When a Chinese Speaker Tries Reading Japanese (ARIGATOU)

[@ferretyluv]

I’ve never seen arigatou spelled with kanji, so I didn’t recognize that.

[@jaycee330]

Because no Japanese writes it that way. They might write the adjective "arigatai" as 有難い. bit not "arigatou".

[@JSerrato289]

私も

[@GoodGood-vb8gm]

I don't know Japanese but once I watched a movie about a present-day girl communicating with a boy during WW2 by slipping notes in the same book in a book shop. The boy wrote anata as 貴方 and the girl was amused.

[@cooikemint]

its probably so the chinese reader doesnt just read it as "morning"

[@ntf2049]

It's because the Kanji is too difficult so it's just much more faster to write in hiragana

[@pear3136]

The origin of ありがとう(arigatou) is 有難い(arigatai) meaning being very rare to be. 有 existing and 難い difficult so it is difficult to exist = rare. The idea is more close to not taking act of kindness for granted and acknowledging it. Acknowledging kindness turn into a expression of thankfulness. There are ways to appreciate by apologizing in Japanese but ありがとう is not that linked to being sorry.

[@Langfocus]

That's interesting. My speculation was based on the close connection between thankfulness and apology in Japanese culture. This particular clip is not in the main video, partly because I wasn't certain enough about my explanation there. But I thought I'd throw it out as a Short anyway.

[@viewsandrates]

Yeah Arigatou is basically saying "it's very rare that this happens to me" as a sort of sign that this is worth appreciating.

[@freemanol]

​@@Langfocus i think sumimasen fits the situation that you described

[@Vasharan]

@@Langfocus @kyotako1372 dives into the meaning of 有難う in a short, pretty much what @pear3136 said. Sumimasen 「済みません」would be one way to express thanks with an apology.

[@GoodGood-vb8gm]

I think present-day Japanese such as 大丈夫，錢湯，走 are ancient Chinese. I dun remember where I read it. In ancient Chinese, bath water is 湯 and to run is 走

[@dunwallghost7315]

There's a similar expression in Chinese called有劳 (you lao), it means have effort or have trouble, usually use when you asked for a favor and others agreed to help, to apology for taking their time and effort. Like 有劳您了.

[@OspaykO]

There are also expressions like "打扰了/打擾了" and "麻烦你了/麻煩你了" which have a similar idea.

[@cottbdbdbbd]

辛苦你了！

[@skateforfun4224]

It reminds me of the character 労, from Japanese ご苦労様です, meaning thanks for your hard work

[@calebhu6383]

​@@OspaykOYes and 不好意思

[@jp4431]

I know all these expressions but I've never thought about it.

[@eljaminlatour6633]

Yeah, 有り難う("arigatou", thank you) comes from 有る("aru", to exist/to be) + 難し("katashi", hard/difficult) which means "difficult to exist" or "hard to be". It also came from 有り難し/有り難い("arigatashi/arigatai", welcome/thankful/greatful). Also, it became the descendant for the Hakka Chinese word 阿里加多("alikato"). Also, be aware that the Portuguese word "obrigado"(thank you) is purely coincidental, since the Portuguese arrived in Japan in 1543 which is over a century after the meaning "to be thankful" was cited.

[@Frost_on_YouTube]

If I'm not mistaken, the reason why it's somewhat dissociated from the modern form 有り難く is because the dialect spoken in Kyoto (among the court, not the townspeople) had a tendency to form words not with く as we do today, but with ～おう. For example not 高くbut たこう. Hence we get not お早く but おはよう. And not 有り難く but ありがとう.

[@chrisgascoyne2958]

​@@Frost_on_KZbinI never clocked おはよう and 早くas having the same origin, but it makes a lot of sense!

[@attilakreisz1870]

The Hakka word is the descendant of the Japanese.

[@AristizabalixGrimm]

​@@Frost_on_KZbin This just explained so much! Thank you!

