"Miscavige is crucial to the end of Scientology" - A conversation with Mike Rinder

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

Learning about Scientology helped me and my wife see through our cult's bullshit. Thanks, Mike!

[@yvesandrethevenot3489]

Yeah! Mike is great to beat every and any cult. He's great!

[@ibrandieshay]

Yes. He and Leah’s & Sister Wives series helped me realize that JW’s were cults over many years. Now my immediate and I are out since a July 2022.

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

@@ibrandieshay - Welcome to Freedom. We are out since October 2018.

[@markoredano9141]

​@@EfrainRiveraJuniorWhat cult did you leave?

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

Mike and Leah's work has helped many Jehovah's Witnesses to wake up. Very nice side effect!

[@goldie862]

A lovely bonus indeed!!!

[@michael-4k4000]

Did Mike write “going clear”?

[@goldie862]

@@michael-4k4000 No, Mike wrote "A Billion Years." I believe he may have appeared in the movie version of going clear, though.

[@kissthapistol]

@@michael-4k4000 Hi Michael! Mike was in Going Clear's documentary but Lawrence Wright wrote the book. Have you read any other Scientology-related books? I suggest Blown for Good by Marc Headley, if you haven't already.

[@lianidri80]

@@kissthapistol I also read Beyond Belief by Jenna Miscavige. This one is great since she was a slave at the Hemet base for many years.

[@dogwalker338]

Two of my favorite “cult breakers”!! Great interview.

[@aspco.]

His book is AMAZING. Absolute must read amongst several other stellar books on Scientology. Spent three days using every spare minute to finish it, his recollections are so vivid and horrifying.

[@womenfrom0202]

The audiobook is read by Mike himself, amazing to listen to his life that way

[@rozsheehy6146]

@@womenfrom0202 I didn't know there was an audio book!! I'm getting it! Thanks! 💙💚💛

[@samueldouglas797]

@@womenfrom0202 the lady that works full time to expose scyintolegy

[@alba4203]

Guarda che i tuoi amici Lugli Hanno fuori la foto di Flavio quello sano che ha disconnesso da Renata Claudio il mago si fa per dire e titi i falliti truffatori ridicoli.......Ha disconnesso da truffatori altro che Silvia Toffanin

[@talvimango9229]

Yes, exactly. It was a challenge to put it down and go to work every morning, and I just barely managed to not be late for work a couple of times.

[@mlove.1376]

Leah's work rewoke me. I had been out for many years and never could put my finger on why I was so different. I then realized how many years of my life that I have/had attitudes that dont serve me and where they came from. Then Lloyd, once stumbled upon his work, he had a woman mental health professional and I realized that I have a chance of having chronic trauma. Lloyd also gave me understanding of the different beliefs that weren't the truth along with bible timelines that helped me not to have doubt and that I did the right thing by leaving. I doubted for 40 years. I am so grateful to all of you involved in my process. I look forward to your book! Congratulations Mike. Thanks for being on Lloyd's YT.

[@yvesandrethevenot3489]

Mike Rinder is a gem. I hated his guts when he was a scientology aparatchik. I find him amazingly good and useful for everyone to read and listen to now. Plus I love his humor. Great Guy. Love his Book.

[@AnneOfGreenEggsAndHam]

Clearwater (ish) local here! Hi Mike! I can’t begin to express how grateful I am to have had several dear friends wake up years after exposing me. Your work is so important. Love from Tarpon. Very engrossing interview as usual, Lloyd.

[@MidnightAndLuna]

Mikes book is incredible! I finished it in two days. I couldn’t put it down.

[@goldie862]

Hey Jen!!! 😘

[@MidnightAndLuna]

@@goldie862 Hi Goldie! 😘

[@michael-4k4000]

Is Mike Rinder single?

[@MidnightAndLuna]

@@michael-4k4000 he has a wife. Her name is Christie, I think

[@TBOTSS]

@@MidnightAndLuna Who has dumped him.

[@Fabian-ew7et]

Wonderful interview! As a former Scientologist, I went from being an empathic young girl to a judgmental person. It was the exact opposite of my original path I So Slowly done that I didn’t see it.

