Kathleen Stock: Why I feel sorry for the students trying to ban me

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Philosopher Kathleen Stock has become one of Britain’s most radical voices of reason, celebrated for her incisive cultural theory. She joined Freddie Sayers at the UnHerd Club for an evening of conversation about the Western crisis of meaning and how to read the myths we tell ourselves.
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#UnHerd #KathleenStock #Transgender

[@OliverDobbs]

I go to one of the Oxford colleges that passed a motion against Kathleen. I’m sick of a tiny minority of students making the rest of us look like intolerant despots. If they think they’re on the right side of history why won’t they let the ideas be debated in public forums? It’s because they’re wrong, and history will prove them to be wrong.

[@mogznwaz]

Thank god for sane young people - but you have to challenge them more or they remain the only voice

[@cleverclark4834]

yes, but history can't prove anything, it is a really wrong term that means nothing. Reality is proving things, humans are proving things and those can be proven in the present, history is supposed to document it and as we see, there is a LOT of lies and bias in historical research

[@thomasm1964]

For the same reason the playground bully never asked you nicely if you could spare a few pennies from your dinner money.

[@davebannister323]

Oliver thanks for your msg on here , i think most right minded people will know & see that it IS the " tiny minority , vocal loudmouths " who are clearly Anti Establishment . Many will one day have to face REALITY , Sooner or later this DIVERSITY BUBBLE WILL BURST .

[@lizziebkennedy7505]

Tiny minority? Better do some actual research.

[@Appleblade]

Now that I hear her directly talk about the worldview, I see why she was chased out of academia... she's far too erudite and sensible to be tolerated by loons.

[@davesmith826]

Not all of academia is filled with loons - just certain departments, institutions and subject areas. Gender studies is a prime example of the latter, but post-colonialism and postmodernism have churned up their fair share of nutters, as has politics.

[@mariom2424]

She sounds Nice But this NEW theory interpretation That now we HAVE. What.?? GENDER IDENTITY AND BIO DO NOT MATCH. WELL. ANOTHER EXCUSE TO IMPOSE THEIR IDEAS. HERSELF A LESBIAN. NEEDS TO FIND AND SPREAD DIFFERENT THEORIES INTERPRETATIONS SPECIALLY BEEN IN ACADEMIA. WHERE THIS THEORIES CAN BE PLANTED IN THE MINDS OF THE YOUNG ADULTS TO MAKE HOMOSEXUALITY REAL WHEN IN REALITY IS AN INDIVIDUAL HUMAN SEXUAL PREFERENCE FOR WHATEVER REASON. CHOSEN BY HIM OR HER.

[@opinion3742]

So, you think there is a clampdown on erudition in academia? Well that pretty much sums up the absurdity of the position taken up by reactionaries and bigots alike.

[@thewerewolfofnorway437]

@@opinion3742 positions like what? Men can't have babies?

[@maireadb.4271]

​@davesmith826 Unfortunately, gender ideology has permeated many universities & fields, including psychology, biology, psychiatry, etc. It's quite scary.

[@aindriubradleymarshall6226]

“When you tear out a man's tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you're only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” George R.R. Martin ........

[@mikalina1]

"In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." George Orwell...

[@terrorists-are-among-us]

They're cowards not victims 🙄🤡

[@michaeljust1193]

Even if he cuts off his penis he's still a man , a man with no penis .

[@hansiesma16]

“Stupid is as stupid does.” Forest Gump😳

[@opinion3742]

But they don't like what she has to say. They do think that it is harmful rhetoric.

[@JJ-ic6pn]

My favourite saying... You can ignore reality, but you can't ignore the consequences of ignoring reality.

[@caro1ns]

I love that!

[@LoneWulf278]

Brilliant!

[@ramadev2309]

It's there a particular person this saying is attributed to JJ? I do my best to ignore certain realities, some that regard me directly, others which don't, maybe that's the cause of my sense of being followed and persecuted!? 🤔😬🤷🏽‍♀️😉

[@ArtPhotographerLindsay]

@@ramadev2309 Ayn Rand.

[@ramadev2309]

Thank you@@ArtPhotographerLindsay, I might give her a read someday, maybe it's about time.

[@spicedxxx4814]

A huge loss for Sussex Uni. Shame on them for allowing students to bully a PROFESSOR. What happened is so wrong...

[@onepartyroule]

She’s such a charming, sweet, intelligent person; it makes me so angry that she was abused like that. Where was the teacher’s union?

[@keishagibbs3195]

Her union threw her under the bus and that's when she resigned.

[@et1016]

The teachers union is in bed with the teachers.

[@earlgreystoke3324]

@onepartyroule "Where was the teacher's union?" Teacher's unions are hotbeds of Marxist activism. They are the enemy of facts, logic & reason.

[@onepartyroule]

@@et1016 Yes, like a humourless Morcambe & Wise.

[@markstephens5118]

The teachers' union is part of the problem ,they, like most if not all of the bureaucracies, lost all courage, commonsense, and any understanding of who they are supposed to be working for .

[@aquajuwel7098]

As a gay man who was very feminine growing up, I think if it was today and not 1980 they would put me on hormones, if someone had asked me if I felt like a girl i probably would have said yes. I got to puberty and things changed, still gay, but I became more masculine and definitely was and is a man. I think it is insane that children are told to question their gender based on unscientific babble from so called health professionals and trans activists. Sadly the gay movement that I was a part of before all of this trans thing has now been completely taken over by the trans mafia, gay, lesbians and bi people are being slaughtered to push this agenda……and it’s dragging us all down in the mud. I’m glad LGB alliance exists…gender theory and being gay, lesbian or bi has nothing to do with trans no matter what anyone is saying, it’s completely separate!

