Better than DJI FPV? Fat Shark Dominator / Walksnail Avatar FPV is here!

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Well? Was it worth the wait?

[@pacificnorthwestpilots6050]

Not sure yet, haven't watched the video 😃 EDIT: As of the release of this video, no, I do not think they were worth the wait. This will change over time when fw releases include the 1200mw hack and 50mbs mode. My issue with this goggle is that the "creators" of them seem rather dishonest with the claims made about latency, availability, and performance. DJI/HdZero flyier 😎

[@travis.stevens]

No, IMO.

[@DoubleBFPV]

Just got the dji set up last year so I’ll be stricken to that untill I see that this set up is worth it….

[@craigreynolds4449]

Yes, We love you :)

[@calisti9308]

Nah, not really. I’ll stay with DJI

[@DanishStallion]

Not buying it but watched the whole thing to educate myself, staying with DJI. Great work on this review jb

[@WorkJoker]

What DJI system do you have?

[@chiefaj4745]

@@WorkJoker get the mini 2

[@gloomiehoodie]

Sorry Fatshark, it's been a pleasure, but I just found someone way more attractive and up-to-date. It's been nice spending time with you, but you became an old-tech and didn't care much about improving to keep me around. I know, it will hurt but, you just can't beat the beauty of the feature-loaded DJI's goggles. Welcome DJI to my FPV world, but be aware that I'm also flirting with HDZero, she really is an eye-catcher too! 😁 Sorry Josh, I know kick-back pays the bills, but you can keep Fatshark, she is all yours now.

[@victormuller4462]

@@WorkJoker haha, probably only the main one....all the other systems were given by Fatshark.

[@khadrogo4797]

As a new drone enthusiast, your channel is spot on. There are tonnes and tonnes of other channels out there, but nothing like this regarding informative content. Great work and cheers

[@roboedar]

The best thing about this release is that now I am certain I will not buy them. Can't believe they withheld information on these as though they had something groundbreaking on their hands that they had to hide. Instead they offer something that barely competes with the end of life DJI goggles. Carl Zhou is a man of the people and one that cares about the community. We must support HDZero at all costs. :)

[@KOrnhOliO1]

That's good, in theory. I agree. But, the problem with following HDZero so religiously, is it doesn't compete with these two systems! Problem: HDZero has no where near the penetration, even with their 1000mw VTX! Honestly, the penetration kinda sucks! It's not good at all. Don't think so, go watch JB's parking garage comparison between analog, HDZero, and DJI. Analog had better penetration! Seriously, JB shows it. HDZero also had tons and gobs of analog - like distortion in the image! Snow, fuzz, rainbow distortion, etc. Sure, it's better than analog, but a distant, very distant 3rd place when compared to DJI and this new Fatshark digital system. If it was a race once around the track... At present time, DJI would win, Fatshark would come in second, but about 10 seconds behind, and HDZero got lapped by both other systems and finished a distant 3rd, about 2 minutes back! HDZero has promise, but it's not close to these two systems because of two things. 1. Penetration is terrible. 2. Snow, fuzz, distortion in image quality, is too much like analog to give it much praise. It's better than analog, yes, but too much fuzz just like it! Sure, Carl is supportive of the FPV community and I love that! But, what does that give us in additional picture quality and penetration? Nothing. Carl's a good dude. True. But his system is far, far behind. Getting better, yes! But still so far behind I don't think it will ever compete. Look at JB's part of this and other videos where he flies right through his thick woods. Scraggle and ghost branches galore! DJI works it's way through fine... We can see every little scraggle and avoid it. Fatshark did the same, although not as clear, with lots of blockage breakup. HDZero and analog he wouldn't even attempt to enter the woods! Too much break up, fuzz and distortion. Not enough penetration and clarity to even enter the woods. Promising yes, competitive with these two systems, sorry, but that's a solid no. 🤷🥴

[@paulgeorge1069]

and id add thats the honest truth. i will stick to analog while i can still buy it. but i know with this run out and pre-order the unfinished/ beta version bat shit crazy update driven community of fpv analog will probably go away soon. i like finished pull it out and use it products. if jb says you need to update firmware out of the box I'm out. I can not STAND FLASHING ANYTHING! gave my laptop flying lessons months ago( broke the hard drive) so speedy bee it is.

[@grim-upnorth]

For me, from everything I've read, all the videos I've watched on the subject and now this video.... the underlying "tech" (i.e. the digital image transmission technology) is pretty much the same method as what DJI has been using since their V1 goggle. Whilst now I do concede that technically the hardware in the goggles has not simply been ripped from DJI and is indeeed their own built system, it's still effectively the same as DJI. Let me repeat... NOT DJI but the same as how DJI do it. That's why it looks and behaves so similar if not almost identical to early DJI. I'm sure that with some tweaking, the hardware will be capable of being on par with the DJI V2. Now the fact they were so secretive and cryptic and borderline misleading with the roots of the tech, just left a bit of a sour taste and along with the price and performance of this now released system, I'm 100% sure I'll never go near it. If they'd have just said "hey guys, yup... it's a system that works the same as DJI but we were able to use the base tech that DJI did in our own way" that would have been much easier to take. I think the way they've launched this has probably lost them a fair few sales.

[@saidinesh5]

Did they cheap out on the camera? It reminds me of that weird caddx dji camera that showed haze around objects and weird sky colors.. And the first version of HDZero/Sharkbyte cameras. Very disappointed with their decision to not use an external sdcard for the onboard DVR though. I think the compression artifacts will be ironed out with firmware updates (Assuming Fatshark won't pull a Fatshark and stops firmware updates). What was scary was the jittery frames in the parking lot range test. I can live with worse image but stutter makes me extremely nervous when flying close to objects.

