Live Breakdown - S2E3 House of the Dragon - the AfterMath

[@stephaniec3987]

The deflation of Daemon making his epic entrance to Harrenhal and then finding no one there to either fight or even threaten is so funny. The show sets up the cool guy entrance, the spooky ruined castle, and then the castellan is just like, ok whatever. What a send up of the "guy who storms out after a fight with his wife and goes off to do some violence" trope. Ser Simon is such a great foil for Daemon's energy. I hope we see more of him.

[@wafflingmean4477]

Daemon was rocking his best Aragorn impression but his audience was more interested in finishing their dinner lol.

[@SvenDzahov]

Simon Strong was such a vibe lol. I go to my dad’s house and watch with him, and his reaction was “if someone stormed in here right now with a sword and a dragon, I think I’d offer them dinner too.”

[@jonhauge-evaldsson783]

Yes! Alys Rivers knows the future. So they also probably knew he was coming.

[@anorbet2514]

With Ser Simon being played by actor Simon Russell Beale I would be both surprised and disappointed if he doesn't get some suitable pages of the script to chew through. Look up some clips of him on youtube.

[@minotaur818]

Rhaenyra has a track record of doing "stunts", being brave but also impulsive - such as flying to Dragonstone to take back the egg from Daemon, running away from the camp, and then sneaking out of the red keep to meet Daemon. I think her sneaking into the Sept to personally speak to Alicent fits her character well, even if it might not be realistic

[@J_Mock92]

I definitely agree. I actually liked the scene tbh, think it fits her character from what we've seen in the past, and I think the acting between Emma D'Arcy and Olivia Cooke was awesome.

[@xqrs213]

I hate that action so much

[@bjrnbrynemo9059]

Yes. This works! Rhaenyra was bold. Sometimes boldness works. It can paralyze the mind of your opponent. Alicent should have used this opportunity to catch Rhanyra, but she couldn't. She had to prosess what had just happened. Humans are not always rational, and Rhanyra knows a thing of two about the mind of Alicent. Had Rhaenyra done this with someone like Cersei on the other hand... game over

[@rai2423]

Fits her character but it felt cheap. Why tf would Rhaenyra and Alicent want to speak to each other at this point of the war? Daemon killed Alicent’s grandson and Aemond killed Rhaenyra’s son. Realistically Alicent would’ve had Rhaenyra killed right there and then and Rhaenyra should be full of hate and anger at this point in the story.

[@minotaur818]

@@rai2423 maybe because both of them know the deaths didnt come from the orders of each of them

[@wafflingmean4477]

The final look on Rhaenyra's face was haunting. That moment as she comes to the horrible realisation that Alicent's right, and it's just too late. But then that small smirk. It's as if she can finally set her conscience aside, being able to genuinely tell herself "I tried the peaceful way out, and I was refused." Everything she does now she can blame on her enemies before she goes to sleep at night.

[@wafflingmean4477]

Gotta hand it to Tom and Ewan. After Season 1, I genuinely couldn't imagine Aegon being able to just waltz in piss drunk and bully Aemond back into shy little brother mode. But somehow it worked so damn well.

[@girlnettles]

This surprised me

[@achohelelwhy]

Haunted Harrenhal absolutely made me think of classic Universal monster movies. Questioning sanity, estrangement, solitude, facing your ghosts, coming to in a place you weren't before. The cinematography, as you said D, along with the rain, the lighting, the lone sinister tree, and the ominous woman speaking in prophecy... that courtyard scene had Tim Burtonesque color saturation. Ugh, I just adored it.

[@banne8834]

I agree. I loved it. It was more sinister and horror...big fan

[@AK-pw3oq]

That was best scene in whole series 😂

[@jamesrobertsiv]

The waitress in the bar was the maidservant that Alicent made drink the moon tea in S1, after Aegon SAd her. I was worried she might have been killed.

[@rexibhazoboa7097]

why give her money then? Worried for nothing

[@wayne47able]

Because you can kill her and take the money back and protect Aegons name... Just maybe...​@@rexibhazoboa7097

[@wayne47able]

The Battle of the God's Eye was also foreshadowed here. When Alys Rivers tells Daemon that, "You will die here," and then we get a subtle shot of the gods eye.

[@glacialimpala]

​@@rexibhazoboa7097I'm confused why would Diana want to be downgraded to a pub wench, surely it's better to have a king weird you out now and then and the queen protects you instead of all sorts of dirty men grabbing your ass

[@TrissTess]

​@@rexibhazoboa7097 Hm, wouldn't say that. I also believed her dead. Especially when Heleana asked for her and Alicent's face expression was like when a mom won't say that your puppy died. (Surely there's a better word for it, it just won't come to me rn) And why give her money but still unalive her? So that she won't try to run away and maybe spread the word till someone can "take care" of her. But in hindsight I was thinking too much of Cersei and how she would handle it.

[@yensid4294]

If we're going with the dragons are nukes analogy, this ep was about a cold war turning hot despite efforts at de-escalation

[@canadianravenbrook]

👌

[@achohelelwhy]

Wouldn't it be... de-eSCALEation? ... I'll see myself out.

