Bowling Release | Axis Tilt | WHAT IS IT?

[@jasonsmith3537]

Something else I learned here.....I need a new pro-shop. They have never taken me out on the lanes or ever even asked me any of these important questions. Yet, the pro there tries to sell me the balls in stock by telling me I "need that one right there" and then telling me "you don't need it" for any ball I ask about he DOESN'T have in stock. He thinks bc I have the "freebie" plastic ball from league join that, I am not worthy of spending time helping me find a new permanent ball...despite having bowled a good average of 171 through 24 weeks of league. I do know my rev rate and PAP (thanks to your videos) ...and plan to get my axis numbers tomorrow. You guys rock and thanks!!

[@nordattack]

Thank you for the nod to Classic Full Rollers. There are still some of us old timers out here! As a Classic Full Roller I have zero tilt and a 90 degree axis rotation.

[@chrisbenner92]

Mo Pinel used to say you could cange tilt with your pitches. Thank you for putting out some of the best bowling videos I've seen on KZbin btw! Awesome stuff

[@jrproshop]

Yea you can change the tilt degrees by a few points with the span/ pitch adjustments

[@StephRenee812]

​@jrproshop could you put a video out on span/pitch ratios etc. Not many videos on pitches mo pinel has a few on radical bowling channel.

[@clowny2396]

Good lessons. I have high tilt, almost spinner. Been working to get it lower. Got the wrist restrictor which helped force me from coming over top of the ball. I'm actually getting the ball to get into a halfway decent roll. Ball reaction has improved. Haven't measured the tilt.

[@joshrutkowski8097]

I just got a rst-x1 drilled and figured out that I actually have -3 degrees of axis tilt. I have no clue how I am doing it but I love where my game is at so I’m not too worried about it. Love the vids guys.

[@dijigo1587]

First class content as usual chaps. Hope the word gets out more. You deserve WAAAAAY more subs!

[@jrproshop]

Thanks DijiGo!

[@byronfranek2706]

Very nice demonstration of axis tilt. Maybe the best I've seen on youtube. I calculate axis tilt using the Armadillo, since the ribs are marked in inches, and I need to use it to find the PAP anyway. For example, if the PAP measures 8" from the first oil ring, I can calculate in my head that the initial track is 11" in diameter, which equals 17 degrees of axis tilt.

[@miguelrmzp]

Sooo yeahh... I have the suckiest highest axis tilt ever... I spin the ball like a badass af Beyblade!!! hahahahah Thats why my PSO suggested my arsenal should be 4 Asymmetrical balls, 1 Symmetrical and my spare ball. Congrats on the channel all the way from Mexico, you guys make the best bowling videos!

[@jrproshop]

Haha thanks Miguel !!

[@runnerboy6886]

Tilt also effects your entry angle. Notice how on lower degrees of axis tilt, the ball is picking up and reading the friction earlier than the higher degrees. I myself am on the higher side and have problems stabilizing the pocket due to the higher entry angle. All this to say, lower axis= more control of the pocket=more striking

[@jonathangarland8853]

I work with Mo pinel at one point and he measured me at 3 degrees of tilt. I tend to hit my thumb on all my bowling balls so I have to avoid throwing pin down weak equipment

[@christucker2980]

Love this!!!! Keep up the good work guys, great content.

[@alexanderbreen4010]

I’m a full roller! 0 axis tilt and high axis of rotation… just got my layout fixed and ball motion is a lot better

[@ycombine1053]

This was really well done. I still find it hard to visualize the difference between axis tilt and rotation though. A 3D visual would be helpful.

[@exesemas]

You find difficulty because it was not so well done. There are other videos on youtube that show it better. This video was better for ball selection.

[@flippperboy]

If you know your PAP place a tape on it and watch it roll down. Tilt is vertical and axis rotation is horizontal. All this can be done with different hand positions. Have a coach watch and make sure you are doing it right.

[@hrsey71]

rotation is the PAP direction from side to side, axis tilt is the PAP direction up and down. for example, if the ball goes perfectly straight down the lane, thats rotation at 0 and axis tild at 0.

[@ninjawaver]

LOVE the vids and channel! Helps alot! I also like how yall do comparisons side by side...makes it a whole lot clearer!💯😎🤙🏿

[@aaronrose5118]

5° of tilt for me and 70° of axis rotation 420 rev rate is typical for me suggestions on layouts i find myself liking tropical surges motiv thrills etc for house shots pretty sure with those specs my ball wants to read early and hook hard. Great video guys

[@MrDreday510]

Honestly speaking about having my tilt calculated, solid nope. Always worked on increasing though only when needed ya know. If I can stay behind my ball I will but if I need to open the lanes I don’t have much choice but to give it more tilt to make the corner plus knock the 10. As always awesome vid guys, keep up the great work.

