Sonic Mania is Bad Now, Apparently?

[@SplashDash_]

what'd you think of Sonic Mania 🤔

[@Numbuh_W.]

Sonic 3 & Knuckles better I fear

[@Lime-AID]

It's boring to replay

[@thesmg201show]

It’s a fun game

[@NinjaElectroYoutuber]

Absolute Cinema

[@meta13gaming]

First Sonic game that I didn’t finish that I feel guilty about

[@Itz_Kwame]

Sonic fans be switching up opinions on games 24/7 and still won’t accept sonic eraser is better than all of them

[@cypher838]

Love potion disaster clears.

[@MacUser2-il2cx]

I just see it as modern Sonic fans hating on Classic Sonic. That was one of the complaints when Mania came out, they bitched and said it was too much Classic Sonic even though it was the only time Classic Sonic was handled the right way.

[@lemon5000-tj6nv]

​@@MacUser2-il2cxthe one complaint i heard was that it was reusing levels **again** instead having original ones through out the whole game didnt hear about the whole classic thing until superstars

[@MacUser2-il2cx]

@@lemon5000-tj6nv That too. Sonic Team (Iizuka, let's be honest) forced Mania into being another rehash of the same zones from the same games that were referenced before in previous games since Generations. Top that off Sonic 4 was absolute crap and undeserving of the title since Mania fits it much better but Sega couldn't go back and undo that. But yeah even despite that, the game still had enough original content like the special stages that made it work. They mixed things up for the better in the reused settings with new gimmicks too. The remixed music was great! You could argue that it does a better job paying omage to the classic series than Generations. It was also Iizuka's idea to make Forces just like Generations in terms of concept and gameplay. He's the one who decided to put Classic Sonic in Forces alongside Modern and the avatar. Oh but it's not Generations Classic Sonic, it's a totally new original version of Classic Sonic from another dimension that Tails somehow still knows about. -.-' Seriously, Iizuka, give Sonic to someone competent! Sega lucked out with Mania and it wasn't even made by them! Forces was crap!

[@theceoofbasedandlitswagger2456]

Alongside Sonic's Schoolhouse, of course.

[@megafan1137]

I used to say the Sonic fandom was an echo chamber, but I've come to realize that's false. It's actually just a fucked up game of telephone, where one person says "hey, this game is great!", followed by "Hey, this game is good!", then "This game's pretty good.", "This game's alright", and it just keeps going until the community decides it's actually the worst game ever.

[@fnsiii7975]

🤣

[@yasmineh.1333]

It's come to a point where people genuinely don't seem to like anything Sonic-related and it baffles me

[@bullylowenthal2683]

​@yasmineh.1333 I wouldn't be surprised years later all the sudden the sonic movies are "bad"

[@jomaq9233]

The Sonic fandom sometimes seems like a “reverse echo chamber”, where instead of constantly spreading the popular opinion, people instead go contrarian and constantly try to go against it, and when that “hot take” becomes the new popular opinion, that cycle happens again

[@littletiffany9089]

Its not a Sonic fandom. Its just how people who live on the internet behave. Just like how a "white spaceship" is controversey on Twitter and KZbin, 99% of people in real life are not concerned with that. "Sesame Street was great until it became woke" is how internet people talk. Few in real life behave that way

[@UlticraftMTT]

Sonic fans change their opinions like their underwear

[@furrysubsandwich]

once every 5 years

[@AllThisOverASliceOfGabagool]

You mean they even get out of their pyjamas to wear underwear? 😂

[@AllThisOverASliceOfGabagool]

@@james656-k8e I respect that. I'm kinda caught with it. As someone who isn't as good at Sonic as others (made worse by watching Speedrunners who make a mockery of the game), I think Mania's level of difficulty is higher, but that's not a bad thing. The music is bussin' and I love the expanded levels, but at the same time it just doesn't have the charm of earlier games. Perhaps it was too polished? I don't know.

[@wafflesplatoon4202]

The only time I changed my opinion on sonic games is forces I thought it was overhated but... i realized why

[@mooganify]

Once a year

[@__4762]

Criticizing Sonic Mania's story for a lack of innovation is like criticizing a movie like Schindler's List for not being funny. The story isn't the fucking point of the game.

[@HOTD108_]

Criticizing Sonic Mania's story for being in the vein of the original Genesis games is like criticizing Red Dead Redemption for not having a double jump mechanic.

[@oeufoplat1079]

Criticizing sonic mania's story for a lack of innovation is like criticizing penguins on their ability to fly

[@TheGloopOfMobius]

All of the sonic stories are shit lol, mania is an actual great game

[@oeufoplat1079]

@@TheGloopOfMobius unleashed and frontiers are actually good stories (because they were written by competent people, not pentac and graph)

[@JD-xz1mx]

ehhhh I mean yes but there are problems with Mania's story that aren't true of other Sonic games. Mostly stemming from the reused levels. What is actually happening becomes confusing and incoherent. Sure, Sonic 1 has no real story, but it is at least clear that you are progressing geographically towards Robotnik's base. In Mania, you bop around from angel island to little planet to south island and all around for seemingly no reason. You go to Stardust Speedway, in the past for some reason, an ability the Phantom Ruby never uses again, then when you beat speedway you do multiple other stages on other continents before progressing to.....Metallic Madness, which is geographically right next to speedway. So..... why did Sonic waste an insane amount of time first rather than just going tom Speedway to Madness? Classic Sonic has almost no story, though I will defend S3&K's, but the story Mania has isn't just weak like the others. Its also incoherent. Which honestly its kind of impressive you even can make your story incoherent when there is so little of it.

[@CrypticKnight10]

When people say mania has reused levels there for the game is bad. I always just saw this criticism as worthless since the game essentially remakes the whole level’s concept and adds new gimmicks to make them feel fresh and new. Also the lack of bullshit that comes with classic sonic game design. With a lot of the time the mania versions being the definitive versions of theses stages especially with all the polish. Plus the music stomps

[@james656-k8e]

to each their own

[@yourself1210]

I personally feel that act 1 of most zones don’t really do much

[@hunn1dbands]

Bro it's literally an anniversary game how is that even a criticism that people could possibly have

[@hunn1dbands]

Imagine if people were criticizing sonic generations for using old levels. That just so dumb

[@james656-k8e]

@@hunn1dbands adventure 2 was also an anniversary game but it didn't reuse old levels so being an anniversary game isn't really an excuse

[@Cyborgianoid]

the fact 1 in 4 videos in youtube is using at least one song of the sonic mania OST is a sign that its a masterpiece.

[@elmemearana]

Same can be said for Windmill Isle, from Unleashed.

[@gamercentral2417]

@@elmemearanayeah but 2 things can be good at once

[@elmemearana]

@@gamercentral2417 well, in Unleashed's case, it can be in double lol

[@Channeloftheyars]

Sonic mania just isn’t as good as sonic 1, 2, CD, or 3D blast. Although better than Sonic 3z

[@Magne_Sium]

And half of music is Studiopolis

[@NinjaPickle]

People hate Generations and Mania both for having largely past games as their identities.... but they're taking the best parts of classic games and enhancing the gameplay 10 fold. Hydrocity in Sonic Mania is not just Hyrdocity from Sonic 3&K. It's amped up with tons of new mechanics, new boss fights, all new level layouts, an updated soundtrack, the works. These games are here to celebrate why we love Sonic, and people hate them because they remind them to much of games that they enjoy. Never understood the weird hate for these games (besides Generations which does have flaws besides gameplay) when they've largely been considered the 2 best games in the series

[@yellowstarproductions6743]

Agreed.

