Jeep President Calls Out Ford For "Tricking" Customers With The New Explorer Timberline!

( tfl-studios.com/ ) Check out our new spot to find ALL our content, from news to videos and our podcasts! Head of Jeep Brand, Jim Morrison, would like a word with you if you're thinking about the Ford Explorer Timberline. Here's what he had to say in a recent interview!
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#Timberline #GrandCherokee #Jeep

[@TFLnow]

Check the new the Ford Explorer Timberline HERE: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aX-ZiqZ9hbqfhpY AND Here's the link to the ORI Index and how you can score your own car or truck: tinyurl.com/ytt2h854 Also check out our ORI leaderboard here: tflcar.com/2021/10/tfl-off-road-index-leaderboard-tflori-these-are-the-most-off-road-worthy-cars-and-trucks/

[@RadDadisRad]

It did what Subaru did and replaced painted plastic panels with unpainted black panels and instead of “Wilderness” they are calling it “Timberline.” That’s so edgy of them to copy someone else.

[@georgedoolittle9015]

"soaring oil prices" scares the *HELL* out of Detroit *ALWAYS* ...with of course the irony being without *CANADIAN OIL* their whole worthless business model would be Fuched *AGAIN* !

[@3wolfsdown702]

It's called torque

[@toyota420xp]

Fords are more reliable than jeeps

[@toyota420xp]

@@RadDadisRad uhh you are wrong about subaru. Like more ground clearance, revised bumpers for better departure angle, revised gear ratio for better slow crawling, front skid plate, all terrain tires, stronger roof rack that can support 220 pounds while driving.

[@providentpathfinders219]

Let’s be honest here! Both these vehicles are FULLY capable of hopping the curb and driving through a gravel lot to cut the line in the Dutch Bros. drive through…..which will be their primary use…..

[@jflowers090]

Big facts

[@rodjbosch]

Truest words ever. You can lump in alot of lifted half tons and jeeps too. Lots have the look....but rarely get used seriously off road. I know Zero people who off road an SUV....shit most don't even see a gravel road. Same as trucks....most are used as a daily driver.

[@johnviera3884]

Yeah but what about when it rains? Grass has soil. Soil turns to mud. I got a Ford Transit stuck on grass the other day. Spinning rear driver wheel.

[@Jackmerius_Tacktheretrix]

Facts! 😆

[@wpaia]

but wouldn't you get the toyota 4runner instead.

[@johncuthbertson9858]

The Explorer is IIRC $50K vs the new Jeep GC of around $63K. Things like the camera system or larger infotainment screen don't come as standard on the GC. As a current GC owner I am a bit disappointed in that price. It's about 8K more than the outgoing model and out of my range. For those that mainly head to remote camp grounds, national and state parks, or the national forest areas -- with the family and dog (which is me) the Explorer might be sufficient. $16K is a lot of money for a center locker, a low range, and air suspension. Just my 2 cents. Have a great day everyone.

[@jimgraham6407]

Great breakdown, but we all know the folks buying these vehicles aren't taking them to seriously off road. They MAY take them on a dirt trail to a campsite, but more likely will be running to soccer practice and Costco.

[@vinbia]

lol my fam

[@jimcarlson6157]

the way things are going, tactical vehicles will be needed to get past anti-maskers when driving the kids to school

[@MS-mr4zm]

I’ve seen grand cherokees used for serious off-roading, can’t recall seeing an explorer

[@michaelsmith9308]

i avoid any dirt, sand, mud or water deeper than three inches in my rubicon:)

[@Boltbacker83]

The Grand Cherokee Trailhawk is a legit off roading vehicle. The Explorer is not.

[@user-rg1lx8yt6g]

When it comes to these small details such as height departure trans engine etc more technical aspects of the vehicle I trust you guys more then anyone else. They don’t care about towing or true off roaring you guys push these vehicles and truly speak your mind I respect that keep it up.

[@cod63667]

Oh great; a tinted explorer with leds to freak me out when it pulls behind me.

[@20tea]

Offroad police!

[@DOR1TOMCSWAGGER]

Police headlights on the explorers are a bit different from the reg explorers but I do not know anything about the undercover explorers have not seen one yet

[@zachsteele6964]

@@DOR1TOMCSWAGGER they don't say explorer on the front of them they say interceptor Even though they are unmarked.

[@JimSpence]

@@DOR1TOMCSWAGGER that’s the point 🤔😉😄

[@OffRoadNewb]

@@zachsteele6964 your eyesight would be amazing if you can read interceptor in between the headlights

[@MysteicVoltronus]

So Ford is selling an "appearance" package for those people with 2 kids who want to look outdoorsy.

[@dmelson7502]

A lot of campgrounds have paved parking spots.

[@MistaRoyanT]

Better than those that spend extra to buy Rubicons/G-waggens/Raptors/Rangerovers that never leave a paved surface. Nothing wrong with a mild offroader

[@Pepe-dq2ib]

@@dmelson7502 so buy a luxury suv like a escalade for camping then? Then again, theres a guy in Japan who goes camping in a Ferrari F40.

[@314jeepsnmopars3]

Considering they haven't had an actual transfer case and low range since the 4th gen Explorer can't really be that surprised.

[@Pepe-dq2ib]

@@314jeepsnmopars3 my brother has an Explorer and the air suspension died as soon as warranty did. We just converted it to regular shocks and spring.

[@Damian1975]

Just a side note. I have a 2014 Ford Explorer with the management terrain system and we had the worse snow Soren in New Jersey for the past 20 Years. I had to get to work when the roads were unplowed and deep. The explorer got me to and from work beautifully. I will stick with the Ford brand. I just don’t think the jeeps hold up mechanically

[@benharper1087]

Cool... you made it through fresh powder - tough driving.

[@Jackmerius_Tacktheretrix]

Thank Land Rover because thats where ford got that sysyem from. Also all season tires and awd will do good in snow anyway.

[@smarangolo1234]

Well getting to work isn't a selling point and don't tell your boss that.🤣🤣🤣.....unless you are the boss

[@scotth242]

I had a 2014 sport and now have at 2020 ST. You would love the way the 2020 models with rear wheel drive drive bias handles the snow, much more than the 2014.

[@Steve-yr5vi]

I usually get the Ford Edge as a rental for ski trips, and the Edge has gotten me safely through multiple Colorado Blizzards and does amazingly will in the snow. That capability is what most are buying a vehicle like an Explorer or a 3 row Grand Cherokee. The hard core off-roaders are not in this segment, Ford does marketing better than any car company out there, they put exactly what Explorer buyers are asking for into the Timber line, smooth ride, just enough extra off-road chops to handle the occasional blizzard or off-the beaten path camping trip.

[@jamestl124]

Explorer Timberline is pointed towards the Outback/Ascent. Not a gosh dang Jeep.

