Judge Rules Home Distilling Ban Unconstitutional - Is Moonshine Legal Now?

[@rednecksniper4715]

The fact I can make homemade mead and beer through fermentation for personal use but I can’t make a distilled spirt for personal use is stupid and makes 0 sense

[@bjchadwick4261]

There is a lot more involved in making safe distilled spirits than in making beer and wines. Improperly distilled spirits can kill people.

[@mikenorby9470]

So the government is your daddy keeping you safe?

[@kirkstinson7316]

​@@bjchadwick4261 So? Home canning , if not done right, can kill people as well. Is that banned?

[@sirsteamtrain7913]

​@bjchadwick4261 so can rope

[@danielgodfrey4415]

​@bjchadwick4261 making non-liquor drinks is more unsafe. In my opinion. You have to be more sanitation crazy with beers

[@allswellinendwell6957]

Back before the income tax, taxes on spirits were a huge part of the excise tax they levied. Now I could take an acre of wheat, or apples, and sell it on the open market. But I couldn't transport it very far before trains, or if I didn't have a canal nearby. But I could turn it into whiskey or brandy and now it was a stable, transportable product, that was much higher value and therefore cheaper to transport. But spirits are a commodity. Once they are sold, it's hard to tell who made it, or where it came from. Plus, if I make it at home, I'm not buying it from anyone, and the government doesn't tax it. So you set up a system where the production is heavily controlled, and you have a much better chance of collecting that tax. You know exactly who can make it, and were it's coming from. The fed doesn't want people making spirits, because of money. Always was and always will be. Hell we had a Whiskey Rebellion it goes so far back.

[@canaan5337]

I think the convenience and quality of going to the liquor store would beat Home distillation. Unless you get really good at it to the point where you could compete with the stuff at the liquor store, but then you might as well just be a legit distiller who pays taxes.

[@mgreg8134]

They don't want you making spirits because most people don't know what they are doing. Even today homemade moonshine can cause blindness or death. Especially if you do not know how to distill spirits properly.

[@joewoodchuck3824]

You don't even necessarily need to ferment anything. You can distill commercial wine or beer if it's economical enough. One would need to research that point.

[@joewoodchuck3824]

​@@canaan5337You don't have to be very good at it for shine except for process skills. It's not aged or otherwise treated for flavor.

[@mgreg8134]

@@joewoodchuck3824 Anytime you are producing any kind of alcohol you are fermenting either grapes or other fruit or any kind of grain like wheat, barley or corn.

[@lazyplumber1616]

Rules to live by, "Don't tell, Don't Sell" I agree with everything you are saying. My spouse puts up with a lot of my crap but she wouldn't tattle on me.

[@iasimov5960]

So if private production of Alcohol and Tobacco is allowed as well as the private possession of Firearms, why do we need the ATF?

[@azartyn2906]

ATF was just neutered with the Chevron reversal.

[@matthewconnor5483]

We don't.

[@seananderson4746]

@@iasimov5960 to have somebody to blame because the government allowed them to do illegal things

[@RobertHamm-u7c]

@@iasimov5960 excellent question.

[@crosisofborg5524]

We don’t

[@Leslie-es5ij]

My Grandfather taught me how to make it, he made ends meet during the depression making it in his basement in small batches. Refined sugar was expensive, so he used maple syrup that ha made in the spring. I have his still, and another one I bought . Love making shine in the night !

[@got2kittys]

It should be like beer. Brew for home use, but not legal for sale to the public.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Exactly.

[@420frankp]

Thought that's the way it has been. You could always make your own but heaven forbid you sell any of it. Number 1... government ain't getting tax from it. Number 2... youd be held liable for making bad shine.

[@kevind7617]

1 or 2 of states say it's legal to distill.. but federal law says it's illegal

[@johnfaker8424]

Why? Besides the tax argument. Why? Fucking up enough to make dangerous liquor or beer is damn, damn hard. Have you ever brewed? Do you know methanol posioning from liquor or wine is a myth created during prohibition.

