Why Is Sony Pushing Horizon So Much? - Luke Reacts

[@ethandesangles]

The Horizon series is the gaming equivalent of the Avatar films, they make a lot of money and sell a ton of units/tickets but have almost no cultural impact whatsoever.

[@princerawat4297]

Seriously bro, the 1st time I actually watched Avatar finally Kind of was underwhelmed because I have seen way better sci fi movies and stories But It was just good or decent all people watch it for is the Eye candy and even that sometimes feel uncamny to me same goes for Horizon game I saw the gane 1st time on youtube and flabbergasted with such a good artstyle, graphics and even world setting is interesting and good and has lot of potential thn I found out whole characterization and story is sooo mediocre MAN

[@Apfeljunge666]

@@princerawat4297 the story and characters are fantastic and some key moments make me cry even on repeated playthroughs. finding out how the old world ended, what was done with Project Zero Dawn and the final fate of the Alphas was really good stuff.

[@GiangNguyen-j7q]

The first game is quite good but the 2nd one is so blatant

[@quatreraberbawinner2628]

They're technically impressive but narratively vacuous, aloy is a boring character the people you talk to are boring, the world is boring

[@shibernyan2009]

Eh, gotta disagree, don't think Horizon has seen a comparable amount of success in the gaming industry as the Avatar movies did in the film industry (nr 1 and nr 3 highest grossing ever). I also disagree with the general idea that a good movie should have a cultural impact of any kind. I'd argue most movies that are widely considered to be among the best movies ever made, don't have that effect on people (like Avatar, The Shawshank Redemption, Gladiator and many more). Not everything good needs to make people revolve their entire lives and hobbies around them like Star Wars, Marvel, LOTR etc.

[@marlow21]

it is popular because everytime a new horizon game comes out there is a possibility that a new critically acclaimed video game will be launched alongside it (e.g. BOTW,Elden Ring)

[@THEONETRUEOVERLORD]

I can’t wait for Horizon 3 because that means a new genre defining game is going to come out a long side it.

[@mirusasaki]

​@@THEONETRUEOVERLORDI would love to be on board with that but they need to hire better writers. For a narrative driven game, they already failed the bare minimum.

[@andresvalenzuela160]

​@@mirusasakithe joke is we don't care about the next Horizon, we just want to see what will be the groundbreaking masterpiece releasing right alongside it 🤣

[@misunderstood781981]

@@marlow21 lol burn 😆

[@Patheticbutharmless]

My take is that this is Sony's way of saying...."Monster Hunter"???? We've got that. Lookihere! Since the game is fully owned by Sony and the profits go to it directly. They gained the development costs some time ago so it's all profit from here. They undermine the pricepoint of a upcoming release with a similar theme, doing sales again and again to satisfy a urge they perceive might be building with the imminent arrival of and hype around, Monster Hunter Wilds.

[@elbandito2990]

The biggest game that is seemingly popular, yet no one talks about

[@waynewayne8419]

People like the game, no one has to create video essays on it every single time lol

[@Bakemer94]

​@@waynewayne8419 Me and my step-dads favourite series right now. This is my first time telling the world I liked it. Probably a lot more like me.

[@berkertugrul9055]

I have a very big friend group that are all gamers, we play even the single player games togather (someone plays it and streams it on discord) and we always recommend games to each other. In that 20-25 people group i have never seen any one of them play or recommend any of the horizon games. Im sure its a fine game but it just looks like a tech demo that is not an actual game... doesnt seem fun to me.

[@igobywitty]

Its actually great, but if you speak on the story it literally spoils the way the game tells the story. It would ruin the game if you played it. Reminds me of soma, great game but if i tell you the story and why it is so great… it ruins the game since half the fun is the enthralling story. With horizon, the gameplay is great but the trickle of the story and how the world comes to be is so damn cool and interesting. Aloy is a mary sue and they make it apparent as to why in the story so its not like a rey from starwars just being set up with no build.

[@elmatasesues3630]

And nobody finishes it, nor does all the sidequests. I didn’t bother with the second one, owing to the fact that the first was so damn boring, the worldbuilding and concepts basic and in parts forced, and which basically nullifies the appeal of side activities activities l.

