Ep. 15 - Awakening from the Meaning Crisis - Marcus Aurelius and Jesus

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•Pocket Casts: pca.st/EYU4
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Books in the Video:
•Marcus Aurelius - Meditations
•Julian Barnes - A History of the World in 10 ½ Chapters
•Erich Fromm - To Have or To Be?
•Pierre Hadot - What Is Ancient Philosophy?
•Pierre Hadot - Philosophy as a Way of Life: Spiritual Exercises from Socrates to Foucault
•Margaret Visser - Beyond Fate
Series Playlist: kzbin.info?list...
Facebook: / vervaeke.john
Twitter: / vervaeke_john
Fifteenth episode of Dr. John Vervaeke's Awakening from the Meaning Crisis.

[@kellyfitzgerald5649]

If going to church provided inspiration and meaning as these lectures do for me, I wouldn’t miss another Sunday Service ever again.

[@alisaruddell3484]

As a practicing/believing Christian, I am profoundly moved by how you described Jesus, Logos, kairos, metanoia, and agape. That last section was better than many a sermon I’ve heard! Thank you for showing such respect to all the religious traditions you talk about.

[@dr.varghesed.n8419]

Yes . Doesn't he grip our ?minds in the last bit

[@matthewheadland7307]

I’m listening to this in bits and it’s been transformative for me. I’m excited to get to that section!

[@scotcoleman2013]

Do you not realize that he was mocking Christians and their "quaint" beliefs?

[@alisaruddell3484]

@@scotcoleman2013 Having listened to over 100 hours of John's lectures and conversations, I can't think of a single instance where he mocked anyone for anything, and certainly not over something as important as sincerely held religious beliefs. That's not the kind of person he is. John always does his best to be respectful when disagreeing with others or when summarizing/presenting their views.

[@andrewternet8370]

@@alisaruddell3484 I think Scot was being sarcastic (thus the quotation marks)

[@antoniobarbalau1107]

God my conciousness has gone up so many times throughout the series I barely feel the same man.

[@watcherofvideoswasteroftim5788]

How do you feel about it 1 year later?

[@antoniobarbalau1107]

@@watcherofvideoswasteroftim5788 My relationship got better than ever, things at work got better than ever and I enjoy life more than ever. And it is actually quite remarkable for me because I came from a position where I was depressed. I've been engaging with John's ecology of practices on a daily basis and made a constant effort to apply them in everyday life. Things just get better and better ♥️

[@watcherofvideoswasteroftim5788]

​@@antoniobarbalau1107 That's awesome to hear! Even though I started watching this series less than 3 days ago I feel like you can somehow intuit that the material and the way it's presented is immensely valuable. The way it is presented is also a huge contributing factor in its *salience*, thanks a lot John.

[@SapientEudaimonia]

@@antoniobarbalau1107 Great to hear, Antonio! This series of lectures has been lifechanging for me as well. What practices are part of your life right now?

[@MattFRox]

“Love is a modal way of being.” Possibly the most important statement I’ve ever heard.

[@shelkhanmusic]

It's just beautiful isn't it? Wrote this on my wall as soon as I heard it

[@Ricoidris]

Everything makes more sense that way...

[@jenniferbrantley5931]

One of the best contrasts and explanations I’ve ever heard.

[@TheBillaro]

what does it mean

[@alan-muscat]

@@TheBillaro I think you could remove the word modal "Love is a way of being" and it would mean the same thing.

[@doubleBbooks]

Thank you for this series Mr Vervaeke. I'm not an uneducated person and yet listening to your lectures I feel like my extended education left me wholly ignorant about the roots of my own culture - no wonder we have a meaning crisis. I didn't go to university until I was in my 30s and I was surprised at how little the kids coming into university straight from A levels seemed to know. This lack of education, as opposed to a lack of schooling, seems to be getting worse as education in the UK is increasingly assessed relative to its utility in producing the right sort of workers with the right sort of skills for the economy we're going to have (in the glorious future). The only sort of education such schooling seems to provide is that one's value lies in what one has (in this instance skills but the lesson generalises) and so, it seems to me, to lead inexorably to modal confusion and to a deepening of the meaning crisis. Adam Curtis's film 'The Century of Self' comes to mind.