[@selwynr]

They're NOT told to, you bigot.

[@ambientjohnny]

@@selwynr A woman, is an adult human female, it is not an "identity" or a feeling, dress, attitude etc., that whole line of thinking is regressive in the extreme. Claiming there is some "essence" to "womanhood" that also males can access, but the reality is that women do not have to look or act any certain way, or act out some ludicrously sexist idea of the “social role of a woman”, all females who reach adulthood are women regardless of how they feel or look, and the one thing they ALL have in common, the one experience they ALL share, is that they are FEMALE, they do not have to "identify" as anything, they physically ARE women because they are female. Why should MALES be allowed access to SINGLE-SEX spaces reserved for FEMALES based on their "gender identity"? If sex and gender are separate, then a male announcing his "gender identity" is "trans woman" does nothing to change their sex, they are still MALE - so why should they be afforded rights reserved for the opposite SEX? The movement is regressively sexist, and misogynistic. Why do you believe females do not deserve any spaces free of males? What is hateful about upholding female sex-based rights that were fought long and hard for?

[@cango5679]

As I have understand it - follow the money. This "trans mafia" is not an organic movement of "trans people" but an orchestrated one with many many so called "useful idiots" doing their work, thinking they are doing something good. But - just follow the money - great powers have been invested into this.

[@MK-ih6wp]

It's all bigpharma and transhumanism. Really scary. Thanks for speaking up.

[@autumnnite1803]

@@ambientjohnny Exactly!

[@jimpickard3850]

Full of respect for her after the disgusting way she has been treated. Wish you well Kathleen.

[@opinion3742]

Tell me, do you believe that the rest of the staff in Universities are merely going along with trans "ideology" in order just to keep their jobs? And what is it that you think makes this group of people so powerful?

[@Miamaiya]

Thank you, Kathleen, for speaking up for women, girls, lesbians, science and truth!

[@hansemannluchter643]

You know that a lot of us terrribly white, straight, males also agree, right?

[@supergreen3233]

Also disabled and terminally ill people everywhere apparently born into the 'right' bodies, and apparently privileged!

[@reddragonready]

@@hansemannluchter643 Yes but much as some white straight males like to pretend, you are not under attack by the woke movement as much as women and lesbians are....once again

[@opinion3742]

She speaks for her own beliefs, and is applauded by those that share her beliefs. She does not speak for women, girls, lesbians, in general. And she is not speaking for science, or the medical establishment. And she certainly isn't speaking for truth. She is doing what all reactionary bigots have done for all time, she is attempting to create a moral panic and turn a marginalized group into the villain.

[@mothball5425]

​@@hansemannluchter643 yes and we appreciate it

[@dominicdodd9759]

Dr Stock's view that this is a minority, and one which could be ignored if the majority spoke out is undoubtely true. However, as can be seen in many examples, there may be a severe risk to ones academic career in speaking out. Last month, Riley Gaines was physically attached at San Fransicsco State University when trying to speak about trans women in womens sports. After the attack, Jamillah Moore, vice president for Student Affairs & Enrollment Management at SFSU said that the students protesting against Gaines: “.... took tremendous bravery to stand in a challenging space, I am proud of the moments where we listened and asked insightful questions.” When the support for these vocal - and sometimes violent minorites - is entrenched in senior, powerful positions in universities it is small wonder most students decide to keep their heads down.

[@dragonfox2.058]

these people are so dishonest and cynical...and self hating

[@Relayer6a]

I saw an interview with Elon Musk. The interviewer asked him why he says and does the things he does when it's going to hurt him financially. He said the last thing he would do is compromise himself for power or money. Musk openly admits he voted for Biden. But when he saw the corruption that occurred during the elections at Twitter he did what any person should have done and outed it. Even though the election went the way he wanted it to. And he's not afraid of the consequences. I personally fear for the safety of these outspoken people. You mention Gaines getting attacked. That's nothing compared to what some of the very powerful "connected" people will do to shut up someone who threatens them. We've seen it happen in other places in the world. Where "political dissonants" disappear or go to jail. When I was growing up (I'm 66 now) I never thought anything like that could happen in America. Maybe I was too naive, because I do remember Bobby Kennedy.

[@hadamerryweather577]

And Jamilah was a woman of color, likely.

[@xChinky123x]

Just a pleasure to hear how coherent and thoughtful Kathleen is in comparison to the parrots that would try to silence her wifh mindless chanting

[@arawiri]

Harry harry i krishna krishna i moo tea moo tea you in a hurry garri

[@user-sw2lv3zp6o]

Most of whom wouldn't have got anywhere near Oxford in the old days.

[@NiaLaLa_V]

It's weird isn't it? Even the angry women on this side are still calmer and more coherent than the TRAs.

[@ZambeziKid]

I though quite the opposite. She said a lot but ultimately made no points.

[@user-sw2lv3zp6o]

@@ZambeziKid You nobviously weren't listening properly.

[@gavinheron1]

As a male university lecturer in Scotland for over 20 years I hold heartedly agree with what is being said. Keep up the fight, the tide is turning against this identity nonsense.

[@opinion3742]

And how exactly would you like to resolve the "problem" of the trans community existing?

[@audreysuter4315]

@@opinion3742 by ignoring them

[@opinion3742]

@@audreysuter4315 How is that going to work? Surely you need to get everyone else to ignore them too? But why would any sane, compassionate, caring, normal, human being want to act like such a dick anyway?

[@audreysuter4315]

@@opinion3742 precisely because they are neither sane nor compassionate themselves, probably more like dicks

[@thewerewolfofnorway437]

@@opinion3742 keep it away from our kids, stay out of womens spaces.

