K & N Air Filter at 19,000 kms | Is it Good or Bad? | CRF250L

[@chief1193]

I always use K&n filters and I have never had a problem.

[@thejayman587]

Great video. Another mod for the 250L thats in my near future. Thank you!

[@Scoottoots]

Yeah, unless you do tons of dirt riding in groups in dusty conditions, I think they are good filter. Thanks :-)

[@mrSpatcat]

You are to motorcycling like Bob Ross is to painting. I could watch your videos all day long.

[@Scoottoots]

Lol, thank you Spatcat :-)

[@clivegreenall309]

Thanks for another informative video (and your diplomatic responses to comments) :-) . I enjoy watching yr channel and your calm, polite manner. I currently own a 2010 KLR650 which I love, but would buy a lighter bike when/if the time comes. Regards from S Africa Clive

[@Scoottoots]

Thanks Clive. I appreciate that. Lots of great bikes to choose from these days if/when the time comes to part with your KLR... or addition to it :-)

[@stevenmitchell9250]

Thank you for the video Sir. After watching this a few weeks back, I decided to get one for my CRF250 Rally. Really happy with it. Like you said, it fits better than stock and performs great. It's made my bike much more lively in the upper rev range too. Well worth the money. :)

[@Scoottoots]

Awesome! Thanks :-)

[@LiveFreeOrRIP]

keep it clean and oiled and I use Outer wears and I NEVER see anything for dust or dirt past it. Outer wears is awesome to keep out of the ribs and makes cleaning super easy. KN is awesome

[@Scoottoots]

Thanks for the heads up on the Outer Wears product. I hadn't run across them before.

[@jasonhicks8622]

I bet your neighbors thought you were hardcore by having your helmet on while working on your bike ;)

[@Scoottoots]

For sure; that's gotta look a bit odd :-)

[@clivegreenall309]

LOL .. Safety First

[@scottloudon14]

Interesting, I have used K&N on my street bikes ( with sucess) but haven't used them on any of my Dual sports or dirt bikes. I was surprised by your results much better than expected. I will say I tend to go through stock filters between 300 and a 1000 miles on my 2017 CRF250L . Agreed it can be expensive over time. Both times I did the 300 mile change it was clearly necessary and honestly it just felt right to do it ( probably partly habit, being an older rider) . I have had good luck with the stock filter and they do work fine. Taking into account , I have resisted doing any airbox, exhaust mods not even an EJK. So other than the expense I'm not sure what I would gain.

[@Scoottoots]

I agree, In your case it's best to stay with stock to keep the stock air flow unchanged.

[@diegus1234]

you did good. dont do any mods. I'm paying for a engine rebuild after 8000 kms on KN filter. and 12000 kms of total engine life. stay away from that if you ride offroad.

[@MrMegaPerez]

just put one in my crf and nc750x :) they are great

[@korybleu3491]

I’m diggin the black and white, plan to do the same.

[@Scoottoots]

Thanks. I like it a lot. It changes the look completely.

[@diegus1234]

I had a filter which looked exactly the same - like not used at all. My mechanic did a compression test on 12000kms service. Instead of 13.2 kg/cm2 there was not even 10. He told me that most probably dust came in through KN filter and started to destroy cylinder and piston. I had the engine removed and inspected - it was damaged and there were signs of sand doing its job there. So.. I advise you to go for a compression test. It must be excactly 13.2 not any less (according to service manual).

[@Scoottoots]

I've had the K & N filter for a long time now and have had a leak down test done. A leak down test is more precise than a compression reading. The results show within new engine Honda specs. Lots of people don't know the science behind K & N filters and then treat and clean them as they see fit rather than following K & N's procedures. That destroys the filter's effectiveness. Also K & N used their dirt bike specs when building the filter for the crf250l. And btw, the bike is approaching 60,000 km now.

