Keeping none “REEF SAFE” fish in a reef tank?

[@sunnygoold9449]

Listened to Mike Paletta on Frag Garage and he has Orange Spots in his acro tank and says they don't damage the corals and, in fact, pick at new frags in what he thinks is to get pests. I wonder if they do effect PE in the day (I would prefer PE than the fish) or if it's the angels. I'd be worried about the butterflies going to town on Acropora - I think they really would do serious damage. I did get a captive bred Multibar angelfish and that did go after my acro frags which surprised me as the wild ones are reef safe for angels. Then Reefbums captive bred Regal went after his frags. I am going to stay away from captive bred now. I'd much MUCH rather sustainably collected fish (we have had comments about this going back and forth in the past so I think we are on the same page). I was thinking of putting Orange Spot filefish into a system in the future with fleshy LPS so now I won't do that. If I ever do an SPS QT system I may do them in there. These videos are AMAZING and super valuable for reefers. I love to see videos breaking down myths like this and we don't get enough info on how to keep different types of fish.

[@viking_reefing]

It’s a combination for sure. I did have some minute PE before adding the file fish and that went out the window when they were added. I’ve kept butterflies with corals in the past without any issues. Granted, they weren’t obligate coralivores but they certainly did peck at the acros a lot…didn’t do any noticeable damage :) Glad you liked the video! There’s so many “truths” going around the hobby that are simply wrong.

[@rickysleeper]

I just discovered your channel and really love your main tank! You seem to have quite a few wrasses and I am curious at how you got them to co-exist so well. I have had so many wrasse battles to the death that I have given up. Any tips appreciated.

[@viking_reefing]

Thanks! No real thought behind it really. I just chuck em in. Having a very large tank definitely helps

[@rickysleeper]

Thanks dude. You have a magnificent tank!@@viking_reefing

[@OnkelStonkel]

Chill and nice video. Love your tank, wished you could add more shots of it during the video. Such a tease seeing it from the distance 😅

[@viking_reefing]

Thanks dude. Haha, I shot that video of the cuff and didn’t have enough time to edit in a bunch of stuff :)

[@Peterrdee]

I have a teardrop butterflyfish, probably the most destructive to corals and a Heniochus acuminatus and they haven’t touched the corals I put in the tank, so I think it depends on how much they get fed, and if they were eating corals in the wild before being caught.

[@viking_reefing]

Feeding is a definite factor. I had a semilarvatus that constantly grazed on the acros even though I feed tons. Very much up to fish personality. No harm came to the acros though

[@kevinkarda838]

Nice video, I have a regal, majestic and goldflake in my reef tank and they not picking much on my sps

[@viking_reefing]

Thanks! Yeah, the issue is vastly overblown haha

[@glub9075]

This is a great video, I feed my 700 gallon tank 12 times a day and I have chaetodon butterflies as well as multiple pomacanthus species and other angelfish and they don't bother any corals. I also feed so much because I have a stethojulis wrasse which need to eat almost constantly as well as other delicate species like anampses lennardi and macropharyngodon species.

[@viking_reefing]

Good man! That’s definitely going to be hugely beneficial for a multitude of factors!

[@sashimiturtle]

I have a fish that has recently gone rogue and is devouring corals. First it was a trumpet frag I added, then clove polyp, now my zoas... I've caught the majestic angel, trying to get the eibli now. Not sure which one it is.

[@viking_reefing]

Yeah, both those species will definitely pose a risk for certain soft and lps corals

[@franzyy89]

I really think that the fact that most of ur SPS are big colony are also a reason that u have success with so many "coral killers" I will try a angelfish when my SPS grow out some more but I dont think its smart to put Angels in with frags. Or am I wrong here?

[@viking_reefing]

Yeah, like I said a fair amount of corals is key. If your tank is fairly large and you have enough frags it should work out but there’s certainly a risk. I’ve kept angels with way less corals than I have now without issue

[@coralreef909]

How would you explain vast fields of healthy looking coral colonies on coral reefs with large butterflyfish and angelfish populations Versus your aquarium? It’s all a matter of scale. The predation is spread out. Also to point out that the natural diet of large Pomacanthids is sponge and tunicates along with Zoanthids. Corals aren’t on the menu unless you’re under feeding or starving your fish to keep nutrients low instead exporting the nutrients via powerful filtration like robust protein skimming or chaetomorpha reactors(algae scrubber). There’s no need to starve your fish.

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefinglarge mature colonies set up and aquascaped like a natural reef.