[@timkinss]

When an adult is obliged to cite as a position they have to defend that "there is some sort of reality"

[@newleft2254]

Even if you don’t agree with her, you can’t deny that she is brilliant and hearing her perspective is like a breath of fresh air. I’m so tired and BORED of the same old crap liberal extremists keep spewing and the chains they’ve put on the everyone who dares to think differently. I honestly feel so desperate and thirsty for a different perspective; to meet people whose opinions and stance I can’t guess in 2.3 seconds because they all seem to be the same now. Thank you Dr Stock for being brave and for being YOU!

[@sylviam6535]

These people are the new Red Guard.

[@dragonfox2.058]

Wow I understand completely it's so draining

[@lizziebkennedy7505]

Of course I can. She says the same old discredited rubbish. This isn’t scholarly at all. Scholarship requires reasoned rebuttal.

[@LizaFan]

She threatened to sue a student group at Oxford. She threatened to sue a student journo at Sussex. She leveraged her influence to get a grad student fired from the APA blog. 9:22 "There's this new thing where they have to exhibit joy at every protest." Insipid horseshit. Possibly worse than trans lesbians "only had the chutzpah to self-define into existence in the last 10 years." 0:54 "most of them are they/thems, which just means they have interesting hair" 9:02 "a bunch of very anxious, neurotic, self-absorbed teenagers and young twenty-somethings" This is the way she characterizes her students, as well as her political opponents. This kind of person shouldn't be a teacher. “People could see how much happier I was. It suited me down to the ground. I felt like my whole world transformed for the better. It’s cheesy but it was like there was a puzzle that had been all mixed up and I’d known it was all mixed up, and suddenly it was resolved and made into a picture and the picture was good.” - Stock She refuses this basic dignity to trans people.

[@hansemannluchter643]

​@@lizziebkennedy7505 Right, and men can have periods, become pregnant and give birth. Hell, we can even chest-feed!!

[@ericbrown7297]

The object of attending University is to obtain the ability of critical thinking. If these students and academics are afraid to debate then they do not belong in a University environment. She speaks a lot of sense, if you do not agree with her, debate her, do not try and cancel her.

[@zeno2501]

I am always very impressed by Stock. I love her contemplative gaze.

[@leptonboson7174]

Dear Kathleen, to give it a depth of a content...: You are NOT a terrible person. You are great.

[@opinion3742]

Nope, she is pretty bad.

[@zeenuf00]

@@opinion3742 fake woketroll account

[@opinion3742]

@@zeenuf00 very silly remark

[@zeenuf00]

@@opinion3742 fake woketroll account

[@thewerewolfofnorway437]

@@opinion3742 nope, she's not.

[@sumosher]

always a pleasure to hear your words, Kathleen xx

[@karenfriesen280]

Would love to hear Kathleen and Dr. Julie Ponesse (brave and wonderful Canadian ethics professor who lost her job over vaccine mandates) have a conversation. Two brilliant women whose voices the world desperately needs right now.

[@simonclarke4156]

We as adults, parents and grandparents etc. are responsible for the world young people live in. We as busy stressed people abandoned them to the market to distract them from our inability to be present because we're exhausted. This is what we need to come to terms with.

[@casteretpollux]

Yes. Small families, too far away from grandmothers, mother's doing too jobs. And another factor is very deliberate fostering of identity politics to distract us from how unequal our society has become.

[@thinkingoutloud7425]

Thank you for the shout out to extended families!..........the family used to be extended and now is barely nuclear.

[@TurdFergusen]

You mean we ourselves have hidden in social media and have ignored our children until they become trannies or gay… just for attention.

[@cursedcancersurvivor]

Students moving away to colleges, in which they are then indoctrinated into woke ideology by woke "professors" and are told their parents snd the older generation are racists and bigots and that current society must be torn down.

[@DelphineTheWorstBladeEver]

This is such a mature thing to have to admit. It really is the parenting, and always has been the parenting. Parents are not preparing their children for healthy living.

[@kathenitzsche3809]

Eine sympathische Frau. Ich kann sehr viel damit anfangen, was sie sagt. Eine Handvoll junger Menschen hat große Angst (kein Wunder in einer atomisierten Gesellschaft), sie verdienen Mitgefühl, aber es ist auch wichtig eine klare Grenze zu setzen. Ich habe viele Kollegen und Kolleginnen auch ab 30, die diese Identitätsprobleme haben, sich aber für politisch korrekt halten und alle anderen für Nazis.

[@binghamguevara6814]

The lgbtqya2+ created that “we are normal”/“they’re Nazis” binary. Give them political protection, and things will get worse.

[@robinhood4640]

Many youngsters today would prefer you cut off one of their feet, than take their phone away.

[@stevecharman8420]

Kathleen's so clear-minded and articulate, a breath of fresh air. I hope we're able to work through these years of ideological madness and come out the other side more aware of the dangers of rabid authoritarianism.

[@simonwiltshire7089]

Great to hear Kathleen make the intelligent points she does. It is people like her who will lead us out of the woke mess we are in.

[@ZambeziKid]

Pls can you describe on of those "ntelligent points" bcos I didnt hear her make any.

[@LizaFan]

@@ZambeziKid Good luck finding any. She wilts under the lightest criticism. Utterly *wilts.*

[@pete3953]

@@LizaFan Criticism implies rational debate and challenges to her position. But the trans crowd don't get involved in rational debate. Either they will do their best to prevent people like her from presenting their position or, instead of debate will scream "transphobe", "bigot" or whatever other epithet their warped brains can summon up. Not surprising of course since there is no evidence-based support for their beliefs, so they know how stupid they will appear if they attempt anything approaching a rational debate.

