15 Ways to Make MONEY as an Artist

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[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

As this is a series I want to give you guys a little bit of homework after each episode, to help you start building your art business. I want you to choose which 4-5 revenue streams you think would work best for you and comment them down below! Also don’t forget to get your FREE 2 Hour Real-Time Watercolor Tutorial: www.blog.kirstypartridge.com/newsletter

[@pictez]

I love this videos , I ve got alot of usefull information , felt so lost not knowing what to do . Thank you!

[@esther_franchuk]

I feel like for me already working really well selling originals and prints, but I definitely want to make prints more of a passive income, since I just launched KZbin finally I already started thinking of using Patreon and offering something to people. Another thing I really want to do is to write a book! Would be a great accomplishment truly and starting from January I’m also will be coaching online art students from the school I did couple years ago so it’s pretty exciting!

[@esther_franchuk]

O pictura pe zi it’s always good to have a structure and options!)

[@jodicotton95]

You left out puzzles....saling your prints to puzzle makers

[@ShoshanahShear]

I look forward to signing up, busy completing a course to improve my writing want to complete this before signing up for another

[@Setarko]

My girlfriend told me that when she says that she is an artist, some people would reply "Oh, you poor thing" and offer her some money. So there are 16 ways!

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

😂😂😂

[@esther_franchuk]

WRN it has been one of the biggest lies artists ever believed in... so they would starve... they would be”starving artists”, but it’s so not true! I feel artist is the best job you could ever have, because you are not exchanging time for money and you got to play with paint for the rest of your life, in many ways it’s actually easier to make a living being an artist, you just have to be passionate about it!)

[@theartfox5590]

Lol

[@miriambelanger7292]

😂😂😂

[@ahnunymuse2017]

There are 17...word of mouth. Hehehe

[@ShirosDreams]

Summary- (timestamps added for quick access and more details.) 1. Selling original art - [2:11] 2. Selling prints - [2:41] 3. Selling merchandise (i.e, mugs, t-shirts, phone cases, pillows) - [4:34] 4. Commissions - [6:07] 5. Teaching (i.e, selling art courses and tutorials) - [7:07] 6. Patreon - [7:55] 7. Affiliates (i.e, selling and promoting art materials used-receiving a commission if someone uses your affiliate link) - [8:53] 8. Ad revenue (i.e, ads running through your KZbin videos) - [9:55] 9. Sponsorships/Brand deals - [10:41] 10. Start an art blog - [11:18] 11. Publish a book/an e-book (i.e, art book, comic book, etc). - [11:43] 12. License out your artwork - [12:44] 13. Livestream - [14:25] 14. Teach classes on platforms (i.e, Skillshare). - [15:14] 15. Sell freelancing art services (i.e, Fiverr). - [16:33]

[@Thehigherlifevibes]

Thanks I was looking for this

[@ShirosDreams]

Sanjana !! Glad to help :)

[@jesuskomailful]

lovely. Time saving, thanks ;)

[@Alloniya]

Yeah, none of these are working if you not famous already

[@shamsumaru7751]

You're my saviour. I was about to rewatch the video to take notes. Thank God I scrolled a little bit in the comments 😭

[@attheranch873]

For me: Originals, prints, ebook, licensing and skill share. So making and teaching without pressure😀

[@GhostWriter_369]

🥰🇮🇳💜

[@ThePress00]

How do you do the prints? I do digital artwork and I've been asked for prints of it but i don't have any idea how to do it.

[@Gxie]

❤️❤️❤️ I’m sure you’ve heard this before, and may never see this message either, but I HAVE to tell you how you’ve given me absolute HOPE! I’ve been in tears a lot & I feel like banging my head on the door. I don’t know where to start, but these ideas are amazing! I don’t know if it’s because I have been a stay at home mom for so long. My husband has always told me to sell my art (though he’s given up on me because I haven’t done anything in nearly 20 years), but I always think people will hate it. I looked at your tutorials on the site, and I’m begging him to get me a course! But if I’m on my own in this, I’m so appreciative that there is someone out there who has just pointed the way. I’m typing through tears. I can’t possibly tell you what you just saved. THANK YOU SO MUCH. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

[@miwona_art]

Hi Tracy ! I'm in a similar situation right now and really struggling whether to quit my current job I hate and start an art career or to clench my teeth and carry on. I' m full of doubts and fear whether I can support myself and earn enough to make a living, so such tips as Kirsty"s, although some of them I was already aware of, are great help. Just to let you know, you' re not alone in your struggles :)

[@jessicalafond7982]

Very clever I've been an artist for 15 years and honestly this helped me huge!! I just recently started an Instagram account for my art and it's already gotten me more Commissioned work . I'm so excited for 2020. I'm fired up after watching this!

