Leifang & Jann Lee | Wasted Plotential

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#JannLei4Life #FightingGameRivalries #DeadOrAliveXtremeBeachStagnation

[@itztsukki]

Leifang & Jan Lee is such a amazing rivalry storyline which needs to be canon as a romantically ship. Like come on guys, she literally has interest in him and he also has it. The way how he saved her from a gang, she trained and became stronger to beat him and he still saves her every time just needs a happy ending.

[@TheDigitalApple]

Leifang and Lee’s rivalry is just a “Groundhog Day” like time loop, where you think that the rivalry would actually go somewhere but every time a new game is out they’d just reset it to keep the “status quote”

[@shawklan27]

Alot of fighting games has that issue with rivalries going nowhere

[@MusicoftheDamned]

@@shawklan27 Yeah, at least in this case, it sort of makes sense not to escalate despite it still sounding frustrating. Honestly the worst instances of a rivalry being stuck in limbo to me all come from _Tekken_ since despite the majority of them revolving around one party wanting to kill each other, basically *no one* gets character development unless they're part of the Mishima soap opera. Poor Yoshimitsu (and Kunimitsu).

[@brendongame2543]

@@shawklan27 Specially Tekken. A good chunk (if not most) of the characters stopped having progression in order to keep up with the rivalries.

[@Mitsu2040]

One of the things I like about Soul Calibur/Blade is that (most) of the characters are affected in some way by the main conflict in the story with each game. And the winners aren't too predictable, like it could be anyone. Sophitia/Taki in Soul Blade, Kilik/Xianghua/Maxi in SC1, Raphael in SC2, Siegfried in SC3, etc. Unlike in Tekken where everyone is inconsequential except for the Mishima clan who are always the main focus.

[@calemr]

SC has always been my favourite fighting game series for story... Up until 3.

[@corpsedesecrator2612]

Thats what made the Soul Series great is that as a whole it has many faces of Protagonists from Siegfried, Kilik, Sophitia, Raphael. Also LOVED SC6 a reboot done right unlike nrs’s garbage MK that desecrated it’s respective franchise. The SC reboot is set post Soul Blade during SC1 and pre SC2 and its great cause the lore and continuity remains almost the same with few tweaks I just wish they made each character’s story arcs longer but overall love what they do you feel the emotions with the characters you play through as where as MK and Tekken fail at this with their newer games horribly. Also AMAZING new characters love Grøh and Azwel(a kind of antagonist that this series very much missing in it’s roster) and I can’t wait to see what they do in the future with the series and new characters as a whole and yes I pretend SC5 never happened. My favorite Fighting series and KOF, SC, Samsho, Guilty Gear, DOA and even SF.

[@paperluigi6132]

@@corpsedesecrator2612 SC6 refers to SC5 as the “bad timeline” iirc, so even Namco pretends it never happened.

[@windwind3170]

It's so weird to consider but Scorpion and Sub-Zero never really had a long lasting rivalry... Hanzo's beef was with Bi-han and he killed him right in the first game and he swore to defend Kuai in 2 and Bi-han stopped caring about Scorpion and instead was pursuing his own goals as Noob.

[@EndoScorpion]

Exactly, it really bugs me when people think Scorpion and Kuai Liang are in any way against each other. The only time they were was in MK4 when Quan Chi manipulated Scorpion into attacking SZ, and that "arc" ended in the very same game. I still wish we got more interaction between Scorp, Noob, and Quan - in a sort of hate-triangle (as opposed to a love-triangle). The rebooted timeline really did double-down the the whole "Scorpion + Sub Zero 4eva and eva!!" shtick.

[@MrDarksol]

I know DOA's story is completely nothing and has been turning into nothing but fan service but wow Leifang has suffered from notice me Senpai syndrome. It does feel like nothing was developed and while Jann Lee grew to a degree, Leifang hasn't. Thank god Sol and Ky, at least when it comes to rivalries, they mellowed out.

[@lukejones7164]

I've always thought Lei Fang was simply tsundere for Jann Lee since their 2nd fight lol. One of the DoA volleyball games even has Lei Fang mention that she wants to marry him after kicking his ass 😆.

[@trcsonic]

I'm a Lei Fang's fan and i agree Tecmo could improve her story a lot with Jan Lee.

