Lange & Sohne vs Glashutte Original Comparison Review

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TickTocking

TickTocking

8 жыл бұрын

In this video I compare a Lange 1 Platinum Stealth with a Glashutte PanoMatic Reserve in Rose Gold

Пікірлер: 125
@pulkitsharma6648
@pulkitsharma6648 5 жыл бұрын
Lange is just beauty, What a timeless design. Beats the holy trinity IMO
@cy4624
@cy4624 4 жыл бұрын
Used to handle all 4 when I worked in industry and imho, ALS is superior by long shot. But they dont have sport models or marketing.
@bighands69
@bighands69 3 жыл бұрын
Lange make lovely watches that are on par with the trinity label watches but it does not beat them.
@drizztdourden5291
@drizztdourden5291 3 жыл бұрын
Your right they belong there.
@philhenderson3516
@philhenderson3516 Жыл бұрын
@@cy4624 Glashutte gets even less markerting. For the money, they're unbeatable. And a few models like the Panograph, PanoRetroGraph, and Tourbillon line matches the quality of the most expensive ALS pieces.
@toobalkain
@toobalkain 5 жыл бұрын
Langes are magical, something about them that not even Patek, Vacheron or AP have and the fact that every model gets the same attention, maximum attention to detail, double assembly and all that, amazing, and not that expensive compared to how much Pateks go for. Just not so sure about their metal bracelets, no wonder they always picture them on leather straps.
@FitOutPost
@FitOutPost 6 жыл бұрын
Thanks for your reviews. It's like a discovery for many of your subscribers. Especially those of us who may never be able to hold one of these.
@zoealvarezvazquez1200
@zoealvarezvazquez1200 8 жыл бұрын
I've done a great discovery with this channel. Congrats!
@gmshadowtraders
@gmshadowtraders 7 жыл бұрын
Quality through and through! You put many other watch channels to shame dude! Major respect
@hvgotcodes
@hvgotcodes 8 жыл бұрын
I just discovered your channel. Your content is awesome for people who enjoy watches. Keep up the good work!
@andrewhutchinson1400
@andrewhutchinson1400 8 жыл бұрын
Never realised before just how amazing that Lange is!
@rickj8859
@rickj8859 5 жыл бұрын
It would help, if the guy looked at history of Lange watch making on Wiki. That said, some people liked the review, despite the guy having next to no knowledge of these watches and indeed of the watch making. The German watch making in Glashütte region is comparable to French watch making and goes back few hundred years. Well before Swiss began to make cheap replicas of expensive French and German watches. Unlike majority of Swiss watch manufacturers today, both German companies are vertically integrated. They manufacture everything ... from cases and dials to hair springs in their movements. In general, Swiss watch makers till this day, buy parts, or complete movements from Sellita, or ETA (Swatch Co.) and just stamp their name on. Heuer, Breitling, IWC etc. are just a few of many luxury brands doing it.
@itsapugslife
@itsapugslife 8 жыл бұрын
Lange is stunning and the craftsmanship is second to none, however the Glashutte is amazing value and still very high end finishing with a lovely movement. I'd be happy to have either, could use the change from the Glashutte to buy a nice Rolex GMT or Daytona!
@briancopeland67
@briancopeland67 7 жыл бұрын
I was watch shopping in St. Thomas last week and actually got to compare these two models side by side. While it would have been great to save more than $15K on the Glasshutte there was really no comparing the two in person. The A. Lange 1 is by far the nicer piece. Thank you for the video. I'm glad I saw it before shopping these!
@FanatecSystem
@FanatecSystem 6 жыл бұрын
thats what baffles me though, these two pieces literally have the same level of craftmanship put into them yet people say that lange is SO much better. i arent think that..
@stoneriverwatches
@stoneriverwatches 3 жыл бұрын
@@FanatecSystem have you handled each one before? Lange is by far superior. Not even close
@koolpep
@koolpep Жыл бұрын
@@stoneriverwatches I have the GO and agree with you. It’s a fantastic watch but the Lange is on a different level. Value for money wise the GO is fantastic. Again saying this as an owner of the GO but Lange is just absolute top tier.
