Joker: Folie a Deux - The Sequel Nobody Wanted

[@halotubb1110]

You either die a hero, or live long enough to become a musical.

[@danjonmills]

Bravo

[@eccentriceric88]

Batman beyond even agrees with you

[@mariasol1545]

it sucks too because the idea of tackling the concept of "hey incells took the wrong message from the first movie" would've been interesting to explore... (if It were to be done without mocking people who just enjoyed the first one lol)

[@mikedasilva9752]

😂😂

[@chaseturner]

Lol 😂

[@Grand_Rizzard104]

"The first one was good." - The Todd Phillips filmography

[@c_Durka]

😂😂😂 Accurate

[@DOOMStudios]

To be fair Todd is a One trick pony.

[@rossyboy1980]

Kinda true of the vast majority of sequels, not just a Todd Phillips thing. Bit harsh to solely attribute this general truth to him alone.

[@HasanPikerIsADouche]

​@@rossyboy1980the fall off on his films are drastic

[@Golden_Verses-1883]

Genuinely shocked we never got "Old School 2"

[@WH250398]

The 11 minute applause heard at the Venice film festival was actually the sound of the crowd taking turns slapping Todd Phillips in the face.

[@albertokiosukebonocore9810]

From italy i can assure you: those who clapped like seals at the slaughterhouse were all american tourists (of the wrong kind)

[@Dr.DisrespectFan918]

maybe they were so happy that the crap movie finished after a long 2 hours 😂

[@darthrevan9858]

"What is the sound of one hand clapping?...." SMACK!!!😂😂

[@hlpml]

Circle jerk

[@nnaheim.]

😂😂😂

[@milton7763]

“I used to think that my life was a tragedy, but now I realize, it’s a musical”

[@Cityhunter9580]

😂😅

[@andrewgarfield9898]

Its gotten to the point where I get more excited for the review of a movie rather than the actual movie itself💀💀💀💀

[@eduardvandijk3431]

Like all Star Wars movies and tv series nowadays.

[@JakesFavorites]

Too bad he just absorbs the opinions of other people rather than seeing it himself.

[@Haradas_Shoulder]

then youre fucked

[@DannyKnightblade45]

​@@JakesFavorites Who are you talking about? Clearly The Critical Drinker saw the movie since he's pointing out what happens in the movie and offering his personal opinions on the movie.

[@Vile_90]

​@JakesFavorites he literally says at the end of the video "now that I've seen it" you dunce.

[@buffoonoutdoors]

Heath Ledger Joker: "It's not about the money. It's about sending a message." This movie: "It's about the money."

[@PakoVero]

It's completely the opposite, tbo

[@Ron_Jambo_]

​@@PakoVeroBait so cheap it's infuriating, you have no respect for your craft. Stay offline and think about what you just did.

[@piotr7805]

If this movie was truly made for money, it would try to please the audience who liked the first one, not spit in their faces. "You weren't supposed to like or even empathize with Arthur, so I'm just going to kill him, both metaphorically and literally.." that's the message I got from the director.

[@StressLevel100]

​@@Ron_Jambo_😂

[@FineLineMotionPictures]

I doubt this film will make a lot of money.

[@grandmufftwerkin9037]

Joker II: The Quest for More Money

[@sandboxsub333]

I'll reserve judgment until I see his follow-up documentary on GG Allen

[@Tardenglobe2346]

Not even.

[@emmanuelsneakz]

Thanks Capitalism 👏👏

[@randomvoid4331]

@@Tardenglobe2346exactly, it’s just a 200 million dollar “fuck you” to anyone who enjoyed the first one

[@Vorticy135]

The Quest to Lose More Money

[@ShaneliusPrime250]

I love how the entire internet is uniting in saying this movie is bad

[@bintagmina3755]

and that will ultimately be the reason why I will go to the movies again for the first time in over 5 years

[@imagination43]

@@bintagmina3755 Except they aint, and you are in fact wrong. You're allowed to be wrong ofcourse... but wrong non the less

[@bintagmina3755]

@@imagination43 that makes no sense 😅😂

[@gtmo55mack20]

Literally haven’t seen one person say they like it

[@bintagmina3755]

Update: watched the movie yesterday. The Internet is overdramatic....

[@VygoOG]

you know its bad when Henry Cavill's "f*ck" is in slowmotion

[@tochukwuudu7763]

gave me a good giggle.

[@VygoOG]

@@tochukwuudu7763 slight smile and a nose exhale

[@CindyRink]

One of my favorite cuss scenes that Drinker uses.

[@hellothere9167]

Botted account detected

[@charlesselby3559]

I thaught the same 😂

[@NourArt02]

Joker budget: 55 mil > Huge box office success Joker 2 budget 200 mil > Huge disappointment This is probably the biggest "money can't buy class" in cinema history

[@sentimentalbloke185]

the law of diminishing returns applies

[@HaonProductions]

How the fuck did this cost 200 mil, did Gaga charge 9 figures?

[@thothheartmaat2833]

yall like school on sunday.. no class..

[@andreijohnson3953]

@@HaonProductionsnow that u mention that, probably yeah lol. What a waste. Glad the movie flopped tho. This will teach em a lesson (one hopes)

[@adambastin9488]

You know she did ​@@HaonProductions

[@arcticridge]

I wanted a sequel, I just wanted to see the Joker take over the city

[@jamesthomas4561]

That obviously was not going to happen. You can tell from the first Arthur isn’t the joker we are used to. It wouldn’t make sense for him to take over the city. It is a psychological movie like the first one. People are just so used to normal joker stories that they can’t appreciate this one.

[@_Morri_]

They could still do that with a 3rd one. This time focusing on the inmate who killed Arthur Fleck who is the one obviously becoming the real Joker we know from the Batman universe.

[@hoordeyah]

sad. all he wanted deep down was to be a family man 😔

[@audioadventurer6892]

I don't know mate, MAYBE THE JOKER WHO STABBED ARTHUR IN THE GUTS HALF A DOZEN TIMES AND THEN CARVED THE JOKER'S ICONIC FACIAL WOUNDS INTO HIMSELF WITH THE SAME KNIFE WHILE ARTHUR BLED OUT AT HIS FEET WILL DO IT in the next movie which they should call: "Joker 3 -Did any of you actually watch the second movie or did you just listen to podcasts about it?"

[@Sun-Eater616]

​@@jamesthomas4561Exactly. The discourse and discussion of this film is baffling to me. So many people clearly misread the first one. This was never going to be the story of a Ledger/Nicholson esque joker. And if people honestly thought that would be what we'd get then I dunno what to say. I agree this didn't need a sequel. But I thought it was damn good.

[@Ride-Drive]

I wanted. But I wanted it to be his escape from asylum, do more crazy stuff, go deep into some revenge plot. Not musical.

[@Mereologist]

I would have loved to see Harlequin handled well. Nobody seems able to do it.

[@jackmesrel4933]

Man, imagine a Joker 2 inspired by "Over the Cuckoo's Nest", with Arthur meeting various Arkham inmates, seeing how people are treated in asylums, then meeting Harley as his psychiatrist, then both plan an escape with other inmates.

[@majorpwner241]

@@jackmesrel4933 The psychiatrist turning evil and helping him escape an asylum is straight from the plot of Mystery Men - a spoof on superhero movies, lmao.

[@nonstickpansexual4540]

​@majorpwner241 Which means they stole it from Harlequins' actual origin story.

[@CidGuerreiro1234]

@@Mereologist Because Harley is really popular, so directors/executives keep turning her into a hero in disguise. They don't have the balls to make a real villain out of her.

[@Gandoan]

Original Harley Quinn concept is amazing. A psychiatrist who tries to understand the human mind better. Tries to empathize with patients, seeing them more as victims. Sits in a session with Joker trying to understand his mind and it ends up breaking hers. Her going in with empathy and a desire to understand becomes more of a trap for her.

[@GibDozer1]

Harley is a great character, but the real Harley will never be girl boss enough for modern cinema. Because the real Harley is devoted mind, body, and soul to one Man, err. Clown.