[@JD-xz1mx]

While I don't want to seem like a Mania hater, I am absolutely not, I'd disagree that what they do with the levels are definitively making them better. Adding level gimmicks, like say making chemical trampolines in Chemical Plant, is neither better nor worse on its own. It is in essence just another spring. Hydrocity was your example and that stage in particular is one of the ones where I prefer the original to Mania's remake. Stage design isn't about how much junk you throw in, its about what you do with it.

[@lightyearpig12]

Past games as their identities? That’s the whole point, they’re anniversary games!

[@SuperFlashDriver]

It's weird to think a 2D upgraded game like Sonic Mania would cause people to end up hating what they used to love back in the day. It's a good thing I'm not a fan of many media franchises except the very obscure ones that no one talks about.

[@kawafernandes7025]

@@SuperFlashDriver Okay, so did you know the LCD versions of Sonic 1 and 2 (basically just some electronic devices) are actually playable through some specific versions of MAME? 👀

[@dubb-z13]

I have a kinda cool story with mania. So when I was a kid I was obsessed with sonic, as most kids are. I loved playing Sonic Colors, Unleashed and Black knight on my Wii. As I got older though I drifted away from Sonic. He became all but a memory. Until mid 2020 I went to a friend’s house and he was playing games on his pc and he let me play on his switch. That’s when I saw it. Sonic Mania. “Ooo sonic Mania what’s this?” I asked. “Omg dude it’s like the best Sonic game ever” he replied. I thought hey, I haven’t play a sonic game in almost 10 years, I’ll give it a shot. It ended up being one of the best video game experiences I have ever had. Ever since that day I’ve become an avid sonic enthusiast. I played every single game in the franchise and really got invested into the community. I started collecting Sonic merchandise and now my room is a Sonic collector’s room. I fell in love with this franchise, all thanks to Sonic mania. One of the best games in the franchise

[@james656-k8e]

there was a point in time where i kinda stop playing games, not because i lost interested the series because around that time i was getting into other game franchises and my focus was on that but i got back into the series after seeing the live action movie

[@Jackattack359]

Huh, that is a kinda cool story with Mania

[@adriann3]

biggest mistake of your life it's not too late still

[@Jackattack359]

@@adriann3 you’re gonna have to elaborate

[@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778]

Same here. Love titanic monarch. Mania got me into the franchise

[@JamesMemeHut]

fun fact: the original composer for the Japanese soundtrack from sonic cd actually came back to compose for metallic madness zone and stardust speedway zone. That's why those songs are exceptionally good.

[@PikaPhantomVG]

Pretty sure the soundtrack was all Tee Lopes, barring Angel Island's Encore remix (Hunter Bridges did that song)

[@amereaardvark]

Mania is actually my first sonic game, and it has such a lasting impression that I really got into playing the Sonic games.

[@best_mate456]

Mani is such a great sonic game to play for the first time. Generations also and the fact the remaster is coming we fans are eating

[@Chrissywakeup5]

Same, after mania I only really played the classic for the same experience

[@nintony2994]

Yoooo thats nice bro. Sonic 2 was my first :)

[@skld-xm]

What did you play after Mania?

[@amereaardvark]

@@skld-xm skipped to Sonic Adventure 1

[@madengineerkyouma]

I like Superstars, I think it's slightly above average... but saying it's better than Mania is simply blasphemy

[@Pirate_Knight27]

I like Superstars better than Mania. That's just my taste though. I like the long bosses and the gimmicks that remind me of something from Doneky Kong Country Tropical Freeze, another platformer I love. But I also recognize that those are things other people don't like.

[@thardump859]

Anything and everything is better than mania. Ticks and mosquitoes are better than mania. Cause there both worthless.

[@Mugiwara2k]

Seriously

[@thecoolbroscoolman4672]

@@Pirate_Knight27thanks for explaining why you like it better than mania

[@RedHatGuyYT]

i played superstars like one time and uninstalled it. i still revisit mania on occasion

[@DJontheFM]

0:16 9 months later...

[@SpiderGoblin2012]

A cute detail I've always loved, but never see anyone talk about, is that the amount of levels themselves are the exact same as the number of the entry they're from. Sonic 1 has Green Hill, Sonic 2 has Chemical Plant and Oil Ocean, Sonic CD (which was originally meant to be an enhanced port of Sonic 2) has Stardust Speedway and Metallic Madness, Sonic 3 and Knuckles gets Hydrocity, Lava Reef, and Flying Battery, and Sonic Mania has 4 original stages, Studiopolis, Press Garden, Mirage Saloon, and Titanic Monarch. Yeah, technically Sonic 4 is a different game but shut up

[@JamesP7]

Even the opening cutscene of Mania doesn’t acknowledge Sonic “4” on the elevator, so you’re still correct.

[@endrendstudios7665]

​@@JamesP7I mean it could technically count as happening between 4 and K

[@kawafernandes7025]

@@endrendstudios7665 Well, if that's the case, it would definetly answer some questions... Like, how is METAL SONIC in some CLASSIC games when it was supposed to be trapped in Little Planet between CD-4? (After Sonic CD, Metal was recovered from Little Planet and used in classic games up to Sonic Mania, where it gets trapped in Little Planet 'til the events of Sonic 4)

[@endrendstudios7665]

@@kawafernandes7025 yeah, the metal sonic in 4 could retroactively be from the battle in mania

[@Mr_bukowski4435]

I do kinda wish we got an enhanced remake of Starlight and Spring yard but than again a lot of gimmicks from those levels made their way into Studiopolis

[@ShadowGunR]

I swear I was JUST about to play Mania when I saw this. You perfectly sum up what I love about Mania. -The gimmicks don't feel intrusive but actually act as fun gameplay additions and options for the player -The boss fights and level designs expand and improve on the original games' ideas -The MUSIC is so good, I listen to it even when I'm chilling I've even been making challenges for myself such as trying to beat my best time or holding onto as many rings as I can. Just can't express how much I love this game. Now if you'll excuse me, Ima go play it right now...

[@Jackattack359]

You have fun with that

[@bepbobbap]

So how did it go?

[@ShadowGunR]

@@bepbobbap Finished Titanic Monarch Zone and the True Final boss without dying and keeping the super form for most of it, so it went pretty smooth! (Now that you remind me, Ima go play it again)

[@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778]

Yeah I always disliked how in superstars many of the gimmicks felt more like they where their to make you spend more time playing the game than actually having a fast progression. Compare the press factory act 2 gimmick to manias oil ocean act 2 one. Mania did it so much better giving the player more time to risk.

[@Jackattack359]

@@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778 very true

[@SMCwasTaken]

As a non sonic fan I don't care, Sonic fans hating on Sonic games, Water be wet

[@LuznoLindo]

Yes, I eventually realized it didn't matter, either. Sonic fans are self-loathing gamers who hate the very franchise they grew up playing, and I don't have time to waste on something that pathetic.