[@LateSleeper]

My issue with Aloy harkens back to the first game. She was an outcast and wants acceptance from people. So, I thought they're going with "Anyone can be great if you work hard and persevere. You don't need to be a chosen one to be a hero." Then it turns out she was a chosen one, which kinda undermined that whole thing. Edit: OMG, she's basically Naruto...

[@grafphal5103]

And both are Orange ...

[@Mediados]

I really liked Horizon, but I admit, less for the story and far more for the unique setting and worldbuilding. The story was good, but nothing extraordinary.

[@cyxceven]

Yeah. A lot of gamers are getting older, and getting bored of the same hero tropes. No one talks about Horizon the way they talk about something like Monster Hunter.

[@Skycube100]

But at least Naruto has a personality and has had moments where he has to learn new skills, new lessons, etc. Aloy is sure, much like Naruto, the chosen one, but God dang, she's so boring. She barely has fun with her new buddies because she almost always goes on her own, which makes sense gameplay-wise, but of course, it'll make your boring character more boring. The world, the outfits, the culture, the Zoids, all of which have so much charm, and then we get to the characters and Aloy herself which are like a bunch of Aiden Pierces from Watch Dogs

[@chriscollins3225]

And Naruto is very successful huh

[@Aussie_Tom]

As someone who loves Zero Dawn, and to a lesser extent Forbidden West, I really don't get it. As much as I like them I recognize why people don't, and the games were never popular enough to warrant such a focus on the franchise.

[@solidkwon]

Sales numbers are rly high for this franchise. Not just the games but the Lego figurines and the overall merchandise. So that’s probably what Sony sees

[@Mediados]

Horizon is great, but it hasn't been such a bombing success that you could build it up into a full-scale franchise like they're trying to accomplish. If they succeed then I'd be glad since I really like the world, but I doubt it will.

[@GodChaos333]

It’s just very hard to appeal to others who don’t care. Not everyone is into hunting robot Dinosaurs. They rather play monster hunter. I am in the middle I don’t think it’s bad, but It’s not god of war iconic or anything.

[@sartavin]

How is nearly 35 million copies across two games not 'popular'?

[@sammybosak10]

​​@@sartavinIt's popular but not that popular compared to its other competitors in the open world games. And btw it's not that profitable because of the massive marketing budget and making pretty looking detailed open world games doesn't come cheap. And the Merchandise sales are pretty bad for a huge budget franchise no wonder why Sony is trying their best to promote this franchise to make it more mainstream and increase profitability.

[@PlazDreamweaver]

Sony desperately attempting to force Horizon into the mainstream is like someone trying to convince their non-reciprocal crush to love them back-they know their efforts will end in failure, but they're blinded by what could be. Sony wants Horizon to be their LoZ; I don't see that being successful. Edit: I commented this before you mentioned Hulst trying to force Horizon into pop culture. It just goes to show how clear Hulst's failure is.

[@LethalMlTCH]

They’re not forcing anything. The game is great it’s probably my favorite PlayStation exclusive.

[@Anthony-pq4vr]

whats LoZ?

[@aerus3446]