[@OokaChan]

My biggest problem is I'm territorial of my creations, as in I don't feel I can trust my originals in someone else's hands if I was considering selling them.

[@malikbenachour3511]

So just sell prints and keep your original

[@bitachocho]

Hii I used to have this struggle too! But what I started doing is just painting it again.. so I keep my original painting but I paint another one exactly the same and I know from the start that the 2nd one is going to be for selling. Now I realize it would probably be more effective to just sell prints because it takes less time

[@YehoshuaShellim]

🙌🙌 I absolutely love how you talk about artists incomes while creating a beautiful artwork! It's very engaging. I would love to do that on my channel when I make tutorials one day🤩😁

[@juliai3956]

You just absolutely obliterated any fears I had about making my passion my career. Thank you! Loved watching you paint as well. Beautiful!

[@KimberlyCrick]

For anyone just starting a following it can be really hard finding an audience to sell your originals or prints to. I like Etsy and Ebay since they already have traffic, what's great is that some of the customers you pick up there will follow you to your website/other platforms. Best of luck everyone :)

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

Nice tips! Etsy is a great place to sell your art if you don’t have much of an audience yet 🥰

[@Anajeelkazmi]

Kirsty Partridge Art i want to sell merchandise and prints on Etsy but I feel like it’ll be much better for me to just sell on red bubble but how should I get an audience?

[@esther_franchuk]

Your illustrations are so Dreamy! I love painting with watercolor as well! Using multiple revenue streams is something I was thinking a lot lately, so thank you for sharing these. You inspired me to start my own art channel to share my journey as a professional artist. Its amazing to have this online community to help, encourage and support each other!

[@anastasiiafranchuk7229]

Esther-Anastasiia Franchuk Art I really really love this style of illustrations

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

Esther-Anastasiia Franchuk Art thank you very much 🥰 it’s amazing to hear I inspired you to start an art channel. good luck and I hope you find lots of success! 💕

[@esther_franchuk]

Kirsty Partridge Art You are just the kindest person! Wasn’t expecting for you to reply. Thank you again. Keep shining with your art!

[@pepperVenge]

Its funny that I came across your channel. I've been drawing portraits since I was a teenager, and have always been very well at it. When I was around 20, I encountered this couple that saw my work, and asked me to draw their cat and dog for them. I did so for free.. and realized that even if I had been paid.. that isn't something I enjoyed doing.. It turned something I loved doing into a chore. After that experiences, I told myself that if this is what I have to do to make money with my art, then forget it.. But just last year, I began to realize that commissions are not the only way an artist can make money. I saw at the local Ren Fest that there are dozens of shops selling art prints, and there are Dozens of sites online that do the same. Then I realized (I don't know it took me so long) that I could do the same.. but pretty much everything I've ever drawn was something that I couldn't sell as they are referenced from something I find, like an image in a book or magazine, or something off the web. So I couldn't sell any of that. So At present, I'm am making my own pieces that I can use to sell as prints. I am also going to start my own KZbin Channel, and make other social media associated with it, especially a Patreon.

[@AlphaDrivers]

The most important discussion for today artists! I will follow your tips!

[@liesbethartlife]

One of the hardest things for me is to put a price on my artwork & prints 🤔 I’m not that good in selling my own stuff, putting a price is so hard as a beginner artist. I’ve just made prints and Christmas cards to sell this sunday. Everything is done, except the price tags 🙄 I love making art and I love to show my art on Instagram, but when it comes to selling my stuff I stress out 😪

[@snoopyslu]

I have the same issue about pricing. Adding up the cost of supplies is easy but it's when they tell me to charge for my time that I stress out.

[@Dantmi]

Same here btw 😭💔 , its the hardest thing to putt prices on my art works lol , i wish if i can just fix this problem

[@TicketToLearning]

Liesbeth Vandenschrieck me too!!