[@Randomergoesbrrrr]

:) Water is not fucking wet

[@SMCwasTaken]

@@LuznoLindo fr Sega can make a the perfect sonic game with a great story with Final Fantasy 7/Elden Ring levels of quality and great and fun gameplay and sonic fans will still complain because it's "too different"

[@mr_red3]

@@Randomergoesbrrrrwater is wet keep coping ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[@odinjaynes5003]

I hate to be that "erm ackshually" person but not everyone in the fandom hates on sonic games like this. Some of us are just disappointed with what we got recently. (Frontiers blew my expectations out of the water, I will admit, but Superstars is pretty middling and gets repetitive with its bosses, and by that, I mean they make you wait.) Some of us are just complaining because we know Sonic can do better than this. Heck, sometimes the games can be bad, not every one has to be a hit. But it's just the fact that some of these games feel soulless. (I.E: Forces) The dreaded Sonic 06 was a bad game, but it had soul put into it, and that's what matters. Rant ended, adios.

[@josiahtheawkward6008]

The “Splash Dash is always negative” crowd just fell to their knees

[@vividcolorandrichaudio6134]

Except he's only praising Mania to hate on Superstars, so still negative. Otherwise, this video would've come out years ago.

[@Jackattack359]

@@vividcolorandrichaudio6134 dude, what?

[@josiahtheawkward6008]

@@vividcolorandrichaudio6134 damn y’all be fun at parties

[@vividcolorandrichaudio6134]

@@Jackattack359 So he just *accidentally* waited 7 years to release it almost immediately after his "Superstars bad" video?

[@Jackattack359]

@@vividcolorandrichaudio6134 yes. Yes he did. Now stop whining about it

[@pass_]

you can argue that almost every sonic game is divisive in some way, but I think everyone (even non sonic fans) can agree that this game is a masterpiece, this and S3&K are peak

[@LezSpringfield]

sonic 3 and knuckles has a lot of bad levels though

[@pass_]

​@@LezSpringfieldI have a lot of bad levels

[@blur8163]

Sonic 2 clears 3&K

[@MicahBuzanANIMATION]

@@LezSpringfield I don't think Sonic 3 & Knuckles have any bad levels. The issue is some of the stage gimmicks were obtuse and confusing back in the day, but nowadays everyone knows how to get past the mechanics on the spinning barrels from Carnival Night zone.

[@sebtw8918]

I think Sonic 2 is better than S3&k because I like Sonic 2 level design more but S3&k is a good game

[@POTTERANDMATRIXFAN]

Yeah this is why no one takes Sonic or the fandom seriously.

[@LucasHopkins2006]

That one cheat code that lets you use all of Sonic’s moves, spin dash, super peel out, insta-shield, drop dash, has gotta be my ideal Classic Sonic play style, especially with the momentum, even if it’s from a cheat code, I don’t care that’s definitely my favorite gameplay for Classic Sonic

[@davity2002]

How do you do that

[@LucasHopkins2006]

@@davity2002 Go to level select (in case you don’t know how, while selecting No Save, hold down square for PS4, X for Xbox, or Y for Switch depending on what you play the game on), go to the sound test and play sounds 09, 00, 00, 01

[@davity2002]

@@LucasHopkins2006thanks for the answer

[@sonicszuetomyt5448]

@@LucasHopkins2006 this CODE IS OVER 9000!!!!

[@nintony2994]

You can't do that in Superstars HA!!!

[@alikoneko]

"Christian Whitehead Studios" is actually known as Evening Star, the devs behind Penny's Big Breakaway!

[@MacUser2-il2cx]

Sega's too prideful for their own good. They should have let Whitehead make a sequel to Mania.

[@vividcolorandrichaudio6134]

@@MacUser2-il2cx Evening Star left on good terms. They CHOSE to leave because they wanted to make other things. They've said this themselves multiple times. Iizuka is literally in the special thanks of Penny's Big Breakaway.

[@MacUser2-il2cx]

@@vividcolorandrichaudio6134 I can't honestly believe that. There's no logic behind that decision.

[@Jackattack359]

@@MacUser2-il2cxsorry they chose to make a business decision I guess. Literally nothing wrong with that

[@MacUser2-il2cx]

@@Jackattack359 Mania made money either way. It just sucks that Sega can't come close to recreating that success.

[@JohnnyHikesSW]

A game going from loved to hated to loved is really common and usually means the game is excellent and the people who hated it during the middle stages were being contrarian

[@alphetti4348]

People’s main point is “the levels are reused! It’s bad!” Which is like, NO DOY ITS A CELEBRATION GAME, what separates it from something like Sonic 4 , is how it recycles and remixes levels/mechanics. It’s FUN and well done

[@quangamershyguyyz7166]

It’s the fact that Sega recycles the same areas over and over again, and it only got worse after Mania. They can still make more original levels while still being a celebration. And, Sonic Adventure 2 is an anniversary game too yet still had original levels, so don’t excuse this nonsense.

[@Devilish_Orange112]

​@@quangamershyguyyz7166 Adventure 2 and Mania are doing completely different things, Adventure 2 is a sequel to a already existing 3D game while mania is essentially just a celebration of Sonic as whole.

[@alphetti4348]

@@quangamershyguyyz7166 while I do agree with the first point, the second point not so much. one game set out to be a sequel to an already beloved game One game set out to celebrate what made the classics so good and build off of them, hince “celebration game” Neither of these games are comparable since they have completely different purposes

[@skybite]

Like ‘member berries. ‘Member this? ‘Member that? ‘Member when everything was better back then?

[@Butwhythough881]

@@quangamershyguyyz7166Nah, the only two over reused levels from Mania were Green Hill and Chemical Plant. All the other returning levels were actually ones that were never remade so I can give Mania credit for that. Also the Phantom Ruby is the main we’re even going through this levels which are altered in their 2nd acts mainly due to the ruby’s reality altering abilities. Just because Superstars has all original levels doesn’t automatically make it better than Mania, especially when it fumbles the bag everywhere else

[@mouaznawras]

i still dont get why people saw mania reusing zones from classic games as a bad thing since it doesn't use a old zone without adding a new aspect or mechanic that change the experience.

[@justcallmekai1554]

That's true but everytime I think about Mania it's always the new levels. Those are the best ones in the game. Although older levels get make overs and add in new or scrapped mechanics, at the end of the day you're still playing Green Hill or Chemical Plant. Not saying those levels are bad but rather it damages its identity. Imagine if every stage was new like Press Garden or Titanic Monarch. That's what everyone remembers.

[@superwariobros9108]

It was just the fact Sega was and still is reusing ideas over and over again and people wanted new stuff. I'm fine with mania having green hill but wouldn't it have been better if all the stages were original instead of reused.

[@zLnix]

*cough cough* hydrocity *cough cough*

[@Astro_Crunch]

They handled the returning levels well, but having returning levels is creatively limiting. It limits how the story can unfold, it limits the setting, it limits the level theming layout, it limits mechanics, etc. Sonic Mania had no choice but to be constructed around something like the Phantom Ruby in order to explain why Sonic and co. were bouncing around to so many different locations, and the levels couldn't stray too far away from the originals in order to keep them recognizable. Level progression in the classics worked much better because there was a sense of cohesion, especially in Sonic 3's Angel Island. You really get the feeling that the geography is interconnected, with Sonic going on one big adventure rather than a series of disjointed experiences.

