Karen Read Trial Day 28 RECAP - Medical Experts Help Defense?? | LAWYER EXPLAINS

[@LegalBytesMedia]

What did you think about the voicemails? Did they move the needle at all for you?

[@couls3able]

Nope.

[@Johnbartheart]

Nien..

[@treekitty3136]

Not. One. Bit.

[@zirconiumdiamond1416]

If anything, it puts the jury's mindset in a place helpful to the defense. She was drunk, and apparently had backed into something around the time of O'Keefe's death. That she could have accidentally clipped him and then decided to flee the scene seems plausible as a scenario. The idea that she was mad at him, and therefore decided to run into him while driving in reverse and send his body into the front lawn of a police officer seems like such a crazy idea that even alcohol wouldn't explain it (other drugs? Maybe). As far as I understand, the prosecution doesn't have to prove that she had meant to hit him. So, why try to prove something that doesn't matter, but creates the possibility that if the jury doesn't go along with you for that piece, your credibility will be reduced for the elements of the case that actually matter?

[@tenderstepsPaul]

No, KR is actually a sentient feeling human being unlike her so-called "friends". One can understand her annoyance with JOK

[@uncleswing4046]

If they convict KR I will be shocked! The amount of reasonable doubt that has been introduced by the defense is monumental. Looking forward to the results of the FBI investigation.

[@trevorsmith2006]

The prosecution has introduced enough reasonable doubt that I think the judge would have been well within the law to grant the defense's motion for a directed verdict.

[@tenderstepsPaul]

I agree. KR's case should never have reached court.

[@HLB313]

I feel like even if she HAD done it, take out all the “evidence” the defence have destroyed their own case with, there would still be reasonable doubt from how patchy and inconsistent what’s left is.

[@nimroddiaries_]

@@trevorsmith2006 I was here to say the same thing.

[@uncleswing4046]

@@trevorsmith2006 agreed!

[@squidleyskidley]

As a critical care nurse, I can say that we DON’T use the back of the hands to get IV access for resuscitation. We need much larger veins so we try the AC or use IO access. Which is what they did here. They used IO. The back of the hands are useless for resuscitation. The bruises there are more likely from fighting imo.

[@DreadKyller]

Yeah that struck me as odd. My mother works in the medical field and I've heard about giving IV through the back of the hand, but not during such a time critical period. That would be such a finicky area to get an IV in when time is of importance as the veins there are prone to rolling unless stabilized.

[@amandamosteller1371]

The only time I've seen an IV put through the back of the hand is when I had my tonsils removed, I was really afraid of needles and always had to be held down by aids to get blood drawn or an IV going. So it was easier for the OR nurse to place my IV on the back of my hand. The 2nd time I've seen an IV placed on the back of the hand was for my mother. However she was an IV drug user and had terrible veins.

[@LKMNOP]

I'm wondering why nobody brought the hospital records into evidence to show whether they tried an IV there. Or maybe it was done in the ambulance? Don't know if they have the facilities for that

[@Wyomingchief]

​@LKMNOP if it was a paramedic staffed ambulance, they 100% would have tried to start an IV for resuscitation. In fact when it comes to resuscitation, paramedics on scene can do just about everything that can be done in the ER when it comes to specifically a cardiac arrest, they should have all the equipment and medicines that the ER would have. I spent 20 plus years working as a paramedic and I can guarantee you in a trauma or a cardiac arrest or any critical patient, I am not going to be trying to start an IV in the back of the hand. First of all this guy was cold and so any peripheral veins like in the hands are going to be so small you're lucky you'll ever find one. Secondly just like the original person stated I'm going for the ac, the inside of the elbow, or even an external jugular vein.

[@mighty0974]

If you are unable to find a vein in the arm, and one is easily found in the hand, one will be placed there. There will not be time wasted searching for an IV in a more effective spot when you could be administering medication. Maybe get another IV later, but initially, you get what you can get. "Useless for resuscitation"? Really? Do you not administer medications through a hand IV? Weird.

[@theresabarba3174]

The only thing those voice mails show is that she was angry that John had not come home yet, and she was stuck babysitting his niece and nephew, and she thought he was out cheating on her. Also, if she was trying to make it look like she was innocent and didn't know he was dead, why wouldn't she send nice, sweet messages to him? Her anger was not feigned. If she knew he was dead, she would not be angry that he was still not home.

