective. That is a cliche put about by people who haven't seen many old movies. If you like, you can google to find out what film noir actually is.

[@michaeldmcgee4499]

i disagree. The best is definitely "Out of the Past" with Robert Mitchum,, Jane Greer, and Kirk Douglas

[@chemquests]

Bogart & Bacall is my favorite duo. Their wit & repartee is some of the best chemistry. All of their movies together are great

[@megwilcox2878]

Lauren and Bacall were the quintessential power couple in the 40's and 50's. Their chemistry was so undeniable, they basically created each other's careers. Now that you've cracked Bogart, you must see The African Queen with him and Katherine Hepburn. You need to know Katherine Hepburn, Ashleigh, I think you'll love her! It's a totally different kind of story, and Bogart plays a totally different kind of character, in the most adorable way. It's the sweetest movie, and you won't have trouble following the plot, as they make their dangerous and triumphant journey. Now that you've hit the Classic Era, you've got all kinds of great movies to watch. Can't wait to watch with you!

[@CoachLouise]

I saw African Queen with my parents when it came out. I was a little kid and was hoping for a movie about a Queen...in Africa ala Tarzan of the jungle..😅 Disappointed!!! Later I came to love it for the masterpiece it is. One of my all time favorites ❤

[@kathleensmith3555]

You meant Bogart and Bacall - Yes even tho he was much older than her she loved him dearly- There is a funny Easter egg in How to Marry a Millionaire about him when she is trying to convince a millionaire that she is interested in older men - lol it’s a cute joke

[@vanessawhitneypro]

Fun to watch you watch Bogey & Bacall fall in love... Such a great classic film!

[@jwoodard29]

The film was based on the book by Raymond Chandler, who was my pal back in the day. The filmmakers also became confused themselves and contacted Chandler for guidance. Guess what? He was confused too! I tried myself talking to Chandler about the matter but he got pissed and slugged me in the jaw. The bottom line is that the plot doesn't matter. What matters is Bogey and Bacall. After realizing that, the filmmakers added some additional scenes between the two, including the one where they are discussing the thinly veiled horse racing metaphor.

[@brettv5967]

Exactly! Their screen presence is so fun that the plot is somewhat irrelevant. I love this movie and I’ll admit that the plot details are pretty half-baked.

[@sandramiller1988]

Pal of yours? Raymond Chandler died in 1959, you must be old is dirt! That 64 years ago when he died, I’m calling shenanigans on that statement!

[@lisathuban8969]

I bow to the great old one who knew the legend.

[@JeffKelly03]

@@CaesiusX Yeah, people who were alive 64 years ago can, in fact, still be alive. Mel Brooks was in his early 30s in 1959, for example. Perfectly reasonable that someone could have known Raymond Chandler and is still alive and kicking.

[@jwoodard29]

@@rmnffx Okay, caught me red-handed I FEEL like we could have been pals.

[@RetroClassic66]

34:51 “a couple of C’s” refers to C-notes, aka $100 dollar bills. A lot of money in 1946. A couple of C-notes in 1946 would be the equivalent of around $3100 today.

[@beowulfthedane]

This is one of three Bogie and Bacall Movies that I consider must see. "To have and Have not" is based on a story by Hemingway. "Key Largo" is a movie that defined the late late show for years and inspired lots of imitators.

[@alamc200]

I read that supposedly, Bogart's ear-tugging was a real-life nervous tic that he worked into the Marlowe character.

[@flmoose1]

Bogey & Becall must sees: "To Have And Have Not" "Key Largo"

[@002DrEvil]

To Have and Have Not has a similar cast and snappy dialogue, but a much easier plot to follow. I would recommend that for a future viewing.