[@kevind7617]

@johnfaker8424 money is the reason.. & possibly worried some dumbass is gonna use the wrong materials for their still.. & or blow up their kids bedroom.. But really it's all about money..& control..and I've made lots of beer wine. And mead over the last 20 years I've got no problems with a making his own drink..& or smoke

[@azartyn2906]

this could also be due to the Chevron case being overturned. It takes the power from ATF and non congressional passed LAW.

[@luddite4change449]

The law was written at a time when the two major sources of income for the Federal Government import tariffs and the excise tax on alcohol. Additionally, the majority of people in the US at the time lived on farms, and the only way to save excess grain was to convert it to alcohol. Lastly, due to its transportability, alcohol was used as a substitute for currency across large swaths of the US. It is certainly a law that has outlived its usefulness, but I'm not certain that the ruling will hold up.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

True.

[@baronclime6423]

Steve Lehto gave a good breakdown on this one. He is a lawyer and explains legalese pretty well.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Watched it. Very good.

[@TimHall-y8s]

it was never about "shine" itself. it was about collecting taxes on alchol and income derived from the salws of "shine'

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Yes.

[@trikstari7687]

Governments primary motivation is stealing your money, always.

[@jasongarland3165]

I saw this story when it came out last week. It stems from a lawsuit filed by a Hobby Distillers Association member who got a letter from the TTB warning him that they had been notified about him buying distilling related equipment. The federal judge is actually in Fort Worth. The irony here is even if the guy beats the Feds on this, he's still got to beat the bass-ackwards TABC and waspy, alcohol averse Texas Legislature in order to distill legally in Texas. We have some archaic and strict laws regarding ethanol production here

[@jeremylastname873]

Technically, without a license, it is illegal to even own a still or device capable of distillation in Texas. So, don’t tell anyone that you have a pressure cooker, or even a pot with a lid. Hell, the outside of the glass of iced tea is a condenser. We’re ALL going to Huntsville now! 😂🎉

[@TinyHouseHomestead]

​@@jeremylastname873 I design and build stills, they aren't illegal for personal use! 😁👍👍🇺🇸

[@nerdaccount]

From North Dakota laws: 5-01-04. Manufacture of alcoholic beverages prohibited - Exceptions. A person may manufacture alcoholic beverages for personal or family use, and not for sale, without securing a license if the amount manufactured is within quantities allowed by the alcohol and tobacco tax and trade bureau of the United States treasury department. Of course the amount allowed by federal law is 0 for distilled spirits and 100 gallons a year per household adult for beer and wine. If they upped the amount, then the State laws would immediately support home distillers. (But I'm no lawyer!)

[@kubakielbasa5987]

so let's hope that they won't appeal(they have time until july 24th). If they don't - oops, the ruling is enforced(from what I read that's what I understand I'm no lawyer and never will be). Lawyers, correct me if I'm wrong.

[@airheadevfd]

Good to know from a fellow north dakotan. If it does uphold may have to upgrade some of my homebrewing to dabble into distilling.

[@nerdaccount]

​@@airheadevfd I've actually really wanted to make whiskey from chokecherries or June berries.

[@Shahalud]

Time to run a Sale on the website!

[@TimothyGray-qf2xo]

Thank you for that information. I myself, am a home distiller. I distill inside my house and don't advertise it. It's just a hobby for me, I still don't see how I'm breaking the law.

[@dekulruno]

It’s weird there’s been channels and sites promoting and instructing how to distill, stores which sell stills and equipment for home distilling… and that’s been happening for years with no issue.

[@ArmoryMedia]

"hypothetically..." ;-)

[@SteveRix78]

It's a really laxed law here in AZ. I've been at it for a couple of years, I told my wife about this ruling....her response, "wait, it's illegal?" Well, yea technically.....but it's more of a "don't be dumb" type thing.

[@DieselRamcharger]

its not illegal to home brew, its illegal to sell it.

[@SteveRix78]

@@DieselRamcharger We’re talking about distilling though. But, to your point, yea don’t be dumb and try to sell it.

[@DieselRamcharger]

@@SteveRix78 i looked it up, didnt even realize stills had to be registered. how fucking stupid. This govt is way outta control.