[@marcthamke7545]

Why did you remove the oceanmotion system?

[@viking_reefing]

They are coming back on. I’ve just been waiting on mounts for my Nero 5’s :)

[@RudraPGupta]

Hello, I need an advice. I have a 550 ltr mixed reef system with fair amount of fishes including 1 Hawaii yellow, regal and Tomini bristle tooth tangs.all are healthy and well settled fishes. Recently I added an Achilles tang to my system. It has been 5 days , the fish is healthy and eating nori and frozen mysis. There has been some scuffle with the yellow tang. Last night I observed few white spots on the fish. I already run a 24 watt UV steriliser. Can you kindly suggest any preventive measures to control the infection. Also does Achilles tang show something called stress spots if PH is falling below 8. Thanks in advance

[@viking_reefing]

Honestly, and not trying to be a jerk, the tank is a bit on the small side for an Achilles. They are very sensitive to stress and in a “small” tank that will be a constant issue. However, you should be able to get away with the it for a decently long while if you would get rid of the other tangs. Keys to keeping them healthy is low amounts of stress, lots of flow, lots of feedings and open spaces for swimming

[@coralreef909]

Regarding parrotfish is one exception. Scarus quoyi. Very reef safe. David Saxby has one in his reef. The corals are thriving.

[@viking_reefing]

Yeah, I’ve actually been considering one for a couple of years. However, as I understand it they tend to mysteriously croak after a year or so.

[@CherIsmail]

Totally agree with you. No reef fish is “Reef Safe”. My Powder blue tang eats goniopora, yellow tang eats cynarina, sailfin tang eats zoes, copper band eats acans …. I have a pair of filefish that don’t eat a thing! It’s the luck of the draw.

[@viking_reefing]

It’s definitely up to the individual fish and some species will work fine with some stuff and others are completely different

[@lorenzospina3174]

I totally agree with you 👍.

[@viking_reefing]

Good man! The hobby doesn’t 🤣

[@briankavanagh7191]

Viking has your large banana Wrasse started to change into male adult colours yet, mine has started to change around its mouth with pinks and green stripes. love your tank.

[@viking_reefing]

Yeah man, it’s definitely transitioning as we speak

[@christofferkarlsson9580]

Amazing videos, keep it up! 👊 Greetings from Ronneby

[@viking_reefing]

Man tackar! Det var faktiskt i Ronneby jag köpte mina första saltfiskar någonsin för över 20 år sedan. Jag minns inte vad stället hette men det var en mycket trevlig herre som hade en affär i en källare

[@christofferkarlsson9580]

@@viking_reefing Låter som du var hos Peter i hans källare 😊 Mycket hjälpsam! Faktiskt av honom jag också handlade av första gången. Tyvärr inte kvar. Som sagt fortsätt med klippen, är väldigt inspirerande och roligt att se! Får man lämna önskemål så gärna något avsnitt kring hur du cyklade tanken initialt och hur du tänker kring bakteriefloran, verkar vara ett hett ämne på tuben just nu!

[@nicolaslebert699]

i like your tank and your video i have a tank with 132 gallons, i have 1 hepatus, 1 centropyge loriculus and 1 centropyge bicolor and 2 amphyprions occelaris, do you think i can add 1 pigoplyte diacanthus?

[@nicolaslebert699]

i have lps and soft corals

[@viking_reefing]

It depends on the footprint of your tank id say. If it has a good amount of depth it should work.

[@nicolaslebert699]

thank you for your response. the beautiful anthias of your tank are bimaculatus anthias? have a nice day

[@viking_reefing]

@@nicolaslebert699 yes they are!

[@nicolaslebert699]

are they difficult to guard?

[@luissegadepinin8780]

Whats bout your zanclus?? El idolo moro?? He died?!?

[@viking_reefing]

I transferred it over to the Nyos opus tank to fatten up since the tangs/angels are so quick at feeding time. Jumped out the first night…

[@cleanpaws4805]

Yes feed feed , but that equates to mayor water changes.!!

[@viking_reefing]

Definitely

[@gregdepot]

Angels I think have murdered my Clams and Blue Throat Trigger Shrimp and Urchin. Other then that its mainly nipping Coral Beauty nips and anything in front of it. Lamarks generally fine Koran still young has only nipped soft corals. Longnose butterfly will eat sylos and birdsnest sometimes Pyramid Butterfly will nip and sometimes eat Xenia. I don’t feed as much as you do but feed 2-3 times a day and to me reef safe is a bit boring and not natural. All these are reef fish… Expanded my sump and fuge and looking at mangroves perhaps i could feed more at that time Also clowns and damsels can sometimes defend corals and nems I agree coral beauty seems to go after the old corals on her route rather then new corals.