[@darklighter66]

​@@GibDozer1 Well, apart from when she is Lesbian with Ivy.

[@darklighter66]

If you stare long enough into the Abyss the Abyss stares back?

[@sum1337]

@@GibDozer1 devoted mind, body and soul to one *puddin*

[@wontonschannel]

@@darklighter66 harley and ivy always seemed like such a stupid pairing lmfao. def just a crackship that someone somehow managed to get into an official comic

[@DOOMStudios]

Standalone Movies should never become a Franchise.

[@bigkmoviesandgames]

Idk it worked for rocky

[@skyhunter2816]

Worked for John Wick.

[@MiguelNdiweni]

Some work and some don't

[@BurtonShotton]

@@bigkmoviesandgames True, but that's an exception. It's hard to think of many movies made as stand-alones in the last 30 years that turned into successful franchises. Most of the successful franchises that started as a stand-alone film were based on 1980s action flicks like Terminator, Predator, Rambo, Alien, etc. Even in those franchises several of them went off the rails after the first or second sequel.

[@Mereologist]

Far too many creatives start to coast on the sequel, when it should be the reverse: you have to try HARDER (not spend more! That's not even close to the same thing) because you have more limitations. I would have respected Phillips for taking chances, but apparently he couldn't resist derivative revisionism of his previous work. Sad.

[@sleepforever3494]

They had to kill it with a sequel because audiences liked the first one, they can't help themselves.

[@KaneDeath4]

The first one was just as bad as this one. U ppl were just slaves to the hype.

[@icebox1954]

@@KaneDeath4 Bait used to be believable.

[@sicilian_maxing]

@@icebox1954the first one was ass in my opinion

[@icebox1954]

@@sicilian_maxing I respect your right to be wrong.

[@sicilian_maxing]

@@icebox1954 it’s not wrong or right lmao. it’s all opinion

[@THerculez]

I’m just going to carry on like this never existed

[@wbrennan2253]

And most of the rest of the entertainment industry as well.

[@samblack5313]

I’m going to tell my kinds this was Straight Outta Compton, and Gaga was Easy-E.

[@tredaviousbowser7931]

Not as bad as the alien remakes

[@giorgio5789]

Just like star wars episode 9

[@Mom-pl2xb]

It was actually a pretty good movie ngl

[@JessBoxTwitch]

What a total piece of ****. Best line in the whole movie is when the Joker says "I dont want to sing anymore." Thank God!

[@ControlledCha0s]

Kind of makes you wish he had said that to Phillips right off the bat, doesn't it?

[@Kevin-cl2ez]

Who cares ab singing when the writing is ass

[@dex.cabigting]

Hahahaahahahah

[@TheLifeLaVita]

you have adhd. Don't talk about movies?

[@teccosman]

And then a few minutes later he sings a song

[@529pictures]

It definitely felt mean-spirited. They absolutely wanted to punish their own audience for liking the Joker for the wrong reasons

[@miguelbookman]

i see it as part of the woke ... man bad / woman good ... agenda .. thats has plagued movies and tv shows for the last 10 years or so

[@tbirdUCW6ReAJ]

They kept referring to the made-for-TV movie as the original so yeah it felt meta.

[@Shockguey]

Pretty sure we concluded a long time ago Murder isn't justified. Edit: I literally said MURDER & people still tried to disagree WTF

[@BillSikes.]

Where did you copy this hypothesis from? hundreds of commenters are saying exactly the same, I'd like to find the original source

[@Shockguey]

@@BillSikes. Critical Drinker & Nerdrotic.

[@blaster915]

THIS is a proper review. No BS. No woke bashing. Just hitting on the film for its flaws and positives. Thank you 💪🏻

[@bibbicus3942]

Woke is still trash.

[@Eva01-jy2qu7pu9r]

I love the part when the studio said, "Hey everyone! Go see Joker 2: Folie a Doodoo! It physically hates you and destroys everything the original stood for, but give us money anyway!". And then everyone stayed home, let the movie dry up in theaters, and then the studio got mad that nobody watched it. Truly an experience of a lifetime

[@owenbrandon8370]

⚠️EVANGELION FAN SPOTTED⚠️

[@LuisSierra42]

@@owenbrandon8370 Misato best girl

[@charliebrouun6510]

What did the original stand for? Serious question.

[@marquisdelafayette-xe1ht]

@@charliebrouun6510 how society should care for one another, i guess

[@Eva01-jy2qu7pu9r]

@@charliebrouun6510 It was simply just a solid movie that stood on its own two feet. It didn't need a sequel that takes away any significance it could've had

[@kingDowahs]

The perfect example of a movie that did not need a sequel. The Ending told us enough and left room for our imagination to fill in the gaps but making a sequel to it completely undermines this idea.

[@ArCgon]

Maybe this movie is not actually a sequel to the original Joker, but a spiritual sequel to whatever was the full title of Matrix 4

[@mariasol1545]

it sucks too because the idea of tackling the concept of "hey incells took the wrong message from the first movie" would've been interesting to explore... instead we got a musical

[@nicky2coats]

It didn’t need the first either.

[@KilliK69]

WB wanted a franchise out of it. not just a cash grab.

[@emirlsanchos6302]

@@mariasol1545 No, no, enough with the pretentious "You got the wrong message" 2 hour shaming sessions please. I've had my fair share these past few years.

[@cinebread]

Man, imagine if the story was about the full-on Joker (not Arthur Fleck) seeing how far he could take his fame and power in a fight against the system. Rather than backtracking, go full Bonnie and Clyde with Harley, complete with musical numbers as a city burns in the background. Truly, the greatest disappointment is all the lost potential.

[@alexinfinite7142]

That's what I thought we were gonna get 😢

[@moskva-kassiopeya]

That's what we all expected from the beginning I guess. It could be like The God Father and The God Father 2 with the character development of Michael Corleone. What a waste…

[@АлександрШарендо-т3б]

True. I had hope when he was talking with Puddles in court but then my hope faded when they showed how he was weak and she was strong. Pathetic

[@utmastuh]

Honestly nothing beats the dark knight joker. Going all in on the madness and destruction was truly compelling and entertaining compared to humanizing everything

[@alexinfinite7142]

@utmastuh Ledger left behind massive shoes to fill. In a way I'm glad they have moved away from trying to emulate him. It's so universally loved in the Fandom it borders on sacred

[@Linklex7]

A clear difference of having Scorcesse help produce the first film vs him not producing the 2nd film.

[@WeThreeProductions]

It's a real shame since the first film really stood out.

[@krissteel4074]

For sure, there was some 'good bones' in what they built on that film. I was tentatively thinking the two leads could probably carry some fairly intense and daring cinema to really rattle people... then woke up and its still 2024 and they don't do that kind of thing.

[@Morbian13]

Really stood out, how? It didn't follow any continuity or origins of the Joker. The whole movie was a delusion.

[@the_seer_0421]

​@@Morbian13lot of comic books characters have multiple origin stories, this really isn't all that big of a deal. Besides, I think they did a good job at it so I don't see a problem.

[@Morbutt]

​@@Morbian13who fucking cares about being true to the source material at any rate? It was a great film anyways.

[@Visqq_]

​@Morbian13 It being it's own thing is a much better breath of fresh air regardless, just because it wasn't an origin for any version of joker doesn't make it a bad film lol.

[@Koryos9]

You could literally hear the frustration in the audience's reaction in the showing I went to.

[@kurtpunchesthings2411]

there was 3 girls like 2 seats across from me and they were occasionally laughing quietly at how ridiculous this was the whole cinema just instantly left after the movie finished didn't even bother to wait to see if there was any after credits scenes

[@Bvggerffpls]

I saw it today, and witnessed some of the closing reactions which ranged from apathetic to negative. The two lads in front of me both agreed that the original was better, the elderly man next to me said to his wife, 'well that was disappointing'. I concur.

[@matthewred8622]

People left, in the cinema that I was in.