[@UnmannedSky]

Ok the price killed it for me even more. Worse than DJI and more expensive? However, great video JB. You killed it on the review as always!

[@creationlabsinc.189]

Top tier products especially in 2022 won’t be cheap. It’s funny to read comments such as yours. 😂

[@UnmannedSky]

@@creationlabsinc.189 perhaps. Except its not top tier yet 😀

[@grim-upnorth]

@@UnmannedSky Haha, exactly. If we consider "top tier" as the gold standard DJI V2 has given us, then this Fatshark system is probably at least a tier or two below, at least when performance is given priority. However, I do concede that making a piece of hardware such as this, with the features DJI does not have (OLED screens, USB-C - HDMI out, smaller form factor) is definitely going to be a challenge with regards to affordability.

[@dangerous8333]

@@creationlabsinc.189 He didn't assume they would be cheap, dingleberry. He just said more expensive than DJI for less quality. I laugh when I see comments like yours. No comprehension.

[@UnmannedSky]

I do think there's good potential here. Like JB said its good to have a company that's more invested in fpv community than DJI. I'd be interested in when 50mbps gets released as well as 1200mw. Also more cameras. I'd just need a good reason to convert my entire fleet of caddx vista's to this in addition to the Goggle purchase..

[@johnnyhubbard3361]

Thanks!

[@ryanbell6537]

Thank you Josh!!!!! Still flying a $40 box waiting for funds to buy decent goggles, decided to jump straight to digital once we get there!

[@moritzbeck3677]

Danke!

[@TakeItToTheGround]

I am DJI user and I look at the HD Zero whoop boards with envy. The eco system of the goggles will be the key factor in my next goggle purchase, not so much the goggles themselves.

[@GiantAntCowboy]

As an HDZero fan I’m actually a little relieved by this review because this system doesn’t seem like much of a threat to what Carl and his team are working towards… The Pros and Cons here seem to cancel each other out. The blocky image is just too much for me; I’d much rather have “static/noise” then “blocky/blurry video”. Overall great job with this very complete, and honest feeling review of the system. I’m sure they rushed this system out and will continue to improve, so we’ll stay tuned. Cheers!

[@stanbasov42]

Same here buddy, Im holding my cash for the new HDZero project and this video just made it way easier

[@KOrnhOliO1]

I just wish HDZero was competitive with the image quality of DJI and this new Fatshark system. HDZero has terrible penetration. Too much fuzz and distortion so similar to analog. It's not competitive to these systems because you fly with ANYTHING in-between you and your quad and all that fuzz just shows up in abundance! Currently, it's the worst value, by far, on the market! Why? Because for what we pay, we get a little improvement over analog for a ton of money! At least with DJI, and now with Fatshark, we pay a bunch, but we get a ton of improvement over analog for our dollars! Value because of image quality! DJI gives us the very best, by far, image quality FPV had ever seen... And Fatshark is close behind. Updates will probably get it even closer. There's little value with HDZero because the penetration is terrible, and it's got all of the fuzz and distortion of analog, just clearer. I love that Carl is so in tune with the FPV community, but that doesn't help or fix the problem of terrible penetration and fuzz and snow galore! Carl's great! But his technology is not that great. You can go ahead and give Carl and HDZero all the praise you want! I agree, Carl is an FPV dude! Wonderful guy. But, the tech behind HDZero is far, FAR behind other other two systems in performance. Sure, if you only race in an open field with gates, it's great! You're close, there's little to nothing blocking the path between you and your quad, just the tiny gates. But, fly behind a building a group of trees, bushes, anything solid, and it all comes crumbling down! HDZero can't penetrate those objects even close to as well as these other two systems and it sucks down the image quality drastically! Sorry, but even though Carl is a great FPV guy, that doesn't make his system work any better! 🤷😥

[@ScrapHeapFPV]

​@@KOrnhOliO1 you are not wrong for signal strength of hdzero. it definitely is the worst system in terms of range including analog. however it definitely has its value for racers who want to be able to see better than analog if this fatshark system can be tracked by timing and play nicely with others it might well be better than hdzero but I haven't seen anyone test that

[@KOrnhOliO1]

@@ScrapHeapFPV Yup, if you only have a gate in-between you and your quad, then HDZero is great! low latency, decent picture, thumbs up! But, for the many of us who don't race, and don't fly in open fields, not so good. Put literally anything, a twig - I jest! - but a building, a grove of trees or bushes, a wall, anything solid in-between you and your quad and HDZero just doesn't deal with it well at all. No penetration of objects is it's main problem, IMO.

[@GiantAntCowboy]

@@KOrnhOliO1 I agree that when DJI, or this Fatshark system, are in ideal conditions they look great, better than HDZero for sure. However it falls apart pretty quickly, this is especially true with the Fatshark system demonstrated here. Ex: JB is right outside his house and even with almost no obstacles in front of him the image is already getting blurry and blocky… the ground is mush, the tree branches disappear, and the surrounding world looks muddy. (JB mentions this, it’s not my observation) So basically when slowly hovering in one spot with clear LOS it looks great! HDZero on the other hand may have lower total image quality but the resolution and latency don’t fluctuate with signal strength but instead any missing image data/pixels are displayed as static. For me it’s easier to see through static in a bad signal situation than high latency blurry mush. Additionally send-receive video systems (DJI/Fatshark) have a history of freezing, restarting, and totally unbinding when signal gets too weak. This is a major issue for longer-range folks, but I know we’re a minority in the FPV community. The DJI (and maybe this Fatshark) system is more plug and play which for many users is ideal, but this also results in setup and use restrictions that don’t exist with HDZero. Ultimately, I think each of these systems have a place in the hobby for certain users (though not sure why you’d chose Fatshark over DJI yet). My last point is to your range and penetration comment, with the right antennas HDZero performs much better than most tests show. Linked below is my HDZ 1W review with 3 range and penetration tests that I think are worth checking out. Thanks for the well written comment, cheers! kzbin.info/www/bejne/oKvKdpaan9FggtE

