Kurt's Card Care, Sports Card Influencers & the FBI...

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[@TheDetonator501]

Very interesting, Paul. The services that Kurt's Card Care performs and his products would not be illegal. However, I think the legal issue would be the potential "conspiracy to commit fraud" in this type of situation, along with the related crimes you mentioned (mail or wire fraud). Mainly due to the dollar amount involved. if it can be proven, he knows the customer is planning to defraud PSA (through grading, service levels, insurance, etc.). It all comes down to the intent to commit fraud (two or more people) and actions towards its completion (conspiracy). Certainly, some of his restoration videos show the completed act on behalf of the customer. Still, conspiracy between the parties would need to be proven as it relates to his services. Likely not hard to do by interviewing his customers. From a legal perspective, it seems plausible....especially with the victim being PSA and the eventual buyer of the card being defrauded. 18 U.S. Code § 1341 - Frauds and swindles If you restore cards and keep them for yourself, there is no legal issue. There could be criminal and civil exposure if you try to commit fraudulent activity through deception. I've never submitted to PSA, but it seems they need a legal disclaimer signed by the customer stating that no alteration has been performed on the cards submitted to give them victim standing. Good video.

[@vintagesportsshack]

I'm no lawyer... just my discussions with the fbi being related... I'm just trying to find out the legalities of it all.

[@TheDetonator501]

@@vintagesportsshack It's tricky, man. Ultimately, you need to have an actual victim who has suffered a considerable loss (or continual loss in PSA's position) to file the report. If PSA doesn't take more forceful actions, it also exposes itself to liability (since it provides customer protection on its grading). It will take a real victim who has been harmed to move this issue along.

[@DanTheCardMan2]

@@TheDetonator501 I'd love to chat to a lawyer on this. It might constitute fraud given the TC's of the submission process would have something around acknowledging that you haven't knowingly submitted a card that breaches their policies. i.e. if someone soaks a card and then submits to PSA with the intention to sell

[@rrs013]

@@DanTheCardMan2 Is it the intention of most people that are grading cards is to sell, or that is the picture that hobby is trying to paint.

[@TheDetonator501]

@@DanTheCardMan2 Dan, as I shared, the issue will be identifying an actual victim who suffered considerable financial loss. PSA's Terms and Conditions state, "Customer represents and warrants that he/she has no knowledge and no reasonable basis to believe that any item submitted for grading has been altered in any way or is not genuine." A scenario I could see: Joe Dirt Bag buys a popular card in a PSA 7 with some defects. He intends to use restoration services to correct the defects and resubmit to PSA for a higher grade (to sell for profit). He then connects with "the restoration service," and together, they conspire to commit this fraud. The card gets submitted and returns a PSA 10 (1 of 1). It is then auctioned or sold to a buyer for $62,000. Within 8 months, the restoration treatment materials begin to erode, and some defects begin to reappear. The new card owner contacts PSA and seeks restitution for what happened since they authenticated it. PSA likely has some insurance for situations like this. For people who think PSA should be able to spot every restored card, that is not fair. We wouldn't expect a bank to spot every counterfeit bill that crosses the counter due to the volume of currency they receive. PSA grades a large volume of cards, so alterations could be difficult to consistently catch. Paul has done a good job of shining the spotlight on this issue. It really comes down to fraud and conspiracy. PSA could be a victim or the person who ends up with the alteration. Either way, a victim(s) with considerable loss is needed. Who knows how long these restoration treatment products last on the surface of the card. It is certain that Joe Dirt Bag only cares the treatment lasts as long as it takes to sale the altered card. Many of these KZbin "hobby influencers" have discussed this issue for weeks and typically show their lack of morals regarding what is happening from a fraud angle. However, there is certainly an appearance of fraud (odor of mendacity) that is occurring against PSA and the ultimate buyer of the altered cards. I can assure you that none of these "pro-restoration" people would want to pay a high amount for a card only later to find out it was altered and didn't deserve the grade. I look forward to any future segments you do on this issue as your videos are always well done. :)

[@Yo-vs4se]

I agree, there’s a reason why Kurt always block the serial number of the card he mess with. Cus he knows it’s not right and no one would ever buy a refurbished card like that.

