Joel Kellett: Why You're NOT Growing From HIT (This Will Really Have You Thinking!)

In part 5 of this monster interview, Joel explains the real reason why so many people don't grow from "high intensity training". In this eye opening discussion, Joel shares undeniable, thought provoking points that you simply can't afford to dismiss if you're goal is to truly grow bigger muscles, naturally!
Joel Kellett is an Australian bodybuilder who has trained consistently for over ten years. He was spotted by Nick Strength and Power in 2019 due to the fact that he has a physique that emulates the iconic Arnold Schwarzenegger! The Difference is that Joel built his physique via all natural bodybuilding.
Taken from episode 83 of the Longevity Muscle Podcast with Natural Bodybuilding Icon, Joel Kellett
Joel Kellett on IG: / overkell
Joel Kellett on KZbin: / @morethanmuscle
Kenny on IG: / kennyratatsidis
Longevity Muscle on IG: / longevitymuscle
Longevity Muscle Podcast on IG: / longevitymusclepodcast
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[@longevitymuscle]

There are many audio recordings of Mike Mentzer preaching that 1 set per exercise to failure is all that is required to "turn on the growth mechanism", with many people "wanting" or "feeling" they need more, where he aims to disprove the need for adding more sets in many of his audio recordings published. A lot of the recordings took place near the end and/or after his competitive bodybuilding career! Regardless of what Mike preached though, no one of this current generation truly knows how he even trained during/throughout the majority of competitive career and/or how his physique/drug protocol etc. evolved when he did what he claimed was HIT at the time vs. traditional higher volume training, which is how he most likely built the foundation of his physique doing. Depending on the HIT source, goal etc. many High Intensity Training advocates/trainees would frown upon anyone doing more than 1 set to momentary muscular failure per exercise (and perhaps even per body part, per workout) Some have even cultivated a set of "rules" that people must follow when performing a HIT protocol. A protocol by definition is a system of rules, a procedure i.e. an established or official way of doing something! "The way" by HIT standards is 1 set to momentary muscular failure (concentrically). True HIT advocates even suggest that the first few reps of the actual working set act as a warm up, which is why many don't even perform "warm up" sets and just get right into the all out set to failure. Mike Mentzer even talks about this in many of the recordings published before he passed. Lastly, just because someone claims they train to failure or implements failure training into their routine, doesn't automatically "qualify" them as following what is modernly considered a HIT protocol (which is even subjected to a very specific rep tempo). Also it seems as though many could use a good history lesson on HIT which was first introduced by Arthur Jones and later popularized by Casey Viator & the Mentzer brothers (in that order too). - Admin

[@mertonhirsch4734]

Mentzer claimed "in print" that at his biggest he was doing half his body every other day with 16-20 total sets to failure. That's 60 sets to failure a week and hitting everything 1.5x per week. Yates did 2-3 warmup sets on leg press where he looked like he was done.

[@RaveyDavey]

I've watched Dorian's training in Blood and Guts and it doesn't look like Dorian is training harder than anyone ever in history etc. He's pushing a set to failure. It's not that bloody hard.

[@angrygoldfish]

Yeah, I think people have romanticised his style of training and put him on a pedestal, which he generally seems to agree with. There's no doubt that taking a set of incline bench to failure with partials is incredibly hard, but it's not something only the top 0.1% can do. Gun to their head virtually anyone will do it. If the muscle cannot contract any longer to move the weight, the stress on the body decreases as the spotter takes over. It's just hanging out in that painful and difficult position instead of stopping. Spending an extra ten or so seconds in a challenging position doesn't mean you climbed a mountain barefoot while everyone else was having a picnic at the bottom. Most other people just take the slightly easier route to the top on wear shoes because they choose to and that's what their program dictates. If I decide to, I take off my shoes and take the harder route. I adjust my program and recovery to allow it. Done.

[@malcolmdcwwed]

It's not that hard bro. Just lift the weight.

[@Leo.de99]

He doesn’t even train muscle failure in blood and guts lmfao he’s really a few rir

[@LS-fp4mp]

0:45 John Heart was initially trained by Mike Mentzer and won the Mr America contest in 2013.

[@chrismosleythept2361]

Now that’s a smart dude. That was an excellent explanation.