[@gemto4378]

Same with me actual people were complaining about the songs and others left the cinema.

[@donperegrine922]

Sorry, I think that was me. I was groaning "Oh my god, another red smear! I wonder if that's a reference to clowns! Wow! Oh good! That song from CATS, to help explain how suicidal Arthur is feeling! Perfect!"

[@RyanFloom]

They almost did a “Joker in Space” sequel so shockingly a Joker musical was the superior idea

[@kaasmeester5903]

Joker vs Predator?

[@iy8-z1o]

I heard they were gonna make it an anime with dinosaurs with a dragon ball z crossover

[@alexandermccabe556]

that might have been better

[@issahumps]

I want joker in space now 😔

[@cleveryoutubename4445]

@@iy8-z1oAs long as Team Four Star gets to dub the DBZ characters.

[@Flintmayo]

*Joker 2* Expectation:- Dominating Joker Reality:- Singing Clown

[@UncleBashface1]

Getting a big fat “fuck you” from the director because we liked the first movie and, dare I say, *empathized with Arthur* is just proof as to how tone-deaf Hollywood is.

[@jesterssketchbook]

it feels like the movie hates you and wants you to have a depressive episode, while also being extremely boring - what a combo! lololol

[@TheStrengthScholar]

How dare you empathize with a broken man who was cast out and failed by society? Don't you know he's privileged and a beneficiary of the patriarchy?

[@MalkavSaiyaYautja]

They aren't tone-deaf, they hate us and they are evil. Nothing complicated about it.

[@seanbell69]

A wonderful moment for self-reflection wasted. The fact that you empathized with Arthur and wanted to see more of the same speaks to how tone deaf *you* are.

[@truthcantbesilenced4533]

They didnt like how he killed a rich person in that way on tv. Theres no way you was getting it again.

[@Sierra-Whiskey22]

Joker 2: A Star Isn't Born.

[@21palica]

Joker 2: Fully A Dud

[@BarryMikokinju]

Joker 2: Theatric Boogaloo

[@kevingray4980]

A Star is Worn

[@adam1984pl]

Joker 2 :Revenge of Bruce Wayne

[@Vladi48mir]

a star is porn

[@Lord_Deimos]

Joker 2: Complete Character Assassination

[@TheSergio1021]

"Complete Character Assassination" is actually a banger subtitle that should be used on a more impressive movie

[@PotatoBandana]

Joker 2: Not Joaquin Around

[@notsojharedtroll23]

​@@PotatoBandana 🤣🤣🤣😭😭😭

[@krystofthepolishguytalksan310]

Honestly, first movie was this. Making Thomas Wayne a “rich greedy businessman” and Joker a “misunderstood mentally ill man”. If those arent character assassinations, I don’t know what is.

[@KenseiRaptor]

The plot is literally that Arthur Fleck IS NOT the Joker. Did you watch the movie?

[@jmace2424]

0:42 Sorry Drinker, Arthur Fleck in the first one was not pushed into madness and despair by society. He was always there. It’s what annoys me about the first one. Arthur didn’t have a fall, he started at rock bottom and stayed there until the very end.

[@l33fox]

Fun fact: Harley wasn’t introduced into the comics until her introduction in Batman: The animated series where her popularity skyrocketed. She was a psychiatrist working at Arkham Asylum who was manipulated by The Joker into falling in love with him and when I say I love I mean totally obsessed with him! Joker basically treated her like absolute shite and their relationship was one sided, toxic and abusive for pretty much all of it.

[@MrGamman3yt]

Actually, if you are 'down with the patriarchy', that would have made a compelling story. Whate man holds his brilliant understudy down, so much so, that she falls/ gets easily manipulated by J, as he witnesses her getting chastiszed by mean boss. He comforts her (as he too is wrecked), she falls for him, then he manipulates her to get out, like Hanibal. THEN she girl bosses her way to get both back. That would kinda work.

[@tymonsulimastalman1727]

Because she was supposed to be a character for one episode in the series, like many other sidekicks. But the creators and fans liked her so much that she became a recurring character.

[@f1jones544]

DC writers have been trying to issue apologies for the original Harley for 30 years when no one asked for it.

[@JoakimOtamaa]

I hate sidekicks and hmHarley is just damn obnoxious. If Joker really has to have a sidekick, let it be Bob ffs. He's the number.... one... guy.

[@tbird-z1r]

Everyone who was a boy at the time knows why Harley Quinn was so well liked in the animated series.

[@ShepardOfficial]

This reminds me of that joke in Spaceballs. "Well see each other again when we all come together for Spaceballs 2: The Search For More Money" 😂😂😂

[@bayly1977]

But spaceballs was smart enough to not actually do it

[@DMGSL]

@@bayly1977 You sure about that, bud?

[@bayly1977]

@@DMGSL holly shit, in the works for 2025 😂😂 amazing

[@Sonny_McMacsson]

@@bayly1977 Oh, no

[@remaincalm2]

From Movieweb: "Spaceballs 2 Director Reveals Sequel Will Poke Fun at This Now-Divisive Sci-Fi Franchise". Should be worth the wait.

[@GlennJimenez]

I still cannot believe there is a scene in this movie where Joker tells Harley “Please stop singing” At my theater I heard someone say “that’s what I’m saying” 💀

[@braviafeed]

I had the same reaction.🤣

[@ssa6227]

Joker s joke😂

[@janisjackson7322]

😂😂😂

[@powerjolt7215]

😂😂😂

[@James-c1b7s]

Same here. I didn't pay to see a f^cking musical...

[@theucheao]

I remember reading somewhere that there was never supposed to be a second one. I was told that The Joker was a one and done and that Phoenix wouldn’t do a second one. This industry never listens. Let it fall apart if it wants to..

[@timslick7390]

That ending really makes it clear to me that this was never the joker movie, just a character study with one of the most popular villain IPs slapped on it 😂.

[@Mereologist]

Phillips did say that was what he was going to do. Still... I think it could have been possible to do BOTH, and he wimped out. I'm reminded of the famous Picasso quote, "Good artists borrow but great ones steal." He could have DEFINED the Joker in a way few people really manage to do. But Phillips is no great artist.

[@SeasideDetective2]

This is probably an obscene thing to say about one of the wealthiest actors in history, but Jack Nicholson got screwed. If "popcorn epics" and cinematic mythologies had been a phenomenon in the late 1980s, he would have gotten a film precisely like this one. We'd have an origin story for the "real" Joker, not (sorry Joaquin) a Cesar Romero knockoff. Tim Burton would have won an Oscar, and his career wouldn't have taken a long downward slide.

[@CidGuerreiro1234]

Agree 100%. It was only a "Joker" movie to garner attention. Most people who watched it wouldn't have cared about the exact same movie with a different name on it.

[@MrGamman3yt]

Ya, like Taxi Joker.

[@TheHiddenHistoryChannel]

That’s the meta element. He says “there never was a Joker” in the film.

[@hesdeadjim66]

As soon as I saw that Lady Gaga was going to be in Joker 2 I had that gnawing feeling it was going to go badly. When I saw they weren't sticking to her original story being Joker's psychiatrist and making her a patient instead, I knew it was over. Why can't we have nice things?

[@robertdog]

Stop complaining, goy!

[@ScrambledAndBenedict]

My headcanon is that this sequel is actually an in-universe fanfiction made by a teenage version of the guy who would eventually make Batman The Musical (kzbin.info/www/bejne/eXXXd52dbcSDjck) from that one episode of Batman Beyond, and not even God Himself could convince me otherwise even if He came down from heaven and aimed a shotgun at my face.

[@Mr.Heller]

Why though? She's known as a genuinely good actress since forever.

[@Jayskiallthewayski]

Hmmm, she really surprised me in a Star is born, she could do it and do it well I think but she didn't write the thing.

[@MisterNobody608]

To be fair, she's a pretty good actress. I loved her in the American Horror Story. And it's certainly not her fault that the movie sucks.