[@stephenkoehler4051]

This was THE Classic film noir Hollywood romance. Bogie and Bacall weren't exactly acting here. Bogart was in the process of divorcing his abusive third wife while he and Bacall were having an affair. They eventually married and stayed married until Humphrey Bogart passed away in the 1950's. They were a screen phenomenon in the period and Bacall's agent insisted on reshoots on some scenes of the movie to capitalize on this. There were delays on set because Bogarts alcoholism left him unable to function on some days. What I love about these movies is I finally get a lot of references in the Warner Brothers cartoons. You can see a lot of them, and this movie was popular and the Loony Toons writers drew a lot from this one. Probably why you got lost is that they had to allude and dance around what they really meant due to the Hays Code censorship of the time. They could imply things, but never overtly indicate the real things going on. For example, in the novel Geiger was selling Pornography and making movies but even this could not be said out loud. The writers had to make cryptic reference to photographs of Carmen in a Chinese dress (silk dress) and so on. The movie also had a lot of trouble with writing with three writers and constant changes were made during the movie. Some of the terms such as "Red points" and such were WWII references. Red points referred to wartime meal rationing and was a slide reference to the body count in the movie. Much along the lines of other famous movies there are two different versions of this movie, the 1945 "original cut" and the 1946 release. Some scenes were missing in the 1946 release at 114 minutes and the 1945 version which was screened for troops overseas. It was the tail end of WW II and these kinds of movies were used to entertain the troops and more often than not were recut to make them more entertaining for the troops.

[@danmonges1539]

Bogie and Bacall announced their engagement a few days after filming was complete and were married for over a year by the time The Big Sleep had it's premiere.

[@johnnyskinwalker4095]

I thought my not understanding part of the movie was because of me not getting stuff but it's probably stuff taken out. lol

[@missmartylynn]

Also, the female cab driver was there because women took over traditionally male jobs when they went off to war. As a result, women got a taste of career freedom.

[@skibugy]

"The Maltese falcon" and "the treasurer of Sierra Madre" are must see movies

[@Antropologopt]

And "The African Queen" plus "We're No Angels".

[@jakubfabisiak9810]

One of my favorite Film Noir. More must-watch noirs: The Maltese Falcon (1941) - Film Noir (and Bogart) classic. Considered the first film noir, based on Dashiel Hammet's classic novel. Naked City (1948) - two oscars. Filmed almost entirely on location in NYC, when films were made in Hollywood studios Touch of Evil (1958) BUT WAIT! - watch the 1998 edit, which is considered the ultimate version, much like the "Final Cut" of Blade Runner. Orson Welles masterpiece.

[@glennwisniewski9536]

Some of my fave film noirs: Out of the Past (1947), Kiss Me Deadly (1955), The Killers (1946), The Killers (1964), Point Blank (1967), Crossfire (1947), The Big Heat (1953), Murder My Sweet (1944).

[@newodkin]

You finally meet Bogey's baby! Lauren Bacall was much younger than him but just as macho as he was. They made the perfect couple and stayed married until Bogart died. They were even drawn into a couple of Bugs Bunny cartoons!

[@sandramiller1988]

2 ⭐️?!?! Ashleigh! This movie is a classic. One of my top ten! Movies like Chinatown are influenced by this movie and others in this genre… “Film Noir” which translates to “dark cinema” in French. Watch this movie again sometime when you have a chance… It’s simply a dark, dazzling tale. Humphrey Bogard was Harrison Ford before he was…

[@CigarMick]

Bogy's character interpretation of P.I. Philip Marlowe is one of Bogy's best roles in my opinion. Philip Marlowe is one of those that started as a radio show in the 30's and transitioned to movies and then TV.

[@rmhartman]

"this is scandalous! For the '40's" Every generation thinks they invented sex. They played the game a lot better back then than they do now!

[@757optim]

From the turn of the century to WWII Packard was a luxury brand automobile. Humphrey Bogart and Lauren Bacall were a big Hollywood love affair thing. One of their movies, "Key Largo", inspired a hit one-hit-wonder song of the '80s by the same name. It also included Bogart/Casablanca references.