@40000pirate
@40000pirate 5 жыл бұрын
Both are beautiful watches but the Lange is by far the clear winner hands down.
@thepassionofthegoose5472
@thepassionofthegoose5472 5 жыл бұрын
As a GO owner I agree. Since a GO is at the top of my price range, and I get a watch that realistically compared alongside a Lange, I consider GO one of the best values in watches by an order of magnitude.
@lestermiller2717
@lestermiller2717 5 жыл бұрын
I really love my Glashutte pano reserve. I bought mine at a watch show many years ago. It is one of the earliest models. It works super, very nice clean dial a little hard to tell time when it is near the no 6 no.#. I have a custom made crocodile band that makes it stand out even more. There not cheap to buy but after 10 years it is still running strong.
@dlhussain81
@dlhussain81 7 жыл бұрын
It has a 3 day power reserve, first two large increments indicate 12 hours each, next one 24 hours and the final one 24 hours. It's done that way to give you a sense of urgency to wind the watch when you're in the final 24 hours as final increment is smallest giving you a visual sense that not a lot of power is left.
@149montblancc
@149montblancc 8 жыл бұрын
I love the lange 1! Thats going to be my next watch purchase :)
@kw.7142
@kw.7142 8 жыл бұрын
Awesome review! I recently got a Glashutte Original Panomaticlunar and find its value stunning. I don't think any other brand at this price point can offer GO's level of finish and look. I took a quick look at the Lange1 at the AD the other day and have to say the finish of the Lange is definitely visibly better, though maybe just 10-15% better for 3x the price? I used to love JLC Master Ultra thin watches, but now I have the GO I find JLC's movement finishing a bit underwhelming.
@jimwong5612
@jimwong5612 7 жыл бұрын
K W.
@MSH3423
@MSH3423 7 жыл бұрын
thank you for the great review. it was fun to watch.
@MrRoyck10
@MrRoyck10 8 жыл бұрын
A Lange & Sohne is the pinnacle of haute horology. I must also credit your review for sharing two alternatives to Swiss made watches, A Lange is the future.
@2011blueman
@2011blueman 7 жыл бұрын
At street retail GLASHUTTE PanoMaticLunar in gold is now $17,195.00. The Lange sells for $36,995.00
@koolpep
@koolpep Жыл бұрын
Just got this very GO as new old stock. And I love it. ❤
@abhishes
@abhishes 8 жыл бұрын
I would love to own a lange some day...
@ErosGuide
@ErosGuide 5 жыл бұрын
2 great timepieces and great review. 👍🏻👍🏻
@ranpatidewagesiriwardana8967
@ranpatidewagesiriwardana8967 3 жыл бұрын
I have more than 10yeas old watch. I sell it. m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=178817693779973&id=110503193944757&sfnsn=mo&extid=dhyjQxHLvXJnaE4v
@topgear682
@topgear682 8 жыл бұрын
Always enjoyed your videos! However, the Lange has a 3 day power reserve, not 5. The two closer dots show 12 hour increments, I believe.
@davids9885
@davids9885 4 жыл бұрын
So that would make it 3 1/2 day reserve.
@axlcrush1954
@axlcrush1954 7 жыл бұрын
Between 2 high end watches, how much of this perception of finish is in the mind.....one wonders
@700steezy5
@700steezy5 3 жыл бұрын
Lol exactly
@jameswong6590
@jameswong6590 7 жыл бұрын
I am about to pull the trigger on the Panomatic Lunar.
@tc9383
@tc9383 6 жыл бұрын
James Wong how is it?
@malthus101
@malthus101 4 жыл бұрын
James....? Something Wong?
@michaellee3852
@michaellee3852 8 жыл бұрын
Really great video, however I wonder why the older automatic was chosen as comparison, when the current PanoReserve is manual, a closer match? The 65-01 caliber is magnificent, sprinkled with chatons, glorious hand engraved double swan's neck regulator, and features functions which Lange has only addressed with this year's updated movement like the instantaneous date change at midnight. Still the Lange requires a pusher for date changes while the GO is crown operated, keeping the case profile undisturbed. As noted, single plane date wheels on the GO better the stepped wheels of the Lange and GO prints the zero for single days. Also the GO in steel is nearly $11K, in Au it's in the $20K's while the Lange in Pt as shown is a great deal more still. Just on finishing, the Lange is superior and ultimately worth every cent extra despite some quirks, yet the GO is really it's own watch, and it's combination of features, quality, and value make it a formidable watch even when compared against the Lange.
