Loading 18th century civilian smoothbores Part 1 Round balls

[@jimpelikan457]

That’s actually some extraordinary shooting. Especially considering no rear sight and a smooth bore weapon. Nice job Mike.

[@murphysmuskets]

Mike I too have found that it requires at least 110gr of powder to be accurate with a large caliber smoothbore. Great video and thanks for sharing!

[@david9783]

What a gratifying sound is heard when Evil Roy is hit!Thanks a million for your dedication and videos!

[@folday6169]

Mike, thanks for the demo showing the use of tow in a smoothbore. I tried the technique using 0.610 balls with tow in my trade gun and I’ve become a true believer...no need to swab between shots...wonderful!

[@woodsmanforlife1677]

Some of your videos I watch over and over again. This is one of them. Excellent job!

[@1guyin10]

I think it is really interesting to see how capable these early guns were. A lot of animals were taken and a lot of people met their end from the muzzle of a black powder firearm. I'm sure a skilled woodsman could reach out quite some distance even with one of these smoothbores. If you grew up shooting one and had to rely on it for safety and sustenance you would become very proficient with it.

[@filianablanxart8305]

And you would become very proficient at stalking to within range .

[@christopherbennett4559]

Mike is the best at flintlocks. I use sheep wool it has natural lube in it. Thanks for all you do Mike . God bless. 👍

[@HitokiriRaiden]

I always really enjoy you're black power videos I always learn a little something new everytime. Thanks for taking the time to make them.

[@rider-uj2kr]

Hi MIKE. These smoothbore flintlocks , to me, are so much more fun and interesting to shoot. Thanks for all your efforts sharing your experience with these "the gun tools". Lol.

[@earlshaner4441]

Hi from Syracuse NY brother and thank you for sharing your thoughts and adventures and information

[@craigweyna8027]

I really enjoy your demonstrations of correct historical information and also your gund demo's . This period really interests me.

[@dennisanthony1874]

Hey Mike, really enjoyed your video. My brother who is a gun builder has just finished my Rockbridge Co. Virginia 62 smooth bore, can’t wait to get some loads put through it. Keep up the good work!

[@jeffshootsstuff]

Evil Roy's still down there, tapping his foot... LOL

[@mannamedisaak3316]

That made me chuckle

[@matts.1758]

Great stuff as usual Mike! I cant wait to get my fowler back from the gunsmith to try some more period correct techniques!

[@mikemessier7977]

Good shooting once you got a feel of the drop. Keep up the good work Mike!!

[@andymandyandsheba4571]

great video mike a really nice looking rifle great to see some of the old style loading techniques being used

[@duelist1954]

Scott Barber, your question won't allow me to reply to you...your settings maybe? Anyway the frizzen/pan cover keeps the priming powder in the pan.

[@scottbarber6694]

Thanks!

[@robiker416B]

I learned so much from your videos. Thanks for making them

[@lmomechtech7709]

Really liked the examples of period style shooting. although more time consuming than cartridge shooting nowadays, I like the 'fun' factor in shooting the ol' way and still getting the job done. Thanks for the vid and I look forward to the next instalment.

[@rebeccaback3287]

Mike excellent shooting! I like the Fusil de chasse smothered bore. I know that packed well with ball and patch and 110 grams charge makes for a excellent target accurate shooting David Back from Menifee county Kentucky

[@Pavia1525]

Great videos. I read your smoothbore article in the last Guns of the Old West and loved it. I have a Pedersoli Indian Trade Musket in .62/20g and would love to see a video on it, if you still have it. I've been struggling with mine to find the perfect load. For some reason it just doesn't like patched round balls. I couldn't get a consistent grouping using patched .600 balls, even with a tight fit and increasing the charge. Paper cartridges I made up actually did a bit better. I obtained some cushioned wads and left the patch off and... magic, ragged hole in the bullseye! 90gr FFg with a lubed overpowder wad, .600 round ball, and overshot wad seemed to do the trick. Not sure why, but what works well in my rifles did not work so well in this smoothbore. Thanks again!

[@johnnottahcal5725]

I too have the Pedersoli Indian Trade rifle. I’ve been slowly.. working on a hunting roundball load. I thought I had it with a 600 and fiberwad sandwich but I can’t duplicate the accuracy this year so..back to the drawing board. I cannot get a patched ball to ahoot minute of barn door. 🙄

[@kenmccoy5582]

Excellent video Mike! Looking forward to the next one.

[@markvandyke3026]

Many but certainly not all of the early smoothbore guns started life as rifles. Many were shot out and freshened many times until there just wasn't enough material left to re rifle the barrel. Also by the time these guns got to that point the large game was pretty much gone and a smoothbore loaded with shot became a very practical gun for the small game that remained.

