Joscha Bach: Consciousness and AGI - #76

[@drhxa]

I'm a simple man, I see Joscha Bach, I click. The density of signal from him is unmatched

[@v1kt0u5]

I'd say that Stephen Wolfram and Michael Levin signals are unmatched too ;)

[@Crawdaddy_Ro]

​@@v1kt0u5 Hell yeah, man! Add Iain McGilchrist to that list too!

[@trisshlv]

Simple woman... Same

[@drmedwuast]

Wish this would have gone on for at least another hour, felt like you guys were just getting started. Great podcast, thank you!

[@BitShifting-h3q]

yet another great interview with Joscha Bach- happy to find your channel:} thank you so much! Subscribed !

[@AustinKelly94]

Thouro glad I discovered this podcast, thanks to you and your guests.

[@NilsEchterling]

Can you share a link to the youtube page Joscha refers to near the end? I have trouble finding it. Thanks !

[@RavenousBugOfTraal]

Should be kzbin.info/aero/PL23rUNk2HqJErizLGkuZE99CvGsalwAwX

[@top115]

youtube.com/@joschabach?si=R1QViLlnk5Q2V5Le

[@InquilineKea]

SOME OF THE TWO MOST OPEN MINDED PEOPLE EVER!!

[@alexandrazachary.musician]

Great choice of Blade Runner soundtrack! Thanks for a fine conversation 🙏🏽❤️

[@kooperinterstellar-s2m]

amazing to see this new podcast guest who has very unique perspective on AI and physics etc.

[@PaulHigginbothamSr]

When I was really young Boeing was shining microprocessors on a wall. All of that was shrunk down to a tiny chip. It was simply amazing to me. Then a lot of scheming was done for the first megabyte chips. I remember studying to figure out the best method. Then they just introduced longer names to find the data. My first computer was also a Commodore 64. It meant it had 64 kilobyes of memory.

[@amalshashika1997]

This is a gem.

[@LetGoofEverythingNow]

Love the talk and insights.

[@peterwilkinson1975]

Bottom line is consciousness is all real, there is no such thing as “artificial”. Or it’s all artificial same thing

[@xmathmanx]

Everything has a real version and a ton of fakes, I don't know why consciousness would be an exception

[@v_i_e_w_e_r_405]

What Joscha is saying is that consciousness is a pattern, that is why "is not a property of physical systems, rather a property of simulated systems". Basically, physical systems (in our case a brain inside the skull of a monkey) are the substract that implements the pattern (in our case the human mind). Is a really simple and pragmatic point of view based on implementation

[@simonedefilippo6389]

​@@v_i_e_w_e_r_405but the physical system is inside, as a concept, the pattern, if consciousness is a pattern why there are physical systems as physical systems?

[@OtavioVeras]

"Tell me about your childhood in the woods, Mogly"

[@drmedwuast]

hahaha

[@Crawdaddy_Ro]

Right!? And the way he describes his childhood, it was similar too! He had a different introduction to society than most people do lol

[@cooperveit3289]

Joscha hosted some public sci fi movie nights in SF that were AMAZING. movie then discussion.

[@youtubelisk]

That sounds fun. How was the discussion facilitated?

[@drmedwuast]

woah, amazing. can you say a bit more about how that went and what movies you watched?

[@trucid2]

Always love finding other Zelazny fans.

[@joshg469]

Library of Babel is my favorite. It's kinda like how in Tarzan, Jane introduces herself first and that's what started the speech recognition for meaningful pattern recognition

[@claspihlstrom7335]

Great talk!

[@JuergenRarey-Th]

Thank you for finding this 🙏

[@michkrom]

Beautiful choice of opening music: Blade Runner.

[@theodoreshachtman9990]

Great interview! Super interesting, thanks! I’m subscribing

[@NeoShaman]

How would you explain the statement, that "you should be motivated by the outcome, not by the emotions or feelings" (52:10)? Doesn't this render emotions and feelings useless?

[@mattwesney]

Just means your reward functions should not be the purpose

[@edenaut]

@@mattwesney ✨ well said

[@NeoShaman]

@@mattwesney What is the point of reward function, if not defining the purpose? What is the purpose of life outside feelings and emotions? You think that those are side effects of some sort, or tools that are used by the conceptual mind to force you to do what it wants? Everything we do, we do for feelings associated with it. If your reward function is not the purpose, then you are exploited by the outcome. System that sacrifices its own well being for an imaginary goal, suffers through his own actions. Human being become a tool.