[@SteveRix78]

@@DieselRamcharger Couldn't agree more.....but, just don't be dumb about stuff and you'll be alright.

[@DieselRamcharger]

@@SteveRix78 i dont even drink so it doesnt really affect me either way. But it seems awful silly. Land of the free my butt.

[@exmcgee1647]

Mr Show and Lebowski are my favorites ! You've got good taste man !

[@StillFunBrewing]

I think some change is coming. But each state will need local support.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Agreed.

[@tommcfadden2226]

A batch of wine that doesn't meet your taste now can be turned into a base for brandy.

[@chilecayenne]

Have the Feds or other law/tax enforcement departments ever contacted Clawhammer Supply to get a list of who you have sold/shipped distilling equipment to....? Have they ever wanted to check your sales records? When you sell a unit...how does that usually show up on a CC card...what is listed for that sale? Thank you in advance!!

[@ClawhammerSupply]

This is one of the more interesting pieces of Clawhammer history. Funny enough, the TTB did ask (10+ years ago) when we were just getting started, only sold parts kits, and only had a handful of customers. We only sold copper still kits then, so we hired a lawyer and argued that we sold copper parts, not stills, and we didn't owe them anything. We spent a considerable amount of time and money fighting the request (outside of court). However, the TTB was actually only asking for info due to a state request by a local agency in Florida (again, the TTB does not seem to have the interest, time, or resources to enforce federal rules on home distilling themselves). Anyway, our months long argument delayed the process to the point that we essentially missed the window where they were asking for info. So they literally sent us a letter saying we had to provide info then another letter saying we no longer had to provide info a few days later... Ladies and gentlemen, The Federal Government.

[@DH-xw6jp]

​@@ClawhammerSupply I'm glad you stick up for your customers.

[@btrent9244]

Thank you for your synopsis of this important action.

[@sweetncool]

Ha! If the government really thinks they can stop people from making their own moonshine, they'd be wrong. I live in Texas and I know a person that knows a person that hooks up friends with their homemade moonshine. I tried it one time at a party a year ago and I was floating high. Afterwards I was told I was supposed to sip it slower. You live you learn 😁

[@sethrose9534]

We can make up to 100 gal a year in missouri but its exclusively for personal consumption

[@damunchman3120]

I can make beer wine and mead. I can even grow marijuana now (i live in Nevada)... But the fact it's illegal to distill makes no sense. I agree with everybody else. With the law talking about taxation, it should just be illegal to sell what you make, unless you have the proper license or whatever so they can get their cut and fulfill their greed.

[@raymondadkins6503]

The materials to build the still, water, corn and heat you have to pay taxes on. Then taxed again on the product????

[@andrewwilson6405]

The U.S.Constitution does NOT, anywhere within its text, grant the federal government the power to regulate the people in their personal and private activities; an inalienable right of liberty. The Constitution only grants the federal government power to regulate “Interstate commerce” and NOT “intrastate commerce”. Federal individualized taxation, despite that it was originally a forbidden act by the Constitution, until the governments unilaterally abrogated this forbidden act, in adoption of the 16th Amendment. The judgment, accordingly; is that a person who is NOT engaged in production, “for purpose of commerce”, may NOT be constitutionally restricted or provisionally authorized, by the federal government, to act or engage in individual private personal activities. Indeed the death of “Chevron deference”, a repugnant affronted usurpation of the Constitution and consequently of the people, is beginning to turn the tides of liberty back to the people. IMHO

[@tonysolar284]

Wait it's illegal to distill alcohol and grow weed? This is new to me.

[@Gr8fullyDeadHead]

420 legal here and I don’t drink alcohol

[@ryankoza7584]

@@Gr8fullyDeadHead distilling booze for rso tho

[@mirandahotspring4019]

Home distilling has been legal here (NZ) since October 1996. It was always legal to brew beer and wine and when the liquor laws were reviewed in 1996 'spirits" was added to the exemption for home brew that was for personal consumption only. It seems crazy you can brew beer legally, but can't distil it to make whiskey. Distilling doesn't make alcohol, it only purifies what you have already made by fermentation.