[@HrDux]

Thank you for the excellent review. I got the DJI V2s a few months ago and I'm glad I did. I'll be sticking with them for a few years. The compression/IQ on the Fatshark/Walksnail system looked worse than DJI. And it's almost as if the lens on the camera is fogged over, especially if is bright outside. It would be cool if it were possible to put a DJI cam on the Walksnail VTX.

[@skyweaver3199]

It's the same camera as the dji camera, that's in the newer air units....

[@KOrnhOliO1]

@@skyweaver3199 that can't be! Because it looks just like the Nebula Nano V1... Fog, ice looking haze of trees when lit from behind. It's awful. No one will buy those DJI cameras. And the new DJI cameras don't give that image quality! No fog at all. I know, I own them. Only that one camera gave that image quality, and it's long ago discontinued. The V2 of that Nebula Nano solved about 90% of that problem. They need a better camera for this Fatshark system!!! And, it's way too big.

[@likwidkool]

I too just got into dji a few months ago. Was a little worried at first I made a mistake, but so far it’s going in our favor. Very interested to see how they handle the inevitable firmware updates and push new or better features. I think though HDZero is winning the race if I were to buy into a new system.

[@grim-upnorth]

Yes, I agree that the image quality is possibly degraded here by the camera, even when the picture was great with good signal... the mistyness and flatness of the image was still there, and reminded me of those nano cameras noone wanted to buy.

[@skyweaver3199]

@@KOrnhOliO1 I have flown it irl, and it also seen the system irl at rampage. It looked exactly like dji to me, and I fly dji every day.

[@Chilternflyer]

Just having focus mode instead of having 'artifacts moving round all over the screen' is enough for me to stick with DJI. I hope that one day the community devs will be able to do more with the rooted firmware in the DJI goggles.

[@Rcschim]

Maybe an nd filter would help against the ground smeariness. It saves Bitrate by being blurry intentionally... Also: the next time you have to use srt files with overlay, I have a super convenient script that fully automatically converts your srt into a nicer format and a even creates a small video with black background that you can use as an overlay (just color key the black). I love using it myself :) can share it on Facebook later...

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Definitely send me that script!

[@grim-upnorth]

Yes please! I struggle with my .srt files where will the link be shared?

[@NGAGEFPV]

Make a video mario!!! Please share that script dude... Its so painful to do things the way im doing them making my own black background and colour key method..

[@Rcschim]

@@NGAGEFPV I already did a tutorial bout the srt script here kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZmSoY5yIj8qHZs0

[@Rcschim]

@@grim-upnorth check my video it has the link and explanation, really easy and convenient. Don't hesitate to contact me if you don't like the design of the overlay, it's pretty easy to adjust. kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZmSoY5yIj8qHZs0

[@GibRealistic]

It seems that it needs quite a lot of software development, I expected it to be slightly better due to using x265 instead of x264, but in contrary to my expectations it produces more artifacts in video feed.

[@gutrali]

You may have heard, but just incase; there is now an update available that Tommy just reviewed. It looks GREAT to my eyes, even with KZbin compression on top of it. Like wow

[@MaxRovensky]

I love that this exists, but I probably won't be moving from DJI The added features are nice to have if you're starting out but it's too much investment to get a new goggle and replace vTXes on all my quads

[@SvPVids]

Even for a first HD headset DJI is still the one I'm going to get, Fatshark stagnated the market for years and now it wants to get in with a subpar product.

[@brandonpurdy7658]

@@SvPVids Why buy DJI goggles now when they are coming out with a V3 and a new vtx. As hard as it might be, you just need to sit tight and see how everything plays out.

[@kurtzFPV]

@@brandonpurdy7658 I'd wait too if I wasn't already dji, but I'm excited to see what fpvwtf can do with v1 and v2. For all we know right now, v3 might also have remote ID built in.

[@Tonkabollocks]

@@brandonpurdy7658 I am in the market and want to know more: is that an opinion based in Darwin's Theory of Evolution or a fact based on inside information? (ETA/spec?)

[@miquelmarti6537]

@@Tonkabollocks he just said he'd rather wait for the contenders to fight before making a decission, meaning it's still not a good time to buy. Makes sense to you? I personally would wait for HDZero to smash all of them, or if I couldn't wait I'd go for a pair of used DJI v1/v2.

[@Dartheomus]

You won the internet when you brought out the spread sheets. I love it! :)

[@stanbasov42]

Absolutely love the new googles! They will save me a ton of money on acid - the DVR is so similar to the trip its gorgeous

[@calisti9308]

lol

[@r3beatty]

$700 buys a LOT of acid.

[@ididfilmit7097]

Very thorough and unbiased review. I wouldn't expect anything less from JB. For me, the general rule of thumb is that if something is working just fine, you don't need to change it just because a new product is available unless the new product or service is revolutionary which in this case it is not.