[@itztsukki]

Same, i love her and he‘s so right.

[@boyoboyo2272]

The rock crushing X-ray blow at the end was really funny. And so was your spot on impression of the Fighters Den

[@kevingriffith6011]

It's sad when a long running rivalry has more in common with Rufus and Ken's "rivalry" than it does with a sensible, well assembled one

[@Evergladez]

I feel like the writers have no where to go with these characters but they're iconic enough to still make it into the games, at least with Leon they retired him before reaching that point but even still some players ask for him back. I personally think she should have confessed her feelings for Jan Lee and that the only reason she's trying to keep this rivalry going is its the only way he'll notice her.

[@MusicoftheDamned]

Huh. As someone who does care about _Dead or Alive_ and who actively loathes humanity, the old man character able to accomplish his goal of saving his granddaughter and getting to retire without his happy ending getting retconned is weirdly heartwarming. I guess good writing and actual character development can be endearing like that. Who knew? (Oh, right, everyone except for writers of franchises where the status quo is god.)

[@meganinten0078]

I prefer a friendly rivalry than always a "I want to kill you" rivalry. It is kinda refreshing these days. I know this is not from a fighting game but I really like Bartre and Karla's rivalry (Fire Emblem series) Bartre never EVER won a fight against Karla in his entire life but at least he was able to survived one of her strikes and keep going...just to be defeated it by her second strike. What I like about that rivalry is how Bartre ended up respecting Karla as a fighter and later calling her a friend. The two ended up becoming training partners, later they started dating and finally getting married.

[@andile-blazermakhanya2047]

And thus! Fir is born

[@paperluigi6132]

I forgot, did Karla die right after Fir was born or a few years later?

[@Neogears1312]

You know have you ever noticed that Leifang has…undertones… with Hitomi, a girl in the roster with a similar backstory of trying to win a man she fell for who’s simply not gonna be with them. I just think it’s a funny connotation that they have a similar general arc and yet the games somehow make that arc work better with each other in a clearly non accidental way.

[@historian252]

Nah.

[@Mitsu2040]

I totally agree that characters shouldn't have the same motivations for every game. Most fighting games have their protagonists who advance with each new story development, and then there's the throwaway characters only there for the tournament who don't advance and aren't affected by the large events at all. I don't mind when their motivations are simple like winning some money or proving themselves, but their stories should move forward.

[@holloworacle3140]

Forget Chunli, Leifang is the strongest female fighting game character

[@kevingriffith6011]

Pretty sure that goes to dizzy from guilty gear... but ignoring crazy anime girls or superpowers you're probably right.

[@OccuredJakub12]

Another good rivalry that develops so much it can almost be considered a non-rivalry by now is Sol Badguy and Ky Kiske.

[@MusicoftheDamned]

Agreed, though it probably helps that the latter accidentally married into his family by becoming Dizzy's husband back when both Ky and Dizzy were unaware that Sol was her father. [/just _Guilty Gear_ things]

[@phabiorules]

It also doesn't hurt that they both have storyline that revolve around more than just their rivalry.

[@EndoScorpion]

I mean, is it even a rivalry, or just one person stalking someone they have an unhealth obsession with beating up - while the other barely notices.

[@pn33milan11]

yeah, they could have literally done anything to spice things up with these two. the only thing that really happened over the years was just their "sorta kinda like" flirt in DOA5, but that's it. I'm ok with the idea of Jann Lee being flustered by his defeat to Rig and with Leifang feeling unsatisfied after defeating him, with Jann Lee not fighting at his max potential. It kinda helped him to get right back on track, even if Diego still took over from that and overshadowed Leifang a little. That was something... for Jann Lee It still felt unfair to Leifang's character growth, tho. Her only objective over the years was to defeat him and, when she did, it left a bitter taste. He still doesn't see her as a worthy rival, or he just doesn't admit it. They never acknowledged this and all it does is leaving Leifang in the same exact spot as she was in DOA1. Except for her rivalry/friendship with Hitomi, but that still hasn't brought her closure with Jann Lee

[@drpac9164]

Great video! It truly does make me sad that fans of games like DOA and MK care vastly more about our games stories than their companies do. I always thought LeiFang should've beaten Jann Lee by DOA5 and had her Grand Finals match with Hitomi while Jann Lee could've came back and beaten her by DOA6. It's kinda weird that Jann Lee won both tournaments, imo.