[@IeuroI]

the character for difficulty is spot on

[@_Executor_]

Because sometimes people find it difficult to say sorry.

[@hundvd_7]

Eh, it's a decently easy one, actually. A lot of lines, but very standard shapes in an orderly manner

[@prototype014]

憂鬱 bruh

[@Apogee012]

you know, all of these icons actually used to be a image/symbol like the egyptian hieroglyphics.. search up the history of kanji/chinese/japanese alphabet.

[@fyang1429]

It’s funny that I heard Japanese actually do use a form of “sorry” (すみません) to mean “thank you” for petty things in daily speech

[@Langfocus]

Yes, when someone does something for you that seems like an inconvenience, it’s common to say “sumimasen”. It’s done with a certain tone of voice and body language, so it’s something you learn naturally in that context.

[@siqizhang]

that's so Canada.

[@Zestieee]

I've heard it's because the original meaning was that the situation they're thankful for is "difficult to come by"

[@professoroflogic8788]

It is difficult for me to exist (with the weight of all this gratitude) because you came early.

[@ajayempee]

Love his English accent 😄

[@立風tachikaz]

It's difficult to exist or happen→rere→thankful→thank you

[@ShanXiTV]

Hi, you should also explore the topics around Hanja used in Korea! They do have their own vocabulary made of Hanja and even created their own Hanjas though they are rarely used and seen today.

[@Mivvudty9999]

If you switch the order of 有难 it becomes 难有, then in chinese it would read as 'you rarely come this early' which is closer to the meaning of 'thank you for coming early' (becaue you rarely do so)

[@danielantony1882]

It’s kind of an old philosophy of how kindness shouldn’t be taken for granted, so when a rare kindness happens to you - 有り難い(Arigatai - hardly happens) - it’s something to be thankful for. That’s the origin of it, I think.

[@Miso_Abura]

The Japanese language loves euphemism so much that there are many words that are hard to understand at first glance. Ancient Japanese language, 有難い(Arigatai) meant something that happens rarely. Its structure is like 有 (exist) + 難い (difficult, severe). However, gradually it got the meaning of thanks because rare things are considered precious and thankful. A similar example is はづかし(Hazukashi), which means those who are splendid, even though the adjective ”Hazukashi“ intrinsically refers to making one embarrassed or being embarrassed. This is no longer used as the meaning I refered to, "splendid," because it is the ancient word. Currently, we use this word as the meaning of embarrassing, the essential meaning. The reason why this word was used to refer to splendid in the old Japanese language is that when one sees people who are splendid, one will get embarrassed cuz his/her magnificent was so dazzling.

[@CalloohCalley]

HAHAHA! I read it as "if you're early, there's gonna be problems" VERY threateningly haha!

[@manutavano]

I'm a beginner in japanese and it made me so happy to be able to read that lol

[@Melki]

Makes sense eventually

[@gohitosun6859]

arigatou (ありがとう) is short from 有難うございます, which is 有り (ari) + 難い (katai, difficult to ...) + ございます. The u-onbin (う音便) of i-keiyoushi (イ形容詞, i-adj) + ございます is the polite form used before WW2 in Japan.

[@falcon9ft710]

感じで貫くことなら「御座います」もつけた方がいいかも

[@atsushi2965]

Yeah, our ancients found blessing in rare things.

[@thenosa87]

That's what she said

[@rockabady2345]

I was looking for this. Thank you.

[@mfvieira89]

The literal meaning of "arigato" kind of reminds me of the literal meaning of "obrigado" (in Portuguese), which also means "thank you" but literally means "I'm obligated to"

[@msk5581]

No the Portuguese came to Japan in 1543 so arigato was already used for centuries.

[@mfvieira89]

@@msk5581 I'm not saying one derives from the other. I'm saying the literal meanings are similar

[@MrNicePotato]

how are they similar? The literal meaning for arigato in Japanese means “a rare thing” as in a rare thing for someone to do, like you don’t need to do this but you did anyway, which is literally the opposite of something being obligatory.