@ranpatidewagesiriwardana8967
@ranpatidewagesiriwardana8967 3 жыл бұрын
My watch is more than 10 yeas old. I sell it. Check this m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=178817693779973&id=110503193944757&sfnsn=mo&extid=dhyjQxHLvXJnaE4v
@9804216
@9804216 6 жыл бұрын
I feel you can't really go wrong with a Glashutte Original, especially their Pano line. GO always offers great value for money without compromising on its quality. And GO's big date is visually more appealing then Lange's which has the bar in the date window to hide the date discs.
@MrCraptakular
@MrCraptakular 8 жыл бұрын
great video Steve. I've been watching archie luxury every night for years. I only stumbled across your chanel a couple of days ago and must say your content is great. I only have an omega seamaster 2254 but am considering either a jlc reverso grande calendar or a glashutte original like your video. I know the watch snob approves of glashutte original but in the back of my mind I will know I only got it as I can't afford a lange1 or datograph. what do you think of the reverso?
@philmay7834
@philmay7834 4 жыл бұрын
When you're paying what I consider big money for a watch, all the little things are important, especially if they're visible.
@davidacpyehuda
@davidacpyehuda 7 жыл бұрын
Hi, may I ask why your channel does not show the number of your subscribers?
@mohammadamin9061
@mohammadamin9061 6 жыл бұрын
Thank you for the nice review .
@sandsmine
@sandsmine 6 жыл бұрын
yes the date is great, and shows on the panomatic date
@RoelfvanderMerwe
@RoelfvanderMerwe 8 жыл бұрын
Awesome video. Thanks!
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596 4 жыл бұрын
hello! Glashutte produced watches in DDR, through the 60'-70' . Lange it was re-vitalized after the re-unification w/ West-Germany w/ Swiss money !
@Narrowcros
@Narrowcros 7 жыл бұрын
I'am considering this Glashutte or Arnold and Sons hm perpetual calendar. Everyone has been giving me mixed opinions, though I am slightly more I favour of the A&S.
@shuiguigmt890
@shuiguigmt890 2 ай бұрын
Do you mind sharing the reference of the Glashutte PanoMatic Reserve you handled in the video? I didn't find it in the comments.
@bobbysebastian3709
@bobbysebastian3709 5 жыл бұрын
GO gives value for the money 💰 ALS for the aesthetics & technicality, but quite pricey
@sarjithpoojari115
@sarjithpoojari115 6 жыл бұрын
Your watches and content are good, it could be better if you can use proper lighting and camera to shoot ,as the light and background reflect on the glass of the watch, like watchfinder.co
@mikehoward5004
@mikehoward5004 7 жыл бұрын
I like the Lange power reserve better. Dial seems better balanced.
@kaiserphoenix01
@kaiserphoenix01 8 жыл бұрын
I believe the Power reserve is 72 hours? Not 7 days.
@5RustyBin
@5RustyBin 7 жыл бұрын
I am considering the Glashutte for my dress watch. I'm not a fan of gold though and was thinking of the steel case version. What sort of price point will that come in at in the secondary market?
@satoshisasada4656
@satoshisasada4656 7 жыл бұрын
HextyVision Around £5-6k for the black, blue or white dial.
@interstellarlapisthecccp4946
@interstellarlapisthecccp4946 7 жыл бұрын
I like the entry level ultra-high end watch market; sort of the toned down model of super-high end complications which cost $100-300K. I believe the Lange 1's are somewhere between $20-30K which I think is a reasonable price for this kind of watch. I love Vacheron and Patek but I feel they really make their watches inaccessible to anyone who doesn't have millions in disposable income. Lange, Breguet and even some newer brands like F.P Journe will make you an ultra-high end watch at a fraction of the price of Patek. For example, the Datograph is pretty much the same thing as a Patek perpetual calendar 5270 but one costs $90K and the other between $200-300k. I love watches to the point I can see myself going up to the $100k mark for a watch I really desire but $300k is just simply too much, at least until I run into some major money.