[@Jonathan_Collins]

Harley should have been a therapist like the original... having the Joker turn around a stable PhD smart lonely insecure girl makes him more menacing and "close to home" instead them just being two broken people inspired by each other...

[@MrGamman3yt]

Like Hanibal? Nah, that show 'sucked'.

[@seanalmond7507]

It's because in this version she is empowered and manipulating him instead of the other way around. It's the Joker for hyper feminists who hate men

[@f1jones544]

She's a strong, empowered sociopath. Sounds like most of my SO's. Coincidentally, the last one could sing fantastically and perfectly mimicked "Oh, Mr. J." I should have known.

[@LN-Lifer]

No damn way today's Hollywood allows that

[@CyanRooper]

Problem is that Arthur Fleck is just nowhere near as smart as most incarnations of the Joker. This is the same guy that carried a loaded gun into a children's hospital and accidentally dropped it in the first movie.

[@GeraltofRivia5150]

The Arnie cameo was unexpected. Thank you drinker.

[@alexkogan9755]

At this point I’m convinced that the involvement of Harley Quinn in anything these past 5 years has made them doomed to failure.

[@somechinesedude5466]

No women allowed

[@insertnamehere5809]

Which is annoying because Harley Quinn (in the original Batman animated series) was a good character

[@misterpinkandyellow74]

@@alexkogan9755 Harley Quinn overrated character

[@Filterdeez]

​@@insertnamehere5809she is a psycho with stockholm syndrome, how is that a good character?

[@Filterdeez]

​@@somechinesedude5466classic projection. The character is objectively bad, yet hollyweird has been pushing her as a role model for younger, impressionable women. Her character is actually detrimental to women and the portrayal of women. But keep virtue signaling some kind of notion that women are oppressed in 2024.

[@p.2592]

Joker: Fellate a Dude The sequel that only exists to abuse the people who liked the first movie.

[@vfvs11a]

Exactly. People identified with the Joker (not the murder parts) and the hollywood elites were infuriated by that. Which is ironic because they viewed him as a loser and they also view anyone who disagrees with them a loser.

[@NoOneGetzOutAlive]

10000000000000%

[@7DAYSOFOPENINGNIGHTS]

I'd argue Star Wars: The Last Jedi was another.

[@CastorRabbit]

Complaining about "the message" has quickly become the new message. I'm glad Todd shat in all of your cereal 🤣Find your movie with too many Andrew Tate incel fans? Follow it up with a Lady gaga musical 🤣Gold!

[@IronicalChronical]

Media Indus Cmplx got their pantsu in a twist so they pressured Warner to deconstruct.

[@ElCaballoTV]

This was Todd Philip's "humiliation ritual"

[@Tardenglobe2346]

The first one was too.

[@majorpwner241]

@@Tardenglobe2346 Nah, even my boomer parents thought the first one was great. It's not just some cringe incel thing or something. It was a good movie with a point. The sequel is not.

[@Tardenglobe2346]

@@majorpwner241 Yeah, they didn't get it either.

[@motherflange]

The 'little hats' are exempt from the ritual.

[@misterpinkandyellow74]

Incel spotted ​@@majorpwner241

[@theodoreavdikos9804]

Joker 1 in a sentence: I'M TIRED OF BEING YOUR SCAPEGOAT AND PUNCHING BAG. Joker 2 in a sentence: Well at least I didn't die a virgin...

[@jayblueheart3203]

If I want to experience people with major depression, anger problems and various personality disorders, I don't need to see it in a movie. I can just go to work.

[@Nokaret]

Well at least you still need to leave the house for that

[@trawlins396]

I would laugh but I completely understand your pain.

[@mikeoxlong1395]

Hey, i don't even have to go to work for that... going to work doesn't help.

[@GregOrtiz]

Realest comment on here lol

[@John.AR.Activism]

Humans are total bell ends.

[@stevequincy388]

People in Hollywood are nutjobs, they literally had a successful, profitable movie in the Joker. So what did they do? Made the sequel a musical just to piss off the people who liked the first movie. These people are insane, it's as if entertainment and profits are no longer a focus to them. Just ego and narcissism.

[@dekooks1543]

cinema was never about entertainment it was always propaganda. It's just that hollywood has turned on you now (whites)

[@CMP-st5wh]

The original shone too much light on the kind of people Hollywood and it's worshippers hate. Downtrodden White men.

[@jytj3731]

Same thing happening to western gaming industry, all of them are falling apart to push an agenda, they know what they're doing and their ignorance will be their downfall

[@CinHalCedHerChance]

You really haven't gone down any rabbit holes since 2020 have you? Time to wake up and look around at the world around you and what is going on, deconstruct things, notice patterns (that's the big one), what are they doing to this world?

[@brianaguilar8283]

Why do you assume that the sequel being a musical was done out of spite?

[@johnniewalker7499]

I can’t believe what they’ve done with Gypsy crusader

[@andrewg4723]

Tragic

[@30noir]

I can't believe what you done with English.

[@ChadKakashi]

He was awesome. That clip of him finding a kindred soul on Omegle and both instantly recognizing each other and doing nazi salutes lives rent free on my mind.

[@ScottishRoyal1]

​@@30noirlikewise

[@JohnDoe14783]

Whats he been up to? He was so based, bros

[@lovefromwonderland]

This movie actually made me start to dislike Harley Quinn as a character. DC is constantly throwing her in everything for money and stretching her character thin and I'm sick of it

[@rifroll1117]

Man took the words right out of my mouth. This kind of mean spirited humiliation of a complex character oddly reminds me of what they did to Joel in The Last of Us. Can’t wait till the show-only fans get to that part in Season 2

[@snuffcarl]

As a show only fan, what did they do in s 1 to him?

[@bizill1984]

It happens in the second game. You might not want it spoiled ​@@snuffcarl

[@StigsGingerCousin]

I was thinking the same thing. That story was told in a compelling way and those characters should not have been touched after the first game. Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley said in interviews that a sequel would feature new characters, but when Straley left Neil picked up those characters and told a ham-fisted revenge story that broke apart the fan base.

[@RanMouri82]

​@@StigsGingerCousin With a side of "bigot sandwich".

[@filho4437]

​@@snuffcarlThey retroactively make him an incompetent wannabe alpha.

[@AkamoriArt]

Why would you take the most interesting dynamic of Harley Quinn (the fact that she was a highly educated psychologist that fell in love with the Joker while attempting to rehabilitate him) and just completely remove it? What reason is there other than complete laziness?

[@hatchhermit77]

Because it would reveal a truth about women that isn't allowed right now.

[@surobyk]

It did reveal the truth

[@PreeSpunky]

Harley Quinn is the postergirl for the Girl Boss fantasy now, chud. Also what hatchhermit77 said

[@BLUESMOKE93]

@@surobykur missing chromosomes buddy

[@bdkj3e]

​@@hatchhermit77damn, seeing how women have reacted to Wade Wilson makes that so true, just not allowed to talk about it.

[@Dan-ni4uc]

Didn’t know that I didn’t need a sequel but I FOR SURE knew I didn’t need a musical.

[@allie936]

Too bad? Lol

[@jimmyboy7817]

It's not even a good musical. No exciting dance numbers or choreography. Just Joker and Lee Quninzel singing songs on stage in Arthur Fleck's mind. Musical fans wouldn't like it either.

[@CannibalOX99]

​@allie936 Yes unfortunately, it's too damn bad.

[@cph5811]

Nailed it

[@allie936]

@@CannibalOX99 Gaga can do no wrong… I’m only watching it for her anyway

[@MichaelMedici61W2]

Somehow someways this man’s brilliance has alluded me until now. All this time I had no idea that he was among the greats. I think he should be an official spokesperson for the fandom universe of basically everything… especially Star Wars. Thanks Drinker… for saying everything that we feel.

[@wukanimation]

I think I’ll just never see it and pretend Joker is a stand-alone film 😅

[@jamesthomas4561]

Why didn’t you like it?