[@getting__crafty5464]

The way I’ve been told to go about this problem is to make sure you’re not low-balling yourself! For example, you don’t want to end up making less than minimum wage for sure, and neither do any other artists. Take a look at what other artists are selling their works for. You don’t want to sell them or yourself short. Price depends of the time and effort and resources you put into the piece- and remember that if you sell yourself short other artists will be forced to do the same to compete. Quality work comes at a quality price and those who want to support you will always be willing to pay the price! If someone wants an ultra cheap print then they can go to a mega chain- you must value your time and art! This was just some advice from long time artists and professors I’ve spoken to!

[@Michelle-dn6lm]

Me too, I’ve recently sold a commissioned project for around $250. The project itself consisted of 3 12’ by 16’ acrylic paintings plus a smaller 5’ by 6’ painting. It took me months to complete it, pack it, and ship it. And it was such a big project that it took a toll on my mental health. I still thing I may have under-priced/sold it and it makes me a bit uneasy thinking about it, but I have also had people surprised that I charged so much (they were not artists). I’m not so worried about it though because it went to someone my family is close too and I know they will take care and appreciate it, but I still feel like I worked a lot harder for a less than I deserved. Edit: it was also my first serious commission so I didn’t rlly (and still don’t) know what I’m doing

[@michaelwardjr7441]

You're absolutely talented. I know I'm telling you something you already know. I enjoyed watching you paint. I hope you prosper more than you expect.

[@zaxpeedy2852]

This video is a bit too soon for me. I'll be back in 5 months.

[@vassilisa.n.1220]

5 months is past lol How are you doing in sales?

[@zaxpeedy2852]

@@vassilisa.n.1220 Not in sales. I've improved my skills! I've done my first ever shading piece just today! It still needs work though, want me to show you?

[@zaxpeedy2852]

Looking back to these 5 months a lot has happened. My animation course was supposed to end be ended by now but due to the outbreak that's been way postponed so I just focused on getting better at just drawing and digital painting...

[@vassilisa.n.1220]

@@zaxpeedy2852 ah yes the world has stopped I want to see, you have a Instagram or something?

[@zaxpeedy2852]

@@vassilisa.n.1220 Yeah my ID is zaxpeedy. I'm just adding some finishing touches to it before uploading it :D

[@joeblankenship377]

There's a big flea market that comes through my town once a month. I've been thinking about going and checking out what kind of art people are selling there. I'd be happy just to make half my rent selling art every month. But of course, making a living as a full-time artist is the dream.

[@bluestarhealingangels9162]

Joe Blankenship tried the flea market some makes to set your price to what they want for you and items don’t sell very well heard on line the way to go

[@mikah.6672]

Flea market is for poor/stingy people so it's the opposite of the market you want to reach. Aim to sell in markets that value art. You want your client demographic to be one that can afford art.

[@T1tusCr0w]

Flea market is a disaster. Tried it for a year a few back and only made a small profit overall for a whole summer / autumns work. I would get insane traffic too and people complimenting the art but turning that into sales was really hard. Lots of people just don’t have the money. Put your art supper low prices a print if you want to actually sell any.

[@amaartz5058]

*if you are reading this god bless, Small artist here,i post drawing videos* 😭💜

[@marrealillustrations759]

Same! Have a great day! God bless!

[@DokaDawg]

I checked out your channel and geez you are such a talented artist 😍 Subed straight away

[@amaartz5058]

Marreal illustrations thanks Subbed♥️

[@amaartz5058]

Janza Nite thank youu so much♥️

[@violetfantasy2537]

*Hey, we should all subscribe to each other* !!!

[@longstrandna1]

Obviously online teaching is the most lucrative aspect of being an artist for most these days and ninja-self-marketing/ self promotion, like this talented young lady. Take a leaf out of her book. While her creativity and technical ability is undeniable, so is that of countless artists out there. What she's harnessed the power of teaching this stuff, marketing with great click bait post titles and shameless self promotion. I take my hat off to her, cos it while it all appears free to the end user she's getting paid handsomely. All the power to her. She's worked hard at it, Well done! Now go out there and create something as good or better than this and stop making a career out of 'Getting prepared' my fellow artists.