[@riffle91ar]

The outback would destroy it lol maybe not the Ascent tho.

[@Natethegreat200c]

Sir. Anything with skid plates and how hooks (which Subaru doesn’t have) is marketed towards Jeep. A outback can’t off-road, TFL showed us that. Both the outback wilderness and timberline Explorer are marketed to go over Jeep, not each other.

[@jeremiegrenier7192]

@@Natethegreat200c take a look at the wilderness package they have skid plates. Do some research you have the internet.

[@moose5.9]

More people will cross shop an explorer and a jeep vs explorer and a Subaru....the price point and size is whats comparible

[@Natethegreat200c]

@@jeremiegrenier7192 I mentioned wilderness. READ

[@krashnpa]

So.... if I am picking up what you're putting down, the two "off-road" decals I put on my Jetta aren't going to help?!

[@99unclebob]

😁😁

[@zachc1297]

+10 horsepower, but no added offroad capability

[@Julian-do7bv]

Any vehicle can be a off roader if you just dont care lol

[@kyleolin3566]

@@Julian-do7bv I made it through a mud hole that sank a Dodge Ram on 33s with a Volkswagen Fox. Never mind that I popped a front tire off bead doing it. Lol

[@Julian-do7bv]

@@kyleolin3566 see if you dont care itll go lol

[@jessesimpson777]

Not to mention, the Grand Cherokee Trail Hawk now has a front disconnecting sway-bar.

[@dearbulls]

Only front not all 4?

[@jessesimpson777]

@@dearbulls The Wrangler Rubicon only has a front disconnecting sway bar so naturally the Grand Cherokee would only have a front disconnecting sway bar. They don't want to make the vehicle lean too much in the corners or else it'll flip too easily like the old Bronco 2s and early Explorers.

[@TheCapn23]

A whole lot of people are paying for a feature they'll never actually use

[@fabioleal3442]

Besides 4xe

[@jessesimpson777]

@@fabioleal3442 correct

[@housepianist]

In all fairness, the Explorer has never been a serious off-roader and that's by design. It's certainly more than capable of navigating off-road but it's not a rock-crawler. The Timberline package is more cosmetic and at best, it might make an average off-road excursion more manageable but I don't think Ford intended the Timberline Explorer to compete with the Grand Cherokee. So Jim Morrison probably has a point but it's petty. I say "So what?" The promo videos for the Timberline show it traveling on mostly dirt and low-grade gravel trails. It's being used exactly as it's intended to so if Ford wants to paint things and stick badges on things, it's no big deal. People who buy Timberlines will be very different from those who buy Grand Cherokees.

[@algarinthompson8749]

Most People who buy the Ford Timberline will buy it mainly for the looks.

[@jamesbeaman6337]

Exactly, what is lost here is what prompted Morrison’s comments. Did Ford claim the Timberline package makes the Explorer as capable as the GC? If not, it sounds like Jeep is feeling threatened by it.

[@DrivenHard]

Can someone pin this comment!!!

[@olliecrow3547]

Well said

[@tri3pleagent]

@@jamesbeaman6337 this has less to do with the Explorer and more to do with Bronco. He knows the Bronco is what's really going to cut in to his brand...this Explorer is a basically an appearance package...who in their right mind actually thought the Timberline was a true off-roader?!

[@Matts000]

I’m confused? Did Ford put out an official press release saying that it’s better then the Jeep?? And if not, then what is FCA so upset about ?

[@larrybe2900]

It is the nature of the times where it is easier to put down the competitor than it is to promote/tout your own.

[@DemsRdisguisedredcoats]

Jeep has got their panties in a wad over all the excitement with the new Bronco... now they're just over sensitive about everything.

[@alswann2702]

He's upset that he never sees a Cherokee on the road.

[@HowardJrFord]

@@DemsRdisguisedredcoats I agree , and I'm a Mopar guy .

[@daves4568]

Upset or scared?

[@resharddurdley6987]

I brought a 21 Explorer Timberline in Green. It's awesome. It's not a rock crawler. Only thing I intially wished was Ford to use the 2.7 ecoboost, with 450 torque. But the 2.3 300hp/310 torque is impressive. I use Amsoil synthetics, and ar6200 fuEL, THE CAR MOVES GREAT. The torsen rear diff works flawlessly. I'd still take the Timerbline over the Grand Cherokee. But you should definately do the video comparison!!!

[@mikejbam]

I drive an Explorer for work. Ford put together a really nice package for daily driving. I think the Timberline adds a cool aggressive style and just enough capability for a little off reading fun. I’m jealous! :)

[@waynewilliams5353]

And that’s perfectly fine if you only care about the highway use. You still overpaid and was scammed out of extra money for the “off-road package” markup on a vehicle that isn’t off-road capable. You can still love your vehicle on pavement and realize ford conned people out of money with false advertisement

[@Jackmerius_Tacktheretrix]

@@waynewilliams5353 nailed it. I still cant get over the cheap interior and fugly fr9nt end because the rest of the vehicle is beautiful! The front end just doesn't match the rest of the vehicle. Its like one designer did the front end and another did the rest of it but they werent allowed to see the others work and they just pasted it together. If they changed the front end to match the test of the body and put a decent interior they'd have a bigger hit.

[@jliefer2484]

mobile 1 is better

[@daveninjaneuro7089]

Why do you want the 2.7? Get to the mall faster?

[@dmelson7502]

"You don't just put stickers and paint on things." Chevy says huh? What?

[@youtubecarspottersguide1]

chevy "we have new a Blazer !" {its a fwd cross over}

[@joshuakurian5994]

@@youtubecarspottersguide1 the predecessor of the old blazer is the Tahoe, that is why the blazer is a crossover

[@bryanbaldassarri3248]

@@joshuakurian5994 the blazer turned trail blazer, Tahoe and blazer were out the same years, some car guide you are

[@keithcollins7435]

@@bryanbaldassarri3248 in what planet did chevy tell you to off road a blazer! The zR2 off road Z-71 off Road and Trail Boss. Chevy has never has badges that tell you to off road any of their crossover. Chevy has a name for the Korean vehicles called activ but if you look at the Spark and Trailblazer called Activ you will be able to see it is not a real off road vehicle.

[@keithcollins7435]

@@bryanbaldassarri3248 he is right the sales of the two door SUV tanked that is why the blazer name no longer existed until 2019 as a crossover. Remember S-10 Blazer was a two door after the sales success of the Explorer GM went to a quad door s-10 blazer until it was discontinued

[@wteslik]

The Grand Cherokee L Overland in fact does offer all terrain tires...I think you guys actually reviewed one with those tires - though maybe it was Tommy?

[@samiam9059]

Ford looks lower to the ground and saw some wallowing...

