Jesse Singal talks about the reaction to his controversial Atlantic story on transgender adolescents

[@dragonfire4244]

Desistance isn't common in those put on puberty blockers. Study in 2011 of 70 children showed 100% of them went onto transitioning. In UK our gender clinic for children GIDs did a trail on puberty blockers and 97% of these kids went on to transition. Before the craze to use puberty blockers came in, the approach was watchful waiting, as long term studies spanning 40 years showed that up to 90% of children with gender incongruence would resolve itself with the onset of puberty and majority of them will turn out to be gay. It'd be a very small number of these children that would go onto transition. To me this indicates that puberty is the key to helping these kids become more comfortable with who they are so using puberty blockers makes no sense. The fact that nearly 100% of those on blockers went onto transition show that they're locking kids onto that pathway. The study from the Netherlands in the 90s on which the use of puberty blockers took off, was sponsored by a company that manufactured puberty blockers.

[@jumpingspider7105]

Yeah but its totally bigoted and transphobic to say that we should just leave kids alone and let them go through the normal process of development that has evolved over millions of years. Growing up is never confusing. If a kid is confused the solution is to give them drugs. Puberty is racist. Shut your trap bigot.

[@andrewlm5677]

It will be very interesting to see how the 97% on puberty blockers feel over a longer timeframe if they come to realize they actually want the things their early treatment will deny them. Children are so impressionable that it seems likely that supportive adults confirming their feelings would essentially lock them in as you say. Would be very easy to see this become another case of well meaning people making things worse through their attempts to do good without an adequate understanding of the situation that confronts them.

[@dragonfire4244]

@@andrewlm5677 disgracefully we’ll never know about those 97% from the UK GIDs clinic as it was found out in court during judicial review in the Keira Bell case that the clinic never carried out adequate follow-ups or kept data on the children they treated. Trans activists target any studies into detransitioning. Universities are scared into backing anyone wanting to do research, as happened at Bath Spa University. The UK charity Mermaids for “trans children” also had a strong influence over the clinic & they’ve recently got into trouble in the media for sending chest binders to children behind their parents back (despite saying they don’t offer medical advice) & having a pro MAP advocate as a board member. Until enough people are strong enough to speak out against affirmation therapy and fight against this censorship of truth & science, I fear for the future of these vulnerable children.

[@killcat1971]

It makes no sense if what they want is the best outcomes for the kids, it isn't, it's about pushing a world view where transitioning is the best thing possible in all situations.

[@andrewlm5677]

@@killcat1971 Never attribute to malice what could be attributed to incompetence

[@peachmelba1000]

I'm all for post pubescent transition if the person has been thoroughly vetted medically and psychologically. I am ardently opposed to medically intervening with children in ways that can never be reversed. That is child abuse, plain and simple.

[@LaoZi2023]

What if the child chose to transition?

[@saje239]

@@LaoZi2023What if the child chooses to engage in sex with an adult? Does that mean they can actually consent?

[@LaoZi2023]

@@saje239 , That has nothing to do with my point.

[@saje239]

@@LaoZi2023 It does. If you’re arguing that children are capable of consent, that has consequences beyond just your preferred area.

[@robinwatkins8528]

Sorry, but no ethical arguments exist for medically transitioning children or teenagers.

[@purdysanchez]

I suppose you're one of those bigots who doesn't believe medically assisted suicide should be handed out like water. /s

[@jonnash5196]

And also we cannot change someone's sex They can only do cosmetic surgery on them .

[@coolbugfacts1234]

sorry, but no argument exists that you have a functional prefrontal cortex. your parents must have lobotomized you as a child because you lack reasoning skills

[@purdysanchez]

@@coolbugfacts1234, but you're in favor of children being lobotomized with parental consent right?

[@coolbugfacts1234]

@@purdysanchez you're in favor of intersex infants forcibly having genital surgery to uphold cis heteronormativity, right?

[@dawnemile7499]

They feel better for how long? Where are the long term studies?

[@jonnash5196]

I don't think there are any !