[@watkinry]

You have got to get around to the 1940 comedy His Girl Friday starring Cary Grant. You would absolutely love it Ashleigh, it ticks all your boxes a fast paced, funny, romantic murder mystery with S-tier snappy dialogue.

[@nightfall902]

And...it's in the public domain so it doesn't need to be hacked to pieces, blurred, muted etc...etc...

[@melenatorr]

Poor little Harry Jones was the lovely supporting actor Elisha Cook. Because he was so tiny and so often played crooks, he was called "The World's Lightest Heavy".

[@KalKratos]

There's actually a reason why it is more confusing than it needs to be. The version that made it to theaters was reshot to include more scenes with Lauren Bacall having the same kind of chemistry she had with Bogey on To Have and Have Not. These new scenes replaced scenes that explained the plot better. Even one of the early scenes in the reshoots with Bogey and Lauren practically spells out who did it. The original version is out there, it's just a little harder to find since they don't label which version you're watching like they do nowadays with different cuts of movies.

[@Philbert-s2c]

I have both. Part of a special set on dvd I bought a while back.

[@edwardmartin4788]

OF course the other reason it is confusing is the whole Carmen problem. In the book she was involved in drugs and pornography, as are the bad guys in the movie. They had to write the script around that. It's actually surprising they were able to get in what little they did.

[@ThreadBomb]

Raymond Chandler (author of The Big Sleep and also worked in Hollywood for many years) said that a lot of Martha Vickers' scenes were cut down because she was acting Lauren Bacall off the screen.

[@KalKratos]

@ThreadBomb Yeah, I heard that Martha Vickers got the short end of the stick due to those issues. She never got her chance at stardom like Lauren Bacall did. Another reason for the reshoots is that WW2 was ending soon, and they needed to unload all their WW2 movies as soon as possible. So they put other films that were already filmed like The Big Sleep on the back burner. One of the WW2 films was a Lauren Bacall movie called Confidential Agent. The reviews of her in that movie were pretty terrible. Her agent convinced the head of WB to do the reshoots to give Lauren Bacall a better chance at recovering her career. I've seen both versions. Martha Vickers was standing out a bit more than Lauren Bacall in the original cut, despite Lauren Bacall being in the dual lead. The new reshot scenes were good and interesting, they just shouldn't have come in at the expense of the plot. Like Inception, the original cut of The Big Sleep needs careful attention to follow the plot. The theatrical cut made even harder to follow the plot.

[@zer0tzer0]

I can't wait for your reaction to Maltese Falcon and To Have and To Have Not. ACME is the company that made on the Road Runner traps for Wile E. Coyote. A Sap is a leather pouch frilled with lead shot used to knock people out by hitting them at the base of the skull. But it's also a chump or sucker. You heard Bogey say, "make a sap out of me." During WWII everyone was issued ration coupons once a month. Each person started with 48 blue points and 64 red points each month. Blue Points were for fruits and vegetables etc... Red Point for meat, butter & fish etc... also possibly gasoline, oil and tires etc... A Kibitzer is someone who looks over your shoulder and tells you which cards to play. "Cs" are C Notes. C is Roman Numerals for 100. So a C Note is a $100. Don't feel bad. The plot is complicated. But then Casablanca is full of holes. Also Letters Of Transit wasn't a thing. That's right. The Macguffin was a phony. So there's that.

[@shawn6669]

Yeah, because of the censors and a bunch of other issues the script doesn't make much sense and trying to make it make sense just hurts ones head. It's all about the performances and the music and the cinematography and the fact that it's one of the earliest Noir's. Enjoy it on that level and think about the ways it could have worked out have always provided me an enjoyable experience every time I've ever watched it and it's one of my fave films...issue aside. That being said, I'd read the book to get the actual story and there's some documentaries about it that say the girl who played Carmen stole the show from Bacall but because of the censors most of her storyline was chopped or chopped up and the rest was downplayed because Bogie and the Studio's first agenda at the time was making Bacall a big star. Their chemistry is the real thing though. Great movie!!! Cheers! S.

