Pencil Barrel Whip With Suppressors

[@BuckFoeJiden]

Glad to see more videos from you guys. THE best data driven videos on KZbin.

[@carboss]

This answered my questions so much faster then arguments on internet forums.

[@LFDResearch]

That was the goal also it does not help that most people in those forums have never tested more than half of what they argue about

[@jimbo_dilly1675]

The slowmo camera is a nice observation, but IRL you should be measuring YOUR grouping. I've met very few people who could outshoot their rifles.

[@jonathanmiller5701]

It looks like barrel whip happens after the bullet has completely left? I have a Midwest combat hansfguard and ,y gas block is close. If I move the barrel it can touch the hand guard, will this be an issue?

[@LFDResearch]

I would say no with the setup in this video you can apply enough force to make the barrel and handguard touch you will notice most of the whip occurs when the bold carrier bottoms out and changes direction the amount of whip can be reduced by using a lighter bcg but there are trade offs incurred by doing that

[@tntshuffle-9799]

That's why MI came out with the night fighter rail and newer barrel nut. Most rails longer than 12in will flex somewhat. Its why Geissele rails (and a few others) are made the way they are, to try and prevent that flex. Barrel whip is somewhat unavoidable unless you have a heavy barrel.

[@seanwhite304]

Phenomenal video bro

[@GunFunZS]

This is really excellent work.

[@LFDResearch]

Thank you!

[@jaberie308]

Interesting. I'm a big fan of Faxon barrels, both pencil and their gunner profile barrels. Based on your observations, my question is if there's no barrel whip until after the projectile leaves the barrel, then there should be no accuracy issue if say there's only 1mm of clearance between the gas block and floated hand guard. Would this be accurate?

[@LFDResearch]

That is possible but in previous testing we have shown that the weight of the suppressor alone will shift the point of impact down and how far that shifts is dependent on the weight of the suppressor. It is an interesting question to ponder and possibly look into in the future

[@michaelhill6451]

@@LFDResearch Isn't the downward impact shift caused by "barrel sag" from having a suppressor hanging off the end of the gun? I would assume you could accomplish the same thing with a weight.

[@rondobrondo]

Awesome video and very useful. Btw, escaping is pronounced "eh·skay·ping". Also, if you want to call your channel "LFD Research", you should probably try to add more quantitative variables to your analysis. Like, put up some kind of grid (or any device which can act as a ruler) with known measurements behind the gun so you can measure exactly how FAR the end the of the barrel is oscillating (i.e. the amplitude of the oscillations) or use a Protractor or something. Obviously these are just examples, what I'm saying is that while you are doing a lot of work getting the testing setups done and filming everything, you should be collecting DATA and plotting it against time. And also collecting the data on things like how long and heavy the suppressors are and seeing how that affects things, or measuring how different loads will affect this. Even on this video, with the footage you already have here, you could, post-hoc, figure out all of this stuff that I've mentioned by using a known, reference length (such as the distance between a few slots of 1913 Rail on the handguard), or if you wanted to go by the angles of deflection in the oscillations, that would be easy to do based on the footage as well. And then you can figure out the other stuff like suppressor weight and length pretty easily and use all the variable data you have collected to actually run some analysis. And if you don't know how to do multi-variate analysis or how to properly compare different variables, then you can either use software to do a lot of it automatically or just publish it online and let some other nerds with different specialties do it for you. The power of any study is data. It's hard to get real insight from just watching the video. Sure it gives me a 'sense' of what's happening, but I had to go actually figure out the math for the suppressors that I was interested in to see if they'll work for my pencil barrel. But again, the point isn't really about this video in particular, I'm speaking generally here about any kind of study or research. Also, I'm obviously not trying to hate on you or whatever -- I'm saying this stuff and taking 10 minutes to write this because I appreciate the work you've done here and I want you to take that hard work you've done, and that you do generally, to the next level.

[@LFDResearch]

Thanks we are working to continue improving the data collection across all of our testing but the goal is to produce accurate data not what we hope is accurate. Our current focus is raising small children so video production comes when we can make time at the moment but we are still focused on continuing to produce new and better videos

[@MegaSloth]

Amazing Video

[@dustinhubbard2338]

Great job !

[@Thomas-dz4eg]

Excellent!

[@Tony_Seed]

How did this translate to groups on paper ? That would be why any of this is a problem in the first place , if this is happening but the groups on paper are still as they should be then I wouldn’t call this a problem

[@LFDResearch]

We aren’t even calling this an issue we are just demonstrating what happens and you can see all movement occurs after the projectile has left the barrel. This testing cycle was not performed for accuracy as we are very close to the backstop for safety and going as close to cyclic as possible to prove movement has ceased even before a rapid follow up shot is launched

[@Tony_Seed]

@@LFDResearch ah gotcha, I don’t have anything full auto so ide only be concerned with accuracy that’s was my thought process

[@LFDResearch]

Sadly is true of all of us Hughes is an issue but our goal is to show that the barrel doesn’t move until after the bullet Leaves and stops well before even a rapid follow up shot it’s not really an issue the larger issue is heat build up possibly allow a shifting point of impact

[@makodra]

Very interesting

[@samt5716]

yeah science!

[@blackhawk7r221]

Let’s try this again with the handguard removed to see more of the barrel. Those suppressors are definitely moving differently than the barrel.

[@LFDResearch]

I’m not sure what your seeing but the barrel and the suppressors are moving in sync you can even glimpse the movement through the rail and it has the added benefit of giving a fixed point to compare the movement against

[@blackhawk7r221]

@@LFDResearch You are trusting your eyes. Never do that. Resonance vibration acts differently through different metals of different thicknesses. Try this. Remove those handguards and make a black and white graph background, you know, a measuring means to analyze movements in videos. You will see the steel barrel move a certain amount, then the tube steel or aluminum tubing of the can moving at a different rate. In fact, one may be up while the other may be down as the harmonic wave travels down the length. I’m not hating. The video is cool as hell. Let’s just say it was so cool that we want to see it redone with more science.