[@davidtempest263]

What I liked about Mentzer is that he used logic and critical thinking in his approach to bodybuilding. Lifting weights is a stressor, assuming the weight something you aren’t accustomed to. It’s like getting a tan, or a blister. At some point, the stress is high enough to cause an adaptive response and doing it again isn’t necessary. I’m in Southern California. 15 minutes of sun is all I need in summer to stimulate my body to produce a tan. There’s no reason for me to go stay on the sun for longer, or to go back out in the sun again, later that day. And if I overdo it, and get a sun burn - I have to take a few days out of the sun. Yes, the mechanism of tanning, and building muscle are different. But the principle is the same. There hasn’t been any study that has found the optimum level of intensity required to build muscle. But if we can add weight to the bar or do more reps (all else being equal) then whatever we are doing for now, is effective. Some people make it rocket science and it’s not. People have to experiment themselves and find what works for them, what they enjoy what is sustainable and stuck with it until it no longer works, and then, make some changes and see if it gets them improving again.

[@TypicallyUniqueOfficial]

Nah. Volume isn’t the primary driver of muscle growth. If you don’t train to failure, you’re going to need more volume…but if you do train to failure you don’t need as much. 1 set is too low, but 5-10 hard sets to failure is truly all you need.

[@sergiojaenlara2091]

We've been lied with the powerlifting wave. I have injured myself working at low reps. The bodybuilding way is to work at 8-12 reps. I am stronger and healthier now

[@mikerude5073]

I agree with this. "Powerbuilding" ot powerlifting as a means to bodybuilding, at best, might yeild no better results, but with far higher injury risk. Low rep with heavy weight is just preparing the cns to test the muscle, but volume with rep work and controling and feeling the weight is better for building the muscle.

[@ddlo6581]

There are several reasons why HIT training hasn’t been as popular as typical volume training. The first would be that people take what Mike Mentzer said and without any knowledge about his philosophy or use if logic, quickly shut it down and say it doesnt work. Unfortunately most people are not even capable of understanding HIT and the logic and principles behind it. I will say this though. Even 1 set is a negative factor because lifting weights is ANAEROBIC which means we have LIMITED resources allocated to recovery.That being said, the “best” workout routine would be one where maximum stress can be put on the target muscle while keeping volume to a minimum so that all our resources can be put to recovery and eventually overcompensation and HIT is very close to that. Unfortunately unless you’re taking steroids volume training is typically unproductive.

[@dontreadmyname4396]

almost every bodybuilder does ramping sets to a top max set to failure or two per exercise, several exercises

[@JamesWilson-vq2fb]

It seems as if the primary difference in training philosophy is what is considered to be volume. Because Mike Mentzer and Dorian yates both did up to three 'warm up' sets before going into sets to failure, which Joel is essential saying is exactly what he does but he just counts those as working sets.

[@chickenlips9881]

Intensity is the key to growth end of, wether you’re doing one set or 10

[@jeffreywingham5302]

Works for me, it has taken 1 year to actually learn how to properly go to failure and beyond. One has to get their nutrition under control.

[@user-se8yv4lc3v]

Are you still training hit ? And also what big mistakes did you do in the beginning?

[@413barbellclub]

Great to see Joel getting recognition…but the mustache must cloud his judgement saying Brock is sometimes bigger 😅.

[@lukeskywalker7461]

Warm-ups should not be counted in "volume training." They don't count toward primary effective reps for progression (although they are often necessary to get to that point). So I'd say this guy pretty much trains similar to DY if his final set (or two) is to failure. Also, did he downplay the role of progressive resistance? It's literally the most important part in gaining large amounts of muscle.

[@georgesarreas5509]

He did not downplay it. It's just that after a point progressive overload occurs very slowly. So I think he meant instead of periodizing or whatever he just makes sure he gets in a good workout and if more weight is there he takes it.if not no problem. A lot of top level athletes train that way actually

[@deanbell2337]

If your losing internal fee just to move more weight then that is not a good idea, overload comes through adaptation and shouldn’t be forced, yes moving more load for more reps over time should be happening but it’s a by product of effective training

[@ConstantinoOfficial]

This is what Mike Mentzer taught though- multiple warm up sets ending about 75 percent of the target rep range load, before the one set to failure - so there’s no difference?!

[@polymathecian]

Mentzer's approach works for me.

[@user-se8yv4lc3v]

Are you still training hit and improving ?

[@austingriffin3996]

Commenting per usual to boost algorithm

[@longevitymuscle]

Thank you Austin 🙏

[@kylestaker9279]

I always thought to get bigger you had to get stronger in all lifts whether it’s a bench press or a lateral raise?