Its interesting that, at the time a few years before development on HZD began, Monster Hunter had released very successful games on the PSP (MHF, MHF2, MHFU, and MHP3rd) all of these games were part of the top 20 best sellers on that console and it was a huge reason why there was so many sales in Japan for both the console and the games, MHP3rd was a phenomenon when it launched exclusively in Japan. Yet when the devs wanted to work on the successor of Monster Hunter 2 which came out on the PS2, they wanted to initially launch it on PS3, but the development cost was high due to the Cell architecture of the PS3, I dont know what really happened behind doors but probably Sony did not want to contribute to the development of Monster Hunter Tri which led the franchise to be adopted by Nintendo and restarting a huge chunk of its development, this was a bad decision, and was the most likely reason why the PS Vita didnt succeed, since MH moved on to develop multiple games on 3DS (MH3U port, MH4U, and MHXX), all of which were console sellers and sales juggernaut in Japan. This could also be the cause to the huge decrease of Sony console sales in Japan which Nintendo took from Sony in the 3DS/Vita gen. Not only was MH Tri ignored by Sony, also Capcom wanted to localize MHP3rd to the west but Sony denied the decision, so it never happened, at the time there was a huge push by the fans to localize MHP3rd and back then, this push to localize MHP3rd was called Operation Cherry Blossom. Its really interesting, since later on, when Monster Hunter XX was a Japan exclusive title, the fans once again asked for Capcom to localize this new game which came out on the 3DS, and to show interest in localizing the game the fans opened a change org website and hashtag MHXXForTheWest or a similar tag, and Capcom this time took the decision to localize the game for the west. The localized version is called Monster Hunter Generations Ultimate which came out on the Nintendo Switch. MH Tri came out in 2009 on the Nintendo Wii, and as far as I know Horizon Zero Dawn began development in 2011, taking some inspiration from MH but more focused in storytelling and open world, however in Japan it did not succeed nearly as much as MH, which could have worried Sony and made them reinforce the conclusion that Japanese gaming market was failing and conclude that the west was the next step in gaming. All of these factors could have contributed to Sony pushing for westernization for an entire console generation (PS3), and then rebranding that bad idea for the next two console generations (PS4 and PS5), and moving PlayStation's main HQ to California.

[@ericriley1985]

@@Anthony-pq4vr Legend of Zelda

[@simonl5074]

bro, it made more money than bloodborne, get your head out of your ass, you may not like it but it's a commercial success

[@aquapendulum]

Short answer: It's Hermen Hulst's OTHER baby.

[@TimereSanguinem]

Difference is this one is actually good, definitely not star wars level of potential though 😂😂😂

[@lm4585]

Bingo.

[@poonpoon1604]

Isnt it also because the time it came out there was a huge single player vs live service stuff at the time? So it just rode that wave to success back then

[@THESRVNT]

pretty sure this is the only reason. Horizon is a great game don't get me wrong but we are over it now, time to move on!

[@Zer0Hour17]

This is an industry plant game. It apparently sells millions of copies but the only time anyone talks about it is when they post the edit of Nikacado Avacado as Aloy.

[@rjd543]

They made her look just like him

[@upon-fe2720]

​@@rjd543 guarantee Aloy is out of your league and then some.

[@Sukaiba69]

@@NothingElseMattersJM Because the whole video and comments' topic is forced to be Horizon you rusted doorknob

[@IIIIAmSHODAN]

@@upon-fe2720 what a weirdly autistic cope. I expect nothing less from someone who watched and enjoyed Adventure Time.

[@stefanowens6761]

Zero Dawn alone has sold 24 million copies 🤐

[@F34RDSoldier805]

(typed before I got to that part, but he mentions this) The only reason I think that Sony is pushing Horizon so much is because Hermen Hulst, the CEO of Playstation, is also a co-founder of Guerrilla Games. It isn't any more complicated then that. Remember, Concord was Hulst's baby, which is why they put SOOOO much money into it. And they are pushing Horizon just as hard if not so harder. Hmmm, what a mystery the reason for the Horizon push is, right? Nope. It's obvious.

[@tomgames8616]

Most of the Horizon stuff was planned before Hulst was promoted to a CEO.

[@Bookish1995]

Wow you are so clever, right?

[@thetrilltroll7633]

​@tomgames8616 also, they looked at the sales... the first game sold over 24million copies and it was a brand new ip. So it's not surprising they've been trying to profit off an incredibly successful ip

[@waynewayne8419]

First horizon sold 24 mil copies, you guys are just terrible at anything concerning business and jump on any conspiracy

[@MercerVerse]

@waynewayne8419 Exactly. It's not my thing but it clearly sells.

[@harrisonmode8046]

This is the Avatar of gaming - I’m told it’s popular but I know no one who actually thinks it’s amazing

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

That’s like the biggest compliment you can get. Avatar statistically one of if not the biggest movie franchise of all time. Horizon not quite on that level in terms of sales but still very popular and extremely profitable

[@tipidpn3559]

​​@@Thanosdidtherighthingdude, are you a bot or keyboard warrior? you go to every comments to fight. Just touch some grass or at least play some games you enjoy. Instead of picking up fights with random internet strangers. That wont make your life happier.