[@Bird_dog49]

I wish my local pro shop cared as much about its customers as you guys do. He will gladly take your money but if you ask about finding your stats like PAP or axis tilt he just says those numbers don’t mean anything unless your a pro or average over 220.

[@danielweisman6764]

Dude I just had a similar experience at place I league at and I was fckn pissed. I just averaged 179 and obviously want to get better . I wish I could find my tilt , rotation , rpm and pap :( Hard to find anyone willing to help and these apps suck.

[@kingshabazz1310]

That sucks. My pro shop does PAP for free.

[@deguzmansonny]

Truly love you guys and the videos you post! Keep it up! Hope to come visit your place in Canada one day!!!

[@nicholauscurphey3925]

There hasnt been one proshop that has ever given a crap about my axis tilt, even though I want to know what it is.

[@TheNulGamer]

Exactly what I needed .

[@BARBELLS-AND-BUDS]

So access tilt is based on how high your fingers are on the ball at release. A lower tilt means your hand is more under the ball and a higher tilt means your hand is more on the side or middle of the ball as it gets released?

[@dejabowler873]

Yep I have had my tilt measure it's 13 degrees

[@tonyharlin1997]

You guys are good …. Pro shops down here just sell you a ball and never check that stuff

[@jrcox4655]

Currently I have a Proton, Nova, Trail blazer, Highroad pearl, IQ but haven't gotten the last 2 yet

[@scorpion-ninja8228]

Good video JR PRO! Hey,any idea why Im struggling this early league season with release? I'm using the same balls as last year. I always keep the surfaces fresh, clean balls after 3 games, etc. I hardly ever, even on a bad shot, would have my track/oil rings go over my thumb hole and middle finger hole (right hander). This year its every single strike shot throw! I've tried staying elbow tucked inside more, hand postions, finger spread, tucked pinky finger, un-tucked pinky finger, etc. Clearly I'm doing something totally different than last season. 😞

[@mrcnx77]

My tilt is different between my strike shots and spares. I have around 3-5 degrees on my strike shots, but it’s around -5 degrees on spares

[@cemeterybowling6]

I’m a full roller. My axis tilt is pretty close to zero degrees (but not exactly zero). I’m drilled correctly thankfully my pro shop operators (there’s 2) noticed early on that I was a full roller.

[@StephRenee812]

My tilt is 20° and i have low rotation, 12 to 15 mph. What are some balls i should use. Dont have to be the newest.

[@jrcox4655]

What about a 2 finger bowler an Ideas

[@scottst33]

17" AT, 11" track diameter. PAP 4 7/8" over and 3/8" up.

[@iamasooner86]

It was probably covered in part 1 but I’m lazy today and was just curious where the tapes goes on the ball to measure hour tilt and rotation? It’s across your PAP, right?

[@jrproshop]

We just did middle of the span straight across

[@iamasooner86]

@@jrproshop Thanks!

[@flippperboy]

How about during transition when the heads start burning up. Do you move left to look for more oil or can you raise axis tilt if you notice your ball slowing down too early and the ball jumps off the spot or has nothing left down lane and leaves washouts. Thanks

[@jrproshop]

Yep you can do that although would say that's more difficult than just moving left

[@flippperboy]

@@jrproshop there is one problem for me. I have to learn to pay attention to the transition without the tape in real time. Being present is hard.

[@kristopherdetar4346]

Bowling recreationally for over 55 years all over the country. Not once had any bowling alley announce or provide what type of lane oil job is laid down in their ally. Nor had anyone ever offered to instruct novice bowlers the what and whys of throwing a ball. Before the internet the average person would never know enough about bowling to ask questions about the nuances of throwing a ball. We just know some people are better at it than others. Now it’s all out there on YT complete with acronyms that still require looking them up.

[@cramones88]

Can you find your tilt from your track or you gotta see the ball on the lanes?

[@jrproshop]

Yea that's how you get it from the first oil ring

[@troytrujillo8979]

So negative axis tilt would be when I rotate my hand to the right (right hander) and then pull dead left over the top? Is that what would cause my oil line to be off for example bottom left to top right (I would say the typical full roller illustration is bottom right to top left to through thumb and fingers)

[@jrproshop]

Yes that's kinda what Simoo does and he's at 0 so you're just a little more extreme than him

[@troytrujillo8979]

@@jrproshop so I understand how the change in axis tilt looks like but do i measure relative to directly behind me?