[@k.m.9801]

You are correct. But as a bodybuilder, you train for hypertrophy, which in turn makes you stronger, whether it is in your volume of lifts and / or weight.

[@MrTeodick]

I always did HIT, at least to my comprehension, and I do 2-3 warm up sets leading up to a heavy set to failure and I try to always train 45 min max. I don’t think what he’s doing is much different from that.

[@elix9099]

It is, some routines you’re training chest, legs &triceps, then 2-3 days later you’ll do shoulders, back & biceps and repeat. Another hit programme is literally one muscle group/ week almost.

[@AArmstrongC]

Got it. Little improvements are adding 10 kilos to a dip. 🙃 Nice interview!

[@angelotorri6908]

joel the best

[@angrygoldfish]

So are those 20 *working* sets (hard, stressful, highly stimulative) that he does, or is it like Dorian who did 'warmups' with 2-3 reps in reserve?

[@deanbell2337]

He has a KZbin channel and he talks over this on his training videos I belibe his channel is called more than muscle

[@user-qk8yk7km1n]

Was much more than 2 to 3 in reserve, generally he did around the same reps at each weight jump as the final set

[@ePandasBufek]

Czy da się zbudować tako sylwetkę ??

[@Gardocki74]

Look up Kevin Richardson on youtube. Dude is a natty who has never used anything and trains HIT for over 30 years...also no supplements....

[@jakepotts102]

What he does is not so different than HIT. He builds up to 1 or 2 top sets to failure in a bodybuilding rep range. 10 to 12 or 15 in good form with intensity and trains progressively and is in tune w how his body reacts and is feeling at the time.

[@longevitymuscle]

"Regarding how I train, yes it’s high intensity, but it isn’t an admission of training in the same fashion as Mike - and that’s the point. There are dramatic differences between the two training styles. My total training volume is much higher per workout/ per muscle group and I train each muscle group much more frequently." - Joel Kellett

[@jakepotts102]

@@longevitymuscle yup HIT isnt just Mike Mentzers interpretation there are many interpretations of it without being overly dogmatic like most of those HIT guys. Put simply it is hard work and allowing enough rest for you. Which will vary person to person. Like Bruce Lee take what works for you and discard the fluff. I saw a shoulder training video w Joe and took alot out if it. Mainly the fact of lightening up on laterals and getting more reps. Made sense!

[@BarbellsandBBQ]

Problem is is that everyone calls warm up sets "sets" these days.

[@steelphantom9105]

@@longevitymuscle. Depending on the person, what’s high intensity to one person isn’t to another. Meaning everyones body reacts differently to a stimulus depending on genetics, gender and age.

[@bobbuilder5362]

Dorian was no way a typical HIT trainer, look at his routine, it was more volume mixed with some ridiculous all out sets, 2 sets per exercise to failure, then later switched to 1 set per exercise. So back was 6 exercises, 2 warm up sets, 2 working sets which is 24 sets. Later his volume decreased slightly but volume would be more considered moderate.

[@spurzo-thespiralspacewolf8916]

Warm ups don’t count!

[@counts.archive]

HIT does work if you’re the 1% that does it right

[@bradfordmcdermott2063]

Helps to have a training partner to do the extra negatives when a positive failure

[@scottharrison5734]

The stronger you are more warm up sets need train twice week 5set a Bodey part 2 working sets look like athlete feel great but not big solid to 170 at 6ft genetics matter rather have good health joints

[@cygregory3773]

Struggling to see where the argument is... Using Dorian as an example, he would do a handful of warm up/ramp up sets. If you watch Blood & Guts I think he does like 4-5 sets of Incline Bench total. The last set is to failure. Joel just says he does the same thing...

[@longevitymuscle]

Hey Gregory, This quote is taken from Joel. "Regarding how I train, yes it’s high intensity, but it isn’t an admission of training in the same fashion. There are dramatic differences between the two training styles. My total training volume is much higher per workout/ per muscle group and I train each muscle group much more frequently." - admin

[@longevitymuscle]