[@klimeck95]

That compression works 😀 If you move faster, you need to send more data, but you still have the same bandwidth defined as bitrate. I think DJI and HDZero can sleep well because this system brings nothing new to FPV.

[@jakeh3144]

Does HDZero even hold a candle to DJI or even these new Walksnail/FatShark HD goggles? All the videos I've seen of HDZero are unimpressive and have similar penetration to my analog FPV. People are hyping over goggles that don't even exist yet. I don't understand how HDZero is even in the same sentence as DJI when it comes to comparing the two.

[@anthonyfpvminiquad1728]

In fact does it worse. I thought I hated dji 25mbs lol....this is so bad that most of the time it's less that standard definition considering the textures are just water color and even cinewhoop speeds seem to take this system out of its ability to handle the bitrate. Can only imagine how bad 1080p behaves

[@richmiller540]

@@jakeh3144 HDzero is worth it for racing due to the fixed latency. In fact DJI isn't permitted at races (in the UK at least)

[@mikehundley1]

​@@jakeh3144 I've been using HdZero/sharkbyte for a little over 3 months now. Even with the measly 200mw vtx I am seeing much better penetration than my 800mw analog setup. Haven't tested long range, just freestyle but flying behind thick trees and brush I do get a lot less breakup than I did with analog. I think the dual patch antennas help. The 720p image resolution is a definite upgrade from analog and it has the ability to display more colors so the image looks more natural overall instead of being overly saturated with red and green colors. DJI still outperforms HDZERO with non LOS flying but it does come with the trade off of varying latency wich can be disorienting when doing close proximity flying. I think it's all personal preference at this point but for me, I'll stick with HDZero

[@creationlabsinc.189]

@@mikehundley1 get out of here with the “latency” bs. Top pilots like Vanover don’t sit on the latency cock like most of the no-namers in the comments that crap on Dji because they feel this massive massive delay. Bs… in a blind test I bet it’s only in your mind you feel 20ms of latency. Y’all must be androids to feel 20/1000 of a second. Give me a break…

[@mopatop3921]

In the segment around 26:30 in the onboard footage I am seeing really bad frame pacing and stuttering. Did you see that as well or is it some artefact of editing or even my computer?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

No that's what the goggles were doing.

[@mopatop3921]

@@JoshuaBardwell Thanks. Ooof.

[@duavelittleford1447]

Great vid as usual. I have gone down the HDzero route and to be honest I`m glad I have. I just think carl will get this system to the point where we will have 1080 res with lower latency than the competition.

[@creationlabsinc.189]

Not before something else comes along like Dji v3’s. I’m betting they’ll make hdzero go back to the drawing board for all you latency cock riders

[@arniebmx]

I'm sure he will, with enough breakup to make analog look like a good idea again. xD

[@cornholio514]

@@arniebmx You obviously have never tried HDzero lmao

[@arniebmx]

@@cornholio514 why would I need to try it? I've seen the footage and just like this walksnail stuff....not impressed.

[@seanconnolly2179]

@@arniebmx I don’t like the break up ether but if he can fix that it’ll be perfect

[@johnnydepp4114]

cheers... i have the v1 og dji and was really happy when they got the 50mbit update... it made a big difference in the clearity close to the ground... i think i will be waiting for v3 from dji...

[@N3xTw1tN3eS]

Besides JB's great review of the product he received; I must say this looks disappointing. This looks very similar to the tech we already have with the addition of shady business practices, weak communication, and a higher price. I'll skip and wait for the HDZero set to release then reevaluate.

[@Pintosonic]

Well, considering it’s an early version of the firmware, I’d say that it has potential even if it’s not yet on par with the DJI system. Since I’m already on DJI, I’m going to wait because I don’t really like the ground texture smearing and they have work to do to tune their compression algorithm.

[@ivanluhi]

I guess I'll keep waiting for HDZERO...

[@pivoglotik]

That branch flick perfectly synced with music - amazing!

[@brettrichard78]

Kinda feel bad for the people who preordered. In my eyes it looks like they rushed this product out and probably shot themselves in the foot doing so.

[@hallio111]

yes. I was also looking to get one of the new Digital goggles, DJI V3 or mayyybe the fatshark.. but the fatsharks just blur out the most important areas, flying close to water? nopee... glad I bought the mini3 instead of a digital system right now... I'll wait and continue to use analog, until DJi packs out the next HAMMER:) lol... the way this is happening is also death for any company... their system seems worse than DJI v1/2 and shortly after this one the DJI v3 will come out... everyone with a brain, and that isn't already in the digital game, will wait until the V3 is released. then either buy the V2 or just the newest and smoothest shit... which will probably be DJI.

[@austntexan]

@@hallio111 Fatshark has already been sold to a holding company. There's almost zero chance this isn't DJI up to some shifty method to sell more units. This is the problem in buying from DJI. They really should make the VTX common to both units, but you know they won't do that. They'll milk the DJI fans as long as they can, while simultaneously blunting the capabilities of the "Fatshark" line. . . then at some point they will kill the DJI line, and move everything over to "Fatshark". Current "Fatshark" owners will get the FW update that clears up the video and gives them better reception, but all of the DJI owners will have gear incompatible with wokeSnail VTX. . . so they will be forced to upgrade to the new "Fatshark" line.

[@brendand.2269]

DJI for the win!!!! Lol. Nice review Jb! Thanks for giving them a fair shake but I think we all know……… DJI will never be second to anyone

[@JohnCuppi]

As someone who is already invested in DJI FPV System and HDzero, this system is not going to succeed as it stands today. Unless DJI and Caddx decide to just totally drop support overnight, causing a catastrophic choke-hold on being able to obtain parts to keep flying, then I don't see a reason to adopt it. Not convinced to buy into these at this time.

