HPFP Rail Pressure Crashing and Backfires - Common B58 Issues

[@B58Meh]

Having this issue on a stage 2 ots bm3 map gen 1 b58, i wasn’t having this issue before xhp could this he related ? Am i just pushing my b58 past the fuel requirements ? Or could all this be coincidental as my hpfp or my lpfp is on its way out. Whenever im doing a hard pull drivetrain malfunction.

[@NexusGoomba]

So the rail pressure depends on the pressure produced by the HPFP and the amount of fuel flowing through the injectors. In a high boost + low RPM situation the injectors need to push a lot of fuel while the HPFP cannot produce enough pressure at the current RPM so the rail pressure dips. That makes complete sense! My rail pressure dips by 800 psi at low RPMs as soon as peak boost hits in 3rd gear, but in 4th gear it's not an issue I guess because the boost doesn't hit as fast and the HPFP can keep up. What I also see is that as I continue the pull (in 3rd gear after the rail pressure dips) and get to >6k RPM the rail pressure exceeds target by about 700 psi... what do you think is happening there?

[@kern417]

It recovers and goes over target sometimes, especially when you shift and the injectors shut off for a split second

[@killahboii]

So what would be the solution to this a custom tune that will fix those issues? Or a upgraded HPFP/LPFP ?

[@mikey147542]

You ever figure it out?

[@cryptojay727]

just bought a g1 b58 340 gonna start the build glad i found you real info !

[@dobbo_f21]

I had this on track and it was nothing to do with the HPFP it was the LPFP when cornering. I added a second LPFP and it’s never done it since.

[@dNNSunni]

Hello, my pump breaks from 2.9k to 1.8k but without backfire but I don't know what else to do. I've already replaced the pump and the injectors but still no success. I'm already on the 15th map of the software. Can you perhaps describe the problem to me? ahh and i drive stage 3 with 600hp

[@0071maou]

Hi! I'd appreciate very much if you'd respond to this, you seem like one of the only guys around that talks facts and really does care about the longevity of their car. I have an M340i, same B58 engine. I've recently bought an MST Intake for my car. While it sounds very nice and all, I'm afraid of the filtration deficienty compared to the stock paper air filter and how that will affect the turbo's lifespan. What do you think?

[@kern417]

I don't think you'll see any issues with filtration, but the stock intake has been proven to flow very well so an upgraded intake doesn't net a significant improvement in performance.

[@tenaciousjeebs]

Assuming that an upgraded HPFP would be able to support the amount of fuel required by your current tune (big assumption), why would that be just putting a band-aid on the issue?

[@kern417]

If you asked a tuner to tune your car, and instead of making your setup work they just told you to buy more parts, is it an issue with your car or the tuner?

[@tenaciousjeebs]

@@kern417 Fair point, but I'd think it's a chicken/egg scenario that depends on your goals. Also I'm new to the world of tuning and was limiting my thinking to a flash tune that I could do myself.

[@kern417]

As I said in the video, a flash tune designed for stock hpfp shouldn't cause pressure dips. Just like if it's for stock turbo then it shouldn't cause the turbo to fail, or if it's for stock downpipe it shouldn't melt your catalytic converter. Simple.

[@tenaciousjeebs]

@@kern417 Understood, thank you.

[@thebarrcola]

Hey bro, pretty late to the party in this video but my cars been throwing a couple of codes occasionally on pulls recently; 11A002 high-pressure fuel, plausibility: pressure too low 118401 mixture control: mixture too lean, e fl large deviation. Car then goes into limp mode till restarted. Do you think this is likely an issue with target boost being too high also? Running bm3 stage 2 93 octane. Thanks

[@kern417]

How do the logs look

[@collinwaters2013]

Im having the same exact issue. What was your root cause?

[@NikkoCruz1]

Late comment but any ideas on if your fueling is not the issue? I mean I have a precision stage 3 lpfp and a dorch stage 2 hpfp and rail pressures look fine

[@ericlaflamme2504]

Hi ! Sorry if someone already asked you this but I tried to read all the comments before asking : I have a random issue where my gen 1 b58 fuel pressure crash at 5k rpm (goes from 2800-2900 to 1400) I'm MHD stage 2 91 with downpipe only and always put 91 octane gas. I don't understand why it's happening at such a high rpm given what you explained 😕 the target pressure don't move but the actual pressure drop

[@kern417]

Send a log and i can review

[@F30Bruh]

I have a 2017 340i Ive been on a stage 2 tune for a while now with a cat less dp recently been having backfiring issues I did your fuel injector test and it’s not them, never had a code on the car until few days ago which is system to lean so I flashed to stage 1 and still getting horrible issues and car is driving terribly I think my hpfp is bad but you said it’s more then likely my tune I emailed Mhd bc I’m on ots map and waiting for reply