[@Steve-yr5vi]

GCL Overland is $10k more than the Explorer, I wouldn't be cross shopping but if I were then decided the two speed transfer case was necessary, I'd compare one to an FX4 Expedition with the 3.5 EB or Tahoe with the Z71 package. That expedition with the 3.5 EB is a beast and the Tahoe is worth a consideration as well.

[@samiam9059]

@@Steve-yr5vi Tahoe is rated terrible for many years with the Exploder. Both are not remotely as nimble and wide as a boat.😬

[@zachbowe1746]

The issue I have with this comparison that Jeep did was that they were comparing apples to oranges for the most part. The Explorer is a unibody 3-row SUV and they were mainly using the Trailhawk as comparison, which is a 2-row SUV. If they were to compare to the GC L, it would be more straight up in my opinion because the L does not have a Trailhawk version. The regular GC is also shorter in length than the Explorer, which gives it an advantage right off the bat regardless of the trim. Ford does not offer air suspension on any Explorer, which means that they can’t improve the approach, break over, and departure angles compared to the GC. If the Explorer had air suspension it would be a different ball game in my opinion, but it doesn’t. You can make a point with the Overland package on the L because it is offered with A/T tires, however the Explorer is meant for more moderate off-roading on little dirt trails and not climbing Moab and other related places. Could the Explorer potentially handle it, maybe, it will have to try it first. Ford basically made the Timberline package to look more off-road worthy but didn’t change any of the mechanical aspects to it besides changing the tires, drive modes, and raising it. The mechanical drivetrain components are basically identical to a normal Explorer with the 2.3 Ecoboost, which is upsetting if Ford’s attempted direction was to go after the Trailhawk or GC L Overland. No wonder the Jeep would win in this instance because they were using the stats of the shorter 2-row for the most part, and it comes with air suspension as well. I enjoyed watching the video, however, if I were to cross shop these SUVs straight up, I would compare more of the GC L to the Explorer because they are about the same size. I know they put the stats of the GC L with applicable options in as well, but buyers of the Timberline have to keep in mind that they are not buying a true off-roader that will go scale Hell’s Revenge and the Rubicon Trail. The Explorer is meant for lighter to medium off-roading. It’s more of an appearance package than anything. Also, the fact that the Morrison would call out a 3-row SUV that is more of an appearance package and compare it to their SUV that is meant to go off-road means that he’s pretty threatened by the Explorer and it is comical to me. I hope Ford makes an Explorer that will go more head to head with the GC in the future, but that may not be the direction they are trying to position the Explorer.

[@savioemc2]

Are you sure you watched the video? Because they say: Ford 50 points; GC TH 90 points; GC-L 75 points. So they did compare both versions of the Grand Cherokee

[@zachbowe1746]

@@savioemc2 I did watch the video. I don’t know if I made my point understandable or not in my comment. I wasn’t necessarily talking about the fact that they were mainly comparing it to the TH or the L to the Explorer, but rather that the GC overall, regardless of the L or TH is more off-road capable than the Explorer. Jeep GCs are designed to be more off-road oriented, whereas the Explorer Timberline is more of a cosmetic appearance upgrade but the drivetrain components are unchanged. If I didn’t convey that, I apologize. I was trying to make more of a point of that the Explorer is a light off-roader and the GC, regardless of trim, is more off-road worthy. It’s comparing apples to oranges in my opinion. Like I mentioned though in my original comment, the main focus in this video was comparing the Jeep GC TH to the Timberline, which is an unfair comparison because of the fact that the GC TH has air suspension and the Ford doesn’t, and the TH is shorter with a 2-row, and the Ford is longer with a 3-row. Had they compared the L to the Explorer from the beginning and not compared the TH to the Timberline, I wouldn’t have had an issue with the comparison because they would have been comparing similar vehicles in size. If the Explorer had air suspension, we would potentially be looking at a closer comparison, but since the Ford does not come with air suspension, they are scoring the cars subjectively with what they have at the moment for information. I’m not saying that this is a bad comparison, I just wish that they had compared the L more instead of the TH because that would have been a closer comparison, and one that prospective buyers of both vehicles could use. Hopefully that clears up any confusion with what I had originally written.

[@stevea3936]

I owned a Grand Cherokee Laredo. I think it was a 2002. It had the small 4.7 V8 with the factory off-road package, including full time 4WD with low range. That Jeep had the most comfortable seats. The Infinity Gold series sound system was pretty good as well. The Jeep ended up being one of the most reliable vehicles I’ve ever owned. It was a gas hog though. 15 MPG was about the best it would do.

[@joanned8172]

That was 2002 and now they are all just Peugeots.

[@1gr8oil]

Steve A...........I owned a 1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the same 4.7 L Engine, and it too was not very good for fuel economy, but it did wonderful in the Mountains, as it also had a 2-speed Transfer Case. It was so COMFORTABLE to ride in too!

[@JeffSh00ts]

Same but mines was a piece if junk transmission went out first and then the motor all under 150k

[@WW-wf8tu]

I would like you to do this ORI content on their most OR worthy 4WD's. Been awhile since TFL did a mash up with all of the available 4WD competitors. Most of us that follow your channels daily since you started know where things once were. But there are new competitors now to look at. New vehicles since you originally brought out your board and went down the list. :)

[@luislebron4785]

I think Ford recognizes that most people driving 3 row SUVs (and even larger 2 row SUVs) do not take them rock crawling. Off road capability for most people just means the ability to drive some unimproved dirt roads. Most could care less if the Jeep is Trail Rated if the ride on the road, which is 98% of what the users do, is not as good as the Explorer. Reliability is another issue.

[@waynewilliams5353]

There’s nothing wrong with that…….other than they advertise and price it as a trail ready vehicle. The thing is false advertisement. You can still love the pavement queen you bought, and be pissed at them for conning people that don’t know any better

[@infieldm.i.s.5132]

It is a trail ready vehicle, it's just not a rock crawler.

[@TheJmlutes26]

Based on your posts for this vid I was expecting a “test”. This was a discussion. Still another good TFL video though.

[@TJY2K]

Both aren't available yet. I'm sure they're gonna get their hands on them and make a video.

[@larrybe2900]

Should MPG be included?

[@jonlosito2004]

@@TJY2K sax

[@lego4virgo]

Explorer Timberline delivers on capability in the form of its standard steel skid plates. The underbody protection starts underneath the front, continues under the engine and transmission and through the rear - all to help protect key components and give customers more confidence while off-roading. So, yeah--it does have front/center/rear skid plates. You can take the Timberline in places you can't take a regular Explorer, but not places that you can take a Grand Cherokee.

[@capt.stubing5604]

It’s going to need those skid plates with only high range gears, lousy approach, break over and departure and inadequate ground clearance.

[@lego4virgo]

@@capt.stubing5604 CAPT. STUBING! Shouldn't you be piloting The Pacific Princess, right now? That said, I don't see Ford marketing this as a JGC alternative, just as a slightly more off-roadish Explorer. Even the marketing photos show this thing in mostly 'soft-roading' areas, nothing like what the JGC is doing. That's why they have the Bronco.