[@wetcarpet7537]

@@jamesthomas4561Come on use your brain for once

[@damiang888]

But it was a standalone film, tf are you talking about with "pretend" ?

[@ryantrudell4686]

The overriding 'tension' happening throughout the first Joker was that the audience knew they were getting an answer to the question "So how does this man become 'The Joker'?", and so we were enthralled from start to finish to see the origin happening before our eyes. I believe it's fair to say that the question most viewers thought they were getting an answer to in Joker 2 was "So how does an imprisoned Joker become the 'Clown Prince of Crime' mastermind?". Little did most audience members know that the producers never had any intent in answering that question. And that's ultimately the tragecy of Joker 2.

[@JurassicTrance]

The question was answered... He isn't the joker. The other inmate at the end is. I actually felt, aside from the singing (which allowed me to get more popcorn without missing anything) and Gaga’s lackluster performance that the overall story was good. It’s a self contained story about Arthur Fleck who is not the joker, but ultimately helped inspire the Joker’s persona.

[@Fernybun]

@@JurassicTrance oh right right that other inmate, yeah... WHO THE FUCK CARES ABOUT HIM!? HE'S THERE FOR A FEW MINUTES WTF?!?! WHY NOT MAKE THE FUCKING MOVIE ABOUT THE JOKER ABOUT THE *JOKER IN THE FIRST PLACE* what a waste of time and money.

[@woiowoiow190]

Part 3 maybe?

[@JurassicTrance]

@@woiowoiow190 no it’s done

[@123hattan]

@@JurassicTrance Nope, as the last musical said, the "son" will continue.

[@Jonathan_Collins]

I’m convinced Todd Phillips made this film to ensure the franchise dies and he isn’t asked to continue this saga.

[@ezzahhh]

Nice word for word copy-pasted comment from Jeremy Jahn's review you got there 🤡

[@JustGaming117]

Gremlins 2 syndrome

[@seanalmond7507]

​@@ezzahhh everybody thought this before whoever the fuck that silly goofus is said it

[@justinmadrid8712]

What a silly thing to assume. That’s a huge cope. He wanted to ruin the first one because his superiors ordered him to. He had to play ball to stay in the club.

[@ClarenceJBoddicker1987]

He was contractually obligated to make a sequel?

[@MaxPower-zw7go]

When you have one of the worst women in music today your gonna have a movie like this

[@olleselin]

Yeah, the previous one was like way too perfect to be followed by a sequel

[@thenoobassassin]

I get that and I am by no means defending this sequel but done right.. it could’ve worked if they developed but it was sadly just a cash grab

[@flackjacket3dits]

The king of comedy ripoff was never good

[@daddynanners3944]

Perfect? Debatable. The first one was good, but it wasn’t some groundbreaking original story.

[@bondalemecovillage6738]

​@@daddynanners3944a lot more was endearing in the 1st movie than just the story... It was an acclaimed masterpiece because people felt like the many components came together & worked

[@PeakDennisReynolds]

A good sequel could been of made it just shouldn't of been a musical. Way too jarring when comparing that kind of tone to the tone of the first movie. It was basically Taxi Driver with the most famous comic book villain of all time as Travis Bickle.

[@truewilliams7118]

There’s rumors circulating that this movie was “ordered” to diminish the legacy and cult following of the first one. I believe it.

[@XandateOfHeaven]

That's sad and delusional. Hollywood wants you to tie your identity to movies, so you feel you have a personal stake in their product. You don't. You aren't subverting Hollywood by liking their movies.

[@marismm6405]

@@XandateOfHeaven oh the innocence..

[@TheMASTER4real]

It didn’t work I still like first one I just like Hollywood even less now.🤷🏽‍♂️😂

[@XandateOfHeaven]

@@marismm6405 No, you're just delusional. You think watching movies makes you subversive, and Hollywood doesn't want you to like particular movies, but you are so naive you don't even see this is all about money. You want a shitty sequel to a cape-shit movie to be a grand conspiracy, because the reality is so much sadder. You tied your identity to a Hollywood movie, gave them money, and they made a half assed sequel. You must be very young or very forgetful to think shitty sequel are meant to be a personal attack against you, and not what they are, a lazy cash grab.

[@fizzyjecado]

yeah and they made a lot of money… they just don’t care, Hollywood is all about the 💰

[@SerSerington]

Thankfully I found out this was a musical before paying for a ticket: thanks internet👍 Fuck Hollywood

[@CrowsDoMath]

Same.

[@paulpetersen6539]

And musicals could be good; if they didn't have to first jump through The Ring Toss Of Pure Evil & get re-written 'n re-cast.. With-BY-&'For literal RINGWORMS.

[@SerSerington]

@@paulpetersen6539 hey, I enjoyed The Greatest Showman & I hate musicals! At the end of the day, this movie had no place being made. And to your point: absolutely agree. All of Hollywood are absolute scum. They hate us just like the media, politicians, music industry, & other veritable celebrities. It’s all psyop’s & propaganda.

[@robertdog]

Whoa! Cool it with the anti-semitism!

[@robothug6688]

Nope trash. ​@@paulpetersen6539

[@dustyhills8911]

Once again, you NAILED IT! I loved everything about the production and performances. The story concept and main character arcs were frustrating to watch and sometimes downright vomit inducing.

[@Agooo13431]

Maybe it's a "how dare you like the original movie, deplorable?" slap in the face to the audience

[@Rex.Actually.411]

Absolutely, sorta like Joaquin Phoenix lecturing us about how we treat dairy cows while accepting his Oscar

[@davidortega3968]

omg like that would be so meta and 2deep4u. fk off

[@RanMouri82]

That's exactly what it was.

[@mariasol1545]

I mean the idea of tackling the concept of "hey incells took the wrong message from the first movie" would've been interesting to explore... if it was done in a way it didnt mock the audience

[@filho4437]

​@@mariasol1545Phillips doesn't have the intellectual capacity to flesh ideas like that out. Joker 1 was a fluke. The character wasn't meant to be identified with, and Phillips used the sequel as an opportunity to undue what he viewed to be as the mistakes in what was considered by most to be his Opus.

[@Ami-vh7sr]

They reallly just rewrote Harley Quinn's backstory? The whole point of Harley Quinn was to see the effect Joker had on people, in that he took a brilliant young Psychologist and turned her into such a violent young psychopath.....

[@jonhall3151]

Na this trash don't count.

[@lorenzo_smit]

They changed Jokers origin in the first movie as well. Yet no one complaint about that

[@madpuppet666]

that wasn't the problem with this movie. the story was great if they had focused on it and expanded it and changed th ending. The musical bits didn't work and destroyed every scene they were in. Whats most annoying is that this had the core of a really good sequel but they destroyed it making it a musical.

[@sgtGiggsy]

To be fair, Harley's backstory is one of the most rewritten things in comic history. First she didn't have any, then she was a young naive graduate who got seduced by Joker, then she was a cutthroat bitch who cheated and fucked herself through every obstacle in her life, then she was the same cutthroat bitch as the previous version, but literally wanted to get herself assigned to Joker and helped him breaking free several times, then she was a normal girl once again who just turned rotten by Joker.

[@xiii0722]

I mean, sorry this is more like an alternate universe. Joker's backstory and personality is also very different btw. So, no, they didn't. I doubt batman even exists here or other characters. But yeah, clearly not thought-through as much as the first movie and falls flat.

[@rotem..]

I wish I could forget ever watching this movie. When it ended I wanted to boo it so hard and see if anyone joins, I could feel the entire cinema fuming with anger just like I did. What an absolute disappointment.

[@injetavel279]

Idk why but this movie made me feel bad, just the fact that the joker is bullied the WHOLE movie and in the end nothing happens to the people who hurt him makes this soooo bad

[@injetavel279]

I literally booed the movie when it ended, it ruined the first movie for me

[@Vespyr_]

Next time just do it. What are they going to do, throw you out? Might have been cathartic for others to hear it.

[@rotem..]