[@JiminiCrikkit]

I am often reminded of Aldous Huxley's words in The Doors of Perception, on this aspect of education - "Instead of transforming children into fully developed adults, it turns out students of the natural sciences who are completely unaware of Nature as the primary fact of experience, it inflicts upon the world students of the humanities who know nothing of humanity, their own or anyone else's."

[@jjasmin1000]

I almost cried during the "heaven" analogy and your personal stance on immortality. Thank you for these treasures and wisdom Professor Vervaeke

[@peterrosqvist2480]

Do you know when during the video he spoke of that?

[@n2the1]

@@peterrosqvist2480 I think it's around 35:19

[@peterrosqvist2480]

@@n2the1 Thank you very much

[@marivn8156]

same, that was very touching

[@jamsenbanch]

Im not crying yOURE crying

[@tensevo]

I have studied philosophy and psychology, casually for over a decade, but this course continues to provide some real insights that I had not come across before.

[@OfCourseICan]

I have been living my life as a Cynic and now going to live as a Stoic. Thank You again John.

[@vib2119]

'You can be happy even in a palace' I love that line. While I greatly admire The Buddha for everything thing he has done which are in some ways greater than what Marcus Aurelius did, but just because of that one line Marcus Aurelius seems so much more moral and good to me. To achieve his personal wisdom,he didn't abandon everything. He carried it all while on his journey to wisdom. So amazing, that's a great role model.

[@spiralsun1]

That quote really hit me too. One of my one struggles in life is that I never valued material things or attention per se. I loved the meaning in them. The connections. So I value my quiet moments staring at pebbles on the beach so to speak. I have become so good at seeing meaning. But I never did much with it because I only recently realized that I didn’t want attention and “palace” life anywhere near as much as meaning. There is no wealth greater. By sharing meaning you have all that and it’s isolating and distracting. But yeah I finally think it’s going to be fine if people see me and the pebbles I found, lol. Since I love meaning, why not make everything more meaningful by sharing the love? Yay.

[@vib2119]

@Ashley McCole I think that's what I drew from that translation as well, but a more sincere translation is always appreciated

[@travisstotts1107]

Thanks for helping me discover myself one video at a time

[@noahweikert9367]

I have been sitting down on Sunday with the kids and watching an episode of your series after church. It has raised alot of interesting question from them.

[@LukeMlsna]

NOAH WEIKERT you earned the heck out of that “#1 dad” mug.

[@michaelmorrisinfarsi]

“Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference” - serenity prayer

[@MattFRox]

I’ve listened to this full lecture all the way thru a few times and yet I still routinely get sucked back in when one just randomly starts playing. AMC is the Shawshank Redemption of KZbin lectures

[@jeoffreywortman]

You are the only genuine ally my generation has ahead, in the name of the milleannial spirit. I most sincerely thank you for your breaking it down. It might not change the world forever on its own. but for sure what you're portraying is a huge millestone. Thank you very very much.

[@keyframe5806]

ok. Noooow I am hooked. I mean the part with the budha was awesome but now you bring clarity in subjects like death and love. Wow. Best class ever.

[@guycomments]

The one after this one gave me a conversion experience

[@philmessina476]

I'm watching this episode again. And it's blowing my mind even more than before, now that I have a stronger grasp of all the concepts. I'm glad this resource is publicly available.

[@philmessina476]

(c. 10:18) "The core of wisdom is knowing what's in your control and what is not."

[@MattAngiono]

"Love is a verb, it ain't a thing. It's not something you hold, not something you scream. If you show me love, you don't need your words. Cause love ain't a thing, love is a verb." A beautiful and insightful song by John Mayer

[@one4320]

I used to think that too, now I think love is what I AM. It's what we all are, we don't do it, we are it. Recognise that about one's self and see how much easier and naturally the 'doing of it', or expressing it, becomes.