[@Trekyhunter]

The internal struggle of reading Japanese as a Chinese speaker and then responding in English. The mental gymnastics are impressive 😮

[@lehw916]

I love how Chinese looks for the logic behind each kanji

[@cooikemint]

its because we're forced to, otherwise we just see "morning zkjsbfkjseb come skjfhjsdfb have difficult aoisehfoisehfoih."

[@Aratta13]

I was surprised when I learned the definition of this kanji too, but it was super easy to remember and understand when someone used the example of a samurai using it to his lord after being praised for something.

[@pault9544]

Hmmmm, but from what I’ve seen ありがとう is typically written as such in hiragana. Even though Japanese kanji do retain the original Chinese derived meaning, many are used in a context developed separately from Chinese. Such as “有難う arigatou” to mean thank you, Chinese is totally different with “谢谢/謝謝xièxie” (of course referring to Mandarin). Another example would be “行くyiku (to go)” where as in Chinese the character for to go is “去qù”. ”行” in Mandarin is read as “xíng” and Chinese may be able to guess it means to go, but this word is not used colloquially to say you’re going somewhere. Kanji dense contexts used in more formal language I think Chinese may have a better grasp at. Such as if they saw the road signs that said “自転車 jitensha and 歩行者 hokousha” to the Chinese reader this should be easy to distinguish as “自行车zìxíngchē - bike” and “步行者 bùxíngzhe” - pedestrian. Furthermore, 歩行者優先 should be easily distinguishable as “pedestrians have the right of way” as it can also be read so in Chinese.

[@blablablablablablablablablbla]

It's usually written in hiragana, but on rare occasions in kanji. You might say the kanji form might be used in more formal contexts.

[@ijansk]

I think a better literal translation of arigatou is "hard to exist" and the intended meaning is that acts of kindness are rather rare so you express your appreciation for that act of kindness.

[@almdrs]

The "thank you" in Portuguese is almost like the one in Japanese... "Much obliged"... Like "now I have an obligation because you helped me".

[@Crusty_the_goblin]

The way I was like, I have never seen that last word… odd… and like they’re just trying to play tricks on that poor Chinese speaker 🤣

[@victoriaz1312]

Yep, in Chinese there’s a similar saying too. People who don’t know is just… kind of uneducated 😂 it’s 有难了 signifying that someone is acknowledging other person’s actions, and is grateful.

[@wtz_under]

wow i guess despite my 9 years in mandarin class, im still 'uneducated'

[@danielantony1882]

It’s not in 漢語大詞典 so I’m not sure how it’s an education issue.

[@victoriaz1312]

@@danielantony1882 learning from your environment and surroundings is also a type of education, educate yourself

[@danielantony1882]

@@victoriaz1312 Bruh…

[@laifamily7804]

有难了 means i'm f**ked..doesn't mean what you claim it means, 辛苦了/ 有劳了yes, but we wouldn't use it as pure gratitude, it means thanks for your trouble, just as in english, it's apologetic w/ gratitude...that's what 有難 sounds like, but seems like the japanese use it for pure thank you as well, which isn't the case in chinese.

[@abarette_]

arigatou kanji doesn't exist, it can't hurt you! arigatou kanji:

[@chocolatte7736]

It's used more often in business, so don't worry lol

[@wtz_under]

@@chocolatte7736i see

[@RubyChiang]

I rarely see the kanji for 'arigatou'. Extremely rare.

[@stephencampbell2735]

Haha I like that guy

[@WendyHuNanNZ]

😂😂有難う　si okok. Really ありがとう😂😂😂 this is hilarious 😂❤❤good to know! 愛= あい

[@upalbanget]

Today I learned that Arigatou has a kanji for it

[@carvoloco4229]

This is very interesting!