[@glacialimpala]

It's as if leaders want peace but then you have two submarines running into each other with comms being down. Oh wait, that happened 😂

[@wallybonejengles5595]

Watching Alicents face at "That's a story about Aegon the Conqeror." "You mean he wasn't talking about my shitheel son? Oh no." You can see in her eyes the moment she's broken and crosses her moral event horizon. Well, I'm too deep to get out now. This whole episode screams, "MY GOD. WHAT HAVE I DONE?" AND THE DAYS GO BY

[@MoonStone_Empress]

I still don't understand how that's what she got from what Viserys said. He never had anything nice to about Aegon, so why would he suddenly change his mind? It's a classic case of someone hearing only what they want to hear and clinging to that.

[@rai2423]

It really annoys me that she got the answer. It felt more poetic that she would go her entire life thinking it was her Aegon, he was talking about. Perhaps if she had heard about it in her old age it would’ve made it even better.

[@MoonStone_Empress]

@rai2423 I like that idea too, but there's just something about having that knowledge while she watches helplessly as everything descends into chaos that seems fitting. Plus now she knows Rhaenyra won't be backing down for any reason.

[@rai2423]

@@MoonStone_Empress She knew that already though. She knew Rhaenyra is genuine and won’t back down, she knew that Viserys loved Rhaenyra and Rhaenyra loved him back so of course his eldest daughter would never give up. I don’t think Alicent needed to talk to Rhaenyra to come to that conclusion.

[@AK-pw3oq]

Even her misunderstanding with Viserys never happened there was always plan to usurp the throne

[@yensid4294]

My favorite scenes were Daemon at Harranhall, especially the ambiguous possible weirwood dream/dragon dream/haunting/enchantment segment

[@taytayqueen7024]

I actually think Aemond is naturally an explosive in his anger. But I think he learnt a serious lesson after the situation with Luke, he’s significantly pulled back now.

[@latishabuckner8231]

I'd say Aemond is very good at controlling his anger. He seems to have quite a few deep rooted issues and he keeps them in check, obedient to the HighTowers. The Luke situation was too good of a chance to settle an old score, so he took it.

[@taytayqueen7024]

@@latishabuckner8231 I think he is in s2. But in s1 he causes alot of stir. Dinner scene he escalated situations for no particular reason. He’s def an angry man.

[@latishabuckner8231]

@@taytayqueen7024 Jace and Luke were laughing at the pig on the table and it was easy to guess they were remembering when they made fun of Aemond. In turn he mocked their parentage. This isn't uncommon for teenagers and Aemond had more than enough reason to provoke them. If somebody took my eye, I would hold a grudge too. Just saying! And I'm not saying he's not angry, just that he's got a tighter lid on it than his uncle.

[@rexibhazoboa7097]

@@taytayqueen7024 He escalated it for no particular reason? Common, if you dont find his reason good enough, sure say that, but don't straight-up lie that he did it for no reason.

[@rai2423]

@@latishabuckner8231I mean Aemond can only blame himself for his eye. No one told him to try and kill Jace with a rock 😂

[@J_Mock92]

Thr Helaena and Alicent scene was _definitely_ my "scene of the week." I'm "Team Black" (if I had to choose, as both sides make mistakes and commit atrocities), but I just LOVE Helaena. The fact that she's even considering the grief of the smallfolk (and not just by saying that they suffer when war happens), by acknowledging that common-born mothers probably lose far more children and babies than high-born ladies, absolutely broke my heart. I actually replayed the scene multiple times while watching the episode, because I started to tear up, and I really wanted to let it sink in. The actress playing her (Phia I think is her name) is absolutely KILLING it with her performance this season!

[@canadianravenbrook]

Yes she's a skilled actress

[@wallybonejengles5595]

I'm gonna defend that scene and say that our Queen has disguise proficiency on her character sheet. She learned it from Daemon in season one. Who is a master of doin dirt in a black hoodie. She has had years to develop and hone this skill. This doesn't break my immersion. Like how did Barristan get in and out of Duskendale with a madman slumped over his shoulder AND kill like fiddy men? George will never write that POV, and we all know why. It's goshdern flippin impossible, no disrespect to the Badass. I buy Rhaenera sneaking in. I dont buy Alicent caring that much about her own life at this point to not try and snatch a hoes veil and take her down with her. The scene could have used a couple agents from the Blacks by the exits or something.

[@canadianravenbrook]

Yeah we've seen Tyrion escape death and King's Landing's dungeons, plus many more wild events in GOT

[@WatashiMachineFullCycle]

For me, it's not that I don't think Rhaenyra would risk her person to speak with Alicent face to face (and I did enjoy the dialogue between the two very much, that scene was SO well acted) because she has precedent in her youth of being very impulsive, and she strikes me as the kind of person who would do anything to guard her children but not necessarily herself. For me, it's that after Daemon snuck in so easily and got cutthroats into the red keep, that nobody on the docks is keeping an eye on who comes in and who goes. You would think security would be MUCH tighter. My favourite part of the episode has to be the Harrenhal bits, FINALLY it's just as spooky as we all knew it was. Also the ROOTS in the WALLS!!! Ryan is a believer in the blood thesis

[@stephaniec3987]

I skipped the show intro earlier so I wouldn't be delayed for the chat, but I noticed on the rewatch that they _are_ adding sections to the embroidery of the opening credits as I had hoped they would throughout the season yay

[@CameronkAK]

It's interesting how the world treats Aemond as a born monster yet we see that in the entire show, there are probably only two people who actually make an effort to get along with him - Cole and a paid prostitute, who he seems to have lost this episode.