[@keithjurena9319]

Stove top distillation equipment has been sold by Amazon for years now. At first, it was sold as essential oil steam distillation equipment but now some have miniature thump kegs etc..

[@RobertJohnson-ud3bn]

Thank you very much for posting that, that's very informative. If I made something really cool and good and people wanted to buy it, I would probably be proud to pay taxes, no problem. From what I gather from this, is if I'm not going to sell it, it's just for my own purpose, in my opinion, I've already paid taxes in equipment, electric that I need to use, some ingredients are taxed, even bottles or jars are taxed. Not making any money my own stuff, but I'm spending it

[@ClawhammerSupply]

As someone who sells home distillation equipment, I can confirm that taxes are already being paid!!!

[@dougdorrer4622]

WV already passed their own law allowing home distillation up to 5 gals per year, per adult.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

True story!

[@chrisparker9886]

Hell yeah they did!😁

[@cmphighpower]

I have no idea why the feds are so against home distilling.

[@OVRCOME]

The hypocrisy between beer and spirits is staggering. If for no other reason that should make it legal. They are BOTH alcohol. Simply extracting the alcohol from the "beer" making it illegal is beyond ridiculous.

[@Handlethis342]

However spirits is flammable. Beer is usually somewhere between 3.2 and 18% ABV, or 6 to 36 proof. Most bourbon, whiskey and vodka are closer to 80 proof, or 40% ABV. But sometimes much higher than that. By definition, in the old days, a few drops of the spirit was put onto a small pile of gunpowder, and if it could be lit such that the gunpowder ignited, it was “proof”. As in, 100 proof, or 50% ABV. But exactly when a given spirit can be ignited depends a lot on temperature as well as ABV (note that wine, at ~18% alcohol, is easily used for a flaming effect when cooking). In fact, if the spirit is below 55F, it cannot be lit when at sea-level pressure.

[@burtmacklin6443]

But the taxes. Lol.

[@OVRCOME]

@@burtmacklin6443 Exactly, Wine and Beer….. turn your head and don’t worry about it…. Spirits…. OH MY. We have to get the taxes.

[@GeorgeWashingtonLaserMusket]

@@OVRCOME There's a decent amount of state taxes on wine and strong beers, usually it's 5% or so, some places 7%; then the tax goes way up.

[@themastermason1]

Because there's different forms of alcohol. We drink ethanol but methanol is also produced and is concentrated when you distill. A tiny amount of methanol can leave you blind or dead. Since common sense or even intelligence seems rare now, some idiot or malicious asshole is going to get someone poisoned. Fermentation can happen naturally if you leave fruit or honey out. Distillation requires energy input. Additionally, when distilling is rendered so cheap, an alcohol epidemic can happen as it did in England in the 1700's with the "Gin Craze" and quite a bit of Russia's history.

[@zer0tzer0]

It's funny, but we went to war with England over a tea tax. Then when they couldn't raise enough money, the government taxed spirits. The Whiskey Rebellion happened because of bad roads. It was incredibly difficult for farmers back then to get all that grain to market with a horse and wagon on dirt roads, especially given that at harvest time they were mud roads. However, if you took that grain and distilled it, it would be a much more manageable load. Fortunately, those same roads slowed Washington's army so much that by the time they got there everyone said, "What rebellion?", but George hanged a couple of people anyway which got people paying the tax again. I don't think they need more taxes to waste, but at least the roads are a bit better.

[@checkyoursixgaming]

Its a sound ruling. The government has the power to tax, but doesn't have the power to make up any law they want just because they can use the excuse of taxation. Which is why the general Welfare clause is horribly overbroad in giving power to the Federal Government. Glad Chevron Deference went away, but so should General Welfare and other overbroad power reinforcing interpretations of the government should go away as well. The government can say it is illegal for anyone to make their own cups because it that would prevent them from receiving taxes on cups that could be used to drink alcohol with. It's just broader and broader crap. The whole point of the Constitution is to put limits on the power of both State and Federal government. Laws that are written by Congress should also bear in mind the limitations for government as well.