[@larrybe2900]

@@lego4virgo Ford may have goaded Jeep with the red hooks. Now the door is open to enter the Bronco vs. Jeep.

[@JeffSh00ts]

You have to be brave to drive anything jeep into the wilderness

[@Expressionistix]

For a company that rebadges a Fiat 500X as a Trailhawk level off-road SUV I'd keep my mouth shut.

[@hellcat69420]

What do you mean? Rebadges the Fiat 500X as a Trailhawk

[@MrCh1cken]

@@hellcat69420 I think they mean "Renegade".

[@brucemartin492]

@@hellcat69420 The Fiat 500X is basically a Renegade. And we all know how well Fiat is for reliability.

[@dmelson7502]

I drive a 20-year-old XJ. I have no problem pulling any of them out. 🤘😁🤘

[@hellcat69420]

@@MrCh1cken that would be a Fiat Panda, the 500X looks nothing like a renegade and the renegade looks nothing like any Fiat

[@OttoTheWeim]

I watched a brand new GC take the hard lines on blue trails at Rausch Creek in amazement. I never thought it would make it through some of the Boulder fields alive but the skids plates screeching and doing their job allowed it to get through with a good spotter. I was impressed.

[@mr.boostang2064]

Since you've never taking a Explorer off roading you should really try to find a 2010 V8 4x4 Explorer and compare it to the new Timberline in the rough stuff

[@johnwiegers3502]

@tflclasic That would be a great comparison!

[@cristianortega5850]

This is a great idea

[@SmlyWenr]

@andrew andrew woah now. Let give some love to the 2nd gen 2door

[@javierspilere8257]

I think “full-size spare” should be added to the ORI index as well. Essential in an Off-road vehicle

[@RealCopsReelLife]

Y'all basically do all my "homework" for me when trying to decide which vehicle to move towards. Great video guys... thanks from the Great White North

[@oscara.9265]

Funny that Jeep says that they build off-road capable vehicles from the ground up... What do they have to say for the Jeep Renegade then? You know, a re-badged Fiat 500

[@ldmtag]

I'm seriously disappointed with the methods Stellantis uses to do their dirty ad compaign. First was the disgusting T-Rex eating a raptor graphics, now it's this. Jeep was my favorite brand (Ram never was, so I was sorta fine with that first one), they have finally made something I'm trully excited about - the 4×e Trailhawk. After watching the video I'm back to fanboying Land Rover Defender. Unfortunately, I don't have money to bay either of the vehicles but if I had I swear I would... well, I won't say I would buy thr Defender instead, cos JGCTH is gonna be so much better value but It would take much longer to make a final decision to buy the Jeep.

[@savioemc2]

Any rebadge there. Both models were engineered at the same time.

[@quadrifoglio6058]

The renegade uses the modified fiat 500 platform. So it was built from the ground up. Sorry to burst your bubble.

[@kvasnaik8920]

The ride in the explorer is far superior to the Jeep also the Ford is a lot quicker and road worthy and does not drive like a truck

[@jordangraf673]

The jeep just came out. You've never driven one guaranteed. They're much nicer inside and out than the explorer too.

[@mattbrown942]

Grand Cherokee are some of the smoothest riding SUV’s in the market. Built off of an Alfa Romeo stelvio platform lol just with different suspension tuned for different purposes. Everyone knows they ride incredible well

[@jordangraf673]

@@mattbrown942 yeah my wife had one of the Grand Cherokee Ls for a short time. It was probably the most comfortable and smooth driving vehicle I’ve ever driven. The 8 speed transmission was super smooth and it was quick.

[@scottyellis3442]

Great video, I'm a ford man but saying the Explorer is just as capable as the Grand Cherokee I would've say no way even before watching.

[@bennmustang1]

It really isnt build purposely for off road use. Its build for hauling balls and criminals.. literally lmao. Ford built the platform for emergency vehicle fleet use. They are not going to change a platform for a soccer mom that never off-roads. You have to realize Ford owns this class. They sell 3 to 1 to the GC

[@LigerZeroFtw]

@@bennmustang1 3 to 1? Sales of both the explorer and grand cherokee are close every year and in 2019 and so far in 2021 more grand cherokees have been sold then explorers.

[@Mark-tf7kb]

@@LigerZeroFtw I’m curious where did you look for the information on that. I feel like I see more Explorers on the road. Obviously that subjective*** but I wonder if wherever you found that information that also includes Police Explorers as well

[@Natethegreat200c]

@@Mark-tf7kb YOU DO NOT SEE MORE EXPLORERS THAN GRAND CHROKEE. not objective subjective or anything. just flat out LIES you just typed

[@LigerZeroFtw]

@@Mark-tf7kb Seeing more explorers doesn't mean anything compared to actual sales numbers. A quick Google search of the sales of both these vehicles yearly is all it takes.

[@jeepdogjl8687]

I think sway bar disconnect should be added to the ORI index. Jeep is going to make this available on the Grand Cherokee.

[@matthewsilver1710]

agreeded

[@matthewsilver1710]

I agree

[@adamharriger5193]

Jim is spot on- anyone who offroads knows that angles and ground clearance are primary- especially in a new vehicle where you are conscious of trail damage. All the electronic tech in the world doesnt make a difference when you can’t get a tire on the obstacle because you are on a bumper or high centered. Too many are confusing offroad appearance packages and real world capability.

[@The_Mister]

And I can’t imagine using cruise control in a true off road situation, climbing steep inclines over rocks and such. Drivers want all the control over the vehicle.

[@j.r.b.5464]

And yet, if we compare apples-to-apples, the GC L, not GC is the more comparable vehicle to the Explorer (though the explorer has more cargo space and more 3rd row legroom than the GC L). There is no Trailhawk GC L, and the Overland trim with the air suspension is in another price class (+20% more than a Timberline Explorer). So if you pit the Timberline against the GC L Limited, comparable in price, cargo space and passenger seating capacity, the Timberline has better approach and departure angles and better ground clearance than the GC L Limited. Yet Jim Morrison says EVERY Jeep model is designed with off-roading in mind, so the Timberline vs. GC L ought to be a fair comparison, right?

[@ryanhessler8966]

That Jeep certainly seems more capable than the Explorer, but I have to laugh at the statement from Jeep about Trail Rated because they're awfully happy to slap that badge on anything they can

[@Natethegreat200c]

What car is “trail rated “ that’s not supposed to be? Have you seen the renegade and compass off road? Research before you speak.

[@joshuamarois9841]

Like the "trail rated" renegade or compass lol

[@joshuamarois9841]

@@Natethegreat200c I mean they certainly can drive off of the road...to wait for the tow truck

[@joshuamarois9841]

@@Natethegreat200c honestly id trust my 21 year old Acura tl on the trails before I'd take a renegade or compass

[@Agent.K.]