[@hateforall4012]

Nail on the head.

[@GrrillaFinger]

Scallop on the noodle

[@austntexan]

It's a scam. Both companies are DJI. My guess is they'll milk the DJI owners and keep the capabilities of the Fatshark brand blunted for now. Eventually, they'll drop support for the DJI goggles, then release a FW updated that clears up the video on the Fatshark/wokeSnail setup. Eventually the DJI owners will migrate over to Fatshark, so they'll get another sale to the former DJI FPV customer. Fatshark will become their DIY line, and DJI will be the videographer line again. There's not enough money for them in real FPV. All the money is in selling Mavics for them. They're a vicious company.

[@GrrillaFinger]

@@austntexan filthy trollops getting their soy sauce soaked fingers in everybody's pocket.

[@JoeWayne84]

@@austntexan DJI makes a lot of for commercial drone the agricultural drones,search and rescue/Law enforcement/ non destructive testing/engineering/ id be willing to bet they make more money in that side of the industry than the consumer camera drone market. Till DJI was selling the Magic’s I’d assume they lost money on consumer drones and now with the Air 3 little bitty video drones they are selling for a $1,000.00 haha that’s there big money makers they or selling a 250 gram drone for $1,000.00 haha although they are the best at what they do. I can’t say shit I’ve had a phantom 4 for years now and got a Air2 couple years ago it seems like . I’ve never got into analog fpv drones myself I would like to but since DJI has release there fpv setup it’s almost a shame to not just cough up the $1,000 and get DJI all the analog is just as much money to get a good datshark setup

[@muchthump]

I am in need of a new set of goggles! Was excited to be able to jump on the fatshark train as I loved my old and now passed along HDO's. After watching this video, I think I am definitely ready to buy... some DJI goggles.

[@muchthump]

so now that the v3's are on their way, does this mean I should wait even longer and either get those, or buy someone's used v2s?

[@juliannojungle]

5:10 professionally using rubber band to keep my professional expensive equipment together! 🤣🤣🤣

[@mouseFPV]

@joshua badrwell can you tell us if it uses the SAME mipi as dji or not? if not, buying a cable may become a PITA with hdz, walksnail, and DJI all using their own cables..

[@davidrgilson]

Carrying on with analogue for now and if I switch I'd go with HDZero just because Karl is doing things right.

[@gutrali]

HAve you flown/seen DJI with your own eyes? I am a convert from analog forever. I havent sold my fatsharks but I have upgraded every single quad to DJI. I'm spoiled and cant go back now. You have to try it !

[@davidrgilson]

@@gutrali I've seen DJI, it certainly looks great, but that's not the only consideration. Apple makes nice phones, but I certainly wouldn't buy into their ecosystem, and I feel the same about DJI. As I say, Karl from HDZero is doing things right, and he's who I would vote for with my wallet.

[@brennerfineart]

Thank you for this detailed test :-))) For now...I definitely will stick with my DJI system...no real reason for me to switch as I do not really see any real substantial advantage over the DJI system.

[@1nobillyno]

No AV in also means no more goggles for the simulator.

[@marcosx86]

35:15 yeah now you said everything. more details means more cpu effort to compress it and depending on the compression parameters, some details are trashed to save milis on latency

[@trebor1477]

Im glad that i bought DJI V2 last week for 450€ and air unit for 168€. Now i get analag mod for my old analog kids :D

[@Indpendent01]

29:20 reminds me of old school MD-DOS Microsoft Flight Simulator where the ground was just one color and if you were too close to the ground, it would be really difficult to discern an elevation change

[@wodifpv644]

See in both yours and Mr Steels videos that it basically has this circle in the middle that stays some what clear and anything outside that circle it looks blurry or smeared or foggy

[@JoshuaBardwell]

That's focus mod but I turned it off.

[@wodifpv644]

@@JoshuaBardwell oh ok 👍

[@sendorm]

The avatar looks like the Caddx Nebula Nano V2 for dji. Which were fixed after a year, now the nebula pro's are on par with dji. DJI cameras coming a little bit better. Avatar has some work to compare with dji.

[@DjAD0NIS]

Josh killed it with this video, Great work!

[@eatyourvegfpv]

Those opening shots look HORRIBLE!!! 😱😱😱

[@pacificnorthwestpilots6050]

It's so cloudy

[@Xailow]

It kinda looks like there's fingerprints on the lense or oil or something

[@eatyourvegfpv]

@@Xailow I'm talking about the compression blocking and smearing.

[@brandonwoodford579]

Ok, at least I wasn't the only one thinking exactly the same thing there.

[@shadowstoner420420]

Thought that as well, thought there's no way jb left a finger smudge on the lens. But danm that's cloudy

[@FormerlyDavid]

I think you're exactly the right person to ask about this: I recently bought a DJI Mini Pro 3. It has the remote with the screen. Can I add FPV to it? Keep the remote, add the goggles. I'm new to all this, and I'm not sure how all the building blocks go together.

[@JoshuaBardwell]

I'm not sure what goggles do or don't bind to the Mini Pro 3. It would be some set of DJI goggles though

[@lunatic20001]

Maybe we should call it Fatsnail? Or does Walkshark sound better?

[@inhisimagefpv7826]

Great job JB! Not buying it to many questions still and as the old saying goes "if it ain't broke don't fix it!" Sticking with DJI.