[@gopalarora9997]

I think its great, the first one is a masterpiece and did almost everything that GoT gets a lot of credit for, but some things it did better than GoT.

[@gh0stparad0x3]

I think it's amazing

[@shibernyan2009]

Avatar's amazing, the first one is my personal favorite movie of all time. But also, I don't think that's a good comparison at all. The Avatar movies are both in the top 3 highest grossing movies of all time, Horizon isn't top anything for as far as I know.

[@jfwalken]

No, it is just Alloy is Sony's only premiere human character that is still active and liked. PlayStation Roster: Kratos is done until further notice, Drake is done until further notice, Who would they promote in tLoU: Joel is dead Abby is disliked by a majority of tLoU 1 fans, Ellie is a protag/antag that slaughters cities worth people but stops at her target for reasons, Jin isnt the main character in the sequel, Peter is partly Disney. Deacon St. John was a one off Deslin is done and 13 years old.

[@joshua7734]

@@jfwalken a couple incels on Reddit is not ‘the majority of TLoU fans’ lol

[@CIA_Informant_number_8629]

​@@joshua7734anyone who does not like your slop is a incel. Please prove me wrong and define incel for us

[@Leonkennedy19992]

Kratos is far from done.

[@smathews731]

​​@@joshua7734 I'm willing to bet if you took a poll and asked people who played The Last of Us 2 if they liked Abby, way over half would say no

[@LethalMlTCH]

@@joshua7734u underestimate how many people dislike Abby. Plus disliking her doesn’t make someone a incel.

[@egalart]

I think as of today, Sony’s “Mario” should be Ratchet and Clank

[@foberdud7576]

Ratchet & clank lost relevancy soon after the ppl at insomniac lost the balls to tell a joke someone might be offended by. Lifelong R&C fan btw

[@goddamnarshia]

Should be astrobot honestly. Deal with characters like mario and astrobot is that since they don't talk, there is no language barrier, thus easier adoption. The tom and jerry and road runner effect.

[@aru5117]

I'd expect nothing less when it was made under the same guy who invested in a whole Amazon animation for Concord.

[@Mediados]

I can only imagine how much they paid Amazon for them to make a whole episode just for them.

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

Too bad Horizon sold 33 million units so facts don’t care about your feelings.

[@carlopanella5855]

@@Thanosdidtherighthing well concord sold 250 000 units so facts dont care about your feelings sony dickrider

[@aru5117]

@@Thanosdidtherighthing Except Forbidden West sold dramatically less, about 8 mil compared to the original 24 mil. Never you mind the VR game hardly sold, and the forced crossovers. Stop.

[@kaytee7607]

“Muh babeyyy”🤣

[@xX_JGGJ_Xx]

Ive grown to genuinely despise this mid franchise due to sony giving it so much unwarranted attention to it instead of giving attention to its other ips like gravity rush or infamous and so on

[@joshuamagruder2241]

Fuuuuuuck a modern Infamous would be sick.

[@NothingElseMattersJM]

I LOVE the infamous games but let’s do some math shall we ? Horizon more than quadruple the sales of all the infamous games combined.

[@guccii_daddyy]

@@joshuamagruder2241 a modern infamous would be the game called Forspoken. The voice acting isn’t too good but the combat is actually very fun

[@nelsonsham2368]

​@@NothingElseMattersJMif we do that math, Sony should Stop selling exclusive and try to get a share of Call of Duty somehow, cuz none of the Playstation Title gonna beat that

[@splashydiamond]

Because Herman Hulst was the director at Guerilla Games and he created Horizon by spending 7 years of his life on it. Now that he's the head of Playstation, he gets/wants to push his baby up as much as possible to feel good, boost his ego and not feel bad about losing an enormous amount of his limited adulthood life on a boring game.

[@RomnysGonzalez]

Pretty much yea. Is like his Baby and he's doing the best he can to show it and put it on the spotlight regardless if the game is a masterpiece hit or not because he's proud of it like any father would be and would overvalue their kids

[@Atrocitez]

100% that's what it is. Horizon as a franchise is good, but not that good.

[@Mr.K.dilkington1965]

@@Atrocitezit is though!

[@UltraGreenNo.57]

It's good, but there are plenty of other franchises that have potential. The sequel was no go for me. Personally, the first should just stand to its time.