@@Natethegreat200c No low range = Not trail rated!

[@MrTxblksteel]

I think had Ford actually advertised the Timberline package as a Jeep competitor it would be a different issue but that's not there goal.

[@daveninjaneuro7089]

*their

[@jamesoldman3021]

I recognise that OEM tires do come into play slightly. As a person that used 4 wheel drive vehicles since the early 50's for work and personal use tires play a small part. I remember the days before you drove the vehicle off the dealers lot you swapped out the tires. Unless you have a low and high range it is not off road material.

[@tedunguent156]

Yeah, the two-speed transfer case is the main difference.

[@chingon_grandpa]

You guys just saved me a ton of money. Thank you for this review. So many other channels were basically running the explorer through the mud, and calling this vehicle " the ultimate 4x4...new member of the overland class..." again, Thanks!

[@TheCyclingConquistador]

99% of customers won’t ever go off-roading on these vehicles.

[@SJT.IN.KC85]

The Ford is more than capable for the vast majority of buyers. I only use 4wd getting around in the snow and getting to the trail head. It would come down to how the vehicle drives and how comfortable they are.

[@alale923]

Ford needs to come out with the SUV version of the raptor. An explorer/4runner lookin wide prerunner suv. Ppl would eat it up.

[@julianprice6179]

Bronco?

[@alale923]

@@julianprice6179 ya i guess ur right. It doesnt give me that Baja feel tho. Are they as capable as the raptors?

[@matadorprime6555]

Jeep president is correct in this case. Badging and stickers do not make a vehicle more capable.

[@FusionBoost2.0]

What about the Compass and Renegade lol

[@enjoylife7030]

My wife and I have always liked the Grand Cherokee but needed something larger with our 3 boys and all their stuff over the years. We finally bought a used one this year and I have to say it is a great vehicle. Ironically one of those boys now drives it primarily but it is a wonderful vehicle to have. It does just about everything well and I have been surprised with the power of the V6. The one we purchased is over 6 years old but it still has a ton of creature comforts.

[@mattdavies3023]

A transfer case is not the same as a center locker 🙄 come on guys.

[@Cannibal440]

If it is a traditional transfer case, it most certainly is a locker, in the sense that the front and rear axles are locked together. We don't typically call it a locker but to demonstrate the differences they are calling it a locker.

[@mattdavies3023]

@@Cannibal440 not strictly true. My Defender had a transfer case and a center diff lock which were independent of each other. I did not have to be in 4 low to have the center diff locked. I think this must be a Jeep thing where shifting to low also locks the diff?

[@Cannibal440]

@@mattdavies3023 When I say a "traditional" transfer case, I mean one that whenever engaged(whether high or low range) it locks the front with the rear. I believe that's what TFL was implying.

[@mattdavies3023]

@@Cannibal440 I'm with you - didn't mean to sound argumentative . :-)

[@MNsaint]

I think what surprised me the most in this video is you don't include a detachable front sway bar as a variable in your ORI.

[@valdius85]

I think these options were available after that scoring system was created.

[@TheJeep1967]

@@valdius85 except that the Wrangler and Ram Power Wagon had them at the time of creation.

[@mikeowentaylor]

@@TheJeep1967 the scoring system was made in 2009 neither got it until 2010. Should've probably added it, but the detachable sway bar didn't allow much more movement until the jl/jt release

[@tyleranderson5823]

Jeep and dodge were the only ones to have it until recently also. They mentioned it in one video that it would take points away from the vast majority of vehicles they rate and give an “unfair” advantage to anything Stelantis.

[@TheJeep1967]

@@mikeowentaylor Oh, my bad! Thanks for the correction.

[@jaretbishop7909]

I surprised not even a mention of towing capacity? It seems like the comment was made in reference to Ford painting the tow hook red, which is a signature look for trailhawk/rubicon for jeep. If the Ford can out tow a jeep, which isn’t really that hard because Jeeps typically have a pretty poor tow capacity, that would certainly merit some points for Ford over the jeep.

[@andrewgee241]

The dispute is about the recovery hook and what that symbolizes about it's off road chops not towing a trailer. Towing capability is not related to off road capability. A Ford F250 can tow a huge flat bed trailer or RV but would get stuck quickly doing serious off roading because of the overall length and weight.

[@larrybe2900]

But if you can't make it over the trail the issue is moot.

[@manicmotox4214]

I just want to say, I very much enjoy your guy's perspective when reviewing vehicles. Offroad or not, they get reviewed for what they are. And not what badge is on them. It's a very objective review, even if I don't always agree with your objective perspective. I still respect your guys approach at reviewing vehicles

[@theporkchopexpress3782]

Maybe Jeep should "engineer in" reliability. Then he can talk about other companies products...

[@woxie4990]

Bingo.

[@TakuroSpirit77]

Not gonna lie I was hoping you were gonna yank on some red tow hooks to see which one was gonna break first.

[@fernandobriseno8164]

That's more like something ProjectFarm would do.

[@marcm8209]

Love your reviews, the Point system you came up with should have a sliding scale in each category. instead of all or nothing for each section.

[@MrAndeev8]

grand Cherokee has air suspension option so does it have 10” ground clearance without that option and if not what’s the clearance with out the air suspension and if less than 9” does it still get points ?

[@michaeldushack8248]

Trail hawk without air gets over 10 I believe

[@bigretardhalo]

Looking at the advertising for the Explorer Timberline I have seen so far it seems Ford is just trying to provide a package that gives the Explorer back the tires/ground clearance it had before it got street oriented and lowered for fuel economy in the FWD years…. For the true mall crawlers the base Explorer exists… For people that like to travel up rutted fire roads to camp or hike the Timberline package will work great and give up a couple highway MPG most likely

[@rocketj7449]

Chevy does the same thing with their NON Z71 half ton trucks, it says 4x4 on the side, but no low range. Was kind of a disappointment after I bought the truck, because their is no way I would take it on a trail without low range, or 4WD Lo.

[@joshuakurian5994]

Chevy Tahoe z71 does have 4 low

[@rocketj7449]

@@joshuakurian5994 you are correct! The Z71 comes with a 2 speed transfer case.

[@michaellewis5921]

Cool stuff. Local in Boulder and I really enjoy your content. Question - is there a publicly accessible table of ORI values for common 4WD SUVs and trucks you guys have tested? I am thinking of buying a Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk for myself and so tried to score it as you went through the criteria. I got a number of 80 for a stock 2019 model year or newer trailhawk. Would love to see if I got that right, well as a quick way to compare that vehicle to others in it's class...

[@thepebblesexplore83]

Unibody: on road focus Body on frame: off road focus. No real other way about it. They can try to make it check boxes all they want but if you go unibody you’re still going to have a “car” first.