To add, there is no argument intended! It's fair to consider the possibility that there are many people out there attracted to a HIT protocol because of the idea of less total volume and frequency, but don't have the understanding/experience/skillset required to adequately train to true momentary muscular failure (or perhaps even the ambition/desire to do so) which could explain why they aren't experiencing positive results from a HIT protocol. This was mentioned in the video, and for those who are aware of the history of HIT, what the modern day HIT advocates/defines HIT to be is actually far different than what Dorian did. There's no doubt that there are many different "versions" of what people consider to be HIT and perhaps that's where the confusion lies. An interesting question is, what do people consider "warm up" sets? How far away from failure these "warm up" sets are will influence how much they do/don't contribute to the potential for growth to occur. For example someone performing no warm up sets/1-2 warm up sets not even remotely close to failure vs. performing 3-4+ really hard "warm up" sets close to failure, both still leading up to 1 set to failure will lead to very different outcomes. Not to mention the other influencing factors on the outcome (within our control) i.e. training frequency, overall volume, execution and recovery. It's no doubt that a skilled bodybuilder doing 3-4 hard "warm up" sets close to failure and then 1-2 sets to failure (like they claim) involves a really high intensity of effort, but it's different than what a HIT protocol is (Please see pinned comments for a short breakdown on HIT) Especially when it involves someone implementing training to failure 6-7 days per week vs the 1-2x per week training that a modern day HIT advocate advises for most people vs what Dorian actually did. The real issue lies in the branding of various training systems much like various diets i.e. keto vs. carnivore vs. paleo etc. When you peel all that away it's more about understanding when, how and at what point any combination of volume/intensity/frequency is appropriate based on individual needs/goals. This was not mentioned in the video because it's besides the point, however it's definitely worth mentioning here! If you made it this far, you deserve to be more informed 👍 - Admin

[@ClassicTor]

I agree with almost everything that joel says but i tried high volume, really low volume, ppl, upper lower, fullbody you know every type of workout i tried but i do HIT for roughly 7months now and i have really good results. I also dont have a stric scedule so i train when im ready to train again so i let my body recover and build good. So most of the times i train 2days a week and HIT just works the best gor me at the moment maybe in the future it will change again( but to be honest there isnt a golden workout or something yes every human body builds muscle the same way but the best way to get there is different)

[@truefitness3277]

Let’s see your physique

[@possible_131]

Well let me be the devil's advocate. When you usually change up your training, you also change other variables as well. Were you recovering better by eating better, sleeping, etc. When you were training high volume, was every set taken 5-0 RIR? Did you periodize your exercises? etc. etc

[@ClassicTor]

@@possible_131 yes i didnt like do it for a week or 2 and switch i did a year or 6months of the type of training style and tried to make it work for me and i got gains and stuff but when i came across mike mentzer and dorian yates and there style it just made sense to me

[@ClassicTor]

@@possible_131 and my recovery and food consumption are always good

[@ClassicTor]

@@possible_131 but because they always say you have to train your muscles 2x a week the recovery and improvement are not really that great

[@MrHyjac]

So how do you explain Jeff alberts, Ben Howard, Mr America Heart, Alberto Nunez (To some extent) etc etc.

[@longevitymuscle]

They've have been interviewed on this channel and some numerous times even, if you're curious and would like more insight, just type there name in the search box of this channel.

[@MrHyjac]

@@longevitymuscle I know I’ve seen them. I meant so now you don’t believe what they said? You seemed to agree with this gentlemen and act as if low volume high intensity isn’t enough.

[@longevitymuscle]

@@MrHyjac It's not a matter of believing anything. The podcast isn't even about Kenny! However, since you asked, Kenny specifically mentions that perhaps many people are more attracted to HIT because of the of the lack of volume/frequency and want an excuse to just do 1 set when in reality that set for many isn't even close to what is considered true momentary muscular failure. Is this the case for everyone, of course not! Also, It's rare to see someone who has proven to actually grow an impressive amount of muscle naturally only doing 1 set to failure via a true HIT protocol (please see pinned comment on this). To be clear, what's mentioned in the video is not an attempt to defend one particular form of training "style" or one method being superior than another. In reality it's about knowing when, how and at what point any combination of volume/intensity/frequency is appropriate based on individual needs/goals. This was not mentioned in the video because it's besides the point, however it seems as though it's worth mentioning here. Lastly there is no doubt that there are many different "versions" of what can be considered HIT and perhaps that is where the confusion lies in this comment section. - Admin

[@MrHyjac]

@@longevitymuscle right but I never mentioned 1 set to failure. I mentioned Jeff, Ben, Etc who do minimum 2 sets up to 8 sets per body part per week. I guess there’s a lot of context missing. Just going off of the stance, words spoken and body language in the video.