[@MattAngiono]

@One agreed, although it's just one perspective. We are all part of the same thing, which is the basis of non dualistic ways of conceptualizing the world. I would also say that it isn't enough in this version of reality to just be love... WE HAVE TO DO IT! WE HAVE TO SHOW IT TO OTHERS! Not to virtual signal, but because that's what we are and it's the most natural way of being human (which means compassionate, or loving) Cheers

[@vademecor]

Fantastic. Your description of agape made me cry. It's so profound and beautiful.

[@samuelnuzbrokh3027]

Amazing closing statement John. Connecting this to the last lecture on the wide-scale domicide experienced by so many peoples in the Roman Empire that were left in a state of existential homelessness - one can fully appreciate the draw of the Christian message in offering them personhood and spiritual citizenship.

[@jenniferbrantley5931]

I totally agree the last statement was an eye opener!

[@betauser6233]

Hands down the best teacher and thinker on youtube. You can definitely see that he practices what he preaches and is speaking through wisdom instead of knowledge.

[@nugzarkapanadze6867]

Brilliant! Thank You!

[@corruptcatalyst4141]

"You're not trying to consume the child" feel this is the kyros to mention Kronos

[@LondonReps]

God bless you for this series, thank you.

[@garykoshland]

Thank you John for all this beautiful work.

[@rdrzalexa]

Aaaah!!!! This is your best lecture to date John! I cant wait for next week!

[@HMALDANA]

It is always a pleasure to listen to you, professor Vervaeke. Your talks help me assess my assumptions.

[@a-bis-zett]

Again such an insightful episode. And when you spoke about yourself in third person as, of course, John Vervaeke, my subtitles made "John Verve a Key" out of it - which makes perfectly sense to me :-) Key experiences conveyed with a lot of verve. Thank you so much.

[@tomastorrens7972]

Thank you so much John. Your work is painfully deep and inspiring.

[@antonyliberopoulos933]

This is a treat. Thank you John

[@JMTibbetts145]

Love it, this has inspired practical engagement to mental health here in Marion Ohio.

[@wcropp1]

Enjoyed this one...thanks Professor!

[@leedufour]

Thanks John.

[@satinek]

Thank you so much. Since I’ve started following you my life has become more meaningful again. I watch these videos and do your guided meditations. What makes your videos special for me that I end up feeling peaceful instead of being confused or feeling hatred towards others.

[@user-yk9sk7pg6v]

I can't believe how incredible this is and that I have access it to it. Thank you, John.

[@trinitycare2023]

Thank you very much for your time and dedication.

[@lawrencehaynes3843]

I just stumbled upon this series and what a profound gift it is. You are indeed a master of the craft of teaching.

[@user-dj7nl2ct3q]

Today Marcus Aurelius's birth day!

[@joereeve2569]

Lately I've been toying with the idea of applying to a master's and becoming a therapist and this video convinced me.

[@tracywilliamsliterature]

it's a genuine privilege to watch this series.

[@justicebjorke2790]

Thank you, John.

[@Blaze92NL]

By far the most impactful lecture so far! Thank you deeply for this series John and I look forward continuing it.

[@marivn8156]

Thank you John😊

[@klavstarp]

I am in awe..! Nothing more and nothing less. Totally deeply in awe.

[@Beederda]

I appreciate YOUR time JV ❤️🍄

[@wisamrohilina3006]

A marvellous episode.. a lesson on living and being.. everyone dies, but not everyone live.

[@LunaLu-00]

"L♡ve turns animals/non-persons into a moral person" Love this💖👍

[@danielan889]

when you fuse them together you get confused, that's pretty deep

[@user-qm3xs9eb6m]

You’re blowing my doors off John 👏

[@celesteschacht8996]

These episodes are the best thing on the internet!!!! Thank you :O)

[@Rhysibabe]

Thank you infinitely for your work and your insights, you're a badass.