[@TheBargainBoxer]

Keep up the great work, Paul. This garbage needs to be called out and the turfs who condone this crap need to get the flock out of this hobby…..

[@Ready4Wednesday]

If the FBI shut down Kurt's Card Care, we would hear the cheers from Sports Card Radio around the globe.

[@sylversyrfer6894]

People frequently clean and press comic books before submitting them for grading. NOT doing so is considered to be like throwing money away, and there is ZERO expectation of disclosing said cleaning to the grading company. Very different attitude in the two hobbies.

[@vintagesportsshack]

the card hobby is not about the money.

[@SilverSluggerCollectibles]

I actually just posted a video myself about this crap. Kurt is a Fraud and is in Denial. I Cant wait to see what happens with this and his "product" which is probably Guitar Wax and Guitar Polish. 😂

[@vintagesportsshack]

its not guitar wax. that comes in hard blocks like substance i believe... its call violin wax i think. could be some type polish?

[@smackdaddy710]

You are the best! You just put a checkmate to everybody that defends Kurt.

[@benjaminlyng8269]

Why did PSA savage grades for coins that were cleaned but not do the same for sports cards that were cleaned. PSA enforced these standards on coins for literally decades.

[@DanTheCardMan2]

Its boggled my mind for a long time, why people think its ok not to disclose. Its deceptive and the fact PSA suck at their job shouldn't dismiss or downplay it.

[@vintagesportsshack]

I agree 100%... no real money will ever enter this hobby with this much scandals...

[@gregb120]

On a previous video where you are turning cards into your bulk submission people they clearly have Kurt’s card care polish on their desk

[@vintagesportsshack]

Watch all videos. We know this. Psa knows this.

[@gregb120]

@@vintagesportsshack I don’t have the time for that. I was honestly trying to find out what your 1990 bo Jackson came back as from a video you made 7 months ago. Don’t you find it kind of childish to crap all over a product, call the FBI, make a video saying it’s 100 different types of fraud, but also submit your cards through a third party who you know uses said product. Doesn’t that mean you are also committing fraud a million times over? If you’ve cleared this up in a later video let me know

[@vintagesportsshack]

@@gregb120 do you smoke Crack? I've talked about this over and over... I've explained that to be part of the hobby, sell cards at a profit, you have to grade with who sells. I don't clean cards, so no I'm not part of the problem... you have to watch all videos made to have an opinion. But thanks I guess?!?!?

[@gregb120]

@@vintagesportsshack cmon man let’s not stoop down to that level. Act your age. At the end of my last comment I asked if this has been discussed more in a later video. No need to be rude.

[@akinsattic9793]

PSA would quickly go out of business if they started turning people in to the FBI. To many people including myself buy raw cards from eBay and submit them. If i bought a card off ebay and then submitted it and PSA turned me in then why would i want to take the chance of buying cards and sending them in? Also if someone was to buy a card and use that stuff and then get turned in couldn't they just say hey i bought this from someone off ebay how was i supposed to know. So now card sells on eBay come to a halt. The card selling market on third party platforms would crash. instantly

[@Shanemo007]

If you’re gonna smoke, smoke some pot!

[@Koufax55505]

Us true collectors gotta stick together and keep these scumbags like Kurt’s Card Grease out of the industry that they are steadily ruining & deceiving!!

[@SplendidSports]

I thoroughly enjoyed this video sir.

[@user-tm6qh6su7o]

Collectors have been posting videos for years now, using any sort of product to clean/restore cards using household cleaning supplies, lens cleaner, auto wax, etc... Now, I will say some of Kurt's methods are different. I have never seen anyone completely soak a card in a liquid before, but it certainly not the first time someone has used a cleaning product on a card. I am not defending these actions, just saying it has long been a part of the hobby with little push-back until now. There are tables set up at card shows now where people offer a "cleaning service" to prep your cards for grading. Many say, You are just cleaning a card to remove stains that were not originally on the card, so there is nothing wrong/deceptive about the practice. It is a big 'Grey Area' in the hobby. I think the real problem is that the Grading services cannot enforce a definitive set of guidelines until they can properly detect it during their grading service and that lies the Big problem.

