Law/Gospel Distinction Is Life-Changing | Theocast

[@Judybhorne]

The Gospel shines the light completely on Jesus Christ, who He is and what His death accomplished for us. Law puts our minds back on ourselves, our failures,sins and weaknesses.

[@ibperson7765]

Amen Judy 2 Cor 3.14-17 14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

[@johndodson8464]

Legalism always slides into sinless perfectionism. And "perfection" requires a LOWER BAR for anyone to achieve it.

[@TL-yl5tp]

Thank you brothers, thou im not a 1689 LBC guy anymore ( but still a confessional christian :) ) i always appreciate your guys hard work and clear explanations on what us confessional christians, regardless of bastismal views, hold to and pointing us to rest in Christ alone :)

[@jgeph2.4]

What confession do you hold to now?

[@gigenaia]

@@jgeph2.4 Probs the 1647 westminster confession of faith.

[@KatAmanti]

I really needed this! I have family and used to have a friend (we parted ways, her choice) because they are into the Hebraic roots movement! They teach we must keep Torah to keep saved! They say the Torah is the Gospel!! I need to hear this because the Torah people try to poison my faith and mind!! Thank you 🙏🏻

[@bowinghearts]

Great discussion

[@garymc201]

This is so good.

[@johndodson8464]

Please, please, please talk about IMPERATIVE vs INDICATIVE. THAT is the essential distinction.

[@Jesusandmentalhealth]

So good and such great insight! Thanks for sharing this! Definitely a gift.

[@shawngillogly6873]

Great panel discussion. Thank you for sharing it.

[@Muzicboy3]

I think that there should be some type of healthy balance… by grace through faith should be preached and preached heavy but there also should be CLEAR sermons and talks about repentance, regeneration, the new heart of flesh for the old heart of stone, a walking in the light, holiness, etc… we’re human and we won’t preach it perfectly, but there should be a balance of the clear message and how shall we as believers and someone who claims the be a Christian or as someone on the outside trying to find out what it means and looks like to be saved. You don’t want to make extreme free grace/antinomianism nor do you want to be preaching Faith+works or Faith+obedience, or anything… but we do want to emphasize God working in the believers life, bringing about sanctification, and sensitivity to sin, a hatred and a bothersome when we do commit sin… some people can lean too far in either direction and that’s neither is healthy and can come across as an unclear message at the least and heresy at worst in my opinion

[@secondmanup]

Great clear and concise presentation of Law and Gospel. It was great to see Patrick! Haven’t seen him in awhile. Thanks guys.

[@MandMe91]

You were NEVER under the law nor its curse. You're welcome.

[@johndodson8464]

"Do vs done" is a very helpful distinction. But INDICATIVE is not just past tense. INDICATIVE can be a present truth. INDICATIVE can also be a future promise. As long as it asserts truth, it's INDICATIVE. PROPOSITIONS are INDICATIVE. Strictly in the DECLARATIVE mood.

[@johndodson8464]

All of you guys on the panel are freakin awesome. 26:32 Listen to old boy go. Just great! (Not to be knit picky, but "believe it" is an IMPERATIVE command, not an INDICATIVE statement. The command to believe IS an imperative).

[@maximusralte777]

Good discussion. As always.

[@cindymonk6994]

Jon, can you and Justin do an episode on Quietism vs Pietism and where TC falls? Great job on the panel, everyone.

[@taylorclayton3402]

Super thankful for you guys for your ministry!! Might I humbly make a technical suggestion?? The SM7b mics that you are using are powerful in the bass end. Your audio quality would greatly improve by adding a low cut to your mics. ❤

[@lguerrero8628]

Can you please make a podcast/video on the difference between cessationist and continuationist 🙏

[@davevandervelde4799]

This thought just came into my mind. Maybe to show the relationship between law and gospel it could be stated in relation to my wife and I . This summer will be 35 years married and if you ask me why this bond we have had for so long is there, it could be answered a couple ways. 1. I don't commit adultery so we are happily married. Oh, and I take out the garbage. or 2. We love each other and we have a covenant that is secured by that love. Both answers are true but the first one is true because the second one is true.