[@euanmacleod3738]

@@ZambeziKid I mean, essentially everything she says is coherent and well articulated - to go over all her good points would be to transcribe her whole book, or at least to write a deluge of bullet points. The better question would be what points, specifically, do you consider to be weak? The general stance that biological sex is objectively real, denotes a distinct group that is worthy of advocacy, requires language to describe it, and is more culturally significant than gender as a disembodied construct... is very, very robust. As best I can tell, the most common complaint against her is that her view on keeping protected spaces for biological women (or people who present as biological women, as she clarifies) is a damning judgement of trans-identifying people... but she very rightly points out that this is no more true against trans-identifying people as it is against all biological men, but this is the only way protected spaces can work. If the protected space cannot discern who enters it, then it literally is not a protected space, but that doesn't mean we think ALL men are predators.

[@euanmacleod3738]

@@LizaFan What criticism have you seen her struggle with? I've seen her in a number of debates, and I've only ever seen her calmly and respectfully dismantle any counter arguments offered to her, while very robustly articulating her own gender-critical position. Is there a place you can direct me to see her utterly wilting under criticism?

[@Philosopherdude91]

She was my metaethics professor in graduate school at Sussex, in 2015-2016. Looking back, she was having difficulty teaching the course. When I realized (much later) that she was under-fire like this at the time, I really sympathize with her.

[@Grimenoughtomaketherobotcry]

She appears to me to be someone who has been subjected to unrelenting extreme stress. I think she can be forgiven for any times she's reaching for words.

[@UteHeggenTranswidowHeals]

We trans widows, that is, ex-wives of suddenly 24/7 crossdressing men, know the rage, the illogic & targeting. Thx from YT channel, Trans Widow Ute Heggen

[@rigilchrist]

As Andrew Doyle has eloquently described in his excellent book "the new puritans", it is not the deluded kids that are causing all this nonsense - it is the adults who empower them.

[@anthonybrett]

"Which means they have interesting hair." So true. Stay strong Kathleen!

[@lizziebkennedy7505]

Because that’s a keen rebuttal of a complex point. Ad hominem is unscholarly and anti-intellectual .

[@hansemannluchter643]

​@@lizziebkennedy7505 You are anti-reality. And obviously a troon.

[@ohwellwhateverr]

@@lizziebkennedy7505 It’s called humour, Lizzie. Maybe you should take a break from pontificating and try it sometime.

[@anthonybrett]

​@@lizziebkennedy7505 So are we not allowed to make comical tongue in cheek comments when disusing topics? It's certainly a pattern observable in the gender ideologue groups she speaks off. What's wrong with pointing it out, even if it's a stereotype. Its funny. As in 'haha' funny. You know...humour. The clear majority of Kathy's time was spent making arguments based on rationality and reason. Lets not turn little exceptions into hyperbole shall we.

[@ScottytheBlueBunny]

@Brett Anthony I dunno. her opening they thems remark is a pretty garbage take to make when you're on the defense. she wants the fight.

[@louiseparker1915]

Kathleen Stock has a great sense of humour. 😂

[@mothball5425]

Amazing she's kept it 💪

[@simonboland]

How amusing as she puts it. Students from Oxford who are on track to management consulting roles.

[@hurstmitchell6392]

The reality is most are probably not suitable for university. In my day, it was only 10% of the population who were the brightest and the best of their peer group.

[@ohsweetmystery]

Yes, the idea that going to university will somehow make stupid people any better is patently ridiculous.

[@underbelly69]

everybody should be free to give university a shot, not just the elite.. wokeness is a side effect of social media rabbit holes grooming young minds, empowering neuroses of the confused. universities are now mired in sheltered feelings and trigger warnings

[@sylviam6535]

@@ohsweetmystery - Jordan Peterson said that they actually come out dumber at the other end.

[@casteretpollux]

Including you?

[@casteretpollux]

@@sylviam6535 That certainly applies to Peterson.

[@ciganyweaverandherperiwink6293]

Fantastic. The laughter added such a welcome tone...the energy of the room radiated a clear communal feeling of people being sincerely curious, emotionally relaxed and psychologically well-integrated. The easy laughter seemed almost 'retro'-- you don't get that often in these ugly 'culture war' skirmishes, either online or off. The entire clip displayed a really refreshing, reassuring kind of level-headed attitude in the audience and I found that really enjoyable. The room just seemed full of smart, fun, normal people (for lack of a better word). It came off-- to me as a viewer at home-- as almost retro! A terrific reminder of how issues like this would have been discussed by intelligent, curious, emotionally stable and well-socialised people in the 1990s pre-internet. Nowadays it's not fun at all. People really do seem different in the world post-internet...almost vibrating with hysterical, solipsistic, juvenile anger and unable to manage their emotional incontinence and underdeveloped thinking. These enormously immature 'culture war' rucks going on continuously all over the West read like live-action academic thought experiments mixed with developmental hormonal surges, untreated psychological disorders and fashion trend obsession. What a combustion! There are no 'conversations'; there's only strident, vicious, manipulative, hysterical hardline lecturing and manipulating. I'm not convinced the communication technology known as The Internet has actually been great for humans at this stage of our evolutionary development but that's another conversation entirely. I really enjoyed this, thank you so much for hosting and then uploading.

[@dashcamvideos6742]

Employers are just crazy if they hire these activists. They are looking at years of lawsuits from them or against them. I am seeing this more and more. People are sick of them and are now fighting back. Lots are suing now.

[@Coromi1]

They want employees that behave without a conscience towards subs, collegues and customers/ readers/ viewers. These are the personalities that go all in for that.

[@elliejane1459]

She says "the idea that you can force others to view you as you view yourself is bonkers". She is right, it is bonkers. Piwer and control.

[@llIlIlllII]

For anyone who has lost friends and even had family turn their back to you because you refuse to go along with wokism.. you're not alone. It's so painful. I wish this wasn't happening.