[@shawn6669]

Also, you should really watch "The Maltese Falcon". It's AMAZING!!!

[@shawn6669]

Also I think Carmen was smoking the Opium.

[@jackjones5314]

For black & white movies being old: Mel Brooks decided to make Young Frankenstein in 1974, Carl Reiner & Steve Martin decided to make Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid in 1982, Ed Wood with Johnny Depp in 1994, Steven Spielberg's Schindler's List in 1993, and many more.

[@beowulfthedane]

The General didn't know. All he knew is that his daughter was being blackmailed. He didn't know or care why he just wanted the blackmailors to go away. Vivian knew and Eddie Mars knew and they concocted the story that Shawn was still alive and had run off with Eddie Mars' wife. In the book that the movie is based on Carmen lured Shawn to an oilfield owned by her father. Where she killed him. She tried to do the same thing to Marlowe but he pulled the bullets out of the gun without her knowing and she tried to shoot him with an empty gun. She was a psychotic that killed Shawn Regan because he said no. Marlowe said no too. She is a spoiled brat that doesn't take no for an answer.

[@jpavlvs]

Note on the car windows the Ration Cards. This was filmed during the war or just after and all the cars had ration cards for gasoline.

[@unkindestcut]

Definitely watch the Maltese Falcon next. It (and the book it was adapted from) pretty much invented the entire hard-boiled detective genre. And Bogart is even better in it!

[@gwenking7700]

I am pretty sure that the pulling of the earlobe was just a nervous tic that Bogie had. I have seen him do it in all of his movies

[@citpeks2000]

I love how shocked Ashley always is at how aggressive the women were in these old movies! Don't feel dumb. _Nobody_ gets this movie the first time they watch it. It's one of those rare movies that gets better every time you see it.

[@paintedjaguar]

Everybody knows that "strong female characters" weren't invented until 2015...

[@stevev2492]

Bogart lost an ear in WW1 and had a false ear that was glued in place, it got itchy under the studio lights.

[@DegrassiInstantStar]

Woo-hoo! An older film. Amazing. And we play our favourite game: watching Ashleigh's hair dry naturally throughout the film review, haha.

[@JayM409]

Don't feel bad. The movie and the book were noted for their complexity. The male-female dialog was probably Leigh Brackett's influence. She was Howard Hawks' favourite screen writer. She is said to have invented the 'Meet cute.' She also wrote' Rio Bravo, Rio Lobo, and one of my favourites, Hatari. She was also a popular Science Fiction writer. Her last film was The Empire Strikes Back.' She wrote the first draft of the screenplay before dying from Cancer in 1978.

[@kevinmcfarland6724]

If you like the banter between Bogey and Bacall, they are together in another detective story called Dark Passage that's pretty good. Bacall is the definition of smolder in most of her early movies.

[@BillTheScribe]

About the writing... You'd love the banter in The Thin Man. A lot of the language was very time-specific. It's part of the Hard-boiled style. For a small, more manageable version of this, I'd strongly suggest a scripted audio podcast that ran for a little over a decade called "Black Jack Justice." It was done in this style, but more modern. They are only about 30 minutes long and when the dialog is on, it's really good.

[@anath7589]

As I said before, this was Bogart & Bacall’s 2nd movie together. The first was “To Have or Have Not” with the famous lines of Bacall’s character: “ You don't have to say anything, and you don't have to do anything. Not a thing. Oh, maybe just whistle. You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? You just put your lips together and... blow.” After Bogart’s death, he was buried with the small, gold whistle that had been part of a charm bracelet he’d given to Bacall before they married inscribed with "If you want anything, just whistle." Their marriage was considered one of the marriages of a lifetime.

[@mattperiolat]

And Bacall was 17 when they made that movie, wasn’t she? Mind-blowing.

[@danmonges1539]

@@mattperiolat 19 years old. But wow! No wonder she bowled him over.