[@UseADamnCoaster]

I agree, I could listen to Mike talk all day. He's well-spoken and objective while still driving his point home. When I'm not broke I plan on getting his book and reading it as well.

[@bigboithe8th]

Great interview! If you haven’t yet watched the JW Aftermath with Mike, Leah and Lloyd, it is an absolute must. Thanks to people like Mike, Leah and Lloyd, hopefully one day Scientology and the WT will no longer be around to destroy people’s lives.

[@Julescage1]

PLEASE READ THIS!! It's crucial that everyone understands this about sociopaths and why you must shut them down no matter how they are connected to you! I was married to a sociopath. I didn't realize it until I started researching sociopathy. My now ex husband put me through absolute chaos and hell for 20 years. He had ONE very weak moment ( rare). I had rented an apartment and was moving out against his wishes. I was DONE! He was crying real tears ( very rare for this to be genuine). These were his exact words that FINALLY made it all make sense to me... " I GET A RUSH OUT OF GETTING AWAY WITH THINGS. IT'S A FEELING I CANT EXPLAIN AND IVE BEEN DOING IT SINCE I WAS A LITTLE KID. I CAN'T STOP. IT'S THE WAY MY BRAIN WORKS." That was what FINALLY made me understand who these people are! They have no empathy. They can't learn to. They can't. Its not in their make-up. They cannot feel REAL LOVE. THIS RUSH THEY GET IS THE BEST FEELING THEY CAN REACH. THIS IS HOW THEY SPEND THEIR ENTIRE LIVES. PLEASE RESEARCH SOCIOPATHY!!

[@Jezzebel1313]

Martha Stout - The Sociopath Next Door" explains the urgently needed basic knowledge that we all need, to understand and recognize. And it's in a way that is understandable for everyone and no boring science lecture. It's a wonderful basis for training your instincts. Great that you mention the book.

[@ianwalton284]

I had to kick half the people out of my life after reading that book. Especially my animal torturing brother.

[@robertwatson6888]

Scientology claims that this book is all lies and fabrications but what legal action did they take...ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!! That speaks volumes.

[@Rawnblade13]

I listened to Mike Rinder's entire book. Definitely recommend.

[@MidnightAndLuna]

I read it too. Absolutely insane. I have a lot of respect for Mike. There were many parts that were heartbreaking but I would have to say the worst was worn he went to FLAG to see his son because he heard he had cancer. His son was there but they wouldn’t let him see his son. At that same time, his son was under close watch because he wanted to leave. So close! If he would have been able to see him, he might have gotten him out. I cried at that part

[@Rawnblade13]

@@MidnightAndLuna Listening to him read it is great too.

[@MidnightAndLuna]

@@Rawnblade13 he said he narrates it. I should get the audiobook too.

[@LinkChow8150]

Fantastic video! I could listen to you two talk for hours, two heavy hitters in terms of knowledge/experience with these cults. Bravo

[@user-vo4wc2jz8g]

You really helped me Lloyd. I really appreciate the slings and arrows you take in order to stand up and do what you do so well

[@willrussell2583]

What is quite amazing is the way both of these men choose their words. So carefully, from the experience of having their words dissected and banned by unique, entire, organizations.

[@mjq243]

Just love Mike - great interview!

[@lawrence5117]

An illuminating discussion. Thanks Lloyd and Mike.

[@JudgeFredd]

Mike is really courageous to speak out

[@alba4203]

Dal 2007 e non gli è mai successo niente che coraggioso è ahahahah siete ridicoli lui la leah remini la j lo Michelle Obama bullshit cult democratici psicotic lunatic party criminals drugs pusher bullshit woman woke gender.qiestioni politiche questi sono utili idioti secondo i dem secondo me Fanno perdere una marea di balle solo Fedez la d Urso la Palombelli la cavallo la odescalchi la Hunziker parodi Parodi Gori ci credono.coglioni dem sono identici ai coglioni Americani dem ed europei.come GLI psichiatri e psicologi of course

[@geoffreybunting9837]

I watched John Sweeney and his documentary about Scientology a few years ago. I'm glad Mike Rinder and J Sweeney have made up, and I'm even gladder (yes gladder) that Mike Rinder woke up, escaped Scientology, and can begin to live a full life

[@StKrane]

I agree; could listen to Mike for hours! Thank you for this!