[@alphetti4348]

@@superwariobros9108 honestly the 2nd acts of most of the returning levels just feel like entirely new levels, especially with the remixed tracks that are so good Like how chemical plant act 2 got the whacky workbench gimmick and it makes for really fun and interesting gameplayz

[@Fluxuation]

16:20 YOU CAN DO THAT??? THAT EXISTS???? IVE PLAYED THIS GAME CONSTANTLY AND NEVER KNEW YOU COULD DO THIS *WHAT???*

[@UsurperEntropy]

I think my biggest disappointment with Superstars is that it could've had a 2D handdrawn artstyle, however they cut it early on with the reason being "The team felt that 3D format would better preserve many of the classic aspects that are important to the feel of this format" ... yeah that's just straight up corporate talk for "We don't want to spend like half a million pounds on 2D animation".

[@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778]

We were robbed of a sonic OVA style game. FFS!

[@GGs24-0]

@@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778and if they want ova style in superstars they make it paid dlc

[@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778]

@GGs24-0coming soon in sonic superstars plus digital deluxe

[@Snowstorm...]

Not just that, they said 2D wasn't viable anymore in general, and that 3D was the standard now. That's what made me really upset. I have no issue with the 3D but 2D, spritework especially, is definitely viable.

[@FedoraKirb]

I got Mania last Christmas, and it was my second Sonic game after Generations. While I like Generations more, Mania is still INCREDIBLY fun and well-designed. And the thing is, if you’re new to the series, you don’t even know which zones are new and which ones are returning (I could only really tell Flying Battery and Lava Reef were returning because the original zones felt so much more creative, but it’s not like they felt out of place). Frankly, those two games were the 1-2 punch that made me a fan. The desire to celebrate the past didn’t bore me or lock me out as a newcomer, but rather drew me in because of how much love went into making it all quality.

[@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778]

Mania is what got me into sonic. its gameplay removes all of the slog the classics have and gives the best of all classic sonic. It improves every level it reintroduces.

[@AnferneeMyers]

At first, I was not sold on this video. Then, 14 seconds in, you said Heroes was the best in the series and I was locked in.

[@milkman3214]

Couldn’t have said it better myself, Can’t wait for the whole fanbase to suddenly be team mania again because no one seems to be able to think for themselves.

[@MZOver]

I love Sonic Mania. I really wanted more original stages but it’s fine. The music is great too

[@mcnierstenen9017]

18:52 stopping the music was diabolical

[@jimmy3608]

The Heroes remake is being CONSIDERED. That doesn’t mean it’s been confirmed.

[@mechadeka]

@@n50409 That's still an absurd exaggeration of "considered".

[@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778]

knowing sega, it will be a port with crappy upscale textures and more glitches than the original had

[@Mas0nAnimations]

I guess segs just loves making remakes then making original stages and new games then nostalgia shoving

[@Hugelag]

Sonic Mania reinvigorated my fondness for Sonic and Puyo Puyo. Any game that can do both at the same time is clearly a masterpiece.

[@hydrocityharry977]

What? Who is saying Superstars is better than Mania?! I have never heard of this

[@james656-k8e]

channel pup

[@polocatfan]

nobody, he's faking outrage for views

[@RandomFanOfYourFavoriteGoobers]

​@@james656-k8e LINK IT

[@Hyp3rSonic]

​@@polocatfanyep

[@AaronNew78]

@@polocatfan yeah nobody is also saying mania sucks...

[@Mario1080p]

Upon replaying Mania shortly after Superstars, I really appreciate there being a sound fx slider to lower the sound of ring collecting all at once.

[@voomette_]

16:20 this game has been out 7 years and i have played it countless times as every character I DIDNT KNOW YOU COULD DO THAT??????

[@FedoraKirb]

16:38 Perhaps even more interesting (to me at least) is the fact that not only has the Drop Dash become a series staple in the official games, but in fan games as well. Pretty much any post-Mania fan game that’s not explicitly based on a Genesis-era title is almost guaranteed to have it. Mania really was “by the mania, for the mania.”

[@kyj6838]

Sonic Mania is the golden standard. Then I can't believe after 5 years we went backwards instead of forwards. Superstars is fine but that's the problem. It's just fine.

[@GameAW1]

I don't see that a problem honestly. The franchise doesn't always need to be focusing on improving at all times and it doesn't need to always go for better. Honestly the fans declared Superstars to be the followup to Mania solely because its a Classic Sonic game, but even in design its 100% clear that was never the aim behind it, instead just being a totally original new Classic Sonic experience and nothing more, something it definitely did well enough. Having a game like Superstars happen is not a bad thing, so long as they don't make a habit out of it. A game being fine once in a while is a good thing. Its not always about raising the bar higher and higher.

[@clasherinotheone5249]

Funny I actually think Superstars is better than Mania and a step up i thought mania was to easy and gives you speed to easily personally

[@kyj6838]

@@GameAW1 You're not wrong. But if you're going to ask me to pay $60 for this then I'm going to have my expectations. Is it wrong for any of us to think we could have a successor to mania? Superstars is fine and if you like it then more power to you. But even when it comes to the music it's night and day. Is it wrong for me to have expectations? But other than that you're not wrong bro.

[@kyj6838]

@@clasherinotheone5249 I wouldn't say it's better in the animation or music department but I'm glad you like the game. And who knows it could be better.

[@clasherinotheone5249]

@@kyj6838 the thing that drags manias music for me down is that I like most original tracks more than the remixes especially the cd tracks And animation wise I think the characters themselves are at their most expressive but the rest is not as good as mania

[@WyattD03]

Anyone else prefer the original thumbnail? It used to say “This Game Rules (And I Love It)”, which was the perfect contrast to the Sonic Superstars thumbnail. Now it’s the same words as the Superstars thumbnail but with question marks, yeah that’s just as good.

[@artalogue]

do sonic fans even like sonic?

[@Faisalthefist]

Fr

[@omradacobra]

yea lol

[@ChargeJN]

no

[@gamercentral2417]

No

[@Trivial_Man]

I'm more of an Eggman fan nowadays

[@BeanBeanKingdom]

I can't believe Splash Dash will soon get the chance to realize Sonic Heroes was never good.

[@gamecrafter115]

Yeah it makes me wonder if he ever went back to Heroes like he did to SA2. Because SA2 is a 100 times better than heroes.

[@GUNUFofficial]

​@@gamecrafter115 sonic unleashed better.

[@GoofyBONbon]

Nah not at all​@GUNUFofficial

[@GUNUFofficial]

@@GoofyBONbon HAH, YOU'VE FALLEN INTO MY TRAP, I WILL NOW TELL YOU WHY SONIC 06 IS THE BEST SONIC GAME!

[@RameNoodls]

@@GUNUFofficialNOOO

[@DES_-yo9zg]

The mania soundtrack is so good that my sister who’s never even played has some mania songs in her playlists

[@PencilXY]

Sonic is just bad in general. A sexy bad boy.