[@diegus1234]

@@Scoottoots I agree that I made mistakes. But filter is a filter. The paper one you put on and discard when used. The KN has a special procedure that you can always blame on user when things get messy ;) Alslo, did you notice any increased oil consumption? I think that was something I noticed fist - like 100ml of oil burnt every 1000kms. That got me worried a bit, but I did not suspect that the engine was failing slowly. Did not notice any lack in power or with starting on cold engine. The compression test was a big whoa! for me. And later discoveries of damage to the cylinder.

[@Scoottoots]

@@diegus1234 I appreciate your input. I'll be very watchful for any telltale signs like you say. So far so good :-)

[@bombidude]

My kn been working fine in my crf250l..

[@timc5303]

Never use a K&N filter.It allows too much dust through.You need to inspect the inlet side of the piston after using these filters to see any scoring.Some good videos on you tube to watch about excessive wear with K&N filters.

[@Scoottoots]

Too many people don't understand how the K & N filter works, and because of that they maintain them incorrectly causing them to fail. They work well when used according to the directions. I've tested as well as I can by applying a swipe of grease on the throttle body intake to catch any dust or whatnot. The intake including the greased area was whistle clean. Also a leak-down test was done maybe 15,000 km after install without any cleaning done to the filter. The results were just within new bike specs despite the bike having fairly high kms on it. Worked for me.

[@timc5303]

Check out Patrick's cycleshop Morrison on you tube 21st July 2017. He tests the filter and shows the damaged pistons.

[@danielsan4107]

Buen video. Gracias. Yo tengo el mismo filtro en mi CRF250 L y creo que es un acierto. Pero lo revisaré para comprobar su estado.

[@Scoottoots]

Good to hear. Thanks :-)

[@danielsan4107]

@@Scoottoots I would like yo show you my bike. I have a los of accesories. You may give me your opinion. Thank you so much for answer.

[@Scoottoots]

@@danielsan4107 Sure, put a link in the comment.

[@danielsan4107]

@@Scoottoots kzbin.info/www/bejne/jaTdl4KGjt-Xgqc

[@Scoottoots]

@@danielsan4107 Looks great. You're ready for some good long trips. The disc lock is a good idea!

[@scarumanga]

Awesome, thanks for the review on them. I might just get one. I wonder if k&n filters will work with the maxima fab1 spray oil for filters... Its significantly more tacky than the K&N oil. On my truck I found that the k&n filter allowed a film to build up on my MAF sensor, tripping a fault code and requiring it to be cleaned every 15000k or so. That was my experience, it went away when when I put a OEM filter back in my truck.

[@Scoottoots]

I wonder if that film was the K & N oil. The instructions are very particular about how much oil to use when cleaning and oiling. I suspect you may impair the filter by using the Maxima Fab1 oil. I have a can of that I used to use on a 2 stroke. Like you say, it's tacky stuff. Maybe call K & N and get a tech on the line and ask.

[@Zen-525]

i have 2 of them. if i been riding gravel roads or dusty tracks, ill swap them out. clean the old one and re-oil ready for next swap. u buy K&N cleaning spray and oil to re oil them

[@Scoottoots]

Yup, it's important to follow their directions and use their kit to clean and re lube them. Thanks for your input Zen :-)

[@doneB830]

My experience on earthmoving machines has been that new filters don’t work as well as midlife filters therefore if you continue to put new filters to often you could be damaging your engine.

[@ianward1126]

Another great review thanks again!

[@Scoottoots]

Thanks man :-)

[@jb-lu4vo]

I think you should have cleaned it earlier with 10,000 km or 12,000 km. Dirty air entering the engine is not good. I have always used K&N filters and I like how the engine runs.

[@Scoottoots]

K&N advise not to clean it before dirt covers the wires on the filter. That's the way it is designed to work. They caution that cleaning more often will cause issues with the filter.

[@gosolobox]

I found dirt on the intake of my KLR. K n N went into the garbage..