[@aaronorland9242]

It’s good to live in Missouri

[@OutlawSpirits]

I believe this ruling can pave the way for legalization of Home distilling! We can only hope for the best!

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Agreed!

[@bobbyswanson8047]

Ya. This is crazy. I had no idea it was illegal good thing I didn’t order one…..dodged THAT bullet

[@glencooper1091]

If you live in the same household and rat someone out that makes you an accessory. LOL

[@Green.Country.Agroforestry]

The manufacture, possession, sale, transportation and consumption of spirits has always been Lawful .. there has only ever been interference in commerce from an organized criminal syndicate that desires to regulate trade for its own benefit and profit to make people believe otherwise.

[@MacBailey]

Here in SE Oho we have a legal local moonshine distiller, and there is even a "Moonshine Festival' every year. The only stories I have seen is where the person was trying to actually sell the home made stuff. One guy was trying to sell pints at a flea market, and another guy had tried to open a business but failed and was still selling some under the table. Selling is still a big red flag to get the 'revenuers' involved.

[@terrycarter1137]

Sounds like it's a step in the right direction

[@damiansullivan9728]

To be fair, we're taxed when we buy the equipment and other supplies to make said distilled spirits, all said and done

[@stlouisfan333]

A lot of states default to the federal stance so wouldn't having it overturned either grant reprieve or make it so each state had to vote on whether or not to keep the ban?

[@bob-rogers]

Meanwhile, here in South Carolina it's not only illegal to distill, it's illegal to own still parts. Parts.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Yeah, crazy... But SC has a loooong history with this topic, I'm sure. I assume you're familiar with the "dark corner?"

[@bob-rogers]

@@ClawhammerSupply we're near the dark corner.

[@dekulruno]

So you can’t have indoor plumbing? Cause that’s all still parts…

[@rezzyredskin]

In Washington state you can make up to a gallon and half a year for personal consumption

[@stephenbrinckerhoff3510]

In the 1860's there weren't so many car radiators for distillation units.

[@aminutewithbourbon]

Massachusetts residents of legal drinking age can distill spirits for personal use, but it is illegal to manufacture and sell moonshine. However, federal law prohibits the production of distilled spirits at home, and producing them elsewhere can result in serious federal charges.

[@joewoodchuck3824]

Distillation is commonly synonymous with moonshine in the home distilling sense. It's a distinction without a difference.

[@beeroquoisnation]

When SCOTUS negated Chevron Deference it opens the door for litigation over rules being created by bureaucrats. Congress will have to clearly delineate boundaries and regulation, as the agencies were never designed for that purpose.

[@burgurboy]

A great ruling!

[@stevehafke3614]

Yes... this was a huge power grab by the judicial branch. This ensures any rule/regulation is tied up in the courts for years. Add in another ruling that basically eliminated statute or limitations on claiming harm from a regulation, and everything is now under the rule of the judicial branch.

[@beeroquoisnation]

@@stevehafke3614 constitutionality of law has always been the domain of the SCOTUS. The court is just mandating that law needs to be articulated fully and not left to bureaucrats to interpret, as it was before Chevron.

[@stevehafke3614]

@@beeroquoisnation so now it's up to judges to interpret since we know congress is not going to do anything. And, if they do, they will craft any new regulation based on input from those they want to regulate or should I say, their donors.

[@azartyn2906]

​@@stevehafke3614you're not very bright, are you? The Constitution clearly states CONGRESS is the only one who can pass LAWS. Regulations, rules, etc whatever other name you come up with BY UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS are NOT legally enforceable. The FEDS have overstepped their power for far too long. The Chevron decision put LAW MAKING in the proper hands.

[@jamestate75]

I'm a Okie, but How can you not love Texas. You mess with My brothers you mess with me.

[@dus10dnd]

You can make fuel at home... you can't use it to drive on a public road, though... you must pay excise taxes for the roads that you're driving on. That isn't to say that people aren't doing it... but it is technically illegal. They could offer an annual license fee like they do for EVs... but I haven't seen such a thing.