[@longevitymuscle]

@@MrHyjac ​ Not saying you did, just clarifying the main points of the video :) Also, it’s understandable for sure. Unfortunately it’s not uncommon that people will take something very specific that is mentioned in a particular context and assume it automatically applies outside of that. Perhaps one’s bias towards a certain “style” of training (this is just an example) has something to do with this. Lastly, this is a short segment of a much more in depth conversation, so yes, more context around this subject and/or elaborating further would probably be helpful for many or at least clear up a lot of the confusion. The title sure didn’t help lol! Thanks for chiming in. - admin

[@Nicholas19823]

Over complicating it, you do t have e to train like a complete warrior on every set, use your initiative, take a set to momentary muscular failure, job done what is the problem? If you get stuck half way through a rep then congrats, you have achieved failure! Great effort, strength gains to follow 👍

[@user-vu6lq7yk1n]

I took Mentzers approach from a natty standpoint and What ive learned is that if I get to train to a certain level of intensity i hit the gym only twice to mostly three times per week. The one giveaway that it works is that i am an intermediate to advanced lifter been working out more than 10 years but metzers approach not knowing if steroids were involved (most likely yes) that would mean you recover from soreness pretty quickly and that makes you go and train more often. I take it as a modified version trying to go to complete failure after at most 4 to 5 sets 2 or at most three exercises for each body part depending on the muscle group and not hit the muscle again until i am at 0 soreness and then repeat,, this has granted me to progress on a consistent basis and I do not put much emphasis on the scale and how much I weight because i am pretty lean and one day you may retain some water and weight more some days its less so since its all an illusion and the fact that i have an insanely fast metabolism ive gotten to a place that Mentzer who is the biggest scientific based bodybuilder of all time and tweak it to my needs and how my body recovers, He, Mentzer made an analogy regarding poking a sponge and the more you poke it (frequent training) will not allow for your muscles to recover and grow because you may be training half assed or training while still in some pain. Once you get experience you will know when soreness is from overtraining rather than actually stimulation. I pay attention to my diet and has worked for me. So its been a matter of just tweaking Mentzers philosophy to your knowledge of hoe your body works and then se if progress is reached. Its worked for me look very lean not fat at all water percentage is between 10 and 15% and I prefer that separation and leanness rather than just looking buff with no definition of where one body part starts and the other begins. So first off it is crucial to recognize your metabolism so you know what diet to approach. I do intermittent fasting so I do not clog my system of overeating and nutrients such as protein that will not be absorbed and you might have that transformed into fat. If you are holding fat and just tweak it for your cardio needs and just watch Mentzers seminars about the way to gain mass and you will be convinced that he nailed the scientific proof of his program. Always taking into consideration that even for an enhanced athlete just one set per body part once a week or something like that is just to little of a work out. You have to warm up and your last two sets go all in the second working set is to make sure that the muscle was taxed enough and come back and do it again when soreness is gone. That i cannot stress enough. Soreness must completely be gone even if it takes a week or more. Not that other programs do not work but just try to understand that in bodybuilding (not weight lifting for power) does not call to more is better like the ridiculous weight training program Arnold was doing remember he took steroids and some that are more hardcore to put it one way than others. Its just unsustainable. So to me Arnold is the king who put the sport on the map and inspired his generations and all generations up to today but his training regimen is rubbish to me. And Mentzer is the father who needs more recognition by bringing in the principals of what it takes scientifically proven btw to get progress and strength week after week.

[@TheKinetic]

Never button your shirt all the way up. You see the difference, right?

[@stevencaldwell838]

53 years old. I smoke weed, a few cigarettes a day and drink whiskey every night… put on 8lbs of muscle on an intense HIT program over the last 6 months! Genetics or does everyone have it all wrong? Top athletes die at 47 and guys like me live til 90! I take my training seriously but also indulge in and have for over 40 years! Today was leg day…

[@JungleIsMassiv]

You're delusional

[@ppe1337]

Markus rühl used this Training method , like dorian. He said you Need only one destroying set for each muscle group, the other sets are for preparation so the muscle is not overly shocked

[@oooBoEoNooo]

Markus Rühl never trained according to Dorian's method and he never said that it only takes one destroying set for each muscle group. Asked about his training style, he only ever said with a smile: Heavy and false.

[@forasago]

@@oooBoEoNooo * Heavy and wrong False means something else.