[@DoseOfRandom137]

Gotta agree with that one honestly

[@Xeh7197]

Real

[@piranhalettuce]

hot chick heaven

[@Terminal_Apotos]

Vanilla is the size of the Average Human Mother

[@olizalzeortolan8322]

Yeah‚ he can run at sound's speed‚ take out enemies in a flash‚ and best of all‚ he's blue colored and knows how to handle the females !

[@Desencuentra]

Blue Spheres, that's all I need, give me a cartridge of Sonic & Knuckles with a cartridge of Sonic 1 and a Lock-On, that's enough to make a man happy

[@furrysubsandwich]

Hi, I'm brittany bluespheres, and i fucking love bluespheres. It's better then sex.

[@SuperPCgamer101]

I remember playing sonic mania on a bus whilst with my friend and he looked at my screen and was amazed how smooth and fun the levels looked and he finally got why sonic is so mucj fun to play.

[@gamefreakDX]

You probably said it best. Sonic Mania has the best gameplay, but its closest comparison, Sonic 3 & Knuckles, is the better overall experience. Truth be told, the main reason why I prefer to play S3K is because of its narrative. If I was asked to play Mania, I'd do so without complaint, but I have my preference. Mania compared to Generations though, I'll actually choose Generations. Mainly because I thought Generations was a stronger celebration of the overall series and I thought its unique spin on Classic Sonic was more exciting to me, amongst a few other reasons.

[@satelliteprime]

The 3&K | Mania and Unleashed | Generations comparison is spot on. I might not enjoy everything a game has to offer, and in some cases, genuinely despise a large portion of its required gameplay, but I think for some games and some series, the one you consider the best, or even just your favorite, comes down to whether or not you judge one as more a piece of art, or a work of science. If asked what Sonic game of each I'd consider the best overall - it's going to be 3&K, SA2 and Unleashed. But if you asked me which ones I most revisit and would replay at any given moment? I'm gonna answer with entirely different choices - those being Mania, SA1, and Generations. This sentiment is why I and I imagine many others find Sonic such a frustratingly inconsistent series to be invested in, because things like 06, Forces and now Superstars, in many cases, could very easily make these discussions and decisions easier (and in turn, better inform the direction for future titles) but an absence of either quality assurance, competence or even just focus, weaken them substantially compared to what came before.

[@zenerstorm95]

People complaining that the game reused old levels? My god, THE ENTIRE FRANCHISE IS BASICALLY REUSED LEVELS.

[@Breadfruit24]

EXACTLY! THEY PRAISE GENERATIONS BUT HATE ON MANIA??? LIKE-

[@Hyp3rSonic]

​​@@Breadfruit24the issue is that mostly the act 1s of the reused levels only bring back all of the original acts, with barely any new stuff. But for the act 2s, they do a lot of unique stuff for the reused zones. But in generations, every level has unique things. Like I don't remember classic chemical plant from generations only using the original act 1 and 2. It also adds now level design. In fact, I think it has mostly unique level design. However, for the act 1 in mania, it has some unique level design, however, it uses the act and 2 of the original zone

[@yuchun_]

Revisionism has hit such a point that apparently all the games Generations reused for ideas were apparently also rehashed. ...I mean, you're right on 06, that WAS actually pretty rehashed, too bad people ignore how shameless Wave Ocean is because of "muh soul."

[@Orange_Swirl]

Dawg, I have like, more than 500 hours on Sonic Mania across two platforms. I love Sonic Mania so much. It's like candy to me.

[@Charlesingworth]

For me, I like mania. But it is one of those games for me when I pick it up and play it once, say "that was pretty good" and never touch the game again

[@Unoriginal_Fox]

Remind me to never read the comment section of a Sonic video ever again.

[@murabito6435]

Once dated a girl who said she didn’t like Mania, big red flag tbh.

[@Hyp3rSonic]

What's wrong with that? Not everyone has to like a game, its their opinion. As long as it's a valid reason, then you shoudlnt judge them. Just my stance on it

[@Jackattack359]

What the hell is wrong with you?

[@Jackattack359]

What’s wrong with you?

[@supaskiltz9877]

People took this too seriously lol

[@Jackattack359]

@@supaskiltz9877 a bad joke’s a bad joke, dude

[@TheCreativeType]

Something I like about Mania is that every time I return to it, I seem to find new areas in the game’s zones, as the gaming experience I’ve gained over the years lends to a better ability to explore and find things I never would’ve back when I struggled with the Oil Ocean Act 2 boss.

[@KJR_Whatever]

If there’s one thing Superstars has over Mania, it’s that the zone variety is very nice. No reused levels anywhere. Other than that, Mania tops Superstars in almost every way. I still like Superstars, but between the two, I’d play Mania over it any day. I bought the game 5 times so far lol.

[@pokade3659]

bro the "original" zones in superstar still feel resused, the only ones that dont feel like it are cyber city and that ice base map

[@yellowstarproductions6743]

Fun fact: before it was changed,the video title used to be: Sonic Mania Is Fundamentally Fun.

[@andrijajankovic3865]

Why did he change the title?

[@polocatfan]

@@andrijajankovic3865 to clickbait and invent people that don't exist.

[@mr_red3]

@@polocatfanno, some people genuinely think superstars is better and i’ve seen them

[@JeffTheBagel]

@@mr_red3 i am one of them hi

[@JeffTheBagel]

please exeptt me into your socity

[@RedNK]

4:20 Lil note, you're in the Present Stardust Speedway Act 1 is in the past, then you travel to the future and thus you end in the present That's present Stardust Speedway in Act 2 So it's fine

[@bringoni]

mania was my first proper dive into a sonic game, and I loved it, so the sentiment that people only like it due to low expectations is ridiculous

[@BeanZ_Burnt]

Its prett nostalgic now, the multiple times i'd play it on my nintendo switch with multiplayer and stuffs

[@tjreardon8495]

People thinking sonic mania is bad is one of the many reasons the franchise is what it is

[@LuznoLindo]

Exactly. Why Sega thought Superstars would outsell SMB Wonder, I've no idea.

[@tjreardon8495]

@LuznoLindo wait did they really?

[@LuznoLindo]

@@tjreardon8495 I'm just speculating, but they did release Superstars the same time Nintendo released Wonder.

[@tjreardon8495]

@@LuznoLindo they also released forces close too odyssey

[@LuznoLindo]

@@tjreardon8495 Yes, Sega is delusional like that.

[@Buzingle]

Im new to the chanell and the first thing i noticed is your accent, and i like it- great vid

[@chinorobua9596]

sonic mania is peak gaming

[@Agent_Ice0]

You spelled Sonic 3 & Knuckles wrong... 😆

[@andrijajankovic3865]

​@@Agent_Ice0Nah, he said what he said.

[@tjmonkey5795]

Subnautica made me s*** myself it is a good game

[@DemonBlanka]

Saying Mania is bad is crazy because like, it's just super refined classic Sonic, and classic Sonic is fun. Like damn, the worst thing you can say about Mania is that it's like a bunch of hella fun games.

[@randomjunkohyeah1]

@@whentheyD What the hell does your arbitrary construction of “normal person” have to do with this conversation?