[@squaddingquads]

"what your seeing is exacly what I see inside my goggles " so we don't have an osd let alone canvass then? The rota riot video had no osd either

[@JoshuaBardwell]

The DVR doesn't record the OSD but it is there in the goggles.

[@Fredd32]

Is the vtx plug and play with the existing flight controllers that support plug and play with DJI?

[@dana2750]

Just watched the HDzero freestyle video and besides the breakup the HDzero looks a lot clearer than the Fatshark system here.

[@honeybeedrones5510]

I am glad I have DJI and I will be staying with them for awhile there is alot going for the Fatshark still a wait and see for me as far as V3 and HD zero great reviews JB

[@KellDogg1965]

I’m sticking with my current set up of analog for whoops and DJI for everything else! I’m not going to invest in digital that looks worse for the same $$$$$$&$$$$$

[@samtarariverasanchez59]

So question they both were at 700mw . How about the max output for both and retest? Or is it not an issue asking as a noob! I have dji but walksnail has been calling my name

[@lstavenhagen]

As I posted on Ian's channel, the main headwinds for this system will be the inevitable available-for-3-days-then-out-of-stock-for-half-a-year problem, and then of course the firmware issues, including what hasn't been found yet. Nobody is immune to those, so it is what it is and we're all just going to have to wait the unavoidable waiting period. By then DJI may have something better, or HD0 may have done some of the needed repairs on their system, etc. So I'll revisit this probably around Christmas, when/if it's finally available in volume and there's some field testing from the early beta testers who got the first batch in the first few days before supply dried up. Looks like a decent 1.0 release, but it has a ways to go yet before it can replace my DJI stuff for the same money if not more. Looks like a lot of potential though...

[@DirtyCrossBalisong]

Great review Joshua! I feel this is one of the more honest reviews about the new system. Others forget or leave some disadvantages out on purpose. I just watched the video from RotorRiot before, and yeah I get it they need the hype to sell stuff, but saying "Oh wow I get double the range" and "If I can fly trough this tire then it's better than DJI" isn't in any way honest or scientific. Because they also don't show the settings etc. But in your video I can compare for myself the images from Walksnail and DJI, and you also speak about the smear in the footage. So thanks for that! As a DJI-user I don't think I will switch, since IMO there are more disadvantages than advantages. Also the new DJI V3 will come out sooner or later....so what if they are far better and maybe cheaper than this system? Will this system die before it's on the market?

[@gilowens5785]

How on earth did the 5s thing slip through?? Geeez!

[@NatureOne82]

As dji goggles consumer I love the feature of having my glasses underneath and not to always having to put them away !

[@jmcjmc5587]

Yes it's a big advantage.

[@timlong7289]

My impression is that it looks like the lens is dirty and needs cleaning. I think its because they're using H.265 encoding. I get similar smearing when I write output from GyroFlow in H.265 format. Obviously they need that for higher compression but if you get higher bitrate at the expense of lossy compression then I'm not sure that's a smart choice.

[@nicknick8148]

H.265 has exact same quality at h.264.

[@lskjf02jlkdfj]

Can you confirm if this will be suitabe for MultiGP? I heard "bi-directional." Does this mean that similar to DJI, it may not be well tolerated due to proximity interference with other pilots?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

That's correct. Causes interference same as DJI.

[@MCsCreations]

Well... To be honest, it's not bad. It's definitely not as good as DJI, even in the beginning of the DJI system. BUT I think the issue is the camera. This camera looks as bed as the earlier Nebula versions. But we shall see what they can do. Anyway, thanks for the review, Joshua! 😊 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

[@rcrdps8144]

Exactly my initial thoughts. Looks like Nebula Nano v1/2. It's all in the camera. SharkByte and HDZero suffer the same fate,....though HDZero cams are improving. In the case of DJI and this system, a fuzzy camera makes the compression look worse. Trash in, garbled trash out.

[@MCsCreations]

@@rcrdps8144 Exactly.

[@ArcheantusFPV]

Yes, there is so much chromatic aberration in the lens that this camera appears foggy. This has nothing to do with compression. Most likely this is using a cheap lens. It badly needs a quality glass lens.

[@MCsCreations]

@@ArcheantusFPV Sure, but I'm not sure it would be enough...

[@rcrdps8144]

@@ArcheantusFPV With DJI, I find that anything that lowers image quality, the compression then "blanks" that section. This happens a lot in lower light and shadows. Once it reaches a low enough resolution, the compression seems to say "this area doesn't matter", and it goes blocky more so than what the condition calls for.

[@CarlPaulsen]

33:30 I wonder if there's a reason FPV cameras always seem to show more of the left prop. It's the same with HDZero...

[@tubsucks]

left bias I think they have called it. yeah its very common

[@kenb6565]

Glad I picked up backup dji goggles and vistas. Looking forward to HD zero for whoops and micros. The goggle size is just not a big problem for me and canvas mode (while nice), is also not a biggie. Fatshart seems to have really pooped the bed on this....no analog in is a weird oversight. The price?! This whole system makes no sense in todays market.

[@brendand.2269]

You should build an A75 with a naked vista and a nebula pro nano. You will be pleasantly surprised how small it is and light for an HD

[@gregdavidd]

How does the DJI Smart Controller work with DJI goggles as he mentions at 3:45?

[@seewell8168]

I would argue that FatShark is on the fringes of FPV these days. They and Rotor Riot have made their own little bubble that seems unaware of what any other companies or pilots are doing outside of that little bubble.