[@adavidbujanda]

I really like this video its good back ground sound to work or drive to. Helps me manage myself better.

[@daNihilism]

I am currently being asked to join a mental health organization for work. I am already vice-president of my state’s National Alliance on Mental Illness and only 27, but now that my position involves managing networks of teams I have been listening to Aurelius while alone. John, I am going to be managing people who are all motivated to be in the mental health field, what content can I share with them that can explain modal confusion? The quote that: one can be happy, even in a palace, has always weighed upon me. Thank you for your efforts and your team’s help. Also, thanks for respecting Christianity enough to talk with Pageau, that conversation and your Revel Wisdom interviews are very helpful for those of us who go to church every Sunday.

[@Oneeyedone]

I watched the series backwards and reached enlightenment

[@johnvervaeke]

😂

[@Oneeyedone]

Im really enjoying your series. Ive learned more from you today .than i have in 10 years of searching for meaning in my life

[@Vgallo]

wow this is brilliant, especially for people like myself and my partner who are fascinated by philosophy but couldnt afford to study it!!!

[@NeilAcquatella]

I have been into Stoicism over the past months, reading and watching lectures. Found this series by chance mentioned on a podcast, and I’m now quite interested in following the whole set of videos. Recommend by J.B. Peterson, and complemented by books by Ryan Holiday. Thanks.

[@love80music]

Thank you

[@skadiwarrior2053]

Excellent thank you

[@ZacharyBetz]

Beautiful.

[@matthewgillam149]

This was probably my fav ep so far. Agape

[@aryanz66]

Thank you very much, for your time and attention.

[@dekka213l]

This dude is a body snatcher!! Love this smoke!

[@protestanttoorthodox3625]

"Would you be free from your burden of sin? There's power in the blood of Jesus." I agree with you John... an eternal existence stuck with our sin nature would be torture.

[@cbyrd2010]

The title got me and the Debussy intro got me cozy and dialed in.

[@mills8102]

In a situation where I have been profoundly jaded, this video series has brought about deep insights in me that have been integrated into my conscious and unconscious processes that have enabled me to facilitate the same realizations in my children. The concept of parasitic processing was pivotal. In this video, it was new understanding Agape. I owe you a great debt of gratitude.

[@offthecuff7.]

Truly an excellent and moving explanation of Jesus , My Lord.

[@accadia1983]

24:08 it's ok! it's ok! shhh. it's ok, we are here. :) he is so passionate with this one!!! because this is a hard truth - "the world does not care" - or probably, the opposite - "our views are often wrong"

[@tensevo]

I have never before thought of the Buddha as one who shirks moral responsibilities, but that's pretty much what he did in a way.

[@LunaProtege]

The problem I have with the "I'm done now" idea, is the scope of the desire I wish to see fulfilled would take an incomprehensibly long time to see to completion... Imagine how long it would take to see every planet in the galaxy, to seed each and every one of them with life, unique life, and see each of those planet's inhabitants grow to say they truly lived. To see all that creation has to offer and then to remake creation in order to create new things for it to offer. The sad thing is, it presents a stark picture; as if what meaning is now within our grasp to comprehend is beyond the scope of our lives to obtain... In stark contrast to how it was for the majority of people throughout history. The best we can do is express it in art and call it a day.

[@pvanthony]

I am not very smart. I had to re-listen to this video many times. I think about 6 times over weeks. Every time I learn something new. Just beautiful. Really beautiful. Can I use the word orgasmic? :-)

[@hamedmoradi5291]

I enjoyed this lecture a lot. I agree that love isn't an emotion, it's rather a mode of being, a mode of relating to the world that engenders different emotions. Paul Tillich in his book " Love, Power and Justice" said that if love is just an emotion, how can it be demanded? You cannot demand someone to have a particular emotion towards something. But love is the basic moral principle in Christianity that transcends justice and is demanded of people to treat each other according to it. It stand to reason that this sort of love is agapeic.