[@lizziebkennedy7505]

Human rights? You refuse human rights. Aha.

[@LizaFan]

Maybe consider listening to the people you presume to call family. That's a start.

[@mariom2424]

Do not WORRY. THOSE THAT REJECT YOU POLLUTE AND DAMAGE YOU . IF THEY DO NOT ACCEPT YOU BECAUSE YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH THEM. DO NOT WAIST YOUR PRECIOUS LIFETIME LIVE FREE MAKE YOUR DECISIONS GET AWAY FROM THESE SOCIOPATHS. YOU DO NOT NEED THEM. THERE ARE PLENTY OF GOOD PEOPLE OUT THERE GOD WILL DRAW THEM TO YOUR PATH. FIND AND HEAR AND REASON WHAT SOMEONE LIKE MR JORDAN B PETERSON TEACHES. ENJOY LIFE. AND TAKE CARE. .

[@euanmacleod3738]

@@lizziebkennedy7505 Strange, they never said they refused human rights, but that is what you read. Are you cosplaying as the family that turned their back on them?

[@matthewmcclusky3544]

Unfortunately for me and likely you, I realized too late that everything that is going on politically and culturally taps into the same primitive part of our brain (amygdala) that religion does. So trying to reason with them is a very unreasonable thing to do.

[@kevinmcnamara860]

That second last sentence-there’s always been a small number of narcissists is spot on- we just have to stand up to arseholes

[@dragonfox2.058]

seem to be a LOT more of them here lately

[@LizaFan]

Stock is dispositionally unequipped to be a teacher - or any job that involves interaction with young people.

[@hansemannluchter643]

​@@LizaFan OK troon. Anyone else you care to cancel while you're at it?

[@scswp6945]

@@LizaFan Really? That’s the extent and depth of your opinion? And your reasoning is…?

[@Grimenoughtomaketherobotcry]

I'm afraid it will take more than just that. This isn't just about university students. In addition to academia, this ideology has captured the commanding heights of the legal profession, civil service and corporate HR departments in most of the English-speaking world. Here in Canada, I just read an opinion piece in the Globe and Mail, what was once referred to as the, "national paper of record", that argued any expression of "transphobic ideology" should be considered a terrorist offence, rather than a hate crime. Honest disagreement with rainbow flags flying from publicly funded schools is, to this person's way of thinking, to be equated to an act of terrorism. What is really scary is that there are many in the professions I mentioned who would entirely and uncritically agree with her view.

[@daniaratiba6443]

she's so fucking cool! such composure and clarity throughout it all

[@maxineallen5673]

yes, I'm totally straight but I think I could fall in love with her!

[@daniaratiba6443]

@@maxineallen5673 hehe ^^ bisexual myself, i would love a woman who could stoke my bravery and grace in the way she could!!

[@acc426]

I wish Ms Stock were my professor!

[@dragonfox2.058]

I wish she were my lover! 💜

[@graceb3934]

Such an intelligent, insightful and compassionate woman...funny too!

[@pas2pb]

Is Unherd aware that a majority of NUJ members recently voted *against* a motion stating the union’s intention to protect journalists facing abuse and damage to their livelihoods when reporting on the gender debate?

[@rl7012]

Those students are brainwashed woke sheep then.

[@gerhard7323]

Journalists no longer supporting freedom of speech and of the press? Who'd've thunk it. At least they've had the decency to finally let us know for sure what many of us long suspected.

[@sylviam6535]

That should not only have been passed, but extended to all identity politics. Anyway, I’m not surprised: they are brainwashed cowards.

[@shiva_productions]

Love this amazing woman!! Keep speaking up Kathleen!

[@L.I.T.H.I.U.M]

She's really blunt. Haven't heard of her before. The positive side of this obsession with gender identity is making these voices known.

[@AF-gd7fh]

I could listen to her and Helen Joyce talk all day. They're both extremely blunt.

[@Bertrussell396]

It’s true, incredibly intelligent minds are being exposed by the “Woke” and brought to the light! Im grateful for that!

[@adriant240]

I really like the way she expresses herself and thinks. It's quite a rare trait for a woman. It's very refreshing and with high intellectual depth.

[@L.I.T.H.I.U.M]

I don't have the same experience. I have met as many brilliant women in my life as men, if not more. @@adriant240

[@valeriecherylirving4048]

It’s not ok to stop anyone from listening to her …if they don’t want to see or listen they don’t need to see her do they ? They can cancel themselves!

[@opinion3742]

What you think people should be forced to give up their time and endlessly debate someone who won't back down from their bigoted position? It makes sense to cut the rot out. It is not going to be magically transformed into something positive and healthy.

[@zeenuf00]

@@opinion3742 fake woketroll account

[@angrygopnik2317]

​@@opinion3742 "It makes sense to cut the rot out" The world will cancel YOU to cut the rot out.

[@opinion3742]

@@angrygopnik2317 You think that the world should cancel anyone who stands up for the marginalized and the vulnerable? I wish I could educate bigots out of their hate. They are determined to make it an uphill battle just to have the same rights as them. How does anyone look at that and think it is what the world needs?

[@w.sommen5209]

@@opinion3742 marginalised and vulnerable ? In your head only. At the moment they have more privileges than anyone else. The only ones i hope will be marginalised are people like you who make it more difficult than ever for lesbians, male homosexuals and real transpeople to integrate in normal life as they have done already for years before the fakes found it necessary to make it a freak show to get attention. Example; lesbian women being cohersed into having sex with transwomen ( who are actually men) because “ a transwoman is a woman”?! The problem is that you people want to impose your ideology on everybody else including children and silence everybody who doesn’t agree. That’s facisme!