[@whentheyD]

@@randomjunkohyeah1 yeah fair enough, i really need to stop interacting with sonic youtube comments cause i'm just repeating the same shit over and over again anyways. not worth the time or embarassment i am causing myself

[@genyakozlov1316]

It's a refined version of Sonic 3, which was worse than 1 and CD, thus Mania is too.

[@gamercentral2417]

@@genyakozlov1316worst take of 2024 is wild. But expected from the sonic fandom

[@gamercentral2417]

@@genyakozlov1316Worse than CD is a personal preference. WORSE THAN ONE?!?! 3&k is the second best 2d sonic game and top 5 in overall.

[@FranHN_]

I think that saying Mania is bad is dumb because is "best of classic sonic compilation", and because of that, is going to be good. But that's the reason why I got bored of it after some time, because it has not personality. Playing levels out of context is just shallow and incoherent. Like, I prefer playing the original games than Mania

[@Jackattack359]

How exactly does that at all tie into the game still being fun?

[@sonicthehedgehog8638]

Your video made me realize that Sonic games immense replay value might be the reason why people change their opinion on a game When it's a game like let's say Mario that is played once and put down you can't see any issues unless it's really big and your experience is gonna be more about the feeling and the atmosphere not the actual gameplay of it But when it's a game like Sonic I feel like we play these games to the degree that the feeling or the atmosphere of the game (the taste of it if you will) is almost gone And it makes small imperfections feel like reasonable issues and small issues into a huge deal One example of a changed option through repeat playthroughs is the orca chase in SA1 the first time you go through it you lose your mind from the sheer excitement and spectacle but after many playthroughs, it becomes this section of the level where you don't do anything for 7 seconds I believe the reason for your changed option about SA2 was the fact that when you were a kid you were experiencing the game as a "spectacle" or an "experience" and now as an adult, you're experiencing it as just a game ... SA2 isn't exactly a game you can enjoy playing casually it's either you are a master of the game and love or you play it casually and don't like it and in general it does have a lot of issues one being the painful radar system I don't think the opinion on Sonic Mania has changed, there have always been these people who don't like classic Sonic and 2D in general and they are the same people who don't know how to play the classic Sonic games and these people didn't like it from the very start but their option was overshadowed by the many lovers of the game, which is something I can understand because I've been there before the game is boring if you don't know how to play it and it has a high skill sealing, it took me about 7 playthroughs to see the game for it's worth and super Sonic helped a lot The game never was overrated and no one compared it to Sonic Boom, people were comparing it to Sonic 3&K and it was praised for the fact that everything thing about was perfect and it still is to this day and the only complaint about it was the "original levels"

[@fnsiii7975]

I liked how you worded your thoughts. It’s good food for thought and makes sense to me.

[@yasmineh.1333]

I was surprised hearing him say he couldn't stand SA2 anymore. I bought it recently and I've loved it, it made me feel like a kid again in a sense. Although I've installed multiple mods that make some aspects more bearable (treasure hunting levels in particular), so that could be why I'm not all that bothered by it lol

[@MikeTButler]

You be Spittin

[@gamma_dc8289]

I love sonic mania, it was never my favorite classic sonic game (that will always be 3&K) but it's absolutely worth every penny I put into it.

[@boldnbrash214]

Whats next: "Sonic Adventure 2 is Fundamentally Flawed?"

[@Wizardjones69]

Kinda........ especially tails and knuckles stages

[@Hewasnumber1]

@@Wizardjones69The mech and treasure hunting stages are good. Anyone who thinks otherwise is just bad at them.

[@Wizardjones69]

@@Hewasnumber1 knuckles stages are a downgrade from SA 1 ones, instead of collecting 3 at the time time (it was pretty fun), in SA 2 knuckles stages are just 1 piece of Master emerald for time, tails stages are A LITTLE better, but they souns design of them are annoying, sonic stages are obviously the best, but sonic controlls in SA2 feels less enjoyable than SA 1(because the levels being well, more linear), i understand the nerf of spin dash, but that was the charm of SA 1, its like remove blj from mario 64

[@Hewasnumber1]

@@Wizardjones69 Knuckles stages in SA1 were awful. They small locations with the emerald pieces oftentimes being out in the open. There were no hints (or if there were they were useless), and the radar was your only lifeline. Treasure hunting stages in SA2 were far better because the levels were slightly bigger on average, and the radar/hints only steered you towards one piece at a time. You had to remember where each hint’s emerald piece was, and master getting from each of those locations to the other. Most Knuckles and Rogue stages in SA2 were still able to be completed in under a minute, but it was significantly more challenging and engaging (not to mention the music was a huge step up). And the mech stages were significantly better in SA2 because they took the already solid base of Gamma’s stages, but actually gave an incentive to do well. Maximizing your chains to get the most score makes the experience a whole lot better.

[@Wizardjones69]

@@Hewasnumber1 "more" doesnt mean its good, the hints you go with the tikal red light or idw what is that, minus is more

[@EclipseKirby]

There are people who think Superstars is better than Mania? Really? REALLY?!

[@Robotta]

I wouldn't say is the better game overall but I can def see why some people prefer it. It has all original levels, the chaos emeralds actually having an use for once instead of being only for Super Sonic, and it feels fresh. Now, you can like or dislike the execution of the game, or that the bosses are too long, but people are exaggerating with Superstars overall. I've already seen people putting it below Sonic 4 and... just no.

[@diegorocha6931]

Thats disrespectful af, Superstars is a shitty unfinished game while Mania had everything that makes 2D Sonic enjoyable

[@Foxthatisaplush]

Those people are the true NPCS, because there is NO WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH that Sonic Superstars Outclasses Mania.

[@pablogradiente]

​@@Foxthatisaplush Recently, I literally answered a Sonic fan on Twitter saying Mania is better than Superstars and his army of followers started quoting me without even explaining why Superstars could be better.

[@NeroV1L3]

​@Robotta level design is garbage, bosses are garbage, music is mid, visuals are alright. I don't know how they made a masterpiece like Mania then absolutely fumble the next 2D game. Obviously Sonic Team had little to nothing to do with Sonic Mania and it was all Christian Whitehead and the other teams involved

[@Realtacl]

I have not seen mania hate at all. People have complained about mania reusing old levels but the thing is that is uses them in cool ways instead of just being a lifeless rehash like a certain 2D platformer from 2010 from this franchise.

[@МишаСав-ц9ь]

.......What cool ways?..... Also IT IS a lifeless rehash. A good chunk of level design is COPIED from older games.

[@Jackattack359]

@@МишаСав-ц9ь you done whining yet?