[@GrantMcWilliams]

If there's money to be made by the government (or it's constituents) for dissolving the current statute then they'll let it go. If there's money to be made by the government (or it's constituents) for home distilling to remain illegal the laws will remain in place and change to adapt. The US is a very easy country to predict.

[@cryptkeeper4727]

They already make money off of it from the sales taxes they get from the grain and other items.

[@DUMPTHETRUCK]

Sorry Claw but I may have got a mile high Stil years ago atf did get all there records and just send scare letters to everyone on there list but never really did anything. I do follow you guys and have tried your apple pie pretty good stuff. I tried to read the state laws where I live as a yankee and there is not much almost like they don’t care, 🤷

[@ClawhammerSupply]

And I assume nothing came of it? People got letters but nothing happened. That was what we heard.

[@A.L.Thompson]

Here in west Virginia they won't arrest you for under 20 gallons.

[@taliaperkins1389]

Does it only take effect in that judicial district ?

[@Bob-cx4ze]

It's unthinkable this was illegal in the first place

[@ClawhammerSupply]

It really is.

[@nwerd7584]

It should be like any other food or drink, can make for personal use but selling it or giving it away is a huge liability without testing it. Just takes one person to get botulism and then everyone in that area is against it because everyone so reactionary. Drugs and manufacturing for personal use should also be allowed.. And just enforce the selling of it, without the tax stamp, if there is one. And yeah the ATF should be out there tracking down illegal guns, not worrying about some still or whatever.

[@vernonwilton8910]

When I was young, went to the Texas State fair ATF had a moonshine display and the agent told me the making of it is legal is the transport that is illegal know what part of that is changed and that was back in the 70s

[@dirttdude]

that's not going to bring Popcorn Sutton back

[@jimmieburleigh9549]

Alot of states already let you make shine at home with variations in still size and amounts made and stipulations on not selling gifting not gifting etc.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Negative.

[@jimmieburleigh9549]

@@ClawhammerSupply yes. My 2 home states in the south let you

[@bearsiksika2825]

Many states allow “Craft (home) Distillation”

[@frekigeri4317]

Just fyi, there were entire communities that were using distilled spirits as currency. Many Irish communities in the United States were doing this. When the spirits themselves are the currency, the government cannot tax them, as the government has no use for a large quantity of spirits, when what they want is large stacks of cash. This is why home distilling became illegal.

[@TinyHouseHomestead]

The "funny" thing is by law you homebrew ANY substance for your personal use! WTFDHJS! 😱😁😝🤪🤣👍👍🇺🇸

[@danielgodfrey4415]

The government used to be funded by the alcohol tax

[@BigEdsGuns]

The Craft Beverage Modernization and Tax Reform Act H.R.2903 - 114th congress. Any can google it and read up about it. I know it help out Craft Breweries all over the US. It was 2015 when I became a member of the HDA and donated for the lobbyist in DC to get members of the House & Senate to legalize Home Distillation. It ended with 65% (284 co sponsors) from the House of Representatives and 51% of the Senate on Board. But in the end "home distilling" was Cut from the final version, and President Trump did sign it into law.

[@Jagdtyger2A]

Legal for personal consumption; but the government still has authority to tax the product if you try to sell it

[@crosisofborg5524]

And that’s perfectly acceptable

[@XXtheultimatewarrior]

not sure how it is in asheville, but down here in wilmington, the enforcement is STRICT on businesses. You're safe if you're doing literally anything else

[@FarleyMan151]

My grandfather made it during probation. People that want to make shine or whatever, do it no matter what the law says.

[@finspin4984]

I hope this holds up

[@bigdaadio.K2WW]

Arent Distilling manufacturers, forced to track sales and report to big brother?

[@crdorado1195]

Hey mom, " have you seen grandpa's copper machine? I need to get that thing set up again!"