@mr.jawlineyoumad5416
@mr.jawlineyoumad5416 5 жыл бұрын
hahahahah yea right
@kittenfan
@kittenfan 4 жыл бұрын
wait how can you say that dato is the same as 5270?
@gpearce11
@gpearce11 4 жыл бұрын
I honestly prefer GO to ALS much of the time (although I love both), however the PANO really feels too much like a Lange 1 homage. I agree the GO Panorama Date is the best on the market, but that just makes me want a Senator instead. To make matters worse, the Pano clearly doesn’t have nearly as much though spent on layout an proportion as the Lange 1. The L1 is a masterful exercise in the rule of thirds (check out IDGuy’s video), while the Pano is clearly just trying to look like the L1.
@ruud4508
@ruud4508 7 жыл бұрын
Everyone should also watch the vid by A.Lange & Söhne. you can see how they finish each part by hand. The level of detail is incredible. Compared to the pricing of other top brands, these Lange watches are a steal.
@thanawanschadach9880
@thanawanschadach9880 4 жыл бұрын
great review.
@ProCelestialEmpire
@ProCelestialEmpire 6 жыл бұрын
Is there any brands other than lange that make date pushers to adjust date? I find it very convenient. Thanks!
@paotheppichanusakorn4446
@paotheppichanusakorn4446 6 жыл бұрын
ProCelestialEmpire GO watches also have date pusher. For sure on their 70s Chronograph watch. But you need a pin to push it
@ProCelestialEmpire
@ProCelestialEmpire 6 жыл бұрын
Thanks for your input, but I mean the finger-touchable pusher like A. Lange has. A lot of calendar watches have that pin-only pusher.
@jhummax
@jhummax 8 жыл бұрын
Hi, did you how much it cost?
@b2themfeto
@b2themfeto 2 жыл бұрын
Oh to find a Lange 1 in the 20s now ...
@leonardo.fibonacci
@leonardo.fibonacci 5 жыл бұрын
Lange & Söhne ist the best of all
@vanbrabant6791
@vanbrabant6791 2 жыл бұрын
Johann Rupert's Richemont has come a long way: Jaeger, IWC Schaffhausen, L&A, Van Cleef & Arpels. Makes me wonder about the tech transfer ...
@phillycheesetake
@phillycheesetake 7 жыл бұрын
The regulation on the Glashutte looks like a more precise mechanism. You have two tensioning arms instead of one.
@ranpatidewagesiriwardana8967
@ranpatidewagesiriwardana8967 3 жыл бұрын
See this my watch. I sell it. m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=178817693779973&id=110503193944757&sfnsn=mo&extid=dhyjQxHLvXJnaE4v
@smoothacceleration437
@smoothacceleration437 4 жыл бұрын
Man nice video but your camera is constantly out of focus, please fix that !
@watchfan210
@watchfan210 2 жыл бұрын
Not very well informed on the history of ALS and the Lange 1 technical data… Quite a lot of bugs. Nice video anyway
@MagnificentKot
@MagnificentKot 8 жыл бұрын
Is that actual gold on the rotor of the Glasshutte Original? Or is it some sort of coating made to look like gold?
@berzerkerzbunker688
@berzerkerzbunker688 8 жыл бұрын
+MagnificentKot It's real 21k gold.
@DJogdog
@DJogdog 5 жыл бұрын
Why would they use fake gold at this price point?
@SuperEmlo
@SuperEmlo 6 жыл бұрын
They both excellent
@frankmastromauro5630
@frankmastromauro5630 3 жыл бұрын
Great video
@hvgotcodes
@hvgotcodes 8 жыл бұрын
Another comment -- when you are pointing to parts of the watch, use a toothpick, or something thinner than your finger. :)
@BoyInStyle
@BoyInStyle 4 жыл бұрын
Awesome watches 👍👏👍
@chopschat8415
@chopschat8415 7 жыл бұрын
Ditto.:-)
@bhavikshah5016
@bhavikshah5016 5 жыл бұрын
the buckle for Lange is 6 grand? :0
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596 4 жыл бұрын
power is reserve 72 h
@publiusvelocitor4668
@publiusvelocitor4668 5 жыл бұрын
Both beautiful- the difference in quality can't justify the difference in price. I'm kind of amazed that Glashutte doesn't get called out for ripping off the A. Lange design. (or was it the other way around? Either way, they're too similar to be coincidence.) Is there no rotor on that Lange? Is that a manual wind?!