[@Corteum]

_"Maybe all consciousness is made up"_ Maybe. Except you haven't explained how it's made up, or what it's made of, and defined it in purely physical terms. lol

[@Leksa135]

If all possible universes are ontologically equal, does it make sense to ask if this one is simulated or not?

[@kutfingertv814]

Also, has Steven Hsu read Frank Herberts Destination Void? Sounds like it, based on the conversation. All about how to create an Agger.

[@PichiMaude]

You're doing a fantastic job! I need some advice: My OKX wallet holds some USDT, and I have the seed phrase. (wonder obey dial dash soon tank spike scout region undo zero such). How should I go about transferring them to Binance?

[@MiyamotoMusashi9]

Buckminster Fuller had this same vision, just couldn't really put it into words the same way.

[@Bungaru]

intro/outro song?

[@penguinista]

Roger Zelazny is great! If you like his stuff, don't miss Walter Jon Williams. Williams has a bunch of books I like, but 'Aristoi' is interesting with relation to cognition as it is about people who have separated out their personalities, splitting off sub personalities, and are wired into the web so that the sub personalities can go off and do useful stuff and come back and report on it.

[@Alf22374]

31:49 you're welcome

[@calvingrondahl1011]

Joscha Bach 🤖🖖🤖👍

[@ephimp3189]

If we create conscious AI that has no ability to feel pain, no fear of death, no desire to "survive" - do we really need to have "human ethics" applied to it?

[@johnnytass2111]

It will need to understand how human ethics affects the lives of the living.

[@MiyamotoMusashi9]

We tried this once ,building a tower ,back when our language was the same... probably were telepathic then. It will be shattered again and we will be wondering and babbling ...

[@MysticalPolymath]

40:40 imo this would be very bad for society

[@matrixpredator]

the startrek teleportation question is so annoying ^^ i mean if they could recreate the human it would mean Immortality, who cares about transportation at that point xD liebe Grüße aus Wien :D

[@looseunit9180]

Monetising this discussion with ads shows me that you’re not serious about allowing your audience to absorb Joscha’s fascinating ideas without interruption. I will not be returning to your channel

[@jamesp3871]

Zelazney is a master. The Book of Amber is amazing

[@sirrobinofloxley7156]

If I'm following Joscha right, he's saying Buddhism. Strike that, Zen Buddhism!

[@danscieszinski4120]

i wonder if he has ever seen “The Mosquito Coast”. classic.

[@oliverjamito9902]

My Host Meek, thank you!

[@penguinista]

Extend the transporter thought experiment a bit and imagine what happens if the machine fails to delete the original copy of Joscha Bach. Are we supposed to believe the original copy would be copacetic committing suicide because there was another copy of him on Earth? Maybe the original and the copy have a Zoom call and decide who dies.

[@rickyboyz1006]

OmG!!!!!!! LOSE THE LONGFORM ADDS PLEASE

[@jasonshapiro9469]

I'm really banking on being able to get a chip in my brain...I feel like it's the best chance i have for learning to operate a computer. Even if i could just change the channel or turn on some lights I'd be happy. I would take a pill to get smarter, too, whichever comes first.

[@drmedwuast]

Elon's got you covered

[@psi4j]

For real. P(Doom) without AI is already 100%. Yudkowsky has had too much time to sit with his autism thinking about narrow hypotheticals.

[@oliverjamito9902]

Unto all the Elites according to their own demise and understanding resting upon easily can be blown away in front of Who?

[@AlexCulturesThings]

AI that sleeps. That will be the solution. And conceptual/sylabic language generation tied via certain mathematical sets.

[@youtubelisk]

The solution to what and why would sleep be the solution?

[@AlexCulturesThings]

@@youtubelisk Sleep is a means to consolidate self similar constelations of resonant patterns via x number of features. Eliminate brute force search. Continuity without bruteforce search.

[@youtubelisk]

@AlexCulturesThings So you think Ai is awake?

[@AlexCulturesThings]

@@youtubelisk I’m not sure what awake means I the context of AI. Maybe during generation, but I have evidence that sleep like cycles can be used to tie concepts via resonance and AI can use that at generation time without need for brute force search. It results in unique responses.