[@tomchristensen2914]

I hope it does change things. I dont drink as much as I use to but for me it is so much fun to mash in and watch it work off and then be able to distill it and see what I can come up with. I can make beer, mead, and wine just dont distill it. so stupid

[@REVJC]

Its because the entire drug schedule bases plants alcohol extraction in a controlled substance because the ATF Taxation system implements a controllable measure and the Volstead Act repealed the prohibition and gave religious freedom the right to alcohol production and distillery.

[@illa-noisemusic1081]

I ran a corn still for fuel only in Wisconsin. they shut it down and took my flute.

[@williammayes1155]

I've had sheriff show up at my house once cause some how my nosey neighbors thought my 2 15 gallon fermenting tanks was some type of explosive device u was making lol then the cops thought It was part of a meth lab initially until I showed them 5 gallon pressure cooker with condenser collum and worm coil I told them thinking they would be more concerned with than was that I was using as racing fuel in go-kart and put denatured alcohol in they could check and they informed me didn't matter in that county each county in KY had so many gallons they allowed for personal consumption and the county I was in was like 6 but they told me if someone was aging in oak and what not they had recently left an old man's house that had 13 gallons between him and wife sounded reasonable to them and left at that after going and explaining to neighbors to be less concerned about my yard since they clearly being second bs call in less than 2 months didn't need to harass me any farther because with another wasted trip on their behalf they would not only allow but try to get me to persue harassment charges so technically I have but once found out it was hobby still they was cool with I lived in trigg county KY at time period for anyone wondering.

[@boscodooley8561]

Run Ronnie Run is so good.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

So good!

[@greywuuf]

Until a year ago ....most atf related gun charges were secondary as well.

[@greg-snapr4136]

I'm crying 😭😭 they can't/won't ship distillery equipment to NC...

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Yup. Conflict with a local law there...! So although the fed law may change, we're all still dealing with local laws.

[@greg-snapr4136]

@@ClawhammerSupply Thanks for your reply. You are 100% correct, local laws especially for something like any kind of distillery operation are a total pain in (pick whichever sensitive areas you will)...😁

[@blueberrywilbur315]

Seems like you could issue a permit that would cover 500-1000 gallons a year easily. If you’re really that worried give a safety class for home distillers 💯

[@Python_John]

contrary to popular belief aside from the actual prohibition itself its never been illegal to distil alcohol for personal or medicinal use, the moment you gift any of that snine to someone then it breaks the law

[@Jason-o5s]

Cheer~~~not in accordance with a political constitution, especially the US Constitution, or with procedural rules.😅

[@rhino7342]

F the ATF

[@cropduster2740]

So they will come after my garden soon because i pay no food tax?

[@joearledge]

apparently they are trying in some states.... grow it twice as big and learn how to set up a proper ambush

[@DrewLonmyPillow]

I thought it was legal to brew/ferment/distill in your home for personal consumption. It's commercial (e.g. production for sale) activity that's been regulated.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Distilling spirits is the exception and is not legal.

[@terrythompson9301]

All you need in your state is a law that says it’s OK for you to distill alcohol for home use . if you want to sell it then you should have to get a license if you get caught selling it then you should have to pay the fine. this is how Missouri law is I live in Missouri and I make moonshine but I do not sell it.

[@bobbg9041]

Distill for your own use yes. To sell no you need to pay tax on that But you should be able to sell limited amounts if you keep records and pay tax on your end products but there is a limited amount you can do for sale each year with said permit that is not the same as a full blown commercial distilary , but a home distillery can Supply to a major distillery wholesale with records and not pay taxes it will be collected from the main distillery who sells it to a distrubtor then retail So Toms country mushrooms moonshine cherry flavor works it way to market as a limited production product. This gives a small time guy a chance to experiment and grow.

[@TheBrewQ]

Texas bam! My home :D Cheers, gents!

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Listen everyone, we'll address the power outages later... We got home distilling to worry about first! I like it.

[@Vykk_Draygo]

The legal reasoning is sound, so I don't see how the Feds could make a compelling argument to the contrary. They need to treat it the same as fuel alcohol and require a tax stamp (if they want to regulate it via taxing authority). But, I suppose we'll see.