[@MellyBooHoo]

More i watch this trial, more im convinced that we will never know what really happen that night.

[@chrystalmcatee6224]

The FBI knows and they are coming after all of them! We know as well. It's more than obvious what really happened. Now getting any of the Alberts or McCabes to admit it is another story, but we all know what happened!

[@HLB313]

I can’t believe the defence haven’t even started presenting their case…

[@magicsforce]

@@HLB313 have you heard them speak? the prosecution is so long winded for the simplest question. It takes 3 hours to establish the sky is blue lol

[@MildredCady]

@@magicsforcethree hours? I’m going to go with three weeks, which is just short of how long it took the prosecution to call in the MEs about what actually killed the victim… and they didn’t really support the prosecution’s case.

[@Lou-gr6lc]

@@MildredCadydidn’t it take them 3 weeks to also establish it snowed that night?🥴

[@uncleswing4046]

I've been in relationships with woman that have that same level of crazy in their voice when they get mad. What that told me was that she did not know he was dead, and she did not kill him because that pure rage that you heard cannot be done on command. That was actually her being livid because she legitimately thought he was at the party banging another girl while she was home with the kids.

[@jillruben8924]

😂😂 We do calm down later in life. Promise.

[@jackeeB]

Exactly.

[@ttugrlduck]

Same. She 100% was not covering up anything in those VMs she was very sure he was going to be hearing that later. Not a way to speak to someone, but she's not on trial for that. A rational sober woman knows she definitely expected him to hear all of that. She didn't know he was dead. She did know she was drunk and drove though...

[@diannlimo4502]

@@ttugrlduckthey were all drinking and driving

[@KDSima]

@@jillruben8924isn’t that the truth. Menopause was amazing for me. HRT took care of the physical problems of menopause. I’m all good now, for the most part.

[@JeeJubee]

I think it sucks that the doctors said they can’t determine how much force is needed to crack JO’s skull “because they aren’t physicists,” yet Auntie Bev won’t allow the physicists to answer that “because they aren’t doctors.” I don’t trust Auntie Bev one bit.

[@valerielevasseur8674]

It's fine. We've still got Trooper Paul. 😵‍💫

[@HDnursepractitioner]

I am so mad. Everyday I am more convinced that someone else killed John and they are getting away with it. I really hope the FBI investigates and finds the real culprit.

[@randomnumber231]

As the standard is beyond a reasonable doubt, no one in their right mind would convict

[@1superemily]

The medical examiner’s testimony that the injuries to the deceased are not typical of a vehicle strike are very important. Why are there zero injuries to the victim below the neck after being hit by a car going 24 miles per hour???

[@LKMNOP]

Some people have pointed out that that 24 miles an hour could have been registered because the tires were spinning on snow or ice. So she could have been going much slower

[@zirconiumdiamond1416]

​@@LKMNOP sure sounds like something that the state's accident reconstruction expert ought to have mentioned and accounted for in his analysis. Because a smaller bump that knocked O'Keefe onto his head, and then Read drove off in a panic seems much more plausible given the medical examiner's report than the prosecution's current theory of the case. Though they would have to account for how that body "projected" 30 feet and how it shattered the brake light in 45 pieces.

[@mykeljmoney]

1:52 “Dr. Cannone?” Is that an accidental great joke? What with how rude she was to Dr. Russell, acting like she was a better medical expert 🙄 it annoyed me so much. Like yelling at grandma, or something. I thought all 3 defense experts were a breath of fresh air. Thanks making these summaries, they’re great and so are you!

[@jozymorales]

Judges have doctorates. I think she's just showing class, unlike the judge and prosecution

[@Katosepe]

​@@jozymoralesJudge Cannone has a JD which is not referred to as a Doctor. Yes, it is a doctorate but that's not the title used for a JD.

[@johnabney3530]

There was nothing atypical about those voice messages, she was simply pissed and probably drunk...many can relate to that. This is a terrible case of Keystone Cops v. Read. 🤦🏻

[@AZQueen31]

If she is found guilty this will be a gross miscarriage of justice!! It scares me as a law abiding citizen that this could happen to me or anyone, especially if LEOs are involved and I back the blue, but not in this situation.

[@chrystalmcatee6224]

Ever watch dateline?? Unfortunately it happens all too often! Of course I've never seen anything this absurd ever go to trial!