[@philipanthony9596]

Kathleen is a star. Nothing more to be said, except… she just happens to be right. If you doubt it, read the book first, then come back and argue your case 😊

[@yinoveryang4246]

Shame is the driving force. Deep down, they are aware of how absurd they appear, and as a result, they deal with their own self-loathing and project their own inclination to judge onto others. Regrettably their peculiar fashion sense, somewhere between a 1984 Greenpeace rally and Crufts terrier category - these individuals are often not the most naturally attractive. This only adds to the discomfort many feel when encountering them. So they must cope with the natural tendency that many have to recoil from them on a daily basis, which inevitably leads to anger. As Kathleen points out,(who would've been singing from a vey similar hymn sheet 35 years ago, the irony is not lost on her clearly) theyre trying to make the whole world drink their Kool-Aid, which tastes like expired milk

[@lauraortu7104]

Amazing talk if you can see the whole conversation (I just registered for the UnHerd Club), she is a great soul, and I simply cannot believe still academic places such as Cambridge a few months ago and Oxford now keeps bullying her...and Academic are just being silent...astonishing!

[@philjoyce7939]

Thanks for this UnHerd and Kathleen Stock.

[@carie58]

Professional Stock is an incredible lady. I could listen to her all day.

[@barrymcdaid2855]

I fully agree with Professor Stock. This is totally gone out of control. A voice of reason in an insane conversation.

[@garyweglarz]

A wonderful conversation. Thank you both so much.

[@diveinnjim]

if you don't agree with what someone is saying then you need to discuss it, not letting them speak shows that you are ignorant and just a little cowardly in not wanting to confront what it is that makes you so angry, It might also mean that your side of the argument won't stand up to scrutiny,

[@cygnusrays]

I get the pity, they are pitiable, but also extremely dangerous, to themselves, us, society, humanity.. Madness must be addressed! Or it will destroy us all, or open the way for AI to do it..

[@WorldView22]

Freedom is not a right, it is a state of being, and those who fight against it are self-destructive.

[@simonclarke4156]

I think young people are neurotic and deeply anxious for a reason. Namely responding to their environment witn fear and anger. The levels of stress are unprecedented and young people will be especially sensitive and reactive to a society and culture that is dehumanising and meaningless. Doesn't justify their need to control everything about their external world and how that is being deliberately orchestrated to isolate and divide everyone into separation and loneliness. But it is their reality and safety is everything. They are terrified and act like it.

[@gedofgont1006]

Very astute comment. There's a very deep malaise at the heart of society, underpinning all the woke nonsense. I see it as an inability to confront the truth and live with the consequences. We are surrounded by lies and liars on all sides, much of it calculated to demoralise and corrupt. Eventually, reality bites.

[@apebass2215]

It is their *perception* of reality, in reality they're not in any danger and there's no need to feel so threatened.

[@simonclarke4156]

@@apebass2215 perhaps they have been manipulated into fearfulness but there are existential threats to humanity do exist in reality.

[@dragonfox2.058]

@@simonclarke4156 I agree but separating themselves from society and undermining objective reality isn't helping them a bit

[@zenden6564]

KS is charming, lucid, articulate, erudite, funny and just little bit pertinaceous....❤ So what's not to like?

[@rotaerk]

Not only do I see it as absurd that some people seem to elevate their identities to priority number one: I actually consider having an identity to be an undesirable thing, like having a delusion or a bad habit or some other flaw. To me, an identity is nothing more than caricature, and adopting one makes you a caricature of a person.

[@Yoganflogan]

What an intelligent comment ... I absolutely agree. And they can be hard to let go of as the sense of self then feels diminished in some way, when in fact it's liberating

[@lizziebkennedy7505]

Wow. You put that in writing. Psychiatrists have a name for it.

[@rotaerk]

@@lizziebkennedy7505 What's that?

[@hansemannluchter643]

​@@lizziebkennedy7505 They also have a name for "people born in the wrong body", or rather: A diagnosis.

[@oliverhug3]

Creating and maintaining an identity must also be very exhausting. One must never lose control of one`s fellow citizens so that they don`t forget to honor one`s identity.

[@Cotictimmy]

I’ve only heard her talking seriously before: I hadn’t realised that she is wonderfully funny too. 😊

[@royjacobs1204]

An inspiration, bizarre this is considered brave.

[@steelcrown7130]

"...prepared to throw my weight behind small initiatives, but I get a bit Hamlet-like about big ones because we just don't know if we'll end up with something worse than when we started". AND ...we should make a defence for "the bits that hit us in the face, the bits that trip us up". You can see the shift right there in those two quotes. The poor woman has been treated appallingly for simply seeing reality and stating it, but in the two lines above is a world of meaning that she may still be working through, I think. She has been described in the past as left-wing, but in making small changes rather than big ones, and in focusing on the obvious problems rather than inventing big problems that need solving with big initiatives, lies the very heart of small-c conservative thinking. Her book "Material Girls" is a clear, well-researched and convincing read, by the way.

[@casteretpollux]

Maybe but even Marx stepped back from active politics in some reactionary years. It sounds to be as if she is using her personal resources wisely .

[@timwhiston8279]

Lots of love to Kathleen, thank you so much xxxxxxxxx

[@stephenbond2478]

Are academic youths these days more easily influenced/brainwashed ?? Is that a result of device media and mental illness

[@casteretpollux]

It's a period of reaction and the CIA has pushed the Frankfurt School since is was the OSS, to block class politics.

[@MarkKap]

The narcissism that is encouraged and rewarded these days fosters a way of being in the world that is more and more shut off from Beauty, Intuition, and Genius-anything greater than the sum of small minds

[@ambientjohnny]

Fan of McGilchrist?