[@silviopuertas1925]

It means something like 'It's rare to find (exist) someone who reflects so well the features of a Buddha'

[@saiyajedi]

It’s the same way that すみません can mean both “sorry” and “thank you” in modern Japanese. It’s thanking the other person by way of apologizing.

[@Yongsam-i]

Wow this video is so interesting😮

[@frenzii8332]

It's that old "canadian business japanese" lol

[@skychaos87]

Think of it like 有劳你了, had to trouble you or put you in difficult situation. Sorry to trouble you to come early or it must be a difficult for you to come early. Its like acknowledging the effort someone has to make for you, in that context it also means thanks for coming early.

[@yyy6168]

Ay thats me

[@Langfocus]

Is that really you? Thanks again for taking part!

[@sanbilge]

Thank you Quentin Tarantino, I learned a lot

[@stupidhinoto]

And Chinese think JAPANESE can understand thier Mandarin chat...😂

[@AoyamaBlue-w1j]

umm……no we don't😂

[@ReallyRandomMe]

Kanji comes from chinese

[@play005517]

​@@ReallyRandomMe It's more complex than that. In some sense, Kanji isn't just "from Chinese" but "is Chinese", because Kanji is just the Japanese name for the script. Strictly speaking Chinese is not a full language, it is actually a written language. It is historically and still to this day a script shared among Sinitic Languages Family and a few unrelated languages. Somewhat analogous to like how the Egyptian alphabet is ultimately adapted and shared by Latin and Cyrillic languages. Every single language in the Sinitic Family has two parallel pronunciations for each Chinese character, one in their native pronunciation(colloquial reading 白讀音) and the other one is closer to the pronunciation near the capital(literary reading 文讀音) Similar to how speakers of a language close to Latin may have two pronunciations for a given spelling one closer their native language one in Catholic Latin. Modern Mandarin is an exceptional to the rule, it's artificially altered spoken language that derived from the latest official language undergone the language standardization movement. Its dichotomy pronunciation system has collapsed almost completely with only a few words preserved the remnant alternative pronunciation. The majority of the words are now pronounced only in either their original vernacular or literary readings, and the choice is more or less random. And because to the other Chinese influenced languages like modern Japanese, most of the Onyomi are derived from literary readings, so unless the Mandarin speaker intentionally speaks literary pronunciation, most of the time words that are pronounced in colloquial readings will not going to even sound remotely close to what a Japanese speaker may be able to guess. But if they write it down, especially revert to the classical vocabularies it's almost mutually intelligible. Analogous to two Latin languages communicating with each other by writing down the oldest words closest to Latin.

[@oh-noe]

​@@ReallyRandomMe then you should be able to understand spanish then since english is half latin no?

[@flysmask]

​@@play005517nah bruh. 文言文is a form of writing and has jack to do with pronunciation. Standard Mandarin is just a region-specific Hubei dialect. Most northern dialects are more like accents+slang than more distinct southern dialects, which are basically not mutually intelligible. How people read written Chinese has nothing to do with their dialect and accent, only that writing is slightly different than colloquial speech. This is true for every region of China.

[@draquela96]

I didn't even recognize ye olde arigatou like that lol

[@ruicongli-y4v]

The reason is, in Japanese some Kanji has a lots pronunciations. But in Chinese, characters basically have 1-2 pronunciations. Arigatou ありがとう, 有難う Arigataiありがたい, 有難い In above case, kanji 難 has lots pronunciation. Gatoがと、Gâtaがた、 Moreover, 難なん, 難しい(むずか)しい…..

[@Kamiyu97]

Interesting!

[@周为-s9v]

It is similar to 劳驾 and 麻烦你 or 唔该 in cantonese

[@nelia6118]

This is how looks ありがとう😮？I've never seen it in use.

[@Langfocus]

It’s not normally used in casual writing, but I’ve seen it many times.