[@wardyy8304]

Loving all your videos (new subscriber). This happened to me recently while trying Bm3 rolling anti lag on my stage 2 ots 93 340i. I already had a custom tune and TU HPFP on order before trying antilag, with anticipation on upgrading my current setup. So this would be a tune issue, correct? Also would this have any long term damage on my internals? Thank you, looking forward to your response and future videos

[@kern417]

You'll need to log to see what's going on

[@wardyy8304]

@@kern417 this only happens on rolling anti lag, and only happened twice, stopped using it after. Is this something the tuner will be able to take care of once I start sending him these logs? As I understand this is a boost problem, so he will be able to adjust my tune/boost accordingly. Also will the rail pressure crashing if only happened twice cause any damage to engine?

[@kern417]

You'll need to log to know what's happening, then yes it can be corrected. With new features like that, you'll always want to log it the first few times to make sure everything is running properly.

[@matthewcastillo731]

hello i have a 2020 bmw 440i with 13k miles and i am getting a 11b209 code after tuning it with a stage 1. is the hpfp act and target supposed to be the same?

[@osmanmorales8434]

Hi I know I’m really late but I’m on a e30 Costume tune with catless vrsf downpipe and mar intake I hear back fires but when I step on the gas and let go is that sign of some sort ? Or is it just what I have done to it

[@keyanridgeway5639]

Hey Ik I’m really late, but I am having this problem now after installing my charge pipe, dp, and stage 2 tune. I also accidentally broke the clip for my map sensor on my charge pipe, but the connector is still in but there is some plastic missing from the bottom( threw the stock charge pipe once I finally got it out😂), but do you think this could be affecting it as well? I’m on an ots 93 tune. Because the map sensor deals with the air fuel ratio so I thought maybe that’s what’s causing it for me on the ots tune? Thanks

[@BadLTD]

Plan on upgrading to a HPFP (Supra) for my Gen 1 2016 BMW xDrive. Will a OTS map be fine or should I get a custom tune?

[@kern417]

Yes. The stage 2+ ots maps are designed for the TU pump

[@nickmarsden8129]

I’m having this issue lately when I run anywhere over E70 with bootmod3 OTS flex fuel kit/map. Idk if 21 PSI of boost that it’s targeting is too much for my DS1 at that E level (stock turbo). It only happens when using kickdown to 2nd or 3rd gear. Loud exhaust backfire followed by a stall, then the car continues pulling. I’m not sure if it’s the OTS map being too aggressive, DS1 not being enough, or an issue with my car. I can send a log if you’re willing to take a quick look

[@kern417]

Sure. Pm me on your preferred social media channel. Links to my pages are in the description

[@parisbrown4606]

My car is having a similar issue did you ever solve this issue?

[@nickmarsden8129]

@@parisbrown4606 For the most part yeah. So the HPFP line wasn’t installed correctly. The hole from the pump to the fuel line was ever-so slightly crooked, so I had to adjust it to have it go in straight. The logs looked better afterwards but there was still a little bit of a drop during WOT (-400PSI between targeted and actual). I emailed dorch and had them check my install, mods, and logs. They said from my logs, the bootmod3 tune was too aggressive down in the lower RPMs, spiking 24PSI which overwhelms the stage 1 pump. They recommend to have the boost max out at 20-21 down low and gradually increase to peak 24PSI up at higher RPMs, and the fuel pump will have no issues. Haven’t driven my car in a bit but I’m going to email bootmod3 to have them adjust the tune for me

[@DriveDynamicsAz]

@@nickmarsden8129lol they dont adjust tunes for you there gonna tell you get a custom

[@BumpytheBench]

Looking for advice, I just had my engine rebuilt. And during the installation the mechanic also put in a new oem HPFP and fuel pressure sensor. I have driven for just over 2000 miles. I get back from vacation and go for a drive, the rubber tube below the intake popped off retainer clip nowhere to be found. I get home, after the inspection and fix. Now the car won't start and I am getting a P0087 code. Any advice on where to start this diagnosis?

[@kern417]

Scan with a bmw diagnostic tool to get the 6 digit code

[@pencilcups3088]

Hello, Would Upgrading the lpfp help to prevent a DS2 hpfp from crashing on full e85 and a hybrid turbo. Basically, when im turning up the boost on a full e85 Hybrid turbo car, is the DS2 hpfp crashing because it is not getting enough fuel for that boost level or is it crashing because it cannot manage that amount of e85 at the boost level. If it is the former then an an upgraded lpfp would theoretically allow me to run more boost at full e85 by supplying more fuel to the hpfp. This is just my thinking I have no Idea if its right or wrong and would like your opinion. The reason for this question is in the near future I plan to upgrade the turbos and run full e85, so I don't have to mix and don't want to go the port injection or WMI route. Thanks!