[@MarkKap]

@@ambientjohnny don’t know his work but his interview with Freddie resonated a lot… I’d say I’m a fan of Adyashanti and Charles Bukowski ;)

[@foxdenham]

Another good post Freddie. Well said Kathleen. Thank you for taking a stand against these current absurdities.

[@danilodesnica3821]

Oxford was always a great place to help the young generation work out what they think and stand for. Not that much has changed in the half a century since my time there:- my first Oxford exposure to the concept of free speech was seeing a bit of graffiti on Hartford walls: "Free Angela Davis" it proclaimed, and someone had added the letters "ZE" after the first word... I had no idea who Angela Davis was, except that some wanted her to "free" her while others wanted to "freeze" her, and presumably stop her spreading her ideas. She's now a grand old lady, an academic - a professor of ethics (?) at one of the US universities, and from her controversial beginnings, she went on to become a hugely influential figure. One could almost imagine that controversy is a rite of passage for budding future senior academics (or management consultants). Lesson of the day:- free speech is good. If you disagree with what's being said, find a way to beat the argument with a better one. It's always better to be tactful than offensive, but ideas can be offensive even if tactfully expressed and the right to free speech shouldn't be taken away just because someone somewhere is offended by them. 50 years ago, Teddy Hall was a men only college; had been so for centuries. And now, after 40 years of admitting men and women, gender is in flux again. A backlash perhaps? 🙂

[@casteretpollux]

Ironically Angella Davis is now widely viewed as a State plant and identity politics as a State backed "divide and rule" initiative aiming at distraction from class politics.

[@peterconlondrawing8757]

Very intelligent interview and so good to hear common sense please keep it going.

[@AliB-cf3bq]

Well said Kathleen - the woke trans brigade are bonkers.

[@azurenojito2251]

This is a most amazing lady. God bless.

[@SirRobinDeSway]

If you are of a generation not to know it, I highly recommend Malcolm Bradbury’s “The History Man” from the early 70s.The dynamic is so like what is going on now in universities it is uncanny. And like Stock, Bradbury fixes the villainy squarely, firmly and unflinching on academics…one in particular. Bradbury is keen to show just how much damage in the long and short term such an academic can wreak on the minds of young students.

[@jmacdonald8733]

Love the placement of the children's books in the background.🤣

[@juvenalsdad4175]

It is unfortunate that the nature of current political discourse means that someone so obviously decent as Kathleen Stock has been vilified by those who disagree with her. Worth remembering that it cuts both ways, and there are people with blue hair and funny pronouns who are also fundamentally decent, albeit misguided and wrong.

[@apebass2215]

How do you know they are fundamentally decent?

[@juvenalsdad4175]

@@apebass2215 I do not require people to produce certificates of decency in order to determine their worth. I mostly go on how they treat others outside of social media twaddle (which brings out the worst in everybody). The question can also be reversed i.e. how do you know that they are not?

[@apebass2215]

@@juvenalsdad4175 I'm not the one making claims regarding fundamental decency, you are.

[@juvenalsdad4175]

@@apebass2215 Burden of proof (Yawn). Not interested, although Stephen Woodford and Matt Dillahunty would probably be on my side here. Embarrassing as that might be for me.

[@thinkingoutloud7425]

​​@@juvenalsdad4175 not sure why the twitterverse gives anyone a free pass to behave badly....... Like wearing a paper bag over your head whilst beating the cr@p out of someone then walking away. You are still the villain of the piece.

[@patricksee10]

Hear hear Freddy and Kathleen. There is a lot of pressure on the young to conform to a oddly mediated, air brushed version of the world through a computer. Turn off the devices schools!

[@thepepperlanders]

Freddie Sayers is excellent in his role.

[@Shannonanders]

I like the philosophical thoughts on the topic. And the attitude to discuss it in an exchange manner.

[@petneb]

It is a psychosis originating from when we departed from our non-human ancestors. We generally became psychotic from our instincts fighting our newly acquired "self aware" neurons whenever we decide to behave in a non-instinctive way and neither our instinctive nor our cognitive neurons know why they can't control what we do - or we get this sense of doing something wrong. The further we have departed from our instinctive behavior, the worse the internal conflicts gets - the more psychotic we get. It's completely understandable when we realize that 90% of our brain is almost identical to our prehuman ancestors. We need to get to terms with our human condition before we all become insane.

[@dragonfox2.058]

We decide, thru religion, that we were better than everything else in the world and it was ours for the taking. HUGE mistake and we're gonna pay for that so bad. It's no wonder we're all pretty crazy

[@regm1220]

This is interesting, do you know any materials or studies that talk about this?

[@robertsands8137]

The metaphor is the elephant (instinct, emotion) and the rider ( rationality) from "The righteous mind" by Haidt.

[@rosablume4346]

As another one asked, could you please recommend any book title, paper or something. It does sound interesting and plausible to a certain point and probably worth diving into

[@perlefisker]

What is most disturbing in all this is by far that we are talking about Oxford University students😕

[@angelotuteao6758]

Reminds me of Bernardo Kastrup saying “We are very,very desperate lonely children “

[@kashesan]

She is wonderful. Cheers Professor Stock.

[@ts8538]

I am 73 years old. There are short periods of time now and then when I feel like I am 35 years old. But I don't think, "I'm 35 again." And I don't expect anyone else to tell me I am young, or treat me like a young man. There is such a thing as "fact," and there is such a thing as being truthful in relation to fact.

[@TheGruntski]

A correction for Kathleen Stock. These students are desperate for a safe villain to appear for them to oppose. If they want a real villain they can go support the soldiers in Ukraine against Prigozhin and Putin, but these are really dangerous villains.This is something the interviewer does not understand. There is no great epiphany that will occur as a result of these students, rather they are hiding from the very real problems and challenges that exist in the world. This exercise they engage in is simply self aggrandizement while in university prior to joining Daddy's firm as a junior executive or lawyer.