[@bufnel]

One thing I know for sure, if Trooper Proctor ever showed up at my house I'd first call 911 and second call a lawyer.

[@hugheffo]

All I got from hearing those voice mails was, she was very angry with him, and that's why when she dropped him off, she never went in with him. Her voice sounds genuinely like, she has tried calling him, but he was ghosting her. This does not sound like a woman who has just killed her boyfriend, and was faking her anger, to cover up a crime.

[@couls3able]

You’re such a bright light! 😊 I love your take on this trial. Also appreciate you explaining everything!

[@kellstarama8235]

This whole trial seems like a hasty mashup of Keystone Cops, The Sopranos, and Mean Girls... 🤦

[@zaniiite]

While I watch the live trial on Emily’s channel, I always come back here to watch your recaps. You do great work! Lots of love from a Latvian 🇱🇻 residing in US! Gotta support our dearest neighbors ❤️🇱🇹

[@Justinfrost12]

Thanks for explaining WHY having tattoos in court is bad. I thought the tattoos were amazing and never considered the negativity they could bring.

[@Always_Thinking]

I agree about the tattoos. It was a very well done sleeve & she had a "K" on the left side. Topic in a lot of chats. I don't have a problem with tats but they definitely distracted me from her testimony. She is definitely very intelligent & did a good job explaining things!

[@mighty0974]

I could be wrong, but I saw that "K" as a chromosome, along with the other ones on that arm.

[@stellabythesea1492]

Thant you Alyte. I had to go back to work and couldn't watch. I am so thankful you do these!!

[@BaoVwm4Christ]

The voicemails prove her innocence. And actually, seems to prove she’s not as drunk as the alleged .3 blood alcohol. She doesn’t sound drunk.

[@texasrefugee7888]

Hey, honey, they found a body in the yard last night.But don't worry we're cops , so they're not even going to talk to us.

[@lindahorton7851]

IMO, Proctor called her a whack job because she disagreed with him and didn't give him the manner of death he wanted.

[@Always_Thinking]

No. It was Dr. Bello that Proctor called a whack job.

[@normhamel327]

On the subject of butt dialing. Everyone has a security code to get access to their phone which would eliminate butt dialing imo

[@dean.mcmxcvi]

Arghhh yes I completely agree! The fact that judge K even needed to hear arguments and didn’t flat out deny the prosecutions request was enraging! Also to think she just got done saying how the defense violated rule 14 whatever and you’d think the prosecution would’ve had THIS little bit of evidence the whole time!!! Enraging to say the least

[@jb7692]

It felt more like theater than law. It wouldn’t be appropriate even if Proctor hadn’t called Read…so why did the defense have to even show that proof?

[@tenderstepsPaul]

Unconvinced KR is inebriated. I am sure she is angry with JOK. KR is a highly intelligent woman, with sadly many severe physical health issues, who seems isolated to a degree. JOK does not seem to appreciate KR's contribution to helping with the children, or her desire for an honest relationship. KR has no case to answer. I hope she can launch civil suits on her acquittal.

[@bornfree0507]

She has MS and probably drank more after she dropped him off. She thought she was in for the night. She didn’t do it.

[@Always_Thinking]

Did you read through the 176 pages of text messages from 1.3.2022 - 1 29.2022. Very enlightening! The pulled 8 texts!

[@tenderstepsPaul]

@@Always_Thinking Clearly, I have not. So, what is your understanding after perusing them? In your view, what do they show? What do they indicate? How can I easily access the texts?

[@Always_Thinking]

@user-yg2si8lo1x I hope I didn't sound snarky because that was absolutely not my intention. I've read part of the texts & think it's evil how Lally picked a few. I agree with what you have posted. Seems to me they had more stressors in their lives than many couples. OJO was moved to the s*x crimes unit in Boston which is gut wrenching; their renewed relationship & instant pre-teen/teen (such charming ages..lol), Mrs. O'Keefe still unhappy that John ultimately was raising the kids, not the proper outside support, maintaining 2 homes plus Karen had a rental property, the physical toll Karen's health issues had among regular everyday life. I saw an interview with a family friend of many years who said they were planning to do some work on Karen's house to sell it & buy a vacation home & they were very much in love. Life is chaotic & unfortunately we don't always show people the appreciation we should. Part of the emotional & psychological aspects of MS is fear of abandonment which made Karen insecure & JM creeping around John is unnerving..imo. My late husband was similar to John. If I was upset he would not answer calls which upset me more! Eventually cooler heads would prevail! The text messages can be found on Aussie Insider's channel, on the Community page - it's the one with crazy eyes JM! I believe Karen is 100% innocent!