[@youtubecarspottersguide1]

its front wheel drive car base

[@Theravadinbuto]

@@thepebblesexplore83 I hear you in principle, but I took my old lifted, unibody Cherokee places that 95% of off road vehicles would never make. I think the benefits of body on frame are way overstated unless you want to do a body lift.

[@williamreinhardt2774]

@@Theravadinbuto Problem is that was an XJ, which is way better than its modern cousin, or most vehicles for that matter!

[@anthonys7534]

Chevy thinks a red stripe on a black rim is pretty much the same as red brembo calipers. Nobody cares , why is Jeep so whiny?!

[@brianfisher2446]

Doesn’t really matter either way, they are not going to even see dirt. They are going to soccer mom mall crawlers.

[@ChaseJoos]

But my question is is did they design the explorer to compete with the Jeep Cherokee. With the specs that you guys just compared it to I would expect it wasn't designed to compete directly

[@capt.stubing5604]

Their ads say, “if you’re looking at a Grand Cherokee, consider an Explorer.”

[@Notourtube]

No transfer case is the nail in the coffin! Absolutely unacceptable to sell an off-road trim with no low range!!

[@lesterparker1594]

Nobody is taking this off-road. 99% will be driving soccer moms to the mall

[@gs98999]

Subaru has left the comment section

[@Notourtube]

Overheating clutch pack has entered the chat

[@tbm275]

*Jeep Renegade/Compass hides in the corner*

[@ryanintegra3165]

@@lesterparker1594 I agree with you… however they still build the g wagon and Range Rover. Both of which are likely the two most capable off road vehicles that are very expensive.

[@JDMEXforme]

Makes me love my Jeep even more. Jeep has been doing this longer and consistantly than anyone else.

[@andrewtaylor2067]

The only thing long and consistant about jeep is the visits to the shop. Before you freak out I had one.

[@mattgray6436]

Bronco probably made them cry

[@BBTyrant]

@@andrewtaylor2067 I'm not sure if this is all jeeps or specific ones in general. I see this posted alot. Owned a 2007 JK unlimited with the crappy 3.8 and it finally blew at 210k miles. But besides that I never went into the shop once. Have a 2018 JL 2.0 at 60k and still haven't been to the shop so maybe I just have good luck. Always kept up on maintaining the vehicles, which is important cause offroading puts alot of stress on components.

[@andrewtaylor2067]

@@BBTyrant Had a 2010 jk put thousands of dollars into the thing in maintenance and it was just endless problems. Maybe I just got a lemon but it really tainted my view on jeeps

[@SanctumOfDreams]

@@andrewtaylor2067 I’ve had a wrangler JL (2.0 i4 turbo like the guy above) that’s been abused heavily on and off road for 3 years daily now, floored to 7k rpm many times. $0 repairs, once a year maintenance that in three years has costed me $0. Buddy bought a new tacoma boasting he’ll be towing me and that he’ll make it to 300k miles with no problems. It’s been 4 months and his transmission melted on a flat road. The most ironic part is the little Italian 4banger in the Jeep seems to be holding up really well for everyone.

[@jeffissimo1221]

Morrison should have included the GMC AT4 trim on the Terrain, Acadia, and Yukon in those comments as well.

[@ivan-dx1ec]

He is just butt hurt that they selling way more Explorer than this crappy Jeep.

[@A15689]

No Low range on the GC-L Limited/Altitude/Laredo trims which will be the majority of its sales. All the extra functions like air suspension ground clearance raise & eLSD are also on overland and above only. Plus come on, GC & Explorer are not in the same segment due to size so the angles will not fairly compare. It should really be the GC-L vs the Explorer.

[@youtubecarspottersguide1]

the comparison was the most capble off road of each and to get a v6 you have to go to the exploer ST @$50k which Is not a off roader

[@A15689]

@@youtubecarspottersguide1 Explorer is 3-row SUV while GC is 2-row. The equivalent is the GC-L with 3-row. Length affects all the angles.

[@nycad2484]

Instead of Ford Vs Ferrari it’s now Ford Vs Jeep

[@gpaje]

Jeep Trail Rated, built from the ground up he says, lol. You mean all those little car based Jeeps with Trail ratings, including the Fiat Panda one? From the ground up?

[@hellcat69420]

It is made by Fiat not by Jeep and it is build from ground up

[@Natethegreat200c]

Those aren’t pandas. The stuff you keyboard warriors type without even researching it is beyond me. 1. The renegade and 500x were codeveloped together from the ground up. No Jeep is based on a pre exciting fiat. 2.) all the little jeeps have skid plates, tow hooks, stiff chassis , good 4x4 systems with good low range different shocks (adaptive) springs, tires and more just like this grand Cherokee minus the air ride. This comment really shows how ignorant you are.

[@Natethegreat200c]

@@hellcat69420 it’s Jeep not fiat. What fiat goes off road?

[@gpaje]

@@Natethegreat200c Panda just sounded funnier, but if you want to be accurate, it's still based on Fiats SCCS/199 platform, which was developed in the early 2000s. The Jeep Renegade, Fiat 500X, Fiat 500L, and a bunch of Alfas and Opels have used this platform. To call it ground up developed is ridiculous.

[@Natethegreat200c]

@@gpaje false. the panda is on the b platfrom, the 200 dart compass renegade 500x cherokee use a variant of the Compact small US wide platform from alfa. if you want to be accurate

[@AaronJones-yt4vd]

The Jeep CEO is still butthurt over the Bronco kicking them in the nuts🤣🤣

[@tombrenemanMt]

How many did ford deliver in September? 0 !

[@bryanbaldassarri3248]

The bronco is the new thunderbird, which was the Bronco 2, which was the For Edsel (ever hear of it) it was the biggest flop in car history, Ford has always been proud of the flop

[@bryanbaldassarri3248]

Think Ford also has people who make videos not actually test it in tough conditions, only videos of real wheeling in Broncos was lite Brite they lied too, they said we’re taking this stock Sasquatch package, it had a 2.5in lift and 37’s(not stock) everyone else takes it on fire rds and call it off rding, joke Jeep doesn’t need to be worried, especially with a 392 and a 4xe on market

[@ObsequioGalanteo]

Very informative guys, thanks! I’m new to the world of SUV. Right now I just need something that can get me to work and camping and trails. For those wondering if they need to climb Hell’s Revenge, a video like this lets them know exactly where they stand.

[@Pilot545]

2018 F-150 3.5 EB Platinum owner here. LOVE my truck! But…Grand Cherokee ALL day EVERY day over the Explorer!

[@fahdabdulaziz5067]

It would be nice if you can compare the Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk vs the defender.

[@Turshin]

That's more in the class of a wrangler

[@fahdabdulaziz5067]

@@Turshin how so? Both are unibody, both use air suspension and traction control focused.