[@sefferrr]

literally LMAO you hit that nail on the head, i understand liking what sponsors help you out with its literally your job but whyy continue to use outdated tech that they say is new but really its just some extra settings they crammed into a goggle in a hobby/sport that could be growing but people keep wanting old stuff so honestly i dont see crazy tech out brakes in this hobby for awhile, if we had more people wanting digital we would have HD on every toothpick by now.

[@SvPVids]

I wish Fatshark didnt stay with the same base model for years with little to no improvement. The way the CEO takes criticism for his product is disappointing. It would seem that Walksnail did all the heavy lifting and fatshark just slapped the logo on the side.

[@HalfwayAerial]

What are you going to start flying Josh? Sticking with DJI or have these goggles made you think about switching

[@camomaster6316]

I love my DJI setup and I was seriously considering these just to have a smaller fat shark style goggle, but after this video it's going to be a no for me. Sticking with my DJI set up. But great review as always JB!

[@KOrnhOliO1]

Agreed! 😎🤘

[@mouseFPV]

21:40 FPVCycle frames tend to have 25mm mounting available. it would be cool if it was both 20x20 and 25x25 like a vista...

[@travis.stevens]

Better than DJI? No. Glad the Dominator HD is out, but I'll be sticking to DJI.

[@user-yk1cw8im4h]

good. one less people fight for the hdzero ones.

[@erictrexel2503]

I am in the market for new goggles and I have only analog systems currently. I was waiting to see what these goggles had and am disappointed. I was hoping for some form of input to accommodate the analog systems I currently have and will probably continue to have. I guess I will have to wait and see if DJI releases a new model.

[@mouseFPV]

"Fatshark pedigree". Maybe you old heads have a rosier picture, but as someone who has been in the hobby for 2 years, fatshark sucks. they ignore their customers as much as dji but dont have the weight to get real things done. They made the HDO2 and just sat on it and ignored everyone for years. They left HDz out to dry. They left HDz users out to dry. they left analog pilots out to dry by not including a module bay on these. They sold out to RC. Fatshark can kick rocks. even here, they designed a shell for someone elses system, cool.

[@evandoughty3359]

Hows that analogue module working on your DJI goggle?

[@mouseFPV]

@@evandoughty3359 it works amazing! I'm using the foxeer wildfire And it works awesome for my toothpicks and whoops, 60fps DVR is epic awesome as well. Edit: wait was your comment facetious? Because the DJI system has A/V in which allows for an analog module if you didn't know...

[@QSpeedRacer]

Wonder if they will make a whoop board. Looks like I'll still need hdzero Guessing 1080p trying to run 25mbps or less going to be more blurry/blocky at times I'm not a DJI fan boy. & I really like the idea supporting fpv company that will support us. We never got canvas mode from dji which would been easy for them to do.

[@KaizerTest]

Im going to wait for HDzero to become more refined over the next few years and the next system I invest in will be that. For now I have DJI and analog with a Ratel 2. Which the Ratel 2 or a high end Foxeer camera look pretty damn good still. I hope they keep making better analog cameras.

[@trekporter365]

Looks like in your range test the connection died for both the DJI and the FatShark right next to the EV chargers. Wonder if the chargers make noise that caused the problem.

[@Jingleboy14]

Nice review, Joshua! Wee bit of feedback - the music sort of drowns out your voice over at points, especially at 28:00 onwards

[@ddegn]

I agree on all points.

[@jackhodges6610]

Thank you very much for this video I have been grounded for about a year since my current FS dom3 goggles brightness button died and I can't find a replacement part. I have been torn between the FS hd system and the dji. You made a point that made my mind up and that is the fact that FS(fat shark) is all in for FPV. Also some positive changes are already here (3 months later)

[@1967friend]

I was poised and eager to slap that pre order button the second this new Fat Shark system became available. But my opinion has shifted quite dramatically in the last month watching it all play out. For starters we must never forget Fat Sharks ability to release a product, then drop it and completely forget it ever existed. Next up is how shrouded with mystery they have kept this release. The lack of any external input or ability to run outside modules. No Analog ever 👎🏻. The performance appears to be mediocre. And by all appearances it really is DJI hardware that has been nerfed. Way too many specs being identical. And the claims of superior performance that you’ve just proven to be outright false.

[@mikaelbackstrom]

Thanx for the review JB. The system looks promising, but not ready. I get a bit of a flashback to when Fatshark was releasing Shark Byte... Great that it is released, more options and possibilities... I personally think I might explore HD Zero next "season", inless DJI comes out with something that blows our minds (such as a working BF OSD :O).

[@vedasticks]

same here, hdzeros image imo iis far better.

[@JekleFPV]

Two minutes in, very underwhelmed so far. If this keeps up, penetration might the only thing going for it relative to my current digital setup (take a guess which one)

[@NilssonFPV]

What penetration improvment? the iFlight antenna has been really lacking on my setup versus a my x2 airs. Not using the same antenna on rangetests invalidates them, and really the receiver should be mounted in the same position, (sorry Joshua, but you should know that by now ;) ).

[@Itsdarts]

The camera reminds me of the Caddx Nano v2, slightly foggy. Not as bad as the Nano v1, but still foggy. Certainly better than HD Zero but for me, not compelling enough for me to switch from the 12 dji/Caddx quads in my fleet. I do admit I like the smaller size of the goggles, but I’m curious what the actual weight comparison is between it and dji. During this writing, the Rotor Riot review came on. Did you have the WS nano camera? The RR review seemed to have clearer video, more like DJI air unit and the larger WS camera.

[@madfpv3154]

Just started the video and the quality looks miserable compared to dji

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Keep in mind it's only supporting 25 Mbps today, but 50 Mbps is coming. I had to remind myself how DJI looked at 25 Mbps to calibrate.