@TwentyOne_Five
@TwentyOne_Five 5 жыл бұрын
Changing the date with the time at 1:40 is a dangerous habit to get into. For both of theses watches it’s best just move the time to 6:30 before hammering away on the pusher. You’re going to scare potential customers off.
@watchvideos4754
@watchvideos4754 8 жыл бұрын
Hey! Say, I am so sorry, but I forgot your name (terrible, and I don't want to replay video right now in order to get my thoughts out...real quick)!! Anyway, I understand your point about the Lange being the nicer watch; however, I think you might be missing the point (perhaps not, but maybe). A true watch lover buys watches that do something for them on an emotional level. Some watch people will buy for investment purpose only, which is fine. But for me, and quite a few watch lovers out there buying a watch gives me (and them if I could be so presumptuous) a kind of emotional attachment that is hard to explain. I have watches that cost more than others in my very small (and no where near the level of a Lange type) collection. However, my watches give me a joy because of their design characteristics and for me that has nothing to do with which watch is finished nicer or cost more. It has to do with what I feel about that watch when I look at it, wear it on my wrist and marvel at some feature that it has. In my humble opinion, the Glashutte is just a wonderful piece of fine German watchmaking and because the Lange is finished better has nothing to do with the fact that if I could afford one, I would pick the Glashutte (but I would take the Lange, too!!). Just wanted to put that out there....great videos, and I enjoy every one you make, brother!! Keep it up!!
@sergeyzerkin8029
@sergeyzerkin8029 5 жыл бұрын
Panorama datum is amazing... but the problem is that the movement kinds sucks ..thick , old , and not even antimagnet ..
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
... antimagnetic* (adjective).
@relojesclasicos7359
@relojesclasicos7359 7 жыл бұрын
regalame uno
@krystianstepien5835
@krystianstepien5835 6 жыл бұрын
Not Glashuttaaa but Glashutteee
@mizizi1
@mizizi1 7 жыл бұрын
Clean you watch smugly at the back with mud
@vanbrabant6791
@vanbrabant6791 2 жыл бұрын
Nice Swedish sing-song.
@sumnercruz4271
@sumnercruz4271 8 ай бұрын
I think your eyes checked glashutte original movement looks way better
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596 4 жыл бұрын
try a Bostok 2441)))) you may save some
@berzerkerzbunker688
@berzerkerzbunker688 8 жыл бұрын
Look...if you want people to not only watch your videos, as opposed to clicking away, but also subscribe to them then do your subscribe/social media spiel at the END of the video. And if you're going to review a timepiece you should know its specs and how to pronounce both the model and the manufacturers name.
@yourdata2478
@yourdata2478 7 жыл бұрын
Steve don't take this the wrong way,😏 l hate you playing with these hot numbers all the time, keep it up. l found you a while ago but lost you in a phone change over , so glad lam back for my fix thank for showing me the top of the mountains ⌚⌚⌚⌚⌚⌚ six instead of my normal five stars 👏👏👏👍
@milesmadison4671
@milesmadison4671 5 жыл бұрын
Um
@nayuki2020
@nayuki2020 4 жыл бұрын
man.. your hand is shaking so much
@richardstevens8839
@richardstevens8839 8 жыл бұрын
the Lange is a timeless masterpiece the Gushutte is merely 'Quite Nice'
@thepassionofthegoose5472
@thepassionofthegoose5472 7 жыл бұрын
The Gushutte is quite a bit more than nice, even relative to luxury watches. Being German they are undervalued, but the craftsmanship that goes into each piece is of a caliber that definitely is deserving of the term masterpiece.
@chongyen7923
@chongyen7923 4 жыл бұрын
Nope Als date is not perfect.. Sorry but you guys keep saying go finishing not as nice and yet you guys can't even justify your judgements so go should be the winner here, lower in selling price but is at the same level of als
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
Glashütte* (if "Ü" is not featured on your keyboard, it's "Glashuette")
@jakegittes6593
@jakegittes6593 3 жыл бұрын
As usual, we are supposed to take the reviewers word that the ALS is far, far superior to the GO.....uh, no.