[@unclesnake3766]

Calling the FBI over cleaning sports cards? Man...at least you're on their radar now.

[@vintagesportsshack]

U don't think I'm already on the fbi radar just for being a white male from the mid west??? And my life is boring... u get to watch my exciting life thru utube. I'm sure that's what has the fbi worried!!

[@williamfonda406]

I am pretty sure this guy is on their radar already. You aren't allowed within 100 yards of a school huh? Federal Violation, haha.

[@vintagesportsshack]

@@williamfonda406 1500 yds

[@unclesnake3766]

@@vintagesportsshack oh boy...have to get that algorithm changed

[@LonelyBasementBaseballCards]

Preach on brother.

[@Christlockhart1]

Good for you on the smoking. Best advice I ever got was, pick a date and let that be the date you stop. No meds or gimmicks. Been about 9 years and I never picked wanted a cigarette again. Stick with it, you will be all good and feel so much better going forward.

[@BoxChildFilms]

How is this video sitting at 1.2k this is yt vid of the year. I watched the next morning to make sure it was real. Need a follow up!!!

[@vintagesportsshack]

I followed up Monday and am currently still working on it. Thank you

[@PatTheRipper]

It should be a federal crime for Panini to hand out meaningless points. 😂 Or a redemption to take over a year to get

[@Shelton_47]

If you ever actually get the redemption 😂 it’s like an I owe you that they can decide not to cash if they don’t want to. Redemptions should have to be removed from these products. Oh wait then you still have to pay expensive shipping on a product you already paid for that was supposed to be in the box in the first place 😂

[@theworstshotinbasketball9890]

Passionate Paul! I love it!

[@shakascloset1700]

Kurt is pissed. He said your a narc.😂 am I the only one in the hobby that doesn't give a fu$k about card condition. 🤦‍♂️ I'll take a authentic card in bike spokes over a hyped up PSA10.

[@vintagesportsshack]

There's a difference in a snitch and someone that is looking out... kurt needs to learn the difference...

[@IOSARBX]

Vintage Sports Shack, Subscribed because your videos always make me smile!

[@vintagesportsshack]

Thank you friend!!!

[@liverust5]

Can we turn in psa first?

[@akinsattic9793]

Also if PSA started turning people into the FBI, couldn't someone do a submission after the did these things to the card and the turn PSA into the FBI for authentication of a fraudulent card? There goes PSA and every other grading company because none of them would want the hassle.

[@vendora1]

last night on dans stream VSS NEO showed up i asked him if he was on the position of if it cant be detected its ok he said the following " maybe they need to send a submission form with a checkbox if you used substances/tools to clean cards" yes VSS the good ol honor system i told him hes was being ridiculous if he thinks thats going to work

[@vintagesportsshack]

yeah, someone altering cards is gonna tell psa... ha.

[@rufrydrmw]

FBI ain’t wasting their money on this shit. Get a life bro.

[@vintagesportsshack]

Get the c o c k out ur mouth... i didnt hear you... but im sure your the one that called...

[@vintagesportsshack]

I just checked ur channel and social... keep the c o c k in ur mouth!! Ha, what a joke!!!

[@shakascloset1700]

Withdraw symptoms bringing the RAGE🤬🤘😂

[@rage508cardsngrails]

U Rang??? 👀 😤😡💪🏻😉😂🤣

[@mindcycle_cards]

The pro-cleaning/restoring crowd needs to talk to grading companies about labeling worked on cards as "restored", just like they do in comics for heavily restored copies. That would effectively legitimize the process as long as the work done is disclosed. They won't though because it will hurt their grift. They'd rather hide behind it's only "restoration" and "it's not hurting anyone" instead of admit what they are doing is deception, mostly in an attempt to try and take in larger profits when they sell this stuff.

[@johnwayne9828]

"BuT yOu WoUlD cLeAn A cAr WhEn YoU SaLe It"🤪🤪🤪 These idiots drive me crazy, and the bs that they just want "preserve art" is a joke. Like you say, they dont want to disclose what they're doing to customers. This hobby has gotten way too shady.

[@kamikazesportscardhybrid6243]

Preach 😊

[@kitescuriosities7717]

It’s just incredible the lengths people will go to make money. It’s the root of all evil.