[@tomedmonson501]

From the book (which is really great), in the opening lines about going to meet General Sternwood: “I was neat, clean, shaved and sober, and I didn’t care who knew it. I was everything the well-dressed private detective ought to be. I was calling on four million dollars.”

[@etherealtb6021]

The sweet sound of Chandler's dialogue! ♥️

[@garysatterlee9455]

2 out of 5 stars???!!! Ashleigh, do yourself a favor and re-watch it when your brain is in gear! This is a top notch detective thriller that can't be beat. Bogie and Bacall are unbeatable in every movie they are in!

[@markh3271]

I was thinking the same thing, even before she gave her rating. While not solving the plot problems in the story, a rewatch would allow her the chance to better understand the motives and dialogue. Not knowing the lingo of the times also hurts, but the more older movies she sees the better she gets the gist.

[@johnnyskinwalker4095]

It cannot be top notch if several people mention that it's an incomplete movie and most of it was taken out. lol

[@ThreadBomb]

Honestly, this movie may be iconic but it's also overrated. The directing style is stiff, the performances are lack-lustre, the plot is a mess, the music is unmemorable. There are plenty of better film noir you could watch.

[@smg85051]

Like someone has already mentioned, Bogey & Bacall were sometimes know as Mr. & Mrs. Humphrey Bogart, although I'm pretty sure the flame was lit during their first movie together, "To Have And Have Not". Her Voice: Howard Hawks decided to cast her with Bogie in To Have And Have Not, but he thought her voice was too high pitched; he instructed her on how to remedy this issue. Hawks told Bacall to go out into a forest or desert area where she could be certain that no one was around, then scream ... and keep on screaming until she couldn't scream any more or even talk. Then go home, drink hot teas, coffee and get plenty of rest, don't even try to speak for a week. She followed his instructions and when she came to do the movie, her voice had that deep, seductive air about it. The Bogart's were married until his passing from esophageal cancer in1957. Must see Bogie movies? 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 The Maltese Falcon 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 Great cast with Sidney Greenstreet, Peter Lore and the little guy who got poisoned in this one. 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 The African Queen 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 Sahara 🌟🌟🌟🌟 Key Largo 🌟🌟🌟🌟 In A Lonely Place 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 High Sierra 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 The Treasure Of Sierra Madre 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 🌟 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 Casablanca 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 The Caine Mutiny 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟 Humphry DeForest Bogart won the Best Actor Oscar for his role in The African Queen and was nominated for Casablanca and The Caine Mutiny. The American Film Institute named him the #1 classic film actor of all time.

[@charflyone6365]

Hi Ashleigh! I just found you and have been binging your videos for about a week. I'm almost caught up :D Just wanted to let you know I think you're great! 🤗 Can I request Jumpin' Jack Flash? I think you would love that film starring a young Whoopi Goldberg! Put it in the polls and see how she flies!

[@deirdreprice6425]

I know, right!

[@sharonallen2020]

My dad grew up during this Golden Age of television, and he loved these mystery stories (still does), and I enjoyed watching these old classics with him, but I often had to ask questions to follow along. The facial expressions, eye contact, witty banter, and expressions of the day are really fun in the Bogart-Bacall films. Cary Grant films are excellent in this way, too, with his co-stars! One of the comedy lines that comes up here in The Big Sleep, you may have also heard in a Bugs Bunny cartoon from around that time: "That's what the man said. He said that. That's what he said." I think this use of "weening" is about Carmen behaving like an infant who needs to be held and fed, so I think your interpretation is right. The follow-up line about her trying to sit on his lap while he was standing up always cracks me up. I enjoyed watching this--great video!

[@Sorryunomore]

This is one of my all-time favorites. Don't get too caught up in trying to solve every one of its mysteries. Like in life, not every mystery is solved (i.e. the chauffeur's murder). This is a notoriously complex plot and we do not get the benefit of dramatic irony. We see and know only what Marlow witnesses and learns. For me, it's all about the film noir atmosphere, Bogart-Bacall chemistry and action.