[@tenderstepsPaul]

@@Always_Thinking You did not come across as snarky (at all!) and thank you very much for all the information - I will look at the texts. Just for information, from your initial text I thought you were anti KR (it could just be me/my mistake). This malicious prosecution of a woman with very significant health issues is profoundly depressing. Also, with the loss of her employments she presumably lost her health insurance as well. I am just so appalled - I wonder about my fellow human beings with this type of behaviour.

[@robinmaynard1640]

Very early on we found out that no one on Fairview had security camera footage. We were also told that the Albert family takes no security precautions, including locking their doors. To me this is unbelievable. I know many police officers with children - they are all ultra security conscious. So from close to the beginning i was suspicious of a coverup.

[@sophie427]

I don’t know, it seems like they live in a pretty small town… people usually feel pretty safe if it’s a “quiet neighborhood” !

[@HDnursepractitioner]

Ridiculous, proctor threatened her and that is why she searched an attorney.

[@Jack-bc5xg]

Proctor had a few choice words about her. Big deal

[@meaghanjohnson370]

@LegalBytes Hearing the voicemail where she mentions being a “babysitter,” just brings me back to the delight that Jen McCabe had saying that in court. She knew that was an insecurity of Karen’s and rubbed the salt in. Also, makes me suspect JM planted “maybe you hit him,” in her mind.

[@Alecia_Marie]

Why would someone admit to a murder on a voicemail? If anything she would leave a “cover-up” voicemail! Come on!

[@hockysa]

If Karen gets convicted I’ll be shook. There is doubt beyond a reasonable doubt some even introduced by the prosecution themselves.

[@suzimonkey345]

I thought that they were NOT allowed to draw reference from any rights, eg staying silent, in trial!

[@transient_man]

I can’t pick what’s worse. Is it Lally putting up the young lawyer to make this unconstitutional argument so she catches the potential admonishment instead? Or is it the judge complementing the motion’s limiting instructions and signposting to the CW that they can admit it in the defense’s case? Well. Probably the judge. Lally is supposed to know better but Bev’s job is to know better. I wanted to move to MA just so I could protest outside the courthouse for the rest of these litigators natural lives. The only litigators with an ounce of integrity during that hearing was the defense team. Despicable behavior by the judge and the CW.

[@skoda18]

Not that I needed more reasonable doubt, but these voicemails are genuine. She's genuinely pissed; thinking he's out cheating while she's with his kids. Also, the # of times she called is significant. I don't think someone covering their tracks would do that. That's panic and desperation to me. Most significant thing for me was the time her phone connected to john's wifi which was 12:36 am. Prosecution said she killed him around 12:40. How was she doing that if she was by his house?

[@carlsanderson1584]

So the sad thing is that if he was beaten up in the house these nasty people could have still saved his life but instead decided to throw him out in the cold where he died of hypothermia Absolutely disgusting 😢

[@kinorspielmann4649]

Shocking that cops made fun of her medical condition, which must be hard living with, practically and psychologically. If they're that low level, they're untrustworthy too.

[@christopheraaron8299]

Now that the prosecution has rested, I know they won't, but if the defense were to just rest now without calling any witnesses, I think they could get a not guilty verdict simply on the gaping holes of reasonable doubt. The defense doesn't need to prove their narrative because the prosecution failed to prove their accusations beyond a reasonable doubt. Hell, I don't think they even established probable cause for the charge. What's even crazier is that the prosecution's expert witnesses gave testimony that damaged their own case.

[@LaceyLace_]

Girl, you are just glowing!!

[@possummansgamingcorner]

I wonder if he just slipped and cracked his head on the kerb, but then that doesn't explain why everyone is being so shady about the whole thing 🤔

[@anix670]

Thank you, your recaps are the best, bar none. ❤

[@ThinWhite_Duke]

My guess is if the jury was polled at this point at least half would already lean toward not guilty

[@HDnursepractitioner]

But the trooper is qualified ???

