Lama Lab Test: Wahoo KICKR SNAP Smart Trainer // Weighted Wheel Test

[@lastpme]

Just upgraded from the Tacx Smart Flow to the Snap, and I think it is an upgrade. With a wife and two kids, this was the best trainer that would fit in my budget and help me become a better rider.

[@bmccall30]

I'm very satisfied with the Snap I have and believe it's good value for the price. I don't race and I'm just looking for a way to exercise when the weather is bad. Accuracy compared to a more expensive power meter may be relevant but is a lower priority for me. Consistency from one ride to the next is all I need. Did I suck today or did I show improvement? From that perspective adding weights to the wheel just seems silly and wasteful. If I have to work a little harder because the wheel slows down faster than outdoors, good. Work is what we're here for isn't it?

[@gregupton6188]

Absolutely brilliant production Shane. Informative and entertaining. Can't ask for more. Your shows just get better and better. Well done and thanks.

[@Ih8GoogleandApple]

Shane getting fancy with the edits!

[@bullwhipjohnson8247]

The Lama Lab is looking really good. The light grey makes it look more Lab Like. 👍

[@jonathanzappala]

I use a heavy junky wheel, but I also fill the tube with water. It adds 950g. It’s about 63psi the one time I tried to get the pressure. The pressure is fine, but that way I have all the weight at the rim, which is the whole point. It doesn’t make a big difference like your experiment. I am measuring power with my cranks and using a fluid trainer without a flywheel. The bonus is I went a whole year and never had to pump it up. Until it got a flat.

[@Juan0003]

I believe Tyler Durden was doing the editing on this one!

[@markhodges1276]

Great review - wheel weights aside, the Kickr Snap sounds perfect.... great for all the interval training and regular riding around Zwift, but then you get a nice like 10% turbo boost on the sprint hahahahaha.... right now I need all the help I can get.

[@mister_ray]

I use the "Pro Flywheel" on the Kurt Kinetic dumb Road Machine fluid trainer. It adds 6 lbs for a total of 18 lbs flywheel. Def prefer the feel with the extra weight. I find the fluid trainer gives the best road feel. I wish someone would make a smart (i.e. controllable resistance) fluid trainer.

[@wercruising]

So this would explain when I upgraded to the Tacx Neo from the Kickr Snap I went from super hero in the sprints and on steep grade hill climbs on Zwift to just above average, lol. I do find it very interesting that in all of the reviews of the Tacx Neo no one ever said you will have to work harder to achieve the same result than most other smart trainers. Curious if you have ever noticed this

[@gplama]

Work harder on the Neo? Not the case, so that's why people don't say it. The reality is a lot of people switch from inaccurate trainers to one that's known for good accuracy. There can be a slightly different ride feel with the Neo and the 'simulated' flywheel. But that's not what most people are referring to when they lose a few good points from their previous FTP.

[@wercruising]

Shane Miller - GPLama I’m a solid C rider on Zwift, FTP of 251 watts on the game, have been riding Zwift for 3+ years, this past winter I’ve logged on about 1300+ miles since the middle of January to date, most always racing with a good friend of mine that uses a Kickr r. Before upgrading to the Neo I would always be leading, out sprinting and winning our races, now I cannot hold his wheel in game, I’m turning myself inside out just to keep up. So when I say I I’m working harder on the Neo compared to the Snap, that’s what I’m referring to.

[@Shauncat1]

Love your videos Shane, very informative indeed. I have wahoo kicker snap 2,would love to try that as well

[@OliverCrowhurst]

It's a good trainer for people who want power data but can't afford a 1.5 grand power meter.

[@hngldr]

Thanks - I've always wondered about this. LOVED the graph transition btw

[@jeanmichel6327]

Hello Shane thanks for the awesome content, I have a PowerTap G3 Hub for a 32 spoke wheel and want to use it on another wheel with less spokes, the warranty will be voided if I do so , in your experience it is possible or I will damage the power meter ?? Would be awesome to try that experiment on your Lama lab test , regards and ride on !!!