[@jonlosito2004]

Yea but the Defender tries are soo skinny tho

[@hippiebits2071]

As a Jeep fan I hate to say this but I think their time would be better spent improving their quality control rather than nitpicking other manufacturers advertising.

[@lesterparker1594]

I was thinking the same thing. Jeep has enough problems with water leaks, electrical issues. Hell not too long ago lots of people couldn’t even start the damn thing because of a faulty ignition. Oh and the infamous “death wobble”.

[@khafrebevins3025]

Well the 22 Grand Cherokee is a brand new vehicle from the wheels up and had 12 years to work on quality so they actually can nitpick

[@hippiebits2071]

@@khafrebevins3025 And another channel just reviewed one with a buggy infotainment system... the reviewer remained positive. Someone who just dropped $50-60k of their own money likely wouldn't.

[@michellej7734]

I accidentally took a drink of water at the same time as the 5in comment and NEARLY CHOCKED. 🤣😂🤣😂

[@rokit4675]

I can tell you my best friend works at a dealership and has already replaced and is still waiting on transmissions to be replaced on previous Cherokee and current wagoneer models with fewer than 5,000 miles. He says customers are furious.

[@Stuka87]

This explorer is the equivalent of GM's Z71 package for the Tahoe. Slightly different tires, slightly different suspension. But not really intended to compete against a trailhawk.

[@joshuakurian5994]

But the Tahoe had a 35 degree approach angle and 4 low

[@Stuka87]

@@joshuakurian5994 Yeah, it’s body on frame, which is different than either the explorer or the grand Cherokee

[@joshuakurian5994]

@@Stuka87 also, there is an expedition timberline which I’m hoping will compare better to the Tahoe Z71 or Yukon AT4. From what I saw, the Tahoe and Yukon are much more capable

[@DrivenHard]

I love how people who own vehicles that have a LOW GEARING not an actual LOW RANGE think its good enough lol

[@jessaphillips2846]

Yep, all putting the shifter in “L” does is hold the transmission in first gear

[@hi9580]

Better than nothing

[@user-rg1lx8yt6g]

Tfl: low range Every other journalist: low gearing

[@jerroldshelton9367]

That's because some of us who have a LOW GEARING and not an actual LOW RANGE can do math. Because we can do math, we know that something like a Renegade Trailhawk has has fractionally lower gearing when in first gear that an automatic trans Bronco II with 3.42 final drive did when in low range and first gear. The Renegade doesn't use it's first gear in normal street driving, And if the Bronco II and similarly geared S-10 Blazers and the like were geared low enough to get us where we wanted to go back in the day, some of this more modern stuff at around 20:1 gear reduction + 2:1 from the torque converter will be, too. Just like not all Forest Service roads are paved, they aren't all the Rubicon, either, leaving a lot of "in-between" that things like the Jeep Compass and Renegade are capable of handling.

[@Tjspycorp]

@@jerroldshelton9367 tell em

[@clintperry799]

You guys are great, really enjoy your shows.

[@imriestaffson9592]

Hey can you do a comp on the R1T vs the F-150 Lightning?

[@luism8130]

Andre has 5 inches! Confirmed!

[@tylermcmahon2952]

You should include recovery equipment on you scale. i.e. recovery hooks or winch

[@jre617]

I didn't know the new gen Trailhawk had been introduced. In current gen WK2 GCs, there is no real difference between Trailhawk and other GC trims with the O-R package. Is that still the case on the new ones?

[@wesshinn1]

I bought the timberline. It drives just like the bronco does on the beach in the outer banks. What’s not mentioned is the timberline is three rows and that’s a difference maker for people like me. Test drive it and check it out. I think you’ll be impressed at the engineering.

[@Apophion]

I don't know why this competition is even being done. The two original chassis were designed with different purposes in mind. Did anyone REALLY think the Explorer would be competitive offroad? If someone was "on the fence" then the should just buy the Explorer because they are not a serious off roader....

[@culcune]

I am a Ford fan through and through (from the car side, 3 different 80s/90s Mustang (one was a Capri) 5.0s, Escort, Tempo, etc) but if I was serious about an offroad SUV, for sure I would be leaning towards the Jeep brand. The Explorer and even the Bronco seem more mall parking lot (if that is a thing) queens driven by soccer (or other sports) moms than offroad capable. Then, again, I have seen plenty of sports moms driving Jeeps of all sorts, but at least in 10 to 15 years used, I will have some good picks for offroading knowing very few of any of the brands' 'offroad rated' vehicles are actually used offroad.

[@HJOperative]

@@culcune idk the bronco is kind of better off-road then the stock wrangler. Of course there is the discussion about solid front axle and IFS but Apples to apples people are pretty impressed with it.

[@culcune]

@@HJOperative I do not doubt the Bronco is a great offroader. I would consider one if I was looking, but I would cross-shop with Jeep, as well.

[@kirkshrum6222]

Great video guys! Would love to see this challenge, pretty sure Jeep has it in the bag! Cheers Kirk

[@rockandroll4689]

has WHAT in the bag? From what I have seen - all Chrysler/Jeep products fall apart....the Fords DO NOT!

[@turbovolvos40]

Just because a vehicle has a transfer case does not mean it locks front and rear driveline together. Awd vehicles will always have a center diff of some kind, (potentially lockable). 4wd vehicles to my knowledge do lock the driveline together when 4wd is engaged.

[@erichanson1740]

I have a 2011 Explorer. That suv is a tank. I drove that bad boy when we had the worst ice storm that hit Portland Oregon. I forgot my chains for it but that suv got me to work and back home. I slid a little but a great vehicle. Now im buying a Maverick next week. Cant wait!

[@Gltokensp06]

I always considered the Timberline vehicles to be overlanders, not off roaders. IIRC, Ford markets as "most off-road capable" and not flat out that it's an rock climber. I think Jeep is getting their panties in a bunch on this one.

[@RadDadisRad]

Better hope that Ford doesn’t find a decent grade on the overlanding trail. It won’t be able to crawl it because it’ll be spinning it’s tires instead of getting traction because it doesn’t enough gear reduction to keep the converter locked but wheel speed low.

[@Welcometofacsistube]

@@nycmaverick BWWWWAHAHAHAHAH. Phew. Good one.

[@Aqwanermuk]

@@nycmaverick obliterated Jeep by poor quality control, two garbage engines, and putting a weak Explorer transmission in the new Bronco? I'm happy Ford built the Bronco. I test drove it at Detroit 4Fest. They implemented some really nice features. But, my 1996 Jeep Cherokee XJ would embarrass the Bronco if I simply put 33" tires and LSDs front and rear. My 4.0L inline 6 and Aisin-Warner transmission will outlive any Ford drivetrain. It's a shame the Germans at Daimler ruined some of Jeep's best attributes. I never was a fan of Jeep, or Ford until I inherited this XJ. But Ford didn't obliterate anything with the Bronco.