[@LKMNOP]

But, but, but he took a whole course! 🤣🤣🤣

[@desicooper7627]

Can you remove the flashing? I cannot watch w/o blocking due to pain in it causes my eyes & I’m worried about it triggering a seizure.

[@reneearnett8761]

I hope not to watch another trial With Lally being the prosecutor lol😂

[@peterbuckley3877]

If the blunt force trauma to the back of his head and his face was severe enough to incapacitate him why was there no corresponding damage to the bodywork of the vehicle to support that argument.

[@LKMNOP]

Especially when they claim she was backing up 24 miles an hour. Which isn't easy. Some commenters on EDB have said that maybe the tire spun on the snow or ice which would register 24 miles per hour but she could have been going much slower.

[@peterbuckley3877]

@@LKMNOP according to the crash reconstruction “ experts” she only sideswiped him and projected his body 30 feet, the laws of physics dispute that claim. If the impact was that violent the airbags would have most likely deployed in the vehicle and the would be corresponding body damage apart from a broken tail light.

[@Kenjitsuka]

Thanks for the hard work every day!!!

[@AutobotChick25]

I remember showing up as a FRESH social worker to support a client at court- just sitting with them before hand and then sitting in the back of court for the hearing. In my job role at the time, it was considered appropriate to dress relatively casually. I wasn’t thinking when I got ready that morning and felt WILDLY under dressed for court when I arrived. I’ve never felt so embarrassed. The doctor with the tattoos was certainly doing leagues better than I was.

[@timothyfreeseha4056]

Don't see how they could convict Karen Read.

[@prisonersdilemma939]

5:29 “…no one knows where you are…” Karen’s statement, here, is illogical. She just dropped him off minutes earlier. She said she watched him walk towards the house. Why would she be saying that no one knew where John was unless she knew that no one, BUT HER, knew of John’s location at the time of this call. She was creating voicemail and call evidence after she killed him, knowing that her calls and voicemails might be construed in the manner LegalBytes and others are doing.

[@mighty0974]

Did she contact other people before this voicemail?

[@suzimonkey345]

Thank you!

[@FlappyBelly]

Why are the feds involved in this case?

[@welshmouse]

Even if you believe she said "I hit him", that doesn't actually mean she hit him. I don't understand why people think this is damning. I would definitely think I might have hit someone by accident long before I got to 'maybe he was murdered and these people are trying to frame me'.

[@HLB313]

I think that alone proves she didn’t do it on purpose. Why would she set it all up and pretend to find him knowing he was there, then say “I hit him I hit him”

[@KDSima]

I agree. It is something I would say. I jump to conclusions, even about myself. I would say something, to express my fears.

[@LKMNOP]

And Kari Who was in the car with Karen and Jen when they were searching for John, and you could tell by the way she talked she was no friend of Karen's, that she heard Karen say did I hit him. I would say she was one of the least biased witnesses in the prosecutions case. She clearly didn't like Karen yet she told exactly what happened, not what she wanted to have happened. And she said Karen said did I hit him and that it was Jen who said I saw you at Fairview and that's when Karen said let's go there to look. Karen first thought of looking elsewhere

[@wolfgalleader]

Also, confession under duress is not allowed as proof. If you do believe she said it, think about how much stress she was under. She was clearly not in sound enough mind. While no one was forcing her into it, she was so out of sorts how could it be reliable?

[@ttugrlduck]

Normalize tattoos and doctorate degrees in the court room. I get what you're saying, but it's part of the problem- not the solution.

[@ThinWhite_Duke]

Dressing modestly in court, where peoples lives are at stake, is decorous & appropriate. Doing whatever you want, whenever you want, is selfish & degenerate

[@ttugrlduck]

@@ThinWhite_Duke also part of the problem I see. It's not about what she wore, it's what she said. They are wrong to think anything else. This logic is the same as people who are racist on a jury and the doctor is not whatever a jurors preferred race is. People's lives on the line, a jury bears the responsibility of putting biases aside for facts.

[@ThinWhite_Duke]

@@ttugrlduck A person chooses what to wear, they don't choose their skin. When you put on clothes prior to attending formal settings, dressing formally shows respect. If a man wears a thong into court it doesn't alter anything about his testimony but it's insulting and mocking to the court, and don't be surprised if you are refused entry

[@LKMNOP]

​@@ThinWhite_Dukehowever, the judge told them and the jury to dress appropriate to the temperature in the courtroom and to dress comfortably. It was steaming hot there.