[@BuckBlaziken]

Asian languages and many middle eastern ones is so apologetic that either asking simple questions or saying thank you is admitting that you caused someone else difficulty or inconvenience

[@yokaza8437]

kanji is like mutation of chinese character

[@mio33]

有難う

[@cxbobt1111]

Can I translate it to 早来了，有劳。 I guess 有難 is similar to 有劳 or 麻烦。有劳 means “have,work” which means “you did some work” which means “thank you”. 麻烦 means “trouble” which means “cause some trouble to you” which means “thank you”. Sometimes we can read those words contains multiple Kanjis separately. Each kanji has its own meaning. But for 谢 in 谢谢/謝謝（thanks), this kanji is dedicated to expressing appreciation and politeness.

[@SymbolicCosmos]

有難 = 難得

[@DomoniqueMusiclover]

Interesting 😮

[@miyuqiii]

it's like Chinese's 辛苦了 roughly: 你來得早，辛苦你

[@blondreports]

Arigato=obrigado= i am in debt or i am obligated to do something as a thank you.

[@Langfocus]

Those two words sound similar by coincidence but aren’t related.

[@blondreports]

@Langfocus 10% of portuguese genetics are Japanese. Also unrelated.

[@Langfocus]

I don't know about that, but I don't consider genetics when learning about etymology. I consult dictionaries and other linguistic sources.

[@blondreports]

@Langfocus of cos you do, there is absolutely no connection between the nations ands its pure coincidence arigato and obrigado sound similar and have identical meaning.

[@rkneerzte]

On the other hand, 🇵🇹obrigado means obliged.

[@bluemarineboy3091]

THERES A KANJI FOR ARIGATOU!?

[@John_Weiss]

"Thank You" == "Apologies that I'm breathing" 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 [Edit: Yes, I saw the other comment about the actual etymology of arigatai.]

[@KeefeL]

Grew up in Hong Kong playing Japanese games in the 90s and 2000s... I can assure you that noone is writing Japanese like that. It's nonsensical to combine multiple different ways to express Japanese writing in this way...

[@k.upward]

He acts like its weird when Chinese people literally say麻烦你了

[@laifamily7804]

麻烦你 doesn't mean thank you though, it's means thanks for your trouble ..i think it might be an inaccurate translation or it might actually be different...

[@k.upward]

@@laifamily7804 I mean literal translation and actually useful translation are different. I’d translate this as “Thanks for your help” but if I were teaching Chinese I’d explain the literal meaning as well. Point is, Arigato carries with it pretty much this exact meaning so I think it’s weird that he wasn’t able to figure out why it’d be written that way.

[@laifamily7804]

@@k.upward 麻烦你 actually does primarily carry the meaning of being a burden to someone, whether literal or figuratively...acknowledging that indeed implies gratitude, but you wouldn't say 麻烦你 if someone gives you a new iphone or complement you on your new haircut. .if it's meant to purely convey "thank you" , people would use 谢谢, ...but it seems like in japanese, 有難 is used for both 麻烦你 & thank you 谢谢 according to the host, that's where it confuses the guest because 谢谢 & 麻烦 are used in different situations in chinese....and 有難 means being in trouble for a chinese speaker , not causing trouble to sb, so it does take a leap of logic to be able to interpret this correctly .

[@k.upward]

@ True that’s why I think “thanks for the help” fits best. Casual but still some effort involved. But 谢谢 is even more casual so I doubt anyone would say it if they got an iPhone. They’d probably say more like 心动 to be honest, haha, cause even 非常感谢 still seems weird in that situation. I see your point though, I’m just saying with understanding new languages there’s always approximations and stretching your imagination. So I could say it’s surprising but it’s definitely not weird. Even to a Chinese speaker

[@R-fi6sf]

"There is difficulty." だったら「難有り」だろw

[@Reversely]

Bro here is teaching asians💀

[@eb.3764]

that's a MANDARIN speaker. Chinese is a LANGUAGE family

[@Langfocus]

Yes, I’m very aware. But Mandarin is the current standardized and official form of Chinese, so I used Mandarin ability as the unifying feature between the participants. I think every participant in the full video also speaks another regional language, and that contributes to their ability to read Japanese, but I can’t talk about every Chinese language in one video. This particular participant also speaks Hokkien, I believe.