[@JS93art]

Going to start implementing some of these this coming year! Artists supporting artists :)

[@MarvelEbiwari]

Loved every bit of this video let us support and encourage each other.✨ as an upcoming artist I really appreciate you creating this community. ❣️

[@sassylebraix8009]

Thanks for this precious information, earning money only by selling commisions while getting 5$ per month on patreon has become a really mentally heavy and time consuming activity

[@DiscoveringTheArtofLiving]

Great ideas! Your painting is breathtaking! I love the softness and colours!❤️❤️❤️

[@cherieadamsdodd1460]

Kristy, I love your videos! I am moving next week and then I will be dedicating myself to starting my art. I look forward to joining your online courses but until then I continue to binge on your youtube vids xx

[@EthosArts]

Thanks, Kirsty! I don't have time to finish this video now, but it's saved to my watch later. Merry Christmas!

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

Ethos Arts it is a long one 😂 thank you and a very merry christmas to you too 🥰💕

[@kimberlyearly8918]

I'm not really interested in making money from my art because I'm brand new to watercolors but I love watching these just to watch you paint! This is so pretty!

[@rupaliembry]

Well done, Kirsty! This was very informative, thank you!

[@ivacheung792]

You are so generous with your knowledge. Thank you!

[@marvin.miiiii]

I will come back in 2022 to do all this.. I need to improve me skills first.. Good luck future me!

[@mjpete27]

Kirsty, you created a wonderful video addressing your viewers needs distinctly and professionally, well done! I hope you’re able to continue and refine your list and give more direction to those who expressed interest in the income revenue streams that they must feel will work for them. I will enjoy watching them as you continue to educate us all. Thank you for continuing to share your expertise with knowledgeable experience and truly lovely voice!

[@juliastasiak4218]

Thank you! I love this new series 😍😍

[@jackiechan1914]

Very helpful. This needs more views.

[@artofgould1945]

This was very helpful! I never saw myself being a full time artist, but these tips could very well be a game changer!

[@SaskaArt]

Thank you for sharing so much..

[@donnawalter3061]

Great tips and advice kirsty, love your painting, very pretty 👍😘😘😘

[@TomQuigleyArt]

Cheers for the advice Kirsty 👍🏻

[@joannalenau1870]

this was such a good video. REAL advice and income streams - probably the best video i've seen on this subject. well done

[@starswater]

This is SO HELPFUL, THANK YOU. I am exhausted right now and feeling pretty ill, so I don't have a lot of energy to devote to fully expressing my thoughts on this video right now (in terms of answering your question at the end, I definitely want to spend time thinking about that), but for now my main thoughts are: I will be watching this video again, possibly multiples times; I think you've just helped me make a decision on how I want to move forward with my artwork; and probably one of the most important points for me personally - hearing you say those things about doing commissions really stressing you out and that it's not for you honestly made me feel really relieved. I've had the same issue to an intense degree but was starting to feel like it was about the only option out there. Thank you so, so, *so* much for this video.

[@joelamore-streetartmuralsi1229]

Thanks for sharing this info!

[@saltlifegull4091]

You're so dang smart Kirsty! Addicted to your videos and have learned so much. God bless you pretty lady!

[@chdeepthisri4784]

Her paintings are sooooooo good

[@emis.artworks1843]

I love your videos😍 and your art is amazing❤️ keep it up!😃

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

emis.artworks thank you so much 🥰

[@Raffael_IT]

Hey kirsty, I have a lot of fun watching your videos, I find them very useful and interesting way to learn watercolor. and also I love this serie about the business side of being an artist. I would love you to do more watercolor tutorials along the business tutorials!

[@mochawitch]

Thank you for the great info, and your art is *amazing*

[@gee355Art]

Thank you for this - I like your distinction between active and passive income streams. This has definitely given me something extra to think about 👍

[@attheranch873]

Thank you SO much, this is just the information that I need! ❤️🌷👍 The more on this subject the better 😀

[@woodspirit100]

Great job, thank you Kirsty😃👍🌹

[@helenknecht2407]

Good advice and beautiful painting. Thank you.