[@Scoottoots]

The downside of K&N air filters is: they must be fitted with grease (some models), they should not be cleaned until the wires are mostly hidden with dirt, and when cleaned only the K & N cleaner is to be used and the water rinse must have no pressure. Not saying you didn't follow procedure, but many owners don't bother to understand how they work and do not read the instructions carefully. Can't go wrong with OEM.

[@gosolobox]

@@Scoottoots Yes, and it was fitted properly. The intake track had fine dust visible on it. I went to a conventional foam and have never seen it again. I think the K & N is okay for road use, but the gauze is too thin for off-road.

[@Scoottoots]

@@gosolobox Yeah, some K & N filters are spec'd for off road. The majority are not. I like foam. So easy to clean especially, and keep it clean.

[@SomeGuy-nf3gk]

You don’t need to take the seat off to get to the air filter?!?! Good video btw

[@Scoottoots]

Usually I could remove the side cover without lifting the seat. Not always though.

[@patriotofgod9827]

Man that's easy. On my street bike , I have to take the seat and the gas tank off just to check my radiator level , air filter , and to change the plugs. I started with a dirt bike 45 years ago and went straight to street. Now I seem to cherish life a little more. The L suits my lousy budget.

[@Scoottoots]

Hehehe, Simple is good. This bike is simple and that's part of its charm.

[@dochazel2]

appreciated the topic, but got motion sick with the moving camera....

[@Scoottoots]

Ah, sorry about that. Thanks for the reminder. I should try to avoid that.

[@brianreffner3548]

I been thinking about putting a k&n in mine. Did you notice any difference in how it performs after the k&n

[@Scoottoots]

It was quite similar to using the stock air filter with the backfire screen removed. If you ride in dusty off road conditions with groups of riders where you're sucking dust all the time, I would stay with the stock filter. I ride solo and so I don't get dust much. The K & N works well for me partly due to that.

[@tdg2615]

Its not what you can see on the filter after a certain amount of time, its what's had been going through it...

[@jb-lu4vo]

It does not cost anything to wash it with clean and warm water, let it dry and put the K&N liquids back on. I do not understand why you put it back dirty, if cleaning it takes you at most half an hour.

[@Scoottoots]

I don't because I follow K & N's specific directions on that cleaning.

[@yessure5291]

Since you had the filter out --- I would have used a home vacuum cleaner on it.

[@Scoottoots]

No, you shouldn't do that on these types of filters. Very important to follow K & N's method.

[@604rioso]

I'm often tailing behind several riders kicking up ALOT of dust...I notice you normally ride solo...Would you still recommend it then? I've seen these in person and they are so see through! I don't know I'm still a bit skeptical although I often come to your channel for CRF250L advice :P

[@Scoottoots]

True, I mostly ride solo and so, not much dust to contend with. The K & N filter is technically different from most though. You can't judge by the looks of it when sighting it into the light. Here is some info on it. Especially note the "Filtration 101 -- a Deeper Cut" section. It's important to understand their technology to have trust in it and to maintain the filter correctly. www.knfilters.com/filter_facts.htm

[@Scoottoots]

Here's another insight into the K & N. This is the page for the filter for my bike. Note that it is "Specifically developed for Off-Road, Motocross, ATVs, UTVs and Side by Sides." They design their filters for the bike's most sever intended use. So mine is designed for off-road dusty riding. Check yours out. I think you will be happy with their efficiency. Their only fault is perhaps being a bit ahead of the times. Most filters rely only on smaller openings to trap smaller particles. K & N employ deeper physics that results in better performance, great filtration, and less maintenance. No wonder they're misunderstood ;-) www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?prod=HA-2513

[@hondavfr7559]

Why do you not wash the Filters and Oil it?

[@Scoottoots]

Because it did not need washing yet. K & N instructions are clear that you are not to wash the filter until the wires are buried in dust.

[@306Geni]

Used properly K&N is at least as good as stock filter.