[@seananderson4746]

dont repeat that. they take enough taxes from us.

[@street-u1y]

Agree. If I understand correctly the law pretty much says it's illegal "because it cuts into tax revenue." This would remove that argument. Obviously, I would much rather it be treated the same as homebrewing with no tax. I can't imagine these days that the output of home distillers would make much of a dent in tax revenue.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

Exactly. And according to the judge, congress IS allowed to levy taxes to dissuade people from doing things (like smoking) but not to prevent them from doing something altogether, which is the case here.

[@apdshadow1203]

hell evenif they wanna regulate it make it possible for small hobby size operations.

[@brianclift606]

If I was, per say, a home distiller, I would, theoretically, be excited by this and, in theory, be watching for the outcome.

[@jimklemens5018]

per se

[@brianclift606]

@@jimklemens5018 I'd thank you for the correction if I thought it was given with any sort of genuine concern for me knowing the exact spelling

[@jimklemens5018]

@@brianclift606 Spelling and grammar are important.

[@brianclift606]

@@jimklemens5018 so is civility and understanding that what is important to you may mean absolutely nothing to others. And that these differences don't make one better or more important than the other. Have a nice day.

[@JamesMoore-q1u]

Unfortunately in Washington the state law specifies operation of any still without a license and includes possession of any mash of distillable quality. Not sure this federal decision will make a difference here.

[@milehidistilling1]

Keep in mind that federal law will trump state law, so if it's approved federally, your state law will no longer matter.

[@wesleyson21]

​@milehidistilling1 that's unfortunately not true. State laws can always be more strict than federal law. See any of the states that have more strict rules regarding firearms.

[@milehidistilling1]

@@wesleyson21 No, I believe it is. Check out The Supremacy Clause. The Supremacy Clause of the Constitution of the United States (Article VI, Clause 2) establishes that the Constitution, federal laws made pursuant to it, and treaties made under its authority, constitute the "supreme Law of the Land", and thus take priority over any conflicting state laws.

[@JamesMoore-q1u]

@@milehidistilling1 it has always been my understanding that state law can be more restrictive than federal law, but not less restrictive (except for the recent issues with marijuana)

[@ClawhammerSupply]

@milehidistilling1 - You've got it backwards. Supremacy clause dictates that federal law trumps state laws in any case where state laws either don't exist (on a particular topic) or are less stringent than federal laws. However, state laws absolutely can be more stringent than federal law and take precedent (but will only be enforced by local agencies, not the feds). There are many, many examples of this in practice.

[@vDRACv]

I been making wine and mead for a year now Trying to find one i can drink 🍷🍷🍷 with my dinner Since I can't drink either mead or wine 🍷🍷 I've been using the leftover stuff to make marinades and barbecue sauce Which leaves me a stockpile of wine 🍷🍷 and 🍷 Mead i can't drink I wouldn't mind turning them into Brandy I have no problem drinking whiskey or beer only wine Mead and champagne I'm unable to drink 🍷🍷

[@dougshelton69]

Rocket fuel.. engine fuel.. moonshine... All the same thing🎉

[@rustywater3219]

Woohoo! Moonshiners tv show needs to come back with tutorials.

[@ClawhammerSupply]

I'm sure they're excited about this.

[@howiesammons3048]

I know states like florida have laws against equipment to distill. but this could be a good start at getting those laws changed.

[@crosisofborg5524]

I could see Desantis supporting legalization of home shine. Florida loves freedom.

[@FusionDeveloper]

​@@crosisofborg5524 get your facts straight. He is raising money to fight against amendment 3 and he wants to remove it from the ballot, so that people in Florida cannot vote for the right to have legal marijuana.

[@Reutzel507]

Processing vs possession is different.

[@scoutdogfsr]

My family doesn't brew white lightning. They make motor fuel for our ranch equipment.

[@bluegreen2360]

I miss living in missouri. Legal to make your own shine, which i did. And legal pot, which i voted for. Too bad more states dont see it the same way.

[@danhoy8356]

Hope we get some forward movement

[@LURLINE_]

they should legalize growing pot next