[@kern417]

If you just have a DS2 then it will make the most power on an ethanol blend. If you want to run full E85, then you'll be capped around 550-600whp. If you want more than that then you'll need port injection and a LPFP upgrade.

[@pencilcups3088]

@@kern417Ok got it. Say I run DS2 full e85 and I hit the cap at like 600whp. Would upgrading the lpfp be a minimal upgrade as in it would raise the cap to like 650whp or even less. My goal in the end is 700whp, so im wondering if I can reach it with just lpfp or port would be required. Thanks for replying quickly btw appreciate it.

[@kern417]

You need port injection and an LPFP

[@the_batmobile0.4]

Ds2 can still crash massively, mines having a hard crash right now on flowmax +

[@X3-M40i]

@@the_batmobile0.4at what rpm and ethanol percentage was your DS2 crashing at?

[@gmo654]

Hi, I have a 340i gen1 I just installed my catless dp right after I flashed the stage 2 e30 ots took it for a pull and heard the loudest pop and car went nowhere, I had no prior issue with the stage 1 e30 and I switched to the stage 2 91 ots and there is no issue, how many gallons do theses truly have says 15.8 But on empty my fill ups are about 14 ish gallons

[@kern417]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/lafFopZ_edGCeZY

[@gmo654]

@@kern417 Are you familiar with this code from Bm3 diagnostic 11B209

[@kern417]

@@gmo654 Low pressure fuel system, plausibility: delivery performance too low

[@gmo654]

@@kern417 is it odd for the low pressure fuel pump on the b58 to go out? Or is it just because my hpfp is crashing because on my data logs tuners says fuel pressure is dipping, and thank you so much for answering all my questions bro you the b58 goat!

[@kern417]

@@gmo654 it happens but usually it means the car is difficult to start as well, not just fuel pressure dropping during a pull.

[@SlowG70]

Had my car 340i stall randomly in the middle of driving and it wouldn’t start back up. I have a TU pump that I was about to install until this problem happened. Should I run the TU and just tune for E40?

[@kern417]

You should fix the issue that caused it to stall before upgrading anything

[@wingedhussar5528]

I'm going to tune my 18 440xi F32 but looking for the most conservative route possible.. I'm going with Bootmod3 and a Stage 1 91 octane tune, plus colder spark plugs.. My car has 25k miles on it, do you have any other suggestions besides spark plugs. I also change my oil every 5k miles and air filter every 12k. Just want to go the safest route without putting to much extra pressure on the turbo. Thanks in advance.

[@kern417]

There are no colder spark plugs available for our engines so all you can do is replace what stock.

[@rashaunhall7056]

So I just got on a ots E50 tune and I only have the flex fuel kit , catless dp,intake and charge pipe. And when I do a few pulls the car’a power gets cut in half is it because I don’t have a hpfp and bigger injectors ? I only noticed it once I got on an E mix - 2020 m340ix

[@kern417]

there are no hpfp or injector upgrades available for your car. chcek your coolant levels in both tanks

[@brenostefanello9262]

I’m running full methanol on wmi + 105ron from brasil podium gasoline. Car runned 1200miles without any problem, but now every time methanol injects, it makes those burps and goes into protection mode. It happend during some mexico’s pulls up to 160mph. May I switch to TU hpfp to fix this or must be something wrong with the tune ? I’m really sad this happend and don’t know what to do ...

[@kern417]

You'll need to run logs and send them to your tuner. Make sure your meth controller is still doing what it's supposed to do and all of your nozzles are flowing properly.

[@j.f.4765]

With previous logs what is average IAT? Im running an open cone intake. Worried about heatsoak etc. Love the vids dude. Y

[@kern417]

Cruising it gets up to ~20F over Ambient

[@ArmandoRodriguez-oj6fo]

I am having the same issue, while at WOT the car does a loud backfire going around 6krpm. My current set up is a 340 with a tu pump and a vargas gc+ on e30. PJT told me it’s a hardware issue 💀. I still don’t know what’s wrong with my car. Please let me know if you have any suggestions.

[@parisbrown4606]

You ever solve this issue ?

[@gabesanchez9830]

Are the same issues arising with stock ECU on gen 1 b58?