[@testpilotian3188]

@@JoshuaBardwell the sky looks a bit blown out which only happens on the cheaper DJI compatible cameras, other than that I can’t see much difference, to me if I didn’t know better, I’d say you were flying a vista with a crappy polar camera.

[@philipp8803]

@@JoshuaBardwell fair enough. DJI v2 50 Mbps looks so much better though, at this point i would not switch it for anything else

[@madfpv3154]

@@JoshuaBardwell I still feel.both systems at 25mbps the dji still looks better imo

[@anthonypocock]

The answer is.... The same as DJI mode, except that feature isn't available in these goggles yet.

[@mxracingunlimitedltd7784]

Awesome comparison Video! Seems like the electric Tesla Car Chargers caused the signal to shoot down really quick. might have some interference going on there adding to the already weak signal..

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Product links are in the video description if you decide to pick this up. Clicking those links before you make a purchase is an easy way to support me and doesn't cost you anything!

[@DavidVogt]

Was the lens dirty? That looks like a camera issue, not a video transmission issue.

[@trebor1477]

RIP Fatshark 😢 once best of the best and now 😭

[@attackfpv]

Is it a plastic lense? It kind of resembles early hdzero cam haze. I may be wrong but just seems kinda smudgy. Res is great though! I'm onboard. Well see how they roll out the updates.

[@vinny5203]

gonna have to wait and see how this pans out. so far its a solid, meh. not paying a premium to be a beta tester when there is a solid tested system out.

[@mikespeedyfpv321]

Hi Great review I am sticking with DJI V2 they get the job done

[@zorianfpv]

I Appreciate you acting like a journalist on all of your reviews. 👍

[@drunkskunk00]

So are these using RHCP or LHCP antenna?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

LHCP

[@drunkskunk00]

@@JoshuaBardwell Awesome, thank you. I got my goggle notice today, and then realized i'd have no antennas. got some ordered now!

[@maro0016]

One remark: DJI was running at 120fps and fat shark at 60 fps. Anyway the fat shark googles will provide only 90fps max while DJI is able to provide real 120fps

[@cornholio514]

But what´s the big deal if HD0 with 60 FPS feels smoother / has less latency than DJI at 120FPS (analog with ~25-30 "full" fps as well)?

[@maro0016]

@@cornholio514 I would say hd0 has lower latency than both other systems. The latency is also all the time the same (perfect for racing). DJI seems to be a little bit better than the Avatar system & is cheaper.

[@maro0016]

@@cornholio514 Ah and just a remark: HD0 is a different system than the Avatar HD or DJI

[@tk-maker]

How about the camera low light performance?

[@richmiller540]

It's fantastic that there's another HD system on the market if I didn't have DJI I'd definitely consider the fatshark but it's not better than DJI so I don't feel the need to switch over YET. But it is super exciting for the hobby in general.

[@skydogfpv]

I'm in the same boat. I'd much rather support a true FPV company in fatshark but I live by the code "if it ain't broke don't fix" and to change a vtx fleet of 7 tools is a dramatic change and not one I'm willing to make for the couple benefits of oled and full bf OSD support.

[@grim-upnorth]

There's no YET for me. I'm on DJI V2 and by the looks of it, it could take upwards of a year to get this system even barely on-par with what DJI V2 offers in terms of performance. The ONLY thing that would push sane people over to these from DJI V2 is if caddx/DJI stopped making the air units and people had literally no choice. Who knows, maybe that's what Fatshark/Avatar are banking on.

[@richmiller540]

@@grim-upnorth well DJI has already stopped making the goggles so it's only a matter of time before the Vista's are discontinued. But we suspect DJI are making a new version. I will run whatever is best. HDzero, DJI or Walksnail.

[@grim-upnorth]

@@richmiller540 I fear you might indeed be right. The number of air units and vistas I already own will probably last me a good few years (swapping between aircraft as I decomission old ones and buy new) so if that's the case at least I don't have to rush in to buying this particular Fatshark system. perhaps in a few years time, fatshark might bring their own V2 to the market.

[@richmiller540]

@@grim-upnorth I don't think it's going to need a V2 the Walksnail system has got a lot going for it, the goggles look much better and surely must be infinitely more comfortable, the latency looks like it's more stable. I think a couple of software updates will do it.

[@rodrigoborgneth]

Man, you really helps the community, thanks for the excellent review.

[@Krunked]

is that a giant grease stain on your shirt? haha -- great content joshua

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Hahaha no it was wet bc I was just doing something in the pool but I thought it had dried out.

[@EvaTheDivarobloxplays]

It’s sweat from a hard working man! Lol ✌🏼

[@nathanmaxwell187]

Mr Steele had the same low quality ground pixilation on 1200mw power

[@hapsti]

analog will never die

[@DroneSkinz]

Another awesome review JB. I'm glad that you mentioned smearing on the lens cause I kept saying to myself, "wow JB you didn't wipe the lens dude!" I appreciate this video very much sir! Great job!

[@andriroyantara]

Where is 1200mw hacks ? Or am I not watching seriously, you said that you will tell how to do it 04:40

[@Humpero]

I think the additional latency you get on the fatshark model is the display response time, fatshark might be measuring only the time to receive the frame not to also display it. (My theory)

[@phiveone]

So...did a Snail Walk across the camera lens? This looks really bad.

[@stevejakab]

Whrn you disarmed, didn’t the vtx go into low power mode, and that’s why you lost vtx transmission?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

No I turned that off but good question.