[@alightshines2703]

There are a few good thoughts in here, but the main and huge error I see is reducing Jesus only to what he has DONE and ignoring, even contradicting, everything he SAID. If I believe that Jesus is who he said is is, then it naturally follows that I should learn and respond to what he said. If someone comes and claims to be king and I say I believe him, but I do not submit nor give allegiance to him, I remain a rebel. I either do not understand what "belief" is, I don't understand what it means for someone to be king, or I just don't care, and shun the king in favor of myself. But Jesus says, "why do you call me "Lord" but don't do what I commnad?" The two are incompatible. The church is full of have people who are struggling because the pulpits make them afraid to seek to obey Jesus. We talk much more about rest than Jesus does, accusing people of legalism if they try to obey him, twisting them up in knots. The biggest thing keeping the church from looking like and being the hands and feet of Jesus in the world is the theology that tells us we shouldn't. When Jesus says "strive" pastors say "rest". When Jesus says "obey" pastors say "trust". When Jesus says "follow" pastors say "don't trust in your works". How long can the church continue to tie would-be followers of Christ into knots, keeping them endlessly debating about how little they need to do, as if the purpose of the coming of God's kingdom were to help us just relax? How long can we act as if the purpose of the kingdom come was to make us theologically accurate, rather than joining and advancing the kingdom of Yahweh to overcome evil and redeem the world? It's been too long. Jesus is not a symbol to be used in a systematic equation. We reduce him to a symbol when we only talk about what he did, and ignore what he said. And we do this at great peril.

[@AnHebrewChild]

Many shall say to me on that day "Lord Lord! Have we not prophesied in thy name etc..." And then will I _profess_ unto them, I never knew you... depart from me, ye that work lawlessness. Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine and _doeth_ them shall be likened unto a wise man which built his house upon a rock... and it fell not. And whosoever heareth these sayings of mine and _doeth them not_ shall be likened unto a foolish man which built his house on the sand. And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. Mat23:23 outlines the three weighty matters of the law, (according to the Lord Jesus). Curiously, but not surprisingly, most evangelical bibles (ESV, NIV, NET, NASB, etc) translate the third 'weighty matter' inconsistently with how they translate it throughout the rest of the New Testament. The KJV, RSV, NRSV, NKJV and Young's Literal render it right (consistently). This was one of the verses that sent me on a journey to leave the broad road of tradition to follow the genuine Jesus Christ. (The one who has things to say to me.) be blessed

[@alightshines2703]

@@AnHebrewChild Right on! His sheep hear his voice. Keep listening!

[@AnHebrewChild]

It's interesting what you said about Jesus being spoken of as though he were an object -- an inanimate object. Yes. And once you notice it, you can't unnotice it. Their idols are the work of men's hands. _They have mouths, but they speak not:_ eyes have they, but they see not: they have ears, but they hear not.... _neither speak they through their throat._ They that make them are like unto them; so is every one that trusteth in them. Psa115

[@AnHebrewChild]

@@alightshines2703 just seeing your reply. Our comments crossed! Hey..... your reply encourages me. Thank you. You keep doing the same! (Because the King does speak)

[@soteriology1012]

You make the distinction between law and gospel. OK However Paul appears to make a distinction between prophesy and mystery in which dispensations are rooted. What do you make of that?

[@johngagliardi8753]

I can’t find where it is defined what is meant by “the law has no place in the Christian’s life”. Why isn’t the distinction between salvation and Christian service not spoken about? I believe we need clarity on this subject.

[@samuelwilliams1559]

They teach the law has a place. Here it is. Romans 3:9 -21 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, there is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes. Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore, by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins. The law shows us to be sinners in need of Salvation. The law is love of God and love of others in action. God is love.

[@RedBeetle]

It is a mixing of Law and Gospel to claim one must join an institutional church to be saved.

[@russmaples5351]

Yes, that would definitely be adding some sort of legal requirement to The Gospel (although not the Law of Moses, so maybe that's not technically true, since you did capitalize the word "Law").

[@ibperson7765]

Antinomianism exists in theory, but Ive never met or heard an actual Christian who fell into it.

[@johndavolta3124]

How would _Free Grace Theology_ fall into this discussion? I mean they definitely make a distinction between Law and Gospel, but they end up bifurcating them to an extreme point where the guidance of moral law is purposely, completely, and fundamentally discarded in all aspects of human life.

[@THEOCAST]

You need to watch our series on three uses of the law

[@johndavolta3124]

@@THEOCAST I will. Will you guys do a series discussing the pitfalls of _Free Grace Theology_ and how it has become a trojan horse in the Christian circle? I mean, wasn't Tullian's preaching style extremely influenced by _Free Grace_ even though he was formally "Reformed", and look what happened...

[@MandMe91]

3 basic questions that debunk modern Christianity: **Were you ever part of the Old Covenant that Moses mediated? **Were you born subject to and obligated to keep the Mosaic law? **Did Christ redeem you from the curse of the law that Paul is referring to in Galatians 3? Hint: if the first answer is "no" (and it is) then they are all "no" (and they are).

[@russmaples5351]

Are you suggesting something like universalism, where the condemnation of the law never was upon any man? Or are you assuming this only about gentiles because you believe the mosaic law is only for Jews? Or is this about deterministic philosophy and that the law was only ever over those were predestined to everlasting fire and not the elect? Or are you espousing some other view?