[@dantealighieri4543]

​@@Atrocitezexactly, it's good but nowhere near a flagship title like God of War, The Last of Us, Uncharted or any other IP from PlayStation.

[@ishaanmurarka9082]

It is a mid game that looks pretty. Most people buy it just for looking at its prettiness and then forget about it. I liked played it once but it was immediately forgotten.

[@SuperNeos2]

The most interesting part about Horizon is the backstory on how the machines came to be. You know, the completely missable story that most players won’t get to fully experience due to 90% of players not going for collectibles

[@blinkusfishus2052]

Better experienced in youtube lore video's than actually playing it for now.

[@bepkororoti8019]

Merchandizing! Merchandizing! Horizon, the Lunch Box! Horizon, the Bikini Collection! HORIZON, THE FLAMETHROWERRRRRRRR!

[@Scrahdabley]

killzone died for this....

[@klasyk1532]

Yes!....HZD alome sold almost 7x's better than the whole KZ frnchise

[@SackboySupreme]

@@Scrahdabley Horizon is a much better series though and it’s not even that good

[@DV-ou1yu]

Only KZ2 is good, 3 was ok and Shadow Fall sucked. Never play KZ1.

[@OneRandomVictory]

The entire Killzone franchise combined didn't sell as much as Zero Dawn did. Heck, the sequel is probably at or around that point too. Killzone was not as popular as people like to tout it being.

[@solidkwon]

@@Scrahdabley I love the Killzone games (except Shadow Fall blech), but I am so freaking glad Guerilla decided to go with Horizon instead. Just like how I love Resistance but am so glad Insomniac went on to do Spider-Man And just like how I love Uncharted but am so glad Naughty Dog went on to do The Last of Us Thats what I love about Playstation teams. They make an amazing franchise and instead of being slaved to that IP forever, after some iterations they continue to make other amazing IPs

[@codyd13]

Kratos's character has always struggled with his own psyche and existence. Constantly wanting to end is own life for his actions

[@Dae...]

He's right. The writing was so bad for the main story compared to the first Horizon

[@TheForbidden_1ne]

That’s crazy because the story to the first game bored the hell outta me lol that’s rough

[@rclaws3230]

​@@TheForbidden_1neSeconded. There was nothing to the first game's story. The fifth time I was sent out on a side quest to hunt down someone's lost boyfriend and was delivered a vapid word salad lecture, I had to put it down. There's nothing to the story.

[@TheForbidden_1ne]

@@rclaws3230 yea I tried forcing myself to TRY to power through the storyline but I was already turned off by the intro (playing as young Aloy). The dialog was uninteresting. The mission structure was definitely boring…. I mean the game had a cool ass premise but after 5 hours I tapped out.

[@GraveUypo]

holy crap it's WORSE? the first one was terrible!

[@rogerlee4126]

I thought first one is good though.

[@grownconch1327]

I don't think the Mary Sue is the problem, since good games can get away with that kind of character. It's when the game is trying to present itself as a compelling story that make people mad.

[@GreenBro11]

The thing about Aloy in Horizon is that she herself is the least interesting character in the cast. Every other character that plays off her is so much more compelling while Aloy for the most part’s only character flaw is her obsession with saving the world.

[@gabrielgomez5528]

There are times i wonder if that was done on purpose. If you look at Elisabeth (since aloy is a clone) she was kinda like that too. No friends, trying to do everything herself, pushing people away to focus on her work. That's what I'm thinking though, and could be wrong

[@solidkwon]

@@GreenBro11 I feel such an odd man out in these conversations cause I find Aloy to be such an interesting character She wrestled with having the burden of outshining everyone as an outcast, then processing the grief and vengeful feelings about the loss of her mentor as the world falls apart around her and now looks to her for guideance. She sometimes has this imposter syndrome as she realizes who she is the clone of, and as she realizes more about the past and more about then other tribes. She reluctantly ends up an inspiration to others but she doesn’t understand how to engage with people because she has had to survive outside of society for more than half her life. I think she’s a really interesting character that’s rarely seen in video game storytelling

[@joshleftthechat3497]