[@lilliangraham9850]

my end result for my future ,livestreaming ,tutorials ,blogs and vlogs

[@JupiterMuffles]

Lol, I know the reference photo you're using. I have the same one in my reference photo folder. You did a great job by the way 😁

[@amymar7644]

This video is super helpfull, i'm thinking of trying to make a consious effort to become an artist so this video really helps 😊

[@jcwt_pdx]

Thanks, and that is a beautiful piece of art 😍🥰❤️💕💜 Selling, prints, social media, blog, and I will see about all the others.

[@kateb6866]

Thank you Brandon ❤️this was absolutely beautiful ❤️❤️❤️you are a true virtuoso 😘I appreciate this amazing interpretation of Chopin who as a composer is very close to my heart

[@thecalligraphyraven3559]

Very useful video :) Thanks for sharing :)

[@willywildcat1168]

Thank you so much! I've been following you for a long time now, when I started getting into art (specifically graphite), and this video was INCREDIBLY informing. As a student, I've been looking to find income revenues that aren't "active", as you put it, since I can't fulfill every single request. So, hearing about the more passive ways, such as selling prints, etc., was remarkably helpful and opens up many options! Thank you!

[@daniahamweih5929]

Thank you sm.this was really helpful ❤😍

[@snoopyslu]

Thanks for the tips. But also I wanted to say that this painting is amazing!

[@Lavendermama]

Thank you so much for sharing with us. ✨Love from Japan

[@GamingShow11]

The only video that is actually helpful, thank you so much.

[@puaaapifaamoana4495]

I know I'm late, but thank you so much. Really helpful. Keep up the good work and stay safe sis❤

[@kavitabhandariarts205]

Thanks. Very helpful

[@lukashenriksen4051]

You're the best! Keep on going strong!

[@jorossart]

You are doing an Amazing job! Thank you ❤

[@mcatherine6310]

Thank you so much for those sets of videos about these topics! Just lately I've been thinking to create an art blog and create tutorials on skillshare. Would also love to sell prints of my artwork and also sell them on objects like phone cases. So these are my four values I would like to focus on.

[@cherc5635]

A well informed set of options to consider! Just learning about its existence is inspiring Kirsty! Thank god I could finally get my google account sorted so I could begin to subscribe!.... I have learned so much from what I have seen just this first week!....I so look forward to colour pencil painting along with you... over and over! kind regards

[@johnmeyers7157]

'brilliant video - this engaged two sides of my brain!

[@nephtaliejalbert]

I'm interested in the art blog and I'm developing a comic and would like to do art books. And give pdfs of the printed books.

[@mumu5263]

do you have a blog? id be willing to check it out

[@nephtaliejalbert]

@@mumu5263 No not yet since I'm new to art and illustration. When my art has improved, I will.

[@malikbenachour3511]

This is great advice. You are amazing

[@karou3205]

VERY useful, thank you

[@StephenWarrenArt]

Love the community in your channel

[@dannyhorner9186]

Right now I just been doing commissions for portraits. I just post them on social media and I been getting jobs faster then I can do them. But it's a lot. I'm waiting for an SD card to come in the mail. Then I can start recording videos with my phone. And try patreon.

[@hudakashif5337]

Thank you so much it really helps me ❤💜🤗🤗🤗

[@rajanrawool]

I lost my job and now i dont have any income source, i started painting thinking i might make some income but so far theres nothing happening according to my plans and now i cant afford this hobby , hope this video helps me

[@syedaiqrahussain]

Amazing 😍

[@1SnarfyDude]

That painting is gorgeous.

[@dannyhorner9186]

I learn so much from you. Your the best.

[@MohiniArtGallery]

Great video and lesson..

[@dreamrabbits5072]

I've been watching your videos for a while and especially about the career part of it. I feel like you haven't really noticed that the online artist community is extremely over-saturated. The supply far outweighs the demand, it seems as if every other person is an artist, and there is a huge cultural shift towards having a side hustle nowadays especially since the pandemic. It's no wonder why so many artists fail, and a lot of artists do the exact same thing and do the same subject matter. I won't expect you to realize everything now because I understand you are still young and haven't learned every single thing or noticed everything yet, especially since you're busy with your own business. There are hundreds of thousands of tiny art channels with less than 5k subscribers, many of them with great high quality videos but underwhelming views, same with instagram, millions of art accounts with like 3K followers. I know it seems as if it must be easier to be an artist now, but personally I think I probably should have started 15 years ago instead of now, nowadays I'll be lost in a sea of artists, billions of drawings and paintings and digital art.