[@MandMe91]

@@russmaples5351 I'm saying that the bible is a story about old Covenant Israel under law and their redemption from that law through a new covenant of grace. The story concluded when the Lord returned, gathered his elect (believing Israel) and destroyed the harlot (apostate Israel) in the first century (before THAT generation passed). The Christianity we see today is, at its core, identity theft. Whatever label that deserves....

[@MandMe91]

@@russmaples5351 Also, for clarity, a "jew" was an Israelite from the southern kingdom of JEWdah. The northern kingdom was "carried away to idols" and became gentiles (ethnos, nations). So in the first century we see both jew (southern kingdom) and gentile (northern kingdom) being redeemed from the law through a new covenant of grace. True pagans were also "gentiles" (ethnos, nations) but they are not part of the redemptive story.

[@dylan3456]

Haven’t watched yet (just released) but you guys seem like you want to be confessional Lutherans. Why aren’t you? What of the Lutheran confessions do you disagree about? If I were to guess: conversation(s) on baptism seem to indicate a tension - but I’m curious to know how you both affirm God’s work as the one who baptizes (and not us), and yet don’t affirm the salvation of every baptized person. You talk at length like Lutherans about remembering our baptism, but unlike the Lutherans, you can’t say with any certainty that we can rest knowing that we know we are saved because we know God baptized us. Baptism is a sign or seal from whom? Is it just us by tradition essentially remembering the signs from God? Is it God in that very moment giving a sign ti the individual? If the latter, then why aren’t you certain the baptism will take? Edit: Guys. Who is the one baptizing? And why does that give us assurance?

[@Outrider74]

I’ve wondered that myself, because they are SO close to Lutheranism on so many things. As a former Calvinist-now-Lutheran, I can say that it was one of the best things I did.

[@Muzicboy3]

Are you speaking of water baptism?

[@AnHebrewChild]

Question: according to Jesus, what are the weighty matters of the law? MAT23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cumin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law: judgment and mercy and faith (πίστις). These ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Question: according to Jesus, what are the weighty matters of the law?

[@PSModernKitchens]

@29:10 it could be narcissistic behavior?

[@sooner1867]

I've asked this question before and was ignored so I'll try again. Bryan, how much support do you receive from the catholic church? How much funding do they give you? How many people do they provide as your support staff? Do you have permission from them to have this channel? Do donations made to you go to the catholic church? Just looking for some honest answers. Thanks

[@johndodson8464]

Legalism is the CATEGORY ERROR of mixing up ETHICS and EPISTEMOLOGY.

[@MandMe91]

Read this out loud: **He has revealed his word to Jacob, his laws and decrees to Israel. He has done this for NO other nation; they DO NOT know his laws. Psalm 147 Does that say all humanity knows gods laws?

[@gideonopyotuadebo2304]

A GOSPEL THAT IS ANTILAWI IS OF SERPENT THE TEMPTER AND NOT OF GOD YEHOVAH THE LAWGIVER THE GOSPEL OF GOD YEHOVAH THE LAWGIVER IS A LAWFUL GOSPEL Isaiah 33:22 ASV For Jehovah is our judge, Jehovah is our lawgiver, Jehovah is our king; he will save us. Isaiah 40:8-10 ASV The grass withereth, the flower fadeth; but the word of our God shall stand forever. [9] O thou that tellest good tidings to Zion, get thee up on a high mountain; O thou that tellest good tidings to Jerusalem, lift up thy voice with strength; lift it up, be not afraid; say unto the cities of Judah, Behold, your God! [10] Behold, the Lord Jehovah will come as a mighty one, and his arm will rule for him: Behold, his reward is with him, and his recompense before him. Isaiah 52:7,11-12 ASV How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace, that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation, that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth! [11] Depart ye, depart ye, go ye out from thence, touch no unclean thing; go ye out of the midst of her; cleanse yourselves, ye that bear the vessels of Jehovah. [12] For ye shall not go out in haste, neither shall ye go by flight: for Jehovah will go before you; and the God of Israel will be your rearward. Isaiah 61:1-3,6,8-9 ASV The Spirit of the Lord Jehovah is upon me; because Jehovah hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the broken-hearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; [2] to proclaim the year of Jehovah's favor, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn; [3] to appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them a garland for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they may be called trees of righteousness, the planting of Jehovah, that he may be glorified. [6] But ye shall be named the priests of Jehovah; men shall call you the ministers of our God: ye shall eat the wealth of the nations, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves. [8] For I, Jehovah, love justice, I hate robbery with iniquity; and I will give them their recompense in truth, and I will make an everlasting covenant with them. [9] And their seed shall be known among the nations, and their offspring among the peoples; all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed which Jehovah hath blessed. Psalm 40:7-10,16 ASV Then said I, Lo, I am come; In the roll of the book it is written of me: [8] I delight to do thy will, O my God; Yea, thy law is within my heart. [9] I have proclaimed glad tidings of righteousness in the great assembly; Lo, I will not refrain my lips, O Jehovah, thou knowest. [10] I have not hid thy righteousness within my heart; I have declared thy faithfulness and thy salvation; I have not concealed thy lovingkindness and thy truth from the great assembly. [16] Let all those that seek thee rejoice and be glad in thee: Let such as love thy salvation say continually, Jehovah be magnified.