[@dphillips4351]

I use .570 ball, pillow ticking, a .62 cal Caywood fowler, 70 gr 2f.

[@thatsthewayitgoes9]

That head hit on Evil Roy…. Wow that was FAST. Target ring came .1 second after ignition!!!

[@Bartman2k7]

I've seen an instance of one using a feather stuck into the flash hole while loading to prevent powder from spilling into the flash hole and creating a kind of fuse slowing ignition. Pull the feather just before priming. Valid? Great channel you have going. Thanks for being here

[@duelist1954]

Bart Mann Yes, valid, but probably seldom done for reloading. More often done to seal the charge for the night after the priming was dumped out of the pan...when they weren't sleeping in hostile territory.

[@1717jbs]

Extremely interesting. Thanks.

[@flatophall]

Great shooting Mike!! Fantstic episode.

[@TornadoCrewStormChasers]

Love your videos. Because of your video I also use the .610 and indeed it is more accurate.

[@corto4027]

That's REDCOAT Roy to you, sir! Or Voyageur Roy, whichever side he's playing on at the time. Great video, and sweet smoothbore. Wouldn't mind one myself.

[@tomcurran8470]

People complain about the 1863 Zouave not having a good rear sight and they can't hit anything with it. And here, you have no rear sight and do pretty good! I guess it is worse having a really off-kilter rear sight than no sight at all. We used to use regular shotguns with slugs for deer hunting in Bucks County, PA and could hit fairly good. I'm getting a Zouave smoothbore in .58 so I'll have a round ball "rifle" and 24 gauge shotgun. Look out NC deer!

[@christopherbenton2902]

Hi mike new subscriber. awesome video. good to see someone shooting classic weapons.

[@matthewpering8091]

Very impressive shooting, Mike! Considering that the Fusil is a musket with no rear sight, nor with any way to really sight it in, 4 shots out of 5 is something to be proud of at 50 yards. I think you are very correct in using a .610 ball, since the slight deformation with 110 grains would reduce barrel-bounce. Being only a black powder shooter myself these days, I have always stuck with rifles and revolvers. But seeing this, I may have to build myself a musket. I need a BP shotgun anyway, and if absolutely necessary, one can shoot rocks or sand through a smoothbore in an emergency. Anxiously awaiting part 2. :)

[@scottpatterson7798]

I have a Early English trade gun from North Star West. I can hit the standard target with it all day long . Using 65 grains lube patch, and ball at about 30 yards out. Inch and half to 2 inch groups. A 20 GA gun.

[@drmaudio]

Good video. Looking forward to the shot video.

[@trum4n6969]

Great video, thanks for sharing it!

[@AF-mv8hq]

after thinking about it more, I think the more practical method of lubing a ball would be to "chew it", as I saw in your video about chewed balls. The liquid lube would fill up all the tiny crevices created by the file/sandpaper and act as a sort of grease groove. this way in theory you could load bare balls without wadding material between the ball and bore..so you could get more shots out of the musket before serious fouling has occured...of course this would be horrendously innacurate to the time period, but I too would like to test this method over the traditional military paper cartridge and ball+wad

[@Sinister_Reaper]

How well does the tow hold the load? I usually use paper towel for hunting because it compacts well and makes it seat tight and I can move with the gun down and charge never slides loose

[@deankoerth9298]

Thanks Mike!

[@bigchungus8131]

Damn fine shooting!

[@turlaghdarkstone8824]

We just returned from a trip to Colonial Williamsburg, where I treated my teenaged son to a trip to their musket range. First time firing a gun and he did quite well! On our return I dug out my never completed Tvlle fusil de chase and have started the completion process. Thanks for your channel! Is that a SE PA accent?

[@duelist1954]

I doubt it, I grew up in New England...Vermont and Rhode Island

[@SteveAubrey1762]

Hi Mike, great video, as usual! Say, what kind of jack knife are you using as a patch knife, and where did you get it? It looks like a little German made jack knife that was being sold at a CW sutlers tent years ago. I'd like to get another one. Thanks, MiF

[@robertbrunston5406]

Thank you very muck for the demo.

[@3toepete574]

That Fusil packs a wallop!

[@photoist4672]

thanks your great work unique to KZbin. Using the cut paper option it seems to me the better way to load would be introducing the cut paper opened V down into the muzzle. Trying to get the 1 inch square to center and stay that way seems unnecessarily difficult. What do you think???