[@camilosalazarmancilla2592]

Hi! Good video! Do you think that WAHOO KICKR SNAP it's a good trainer today in 2022? Not for a big use, rather for a more amateur use (2-3 times for a week). Thanks!

[@gplama]

It's still one of the best options for wheel-on smart trainers out there. Direct drive is always a better option if you can stretch the budget.

[@camilosalazarmancilla2592]

@@gplama Thanks Shane! I will consider your advice!

[@camilosalazarmancilla2592]

@@gplama last question! with wahoo kickr snap, if there is a hill in zwift, does it detect it?

[@gplama]

@@camilosalazarmancilla2592 Yes

[@davepratt9909]

Why do you think the Kickr over did the sprints? Maybe the trainer/tire interface was absorbing some of the effort?

[@gplama]

That’d result in the trainer under reading. Not sure. I don’t recall the SNAP being this far out in sprints. It’s been a while since I looked closely at the data. I’ll have to loop back

[@davepratt9909]

@@gplama So, the sprints were done in SIM mode? Yeah, that would be an under reporting (trainer slipping on tire). In ERG mode, it would be over (tire slipping on trainer). Since I don't have to do this, consider doing 30 seconds (to eliminate transients) at progressively increased levels to see if the delta grows as a function of effort.

[@AaronGoodTimes]

I love data!

[@stefansmets1461]

Shane do u use your new bike with the Tacx Neo? Does the thru axel adapter damage your screw-thread? I Have read some remarks on that and would like your opinion.

[@gplama]

The new Tacx TA kit comes with a threaded adapter for the derailleur side which I find a lot better than the original solution. Still.... native TA support is a MUST these days for ease of use. The Kickr/CORE/Elite/Hammer trainers all win hands down for TA.

[@SvenV8]

Is it still a good option to buy this trainer anno 2020? The trainer €499 + €40 tyre + €50 thru axle adapter adds up to the price. Though direct driven trainers tend to be more expensive.

[@gplama]

Entirely your call.

[@ianw3592]

@GPLama Interested in those ANT+ drop outs, how many times did they happen and do you get them with other trainers?

[@gplama]

Dropouts do occur. Rarely for me (which is good!). They happen with almost all ANT+ devices depending on the cause (signal strength, interference, etc).

[@ackack8752]

question: what if you don`t turn 2 knobs and keep it barely touching enough that it does not slip. Is it a fair assessment or will the power be high?

[@gplama]

It'll be high or low... not sure which direction it'll go. 100% it'll be inaccurate.

[@ackack8752]

@@gplama Thnx. but when you do 2 knobs it gets so hard to paddle and it feels you are carrying some weight. Whereas when you have it barealy touching it feels much easier to ride.

[@pilaramieva934]

Hi Shane, I just got a Tarmac Disc Sport and not sure if it is compatible with the Kikr Snap. the thru axle is not QR. Do you know if by buying the Wahoo kit adapter I will be able to use it? I been searching but can't find a clear answer. Thanks!!

[@gplama]

Ping Wahoo Support. The SNAP TA adapter kit should do the trick for you.

[@pilaramieva934]

@@gplama thanks! think the adapter will work

[@Methodical2]

I have a power meter, cadence and speed sensor on my bike, do I need to do all of that spin down stuff? I'm trying to grasp all of this stuff now that I am open to a smart trainer and Zwift. Thanks...

[@gplama]

No spin down required if you're using an on-bike power meter.

[@arnecarrette8624]

do you think that the favero assioma's dual sided is the best/most accurate powermeter on the market?

[@gplama]

It gives me reliable data that by all accounts and comparisons to date look good.

[@samgrice6759]

Have a snap first gen which has been great, in your opinion would upgrading to the core give a better ride experience? Thanks Shane awesome content as usual👌

[@paulz3002]

I had a Tacx Bushido Smart but recently changed to Kickr Core...much better ride experience IMO.

[@gplama]

I'd choose a direct drive over a wheel-on most days of the week, yep.

[@samgrice6759]

Paul Zuvela thanks Paul for your input👍 save my pennies for a core!