[@jbrock98]

What the Jeep CEO said is true, but i think Ford is going after a market that doesn’t need much off road capability. They want the families hitting up National Parks, small trails, car camping, all while offering a vehicle that won’t spend as much time in the shop as a Jeep.

[@jamespisano3424]

Well sais

[@fuji302]

Worked in a dealership that had Fords, Jeeps, Isuzu and Saab. That said Jeeps are disposable and don’t have half the quality and reliability of a 6.0 diesel. Don’t get me started on the other two brands.

[@khakiswag]

@@fuji302 the 6.0 was junk and so was the 6.4 but they were made by International. Ford sued them, cancelled their contract and engineered the 6.7 PSD all in house. Ford is the only one to engineer and build the entire truck (including the power train) all in house, you have to respect that.

[@patrickhandy2364]

Don't see option for air suspension on Jeep website, so it doesn't seem fair to give it points for ground clearance, unless stock suspension clears 9 inches.

[@infieldm.i.s.5132]

I have a 2023 Timberline. I bought the upgrade not only the appearance but for the better suspension for our crappy Michigan roads. 12,000 miles so far & I love it. Besides I didn't want the unreliability that comes with owning a Jeep.

[@Edwardg2able]

Sure the Grand Cherokee is decent off road, but explain how the Compass is "trail rated"

[@Natethegreat200c]

Watch videos online and see. You heard the designer, it’s baked in. Plenty of owners bashing both renegades and wranglers. Research

[@oceanzu6585]

Wee... Compass has 21to1 gearing and ford bronco Sport get 17 to 1 ?

[@khafrebevins3025]

They really should be comparing the trims. But the compass has a trail rated trim I wouldn’t drive a compass off round but the trim is there

[@Natethegreat200c]

@@khafrebevins3025 why not?

[@Natethegreat200c]

@@oceanzu6585 still great. You can always compromise for it if your good at off roading. That said the compass has adaptive shocks, and wrangler infused capabilities. The Ford is no threat to a Jeep. Any Jeep.

[@JustinKelly]

I agree that it is a video worth doing to prove it right or wrong. I think it is safe to say the GC Trailhawk is more capable all around however.

[@lunamaria1048]

Both are independent front and rear suspension, so i wouldn't take them off road, either way... Wheel lifting is unsafe and hard on your vehicle, so give me solid rear axle and KDSS and i'm happy!

[@em-gm2xp]

Was the GCL a regular model or did you compare the GCL Overland?

[@nick-dw8lg]

i feel like the main competitor should be the GCL and they shouldn’t have used any of the normal GC since that’s not what the explorer competes with size wise.

[@larrybe2900]

Hooks, ....... red hooks.

[@ricardofernandezvazquez3811]

@TFLnow, you should publish the ORI, it would help some of us make a better decision on off road vehicles.

[@TFLnow]

Here you go: tflcar.com/2021/10/tfl-off-road-index-leaderboard-tflori-these-are-the-most-off-road-worthy-cars-and-trucks/

[@ricardofernandezvazquez3811]

@@TFLnow Wow! Thanks for that. Keep up the good work!

[@jeffreybalandra8891]

They will most likely use that timberline as a police cruiser.

[@kennethelliott5985]

No that is a whole different design, I work on police vehicles

[@BigSh00tsie]

I was shocked that your test criteria for off road vehicles doesn't include solid axle vs. independent suspension. like 0, 5, or 10 pts depending on 4 corner IS, IFS, or solid axles front and rear.

[@savioemc2]

What?! They’re comparing SUVs not trucks! Which SUV have solid axes in 2021?

[@BigSh00tsie]

@@savioemc2 gx460, jeep wrangler, bronco, 4runner, etc. Also, they use this test on every off road vehicle they test, so that includes pickup trucks, especially midsized trucks. This test is for comparing the offroad ability of any vehicle (they apply it to trucks and SUVs equally) and should be uniform across the board whether applied to a Honda accord (yes, a silly example but it helps make my point) or a jeep wrangler, so when people compare them they get a straight-up comparison of how worthy off road it is. That may be "not at all" in the case of the accord, or "very" in the case of the wrangler rubicon. It's an off road test and arguably the most important aspect of off roading besides 4wd is how many solid axles a vehicle comes with.

[@brucemartin492]

Trail hawk is being marketed as a rock crawler, Explorer is marketed as an overlander. There's a big difference Jimbo. In none of the videos I saw for marketing on the explorer did I see it doing anything in hells revenge or the Rubicon. 🤷🤷🤷

[@valdius85]

True. I was surprised that Explorer comes with 2.3l engine.

[@YuppieMullets]

The Explorer is a mall-crawler, not an overlander…

[@brucemartin492]

This was is trimmed to be one though

[@youtubecarspottersguide1]

why ford a 2.3 4cy? could of done a FX4 like the ranger but how much payload can the timberline carry if 7 are in the suv and Overlanders we dont want or need 3 rows of seats

[@Notourtube]

Ford sounds like a lot of clutch packs over heating!

[@BWater-yq3jx]

When I stop seeing brand new Jeeps in the suburbs going home on the back of towtrucks... I'll think about testing one's off-road capability in remote areas. Fiat. lol.

[@quadrifoglio6058]

Immature child, LOL

[@williamreinhardt2774]

@@quadrifoglio6058 Still correct, LOL.

[@BWater-yq3jx]

@@quadrifoglio6058 I guess compared to your Alfa Romeo sh!tbox... Jeeps are reliable. 😆 🤣

[@curtschaben5609]

For the vehicle enthusiast I really appreciate these guys.

[@erichnieuwoudt371]

The moment I heard the Ford doesn't have low range I knew how this will pan out... It can't compete off road with a vehicle that has low range.

[@kennethelliott5985]

Its a 10 speed auto, the same Auto that is in the raptor, mustang, regular f150, and camaro zl1. That transmission was built by Alison and designed to be used without a multi speed transfer case

[@AnthonyKopah]

@@kennethelliott5985 lol, no. A couple more gears isn't a real substitute for a transfer case. Ford Explorer Timberline crawl ratio - 29.8:1 Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk crawl ratio - 47.4:1

[@quadrifoglio6058]

@@kennethelliott5985 Allison did not build that transmission, you are funny. The 10 speed was a FORD and GM collaboration.

[@B86432]

Coming from the guy who charges 40k for crank windows & no a/c lol

[@RadDadisRad]

Crank windows because the doors are removable…

[@B86432]

@@RadDadisRad my power windows had removable doors so wrong

[@najthesavior4286]

?

[@jessieleeofficial]

There's something wrong with the scoring. Why have they been awarded 15 points for skidplates when the according to the website it is only up to 9 points? "Armor (skid plates): Up to 9 points** (3 pts front/3 pts center/3 pts rear)"