@juniorjr5328
@juniorjr5328 3 жыл бұрын
Lange is absorbed into glashutte original. A lange & sohne (adolf lange and sons) has zero links with lange back then
@ianmedium
@ianmedium 4 жыл бұрын
I never understand the design of these two and never will. One assumes the sort of person who will wear these will be wearing them under a shirt cuff. If so, why on earth put the time telling section on the left of the dial? Surely it should be on the right so it’s easier to glance at the time, this way one has to pull the whole shirt sleeve up to see fully the time section?
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
Off-center dials require a special taste. Haven't even thought about these design's impracticality, just think it's ugly.
@jacc9061
@jacc9061 2 жыл бұрын
GO can’t even begin to compare to Lange
@tomscott4438
@tomscott4438 2 жыл бұрын
Why are you reviewing a watches that you know nothing about? You are guessing at details that are easy to locate online. Other than having access to these remarkable pieces, your information is second-rate.
@RPMATX
@RPMATX 6 жыл бұрын
The date on the Lange is a deal breaker.
@111ImNumber1
@111ImNumber1 5 жыл бұрын
That is exactly like comparing a Maybach with a Volkswagen. They are both German!
@ZurriyetBlogs
@ZurriyetBlogs 5 жыл бұрын
111ImNumber1 not vw ! compare like maybach and mercedes s class
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
It's maybe like comparing a BMW 750iL to a Maybach. Craftsmanship in the GO is outstanding, it's just not as painstakingly meticulous as in the ALS. That ALS sells for more than twice as much is not due to the additional work that goes into it, but pure marketing.
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
@@ZurriyetBlogs If it was Mercedes vs Maybach (two brands owned by the same company), you'd have to compare ALS to Jaeger-LeCoultre which are both owned by Richemont. JLC also delivered movements (i.e. "engines") to various great watch makers (Maybach uses Mercedes/AMG engines) and provided vital technical support for ALS's re-foundation.
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596
@1labuakimegnyerteasegberug596 4 жыл бұрын
its pronounced : Glass-hootte
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
He pronounces it absolutely correct, including the Umlaut-U. Say "oo" and while you're doing it, touch your lower front teeth with with tip of your tongue to make the "Ü" sound.
@OM-kw4py
@OM-kw4py Жыл бұрын
I don't understand how every reviewer parrots "oh but the Lange finish is so much better"... having held these side by side, the GO has gold engravings in the balance cock and has two swan neck regulators as well as comparable finishing, albeit minus excessive use of chatons, which the GO Panomatic Inverse has... I really don't think the GO is as much of a downgrade as people make it out to be. It's 90% of the Lange, if not 100% for 60% of the price.
@toobalkain
@toobalkain 5 жыл бұрын
It’s pronounced glaeh-shoe-taeh, not glass-hew-taeh.
@einundsiebenziger5488
@einundsiebenziger5488 3 жыл бұрын
Wrong! The way he pronounces it is absolutely correct. He even gets the "Ü" right which is hard for a native-English speaker. What is a "SH" in Englisch, is spelled "SCH" in German. "S" and "H" are always pronounced seperately in German. "Glas" (glass) and "Hütte" (hut, chalet, but also mill) also exist as individual words in German.
@siomaybakar
@siomaybakar 8 жыл бұрын
Glasshutte is better than Lange that over priced shit
@diegomedina6704
@diegomedina6704 7 жыл бұрын
if lange is overprice All the industry of watches are overprice...............
@NitayNostrasifu
@NitayNostrasifu 7 жыл бұрын
You pay for what you get. You'd have to be blind to not see the big difference in the brand. Lange prices far lower than it should in comparison to it's ACTUAL competition. Being Vacheron and Patek/ Glashute is a different range. In the Area of Mont Blanc and other mid range manufacturers.
@jdstarek
@jdstarek 6 жыл бұрын
Dapdoi Ardon He said GO and Mont Blanc were mid-tier, not VC and PP. I agree.
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