[@timothywatt]

Mandarin is the ONLY official language of China. When someone says "我说中文", the person is literally saying "I speak Chinese" and everyone will automatically assume standard Mandarin by default.

[@cooikemint]

@@timothywattalso because if you hear "我说中文” in mandarin, they can probably speak mandarin. if they say it in cantonese (not sure if its written the same way, because i dont speak it) then they probably speak cantonese

[@uploaded9787]

Bro is built like, -u-

[@髭-c4z]

I confused what the man is learning

[@Eldiran1]

???? who use arigato like that? Why not ありがとう? I'm not great in japanese but i don't understand the use of this kanji. I've never saw that so i feel confuse.

[@Langfocus]

It’s used in formal writing like that. Less often in casual writing.

[@maximilianisaaclee2936]

At first I was baffled by the meaning of 有難 but when you said an apology for causing you trouble, it makes sense, because in Chinese there's another way to say thank you similar to this meaning 麻煩你了 literally meaning "it has troubled you", it's usually used when someone has taken the obligation to help you and you say that, with or without the classic "thank you" 謝謝, but 有難 means more of someone in need of help because he/she is "in trouble" or "having a rough time".

[@digitalkarl2000]

no japanese would write 'arigatou' in kanji tho. funny example for chinese speakers tho as they obviuosly recognize the characters.

[@ngohaydenmoe]

早 😊 来 😊 有难 ⚰️

[@WendyHuNanNZ]

😂😂😂😂有难

[@DakkogiRauru23]

Japanese is indeed a very apologetic language

[@FebruaryHas30Days]

Japanese is closer to languages like Turkish and Mongolian because Chinese is a tonal language and the other languages mentioned aren't.

[@YCprivate]

but they both use the chinese character 😅

[@FebruaryHas30Days]

@@YCprivate Chinese grammar is closer to that of English

[@YCprivate]

@@FebruaryHas30Days ya you right bout that part chinese belongs to sino-tibetan language family thus not related with japanese, and it has a word order of SVO which is kinda similar to english but i was just saying that that doesn't seem to be the point of this challenge

[@Langfocus]

Yeah, the point of the challenge is really to see how well Chinese speakers can read Japanese *despite* the fact that the underlying languages are very different and belong to different language families (based on Chinese characters and the Chinese-derived vocabulary they represent).

[@tigeruppercut2000]

@@YCprivate Japanese just borrow Chinese characters mostly for their meanings. The grammar is radically different.

[@amanosatoshitranslates]

nah. you see meaning you know origin. they are saying "it's hard to happen" and what are hard to happen in life? good things

[@2024-l9n]

好奇怪的逻辑😂

[@Fuzzycute32]

Why is blud bri’ish

[@carmcam1]

who tf writes arigatou in kanji?!

[@Langfocus]

Some older people like my mother-in-law do. But it’s usually written in Hiragana in daily writing and texting. In books and stuff it’s sometimes written in kanji.

[@Coolguy644-25]

Bruh just make a new alphabet 🤦🏻‍♂️ Just like Korea did a long time ago

[@thirdrepublic7030]

Arigato came from Portuguese, once borrowed they took the kuyomi reading of these kanjis

[@pbworld7858]

obrigado

[@Aratta13]

??? Where did you get this information?

[@danielantony1882]

It is completely coincidental. The word existed before the arrival of Jesuits.

[@DELTA38g]

Source: my ass

[@PCs454]

This is the 2nd time I’ve seen the kanji for arigatou and I took a while to realise what it was 🥲