[@Scoottoots]

Yeah that's the key: use it according to directions. Don't blow it out with air, or use any force when hosing it out after the cleaner, and use the correct amount of the proper oil. It's not a filter you want to 'wing it' with.

[@veiledallegory]

If you don't believe it, you need to watch Project Farms air filter test. You might have a different opinion after you do!

[@Scoottoots]

Thanks. That was informative.

[@j0rzeh]

You're supposed to clean and oil it every 3k miles so not sure where you read that

[@Scoottoots]

That is what their instructions that come with the filter state. They are very clear about that, and caution against cleaning prematurely. Perhaps yours is a different model.

[@j0rzeh]

Yeah, I think that's what it says on the wash and oil packet you can buy, doesn't do any harm cleaning it and reoiling it anyway, If it ain't broke don't fix it mind :-)

[@tthiakos]

I'm a motorcycle mechanic by trade. I have seen lots of damage caused by K&N air filters.

[@Scoottoots]

I appreciate you perspective. The way I see it though, the damage is done when people neglect to follow instruction regarding how and when to clean them. Most people don't read directions or bother to understand the science involved. And the science behind these calls for very particular cleaning methods and timing. Cleaning too often, using a nozzle or a thumb on the water hose, wrong amount of oil, or using a different oil, can all cause failure. Also these for this bike are made to their dirt bike filter specs.

[@j0rzeh]

I work for BMW mottorrad and it's true that I've seen damage to engines using k&n filters but I've run them on my personal bikes for 15 years and 450k miles with no issues.. I think it's down to how often they're cleaned and what people Do with the bike.

[@Scoottoots]

I agree. Can't argue with 15 year and 450K miles :-)

[@j0rzeh]

VFR800 is on 133k miles now :-D GS1200 on 88k miles etc :) all on K&N's and all still going great :D

[@Scoottoots]

That's awesome. Not just as a testament to the filter but that you ride your bikes. So many guys buy em and park em, taking them out only infrequently. Machines are meant to be used and enjoyed ;-)

[@Skilpadjie1]

Ive got a DNA Filter in my Rally. Best thing ever. The people who say it lets dust through is crazy as they clearly have not read up on these filters. Although you can see through a K&N or DNA. That's when its not in vehicle. When the motor on bike or car starts the vibrations running through vehicle makes the filters fine micro hairs move. Making it impossible for dust or debris to move through. Also the oil layer you add helps further. So they must make sure about facts.

[@Scoottoots]

Yeah, the science behind these filters is missed by a lot of people because they don't delve into it.

[@timc5303]

Very bad for your engine.Check out Patricks cycle shop Morrison on you tube to see the damage they cause.

[@Scoottoots]

His reasoning lacks all scientific method. You can't judge the effectiveness of a filter without knowing how the person maintained it. K & N are designed to be maintained in a very specific way that is counterintuitive. It's in the instruction that come with them. Problem is, these people who have poor experience don't read instructions or attempt to understand how the product works that they're installing on their bike. My experience with them was excellent over a long term, because I knew how to use them.

[@timc5303]

Unless you strip down the engine you will never know if any damage has occurred. After watching Patrick's video I would never take that chance.Manufacturers spend millions in research for the best air filters for their engines.

[@Scoottoots]

@@timc5303 Yes you can know. That's what leak-down tests are for. My engine was still within new specs after 10's of thousands of kms using the K & N filter for most of that. You can't judge a filter by examining piston wear for example, unless you know how the filter was maintained, etc. Your evidence must be complete before making conclusions. Manufacturers install quality air filters. If you want to modify your intake and exhaust you choose something different for higher flow. Is there a tradeoff? Sure, but by choosing smart, the upside outweighs any negative. Do it without care and poorly maintain that filter and you'll suffer for it.

[@Scoottoots]

@@timc5303 Here's an explanation of how they work and why they are reliable: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e2XRiJWPa9WLp9k