[@kern417]

If you run too much ethanol then yes

[@TJ-cw3mv]

I put 5 gal e85 at 76% ethanol level in my ewg n55 and I think I put too much for my fuel pump to handle? I get code 118001 mixture too lean and check engine light. Logs look good except hpfp target is 2500 I’m at 2000 or 1900 actual pressure. This is hpfp crash correct? And I should put less e85 next time?

[@kern417]

Yes

[@rayj1988]

I have a TU Pump my car runs fine but I get a shadow code 11AA08 - High Pressure Fuel System: Pressure reduction too high. Do you know what this might be I clear the code and it comes back. Im on a BM3 stage 2 map but BM3 doesnt pick up the error code. However in MHD it does? Thanks

[@kern417]

Send me a log and i can take a look

[@rayj1988]

@@kern417 sent you a pm on facebook! Thanks

[@fernandocarto6022]

@@rayj1988did you have an answer?

[@osamasoliman6697]

Great content as usual 👍 I need your advice please ... If running acn91 stage 1 on really crappy 91 fuel and in a hot climate... What my best course of action to create a safety margin for my car? Update HPFP or water injection or add some pure ethanol to my tank or a combination ... Thanks

[@kern417]

Adding ethanol

[@osamasoliman6697]

@@kern417 cheers ,👍👍 will have to figure out a way to consistently add a constant percentage to my petrol then as we only have pure ethanol available here

[@kern417]

@@osamasoliman6697 i have a video on my channel for calculating e85 mixes. It works for any ethanol

[@osamasoliman6697]

@@kern417 thanks I will study it again 😀😀

[@hawkreverse4965]

hey it seems like i’m having this issue but my car only does this when i use anti lag. if i do the same run without using it i have 0 issues? any idea or is it the same issue as listed in the video. i will say tho on my log my hpfp psi either dips down to 1800 levels out and then flies up to 3500. gen 1 b58 stock hpfp. would getting the tu pump help my issue

[@kern417]

if your rail pressure dips, then your fuel pressure is crashing. tell your tuner to fix the tune.

[@ChamoF30]

Hey I’m having a problem with my 340, I’m downpipe with a stage 1 dorch running E50 (bootmod3) and sometimes my car misfires, when I’m gonna push it on any gear, it makes the misfire with loud pops (bangs) and I can’t figure it out what it is. Pls help me I would love to get my car back on the E85 because I’m running only 93 😅

[@kern417]

feel free to send me a log. my social media/contact details are in the description

[@killahboii]

Hope you get to mine…. So if this is happening and im using bm3 OTS stage 2 on my b58 440i. Does that mean I have to get a custom tune?

[@kern417]

or you can go down to stage 1 since it's less aggressive

[@fastcashjt4047]

I am having this exact issues my E50 mix is correct tested and mixed properly and my Dorch stage2 is still crashing any advice I’m hearing that it’s unusual

[@kern417]

You can send me a log on one of my social media channels. The links are in the description

[@mauriciopereira8198]

Did you solve the issue? I’m having same symptons

[@vanBentum]

When you put a supra hpfp in it, is the problem over?

[@kern417]

The hpfp is not the problem. It is typically the tune or the fuel mix being incorrect. Upgrading the fuel pump is a bandaid if the tune is designed for the stock pump.

[@twinb5840]

I was doing custom tuning and my tuner keep telling me that he thinks my car has less than a quarter tank of gas because he’s having an issue with my fuel but I have the TU pump on my 340 and told him but idk if he remembers

[@kern417]

When fuel is low the car reduces power to prevent fuel starvation. Usually it happens when the fuel light comes on (50 miles to empty). This happens regardless of the pump you are using.

[@twinb5840]

@@kern417 I had fill the car up with gas before I did the pull and I sent him the log maybe bad gas or it could be his tune because ots maps log look good

[@kern417]

Yeah it may have been a tune problem then

[@oneslowf80]

B58 goat!!!

[@asunstate1074]

Can the stock FP handle stage 2 boost?

[@kern417]

Yes

[@chisingchen3290]

Is it ok to run a custom flame tune on stage 2?

[@kern417]

Some people do. It just reduces the life of your turbo

[@gzakelijk]

Also has its effects on your engine/head.

[@matthewcastillo731]

hello i have a 2020 bmw 440i with 13k miles and i am getting a 11b209 code after tuning it with a stage 1. is the hpfp act and target supposed to be the same?

[@kern417]

The code is related to your lpfp not hpfp. I'd replace it

[@matthewcastillo731]

@@kern417 i can’t even find that part anywhere. not even on bmw parts

[@kern417]

It is in the fuel tank under your rear seat. Low pressure fuel pump.