[@coolbugfacts1234]

where are the long term studies that prove you possess basic reasoning skills, as you clearly have demonstrated you do not possess them

[@coolbugfacts1234]

@@jonnash5196 i don't think there are any studies that prove you aren't a complete moron, and thus far there is also no anecdotal evidence

[@heatherchapman1984]

Jesse, opioids and stimulants make distressed individuals feel better too (at least as long as the high lasts); but long-term use of them to obtain relief from mental pain is very often pretty unwise . . . (in fairness, this interview is pretty old, done back in Jan 2019. I believe Jesse Singal has gradually been persuaded by the growing evidence that there is little solid research done to justify medicalizing teens, let alone young children as the best course of action in the vast majority of "gender" dysphoria - arguably just another flavor of body dysmorphia - cases.) The problem is the conveyor-belt-like result that all the activist pressure on the medical establishment has given us. The subjective claims of a very emotionally distressed few have been prioritized over all the evidence practitioners of physical and mental health have long relied on regarding childhood development and histories of other extremely maladaptive coping mechanisms spreading via social contagion. A long-beleaguered minority seems to have seized the opportunity to enlarge their political impact that a perfect storm of multiple natural and man-made disasters ravaging the mental health of young individuals who are regular users of social media has made possible. All these miserable and lost young minds are "love bombed" and drawn in to serve as poster children for a new faith [which is used to justify all sorts of antisocial behaviors, while its proselytizers camouflage themselves with a stolen rainbow banner, refashioned to the point of parody] which demands universal obeisance to unfalsifiable concepts like "gender identity" and "trans child." Even those who claim to reject the theory of dualism upon which traditional religions employing a belief that every individual possesses an immortal "spirit" independent from the material body, behave as if our as yet not fully-understood bodies and physical brains have NO bearing on our "authentic selves" and therefore can be somehow "wrong" and in need of modification . . . and this is claimed in the face of overwhelming historical and clinical evidence that individual humans typically go through their most dramatic changes in beliefs and worldviews during those critically formative years as they grow from a child to an adult. Pumping still-developing bodies and brains with endocrine system-disrupting drugs (let alone subjecting them to the trauma of invasive cosmetic surgeries on otherwise healthy tissues) in an attempt to somehow spare any individual that necessarily painful process of development from child to full maturity is staggeringly irresponsible, in light of how little evidence has been gathered regarding either the short- or long-term effects.

[@zxyatiywariii8]

This will be the 21st century version of the lobotomy, and future historians will be appalled.

[@phoenixjim0527]

Well-written and stated.

[@masonweiss]

Can someone please provide a specific definition for the word “transphobia.”?

[@purdysanchez]

It means anyone who questions anything that trans activists say. "you're saying they don't have the right to exist!"

[@watkins8256]

'He or She who disagrees with Me' seems to cover it.

[@jonnash5196]

It's supposed to mean someone who is afraid of or hate transgenders but it's used against anyone who criticizes or even discussed anything to do with the gender identity mess unless they agree with the party line .

[@phoenixjim0527]

Sure. It’s the opposite of TERFphobia 😅 The TRAs have abused transphobia to meaninglessness. They always shut up when I tell them they’re TERFphobes with a laugh 😅

[@PumpkinSpicePretzels]

Singal's gotten a lot of unfair criticism for his work, calling him anti-trans when he's just showing the research based on physiology and research. They refuse to get into the details or believe them. He's not said anything anti-trans, but some people think that because the science goes against their ideology (that a trans woman is no different than a biologically-born one), then they're effectively saying that the science or physics or reality is anti-trans 😆

[@synchronium24]

Emma Vigeland of Majority Report is probably the biggest offender I've seen in this regard.

[@johnriddell5822]

There seems to be an underlying assumption that gender dysphoria is predetermined by genetics. I would like to see an investigation into the effect of environmental influences on the development of gender dysphoria. It certainly looks as if many cases are the result of a social contagion. It simply does not make sense that several girls in the same class all suddenly decide they are really boys unless there is a social contagion.

[@jonnash5196]

I djt think this guy has a good perspective on this subject . He may be afraid of challenging the party line because he's afraid of the reaction by the extremists .

[@jimbarrofficial]

graphic has his name spelled wrong.

[@Quillette]

Unfortunately it cannot be updated now. But thanks for letting us know.

[@thebeefyleaf]

Right off the top, Jesse is saying that most trans people want bottom surgery. That’s not true, the vast majority of transgender adults do NOT get bottom surgery. Important information when we’re talking about changing rooms and prisons!

[@purdysanchez]

This is not about "healthcare" for children. This is about shifting the Overton window so that what was irrational 6 years ago will be a "dialogue" today. I'm Jewish, so you can't delete this comment.