[@arkhamsmastermind370]

I have to admit I gotta love the return of DOA content on the channel, DOA content is rather scarce nowadays, but at least MK isn't always taking the forefront, its a neat balance

[@fuzeshore1988]

Great analysis about Jann Lee and Leifang. My only criticism is that in DOA5, when Jann Lee was training with the num-chuks, it wasn't Leifang or Hitomi who saw him. It was actually Kokoro who walked in on him. Then avoided to catch the num-chucks as Jann Lee tossed them at her. But other than that, great video.

[@The4thSnake]

I'm well aware. It was just used to illustrate the point.

[@scatman1236]

Nice to see some more DOA videos; I don't know much about the story from those games but its entertaining to hear you talk about them! By any chance, have you considered doing more wasted plotentials of Street Fighter/Tekken/etc?

[@The4thSnake]

I have some Tekken ones planned.

[@scatman1236]

@@The4thSnake Looking forward to it!

[@New2RetroReviews]

yeah that seems to be the major issue isnt it? Fighting games with rivalries or characters that dont go anywhere or get messed up in development. They end up going a wacky route to the characters too, or wackier to the point where it doesnt make much sense.

[@TheCrystalBlood]

If more poeple took story in fighting games seriously, instead of the stereotypicaly "StoRy DoN't MattEr in My fIGhtiNg GamE" attitude most share, maybe we would've gotten a fan base that would've held the devs accountable for such a repetitive story structure between two characters, throughout six entries.

[@frozezone2947]

What do you expect? Most of the fan base don't give a shit about the story

[@EndoScorpion]

But if the devs made a more engaging story, more fans would take it more seriously. So I wouldn't blame the fans for "not holding the devs accountable". Look at MK - the rebooted timeline shits all over the story and is atrocious. Many of the older fans have called NRS out on it. They don't try to make it better, if anything they troll the fans and make them pay extra for SOME of the things they want via DLC (while purposely leaving out other things in high demand).

[@lukejones7164]

@@shaobingboy No it isn't. Most Fighting games and many other genres in general do not put as much thought and effort into their stories as they put into their character designs and core gameplay. The quality of one thing doesn't necessarily reflect the quality of everything else. For instance, the NRS MK games have terrible stories, yet the general gameplay & even animation of the NRS games are way better than the Midway games ever were. That's why they have greater success among the FGC, E-Sports and even casual gamers than the Midway era.

[@UnemployedWorkr]

I thought Jann Lee lost to Lei Fang in DOA4 but then he saved her from Alpha and like set her back to square one. I don’t remember where I heard that so maybe it was just a wiki writer making assumptions. Or maybe that could have been a thing but was erased when Dimensions kinda established an actual canon where neither of those two got anywhere near Alpha.

[@corpsedesecrator2612]

This whole continuity of them makes Leifang seem like a female simp for Jann Lee if I maybe bold to say doesn’t look good on her since Jann Lee has rivalries with Ryu Hayabusa, Rig and now Diego where as Leifang’s main focus is on Jann Lee. Also Leifang is one of my waifus😍😍😍.

[@flair541]

You say DOA is wild. Most Japanese games are wild.

[@boratzan]

5:00 in the morning wtf

[@The4thSnake]

This isn't funny or clever. Stop it.

[@MarioUcomics]

Personally I see it less of a rivalry now and then just fighting since they really like each other. If they’re are future games, I kinda would like the to hook up officially

[@micah459]

Don't know much about the game so I have a random question. Where would Ryu rank in the game in terms of who's the better fighters.

[@The4thSnake]

Top. Ninja Gaiden is canon to DOA.

[@Mitsu2040]

I rank the ninjas as: Ryu, Kasumi, Raidou, Genra, Hayate, Ayane, Momiji

[@ratchetexperience8379]

Ryu is that -nigga- Ninja. He's at the very top of the leaderboards

[@harlannguyen4048]

Didn't Momiji quit as a ninja to become a shrine maiden?

[@jasomega2446]

0:32 Well, That Is Actually A Fantastic Idea!

[@MSGSlayer1]

7:27's got that Mortal Kombat shit.