[@canadianravenbrook]

I think his brother values and cares for him to a degree... But it's definitely a dysfunctional relationship to say the least

[@SB-yp8vp]

That girl that got smacked in the rear was definitely Dyana

[@Darksun93]

My favorite part of this episode was the Harenhal spooky vision. Loving the look of Harenhal. So creepy.

[@kylerdavis8083]

3 episodes of Condall showing us that you can sneak into anywhere and do anything you want. The writings so bad even GRRM had to step in and say there are two canons.

[@J_Mock92]

I think the "messes" that young Rhaenyra had to clean up was partly a nod to her flying to Dragonstone to retrieve the egg he took in season 1, but even moreso a nod to her lying to Alicent about him "touching her" in Season 1 Ep4 when questioned about her virtue, because that relates to the "Sister Rhaenyra" scene later when Alicent swears on her own mother's memory. Some of the story telling and dialogue in this episode was a bit heavy-handed, but that was one if the more subtle things that I noticed (and I bet there's plenty more upon a rewatch).

[@girlnettles]

Ooooh yes!! Those were perfect examples! Thanks for the reminder!

[@J_Mock92]

@@girlnettles thanks! Those were definitely the first two things that came to my mind, though I'm sure there's probably more nods to things we've already seen on screen if we really think about it. I'll admit that the writing felt a little uneven in this episode, so the blatant things kinda made some of the more subtle things get lost in the shuffle (if that makes sense). I still loved the episode though!

[@glacialimpala]

The king also didn't press for what happened to Rhea Royce, possibly due to Rhaenyras influence since Viserys didn't like Daemon at that time.

[@ben_jamin197]

What a treat to see Simon Russell Beale show up as Simon Strong. A knight on and off screen.

[@foxmlder2379]

Your episodes are so carefully curated. Thank you, David, for providing so many people the space to engage with this material with such amazing, intelligent, hilarious people (including yourself)

[@deirdre7721]

The pay off for Rhaenyra was the knowledge of knowing her father didn’t not change his mind about her being the Queen. She has been taunted since knowing that her brother was made King

[@rai2423]

We didn’t need that though. Rhaenyra already knew her father had not changed his mind, she didn’t need to talk to Alicent to come to that conclusion. Rhaenyra knows her father the best out of everyone and she knew till the very end. That scene had no pay off. I think we can all agree with that.

[@achohelelwhy]

@rai2423 Eh, from that perspective, we didn't need that, no. But it did serve in another way... Alicent now knows she was wrong, and can't hold on to "it was Viserys' dying wish" while playing the dutiful dowager. Rhanerya now knows it wasn't Alicent lying, but that it was Alicent misunderstanding ASOIAF, because she wasn't privy to that knowledge. This will probably be pivotal for Alicent's motivation moving forward- she can't stop the wheel from turning. And as the audience, we needed that scene between the two just talking to figure out the misunderstanding.

[@rai2423]

@@achohelelwhy Why do we need Alicent to know she was wrong? What purpose does it serve? Surely as a writer you would want to save that for when it’s truly too late. Not before the action has even started. It feels very comic bookish and cheesy 🤷‍♂️

[@achohelelwhy]

@rai2423 It already is too late. Otto, the only one who might listen before spinning it, is gone. Aegon's bloodlust can not be tamed, Criston is in the field trying to prove himself, and Aemond is unstable with the biggest weapon at his disposal. Alicent is helpless to do anything, and now knowing she was wrong adds a layer of complexity to her character- before, she was self-righteous and holding up the wish of her husband. Now she knows she has nothing solid to stand on, and that is going to drive her into madness.

[@rai2423]

@@achohelelwhy I think losing her children and grandchildren is enough to drive her insane. I’m not going to spoil anything. But there are many things coming up that will drive her up the wall. This isn’t really one of them. She never wanted Rhaenyra to be queen. The time skip literally started with Alicent berating Aegon about him being king one day and Rhaenyra wanting to kill him and his future kids. She doesn’t need the moral high ground to find conviction. She had already made up her mind before Viserys died. What difference does this really make in the grand scheme of things? Nothing much. B

[@mariesueme8807]

Also I think that Rhaenyra took a gamble, but an informed one. Sure, she could have killed Alicent before the guards took her, but mostly because she knows Alicent. We don't know exactly what the letter said, but I'm willing to bet Rhaenyra felt quite confident Alicent would not give her up. She doesn't even seem to discuss the possibility of Alicent calling the guarda on her when she's talking to Myssaria. In the books it would hve been suicidal, but hiven they're relationship in the show I'm gonna go with she knows Alicent still cares for her and tv logic. As for what do we gaign from this scene, I think Rhaenyra needed that push to actually wage the war. Not only is she confident in hes fathers support, she's reminded of Aegon's prophecy and how this is much bigger. Considering the character they are going for they needed to give her that push so she can actually accept the war. I mean it sucks because it's way more interesting to have flawed charactes that set the kingdom ablaze because of their entitlement to a chair, but this is the Rhaenyra they're going for

[@DavidLightbringer]

I think that's right I just wasn't grabbed by it

[@mariesueme8807]

​@@DavidLightbringer absolutely valid, to be honest it's not my favorite episode either, but I understand why they did it that way for show purposes

[@nyahmariekabiling4197]

seasmoke is restless, made me a bit sad because it clearly implies that leanor is dead

[@doctorajaguar]

Yes, definitetly.