[@troytrujillo8979]

or is it the degree of tilt in just the fingers alone relative to the equator of the ball (if the equator was say between the finger holes and thumb hole)

[@tonyvines6417]

Hey guys, just found your content…awesome stuff. I have been bowling for nearly 50 years. In recent years I’ve suffered from a back injury which has caused me to quit while I healed. Now I’m trying to build rebuild my arsenal. I have two questions, I’m a full roller. How exactly does the pin impact of a full roller differ from that of a roller like Jung? I currently carry the Phantom Vintage (my go to), a Black Widow and a Web MB, My options are the IQ Tour Nano Pearl, the Roto Grip Rubicon, the Honey Badger Revival, the Fatal Venom, the Zenith, the Strata, the Intimidator Pearl and the Incognito. Thanks for your content and although it is 5 mos old, I hope you are able to answer. Thank you.

[@jrproshop]

First it depends if you roll over the thumb or between the thumb and fingers as a full roller. If you do your ball will need special layouts. Second are you asking what ball you should get next? Then it would be the iq pearl. As you don't have a symmetric pearl

[@tonyvines6417]

@@jrproshop I roll between the thumb and fingers. I was definitely looking at the IQ so thanks for your thoughts.

[@marqko7534]

26° one hander with the thumb in the ball

[@joehoenig7596]

My PSO feels that my high axis tilt of over 20 degrees, makes me speed-dominant, even tohugh my top ball speed is barely 14mph. LIke you suggest, he also put me into high-end, strong assym balls. My issue is this: when my high tilt causes increased skid and increase energy retention, even the strong assym cores and covers can lead to ringing 7's (I'm a lefty), or shots that cross over. Move left to kick out the 7, leads to a crossover or split. Move right to deal with the crossover, leads to a wide-open split0--if you are unlucky, and yet another 7--this time a weak/soft one, if you are lucky! It seems that typical lane play adjustments need to be rethought for the high tilt bowler. Could you please speak to that? Thank you, Joe

[@jrproshop]

Yes, high axis tilt makes the ball hook really late and smooth, so it’s about the layout to get the ball to turn the corner. You’ll need early and sharp layouts, such as 30x4x30. Also would suggest strong sym ball like a zen with a little surface on it 3000. Sometimes those big balls will be too smooth for someone with your axis tilt.

[@Dainslaif]

I don't think I could keep up with Jungo on the lanes, but I will absolutely dominate him in the Beyblade Arena.

[@gokool12]

My axis tilt is negative... I can't really find anything on negative axis tilt. My pap points toward the lane

[@ThreeTwoVictor]

I got made fun of for having a lot of axis tilt the other day. Whats funny, is I wasn't even trying to crank the ball either. Now I see why. Is there a pitch adjustment I can make to "force" my hand to stay up the back more on the release?

[@jrproshop]

Yep! You can try lengthening the span a little bit to start with

[@jeremypeterson3166]

ever since i switched to 2 handed this has been my achilles heel... I'm so close, if not, tracking over my middle finger. Been working with my pro shop a lot to get it off the middle, any recommendations? We rolled the pitches a bit, wondering if I should do more

[@jrproshop]

Jimoo was like that, we fixed it with pitch changes. If that doesn't work you'll have to be coached out of it

[@jeremypeterson3166]

@@jrproshop Any chance you could share his pitches here?

[@maxsanchez2339]

Are there high axis tilt players on the pro tour? Or is it something that holds people back?

[@jrproshop]

Yes there are high axis tilt. Doesn’t hold them back

[@hrsey71]

the PSO at my local bowling center said he couldnt measure my axis tilt, and he couldnt even measure my PAP. he said the oil rings didnt look right.. i think its because i have a really high axis tilt. and im a lefty

[@strikeking14]

For the high axis tilt, do you have a recommended layout to use for a high end asym ball? You mentioned something with high flare but would you have some kind of recommendation for the whole layout when the PAP is also really small....?

[@jrproshop]

35x4x35 for high tilt, you need strong early rolling layouts

[@strikeking14]

@@jrproshop Thanks!!!

[@saintsman77tw]

Any tips on increasing tilt as a 2 hander? I never had an issue but recently something in my release has changed and is causing the ball to track over my middle finger hole and I can’t figure out for the life of me what I’m doing differently than before. It’s not layout related as I’ve never had this issue before and it happens regardless of which ball I’m using. I know it’s hard without actually seeing my release but any general tips would be greatly appreciated!

[@jrproshop]

Good question. It is very difficult to manipulate axis tilt for any bowler. However, what has worked for Jimoo (two-hander) was noticing where your dominant hand is positioned inside the bowling ball before you start your approach. He noticed that his hand was slightly angled towards his pinky resulting in a full roller roll. Try your best to shift to the inside of the bowling ball all throughout your delivery and coming around at the release point.

[@saintsman77tw]

@@jrproshop thank you so much I will definitely give that a try. Keep up the good work guys. You all hands down make the best bowling content on KZbin.