[@radscorpion8]

You know what would be nice, is if you interviewed someone who was FOR detransitioning at those ages, exploring their arguments, and actively debating them, instead of only interviewing the people you already agree with. Because otherwise this is a pointless echo chamber. Does anyone else not see this? I just don't see the purpose of preaching to the choir. Its only a tactic used if you want to make money maximizing your subscriber count on youtube, its not something you do if you genuinely want to debate your ideas. Is it that NO ONE will come on quillette to debate? Or is it that they never invite anyone on that can challenge their views? There must be a reason why the AMA and and other authorities in this space think its okay to transition children, as far as I can tell. And I'd like to hear what the other side has to say, instead of sticking my head in the sand and pretending the other side is always wrong, because then I may as well be in a religion

[@zxyatiywariii8]

I'd like to hear that format, too. I don't know whether they asked anyone. I do know many in that space would never agree to "give their legitimacy to" Quillette (their words, not mine) by coming on here to debate, because they believe it's a dangerous far-right site. I don't agree with everything on any site, but I'm always curious to listen.

[@dawnemile7499]

No one is 'trans'. It's nonsense to even give it an inch of credibility.

[@dickgoblin]

That's simply false. That's like saying people with PBD are not real. You can go outside right now and you will possibly find a trans person.

[@TreFree-n7o]

You kinda look trans though.

[@markrussell3428]

Jesse is trying to find middle ground where there is none. When a trans advocate is unable to articulate what would shift them off of affirming childen and putting them on the path to surgery you know a real conservation is not possible.

[@mrminer071166]

Here's OPUS GENERIS a suite of five classical poems. CYBELE AND ATTIS is the first one, but the story doesn't end there. Singal seems to be learning that only a dialectic can cope with the gender-chaos. I will be performing OPUS GENERIS up & down CA, as a provocation to better discussion of trans, in the face of SB-107 and Save James Younger.

[@spencercapier2258]

Typo in screen title. Last name misspelled. 😊

[@Woahlookitthemoon]

what is “genuinely dysphoric”

[@coolbugfacts1234]

what is "genuinely cognitively limited"? i would imagine they'd print a picture of your mug in the dictionary, to define the lack of basic reasoning skills

[@littlecatfeet9064]

@@coolbugfacts1234 you don’t like questions, do you?

[@shereemcardell3352]

This is all about a bunch of words to make it seem like he's an expert on this topic. He isn't. It's the PARENTS who know what is best for their children, and their doctors who know them. All anyone needs to do is educate themselves by viewing some of the many videos of these parents relating their REAL experiences of the suffering their children go through, at a very young age, with horrible depression because they are in a body that doesn't match who they are inside. This is terrible for both the parents and their children! Anyone who doesn't have a child with this problem, why don't you thank God, or your lucky stars instead of adding more fuel to a fire that is dangerously growing because of people like you that just won't mind their own business! LEAVE these children alone, and their families. Do you want someone telling you their opinion on how you should raise your child? I'm sure that would be a big NO.Take care of yourself and loved ones, and I repeat MYOB.You live as you think best, and let others do the same with their lives!

[@NonyaSmith]

Agreed

[@shereemcardell3352]

The best information is given by a professional medical specialist in the field, same as information given by non-medical specialist in any field.

[@evesapple]

These parents get told- would you prefer to have a dead son or a live daughter? Tell a parent that, of course they’re going to agree to it. You also are forgetting that some parents are not nice people. Munchausens by proxy should tell u that for a few, they will endanger their child and medicalise them when it is not needed. You also disregard that for some, the chance to show how ‘liberal’ you are and prop up your reputation and image is unfortunately the prime motivator in their lives, including their children. It’s sad, but for a lot of people their children are not the most important thing.

[@marwar819]

I've encounter parents who wear their child's transgenderism like a badge of honor. It's sickening. It's not true that parents know best.

[@cerebrumpateo8112]

Poor Jesse ,

[@paulhwbooth]

Hmmmm

[@Thatssomebadhatharry1]

The Jesse who set his heart on degrading glinner who has always fought the good fight and Jesse now finally wants a seat at the table ?! You need to try a lot harder Jesse hun, and also apologise to him

[@TreFree-n7o]

Apologize for what exactly?

[@Thatssomebadhatharry1]

@@TreFree-n7o for bashing glinner at every opportunity when glinner was raising the same concerns back before that Jesse has finally woken up to and is sharing now. Him and his female mate forgotten her name really bashed into glinner and it was uncalled for

[@TreFree-n7o]

@@Thatssomebadhatharry1 Glinner seems obsessed with trans people in an unhealthy way. Jesse seems like a nonbias journalist.

[@Thatssomebadhatharry1]

@@TreFree-n7o glinner is pro women and lgb, oh and pro protecting children. Not anti normal transsexuals. The transtrenders are the biggest enemy of the trans community . Total difference