[@rai2423]

Makes me wonder why they didn’t just kill him in season 1 instead of the whole escape plan only for him not to reappear ever again…

[@IzzyAndAndy]

@@rai2423i think it will serve as another point of helplessness for Rhaenyra in this war. She tries to do the right thing time and time again, and even when she succeeds (letting Laenor go instead of killing him), it was all for nothing in the end because he died across the sea, away from his family and his dragon. He can’t even be laid to rest properly.

[@rai2423]

@@IzzyAndAndy I guess that could be interesting. I just wish they would stop trying to whitewash these characters. I miss the ruthlessness of the books/GOT. I was really hoping that them letting him leave meant he would come back.

[@Magmafrost13]

"Who was the greenseer before Bloodraven" tbh I think the overwhelmingly most-likely answer is that it was some wildling rando we've never heard of

[@girlnettles]

My guess 🤷🏾‍♀️ But I’m going to dig deeper into this theory since it may come up again. I need to watch Gray’s video

[@KingEdwardMMVIII]

My favorite part of what seemed like a set up episode was the beginning cut from "you wouldnt dare" to dude with a spear through his neck in the mud. Im ready to see some serious action. This is the end of soft Rhaenyra.

[@glacialimpala]

It's not even about her rage or need for revenge, if she believes in the Song she HAS TO win and save the world 😢

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

@@glacialimpala she is boring

[@canadianravenbrook]

Yes! This was a great set up and scene change. So cinematic

[@wafflingmean4477]

I think Rhaenyra's spy mission worked really well to be honest. Rhaenyra initially kept Alicent from crying out by threatening her with the dagger, and by the end of the conversation Alicent was reminded enough of their former friendship that she didn't alert the guards, since she knew it would get her best friend murdered. And while it was a huge risk, that's what Rhaenyra was banking on to get her out of there. Rhaenyra has shown she genuinely cares about avoiding the war, and is placing her children's lives above her own, and at the least thinks she cares for sparing the smallfolk from the coming carnage. Risking her own life for a chance at saving many more is in character for her, especially given this was to prevent the war, not win the war. Now that she knows the war is happening regardless, it would make very little sense if she does something like this again, but honestly this first time I think it works.

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

dumb scene, both alicent and rhaenyra should take their family side always not this dumb best friend angle after 10 years lmao

[@daisybean7109]

I loved David getting so excited about Alys Rivers 😂❤

[@A1B2C3D4E5F-c]

Daemon getting visions from the weirwood was one of the best scenes in all of hotd and got.

[@noahh2338]

Another banger, I saved this one because I knew it would be good..love you 3 when you're throwing the ideas around!

[@jbfromaz]

Ulf could be Baelon’s son. Alyssa died after the birth of her third son. She was really young. I think Daemon was still a toddler. Baelon died like 20 years after Alyssa.

[@WatashiMachineFullCycle]

honestly yeah, out of everybody to pick as the father of Ulf or Hugh, Baelon makes the most sense to me!

[@glacialimpala]

​@@WatashiMachineFullCycleI can't imagine Ulf on a dragon, but I doubt the show introduces him for nothing. I expected Larys to kill him at the pub because he's spitting all sorts of rumors

[@cosmicriptid]

Yeah he def seems the type to be loyal to his wife, he seemed to really love Alyssa, but she did die young and it makes sense he would have sought out companionship in the years after.

[@eldric.stoneskin]

I felt like most of Rhaenas issue with returning to Pentos was because it was the place her mother died

[@rubberduck524]

I also think she was old enough when her mother died to realize that the hospitality her parents received were due to their full grown dragons and potential protection and weaponry they provide Pentos. Pentos is safe from Westerosi threats but sending a dragonless teenager to raise two young children and dragons in a foreign court is not the safe bet Rhanerya implies it is.

[@samf.s.7731]

That's so true, you make an excellent point. It's a place where she experienced a personal tragedy so it's natural she doesn't want to go back there.

[@rexibhazoboa7097]

@@rubberduck524 Pentos will accept them with open arms. Those dragons will grow and they will treat pentos as their home. They would be foolish to be unhappy.

[@rubberduck524]

Oh yes they would welcome those children and that dragon but oh the Pentoshi would never sell a young Princess of the blood in an advantageous marriage, manipulate these children during their long stay through covert threats, try and make some money off information about these dragons to some interested Westerosi court….like they do 180 years in the future. Its the safest bet but its by no means without danger, could Rhanerya spare an adult loyal advisor with wisdom of The Game to accompany the children she would.