@@Vespyr_ Haha that's what I thought too! felt like many of us needed to let it out when it ended but I'm an expat in the Netherlands and it's my first time at the cinema here 😅 I also wanted to yell "oh just shut up" when they started singing at some point. I feel like this movie have a good potential of becoming "the room" or rocky horror where people shout and throw stuff at the screen. It might save the movie actually haha

[@platty9237]

I saw an article that said many people are walking out of the theater halfway through the film.

[@Cuteness_overload-g3g]

They took the movie audiences loved and Hollywood hated and made the movies sequel audiences hated and Hollywood loved

[@Butterwinkle]

>Gets raped. >Stops being the Joker. What did he mean by this?

[@studentNEET319]

Dick so good he became sane

[@kiq4767]

it means freakbob deserves his call's answered

[@Jp-do9ny]

Funnily enough, I thought this movie sent the message, that critics claimed the first one sent. Takes accountability and shows remorse, only for his gf to leave him, guards face no consequences, and dies a lonely brutal death. Seems like you're better off being guilty Joker, than innocent Arthur

[@Lemuria1993]

That when women gets too crazy they need to be dicked down? Dunno man, getting mixed messages by this movie

[@zarekbeck3358]

funny early life director

[@repapeti98]

Whenever I see new movie trailers or posters, I get excited. I look at the cast, the story beats, the general tone and can't help but smile. I go home and wait patiently. And after what feels like an eternity, just like it always does, it finally happens. The movie flops and we get a Drinker review and a Pitch Meeting.

[@thelemurofmadagascar9183]

I genuinely don't understand why most people haven't learnt their lesson yet and automatically assume the lastest upcoming movie will be bad.

[@mad_elf]

​@@thelemurofmadagascar9183 because the majority of modern entertainment is garbage rehashes or poorly executed sequels. The well is dry and someone saying they found water seems unlikely.

[@thelemurofmadagascar9183]

@@mad_elf Yeah that's my point. It's so unlikely that an upcoming movie will be good in this day and age that I don't know why people still get their hopes up.

[@chucksenhowzen9740]

I was excited for Joker 2 at first…until I remembered Todd Phillips also made Hangover 2 🤦🏼‍♂️

[@IronMan-tk8uc]

Hangover 2 is actually my favorite though. ''Stu is chok''.

[@brokenwave6125]

I like Hangover 3 quite a lot, but Hangover 2 is one of the worst sequels ever. Totally did not need to be made and added absolutely nothing of value

[@carlosnn8150]

I liked Hangover 2 more than Hangover 3 (which I barely remember, did I even watch it actually?), they're both funny, but both pale compared to the original.

[@IronMan-tk8uc]

@@brokenwave6125 I have to disagree, even though it's nowhere on the level of original, Stu did divorced Melissa and found a gorgeous Thai woman. The 3rd one that I find it completely useless!

[@PeakDennisReynolds]

I've never understood why people hate 2 and 3. Yes they are basically just the first one copied and pasted but there is still hilarious moments in both of them. Stu finding out he slept with a lady-boy is a possibly the funniest moment of the entire trilogy for me.

[@TheBlatchi]

I don't understand how anybody thinks Lady Gaga has any talent at all

[@TheScarletSlayer]

CORRECTION: A sequel everybody demanded not to exist

[@LycanVisuals]

Canceled my ticket to this and instead watched The Wild Robot lol

[@matacurrei5665]

And totally worth it, isn't? That movie es amazing!

[@rogoznicafc9672]

is it good as the numbers say?

[@LycanVisuals]

@matacurrei5665 Yeah DreamWorks have done it again.

[@zillauniverse7208]

Drinker should really watch both The Wild Robot and Transformers One when they hit his country, two really great animated films that deserves his attention!

[@balkanboi06]

👌 saw it on Tuesday beautiful animation and heartwarming story

[@silverblade357]

Character regression is right. The first movie left Arthur with no reason to regret his actions or have empathy for his victims. He embraced the same madness that he had been witnessing. The madness that stopped his aid, but still expected him to function. The madness that allowed his insane mother to raise him on lies and delision. The madness that treated punch-happy bullies like victims. What reason did Arthur have to go back on the revelation that, from his perspective, saved him?

[@liqurmeup]

I would say its probably doubt. All that new personality takes time to take hold and evolve. Nobody is 100% committed to a new social pr cognitive development. It takes time to sink, often causing a person to revert back to the past. It may only last for a short stint, and not all aspects of their prior personality need revisiting. Think about a time you socaly changed. You met a new friend and passively adopt parts of their manurisums. The longer you maintain social interaction with that person the more it sets in. The Joker character part of his personality needs time to fully adapt and evolve. I believe that is what The Drinker was addressing in the film.

[@hoordeyah]

because in reality, nobody truly wants to be a psychopathic killer. Arthur's conflict in the 2nd movie, his refusal to fully embrace the joker is waaaaaaaay more interesting than what most people expected. it makes you sympathize with him way more, and makes you appreciate the meta the movie was going for.

[@jotairpontes]

I'm happy that Joker, just like Pacific Rim and Sicario, doesn't have a sequel. Thank Hollywood for not being greedy!

[@MsClaudiaDuran]

There's scene where Gaga is singing acapella, and Phoenix is touching her face confused whispering "Stop singing. Just talk to me". THAT scene summed up the entire movie.

[@Lethal_Spoon]

me during the 6 (or more) musicals i endured

[@miskatonic6210]

Sad but true.

[@destroyermaker]

Me with my ex who communicated mostly in memes

[@Lethal_Spoon]

@@destroyermaker ex kinda dope ngl

[@Wallenberg125]

Turning Joker into a musical is like making Alien versus Predator: the Musical

[@bc-cu4on]

I'd watch that, if properly done.

[@LameGeneralissimo]

AvP: the Musical sounds way more fun than the actual AvP movie we got.

[@NoxideActive]

Didn't you see Alien verse the Princess Diaries 2?

[@anubusx]

Damn that sounds like a good time.

[@PatrickOMulligan]

Would be better then the films we got.

[@Greenhead24]

You are too kind. This movie is horrible,every minute,every actor,every scene,every song. I think watching so many bad movies has lowered your expectations. A 1/10 is now a 5/10. And the only reason i say its a 1/10 is because its movie

[@mdiggler]

This is pure hyperbole. It is not a 1/10 film. There are good things about it even though it doesn't work as a whole.

[@taetrrtot6205]

Haven't seen it but I can definitely agree that's been happening including to critical drinker

[@KomeFits]

Thus is a childish perspective. It's a 3/10 and the music was good. Still trash though.

[@Greenhead24]

@@KomeFits its a good thing we have people like you giving such a mature perspective

[@selamandreykum5844]

Same reason why most people nowadays get "blown away" by products that are objectively 6/10, ig. If it's not total 100% garbage it's a "masterpiece" to them

[@mikebasil4832]

Sequels, prequels and interquels have become something of an addiction for several of our favourite franchises.

[@JoshBlueMoon5]

I hope they make a third movie but its only 5 seconds long, we see Arthurt waking up from the nightmare that this movie was.

[@CharaGonzalez-lt7yw]

Didn't expect to see you here lmao

[@Murderpaws]

The hardest thing we as a species have yet to admit is that sometimes things go well by accident, even when shown time after time with sequels.

[@getthegoons]

I've been saying this about Avatar the Last Airbender for years.

[@DeadpoolX9]

The smartest thing you can do as an artist is know when divine inspiration has left you or as my dad said about John Lennon “He knew when to stop writing”

[@lilsneed4334]

I mean, when your entire movie is wholesale ripping off King of Comedy and Taxi Driver, it's kinda hard to fuck up. Seems like Joker 2 is what happens when they actually had to be original. Not slagging on the first Joker either. If you're gonna steal ideas, steal from good movies.

[@User98938]

Todd Phillips was unnecessarily Starstruck with Gaga. Gaga thought she could hijack this movie to obtain an Oscar. Both Failed miserably and derailed the whole movie.