[@oooBoEoNooo]

@@forasago That's right. Thank you for the correction 🙂

[@GG-wg1yh]

Once again, Mike Mentzer did not say do 1 set. Literally listen and or read any of his principles on this. He didnt just walk into the gym do 1 set of flyes and walk out. He said do what is necessary and what you can recover from. If doing 5 sets is a productive as doing 10, why in the hell would you waste your time doing 10? I watched the whole video before I typed this and you never corrected yourself with that. Also, I highly doubt you and the guy in the video have ever trained as hard as Dorian Yates did, Mike Mentzer doesnt have that many videos besides demonstrations, but the reason HIT doesnt "WORK" for people, is because they have no idea how to properly train to failure. Dude just said warm up sets as well. Working sets vs warm up sets are completely different. Literally this dude just admitted to doing HIT training by saying he warms up and then does one set to all out failure.

[@longevitymuscle]

There are many audio recordings of Mike Mentzer preaching that 1 set per exercise to failure is all that is required to "turn on the growth mechanism", with many people "wanting" or "feeling" they need more, where he aims to disprove the need for adding more sets in many of his audio recordings published. A lot of the recordings took place near the end and/or after his competitive bodybuilding career! Regardless of what Mike preached though, no one of this current generation truly knows how he even trained during/throughout the majority of competitive career and/or how his physique/drug protocol etc. evolved when he did what he claimed was HIT at the time vs. traditional higher volume training, which is how he most likely built the foundation of his physique doing. "The reason HIT doesnt "WORK" for people, is because they have no idea how to properly train to failure." Thanks for re-iterating. Depending on the HIT source, goal etc. many High Intensity Training advocates/trainees would frown upon anyone doing more than 1 set to momentary muscular failure per exercise (and perhaps even per body part, per workout) Some have even cultivated a set of "rules" that people must follow when performing a HIT protocol. A protocol by definition is a system of rules, a procedure i.e. an established or official way of doing something! "The way" by HIT standards is 1 set to momentary muscular failure (concentrically). True HIT advocates even suggest that the first few reps of the actual working set act as a warm up, which is why many don't even perform "warm up" sets and just get right into the all out set to failure. Mike Mentzer even talks about this in many of the recordings published before he passed. Lastly, just because someone claims they train to failure doesn't automatically "qualify" them as following what is modernly considered a HIT protocol (which is even subjected to a very specific rep tempo). Also it seems as though many could use a good history lesson on HIT which was first introduced by Arthur Jones and later popularized by Casey Viator & the Mentzer brothers (in that order too). - Admin

[@GG-wg1yh]

@@longevitymuscle This response was about as long as mind in terms of usefulness in the applicability of any training style. What is required is high intense workouts at a maximal effort. Then you have to recover and grow. Yes Mike said that one set was all that was required but I'm not sure if you've ever looked at the workouts he prescribed for people as they weren't just one set maybe one set of a given exercise but never just one set and in his later and what he said was you have to do what you can grow and recover from but still saying all this means nothing. You have to train intensely and you have to recover from that. All these guys come on here and talk about all their splits all this all that and it's a bunch of crap. Some are not natural obviously but peddle their programs like they are and then put people down who say they're unnatural and that's how they got their growth from a certain intensity of effort in a training exercise The training is the same they're ability to recover is what changes. Think about it. If you can work out recover and then grow faster than you're going to build muscle faster you're going to get stronger faster and you're going to be able to keep that muscle versus someone who doesn't have that extra capability. To make it simple it's like wolverine he can get hit and recover almost immediately and keep going A normal person can't do that same thing for an anabolic user You can't train as often as them. You may be able to train as hard but you won't be able to do it as often and you won't be able to grow from it if you try. Tom Platz is another example of training to failure. Mikes dead so we cant even discuss his final word on it so its pointless.

[@overkell3457]

To clarify, neither of us said Mike did only 1 set of any one exercise, nor did we said his style of training doesn’t work, just that people are attracted to the idea of less total volume but don’t know how to adequately train to failure and therefore mightn’t/ won’t see the same results Mike and Dorian saw. Regarding how I train, yes it’s high intensity, but it isn’t an admission of training in the same fashion as Mike - and that’s the point. There are dramatic differences between the two training styles. My total training volume is much higher per workout/ per muscle group and I train each muscle group much more frequently. Mostly because I love training, I love being in the gym, and I dislike cardio, so if I were to train any less, I would have to reduce the amount of food I eat to compensate for the lack of energy expenditure (something else I dislike about training only a few times per week). Mike was also a big believer in heavier weights for fewer reps as a means of gaining muscle, whereas I don’t believe weight lifted = muscle acquired. Bottom line, there are many roads that lead to the same result - that’s not disagreed upon, and I’m not saying my way of training is better, just that it’s worked for me, and if viewers are interested in trying any one training style to actually adhere to it wholeheartedly.