[@alexandermoody1946]

Sticking the cup back together to use is reward in itself.

[@RapPowah]

This is bright side of youtube. Free knownledge.

[@stephen-torrence]

10:00 Totally echoes the Serenity Prayer 39:00 "I do not want to live forever..." I find this utterly courageous, humble, and admirable to proclaim, especially in the way you did. Bravo, Sir.

[@d.r.m.m.]

Wow! WOW!! Such a great lecture! Thank you, John. This video took much longer to complete, although I didn’t want it to end, because I kept rewinding to hear certain parts over again. Truly excellent, thanks! _/\_

[@protestanttoorthodox3625]

John you have a way of teaching logos and kairos that makes me understand more in 15 minutes of your lecture than 15 years of preaching at church lol.

[@Wamagirii]

Very deep and insightful. Thank you John for these lessons. I look forward to listening to them every Saturday. Namaste

[@marktidmore2675]

A powerful journey through the human condition. Like a curious child, he overturns the cultural touchstones and reveals beneath, we are all still there.

[@pantherstealth1645]

Wtf!!! this is such an epic and profound topic of these two names!!

[@tatsumakisempyukaku]

36:50 I think John missed the point of having a period being in heaven is about becoming or grasping or being in most proximity to the highest and most ideal good. So the point of going to heaven is not to achieve in mortality, instead immortality is just a byproduct of chasing the good

[@LearnWithBahman]

It would be awesome to have few hours of lecture about Marcus Aurelius and his work.

[@Brentley88]

"When you bring a child home from the hospital, it's basically a slug." A slug with a distinctive event-meaning relationship. One of love, Agape love. This example hammered home how agape is a Modal way of being.

[@dalibofurnell]

What an incredible , I mean truly incredible episode, I became very engaged

[@5hydroxyT]

my only problem with your description of therapy (which you describe as CBT) is that it assumes we are rational beings, and that resolving the confusion between the meaning and the event (or in CBT, the cognitive distortion ) will alleviate the depression. I don’t believe this is the case - depression is not (purely) a disorder of cognition

[@tensevo]

It is so interesting you decided to combine Marcus A, with Jesus, I would personally like to see a lecture that combines Plato with Hegel.

[@exponentialpotential9442]

Sacred IamMortality 😊😊😊 Blessings

[@newphaze4t370]

Well, John Vervaeke, you may last forever whether you like it or not. This Pre Covid-19 lecture may be the foundation of a long lasting post Covid-19 philosophy.

[@911garebear]

Anyone have a decent set of notes from these lectures they would be willing to share? It'd be much appreciated.

[@christopherhallkvist7519]

Andrew Sweeny writes commentary on medium.com. Could be worth checking out.

[@stephen-torrence]

See user Redient's comments on the videos For this one: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fKevlmd4qrpghK8&lc=Ugy72-IESUWVtAhZRpd4AaABAg

[@rdrzalexa]

John, I love your work and even cited you in my final philosphy paper but can you buy another sweater?

[@jamieyoung9392]

I suspect he films these in one day :-)

[@ChrisJones-hs6nj]

I get the feeling he wears loads of diffetent sweaters but they all look the same.

[@christopherhallkvist7519]

Why have a variety in clothing? It worked for Jobs, Obama and Zuckerberg.

[@rdrzalexa]

Christopher Hallkvist to give viewers variety. KZbin is a visual medium after all.

[@christopherhallkvist7519]

@@rdrzalexa I understand. My post was a bit tongue in cheek. :)

[@kasupa14]

Love the wisdom, but also giggled at the truck not caring about my happiness xdd

[@zujev16]

Could anyone remind me in which lecture John used an example of therapy session where a therapist plays a role of a father?