[@tapiolautavaara9532]

It's the Lady Gaga's: some Star has Extinguished. Nothing, nothing at all to see here people, move along...

[@RanMouri82]

"Starstruck, baby 'cause you blow my heart up" 😅

[@RKroese]

Insight into the ego of the crazy.

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

Im certain they wanted Oscars for music and stuff so they cast her

[@thomhagan8297]

Don't underestimate the workings of Hollyweird...wait till Oscar season before stating that. Not that Oscars really matter much any more outside of the left side. Just an observation.

[@poorsoul8492]

Lots of people have left out the rape scene because it’s so unhinged, if it wasn’t for Possum Reviews I wouldn’t have known about it

[@BloopsMcGoo]

YT also demonetizes people for even mentioning rape.

[@NeonApathy]

I was crying as I left the theater for Joker, cause I work in social work, and it’s sad when people’s potential gets limited due to mental health or cognitive issues. I felt saddened watching him get attacked over a disorder he couldn’t control, him being sheltered and deceived by his mother for years. There were times they hit you on the nose with the message like Arthur scribbling about mental health in his notebook or yelling about it on live tv. I’m definitely not the audience the director is upset with. If anything, he was scared of having another Aurora shooter situation…which honestly happens no matter what. There will always be someone who is jaded and will want to violently lashout at the world, like the Trench Coat Mafia…that took place yearssss before the Aurora Shooting. Reading about the violence that occurs to Arthur in the sequel seems unrealistic… or maybe I’m wrong. Maybe even the inmates felt strongly about the murder of a beloved tv host. I can’t picture anyone attacking someone for murdering say a Jay Leno or David Letterman…but if it got out a person tortured and sext assaulted children, yes - they killed that person quick.

[@ancientredwoods8502]

Stop letting the TV screen brainwash your mind.

[@jennifermoriarty2188]

you missed the point of the end ....he wasn't killed over Murray and the guards were in on it as they helped. and that was the joker who killed Arthur... didn't u see him get his scars... people kill famous people all the time for the glory.. Jeffery darmer for one...

[@jmeiskues]

" If anything, he was scared of having another Aurora shooter situation…" well, if you knew anything about that situation or james holmes (the shooter), you would know that he wasnt in any way inspired by the joker or anything related to comic book villains. you can find this out for yourself by watching the interviews he did with the courts psychologist which are public record and here on youtube.

[@suncrestt4839]

I can relate with you. Most of the time, it felt as if I was just watching a documentary rather than a movie about a fictitious person and city. I wanted to give Arthur a hug so badly. It breaks my heart knowing that there’s countless people in his situation today.

[@samwallaceart288]

The violence in Joker 2 is mostly from the guards after he calls them brutes on an interview. Then in the end, after Arthur disavows Joker and takes full responsibility for what he had done, feeling bad about how he had ruined the little man Gary's life when he didn't mean to, Joker fans take the rejection harshly. One of them, a younger inmate who'd been enamored with him the whole movie, shanks him in the last scene, and then carves a smile onto their own face, cackling way more Joker-like than Arthur ever did. And _that_ younger maniac is the Real Joker who will go on to do Joker things unapologetically. I was _eh_ about parts of the movie, but I adore that ending; that's realistically how it would go.

[@Boss__CQC]

Imagine if Heath Ledger’s Joker suddenly apologised to everyone, realising he’s made a horrible mistake, announcing to Harvey Dent, ‘there is no Joker’. He then gets shanked in prison and the challenge he faces to society is conveniently swept away.

[@FromW]

That probably would happen if it was made in these times we live in. If he was still alive they would have wanted to milk him until they ruined him because of how popular his Joker was. Or ruined him in the worst way just because everyone liked him.

[@MinesAGuinness]

You do understand that people can and, in real life, do advocate for and establish mental health reform without becoming homicidal clowns? Why do this new generation have to have every message presented to them through the medium of psychopathic edgelords lacking in even the basic expression of empathy, in order to even begin to show concern for a societal issue? I wonder just how much of this alleged concern for mental health amongst Joker fans translated into actual support or involvement?

[@MollyHJohns]

​@@MinesAGuinness ah then this is your mistake. Comparing a fictional character that is meant to be Batman's unrepentant eternal archenemy to real life mental issues and how even Joker should be given redemption arcs 😂

[@Dinkywinkyxo]

Lay off crack pipe​@@MinesAGuinness

[@junkscience6397]

@@MollyHJohns Yeah, that was silly, and pretentious to boot! "You do understand..." LOL

[@tnwhiskey68]

Sounds like pretty high praise coming from you! I'm sure I'll see bits and pieces of it when it's relentlessly played on TV in a few years

[@LivingFire_BurningFlame]

I heard early reviews were really bad but damn, I was excepting a big surprise like the first one. Making it a musical was a huge gamble imo.

[@norm-bb3bb]

I'm going to see it and form my own opinion, it can't be worse than Megalopolis, just the cinematography looks superior

[@jamesthomas4561]

@@norm-bb3bbit is not nearly as bad as people are making it out to be. You should definitely go see it I really enjoyed the film.

[@norm-bb3bb]

@@jamesthomas4561 I did, it's a good movie but a terrible sequel

[@jamesthomas4561]

@@norm-bb3bb why do you say that?

[@norm-bb3bb]

@@jamesthomas4561 Because destroys the first movie

[@tacitus6384]

The character idea that Harley Quinn starts off as a fan girl of the publicly perceived Joker, whom pushes it onto Arthur Fleck, only for that Joker persona to take him over and cause him to become abusive to her, is a gold mine writing/drama/character interaction for writers...but that's not what we got. This movie was fantastically directed, shot and acted, but really poorly written. And that's the problem.

[@carlosnn8150]

Agreed, like I said elsewhere it could have been a good idea in principle but fleshed out terribly in actual writing.

[@MightyHawx]

That's pretty much every movie today...

[@jpb2366]

is it possible "THE MESSAGE" got into the way? Cannot make a female character look bad

[@seanbell69]

Because all that story does is turn a woman into an object again. Harley exists to be obsessed and be abused. No character development needed on her part; that's why we didn't get that.

[@tacitus6384]

@@seanbell69 It doesn't. She's a fan-girl whose actions influence someone for the worse, with bad consequences for her.

[@adamhutto8470]

If anyone doubts the fact humiliation rituals aren't the point, watch this movie. This movie absolutely is a humiliation ritual. It doesn't exist to make Money, if money was the point this movie would be completely different

[@legalcoffee5315]

I liked the first one so I'm going to skip the sequel. Thanks for the review!

[@hugostiglitz9864]

They had to weaken the male character to strengthen the female character. How shocking.

[@juanchocorleone]

THE MESSAGE

[@condatis6175]

@@CastorRabbit One closed system of thought, that interprets everything within the same set of basic tropes, replaced with another?

[@syouji185]

the most perfect way to describe it

[@joebloggs3551]

​@castorchua Explain why he's wrong though. For once, let's here your tribe attack the argument not the person.

[@spooningkat6933]

@@condatis6175 It's not that deep you moron, people are just complaining about a shitty message that has plagued media for many years at this point, which is an objectively valid complaint.

[@rokpantner3049]

Imagine the movie starts in the courtroom, Joker being full on Joker and he is sentenced to Arkham Asylum. And Harley Quinn watches and studies the Joker for her PhD. Time skip a few years and we see Harley unhappy and in Asylum she gets to be in care of Joker. Joker starts to corrupt her and the musical numbers are halucinations where she becomes crazier and loses all reason. They plan to escape Asylum, using other inmates as bait. And in the end we see a young Batman catching Harley after Joker leaves her so he can escape.

[@AnnaJo2000]

Now THAT is something I would have loved to see! Not this crappy musical.

[@alexischavez3238]

Literally yes

[@UnapologeticIslam]

Someone get this guy a movie deal!!!

[@The_Modeling_Underdog]

A Thousand-Timer better movie plot than what we got. Here's a fat Seal of Approval.