[@Kiytcu]

Mike helped me wake up and get out of JWs

[@knittiotsavant]

Fascinating interview. I ordered Mike’s book. Can’t wait to start reading.

[@kelliintexas3575]

It breaks my heart knowing Lisa could have found renewed purpose in speaking out about Scientology. She just was making huge moves & could have woken up SO MANY PEOPLE! 🥰

[@toriwolf5978]

Wow what a great interview such a great guy going to see if I can get a hold of his book…please do these kinds of interviews coming so interesting and lots to learn . Thank you loyd for the work you are doing you are helping so many….❤

[@juliehigbee7398]

What a great collaboration here!

[@jillanderson3665]

Drawn to the title like a moth- so very well crafted, I'm in awe...the most positive upbeat backhand I've ever read. Thank you, honorable sirs.🌩

[@juliabridges7731]

Great video. Looking forward to reading Mike's book. Yes to the book, The Sociopath Next Door. Sociopaths are often high ranking persons in organizations. Their way to the top leaves a trail of heartbreak. They are not necessarily criminal but are experts are ruining people's lives and robbing them of true happiness.

[@aaronburns9538]

I just found your channel sir and I'd like to say tongue in cheek thank God for you. It is so refreshing to find another former Jehovah's Witness who didn't just end up replacing it with an equally ridiculous form of Christianity

[@maryhamric]

Such a great book. Mike...I admire you so much. In your example I have taken heart in starting a great part of my life over again.

[@darimari9814]

Mikes book is amazing! Finished audio in few days. Have JW in my family, stuck there for about 45 years 🥺 Hi from Croatia

[@suzyq2389]

Hey, Croatia! Hi from Becky in Orlando. Hugs, too!

[@katrinasmith2843]

Empaths do possess a propensity for attracting narcissists. The information to support empaths through the process of leaving narcissistic people or groups is immense. It's very important to educate oneself to spot those red flags and don't ignore! Great interview! Thank you Lloyd and Mike for sharing.

[@Zabora1]

Keep doing what youre doing Mike!

[@StefWokeUp]

Great interview!

[@FUNKY_BUTTLOVIN]

Enjoyed this, Mike really is just a nice presence

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

In my experience, 100% of Elders and Traveling Overseers or _not_ good people. All Elders who the rank-and-file describe as "good," end up being removed from their position within a year. Only the evil ones thrive in that organization.

[@talvimango9229]

I bought the book because of this video. I more or less binge-read it and can say that it's amazing!

[@cindymiller-flint4698]

Thanks, Mike. The book was absolutely fabulous

[@janebradford2271]

When Mike said you helped me change my life regarding people commenting on his book, that's how us ex jehovah witnesses fell about you Lloyd . You help many people thank you.

[@LloydEvans]

Thanks so much Jane!

[@stephaniefees6059]

Thanks!

[@LloydEvans]

Our pleasure! Thanks so much for the generous support Stephanie!

[@christines5430]

Mike's book ' A Billion Year's' is amazing! I struggled to pace myself because I didnt want stay up all night listening to it, or would have been useless at work the next day. Still only took 2 days🤣

[@rasputanrasputan1380]

A family member of mine was involved in Scientology, he had a drinking problem…he tried to recruit me… right away I thought it was bullshit, I was labeled a Suppressive Person… he disconnected from me… I was okay with the disconnect.. after a few years and lots of money, he came to his senses and walked away from Scientology….he still Drinks..

[@freedom35pedrick]

I bought the kindle version and love the book😀

[@flyingardilla143]

6:07 Whenever someone says 'The Greater Good' I reflexively repeat it like Hot Fuzz

[@robswitzer8334]

Mike's point agreeing that sociopaths are attracted to cults and often rise to the top made me immediately think of David Koresh.