[@jimhuskins8506]

What a crock! “The Gospel contains nothing for us to do” is a dangerous lie. We were created to “do good work.” (Ephesians 2:10) Jesus says that those who love Him must keep His commandments. John 2:3-4 insists that the ONLY EVIDENCE of our saving faith is keeping His commandments. Many attempt to water down His commandments to “have a warm fuzzy feeling for God and others,” but Jesus clarified this one. He says that His Torah and His Prophets will be in undiminished effect as long as heaven and earth remain. I implore you to stop leading people astray. The Covenants are made with Israel. Messiah came to redeem Israel. The Bible never promises salvation for anyone other than Israel. Those who place their faith in Israel’s Messiah are grafted into Israel. The 12 gates of New Jerusalem admit Israelites. It does not have a 13th gate marked Goyim. You folks are so wrapped up in your “man made interpretations” that you have forgotten how to read the Bible and do what it says. Please wake up before Israel’s Messiah returns to judge everyone based on what we have done, not on what we claim to believe.

[@akadwriter]

The problem remains when people quote Calvin so much in relation to the third use of the law. His view was thoroughly unbiblical, as he believed that the law actually helped sanctify a believer. Our focus should be Christ and HIS LAW. THE LAW has no power to drive us to Christ. Only God’s Spirit can do that!

[@salpezzino7803]

So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

[@toolegittoquit_001]

Where did the law originate ?? 🤦🏻

[@russmaples5351]

The Old Testament is His. The Spirit draws us, for sure, but The Law is a schoolmaster to bring men to Christ, just as it once was for saints of the early church and for believers today. So I'm not sure about His Law having no power to drive men to Christ. It is a little different for those who've been born again, but the third use of the law thing seems to be a reasonable way to understand that teaching in Scripture (or at least it's not far off). I mean, if we're not using His Law and His revealed Way as a standard and guide for life, then what are we using. The voice of whatever spirit we're hearing with no standard by which to test that spirit to see if it's His Spirit? Or do we just go with the way that seems right to us, as men? I think His discipleship program is the best way to go.

[@akadwriter]

@russmaples5351 Which verses say that the Law is a schoolmaster that draws us to Christ? It does tell us we are dead in our sin. But which verses point to your statement??

[@russmaples5351]

@akadwriter Galatians 3:24. But you could easily have looked that up, if you didn't already know, so I'm wondering why you would ask as if you don't realize The Bible says that very directly.

[@MandMe91]

False: Lets discuss actual facts: The law was ONLY given to old Covenant Israel and has NOT EXISTED for nearly two thousand years. It was never your "schoolmaster". No one alive today was ever under the works of the law or its curse. For that reason, no one alive today is redeemed from the curse of the law. Questions: ***Were you born under the law that Paul is referring to in Galatians 3? **Did Christ redeem you from the curse of the law that Paul is referring to in Galatians 3? Hint: if the first answer is "no" (and it is) then the second one is also "no". Youre welcome.

[@toolegittoquit_001]

What is your point ? 'If you love me you will keep my commandments'

[@MandMe91]

@@toolegittoquit_001 Jesus was talking to Israelites when he said that... Biblical redemption was ONLY from the old covenant of law and it's curse. My point is you are not redeemed.

[@russmaples5351]

@@MandMe91 Are you suggesting that only descendants of Jacob ever had any condemnation or wrath of God abiding on them, and the rest of us just don't have to worry about any kind of judgement from God? Are you talking about a completely separate curse or wrath on the gentiles? Or are you saying something else?

[@MandMe91]

@@russmaples5351 The first part of what you said is true. The law condemned. The law makes one guilty. A judge can't rightly judge without a law. Paul said "it's the law that brings about God's wrath" He also said: "Sin apart from the law is dead" "Sin in not imputed when there is no law" "There can be no transgression where there is no law" "The sting of death is sin and the power of sin is the law" 'Jesus was born under the law to redeem those who WERE under the law" "For as many as are of the works of the law are under a curse" Were you born under and subject to the Mosaic law?

[@russmaples5351]

@MandMe91 Are you assuming that Paul was talking about some kind of chronologically divided soteriological program that Scripture never mentions? Because all those quotes you listed are in context of a narrative that talks a lot about an old man and a new man relating to a personal response to God's call. There's also some emphasis on there being no distinction between Jews and Gentiles (in the Old and New Testaments, and in reference to the law and to regeneration).