[@destroyermaker]

Congratulations you're a better writer than Todd Phillips

[@Foxaris]

Making him turn even more into Joker would have been a better move. Could have started the movie with people breaking him out of prison and making him their leader.

[@marychocolatefairy]

Yeah, that still could have meshed with his intention for the first one, where Fleck didn't really do anything except be a symbol to others who did go on to do stuff. But no, let's have a 2+ hour courtroom drama, since everyone loves those, heh.

[@M4dM4n96]

Hmmm.. interesting. The beginning of the film could be them trying to break him out, only for him to straight up refuse and remain in his cell - his time in prison is mostly spent in isolation, except for the minimum exercise and counselling he receives.. he's actually slowly getting better - until one day he is introduced to his new counsellor, one who's completely obsessed with seeing inside his mind, but when she finds that he's really little more than just a broken man who wanted to feel needed, wanted, accepted.. well.. I'm sure we can all see where that's going. Have her be ruthless, obsessive, manipulative.. she wants to see the monster that lurks within him... and as he slowly becomes entirely dependent upon her... I would have actually watched that That could be incredibly compelling and chilling

[@suncrestt4839]

Yeah exactly. They could’ve done a buildup of him learning to fully embrace becoming Joker as his constituents’ support grew. It would’ve been awesome to see him gradually transform Gotham into a lawless city ruled by fear and chaos.

[@jamesthomas4561]

@@suncrestt4839you clearly did not watch the first or second movie. When did you ever see Arthur as a criminal mastermind who could rule over Gotham as the crime king? Arthur didn’t create the name joker it was never him. Wether or not you like it they took the joker story in a different direction. Using that title to show issues in society. That is what good movies do.

[@123hattan]

He already escape the courtroom, could have gotten further from there.

[@Ramzblood]

Too dangerous an anti hero.. So they killed him

[@matthewhermon2677]

Story of Hollywood these days... We can't have brilliant standalone movies, there must be a sequel 🥲

[@HankOlson-lt4ct]

No one is forcing you to watch it tho

[@alexisc4922]

There must be a trilogy

[@darrenasquith1170]

Cancer doesn't stop

[@thearch1tect249]

Wait until the pre-qual comes out in 2027!

[@coltonwhite2518]

​@@HankOlson-lt4ctNo one is stopping us from talking shit about it either. If you're looking for a spot where people either blindly clap or plug their ears this is the wrong place.

[@rhyka101]

This sequel should have been centered around Joker escaping the asylum, forming a gang and his initial confrontations with The Batman. That was the movie fans wanted!

[@aktivniigomes1989]

Confrontation with Batman? He's literally 10-12 yo in the first movie, he's not even teenager lmao

[@rhyka101]

@@aktivniigomes1989 You're correct. My timeline is out unless they push the trial for a couple of years. A 16-18 Batman would be a possibility at a stretch. Nevertheless, you point out an error I made. I hold my hands up. Thanks for reminding me/us.

[@crows6591]

Batman is literally the last thing I want to see in jokers origin movies, maybe not until the absolute last second and it’s a time skip

[@emp0rizzle]

and he needs to go shopping at a gag shop so he can have those chattering teeth to spit out when someone punches him in the mouth.

[@shawklan27]

No

[@Tomasin19]

I know you said "no spoilers" but I can't help but get a laugh when even ARTHUR FUCKING FLECK tells Lady Gaga to stop singing and talk to him.

[@mkultra2456]

Lady Gaga is a man.

[@supanerd1554]

It was a meme inside of the movie damn near lol

[@mkultra2456]

@@supanerd1554 Lady Gaga is a man.

[@mkultra2456]

@@supanerd1554 LOL comments are getting deleted. Tomasin18 must have reported them.

[@crisdanai]

I ABSOLUTELY loved the first film.... When I saw Lady Guh-Guh was in part two, I checked out....

[@glenjohnson7690]

"As if they're taking a swipe at the audience themselves for liking someone they weren't supposed to." That about sums it up. We're ruled by ghouls.

[@seanbell69]

Or you were never meant to like it in the first place, and everyone creatively involved with it wanted to show you that you didn't understand the first one.

[@kurtpunchesthings2411]

hell it's gotten so bad i might genuinely never see another movie again because i think this Movie is raising a very serious concern that the only movies made anymore are either terrible or accidentally good it feels that people like you and me are not supposed to enjoy movies that Hollywood make and if we do WOAH thats a problem gotta fix that rq

[@XandateOfHeaven]

@@glenjohnson7690 This is such a dumb take. Hollywood wants you to tie your identity to movies, and that's what you're doing. The whole narrative that "we weren't supposed to like the first one" is you guys jerking yourselves off for liking a comic book movie. Hollywood has a single purpose, to make money. You seeing their product as more than a product is the kind of person investment they kill for. You aren't subversive or special for liking a property film children.

[@Hungabrigoo]

​@@seanbell69 Then everyone creative involved deserves to go broke and be ridiculed for their unbelievable arrogance.

[@XandateOfHeaven]

@@kurtpunchesthings2411 No one is punishing you for watching movies. Hollywood just wants your money, but they also want everyone else's money so not every movies is specifically catered to you.

[@boingaon]

Complete opposite of character progression. Fans are robbed of a triumphant and satisfying exploration into this character.

[@LSB001]

It seems pretty obvious that was the entire point of this film. Hollywoke hates that people sympathized with Arthur.

[@happinesstan]

@@LSB001 Maybe if you weren't so cynical you'd be able to empathise with him in this one. Or have you not actually seen it yet, and just talking shite?

[@I-ONLY-BUILD-MECHS-AND-DUSTERS]

@@happinesstan I haven't ever consumed feces yet still know it's ****, pretty similar situation with this movie, and thanks to drinker for the reviews. They're better than the movies usually.

[@anon_148]

@@happinesstan Shut the fuck up, who is supposed to empathize with a man going through and obscenely disgusting and miserable humiliation ritual because he is white? Gtfo

[@legacymse7095]

@@happinesstan Problem is, this is character regression. He gets manipulated by Harvey then dumped, the guards literally r**e the Joker out of him, and then he dies. And since the majority of the movie takes place in the courtroom, nothing new ever happens or is explored. The movie is 60% recap, 20% songs and 20% background dump, with most of it aiming to revert the evolution we saw in the first movie. I saw it, it really is that bad

[@thespalek1]

Disney Wars taught me to not go watching sequels automatically. Thx for this review.

[@thinkingrainbows3542]

That's not Disney, that's you being a moron

[@TravisHi_YT]

Yep, I was a bit weirded out when the trailer randomly dropped. I knew it was something I'd be waiting for reviews first. Glad I waited.

[@thespalek1]

@@TravisHi_YT Exactly👍

[@jamesthomas4561]

@@thespalek1the movie is good. How about instead of listening to what other people on the internet think you go and actually watch it?

[@thespalek1]

@@jamesthomas4561 How about not going to experience evrything for my own, as my precious time on this Earth is limited, and learn from other people's mistakes? I don't care what people say in general, but I found out, that I agree with Drinker in like 95% of cases, so I am willing to take the risk. Personally I felt like the story was closed and I considered any follow up as kind of sacrilege. And when I found out it's gonna be a musical, I was 99% decided anyway. For me to go, this review would have to be like "Wow!! It is unexpectadly great conclusion of the story!".

[@oldskoolordie]

It’s not incompetence, it’s deliberate.

[@orbitingdecay6797]

For what reason?

[@oldskoolordie]

@@orbitingdecay6797 what is the charge? Eating a meal

[@mrrandom1265]

The end of Joker was just perfect. Him running left and right in the corridor made no sense in a logical point of view but it was just an image to show that the rest of his life would be about escaping, getting caught and escaping again. Why did they need a sequel, nobody will ever know. I just refuse to watch it.

[@TaylorWilmes]

You think they’ll just let him get away with it?

[@deltamaxxhomevideo]

“The sequel nobody wanted.” We still don’t want it, but we used to not want it too.

[@benjaminperez7328]

Thank you, Mitch……..