[@jaredcody6869]

That was a really great interview with Mike and I was glad you brought up the question/observation of how the rigid/outdated/not adapting to the times kind of approach is one of the leading contributors to their downfall.

[@ebtbmb]

It's sad that all these Sea Org members are toiling their lives away with bureaucratic busy work and believe they're contributing to "saving the planet". They're good people who could be putting all that effort and heart into something meaningful and productive.

[@sparklecanada0112]

ebtbmb. Same can be said about those at Bethel and all of the Staunch JW Rank and File. 💔 Wasting their Precious, Short Lived Lives upon a Fantasy Based Cult with No True Benefits into the Future.😔☹

[@James_Bowie]

Miscavige is now in the same position as Hubbard: an invisible man hunted by summons servers.

[@ablue7335]

just watching this and was reminded as to why i am, and how very, very much so…i am very grateful to you lloyd!🙏 it’s been maybe 3 years for me now since i read everything i could find and watch everything i could find and it’s incredible to me that i feel as okay as i do. it’s been a lot of hard work. but i do know for a fact that you were and continue to be a mainstay in keeping me grounded and sane. can’t thank you enough.

[@LloydEvans]

You are so welcome, thanks for the kind words!

[@BuffyLynn]

Greetings Lloyd. I hope you’ve now had the opportunity to read Mikes book. To me it’s one of the best from any of the former Scientologists. The audio version was quite fun as he reads it himself😊

[@lizw.4901]

Great interviewing skills. Enjoyed this conversation - thank you.

[@texbookie]

Mike is a true hero who works diligently to undo the harm he unwittingly caused. Repentance if you will.

[@Jo-razz]

Mike Render's book is a great read. I went down the rabbit hole of finding out what Scientology is about. Seen all seasons of Scientology and the aftermath, Two documentaries on Scientology, and KZbin channels, like Growing up in Scientology, Chris Shelton & approx. A dozen interviews with Mike Render. I thought what else could I get out of this book? I learned very quickly a lot.:) Plus how it was beautifully written, even if you didn't know much about Scientology, you will still understand it, & get a lot out of it. In my opinion, makes for a great book;) Side note- with Nexium I am happy that Justice is done. On the same token, when everyone talks about Nexium, one of the points they bring up I'd how he took a lot of ideas, for a lack of a better word, from Scientology. Yet nothing is being done about Scientology??? It annoys me. Because I know the answer. They are protected by the label of religion to be abusive & or do criminal acts.

[@crunchy3756]

I can listen to Mike "ramble" for ages as well

[@b.w.7588]

One thing I like about Mike Rinder is that he never tries to dehumanize all Scientologists as individual people, much like how Lloyd doesn't dehumanize all Jehovah's Witnesses as individual people. I feel that some ex-Jehovah' s Witnesses, ex-Scientologists, and even ex-Mormons have a tendency to demonize all current members of their former religious community. It's important to be able to separate individual people from the institution as much as possible. We have to recognize that we're all fallible human beings who have flaws and make mistakes. That doesn't mean, of course, that individuals in such religious groups can't be subject to any sort of criticism. But I feel that it is important not to view such people as being "evil".

[@s.a.6082]

I appreciate this reminder as an ex-Mormon! Sometimes the more you separate yourself from the bullshit, the easier it is to dehumanize the people.

[@claremandalas2121]

Lot of references to Jehovah Witness. Move on Scientology I can see one a mile away, lol

[@danathomas3479]

I read your book! It was a great read. I’m wondering if when you were removed from one job to either a punishment or another job. We’re you actually replaced? And I am wondering if they were treated differently than you were or was it mostly busy work and no one actually replaced you? I am interested because I almost got pulled into Scientology, in my younger years. But somehow I didn’t trust them… they were at the Del Mar fair.

[@MrPaulus252]

I miss the Fair game pod cast but I am glad you guys are there to talk about it.

[@pattyb1120]

Ironic How the cults say they are the way to live But Yours and Mikes empathy and actions now are such a lovely and kind work actually live!!!’❤❤

[@TracyDoodle]

If you love listening to him … as I do … listen to his book on audible… it’s fantastic 😊

[@rosebudame]

EXCELLENT vlog!