[@yazanasad7811]

Stoic exercises 1) Separating meaning from events (imagining sex as a physical process cause/event relationship 2) Kissing son goodbye every night 3) View from above (changing arena perspectives) 4) Internal Socratic dialogue

[@mrtyanthropocentrist]

Agape = love for a slug, got it

[@jeffd7976]

The notion of Logos manifesting as The Word in the First Moment is in Egyptian theology by 1500BCE and is hardwired into their language through the use of puns. A major selling point of Christianity because it was a major focus of philosophy and mystery religions of the time was a nullifying of the necessity of fate

[@JohnRiver490]

17:00 Aurelius' spiritual exercise

[@matthewheadland7307]

Things are getting real.

[@daneracamosa]

Great stuff!... The quip about bringing everything into alignment with a scientific worldview seems out of place almost self-conscious... I understand the waters that you swim in almost demand it but at some point we're going to have to come to grips with things that can't be weighed or measured...

[@nickshelbourne4426]

"things that can't be weighed or measured..." - like what?

[@daneracamosa]

@@nickshelbourne4426 John has already mentioned one of them in his previous lectures.... which is the placebo effect.... Scientists have no idea what that is and why it works.... In the Church of materialism the adherents believe and take it on faith that eventually their reductionist scientific mindset will find a mechanism to explain it... But that's just a belief and currently has absolutely no basis in fact... The world is full of the unexplainable which is conveniently glossed over by those that do not wish to see....John knows that at some point he's going to have to address it and it will be fascinating to see how he Bridges the gap... being a scientist himself...

[@nickshelbourne4426]

​@@daneracamosa That's your idea of something which is immeasurable? It's certainly measurable otherwise we would not be discussing it as a phenomenon. Scientists currently do not understand it intimately, but we have a very good idea that it is at minimum operating as a biological/chemical/physical phenomena, just like everything else has been that has ever been investigated. The 'God of the gaps' argument is not an effective one, so I would advise against making it. The very fact that science admits that it does not know things is clearly a counter-argument to describing it as a church. Certain university departments operate like churches, but science itself? Clearly not. If the world is so full of these mysterious phenomena for which we have zero explanation, then please provide one? Science does not pretend to currently have all the answers, but it does not take much imagination to realise that all phenomena have potential scientific explanations.

[@daneracamosa]

@@nickshelbourne4426 LOL I just provided one Nick and you have absolutely no evidence to even try to explain it and it was one that John brought up in his lectures which he couldn't explain either by his own admission... So here you come charging up on a white horse with your vague biological physical blah blah blah chemical phenomena blah blah blah saying absolutely nothing but simply expressing the very sentiment which was the point of my post... For that I thank you... I have absolutely no desire to argue this with you but if you really are scientifically minded then you should be able to step back and admit when you have no evidence for a statement such as the one you just made... if you can't do that then you are not scientifically minded but rather ideologically minded and that's okay too because the world's full of those people as well...

[@nickshelbourne4426]

​@@daneracamosa I see, it makes perfect sense now. You can say whatever want, and anyone who asks for evidence is just ideological. Ironically enough, I have spent time studying the history of ideas and I agree that science is one frame of looking at the world, and there are others. Poetry, art or religion for instance. However, I do not need to contradict science to get there. I like to think of myself as fully a scientist, fully an artist, and fully spiritual without compromising any of them. I believe that science can explain any phenomena scientifically, but that does not mean this captures the whole phenomena, or that other frames might also be able to capture the same phenomena. I think it is clearly foolish to think that science cannot explain phenomena. Cognitive science is even showing that religious experience can be understood scientifically.

[@joshuaweiss1249]

53:18 "I love peanut butter cookies, I love Canada" aren't those basically the same thing?

[@ransetruman2984]

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

[@janurbanek1127]

Oh so its the Meta Model at 31:07 ... I mean there is so many these "Yes I know this one" moments sprinkled throughout the series, you just gotta love it, at least I do

[@ThePeachteats]

20:07 Shat me pants goddammit, what the hell was that noise! I was listening to you in the background and briefly had no idea from where such a demonic sound was issuing Thanks for the vids, profound stuff!