@@solidkwonI agree. She’s like the lone wanderer in Westerns but isnt given as many moments to do awesome stuff or be solemn so people view her as stiff. In reality she has a bunch of conflicting emotions not really explored before but not focused on either until the second game

[@solidkwon]

@@joshleftthechat3497 I think a really great character moment for Aloy in Forbidden West is after she collects the fireworks technology in Las Vegas. She doesnt save the world by doing this but she ends up giving the people there an incredible display of technology and entertainment and she actually learns that life can be an enjoyable thing, and not just a battle for survival/recognition There’s a moment that lingers in which she just looks up at the fireworks, and smiles. I think after the Las Vegas section Aloy is softer around others, more willing to listen and engage with more trivial requests and she’s less laser-focused on saving the world

[@lm4585]

She had no growth in FW. She kept leaving her friends after they saved the world together as if she had no allies or acceptance anymore. She is also the reason Vraal died.

[@mullaoslo]

They gave given me both games for free (first one wasn't even ps plus just free.. I tried the first one but I can't get into it.. It's just pretty, I don't care about the world or characters

[@blessanabey5575]

Aye aye mateys.

[@Concobbers]

Felt the same about the first one. The second one is way better in terms of gameplay and open world exploration. Story and characters still suck.

[@MrCFH420]

Yes siiiir

[@NothingElseMattersJM]

@@MrCFH420 Still sold 33 million copies though.

[@MrCFH420]

@ One of those copies is on my shelf. I’ve tried it four times and couldn’t get into it.

[@nicholasvaccaro4826]

According to the insomniac leak horizon forbidden west was used as an experiment to see how much sales would be impacted by putting a game in their subscription service closer to launch and sales took a significant hit due to that according to internal documents in the insomniac leak

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

Still sold 33 million overall as a franchise.

[@patrickr.1433]

or maybe also bc it was an uninspired sequel and people foresaw it

[@nicholasvaccaro4826]

@@patrickr.1433 could be but the data shows a massive loss for the game vs others that’s probably why games like ragnorok or gt7 never made the jump after to ps+

[@Kolya-687]

What initially drew me to the Horizon games back in 2017 was the art style, the setting, and some aspects of the gameplay. However, as I’ve grown older and started playing other games with a stronger focus on gameplay (like Elden Ring, which was an absolute blast), I began to notice the differences between the games I’ve experienced. Having played games that I found much more enjoyable, I’ve become more aware of the flaws that made the Horizon games feel so forgettable to me.

[@sergioajbs1840]

the first game sold very well, the second did not sell as much but enough to remain relevant.

[@roncrudup2110]

I got the first free during PlayStation play event. I actually bought the second one. I like the franchise but not my favorite.

[@patrickroni4038]

8.5 million sales in 2 years

[@123fakestreet3]

Kirby creator has a lot of influence with Nintendo but doesn't make every other game Kirby.

[@RomnysGonzalez]

You need to put a * on it because Horizon one was sold as a bundle with the PS4 early on and the only way to buy a PS4 was with Horizon on it and that severely inflate the sold data of the game

[@NaviRyan]

I remember the second one in the beginning it reintroduces the first game side characters didn’t remember any of them, except for maybe the king guy. The only two I remembered are aloy and lance riddicks character. After finishing the second game all I remember is aloy 1/2, and lance riddick.seriously it’s a game about giant robot monsters and a hunter gatherer civilization and every civilization is either boring or just the same old criticism of capitalism that has nothing to say as it’s for a $80 game for a gaming conglomerate.

[@iriasu1667]

imagine Miyazaki as Playstation CEO...

[@LordSnake21]

@@iriasu1667 idk if that where to happen he wouldn't be able to make anymore would games he would have to focus on PlayStation

[@whosaidthat84]

Not everything needs to be a Souls-like

[@mup8661]

​@@whosaidthat84Yeah but the man has vision and knows how to execute.

[@whosaidthat84]

@@mup8661 as a game developer. Not trying to discredit him but running a whole company will take him away from the Souls games and it's a totally different beast.

[@mup8661]

@@whosaidthat84 yeah that's true. Running a studio vs a multifaceted mega corp is totally different 😅

[@greedowins]

The protagonist lady looks remarkably similar with a lego shaped head.