[@wafflingmean4477]

I think Aegon reminding his friends of their new Kingsguard vows wasn't just to establish respect or feigned respectful attitude. The creepy smile he gives makes me think Aegon enjoyed their little freakout when they all stopped laughing and thought he was serious. Breaking the Kingsguard vows is punishable by death. They had just confessed intent to break them, for Aegon to remind them, seeming deadly serious for a moment. Aegon just threatened to execute all of his closest friends for accepting a promotion he gave them. Then he goes out partying with them like it's nothing, proving they're all still suck ups and will let him walk over them because he's the king. "Oh I dare. And I find it stimulating."

[@DavidLightbringer]

good analysis

[@canadianravenbrook]

The "you're gonna die here" was almost as unexpected as the cockadoodledoo job 😳

[@shunjay2978]

lol.. the cockadoodledo job took me out. My mouth was on the floor 😮

[@rexibhazoboa7097]

@@FaithAndRepentance it was the voice pitch that threw me off. But that could just be the actor's voice.

[@canadianravenbrook]

@@FaithAndRepentance it was definitely not as well done as it could have been. Felt a little hokey like a spoof of the Ring or something

[@mochrimek]

@@FaithAndRepentanceshe sounded VERY American to my ears. Talk about being out of place, was it intentional?

[@rai2423]

@@rexibhazoboa7097It wasn’t. There’s a lot we can say about GOT but the scenes were always well acted out and the dialogue was seamless even at it’s worst. I can’t say it for this show. The pace is sometimes off and there are too many weird anticlimactic scenes where the dialogue isn’t hitting the way it’s supposed to.

[@tgovani]

Can’t believe Aegon said Kingsguard? No, Tau Kappa Gamma

[@yensid4294]

I think Corlys (sp?) is just traditional, he wants a male heir to carry on the name. He said last season that nobody remembers your blood, they remember your name when the legitimacy of Rhaenyra's sons came up. Wanting a mature male heir who can defend/protect his House's holdings doesn't seem out of character

[@glacialimpala]

Some legitimizing coming up but if I understand the laws, king has to approve. Will Rhae approve Baela and Rhaeyna losing Driftmark to Corlys' bastard?

[@MrHws5mp]

What I was waiting for our hosts to say, but they never quite got there, is that Corlys is sexist, but not misogynistic. He doesn't have that visceral _hate_ for women that makes misogynists insult and disrespect them (and far worse), but he's still a male product of a patriarchal society and it's assumptions are just baked into him.

[@glacialimpala]

@@MrHws5mp It's also a fact that neither his grand daughters nor grandsons know how to work a boat, much less command a fleet. And now that the war has come there's no time to teach them either.

[@canadianravenbrook]

When Nettles said "I like a little mess. I like a little spice." 😅😂 Felt that

[@Addam_]

Alicent's "You know what Aemond is" comment to Rhaenyra at the end. Jesus.

[@BasilHagens]

Ironic too since only Silvi does

[@stephaniec3987]

She has these frequent little moments where the audience is shown she sees the flaws in herself and those around her very well, which makes it that much more frustrating every time she chooses self-delusional decisions.

[@canadianravenbrook]

​@@stephaniec3987yep

[@rexibhazoboa7097]

I forget that she still doesn't know Aemond didn't intend to kill Luke.

[@doctorajaguar]

She knew what Aegon was too and put him on the throne 🤦🏼‍♀️

[@Lightstar449]

Ulf the white casting is great. New man from phone shop😂

[@aneisleeper5515]

I don't think Alicent is in denial at the end. She's just making it a point that nothing can be done, we're past that, so it's as is "there was no mistake". She's just shocked and realises that she's trapped in the quiproquo.

[@claudia_acvs1901]

If she did she would have to assume the responsibility of her actions being the domino effect that killed two children and she can’t obviously admit to that now

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

why is she bashing aemond all the time

[@Jermrants]

Ser Simon is now probably my favourite character on this show 😂😅

[@daisybean7109]

Gotta love House Strong 💪🏼

[@girlnettles]

I LOVE Simon

[@Jermrants]

@@daisybean7109 “Majority” of house strong I should say😅 bar Larys who is just a complete freak lol

[@Conorp77]

Simon Russell Beale is such a great actor.

[@mr.e.knight42]

So, Patel (director of this episode) is confirming that those were Dany's eggs we saw in E3. Retcon confirmed. Via Screenrant: In House of the Dragon season 2, episode 3, Rhaenyra Targaryen sends three of her sons, along with Rhaena Targaryen, to the Vale for safety. She also gives Rhaena four eggs, and director Geeta Vasant Patel confirmed they are Daenerys' dragon eggs, saying: " Those are Daenerys' eggs . All of us who work on this show are big Game of Thrones fans, so it was very exciting to shoot that scene."

[@DavidLightbringer]

yeah it's kind of lame but it doesn't really affect the story so I'm just going to ignore it

[@mr.e.knight42]

@@DavidLightbringer I always liked the lore with Elissa Farman. I don't like that they did this either. Do you think they mixed up which Rhaena was which?