[@saintsman77tw]

@@jrproshop I just want to say thank you. I took the advice you gave me and it worked like a charm. Cleared my problem up almost immediately! I’m so glad I found your channel.

[@wolfpackgaming8206]

full roller baby

[@judweber3338]

Any tips for changing tilt? I have a really high tilt and would like to fix that

[@jrproshop]

Tilt can be very difficult to manipulate. However, it can be changed slightly by making changes to your span and finger pitches. To lower your axis tilt, you’ll need to shorten the ring finger distance, and add more forward pitch (towards the thumb). This will help put more pressure on the ring finger on release, and help you roll the ball more end over end.

[@judweber3338]

@@jrproshop thanks maybe I can get a different drilling

[@chadmitchell5154]

PAP has always confused me. I get what it is, but wouldn’t PAP always be changing depending on the lanes your bowling on? Hand positioning changes frequently depending on lanes and pattern, so wouldn’t that change the PAP?

[@chrisstrong3748]

Yes, changing hand positions to get different tilt/rotation on the ball will change your PAP since you're changing how the core is positioned and how it is spinning off your hand at release. However, that's usually not much more than about 1/4' in any direction. Anything after it leaves your hand doesn't change your PAP. How you decide to throw it is what changes the PAP.

[@connorallen9711]

Your PAP wont be the exact same every time. It's just something you base off of so you can get your layouts drilled to be more exact to how you throw the ball.

[@chadmitchell5154]

Thanks for clarifying

[@earnestdbrow50]

My tilt is minus 4.78 how do I fix

[@ignacioestrada3223]

I like the beyblade reference

[@richardgee9434]

Ok I would have a high axis tilt I point at 6 and suitcase release but my knuckles are killing my finger

[@richardgee9434]

I would like to add a small video

[@richardgee9434]

My pro shop operator just said I am getting old he is through

[@jrproshop]

Knuckles are hurting while you bowl ?

[@rickdavis8410]

Doesn’t drill pattern affect tilt and rotation? Not sure what are accomplishing here.

[@jrproshop]

No it doesn’t. Drilling layout affects how the ball hooks. Tilt and rotation is how you roll it

[@shorty808100]

My natural axis tilt is 5 degrees

[@connorallen9711]

My tilt is like 10-15 degrees. If I really try, I can get about 30 degrees of tilt.

[@larryschlutt7211]

15 degree tilt

[@timwatson3192]

Had mine measured and it is 7⁰. Was told I need to try to increase it to 14⁰.

[@jrproshop]

Nah you're good at 7° just like Jungo!

[@timwatson3192]

@@jrproshop what is Jungos axis? I think that is what the factor between he and I. Oh and the fact that he is GOOOOOOD!

[@on1st]

So higher tilt players should get strong asymmetrical balls with strong layouts, and lower tilt should look at middle tier symmetrical balls? What about bowlers in the mid range?

[@jrproshop]

Correct. Bowlers in the middle can can use a little bit of everything assuming speed and rev rate match up

[@jimcurrie]

I prefer a ball for heavy oil. Most of my balls have a 20 degrees axis tilt

[@cadenhutchinson5750]

My axis rotation is 70 degrees but my axis tilt is 0 😭 I’m working on fixing that.

[@alex_thegamer5639]

My axis is 2

[@danielschank]

Have you noticed Axis Tilt and PAP changing on Urethane vs Reactive?

[@jrproshop]

Nope, as that first oil ring should be the same no matter what ball you throw

[@danielschank]

@@jrproshop I have a local PSO that says urethane is the best way to get a true PAP because reactive balls begin to flare off your hand and you may miss a ring or two of potential flare. He’s an engineer type guy.

[@jrproshop]

If you have an excessive amount of loft yes I agree otherwise the difference will be minuscule

[@gcb]

my axis tilt differs from ball to ball only arsenal is different

[@christopherwilson7004]

Im about 4 but 2 handed

[@brianhunley7704]

I’ve never had any of my attributes measured

[@ackpack8514]

2 degrees of axis tilt

[@paulcardinal2894]

20

[@zackpeebles2372]

Only the 2000's kids know abt beyblades

[@Deltavorce]

I’ve had 3 balls drilled and none of them took me to the lane to measure anything

[@Avery_The_Big_Belly_Dino]

My tilt is 19.8

[@tylerwill5250]

Tilt is 14 :)

[@tylerwill5250]

Makes since why i like longer patterns

[@matthewjspain9399]

No matter how i throw a flaring asymrtrical ball,it always ends up bow tieing in same spot.

[@RocafellaJiggaman]

LET IT RIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@Sproutt]

Lols I still have so me beyblades

[@MultiMogman]

stay safe I hear the virus is on the rise in BC