[@ynz3713]

You can never go wrong with a Bogart movie and Lauren Bacall is icing on the cake

[@Steve_Blackwood]

Watched The Big Sleep for years, never *quite* figuring it out. Finally read the book, which helped tremendously. But the film is mostly great for watching Bogie and Bacall. 😂

[@nightfall902]

Reading can do that to you.

[@jakubfabisiak9810]

"red points" was the contemporary ling for "dead bodies". Remember - this was filmed before WW2 was over. You can see the cars used in this marked with special stickers to denote that they are entitled to gasoline rations.

[@Philbert-s2c]

"Sassy for what reason?" Because she's Lauren BaCall and she didn't need one? EVER... Seriously, she was known for her acidic delivery throughout her career, long after Bogart's death. They cleaned up the scene where Marlowe finds Carmen and the body. In the novel and the 1978 remake with Robert Mitchum, she's sitting in bed naked.

[@MrDportjoe]

On the drugs question, the story is set in 1930's and heroin was an issue among the trendy as was cocaine. Heck there were still reguaor meds and even a few over the counter products that could quickly lead to addiction issues.

[@hadtopicausername]

I read the book quite a few years ago. It was an interesting read. Lauren Bacall, though... What an amazing woman.

[@WatchwithMarcella]

Great reaction Ashleigh. Orchids are so hard to keep alive that I stopped buying them and now I buy people the LEGO orchids. They stay alive a lot longer.

[@acecombatter6620]

Fun Facts: You didn't seem to recognise Lauren Bacall (Vivian, aka Angel) whom you've seen before in Misery. She played the literary agent. She was also married to Humphrey Bogart. You may remember a song called "Key Largo" that refers to "Bogey and Bacall". They were in other movies together including one named Key Largo. The song: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jofdimyHhZaoatU

[@jenniferjones2863]

Bogart and BaCall were one of Hollywood’s great love stories. Their 1st movie together was “To Have and Have Not.” It was based on a Hemingway novel. She was only 19 and she held her own against Bogart in every scene. And Walter Brennan was hysterical.

[@GeryonM]

So great a love story that it along with his drinking ruined his first marriage.

[@darylabrams2]

Bogart is in every scene of this film. The director didn't want the audience to know more than his character. The ear pulling was simply a way of letting you know he was thinking things out. Bogart and Bacall made 4 movies together and were married shortly after their first film.

[@Hiraghm]

it was even easier to trace calls in the 40s; fewer phones, human switchboard operators, no computerized circuitry... no encryption or automation

[@josephmayo3253]

Well Ashleigh, I wouldn't rank this in the top 10 Bogart movies. If you want more Bogey, try The Maltese Falcon, The African Queen, Key Largo, We're No Angels, The Petrified Forest, or High Sierra. You should also try some Precode movies if you want risque. Baby Face, Night Nurse, Red Headed Woman, and Three on a Match might surprise you with their content.

[@redtrib9828]

Noir Films are some of the most complex plots you’ll get in movies. You really have to pay attention to the plots and dialogue. These aren’t movies like Adam Sandler comedies or Commando where you can come back 10 minutes later and know what’s happening. The Big Sleep is the poster child.

[@geraldmcboingboing7401]

Great reaction, as always!! Yes, this film is somewhat confusing, but it's so engaging, who cares. The snappy dialogue and the interplay between Bogie and Bacall is the reason I like this movie. The insults flow like wine!

[@JeffKelly03]

Exactly. I think this might be my second favorite Bogart movie (after Casablanca, of course, though Treasure of the Sierra Madre certainly makes a case for the second spot), and it's almost entirely because of the incredible banter and chemistry between Bogart and Bacall which is, of course, literally legendary in Hollywood.

[@chrisfancher1267]

yes - the Big Sleep is known to have one of the most complicated plots ever. I heard an AMC introduction stating that the Screenwriter called the author of the original and asked why a certain character did something, and the author said, 'I don't know'.... Even the original author couldn't define the full plot.