[@wafflingmean4477]

I reckon Alicent didn't tell Gwayne anything about her relationship with Criston. I think both Otto and Gwayne have figured it out on their own already just from being in their general vicinity. Otto just didn't want to hear it out loud, and Gwayne after seeing Alicent grant Criston her favour likely gathers something more is going on between them but doesn't want to out his sister, and could relish being able to blackmail the Hand of the King who just stole his father's job.

[@elizabethkruse8947]

Daemon crying because he actually feels so bad about Jahearys in the dream was the best scene for me. It shows that he does have a heart and a conscience, and that when he admits it was a mistake to Rhaneyra, he really meant it. It shows that when people deny things, sometimes it means they can't admit it to themselves let alone someone else, which is why she had to pry it out of him. I feel like when he sees little Jahearys and young Rhaneyra, he also sees that he is hurting his own house. And we all know Daemon lovessss being a Targaryen. This dream scene creates so much more depth to his character and showed us a side we have not seen yet. It might be one of the only things he's ever done that he truly regrets.

[@Valkanna.Nublet]

"We march on King's Landing and take the throne." "The throne?" "It's a big chair, made of swords." I was really hoping he'd add "but that's not important right now".

[@debragrogan6235]

My eyes rolled so far back in my head at this line. Garbage writing. He has totally legitimate reasons for asking 'the throne?' and Daemon's answer is just dumb fan service meme-making on the part of the writers.

[@aleksandrakosla8524]

There was Diane in the inn where Ulf were with the Dornish and Aegon came in. Poor girl, wonder if she has any kids (yeah I remember moon tea, not 100% effective contraception).

[@Daniella040]

Daemon in Harrenhal reminded me of Link walking through the castle in Hyrule.. or Dark souls and Alys on that..My favourite part of the episode.

[@jeffreym8503]

I'm sorry and please correct me if I'm wrong but when the king marries someone isn't the queen consort referred to as your grace?....so if rheanera is queen then why wouldn't the king consort (which daemon is) not referred be to as your grace?

[@leykimayri]

Nope, she's referred as your majesty or ma'am

[@arde29]

That's because of the implications which are also still applied in real life monarchies - The highest title is that of a King (Your Grace in HOTD, Your Majesty in real life), his wife, a queen consort, derives her title and form of address (Your Grace/Your Majesty) from the King's authority and power. If a queen in her own right, a queen regnant, is the monarch, there can't be a King consort as this would make seem that the consort holds the superior title, so he is usually ranked lower than The Queen. Now, Westeros does not have a precedent for a female monarch so the title and form of address for her consort is not established - people already have a harder time accepting a female monarch, let alone calling her consort King (I would assume). A female consort however would be perfectly acceptable based on precedent and the point I made above regarding consorts to a King.

[@jeffreym8503]

@@leykimayri in the show they never referred to allicent as anything other than your grace while she was married to viserys so I'm not sure what you are talking about here

[@jeffreym8503]

@@arde29 I think the fact that they (meaning Westeros) never had a queen ruling them before that they don't have a precedent for it!..but I feel like in world he should be referred to as your grace but maybe that's just me!?...thank you thought for your comment it was very informative

[@leykimayri]

@@jeffreym8503 I was talking about real life. As for the show, you have already got your answer why by @arde29

[@Dredaybay]

I think they just needed a scene between the two actresses for this season

[@wallybonejengles5595]

Harrenhal is the Goth kids dream castle yo. All it needs is a way to get the blood running UP the walls.

[@JaayCeez]

Pretty sure it already has that in a lot of those walls if you crack them lol.

[@akiameaart]

just started, but IT WASN'T THE RED KEEP IT WAS THE SEPT, which is way more open/believable. And it was useful because Alicent learned she was wrong about the king changing his mind!!!! ETA - also Daemon just snuck into the city the same way with Mysaria's help to do B&C, and nobody thinks that's out of the realm of possibility.

[@BasilHagens]

I don't mind the long build up, but next weeks episode looks straight up sick

[@lisajoseph796]

Aemon has mommy issues. Kristen Cole has it on Allisentt. You see how he said "put on my cloak" and almost demanded her favor before he left for war. Allisentt still gets manipulated. The episode is about the setup for war.

[@girlnettles]

Yes, I like how you said that. And you’re right. Alicent DOES still get manipulated

[@rai2423]

The way he demanded for her favour was so creepy. That’s why he hates Rhaenyra so much. He couldn’t control her the same way he can Alicent.

[@girlnettles]

@@rai2423 bingo!

[@panajotov]

Eve Best was good this episode. She delivered her lines extremely well, as always. But in this episode, her performance has moved me more than before.

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

worse written char on the show, always bashes others but has the most small folk killed from everybody till now

[@klarakhan]

also. Rhaenys naming off all the ways the war could have started is so hilarious, considering she blasted through the floor and killed all those smallfolk. Very convenient of her to forget about that tiny detail

[@bellefleursauvage]

I got “let’s go beyond the wall and get a wight” vibes from GOT with the whole sept scene.

[@girlnettles]

Omg 😂😂😂😂😂

[@rai2423]

Yup

[@SoilToSoul]

I am totally digging the Greenseer tinfoil, and definitely looking forward to the collab! Actually doesn't seem that far fetched in the big picture of things to me. 🤷🏼‍♀ Great stream y'all. I watch almost everything but just don't comment often.