[@TheKekethatsGenderfluidDuh]

Your story sounds so much better than what we got. 😅

[@dforman4770]

Jann Lee is my all time favorite “Bruce Lee guy” because of his original appearance and his fresh take on the Jeet Kune Do style. In fact he’s one of my favorite fighting game in characters in general. It just kinda sucks that he’s stuck in a franchise that flounders story plots and still seems to be stuck in UnGaBunGA BoObIeS

[@javiersoriano671]

He’s one of my favorite Bruce Lee fighters too besides Liu Kang and Law (I hate how they treated that man like a joke in recent years. They got him running away from Feng Wei like a chickenshit) As for Jann Lee being stuck in a series with tons of oppai I don’t mind it at all (don’t judge me), but the only thing I find wrong with the fanservice is those crazy ass prices (got me fucked up if you think imma pay $100 for a season pass lmao)

[@kzakulenga5138]

This is off topic I've watched the mk11 kritque 3 times (masterpiece btw) and something krossed my mind Raiden- "Every time me and Liu Kang has fought he dies in every timeline." Raiden and Netherealm established in mk9 that Raiden has Liu Kang's number. MK11reinforced the fact that he is his better. Shang Tsung stole both Fujin AND Raiden's soul so technically Shang SHOULD have been able to defeat Liu Kang due to him having Raiden's soul+ powers. It's to my hope that MK 12 actually follows this to me at least it'll give the perfect MK Deception vibe Picking up from the last story when the heroes are either dead or in absolute peril. With the battle between Liu and Shang mirroring the fight between Raiden had against The Deadly Alliance in the Deception into.

[@EndoScorpion]

Raiden > Liu Kang > Shao Kahn > Onaga > Raiden > Liu Kang .... repeat for infinity. Power scaling doesn't really work in MK. Also, Fire God Liu had Raiden's soul too.

[@Nightbanekaizer]

4th snake. Why do you do this to me? Why do you somehow subconsciously make me want to play these characters which up till now have not interested me. Guess I'm hitting the training mode again.

[@The4thSnake]

Because Jann Lee has one of the best movesets in the series.

[@Nightbanekaizer]

@@The4thSnake Yeah he's pretty fun. I don't like the screams he makes in 6 but whatever.

[@steepsort6905]

@@The4thSnake "He is a gatekeeper" "Only the best washes him"

[@pancholopez8829]

As both a Lei and Jann mains, I love this video. Yea, they really need an update and you mentioning it would have helped out greatly. I don't get why the writers stagnated their rivalry and development this badly.

[@mrmoviemanic1]

Jann Lee is my all-time favorite DOA character, dude is just so dam badass.

[@TheRealBDouble]

I first played Jann Lee in DoA 2 back when it came out on the PS2. My favorite character

[@luisgab707]

Leifang best DOA character

[@lyokian]

Either I'm reading too much into the usage of the Xtreme games or...you might be implying your own theory to Hitomi's & Leifang's relationship.

[@cosmicmariana]

As cliche as it might sound I actually think that Leifang liking Jann Lee makes a lot of sense and the two acknowledging they have feelings for each other would be a very satisfying conclusion to all of this; but then they just screwed things up with DOA5 and 6 with pretty much everything else story-related, hell, even in Dead or Alive Xtreme 2 (Paradise as well), if Leifang somehow gets a Pizza for herself; unlike every other character, she won't eat it, but rather inspect it, saying something like ''After I marry him, I need to make him stop eating this junk...'' Now of course the Xtreme games are just fanservice but she literally just said she intends on marrying him...and they did nothing with that.

[@Sungura_Kaiser]

If you assault a T. rex, you're either a badass who knows what they're doing, or an idiot wishing to die.

[@natanmayugen8251]

...... This video is literally you telling you are more a fan of Leifang than Jann Lee. Maybe forgetting that Jan Lee is easy Top 5 best fighter in DOA. Its like telling that Bob could beat Kazuya Mishima from Tekken, keep dreaming.

[@notarant5107]

I look at this like I look at Michael Meyers. “How is this possible?”