[@valerielevasseur8674]

​@@ThinWhite_DukeYou believe the green dress was immodest? Can you explain? I really don't see it, myself.

[@carmenbraun588]

Do we know why trooper Procter was calling Karen that night? That's really sus

[@cougarten]

gps dead zone in a suburban neighbourhood not in the mountains sounds not right. gps is sattelite based and weather alone could have spoiled his "field test". What does confise gps: no clear view to the sky, "echos" from high rises

[@casualgamerdads3840]

They cant convict Karen cause of doubts... But WHEN she walks free, will Jen Mccabe be charged with anything, cause someone did kill John.

[@HDnursepractitioner]

I am very confused. If John had a bruise from an IV, then how was he hypothermic? How long was he outside in the cold? If he was hypothermic, there is no way he had blood flow to his hand. He was bleeding from the head and laying in the cold for several hours. The extremities will be the first to lose blood flow bc our body will try to conserve blood to the organs. No experienced medical professional would even attempt a peripheral IV, when there is no blood flow. It would waste time. If there is no blood flow, then how is there a bruise. If there was blood flow, he wasn’t hypothermic. So which is it?! In order to save John, they would need a line into the bone, an IO or a jugular in order to actually get fluid in. If anyone was able to get an IV in the hand, then he wasn’t hypothermic. And if he was hypothermic at the scene, they still wouldn’t be able to warm him enough to get a peripheral IV. Maybe I’m just dealing with a bunch of incompetent medics?! And I feel like the medical examiner should address it. 🤷🏼‍♀️ this is important information to help determine how long he was out in the cold. What do you think, LegalBytes?

[@Raymail-tj4cf]

But all the Troopers gave medical stuff.

[@dkime95]

Someone on twitter pointed out the “K” on her shoulder and now I can’t unsee it! 😂 most likely 99.95% completely unrelated but just imagine 🤔

[@mighty0974]

What do they say on Twitter? I thought it was a chromosome. There is even more on that arm.

[@chuckfitzpatrick9147]

Yes, I’m new to this video feed. Most importantly I want to say thank you. Very helpful and well defined. Good graphics with your chart. I would like to reserve comment, about guilt, until the jury has made a decision. Catholic comment, I’m not God.

[@WrenMcCabre]

Has an ME ever testified on the defense side before? Asking because the ME looked more comfortable on cross. She looked like she wanted to say something else and was holding back. I'm feeling a zebras/horses situation. Injuries more likely fight/car accident? Fight.

[@TheLuceon]

I got the impression she was feeling pressured to align with prosecution but doesn't believe it herself. Pressured by who? IDK, could be police, could be Lally, could even be the whole media blitz and feeling like she is supposed to side with prosecution. Still, her answers that tried to support Lally just looked like she was almost squirming to get out.

[@WrenMcCabre]

@@TheLuceon I had exactly the same feeling.

[@emmawheeler8559]

Well covered! ❤

[@vistuscaine]

I don't think Procter is xenophobic. Seemed like he thought she was a flaky, tattooed "whackjob" of a woman. I thought her testimony was intelligent and professional, but like you conceded some people have a stigma towards tattoos.

[@TheLuceon]

The tattoo women was not that one Proctor was referring to in his texts, its was the women who testified after her.

[@hkr667]

Agree with Luceon and IMO it's more simple, Proctor and his colleagues just think that anyone that doesn't agree with them and does as they say is a whack-job. Could be true regarding John, too, as it is still VERY suspicious to me that a Boston cop died and no other cop seemed to care.

[@PoppyMom1]

Sorry if this has been asked and answered already but which one of these ME’s was a certain Trooper calling a”…whack job”? Is it the Dr in the black jacket/white shirt or was it the other Dr in the green with the tattoos? I must admit that I’m not the biggest fan of tattoos (although I do appreciate the art that is used to create them) but I did find that those sleeve tattoos were quite distracting as well as the one that looked like a K.

[@yolandabizzell5852]

Dr in the black jacket/white shirt.

[@PoppyMom1]

@@yolandabizzell5852 Thank you so much for the clarification because I have seen it being attributed to both of these ladies.

[@yolandabizzell5852]

@@PoppyMom1 No worries luv!! There's so much info being thrown around in this circus of a case. It's easy to get confused!