[@yensid4294]

Mysaria: she's had a rough & tumble life & has probably been a thief and/or sex worker since a young age. Both dangerous professions due to their low social status. It wouldn't be unheard of for a client to get violent. What didn't make sense to me was Rhaenyra making her Mistress of Whispers & wanting intel on the Red Keep when by her own admission (to Daemon) her spy network was dismantled. It was shown that Larys cleaned house & replaced all the servants with HIS people. So that decision was odd to me. Not saying she doesn't know the habits of certain people like Allicent going to the Sept but beyond that she doesn't have any inside info about The Greens or their plans. (It might be helpful to know what brothels the 2 princes frequent & pay someone to poison them but that's not going to happen)

[@efrent-vr3bm]

I think the last scene of the series will be Alicent or Helaena weaving the intro tapestry. I feel the show will change Helaena's ending

[@edwinbaez32]

“You guys don’t speak Valyrian!?” 😂

[@jbfromaz]

I hope we will see Alysanne Blackwood (Black Aly) soon! She was said to have shot Ser Amos Bracken with a weirwood arrow at the Battle of the Burning Mill. It was after he slew Samuel who was her brother.

[@rai2423]

I don’t think we will. We haven’t seen Sarah Snow either…

[@sanusilamido2342]

Guys love the stream.. in my humble opinion maybe you should consider taking it scene by scene so we dont end up missing anything

[@GehennaDreams13]

I was telling my husband about house Lothston in the episode with the bats and his morning when I was talking about how crazy cursed Harrenhall is.

[@antjestube8774]

You nailed it! The vibe of Daemon leaving being the guy who got into his car drunk is exactly what the director says she was going for (interview on HBO GOT podcast for this episode at about 1h15min)!

[@shreyakar9220]

Emma is not a former, they are a stage actor still. Emma's latest stage show "Bluets" ended last week. Oh what I would give to see her live in front of my eyes , only if I was in UK right now.

[@shreyakar9220]

My bad, what i would give to see them on stage.

[@anorangetabby]

Well, now I can't go pee, because I have to stay and supervise the hearsay (you're about to commit Tim!). 😂😂😂

[@DavidLightbringer]

lol it's funny cuz it's true hahaha

[@anorangetabby]

​@@DavidLightbringer Yes, it is. 😂

[@chicotheworld9763]

i definitely agree with Tim about the rhaenyra alicent meeting... it requires too much of a suspension of belief. It was worse than the rhaenys wedding crasher scene. At least that had a made for twitter moment effect to it. I did like the look on alicents face when faced with the realization she started all this for noooooothing. But yeah, I hope the sneaking into the city stops being a thing for future plot lines. I dont like how easily it is explained away.

[@LSChestersMom]

Love your show, thank you! Love the ep and love that final scene- it reminds us what is at the heart of all the loss we are about to experience... without the heart none of the dragon stuff, wars , will not really matter. They are keeping the friendship at the hearts so when this all goes crazy we care.

[@girlnettles]

Very insightful. We need to care! Yes, good point

[@mariesueme8807]

Also Rhaenyra was left to deal with the mess Daemon made by taking her to the brothel when she was younger. Even having to convince Rhaenys of supporting Lucerys after letting her believe her son had died suspiciously while he just went straight for semi decapitation.

[@girlnettles]

Oooooooh yess! Those were big clean-up jobs! Thanks for the reminder

[@zacharygrinacoff9543]

Second best scene… Blackwood vs Bracken. What a start to the episode! Seems like any attempt to avoid all out war was futile after that scene.

[@milenabianca9787]

I live in the UK soccer is huge here and there are teams that always fight and need extra police. For some reason they have been rivals for years but no one can really remember why, it just gets handed down. Thats what this episode reminded me of…. TLDR go Lions 😂 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

[@b0baf00t8]

I love these recaps. Its nice to hear other people's opinions about scenes, but also some people notice things in a scene that i may have overlooked.

[@SteezLouise]

Anyone else notice Cristina’s army heading south out of Kings landing? What a commander.

[@canadianravenbrook]

I'm literally on the same page as Nettles in terms of disbelief suspension. I already surrendered to this... So for a second or so I'm like gah this didn't happen this is too meta to have them meet on screen and Alicent walk away... But...I went along with it for what it was. And it's sad.

[@canadianravenbrook]

Yeah that bar scene was hilarious in the suspense second of "did he hear am I about to die" 😅

[@wayne47able]

The Battle Above the God's Eye was also foreshadowed here. When Alys Rivers tells Daemon that, "You will die here," and then we get a subtle shot of the gods eye.

[@DavidLightbringer]

yeah that's what I took from it

[@ramixaleandros5893]

Great stream as always. Love the recap streams, best part of the week.

[@sarah-janesiberry5445]

Did anyone notice when adam picked up the crab in the last episode when seasmoke flew over... maybe stating the second crab feeder killed Laenor

[@YenShively]

Ooooo innnnteresting!