[@folday6169]

Mike, interestingly enough David McCullough in his book, “1776”, mentions in the first chapter, as I recall, that the prevalent weapon used by civilian militias in the Revolution was a smoothbore Fowler, which supports what you have been saying. Thought I’d pass it on.

[@johnnottahcal5725]

Hey Mike, Do you think the paper patch-ball holder rides out the barrel on top OR gets blown out ahead? I’ve been using .125 cards but don’t quite trust it to keep the ball secure while still hunting around. Still working on a decent hunting ball load that doesn’t require swabbing between shots.

[@dannypreece8932]

Question. Can Jute or Hemp be used in place of tow?

[@duelist1954]

Yes. You can wad with most anything.

[@danielpowell2266]

Mike i enjoy all of your videos. But i really would love to see you do a video on the brown bess musket. I think it would be very informative.

[@cephasmartin8593]

No do overs is what I like hunting whitetail deer with my trusty young muzzle loader. I say trusty young muzzle loader because it's a modern inline. What can I say, it got me into muzzle loading and I love it because of the challenge.

[@davidbeason3399]

Mike, could you do a video on swan shot?

[@johnendress6534]

Thank you

[@turtlewolfpack6061]

Very useful information indeed!

[@RabidMortal1]

This is great. Now that you have them all together here, the "period correct" methods seem like they make a lot of sense compared to the patched round ball. Because the paper/tow methods are preform best with a larger ball, it seems like the shooter would have always had the option of preforming a quick-load using just the round ball without compromising accuracy too much. Are there any references to loading a bare ball?

[@duelist1954]

RabidMortal1 Sure. Under fire a bare ball, without wadding was often loaded. There are some accounts of guys holding the spare balls in their mouths and spitting them into the bore. The saliva caused powder to stick to the ball, and that light coating was enough to keep it from rolling back out of the fouling roughened barrel...never tried it myself...

[@e.kent.d9561]

Great video, as usual.

[@badgerrrlattin35]

Always wondered what the accuracy was of the classic 18th Century smoothbore. Your work here pleasantly surprised me. By extension I'm assuming the smoothbore , flintlock pistols were also capable of meaningful accuracy.

[@TheGhostrider1959]

What flint are you using in your Tulle? I'm back & forth between a 1in x 1 1/8 in and a 7/8 in by 1 in in mine....just not real sure which on is better...they both perform well....

[@AF-mv8hq]

since I won't have access to my muzzleloaders for a long time, if it isn't too much to ask, could you do a video on lubing a chewed ball as I described in my other comment? Of course this is your channel and love your videos nonetheless! cheers! edit* just caught your most recent video where you descibed a foot of snow!! that's rare where I'm at in Michigan...

[@grendelgrendelsson5493]

Thanks for a great video. What are those insects in the background? Cicadas?

[@jj-ve9wy]

Mike I really like the shirt you are wearing in the video. Did you make it? If not could you share where you picked it up, would like to buy one. Thanks for doing so much of the homework for your viewers. You help us hit the ground running.

[@duelist1954]

Fort Downing Trading Company made that one

[@dahartman88]

have you tried sheep's wool for wadding? it doesn't burn and less likely to have stray burning material

[@duelist1954]

Derek Everyguy No

[@blueskylazer]

From what I can tell the method using tow would be preferred by me. It appears that this method would be the fastest and have as much accuracy as the use of paper or cloth. Is this correct? Are there any records that indicate which method was preferred. The tow seems to load easily without much thought while the paper and cloth may wind up flipping in the barrel, and under stress of battle seems that the tow would be less faulty a method. Thanks for the video. Also, I never thought that most long guns of the 1700s were smooth-bore. I always heard they were rifled.

[@markhazen9521]

Could you use lambs woll Could you use lamb's wool

[@shellmaker10]

Great video. What was the knife used to cut the patch material?

[@Bladeplay]

I'm just getting started with F&I and smoothbores, got the Veterans Arms Fusil. Was wondering your thoughts on that weapon and suggestions for someone just getting started?

[@1uptospeed]

thanks D54,

[@TeamLotus6365]

Mike: For paper card wads, I know you mentioned using target paper, but is there an easily accessible equivalent you can recommend from say, Staples? Also is there a simple formula for determining card dimensions (I've got a .775 fowler (10 gauge) )? Thanks

[@duelist1954]

Almost any paper works. Cheap copy paper should work fine...greasy, well handled old paper works great. I've used .75x1.5-inch paper as well as 1x2-inch paper for 20 Ga, and I've used 1x2-inch paper and 1.25x2.5-inch paper for 12 Ga. I'd try that for 10 ga.