[@nubia1559]

I was a little lost in the timeline, I wasn't paying attention properly at the time and got lost. prosecution say it happened between 12h18 and 12h36?

[@Stacy-]

Basically, their timelines didn't match their theory or the witnesses who testified about what time they saw Karen's car at McCabe's & when it left. According to the prosecution cell phone data, Karen's phone automatically connected to John's home Wi-Fi by 12:36 am. The witnesses & prosecution claim she was still at the McCabe's later than that... Jen McCabe said she saw Karen's car at 12:42 am. The accident, according to the CW, happened around 12:45 am. The ring camera footage mysteriously disappears too. So they have a note from a cop saying she got to John's at 12:41 am. You were lost because it doesn't make sense. Someone's clocks/data is off?

[@LinZLou2000]

Too much doubt. The common wealth time of death when they started is when Karen Read was home according to their own cell phone guy. Trooper Paul’s reconstruction was ridiculous and defied common sense. You’d maybe send a couple voicemails to cover tracks (they’d probably be “I love you, see you at home) but 8 crazy, “I’m not your babysitter pervert” and like 53 dials? She thought he was alive. Then their own medical examiner said the injuries didn’t fall in line with classic pedestrian strike, and she couldn’t determine manner of death. Plus adding on the tow truck driver seeing that Ford edge, and the injuries on his arm looks like other pictures of dog attacks I’ve seen. Not to mention the incredibly incompetent investigation, and obvious bias of the investigators. There’s not just one reasonable piece of doubt, there’s like a dozen.

[@LKMNOP]

Don't forget the blood collected in solo cups. I'll never be able to drink out of one again

[@sbecker1265]

Alyte, no, the vms show someone who thinks her boyfriend is effing another chick. Beyond that every cop, every witness is a liar. I’ve only been paying attention to this for a week and I still don’t know why this guy died.

[@amandamandamands]

I take GPS data with a grain of salt. I have my location turned on for google maps and when I look at the timeline it is most of the time crazy accurate. I then have other times where it has decided that I was walking around for hours in the area directly around my house. I have other times where it has decided that I teleported to the shops at the bottom of the hill from where I live and walked around them for hours in the middle of the night (and then teleported back).

[@HDnursepractitioner]

The voicemails mean nothing to me except that she didn’t know he was dead. They had a dysfunctional relationship, who cares. I think it’s shitty they played these voicemails. She was distraught. lol, she wasn’t going to hurt him. Please. Lol, this means nothing

[@ickess]

It’s a shame he wasn’t wearing an Apple Watch. When he hit the ground, it would’ve gone off and called 911. Mine has done that a couple of times when I’ve been hammering or even once when I did actually fall it asked if I was OK.

[@Jack-bc5xg]

She just called to say I hate you!

[@FlappyBelly]

Why did she say he was a pervert?

[@Alemaniaturquia]

Most important is medical examiner. She agree with defense. Lally got Mad. At the medical examiner

[@beatrizsmith7293]

Sad John didn't see the Celtics win.

[@mostlyvoid.partiallystars]

I think both MEs were believable and professional. I really liked them. Especially Dr Scordi-Bello (spelling is crap, I’m sorry!) But if I had to guess they were saved til last - specifically after Karen’s voicemails - because two very professional and experienced MEs both agreed this couldn’t definitively be classified a homocide. I still can’t believe the case has even been brought given that and the quality (hah) of the investigation.

[@mostlyvoid.partiallystars]

Also I appreciate you point to attachment styles to somewhat explain their behavior. JOK comes off as a dick and Karen comes off as a shrew but that’s very reductionist and judgey of me and I know there’s a world of life and personality we don’t see in this courtroom 😊

[@HLB313]

🎶 ”Red solo cup….” 🎶

[@IJamesCordenLoveMyWife]

Xenophobia as the reason for calling someone who doesn’t agree with you a whack job is a massive stretch

[@susanwilliams8919]

I love being one of the first comments!! Your content is amazing

[@LegalBytesMedia]

Thank you so much!! 💙

[@JackieHerron-p4k]

Why would they kill John in the house and then throw him out in front for everyone to see just knowing that Karen was going to go looking for him they can't be that stupid besides phone evidence proves that he didn't even make it into the house

[@cynthiawhissell9440]

Appreciate your recaps Karen.

[@mattcoats8369]

Idk how this even made it to trail….