[@betegarcia6766]

Sugestion:wast potencial of jinpachi Mishima or Azazel

[@greatnessexiled1655]

I always thought Lei would eventually beat him, but then help him get better. Through getting better together they develop the relationship they both want. Jann Lee has feelings for Lei, but feels he has no time for love and doesn't know how to express them, given his entire life has been learning to fight just to survive. He gets better, fights Rig, finds out about Rig's condition and helps free Rig from Donovan's control. Sounds better than making every character except the ninjas into chopped liver.

[@jessylei]

I love this video I'm glad I'm not the only one who think Jann and Lei story not going nowhere it was cute at first but as DOA was putting out games Lei and Jann story still the same I think well all got tired of the same story but I hope the next DOA game Lei finally gets a new story without Jann being in it finally I mean Lei and Jann are badass characters I wish they would do better with their stories......Leifang my favorite character 😊💛 but keep Lei and Hitomi friendship 💛💚

[@gerison320]

I mean.. Tina is still doing stupid shit just to annoy her dad. That's been the case since like the second game. Most characters in DoA are in an endlessly boring story

[@John-sl4ov]

i always thought the character design for Jann Lee after the 4th game just started looking off

[@oroontheheels]

I’m really annoyed by this type of rivalry where one character almost always wins expect for few times when he was weakened by something, never giving his rival true and deserved victory. It’s so stupid. And sends stupid message. Only example I like is Dragon Ball because Vegeta coming in terms with the fact that he never defeat Goku is a HUGE and important step in his character development. Instead of chasing his pride he found value in family and friendship. He fights to protect and trust Goku to protect him if the enemy will be too strong.

[@gbbbbb6382]

I’m my opinion, doa7 should pull a soul calibur and redo the storyline, except also progress as well so there’s both new and rewritten old content, with that it should do as you said except a little earlier so leifang isn’t accomplishing her goal from 13-21 years old…

[@cryguy0000]

Please do one of these for Marie Rose. She was such an interesting character there, her theme song and lines gave impression she's smarter than she lets on. Pretending to be cute and clueless to put her opponent into a false sense of security, but in DOA6 they took that away from her and just made her a generic cutesy dits

[@joandarc441]

Ming Dynasty

[@ashchisalleh1454]

For some reason I don't see anything wrong.. It feel like good rivalry.. That not involved kill other. Plus Doa world is bigger than tournament itself. Fatal frame, Doa valleyball venus, ninja gaiden, Nioh is same world but different time.

[@The4thSnake]

...What?

[@micah459]

I don't play DOA but the rivalry seems very one sided to the point where it makes her Leifang looks bad

[@christhechilled]

That doesn't explain why the rivalry for both characters being handled badly.

[@ashchisalleh1454]

@@christhechilled rivalry between man and woman is hard to show especially involved personality around it rather than man rival man or woman rival woman. Especially if rival develop from normal to love type but at same time maintain quote rivals feel. It not same how hitomi and hayate , ayane and kasumi, bayman and Leon, rivalry work... Funny how brian rivalry is yohimitsu because both kinda immortal rivalry not human rivalry type. It more to jun kazama and kazuya kind of intense.

[@meganinten0078]

I have to agree. I prefer a friendly rivalry than always a "I want to kill you" rivalry. It is kinda refreshing these days.

[@yousufhellsing581]

My favourite series

[@symadreable]

That's not wasted potential, that's just a true woman 😂

[@marquisespidnnerettemindfa8548]

Ok?....

[@-xiii-13]

Spoiler : Jann Lee is gay, since DOA5 his love interrest is Rig, keep ignoring and rejecting Leifang.

[@markmyers6756]

Showing dead or alive xterm cut scenes during the himtome talk I see want you did there.

[@ratchetexperience8379]

They really did fuck up on DOA 6 tho. Half of the previous roster is missing and the movesets don't hold the same weight or technical like in 5.

[@mathieud1256]

I liked hayabusa x jan lee rivalrybetter. But after doa3, they stopped it without reason. At least they could have put some special win quotes between them

[@The4thSnake]

It's in DOA4.

[@mathieud1256]

@@The4thSnake my bad, after doa4 then

[@MSguy1000]

Leifang is wasted potential in the sense that she is not real.

[@gr8gmr]

...I don't get what you're saying.