[@Realtacl]

@@МишаСав-ц9ь Cool ways as in: adding the zip lines in green hill act 2. or adding on to the chemical plant pipes by adding the metallic madness gimmick,as well as the syringe wacky workbench gimmick splash dash mentioned in the video,if it was a soulless rehash it would’ve been just been these exact zones with almost nothing new (Sonic 4 and forces). Bosses are also pretty cool with the hydrocity act 1 boss being flipped on its head. Or how titanic monarch’s act 1 boss having the elevator gimmick. There’s plenty of other examples like metallic madness’s background gimmick or how baby Sonic is used here much more compared to the the original. The electric shield walking on ceiling (that I believe wasn’t in the original though I could be mistaken) and the wacky workbench gimmick in flying battery. Or the quartz quadrant gimmick in lava reef act 2. Or the marble garden gimmicks in stardust speedway act 1. Or the hook gimmicks and boats in hydro city. Or the submarines in oil ocean act 2. Again,if it was just a soulless rehash these would all be the same as the originals with probably some cheap or tacky gimmick that’s only used for one section in the entire level (once again,Sonic 4)

[@Butwhythough881]

@@МишаСав-ц9ьBro forgot how the phantom ruby works.

[@mulhollandoverdrive]

@@МишаСав-ц9ьyou just categorically have not played the game if you think it's a lifeless rehash. literally by green hill act 2 they're cramming so much into a single level that it's impossible to think it's a rehash. it stops being "just" green hill and starts adding in splashes of angel island from 3, the master system games, and even the old toy show build. every zone and act is like this, packed with things from the franchise the developers love.

[@lavilapis]

Hearing people claiming that Sonic Superstars is better than Mania was truly the most ridiculous thing I would ever hear in my life

[@telekinesticman]

If not for the old zones, vague story and weak bosses (especially the finale), Sonic Mania would probably be my favourite Sonic game of all time. It's that good.

[@chiliboi69]

Exactly my opinion.

[@KperaOfficial]

If it wasn't for the reused zones, mania would be the best 2d sonic game of the franchise (still better than superstars lmao)

[@DoseOfRandom137]

I wonder, what do you think the best 2 Sonic game is?

[@KperaOfficial]

​​​@@DoseOfRandom137 s3k, i know, sandopolis exist but it still doesn't rely on old zones. But overall, youre gonna have a better time with mania, way more than 3k

[@DoseOfRandom137]

@@KperaOfficial Yeah i'd probably say the same, although mostly because I grew up adoring Knuckles as a kid, I don't think I ever put much time into s3k I can't lie.

[@pokade3659]

why do people keep bitching about reused zones?

[@dayvonlouis5187]

@@pokade3659low hanging fruit so it’s an easy target it’s like the loading screen complaint or the kiss scene from 06 people like to harp on about as if there’s no unique or personal take on the quality of the game and it’s easy to forget that this was part of the anniversary year and was a celebratory game the reused Zones aren’t a big deal to be honest given the context of what the game is supposed to be and people should get over it

[@creeptrap3104]

What?! But Splash Dash, how could Sonic Mania be bad now if it's fundamentally fun?!

[@teaoftraffic]

i unironically had this same exact argument before, where someone said portal 1 wasn’t as trash as portal 2 they got grilled by portal 2 fans in a matter of seconds.

[@pokade3659]

both games are good in their own ways, like the half life games

[@deadturret4049]

I love both, but I prefer portal 2 over 1. Portal 1 does have the advantage of being closer in theme to Half Life though. It's a pretty creepy game whereas portal 2 is more comedic.

[@Joshi_ForReal]

My only issue with Mania is that it has a lack of bababooey! (Nah fr tho mania is my favourite classic game, just above sonic 2)

[@3_outof_4]

That 3&K to mania comparison is the best way to look at it, it comes down to whether people prefer a solid game or a strong experience, it’s why I’ll always put 3&K over Mania, or SA2 over Generations. But both arguments have their merits, especially when it comes to sonic. Great video man

[@RockyPixel]

Reminder that Sonic Labrynth was decently recieved when it released.

[@RocketDoesStuff]

Mania is my favorite Sonic game of all time, and I’m always saddened how it’s generally ignored by the community. Perhaps it’s because I played Mania before the other Genesis titles, but I feel like the Mania iterations of each zone are significantly better than their originals, and the lack of original themes is more than made up for with its reinvention of their mechanics and design. I guess it’s also how I approach games as well: you have a discussion of Generations vs. Unleashed and whether consistently good gameplay is more valuable than an immersive experience, and I tend to lean more towards the consistently good gameplay. I’d much rather play a game that lacks some in story/presentation if it feels incredible to play, and I think that’s why I click with Mania so much. Great video, and I appreciated your nuanced take on the subject! Keep bashing on those Superstars boss fights!

[@whentheyD]

immersive experiences are extremely important to the memorability of a game. if you make a game with good gameplay but zero memorable things, its going to end up on everyone's backburner eventually.

[@LuznoLindo]

@@whentheyD You've got a good point there. Studiopolis Zone is the only zone I really cared about back when I played Mania.

[@polocatfan]

it's literally not being ignored.

[@Esclerovácio]

You dont know how to have fun, if someone made the world's objectively best game but it was only black and white and used the same cenery for it's entirety, it'd be foolish to complain about it since looks change jackshit in a game@@whentheyD

[@ItzSpecter]

This really is one of those "Dont mess with us 'blank' fans, we dont even play our own games."

[@fryguy9704]

Finally, something we can all agree on

[@МишаСав-ц9ь]

...No, not really. Game is still worse than its competitors.

[@Devilish_Orange112]

​@@МишаСав-ц9ь .....What competitors? New super Mario bros U deluxe?

[@CJ-42070]

​@@МишаСав-ц9ьbad take man

[@SenvoSounds]

Great... Now I gotta go play Sonic Mania again...

[@soliumi]

1:02 this dude just hit all the monsters on the beat of the song

[@medicfdumbo]

I wish sonic games did that intentionally

[@AltKaxREAL]

​@@medicfdumbocongratulations! you just made an amazing idea for a new Sonic game, I'd wanna see that in action

[@punishederic4761]

idk why anyone would complain about Sandopolis and it's Ghosts. It's basically a good version of underwater mechanics, you just have to hit a lamp switch instead of waiting for a bubble and the lamps last WAY longer than your breath underwater does. The timing is extremely generous and in the 20+ times I've beaten that stage I don't think I've been killed by a ghost a single time so I don't really understand what makes it "an annoying gimmick" it's more just like an additional challenge to the stage that is very easily surmountable.

[@taputrainer8463]

Never had a problem with the ghosts either but the stage just drags on for a very long time and doesn’t feel the greatest to speed through. Honestly I feel like a lot of levels in 3K weren’t as fast and fluid as Sonic 2 and took much longer to beat for almost no reason. Lava Reef, Marble Garden, Carnival Night, Launch Base, Sandopolis, and Flying Battery all suffer this issue. Sure they’re some longer levels in Mania but at least they felt far more fluid and fun to play than what I just mentioned

[@Pirate_Knight27]

​@@taputrainer8463On the flip side, I speed through Sonic 2's levels so fast that they never left that much of an impact on me. 2 to 3 minutes just isn't long enough for a good Sonic level imo. I find the S3&K levels left more of an impact on me.