[@L8BLUUMR]

Hahaha, "If Tibor is gracious," sounds like the prayer of a new cult, Tibor be with you. His grace abides😛

[@exploatores]

Maybe we should troll JWs and other religious pepole. Saying we belive in the grace of Tibor. because we have seen it.

[@user-vo4wc2jz8g]

I'm a true believer of "He who is gracious" 🙏

[@fishmilk0]

@@exploatores OH MY GOD YES

[@namename4012]

So does the Dude! Maybe they are One.

[@sparklecanada0112]

djhorizontl. Or the newest Star Wars movie catchphrases?🤔 "If Tibor is gracious"..."Tibor Be With You".😁😂😊👍👍🤝🏼😎

[@ln5594]

BRAVE LION🦁

[@corneliusantonius3108]

Mike Rinder Big Boss Man.

[@rameysavoie7442]

I wonder if there is a correlation between losing one's religion and loving Star Wars. I didn't watch any of it until I was no longer a believer, and now I am hooked

[@pamelaruth7400]

Awesome Lloyd!

[@robertavila4653]

Mike is doing gods work, xenu is my homeboy 👍

[@b.w.7588]

I enjoy hearing Mike Rinder speak. He's very knowledgeable about the more controversial aspects of Scientology. He's also quite the, what would you say...he's a rather sexy silver fox as well. He was great on the A&E cable TV channel's reality show "LEAH REMINI: SCIENTOLOGY AND THE AFTERMATH" (2016-2019). I liked Remini as an actress back when she played the minor role of Stacey Carosi on the NBC network TV channel's cult classic sitcom "SAVED BY THE BELL" (1989-1993). Here's an interesting fact: Leah Remini's "SAVED BY THE BELL" costar Lark Voorhies, known for playing the role of Lisa Turtle on the series, is a Jehovah's Witness.

[@suzyq2389]

YES to the Silver Fox part, y'all. Thx for mentioning this not at all hidden factoid! Who knew that when I got to age 64 I would still feel like I am 27?! smh... Still, a bit of lust does make life more worth living!

[@denisadellinger4543]

very enlightening.

[@RealPumpkinJay]

OH WOW!!

[@andreadiamond7115]

Lloyd? Is the storm trooper still protecting the Mike Rinder bobble head? Love Mike and Leah. Great content.

[@harambetidepod1451]

his book is great

[@indiandaeng]

My question is why hasnt someone filed a Habeas Corpus motion in court to find out if Miscaviges wife is still alive or being held prisoner?

[@cdd4248]

2:30 -I am picturing David Miscavige typing away at his keyboard and screaming at one of his flunkies..."How you do spell socks?...As in old...is it sox or socks". LOL

[@James_Bowie]

"Rise above the slime and become the chief jellyfish" ... priceless! 😂

[@suzyq2389]

No shit!

[@sstaners1234]

Fact: When asked about Scientology, Charles Manson responded that it was too crazy for him. Let that sink in.

[@ItsNotShakespeare]

Fantastic title

[@dakrontu]

If people leave Scientology, does the last one to leave get all the buildings? (Or would the last person be saddled with the rent bills and property taxes?) What if Miscavige runs it all down and just converts Scientology Inc into a property empire (albeit with a beefy legal department for running financial scams)?

[@naradaian]

Is it the case that LR Hubbard was a cia sockpuppet using their gameplay in Scientology? _ initially and then frightened onto life on the boat with kids to avoid his ex founders?

[@fairyspunfibers9098]

The CIA would never have needed such a bumbling, incompetent idiot as LRH was. Remember: he effed up *everything* he tried. He is believed to have suffered from some sort of brain malfunction that led him to simply not be able to think clearly. His whole life was a total fubar ... literally.

[@susanmurphy958]

Let's hope that by the end of 2023 Scientology will be completely demolished.