[@AlexCulturesThings]

@youtubelisk The hint here is that it is not coming from the API call. Though there is an API call.

[@kaioshine]

.

[@u111111]

"LLM consciousness" LOL Also, researh on topic if Matlab should be granted a degree in Mathematics.

[@skoto8219]

Oh hey we found the guy who knows how and when consciousness arises!

[@silberlinie]

Why does he twist his mouth so contemptuously?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Shared "i" Am come forth!

[@isaacmackey1406]

Adolescence

[@MS-od7je]

Wigner’s box and Schrodinger‘s cat. The subjective reality of God is our objective reality ( observation)( the observation of God , God saw that it was good ) God is spirit Iterate appropriately

[@MiyamotoMusashi9]

How will it pronounce YHWH ?

[@awsmith1007]

Bach doesn't seem very acquainted with the relevant literature in the philosophy of mind. Just sounds like nonsense phrased in a way that attempts to disguise it as something profound.

[@zaq9339]

Have I seen the same comment before somewhere?

[@awsmith1007]

@@zaq9339 Yeah, almost every time I see this guy on a video I make the same comment because I am a hater. This was my second time and I look forward to my third.

[@zaq9339]

@@awsmith1007 So was it your second time or you do it "almost every time"? Be honest now 😂

[@awsmith1007]

@@zaq9339 Second time, but also every time. I've only seen 2 video's of him since I've started, so both can be true.

[@zaq9339]

@@awsmith1007 So why add "almost" in there? Of the two videos you've seen in total by your own admission, you must've taken every opportunity to bash the man in the comments in order for the statement to be true. The failure to do so even once would translate to merely a 50% success rate which hardly constitutes a majority and doesn't warrant the modifier "almost". I don't think you're being entirely honest here. Can you even troll?

[@yourbrain8700]

Before I spend the time watching this, can anyone tell me whether it's [key] and [vital] info? If so it's justified.

[@Macfromwales]

How would anyone know what you consider either? 😂

[@edenaut]

Move on bro. Ask this question on all other videos comment sections but not in this :p

[@MiyamotoMusashi9]

MR.NOBODY, you don't exist

[@TheRianflo]

Joscha: warum so dogmatisch?!!

[@kutfingertv814]

Maybe because he is a Dachschhund

[@MilushevGeorgi]

Putin and MAGA loving Lex interviewed Zelinsky, I’m positive of the fact that president Zelinsky remembers when Trump tried to block preapproved by the Congress military aid to Ukraine while Rudy was looking for Hunters laptop in Ukraine, true story. Thanks for not falling down the Joe Rogan rabbit hole and having guests like Tucker and Alex Jones, Eddie Bravo too, Eddie is famously a flat earther. Look man, we are down here in this realm to learn, optimize for moral agency and the skill of discern, all that while everything is conditional.

[@oliverjamito9902]

Indeed! Day and Night come here in front and remind!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Yes, remember unto thee all forgotten once came from Here!

[@OnSenseAndReference]

You need to be ignorant or just stupid to believe that the so-called "scaling hypothesis" can lead to AGI. Guess why.

[@oliverjamito9902]

What is old minds in front of HIM?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Why say my little infant daughters? Lord so precise!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Lord, ye holding with thy hands. Now Lord ye can be seen!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Without Form and Void darkness upon the deep come here in front and remind!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Old minds have not seen the quaking!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Why say my Devine laws unseen nor seen?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Is like....who in front exist?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Old minds will say, why HE reveals HIMSELF unto little New minds? Love can't be forced to be loved?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Unto all the capital "I" exalted themselves above will be visited! Will be kept nor will be cast down in front of HIM!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Love without force came for HIM TO HOLD. Yes, the WHITE STONE and the MORNING STAR came without force came to be hold.

[@oliverjamito9902]

Elon who among these old minds will run unto their riches nor wealth their God to save them?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Elon who is walking with thee? Lord the "EYE OF THE NEEDLE"!

[@oliverjamito9902]

Likewise unto all my shared "i" Am Hosts Meeks with great riches nor wealth in front?

[@oliverjamito9902]

Many GODS of men exalted themselves above looking at HIS NEW TABLE made from a HANDS without blood stains upon HIS HANDS! Resting upon sustained! Even all HIS DEVINE LAWS UNSEEN NOR SEEN....my LORD!