[@vendora1]

@@JenniferMedina-bg1zb good thing you arent the only opinion on this matter

[@MaidensWorldOfWax]

Once more for the ones in the back of the room. On point well said. Thank you.

[@dwiii1635]

An easy way for PSA to go out of business would be turning suspected card cleaners (lmao) over the FBI, lol. The minute they start doing that, thousands of graders won't bother sending their cards in in the case they buy a raw card that was cleaned and unknowingly send it in and will have to deal with the fuckin' FBI over a sports card, lmao.

[@vintagesportsshack]

No, it'd just stop the card cleaning... but thanks for watching friend!!

[@dwiii1635]

@@vintagesportsshack I'd be here for it. Would be entertaining at the least. Keep callin' people out, champ. Has to be done.

[@JeffsCardJourney]

Yes on the mail fraud for sure. When you go to mail a package USPS asks you if you have any liquids that are hazardous, flammable etc... Pretty sure when he ships this stuff via usps he doesn't disclose it.

[@matthewgreeley3099]

All that passion and tough guy talk.......then you hit us all with Dude (Dude Looks Like A Lady) with those dance moves?! I laughed out loud! Epic

[@vintagesportsshack]

Your welcome

[@RJIII-5]

lol, no chance it's illegal to do whatever you want to your own cards. Nobody can prove it didn't come that way when it was bought.

[@vintagesportsshack]

Didn't listen did ya... I said that... twice even... it's not illegal till you don't disclose it or sell it or send into a grading company to deceive.. but I'm sure that's what you meant.

[@RJIII-5]

@@vintagesportsshack I did listen and my comment stands. Let's say someone gave you a raw card that was "cleaned" and you had no knowledge of that. Then you choose to send it in to get graded. There is ZERO way PSA or anyone can hold another liable or prove they cleaned a card. It's not going to happen.

[@vendora1]

@@RJIII-5 you are not too bright are you? then the SELLER/GIVER of that card did not DISCLOSE what they did to the card thus liable for FRAUD jfc

[@dwiii1635]

@@vendora1 No, it's not, lol. RJ is right, no one in their right mind is going to sue over this dumb shit, lol. If you buy a raw card and send it off to get it graded, they are not going to turn people over to the FBI. They can not prove you knowingly did that. The minute PSA does that, 90% of people will stop with their service since they don't want to be falsely accused and answer to the fuckin' FBI over a piece of cardboard, lmao.

[@vintagesportsshack]

@@Big_Mac_Boy that's where ur wrong. Deceiving PSA is ILLEGAL

[@jbar74]

Agreed!

[@Hockeycardsplus]

Your a joke, then everyone who even wiped off a fingerprint , fixed a corner would be guilty,

[@vintagesportsshack]

wiped off a fingerprint... no. fixing a corner, yes, that is knowingly and wittingly deceiving PSA. depending on the amount of money... PSA can, if they desire, press charges and get the fbi involved for mail and wire fraud. so, am i a joke, or is your opinion wrong?

[@Hockeycardsplus]

You are a joke, whoever damaged a corner altered it, I'm fixing it, not deceptive, nothing was added to or taken away from the original card, go kiss more psa but

[@orangecrush4319]

Snitch!!

[@vintagesportsshack]

theres a difference between good looking and snitch... when you figure it out, life is easier. but thanks for watching.

[@liverust5]

I smoked a pack a day and drank 2 to 3 bottles mountain dew a day and energy drinks. I opened a lot of packs

[@johnmabie5266]

Good luck in your battle with your addictions! And keep dancing!

[@vintagesportsshack]

Day 4 and still winning!!!

[@MaidensWorldOfWax]

@@vintagesportsshack Atta Boy 5 years start of april. Ciggys are tough but you got this. Well done on the pop, I am breaking that habit now. Good Luck

[@BoxChildFilms]

Is this real life

[@vintagesportsshack]

Or just fantasy?!?!?

[@imcheesecakeLLC]

Appreciate the video immensely, but you also look like sketch’s father brother!

[@vintagesportsshack]

You mean "DADDY"???