[@TheLeahsKitchen]

Nice painting!

[@CharleyWang]

Merry Christmas！

[@rathiart2905]

Thank you kristy

[@orpheustolkien2976]

After mastering all your tutorials. I'll watch this☺

[@wachamcaulit]

Yesh U tried something new I’m so proud of you uwu

[@annalisabeery]

Do you have a preference or favorite site when it comes to selling prints passively?

[@YehoshuaShellim]

This is so helpful (especially for other small KZbinrs like myself)! 🙏 Merchandise would be so cool to sell... However would need a bigger following base first lol😂 thanks so much for talking about commissions and listening to your fans comments☺️ it is hard like you say😔 Thanks Kirsty again! By the way do you sell merch?

[@muhammedherwis7836]

An actual living legend. This artist is up and beyond shes the leonardo davinci of our era keep it up!! 👍👍👍

[@user-ot4vs1mg2o]

Davinci who? I bet she's better.

[@vesperstudio]

This video couldn’t have come at a better time! I just set up my Society6 shop today and I’ll have at least two new designs by Monday. Definitely gonna look into other ways of making money off of my creativity, this has been a dream of mine for a while now.

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

Good luck with your new shop 💕👍🏻

[@vesperstudio]

@@KirstyPartridgeArt thank you!!

[@vesperstudio]

@@maxmustermannn I could create an artist account with no problems so I guess they do

[@vesperstudio]

@@maxmustermannn I created it like 9 hours ago, so now xD no problem!

[@vesperstudio]

@@maxmustermannn I'd love to but I don't have Instagram :< but that's odd, I don't see anything like it in my end. Oh well, if this doesn't work out, there's still Redbubble

[@colleenstromberg592]

Hey, love your videos

[@KennyGsca]

Thank you for the upload Kirsty, I have a dumb question but... with the line stencil shown at 1:42, do you do private videos with your tutorials on how you get that line work and to transfer it to the canvas? Sorry for the dumb question just wasn’t sure how it’s done cheers, thanks again -Ken from Australia like Jazza ;)

[@keyenglaoba837]

Awesome arts👌

[@saundieeeart97]

Well done great video again

[@KirstyPartridgeArt]

Thank you 🥰

[@rishusketches8894]

Very nice 👌

[@T1tusCr0w]

I can paint and draw and sculpt just about anything. I have a very appealing style too. I have found the best way to make money in the modern world is to do high quality originals for rich people through the gallery system. I’d advise you to hone your oils or if your doing watercolours you have to be truly top drawer. Normal people now have little money to spend on art. I tried selling lots at a low price. There is to much white noise now to cut through. If I showed you a lighthouse I had done you would say. Oh cool lighthouse painting. I put it on Etsy a few years ago and then tried to make it appear to me as a customer. It was 16 pages.back. 🤣🤣🤷🏻‍♂️👀 you need to understand cross pollination of networks. Everything has to lead to everything else. It’s damn exhausting as an artist that kind of thing. But you cannot cut through without doing it.

[@xLuiKangx007]

That's awesome

[@mishti06]

Kirsty where would be a good starting point for learning how to create e books? I've never done it before but I'm really interested. I really loved this vid..very helpful. And of course beautiful work. Thank you for all the wonderful advice?

[@idairisdottir7664]

I love your videos! How to you film your videos?

[@PhoebeCamui]

Ive started a KZbin for tutorials but I can't figure out the algorithm. Instead of tags now the description is more important. I feel it's very suppressed

[@autumn._.drawzzzz8861]

Where do you find your reference photos?

[@Aimz360]

I loved this video. I kinda know which direction i want to go in like prints to start off with then the possibility of selling enamel pins. It's going to be slow on the uptake for me as i do a lot of gaming and writing (the latter being the biggest income i wish to receive as i am passionate for it).

[@ShoshanahShear]

I thought of doing a book with some of my paintings and the meaning or message of them. Do you have any tips related to this e.g. size of book and how to copyright images? I'd also like to learn how to prepare a calendar or diary with my art and sponsored products with reviews and sponsorship and affiliate. Also, how do you decide which of the POP companies to work with and how do you set prices? Thanks for your help, this is very useful.