[@taputrainer8463]

@@Pirate_Knight27 Interesting I feel like 3-5 is usually like the amount of time a classic level should take someone whether casually or time attack (depends on the level) I feel like anything longer than 5 minuets just doesn’t feel like I’m speeding through the level if that makes sense. It also hurts in flying battery when you’re trying to go fast but it still takes over 5 min and your time bonus is just 100. This doesn’t apply as much to modern sonic games because heroes and unleashed have good levels that are longer than 5 min. But I feel like for the classics 3-5 min is like the reasonable amount of time a level should take so it feels fast. Anything longer just makes me feel like I have a skill issue and I’m too slow

[@globalistgamer6418]

Sandopolis IS a slow and claustrophobic level, but that's not a bad thing; it's actually one of the reasons why S3&K feels so interesting to play though overall because there is variation in pacing and tone across the game. You get rewarded for making it through the tension and darkness of Sandopolis Act 2 with Lava Reef 1, a very fast, open, bright and upbeat level before things get more serious again in Lava Reef 2 and Hidden Palace. This kind of feeling is missing in Mania where most levels maintain a similar cadence of being generally pretty fast but with flow-disrupting gimmicks, and even when it is somewhat grandfathered in from reused levels, there is little coherent overall pacing, sense of context or plot crescendo for it to contribute to.

[@KitsuneYojimbo]

​@globalistgamer6418 Like Starlight Zone in Sonic 1. Starlight gives an easy, refreshing break from the frantic nature of Labyrinth and gives you a breather before the three act final stretch of Scrap Brain.

[@Dewthekid]

sonic fans cant accept that sonic school house is the best sonic game 🤦🏾‍♂️

[@thealterego3187]

Agreed

[@izzy1979]

It's PEAK gaming.

[@BeanZ_Burnt]

FRFR i dont get these people smh

[@Punkyyyyy]

Nah, sonic labyrinth *SWEEPS*

[@BeanZ_Burnt]

@@Punkyyyyy I POLITELY DISAGREE AND AGREE TOO!!

[@scizorbullet8185]

Unfortunately the "i hate all sonic games" internet shit like 7 or 8 years so this won't go very viral.

[@Greo_Animation]

Am I going crazy, or did the title and thumbnail change?

[@poppip10]

yeah they did

[@charlesbishop3170]

0:14 pov: you've never heard of sonic unleashed.

[@GaulSoodman884]

Sonic 06 is clearly the best sonic game. The community is crazy to think otherwise.

[@Probba]

Are these Sonic Mania haters in the room with us right now?

[@МишаСав-ц9ь]

Yes

[@noobbox9113]

they’re mostly on twitter tbh

[@hunn1dbands]

Surprisingly, yes

[@tf_is_this_shit]

They arent real. You guys just forgot to take your schizophernia pills

[@yurifairy2969]

It's an extremely loud minority

[@ItThunderbolt]

Thank you Sonic Mania OST for providing video gamer KZbinrs with background music for their videos. I hear Mania's music everywhere

[@ZacharyDietze]

"You can’t top perfection" (Sees Sonic Mania Addendum) *"…I stand corrected"*

[@Cr1ticA]

Sonic Mania doesn't suck, and it never will.

[@masterreece1098]

Sonic mania is without a doubt, the best 2D sonic game ever, change my mind

[@maddoxreddish4352]

Ok uh, you cant say im nostalgic bc i didnt grow up with it, but 3&k, best classic artstyle, best story, introduces a fan favorite character, originated the idea of super sonic final bosses, hyper sonic, etc

[@masterreece1098]

@maddoxreddish4352 I meant 2D sonic games as of now, not the classic games

[@whentheyD]

​@@masterreece1098 what is this dude waffling about 2D is 2D

[@masterreece1098]

@whentheyD I mean 2D sonic games that came out after the 90s, like sonic 4 episode 1 and 2, sonic advance, stuff like that

[@dayvonlouis5187]

Don’t need to an opinion is an opinion and I say Mania is a great Sonic game but S3&K is still unsurpassed as the best pure 2D Sonic game unless advance 3 is in consideration I’d put Rush up their too but it’s more of a 2.5D game not in the same vein as Mania and S3&K

[@HarperSeemsCool]

the title and thumbnail switch made me go from not interested to clicking asap

[@Butwhythough881]

I find it hilarious how Sonic fans have started trashing on Mania just to prop up Superstars for being less favored. The reused levels are literally a part of the game’s story and have new and different layouts and new gimmick because of the use of the reality altering abilities of the phantom ruby. Superstars may have less nostalgia bait and new levels (that are pretty unimaginative and just pul and blend together elements of classic zones while also still relying much so on nostalgia), in fact those are the only arguments if seen people use in favor of Superstars, but Mania honestly a lot more of something I felt Superstars lacked; heart, charm, and commitment. Mania knows what it wants to be and sticks with its guns from start to finish whereas Superstars I feel struggles in trying to figure what it wants to be and what it does in execution. So sorry not sorry, I’ll take Mania any day over Superstars.

[@james656-k8e]

or maybe it has nothing to do with superstars and some fans just simply think the game is not as amazing as people claim it to be i thoguht it was obvious by now that each sonic fan has their own different taste in sonic games.

[@Butwhythough881]

@@james656-k8e Then why do they feel they need to act like maniacs whenever someone says they prefer Mania over Superstars? It seems to have alot to do with Mania if they’re doing that because every time people defend Superstars, Mania almost always gets dragged in and used in a negative light just to prop up Superstars. Maybe question those people as well?

[@Sonic_the_hedgedog]

​@@james656-k8eThe problem is that Sonic Fans used to love Mania and immediately after Superstar came out, people started to hate it.

[@Ismatic1906]

I never liked Mania, wasn’t all too fun personally. Didn’t like Superstars either

[@vinkennest3274]

Mania is miles better. But nothing tops advanced 2

[@crimsoncrusader518]

That's just the sonic fanbase being petty like when Generations and Colors came out.

[@jamiegioca9448]

Bros out there thinking "More ambitious" equals "better". XD

[@TwistedLullabies]

Sonic fan fallacy

[@theweirdpenguin]

I recently saw a 1 star review of sonic mania saying sonic forces was better cuz sonic mania is a pixel art game smh

[@RandomUser8P]

Well damn, that title and thumbnail changed fast

[@DarnHooligan]

Sonic revisionism is all fun and games until they start tryna say the good games were always bad 🙏🏼😮‍💨

[@vividcolorandrichaudio6134]

Colors

[@lemon5000-tj6nv]

we got ppl trying to say that the rush games were bad now 💀

[@hype5456]

Or people change opinions

[@castform7]

​@@lemon5000-tj6nvI'm playing through Sonic Rush for the first time right now and I'm sitting here flabbergasted. Have they actually played this game.

[@strawb2128]

I swear, it's only a matter of time until we start seeing people make videos, claiming that Sonic 4 was actually a masterpiece all along, and Generations becomes the "bad one."

[@nafet]

Playing Mania is like playing an unfamiliar pinball machine. You just keep the ball alive and hit random spots and watch the colors flash..

[@kernel6892]

I see what you did with the title change >:) I didn't click on this video when the title was positive, but when you changed it to be negative, I was interested. This is a successful experiment.

[@mrpiccionedivino5598]

Imo this title feels like he's less an animation and sonic fan and more a terminally online person on youtube and twitter that when they see more than 3 accounts with more than 3 likes that badly criticize the things they are fan of they think that's a third of the fanbase or something.

[@daxmoney5011]

People that say Mania sucks are the same people that think Sonic 4 Ep 1 is good