[@brucecycles464]

Could they use wasp paper?

[@lesplieninger5108]

Hey, I love your videos. I just bought a .62 cal Fusil and was wondering what a good diameter ball and charge would be to start with. I plan on shooting patched balls at first. Les

[@falloutpropguy]

I'm sitting here a kind of drunk watching this video and keep trying to swipe the flies away 😂😂

[@mannamedisaak3316]

Lol

[@tedfries8970]

Mike ... hey how do you keep from leading the barrel without any lubed patch?

[@AF-mv8hq]

a question: in theory if you dipped your round balls in melted black powder lube (and let it harden), wrapping it in a paper cartridge, would the musket be easier to clean after many shots or would it basically make no difference?

[@duelist1954]

I don't think it will help, but I have not experimented with it.

[@TheDave570]

Hey Mike, have you ever used a "Chewed Ball" ??????

[@adampotraffke2134]

Where would I go to find a smooth bore flintlock???

[@duelist1954]

Find an 18th Century event near you, like a Market Fair, or Artisan's Show, etc.

[@joshsawyer2622]

Any chance you could do a video on shooting “chewed” round balls on paper targets to show the accuracy of that method? From my understanding it’s a period correct method. Other folks have posted videos of that method on KZbin but not on paper targets from various distances to show accuracy. Great video!

[@duelist1954]

As a matter of fact, I'm on my way out to the range this morning to test some chewed balls

[@joshsawyer2622]

+duelist1954 excellent! I can’t wait to see what your results are like. I’m going to try it once I get my smoothie. Thanks!

[@duelist1954]

I'll have a video up in a few days, but, the bottom line is that chewed balls don't make a difference over smooth balls.

[@gregggibson3109]

Interesting video Mike! Question, how often do you pull the barrel from the stock of the fusil to do maintenance or do you?

[@duelist1954]

Gregg Gibson In the normal course of events, never.

[@gregggibson3109]

duelist1954 That’s what seemed the best option to me as well. I wouldn’t want to risk damaging a valuable and near replaceable stock for nothing. Thanks, and keep up the good work!

[@billmelater6470]

Why didn't they bother putting a rear sight on these guns? Seems like it would be invaluable.

[@CaptainFrankHawks]

technical question. Can you load more than one round ball for a buckshot effect?

[@duelist1954]

You can, but the recoil will be pretty amazing

[@CaptainFrankHawks]

@@duelist1954 I suppose smaller shot would be called for.

[@bds123087]

So I have a question I hope it’s not a dumb one. Where do you get the Flint for a flintlock rifle? Is it natural Flint or does it need to be cut in a certain shape in order to spark correctly? Also where do you find tow?

[@duelist1954]

Brian Simpson You get flint from Muzzleloading vendors...shops, or on-line from places like Dixie Gun Works, or Track of the Wolf. Tow you can get on-line from the woolery.

[@mcarmichael13]

Who makes that range rod you use and how long is it and what thread? That looks like it comes in handy.

[@duelist1954]

mcarmichael13 Track of the Wolf...I'd guess about 45 inches long...8x32

[@lewisward8483]

Just read your article in the July/August 2015 Muzzleloader. and thought I would check out your KZbin Channel. Low and behold I I was laready subscribed to the Duelist! I ave a question. Where can you puchase the flared ramrods? Your the first person to menton them.

[@lewisward8483]

Lewis Ward Duelist, Anyone making those ramrods? Or should I just buy an oversized ramrod and taper myself?

[@duelist1954]

Lewis Ward You start with a half-inch diameter rod and work it down.

[@lewisward8483]

duelist1954 Figured somethin like that. Thanks.

[@duelist1954]

Lewis Ward you'll have to make one from a half-inch rod

[@lewisward8483]

Danka.

[@jolo4369]

Mike where did you get that ramrod

[@duelist1954]

Jo Lo Track of the Wolf

[@pacanis]

I just got my first smoothbore. How do you apply lube to a big square of ticking like you are using? I'm used to using spit patches but want to try mink oil. Thanks

[@duelist1954]

I just rub it over lube in a tin.

[@pacanis]

Thanks. I seem to be missing spots doing it that way. It's too hard to see the lube on the ticking. I had read some guys microwave theirs to distribute it. I guess I just need more practice. @@duelist1954

[@stevelemmen7048]

The front sight only issue doesn't bother me one bit. I shoot slugs with my shotgun with just a bead.

[@peterbasha1]

where do you get toe from for loading ? great videos

[@duelist1954]

Peter Basha At events, but you can go to The Woolery on-line

[@michaelpriest6242]

Do you see any signs of blowby when loading with tow wadding? How about blowing through a shot load?