[@GG-wg1yh]

@@overkell3457 thank you for your response. I like watching these videos because I want to see what other people do in order to gain muscle. I think I'm just trying to clear up or I'm upset at confusion because people who are in the gym don't realize the intensity of effort it takes to to stimulate a muscle growth response. I don't want to sound like a fanboy but h i t when put in perspective by Mike mentor it was so straightforward. Simply put start with one set and only move up if that's what is required the stimulate more muscle growth. I think it was kind of like along the lines of Greg doucet He realizes that most people do not have genetics to be elite in bodybuilding and seeing them waste countless hours and time trying to achieve that is futile nevertheless doesn't mean you should never try. 👍🏼

[@patrickclark1000]

Joel, how in the world can you going to wear that mustache and criticize Heavy Duty.

[@cobra4961]

@longevitymuscle YOU and the many others just don't know and understand exactly how to create the right tension and intensity from the very first rep that is all. irst of all, how natural is this wanna-be Arnold?? If you truly learn how to train the Mentzer way, there is no way you can do more than 1 set per exercise and do every set with the same intensity for longer than 30 minutes. I have trained on gear high volume and got results obviously because if you dose right and combine a stack you will gain. Then I trained high volume naturally and ended up getting smaller and injured. Training HIT I have no injuries and I look like I train. Do you look like you train PODCASTER???

[@jakemaxwell2800]

Another guy who does high intensity training without realising it lol

[@hispacacciato3514]

Bulshit. Dorian was training hard but not crazy hard. He was just resting enough, was a good responder and was taking the tight stuff, besides diet, ot course

[@lukeskywalker7461]

Because bodybuilding is mostly a waste of time, it's no wonder people would rather get the most bang for their buck from their exercise

[@lukeskywalker7461]

@morgan1027 it serves no practical purpose (except maybe to see if mirrors still work) and is narcissistic af.

[@lukeskywalker7461]

@morgan1027 You don't have to be competitive to be a "bodybuilder." But you typically have to have a level of body dysmorphia and be overly concerned with how your body appears to others (enough to spend far more hours than necessary doing it, and even take PEDs). Thus, you can be a "recreational lifter" and still be a bodybuilder. Lifting for health and fitness is quite different, IMO. Why the comment? Why not...I'm kinda interested to see the response(s) from a bodybuilding sympathetic crowd.

[@georgesarreas5509]

Cope buddy. It's as much a waste as golf is. Or playing pool. Don't get me started on bowling. Thinking your opinion is objective and verbalising that is literally how you show people how smart you are :).

[@lukeskywalker7461]

@@georgesarreas5509 interesting argument, even though I didn't make any claims to the contrary, including the (impossible) objectivity of my opinion.

[@dontreadmyname4396]

@@lukeskywalker7461 ever heard of health and happiness of achieving something plus the fun of training as a hobby? with your logic everything in live that isn't eating or getting $$$ is a waste of time..

[@robbuchheim6478]

The dude on he left doesn't even look like he lifts, but he's putting it down without having any sort of experience or feedback data from people who use it.

[@robbuchheim6478]

I mean the dude on the right

[@longevitymuscle]

Hey Rob, to be clear this video is not aimed at supporting and/or condemning one particular “style” of training. It's mentioned specifically that perhaps there’s a large percentage of people that are more attracted to traditional HIT protocol (please see pinned comment) because of the lack of volume/frequency than the actual training style itself. Also, this series is about Joel sharing what he does for himself, not about Kenny! At the very least though, this video may offer some unique perspective in that it will have people questioning whether they actually are training to failure, more specifically for those who aren't making progress or growing muscle (assuming that's the goal) from a traditional HIT protocol. Perhaps you watched the video, but it seems as though you misinterpreted the message. If you watched the whole video Kenny even mentions that one must find where on the continuum of volume/intensity they lie i.e. experiment and find what combination suits, which may evolve over time based on many different factors. Lastly, there are many professional natural bodybuilders that have been interviewed on this channel, offering plenty of feedback!