[@jasomega2446]

5:33 🤔

[@LLR1CH4EVER]

I have a mk theory that explains all the recons in the new timeline, in Armageddon Raiden sends visions to him self in mk one but in mk11, we find out about kronica and the hour glass which controls time. So my theory is that sents Raiden sent the visions the timeline got fucked up and everything keeps getting reconed and kronica want to kill Raiden so nothing like that happens again. But hey, that's just a theory, A MK THEORY

[@The4thSnake]

This isn't an MK video.

[@CrashMan156]

Hey snake have you ever thought about doing a video on the absolute nothing that’s DOAs main villain Victor Donovan?

[@The4thSnake]

Not really. No idea what I'd do with him.

[@CrashMan156]

Neither do team ninja, but I think it the bigger problem is that DOA has always had trouble with its villains since most bosses are a one and done, and Christie ends up as the only reoccurring playable villain in the series (still pissed with what DOA 6 did with Rig)

[@centalharper9726]

Atp leifang better be a pregnant dlc for DOA7😒

[@thundersquid5715]

a lot of a lot of stuff within fighting games are wasted potential

[@aezmarvettan9294]

I said it before and I'll say it again, Don't waste your time Koei Tecmo stories as I assure that you put more effort into making this video than they do writing entire games.

[@JosephN.]

You know for years I had thought about how nice it would be for Leifang to actually be more then just "God I'm going to beat the fuck out of Jan Lee" and never managing to do it. After the clusterfuck that was the leadup to DOA6 I didn't end up getting it, nor do I really plan on it with them dropping support last year (Really shows how well that went over). Its almost refreshing to hear that Leifang beat him but I got tired of the "running in circles" problem she had, as of DOA5. Your suggestions were cool to hear, and actually turn Leifang into her own character instead of the "battle of the hour" type character that she seems to be stuck as, despite being part of the original DOA cast! Honestly Dead or Alive might need what Soul Calibur got, a reboot and a story cleanup. SC6 went back to its second entry and just undid the timeline car spinning that SC3, 4, and 5 had. Dead or Alive could benefit from returning to Dead or Alive 2, or hell even 1 maybe, with a total reboot to the story, and graphical overhaul.

[@user-zu8tw9nk7x]

First: who care about story in fighting games?) Second: i always think it is about love story, like she fear to tell jan lee "notice me senpai", and trying to prove something instead, but senpai still don't notice. It is a joke.

[@dariogonzalez8989]

You lost me at "who cares about story in fighting games".

[@CP9NASHY]

Please do honoka and ayane

[@alexp.7182]

I love DOA's gameplay and most characters, but the story is total bullshit and the fact that the main plot revolves around 5-6 characters and the rest of them have their own silly and and not at all interesting subplots really gives me a piss...

[@The4thSnake]

That's most fighting games about tournaments.

[@shadowtactics1940]

Bruh, this whole series w Ninja Gaiden was wasted potential 😭

[@andrewrogers3067]

I almost feel like Rig should have been taken out entirely. Rig does nothing but take away from THIS rivalry, and I don’t even think he provided much to the story to begin with.

[@tricksalot2]

Wait doa has a storyline?

[@gr8gmr]

Isn't that obvious?

[@tricksalot2]

@@gr8gmr yeah i know u gotta read between the lines.

[@kingxd3ath_arts485]

Doa really dropped the ball in storytelling doa5 was the indications it was all downhill. Doa6 completely shit the bed in storytelling and although I love the Doa series gamplay wise I'm not looking forward to any story whenever doa7 becomes a thing

[@waterdog737]

naw, this rewrite is kinda weak, way too similar to the original story. I sorry I had to say it.

[@ni8anttana]

Nothing was wasted about them like omg can you stop arguing about anything not seriously taken?!

[@realrealwarpet]

Im not gonna lie, i dont like jan lee. At all. The best character, easily, is hitomi. She should have won DoA5. Hell, she best jan lee after he kicked a dinosaur!

[@The4thSnake]

He can win that fight too.

[@realrealwarpet]

@@The4thSnake that was a fight he lost. I still consider Diego the winner of doa6. Granted, both options sucked

[@MistressDove]

I forgot Rig was even a character.

[@The4thSnake]

So did DOA6.

[@ratchetexperience8379]

Shame really. He was one of my main

[@yousufhellsing581]

My favourite series