[@imcheesecakeLLC]

@@vintagesportsshack 😂 I should have thought of that! I Appreciate what you do

[@miroslavklinsmann7021]

Hey bud think you need to get back on that dew and cigs. You sound like you’re losing it.

[@vintagesportsshack]

If u think I'm losing it now... u definitely don't want to see me when I do friend... you prob wouldn't have left a comment if I did.

[@vintagesportsshack]

But then again, ur prob one that alters cards... so, I get it...

[@liverust5]

Did you ask them about the x files ?

[@deathmetalfan4lyfe488]

Ima keep rubbing all this kurt juice all over cards. You will end up buying them eventually. Tell the fbi on me.

[@vintagesportsshack]

I won't be buying them... I don't buy graded cards... my pc is all 1980's junk wax.

[@vendora1]

good fuck around and find out

[@vendora1]

consider it done

[@TideWalker45]

This has to a be a joke. Lol

[@vintagesportsshack]

No joke... fbi called.

[@JuanRivera-um4ly]

if you need to clean your cards then those cards are not mint. Why use that stupid product.

[@dwiii1635]

Because cards come out of the factory scratched and print lined by Panini as is, lol. They give reasons for people to use this stuff so they can actually get a PSA 10 of a card they want without it costing $2,000.

[@DanTheCardMan2]

Hey mate, checking this out now! I didn't see your tag, looks like I missed one from a week ago too! Will check that one out when this one wraps up.

[@vintagesportsshack]

No worries just a bunch of my opinion friend...

[@MrJmangini]

You’re a classic.

[@vintagesportsshack]

I'm just trying to help out where I can!!! My other option was to shower with my cards, but you beat me to it!!!

[@stevezeppieri]

💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼

[@makersncoke8676]

April contest # 22

[@sugarperformance7752]

song should say......dude acts like a lady. oh ...obviously withdrawals are a real thing....lol. when will you be showing older cards from your collection? Peace!

[@vintagesportsshack]

My oldest cards are 70s and 80s. They are in previous videos. Also check out the 1960-70s shoe collection

[@README27]

this dude might actually be insane

[@vintagesportsshack]

Might be?!?!? Ha!!!

[@NEO_Cards_Comics]

I'm very confused, I'm not sure we are on the same page? Could you tell me the time stamp that got you so fired up? I do not remember telling people run out and scrub down cards.

[@vintagesportsshack]

You do it yourself... it's multiple videos. You are a Kurt's card care guy....

[@NEO_Cards_Comics]

@@vintagesportsshackI don’t even use Kurt’s stuff how am I Kurt’s guy? My stance is this and always has been: Either the grading companies figure out a way to detect it and crack down. Or embrace it like comics did and set up rules on what’s allowable and what’s not so everyone is on the same page.

[@vintagesportsshack]

@@NEO_Cards_Comics just stop.. don't be part of the problem. Be part of the solution.

[@NEO_Cards_Comics]

@@vintagesportsshackdo the dew my dude.

[@vintagesportsshack]

@@NEO_Cards_Comics don't be a b*tch. Just because you got called out for being a card alterer.. does your sponsor know you support alteration? Remember the psa 6 you turned to a 10 by trimming the corner??? I do... keep it up friend... have me come down hard on you. Have me contact you sponsors with my concerns... you wanna apologize now or when I see you next month?

[@jeremylopez4156]

I think I'm done with this channel not because I disagree, I'm just not a fan of old men ranting and raving telling me he's a "Sheriff"😂

[@vintagesportsshack]

I could rant and rave and tell you how much of a b*tch you are... would that fit ya?

[@Ready4Wednesday]

I don't see this as "Sheriff" mentality. It's more of seeking information and passing it along.

[@PatTheRipper]

@@vintagesportsshack😂😂😂😂

[@kly1994]

Just saw this on my algorithm and clicked on it… 0:44 I paused and read this comment. It’s funny to see wannabe influencers talk siht. I’m done with this channel too. 😂😂😂

[@BulleyeWarrior]

kurts card card need to turn in to the FBI and it need to be ban

[@README27]

psa sucks

[@aihsports]

Good video. I'll try to do a video response next week

[@vintagesportsshack]

I'm gonna add on Monday