[@1Gr8Editrix]

Quite insightful; she reminds me of Camille Paglia, another academic who is critical of the woke madness.

[@buddyneher9359]

"If everybody stood up to them, they'd shut up."

[@heybigbender]

Thank you for all you do Kathleen, and for Unherd for listening and keeping the topic going, respectably. The world of TRAs and toxic GC's is as mad as ever, but people like Kathleen just speak truth, and thats what we need. These are the Women who are winning this war on behalf of everyone else.

[@davidedbrooke9324]

Throw those students out of the university!

[@matilda4406]

"you can morally shame 'them' until they capitulate" and agree with you... as they must !

[@michealculleton1159]

This brilliant lady gets my vote *****

[@dianecorbin8886]

We don't allow people to express reason. Very articulate, brave woman.

[@Abigail-xf3ei]

She is amazing… intelligent, articulate and so brave. Thank goodness for women like her ❤

[@suegornik-bx4pw]

University students should have moral fiber and be able to listen to all sides of an argument or thought. If they can not, they should not be at university.

[@kevindunham3669]

❤ Thank You Kathleen for talking sense stay safe ❤

[@ljsong1]

I have a teen daughter, changed names, goes by he, has interesting hair. I'm not impressed and I don't play that game. But I'm still terrified though and have resorted to work arounds and nicknames. I know it's psychological. I hope it resolves itself. I just want my kid to get on with life, family, school and a job, mental wellness and physical wellness. I'm going to worry for at least another decade. 😫

[@liamh9814]

I love Kathleen.

[@SusanStorm217]

When being fearful of words and ideas became normalised as noble, when ignorance became a virtue, then that is the end my friend.

[@richardbanker3910]

“Loneliness and looking for purpose and meaning “does sound like a fair description of todays students in the days of social media. When I think of my days at uni way back when.

[@thomasbaxter1371]

Stock makes a number of very important points here which expose the psychological motivations behind the attitudes and actions of those who have invested heavily in the language games (beliefs and values) of this particular aspect of the woke religion. Narcissistic self obsession, neuroticism, anxiety and desire for power are certainly underlying causes which are symptomatic of the phenomenon.

[@Indasaid]

I agree that these young people are unhappy and ultimately disconnected, lost without meaningful foundations. I'm a big believer of nurture over nature, and nuture used to extend from the family to community to wider culture.

[@adiazdu]

Wish you the best Kathleen. All my support.

[@LadyBug1967]

I have two comments: the 1st is whatever happened to the word transvestite and the word sexual dysmorphia which means an unomfortable feeling within the body you have. These were considered psychological manifestations of dysfunction and they were addressed and I think it is strange that now they have been completely canceled and instead the person is called a trans person. I think the DSM manual has to re incorporate those dysfunctions as issues to be addressed by therapist and psychologist til the person reaches majority which in America is 18 when the person can choose what they want to do with their body legally. THAT said the rest of the world also has the right to view them as they see fit. THAT is their right as a human. My second comment is something I read recently and it rings true and it says there s a lot of money behind this movement that we aren't seeing. FOR example in America there is a very powerful wealthy family who made their money in coal and one of their members is identifying as a trans woman which they only did as a mature, very mature man. They are throwing tons of money behind this movement. It has also been mentioned that there are other forces that are political in nature from other countries that are throwing a lot of money and energy behind this movement in order to destabilize the West and it seems to be working at least in terms of distraction from the issues that matter in a human being's life Unfortunately we no longer have investigative journalists who r willing to put their body on the line and do the real work and the real research to expose especially this latter group. So in essence the world is like a donkey being led by its nose with a ring through its nose and deviates, the ring is jerked & the nose becomes painful and bleeds so they do not move their nose. Such is the world we live in in 2023.

[@davesmith826]

Kathleen makes many valuable points in this video. The one that really resonated with me concerns academics who wear their progressive credentials on their sleeves. I know the type well, having worked in higher education for almost a decade. I began my career at a third-rate university on a tropical island in the middle of the Indian Ocean and managed through great effort and no small amount of luck to secure a permanent position at a Russell Group institution. The Russell Group is the elite of UK higher ed - its answer to the American Ivy League - and it's typically where most academics in the country want to end up. I discovered almost immediately that it's filled with egotistical, ladder-climbing careerists who make a big song and dance about their 'collegiality' and 'care' for students but are ultimately among the most selfish, unprincipled and devious people you will meet. I've seen it all - backstabbing, bare-faced lying, faked illnesses, corruption, cronyism, staggering incompetence, theft - but what surprises me most is the ease with which people lie and manipulate. Deception seems to be baked into the DNA of the institution and progressive politics and progressive values are used as shields to deflect any criticism or censure. Some of my colleagues use protected characteristics like sex or disability to advance. Others do good work like (e.g.) supporting students' mental health initiatives not because they give a hoot, but because they know it's the one thing missing from their promotion application. I wouldn't trust them as far as I can throw them. I've seen more honesty and integrity in the post-1992s - the lower rung of UK higher ed.

[@queenjasminetemaiharoa7009]

Kathleen is not only incredibly intelligent and knowledgeable, but actually quite funny😂💖

[@thesociologyshowpodcast]

Really good watch that, would love to interview Kathleen one day, she speaks so well.

[@clarissima2958]

This has been the road since the so-called human rights started, which most of us supported ignoring what the plan was. Few people stop to think about where bullying, mistreatment, imposition, and lack of freedom come from today. Sorry to say but nothing good can stream from academia. Who pays for the minorities that are ruling the world? Hats off to you, Kathleen!