[@EricChipko]

Tattoo woman was a real surprise and potentially risky. Her testimony confirmed her expert knowledge that was more specialized than Greek,Italian woman. It just seemed unnecessary. Tattoo was just as uncertain about anything necessary as Greek. It was a lame attempt to use a lot of medical jargon to convince of something. The investigation was good because Cw had the most big words?

[@BrickRoadVisuals]

So she killed him, and then, knowing he's dead on the lawn, she intentionally left vm raging at him to 'cover her tracks'. Yeah, makes sense 🤷‍♀️

[@justinjay2318]

Finally an autopsy. I’ve been very neutral about this case. The voicemails does seem very damaging. Waze can be not very accurate as my family use religiously. I do like Jackson’s cross also.

[@chrystalmcatee6224]

Damaging to what?

[@jillruben8924]

@@chrystalmcatee6224she felt used by him. She has Crohns which is debilitating. I’ve had over 8 years. MS. I feel so sorry for her.

[@chrystalmcatee6224]

​@@jillruben8924but they in no way shape or form are damaging in the respect that they show her guilt. If anything, they completely exonerate her! I feel sorry for her too, this is horrific but the FBI is gonna take them all down! They were already investigating this PD for corruption when this whole thing happened and they're doing their own independent investigation of the real killers!

[@estefaniaacosta2450]

Red solo cup haha I fill you up

[@reneearnett8761]

That judge is sooooo bias!

[@mangojerry2330]

Karen Lesen

[@suzimonkey345]

🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹

[@suzimonkey345]

🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟

[@wendychilders9658]

He got out of the car, slipped as she was driving off scraping himself , dog was out and attacked him biting him, Then he stumbled around in his drunken state, slipped again losing his shoe and wandered around and finally went down for the final count hitting his head on the fire hydrant. Nobody noticed dog because it ran to the back to the back door. He never did get into the house. She is quilty of driving drunk and hitting Johns car. The police made evidence fit their narrative.

[@HLB313]

This is interesting, but why all the disposing of phones and conflicting statements? The others at the party would have no reason not to agree with this version, unless they’re all malevolent enough to frame KR without absolving anyone else?

[@chrystalmcatee6224]

The extreme extent they went and the overwhelming coordination of their efforts to dispose of evidence and jump to framing an innocent person makes your theory all but impossible. Not to mention the overwhelming evidence that this man was beaten within an inch of his life & left for dead! That is murder and conspiracy to cover up and frame an innocent woman!

[@PhoebeMc]

Where I live, no one is allowed in a courtroom in a sleeveless garment. She wouldn't have even been allowed in had she planned to testify here. There's courtroom decorum & her mode of dress is inappropriate. I'm old & old fashioned. I thought she was very good, BUT her posture bothered me in that holding her chin up so high made her look down her nose at others. So, besides wearing her bridesmaids dress for her sister's wedding, not covering her tattoo, & wearing lashes that are likely kept in a cage at her home made her overall look a bit to be desired. 😅

[@sunshinemuldoon]

I'm neither old nor old-fashioned (well...) but the one time I was deposed, my employer's lawyer suggested (strongly) that I wear a suit. Better safe than sorry. And I am with you on the false eyelashes. Save them for the club. 💃

[@KDSima]

I get the feeling about tattoos. But, I live in the Pacific NW. Tattoos are a thing here, and most people wouldn’t look twice at it. Gauges used to be a thing here too. Thank goodness that is over. I was just thinking the other day how long it has been since I have seen those👍🏻🤷‍♀️💙🩵.

[@shantoreywilkins651]

🙊🙉🙈🧑‍🏫🧑‍⚖️

[@treekitty3136]

💙🩵💙🩵

[@LauraVee63]

I think you're wrong on this one; KR is guilty.

[@realhousewifeoftransylvania1.0]

Maybe you're not emotionally intelligent enough to see why those vms fit into the picture of her hitting him. She was in a drunken rage and hit him. You really believe ALL THESE people including paramedics and everyone is conspiring against her😂😂😂, wow.

[@AlmondNebula]

I don’t agree with the whole judging someone cause they have tattoos this is 2024. Everyone has tattoos. It’s not like it’s not more need to deal with the program and give us the current and that’s with this whole oh she has tattoo so she’s not gonna be a good weekend that’s bullshit.