[@mr.loyaladventures6513]

is it okay to use MTB on this?, will the big tires with spikes not damage the roller?,

[@gplama]

The knobby tyres don’t work all that well on these units.

[@babybelkin977]

So the snap should make a good trainer for someone doing zwift racing

[@danjo1967]

yep.. pro sprinter ;)

[@andrewjackson5868]

Does the spin down time mean anything? All my spin downs are double what you were getting here.

[@ianrobins5501]

Wahoo told me to inflate tyre to 110psi ride for at least 10 minutes then spindown to between 12-13 seconds ( for me that is about 2 turns) then perform an advance spin down, then repeat normal spin down and adjust if need be

[@andrewjackson5868]

Ian Robins thanks for the info Ian. That seems like quite the faff. Since I got a proper trainer tyre, one turn is enough to mean I can’t make it slip...maybe I’m just weak 😉 The spindown today took 35 seconds. I don’t think it causes any issues, unless I’m missing something 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@ianw3592]

@@andrewjackson5868 Yes the spindowns matter. This sets the 'brake effect'. You need your tyre inflated to 110-120psi, two full turns of the knob once the roller touches the tyre. Ride for at least 10mins to warnm it all up, use the Wahoo app to perform an advanced spindown.

[@andrewjackson5868]

Ian Woodcock Yeah that’s what I did. Then I got a proper trainer tyre, and now it seems I get the same results from just one turn. I don’t get any slipping at that. PSI same, and still do spindown after at least 10mins. If I give it one turn or two, the spindown takes about the same time, I’m not sure the time for the spindown means anything now, the info about that was removed from the app. There is no advanced spindown anymore. I’m not saying anything you’ve said is wrong, just reporting my own observations.

[@ianw3592]

@@andrewjackson5868 Understood :-) I think the advanced spindown is still there, you have to tap the trainer icon 10 times to access it (apologies if you know that already!).

[@jshepard5840]

But tell me, did you do multipile spindowns?

[@gplama]

I can't recall... spindowns don't change the ride feel. Just the power reported from the trainer.

[@jshepard5840]

@@gplama Here's my issue: I use two different wheels and tires on my trainer at times, and they are very different calibrations. If I put the aluminum wheel with the Vittoria Rubino tire on the trainer and calibrate, I get a certain wattage. If I then replace that wheel and tire with my carbon rim and Grand Prix 5000 tire and don't recalibrate, the wattage reading is way higher than it should be.

[@gplama]

@@jshepard5840 Yep. That's one of the issues you'll encounter with a wheel-on trainer.

[@ketjuariittaa]

Why not just pump water on your back wheel innertube. Oviesly allso after that some presure to 110psi. Add weight 0$ cost.🤔

[@darinsteele7091]

Would this work on the Tacx Vortex? Because when I need to set the tension on my tire it needs to be tighter, and it causes the tire to come to a sudden stop much quicker.

[@gplama]

Maybe.... more test rides needed.

[@erlixerlix7573]

Why faffing around with weights? Fill the tire with water!

[@gplama]

How would you inflate a tyre to ~105psi with water? That’d be the ultimate faff. And hilarious if it sprung a leak.

[@erlixerlix7573]

@@gplama Actually it is pretty easy to fill a tyre with water. You would probably use a lower pressure than with air. As water is incompressible all the compliance must come from the tyre stretching, the water will not compress. If it blows it will be much less dramatic than if it was filled with air also since water is incompressible. (Water filled tyres are used both on tractors and in industrial applications, often for saftey reasons. No dangerous tyre explosions!) It is a really good practical joke to fill your mates bycycle tyres with water. The bike will become very strange to ride. :-)

[@joeochoa4030]

How do you actually fill a rear tire with water ? Or any bike tire .., could you explain step by step ? It sounds very interesting ... thanks .

[@erlixerlix7573]

@@joeochoa4030 let the air out of the tire, put you (not favorite) track pump in a bucket of water making sure the air inlet is under water and pump. Turn the wheel to get the valve in the top most pisition and let the remaining air out. Then pump with water to preferred pressure. You can do it with the garden hose as well if you figure out how to mount the pump head on the hose.