[@duelist1954]

Michael Priest hard to tell with tow. It always burns a bit.

[@michaelpriest6242]

@@duelist1954 thank you for the quick response. I suspected that was the case. The successor to this video, "Loading with Shot" gave additional great information and fully answered my quandary. Thanks for your informative and interesting videos.

[@nathinlane5426]

In the 18th century were the flintlock pistols originally smooth bore?

[@sandervanduren2779]

munch man depends on the gun. As far as I know, military pistols were pretty much exclusively smooth bore. Civilian pistols could be either smooth or rifled.

[@tmoney007confederation7]

Welp, Fowler Pieces are definitely a civilian firearm for sure! Muskets the military used was way faster to load due to the paper cartridges and the larger bore of the barrel. Also Military Muskets having larger bores than most Fowlers was able to accept buck and ball loads that were effective against human enemy targets. So people have to realize that average Joes used weapons that were not inferior to Military Arms. Most civilian didn't have Military Grade Muskets and rifles among civilians was not common as well. The individual that had rifles were specialized marksmen for professions such as frontiersmen, hunters/trappers, scouts, etc.

[@frankhughes5702]

Hey Mike, I'm going to get a smooth bore . I'm planning on using patched round balls. How will I be recieved at 18th cent. Shoots using patches?

[@duelist1954]

You will be welcomed with open arms. That's how most people shoot them.

[@frankhughes5702]

@@duelist1954 ok...thanks Mike.

[@diktatoralexander88]

How would you recommend using conical bullets in a Colt Percussion special model 1861? 58 caliber. What size would you use?

[@duelist1954]

Robert Neson I am not familiar with a .58 caliber 1861 Colt. Do you mean the Model 1855 revolving rifled musket in .56 caliber?

[@diktatoralexander88]

No. I do not want to show you, because you or someone else might buy it, but I found an auction for an "Colt Special model 1861 percussion musket" Valued at eight hundred to one thousand dollars. I am getting tired of buying replicas, so I am going to buy this. It was made in 1863. Anyway, it is 58 caliber. I was wondering what kind of conicals I could use if I win the auction

[@duelist1954]

Robert Neson I didn't ask you to show me. But I did misunderstand what you were talking about. You are looking at the Colt version of the standard U.S. Army Model 1861 rifled musket. The basic version was made in the Springfield Armory, but Colt, and others, also made them during the war. It takes a standard .58 caliber Minie ball, which is a hollow-based, conical bullet. Sizes vary based on the actual size of your bore. .575" is the smallest and .580" is about the biggest that I've seen. I'd buy a bag of .575" Minies from Track of the Wolf and shoot them. If accuracy is bad try .576", and then .577". I doubt that you'll need bigger than .577" Minie balls

[@diktatoralexander88]

So 575? Okay, I'll go with those.

[@diktatoralexander88]

I am so sorry if I came across as rude. I am on a 300 hundred dollar budget right now, and I really want that rifle. I want to show you the link, but I don't want anyone else looking at it and bidding on the rifle. If you want trough email, I can give you the link.

[@shawntannehill]

Did they also use chewed round balls?

[@duelist1954]

Shawn Tannehill I have seen only a few references to them. I think they are much more of a current fad than a common practice at the time.

[@lifebiker105]

You make me want to become a powder gunner.

[@brettduffy1992]

Can u use pyrodex

[@duelist1954]

No. Pyrodex has too high an ignition point to be reliable in flintlocks.

[@brettduffy1992]

duelist1954 you could just use black powder in the pan and Pyrodex in the musket

[@duelist1954]

Not really. Pyrodex often won’t ignite from the flash in the pan. Some people do duplex loads...10 grains of real black powder to catch the flash, topped with the remainder of a B-P substitute...a lot of bother in my book.

[@abseconPC]

Lehigh Valley Pennsylvania

[@rickyburton4642]

Who is Roy and what did he do to you to deserve that? He’s unarmed too!😳

[@MrAzrancher]

I love black powder shooting, you cant really understand weapons and our gun rights until you relive or revisit what our founders did with these weapons

[@nakoawarrior3186]

If I was shooting I wouldn't care about Period methods,....I'd get some Circlefly wads and use them.

[@jgt4862]

hehe He said bare balls

[@brettduffy1992]

You won't go blind shooting those left-handed with the flash with you

[@josephwalukonis9934]

Gunmakers do make them for left-handed shooters with the lock on the left side. Not period correct as far as I know but allows for left handed shooting.

[@isaaccarranza1039]

Kinda looks like a Brown Bess