[@jonhauge-evaldsson783]

All of you three are so fuckking good!!! You three together is magic! Thank you so much! ❤😊❤

[@paulstrife]

I hated the sneaking in plot so much. Even if you suspend disbelief, Alicent still would have her killed at the end. Her grandson was just beheaded.

[@canadianravenbrook]

One of my absolute most favourite things about the world is them showing mature and middle aged + actors as well as children. So great. So many talented people are on screen every episode and season in both Hot D and GOT. Daddy Dae Dae could get it eternally. Duh.

[@Liizardqueen90]

Family should not be allowed to visit 11am mondays. Shattered i miss you guys live but still a fantastic stream 👏

[@jsan3743]

She cleaned up his mess when he stole the egg

[@GehennaDreams13]

Samwell Blackwood was the little boy from season 1 grown up to be the Lord. Sam was reported because he was Lord Blackwood. Now his son Ben will take over the lordship.

[@alliward6040]

I think they are setting up the Aegon upcoming “accident”/ debilitating injury as a purposeful thing with Aemond responsible. The mocking in the brothel, the tension with Larys whispering to Aemond about Alisent and Aemond plotting about ruling in his stead when he went off to fight w Cristin Cole… major set ups coming. Brother tension happening

[@doctorajaguar]

I agree.

[@aworldofmoirairene7655]

I love seeing Nettles jamming to the intro because that's exactly what I'm doing!!!

[@DoktaVODKA]

Why didn't Viserys raise his daughter, to be like his AWESOME mother Allyssa. Like Visenya who ruled for Aegon, was a swordswoman. In a society where the Kings were knighted, why didn't she learn swordsmanship? She could have inherited Blackfyre when Viserys grew so ill. The rules don't apply to the Dragon. As someone wanting to see the Conquest first, so I could the True First Queen. It just kind of seems like some things are getting glossed over to fit a narrative. The society is a Patriarchy, the Targaryens are above normal men.

[@DavidLightbringer]

yeah i was just reading about Alyssa. She's awesome, wish she was around for Rhaenyra

[@sillylittlesheepjax6009]

bec not every woman in the show needs to be a girlboss

[@MI75436]

I would love Raynera to have been an archer! Like real historical sarmatian women, who are mounted archers (on a horse) who are the tribe where the term amazons comes from. But I love that Bayla has a crossbow

[@JDNization]

Mysaria’s scar isn’t a mystery. I’m not sure why that gets brought up. What caused the scar is irrelevant. The relevancy comes from the fact that Rhaenyra just realised who Mysaria was and her history with Daemon. It was Rhaenyra cementing the fact that she can’t trust Daemon anymore because here is another woman he abused and tossed aside when it suited him. The scar could be from a hanging or slave collar. Doesn’t matter. It was a reminder to Rhaenyra of who Daemon really is.

[@canadianravenbrook]

I think Daemon actually sees Rhaenyra in the dream / vision as a younger version of her because that's the version of her he was most connected to or got closest to first and had that romantic spark with. People often remember folks as that sort of first impactful time / age they were in their memories. I also get him seeing her still and forever as a child in some respects. Parts of self complex here and in interplay.

[@klarakhan]

THANK YOU FOR THE STREAM, TIM, NETTLES AND OFC DAVID! I was smiling and laughing so much throughout this one. I've been waiting for a friend to return from sweden so we can watch the show together, so I am catching up with everything HOTD-related this week ! Have been looking forward to this stream and it did not disappoint!

[@jsan3743]

Yeah, I’ve done some crazy sh!t sleepwalking. The worst was I plugged in a curling iron and put it in on a sweater. I’m super lucky it only burned the sweater

[@lucaschapel7197]

I'm so digging the rad bromance between David Lightbringer and Michael Talks About Stuff. If anyone should be producing an ASOIAF TV show, it's them.

[@T_strizzle]

Dumb thought but do yall think poor ceraxes was left out in the rain all night :(

[@girlnettles]

😂

[@dominiclusetti546]

They somewhat wrote Rhaenyra into a corner and needed her to get answers so they had her go to Kings Landing

[@SB-yp8vp]

I thought the conversation with Alicent and Rhaenyra worked because it was clunky and real. Conversations are not perfect and they often do start poorly especially when there is emotions. They got to the point which was, it’s too late. That’s the tragedy of this scene. It is pointless, and finally Rhaenyra sees it.

[@multimediafan6777]

I immediately thought Ulf lied... I don't understand why people believe him😭😭😭

[@nakiaverner-soprano]

Wonderful livestream with great analysis and conversation!❤

[@jaythebookfiend1541]

Pausing 2:15:25 -ish to let the stars clear from head-GWT just compared Ulf to Tom Bombadil, I’m **swooning** This is why this is my after-show.

[@anorangetabby]

I haven't been through all the comments yet, but in case this wasn't said yet, yes, the girl in the tavern that Ulf and his bros are drinking at IS Dyana. Memory jogger, Dyana was the serving girl that Aegon assaulted in season one.

[@girlnettles]

Got it!

[@Noct_Snow]

Nettles comment about cheering vs wailing immediately brings me to Jordan Peel’s “Nope.” To some it would sound like cheers as the monster flew away but it’s actually the wailing of the swallowed. Pretty cool.