[@viking_reefing]

Yeah, some angels can definitely be an issue with clams. I’ve found that if you have a large enough tank and it’s just one or two that’s an issue you can generally find a spot where it won’t get much attention. I totally agree, just sticking to The cookie cutter fish leaves a tank boring as hell haha

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefingLamark‘s angelfish is a planktonivore. Geniacanthus angelfish feed on zooplankton. Corals aren’t on the menu.

[@viking_reefing]

@@coralreef909 yes but they are boring 😜😂

[@wyliecoyote1696]

Butterfly fish are gorgeous, but difficult.

[@viking_reefing]

Some of them are fairly demanding and definitely the ones I’m planning on

[@wyliecoyote1696]

@@viking_reefing Arabian [C. melapterus] is what I heard, any others?

[@viking_reefing]

@@wyliecoyote1696 meyeri as well :)

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefingmelapterus,Lunalatus, Austriacus and Trifasciatus are all being successfully maintained by aquarist in Asia. I may also point out that some Red Sea endemic obligate corallivore butterflyfish have been found outside their natural range in the Mediterranean Sea via the Suez Canal. There is no Stoney Coral growth in the Mediterranean which means the likes of chaetodon Larvatus are thriving on alternative food sources in this body of water. Divers have observed obligate corallivore butterflyfish chasing prey in the water column. These fish are very adaptable. There is hope. Just do research and get very young post larval or juvenile specimens. Adults are set in their ways. Younger fish will learn from other fish in your tank at feeding time what food is and eventually join in. Philippine clams are a good place to start. Aquire from the seafood section of your local grocery store. Oysters and clams on the half shell are also hard resist by these finicky feeders. There are back issues of coral magazine available online from the reef2rainforest website. You should be able to find Matt Pedersen’s article called rethinking obligate corallivore butterflyfish. www.reef2rainforest.com/2018/10/25/coral-excerpt-the-butterfly-chronicles-part-1/

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefingyou mentioned parrotfish as coral eaters but in practice on the reef they bite off chunks of already long dead coral skeletons covered in algae. It is the algae along with the calcium carbonate that they eat and digest and excrete as sand. There is one species of parrotfish that can be kept in a full fledged sps dominated reef tank and that is scarus quoyi. David Saxby has one in his reef aquarium and Andrew Sandler of polo reef keeps one with hundreds of other beautiful reef fish in his 17,000 gallon reef aquarium. They are beautiful and of course you know the parrotfish family is closely related to the Labrids or wrasses.

[@coralreef909]

These fish are native to coral reefs. What an irony.

[@viking_reefing]

And they are behind all of the problems that the reefs face 🤣😜

[@michaeleaddy7568]

What happened to fat Fred ?

[@viking_reefing]

Got spooked and ran in to a damn rock, killing itself

[@michaeleaddy7568]

That sucks, you are my inspiration to keep these types of fish I have been keeping a moorish idol because of you and I’m planning to get more angels also so your videos are inspiring thank you!

[@coralreef909]

@@michaeleaddy7568how’s your moorish idol doing so far ?

[@coralreef909]

So these fish are causing mayhem on coral reefs where they originate. Fields and fields of dead and dying LPS and sps corals caused by angelfish and butterflyfish 😂

[@viking_reefing]

Yeah, it’s such a sad situation all around. Who ever thought that it was a good idea to let those things loose on the reefs 😂

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefing so overblown and exaggerated. Not a good idea to put tiny frags as opposed to large colonies with omnivores reef fish that forage throughout the day looking for food. Starving your fish to keep nutrients down is also not a wise idea and not necessary.

[@viking_reefing]

@@coralreef909 you got it mate!

[@jakebrabec1141]

I've always wanted to keep a trigger fish in a reef tank :k

[@viking_reefing]

You can, there are the planctivore species like crosshatch triggers that shouldn’t be an issue at all :)

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefingOdus Niger is a planktonivore as well. I’ve seen clown triggers and Picasso triggers in reef tanks.

[@coralreef909]

@@viking_reefingI’ve seen full grown clown triggerfish in reef aquariums as well as Picassos in mixed reef tanks.

[@TommysReefGallery]

Many reefers do this