[@sparklecanada0112]

susanmurphy958. And WT along with it! 🤝🏼👍👍😣👎👎⚰

[@JohnDoe-ym5ly]

Hubbard could recall trillions of years of his past lives and lived in civilizations "far more advanced" than 1950/1960s America. Apparently they weren't 30 years ahead of us or Hubbard would've known the internet was coming. He said the same essential things happened repeatedly over the trillions of years.

[@freedom35pedrick]

Revoking the tax status would go miles in helping the demise….

[@LOOOVEIT]

The JW episode of Leah and Mike's show had such a heavy vibe. I could barely watch. This has the same heaviness. I wonder if anyone else notices / feels this.

[@malkaz9167]

Loveit…Of course, it had a heavy vibe. What went on with Scientology was very heavy. How human beings can treat other human beings in such a cruel, hard-hearted way is beyond my understanding.

[@fritula6200]

What's Lloyd Evans doing in Croatia?

[@lesliemartin5034]

His wife is from Croata.

[@jerelull9629]

mike: keep displaying that Emmy -- and point out what it's for more often. Yeah, it's a bit self-serving, but it's for doing such a good job exposing scientology to the light of truth.

[@Hypatiaization]

Hi Lloyd, I love your intro/outro song. May I know the name of the artist and the song? Thank you! 😊

[@bubbercakes528]

For those of you who watch this and wonder how so many could have been fooled; need I remind you that there are billions of Abrahamic religion followers out there who have been just as gullible! No religion has been able to solve the world’s problems after thousands of years. Let’s try something new; like just loving one another!

[@Cat_Woods]

Great interview. I find it puzzling that Mike says that Scientology can't evolve. I thought seeking donations was explicitly against Hubbard's policy and yet that's most of what they do now. Just as an example. I believe there are quite a few others. Scientology evolves; it just can't admit that it evolves.

[@kathymetzger9681]

I wonder if the next person to take over for Miscavige would be Tom Cruise?

[@clarkeldridge23]

Is this still the bunker?

[@Goldenfeather77]

Soon, David Miscavige ( shrimpy) will be gone and we won't have to see him. Extortion charges perhaps?

[@wunkle9523]

The Jehovah's Witnesses want your time, not your money.

[@goldie862]

That's even worse. You can make more money but time is really precious!

[@b.w.7588]

Wunkle, If one has money to give them, I'm sure the Watchtower Society wants it as well as their time (and the unquestioning obedience and dedication of the average Jehovah's Witness).

[@sparklecanada0112]

wunkle9523. Are You 100% Certain of that?🤔 Try refusing to give any "Monetary Donations" for a Year (or 5)...See how soon that Someone will attempt to Guilt You into "Giving From The Heart"( or similarly worded Pressure Tactic). WT exists for Narcissistic Reasons; and one big one is Monetary Greed and Affluence. None of the GB are living at Poverty Level or Dress As Struggling Paycheck To Paycheck, like some Rank and File JWs do.

[@cor-z8m]

What a scam! People are so stupid! Keep your money! Be good people! There’s no written formula for a perfect life!

[@BuffyLynn]

P.S. David Mascavaige had a FAKE Emmy made after the Ted Koppel interview but Mike has the real deal which is proudly shown in all his videos😂

[@sashh2263]

Lloyd you need to get a kindle.

[@fairyspunfibers9098]

Hubbard strictly forbade fund-raising. Boss Baby Davey changed that as quickly as he could wiggle that in!

[@thedarkhorse100]

I know this won’t get answered here however here goes, Mike was aware of all these things before escaping, if Dave wasn’t running the show would he have seen the light and left ?, or would he still be there if he was treated better, I’m very anti Scientology and I’m happy he’s out, just curious

[@harrypersey1422]

I just hope Shelley is okay.

[@lauriephillips7941]

Shes been chopped up and used for chum.

[@harrypersey1422]

@@lauriephillips7941 I should have phrased that differently, I should have said “I hope they find out whatever happened to Shelley”

[@suzyq2389]

@@harrypersey1422 Ah, Harry... You're a darling to care about such things. Thanx for being you!

[@harrypersey1422]

@@suzyq2389 that is so very kind of you to say Suzy, thank you 😊

[@aussie405]

He still has a bit of an Aussie accent.