[@wilihey1425]

doesnt have beard hairs tho 😢

[@Skycube100]

@@wilihey1425 Modders:... WRITE THAT DOWN WRITE THAT DOWN

[@Fraulein_Sausageball]

lol

[@greedowins]

@@Fraulein_Sausageball ngl, I expected a "ha ha", not a "lol"

[@Fraulein_Sausageball]

@@greedowins I know it's a lazy response, I just wanted to boost the comment because I thought it was funny and couldn't think of anything else to say.

[@hihihi1q23]

Horizon Zero Dawn is apparently the best selling first party playstation title of all time. Above stuff like God of War, Uncharted, Last of Us, etc. That's pretty much all there is to it. Aloy is the also the only major heroic original character Playstation has. Kratos, Joel, the ghost of tsushima dude, Ellie are all tied to ultra gruesome games and have dark stories.

[@Susanoo7108]

That's actually a good point. Other than Ratchet & Clank and Nathan Drake, she really is one of the more family friendly mascots PlayStation has among their photorealistic characters

[@TenaciousDougie]

Are they counting the copies they gave away for free? 😂

[@MaidenlessScrub]

@@TenaciousDougieyeah they gotta be counting the copies that went bundled with the PS4 as well. No way in hell a game sold this much got talk about so little. Like even for Avatar, people think the movies are mediocre at best besides the visuals, but at least they’re talked about a lot. Horizon? I don’t hear a thing.

[@petersonofleo11]

@@MaidenlessScrub Like Silvio Dante said "Timeline got fucked up". Horizon games sell a lot but of course people are not going to talk too much about them because the two main titles came when Breath of the Wild and Elden Ring came out.

[@sidneysimons2738]

I absolutely love Horizon. If the quality of the 3rd mainline game doesn’t drop, I’m all for getting some spin-offs, and I’ll definitely check them all out.

[@keysersoze9592]

I spent $0 on this franchise and somehow have both games in my catalogue. I got zero dawn for free during covid and FW came bundled w my ps5. They’ve been pushing this game for quite a long time

[@thetrilltroll7633]

Yes, when you haven't bought a game as soon as it releases, years later they will be heavily discounted or the sequel will be bundled with the new console. Spiderman and gow have also done this...

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

Yes years later after it already sold extremely well lol

[@keysersoze9592]

@ the forbidden west bundle came out the same time FW did.

[@MihaiKrieger]

I loved the HZD story. HFW, the gameplay is improved but tbe Story is worse. And i even forgot about the clone thing.

[@keysersoze9592]

@@MihaiKrieger i agree, and with Luke as well. I actually enjoy the gameplay a lot. My first playthrough i literally skipped the cutscenes, i never do that. And i never play multiplayer, i am a single player narrative focused gamer but i just didnt give a crap about these characters.

[@infesteddeebs]

This is a very easy question to answer by just rephrasing it. Why is Sony pushing the highest selling first party game that they've ever made so hard? It sold more copies than God of War, Spiderman, Uncharted, Ghost of Tsushima, The Last of Us... Why wouldn't they be pushing it?

[@synthiandrakon]

People are so bizarre about horizon, it's one of like 4 active third party franchises song has, why the fuck wouldn't they push it? And whilst it's definitely lacking in some areas it's not like a bad game, it's pretty damn good for what it is.

[@TheAmazingVector]

I don't think it's fair to say that Aloy began as a Mary Sue but Forbidden West really flips that switch and never goes back.

[@noirknight9770]

Horizon will forever be known as that game that released the same time as BOTW and its second game the same time as Elden Ring

[@DerrickOlejownik-z6i]

@@noirknight9770 Don’t forget, Destiny 2 Witch Queen dropped the same week as Elden Ring. Destiny was in a great spot around that time so that probably took potential players from Horizon as well

[@TheEffectOfMass]

I agree with a lot of the points. The first game had a really interesting setting and fairly in depth lore I found captivating. The overall narrative was predictable, but I forgave it for everything else they did. But the second one was just a little lack luster. The story was ok, the setting was the same and they had a tough act to follow. But the combat and gear progression just got stale after about 8 hours. As a parent though, I could play the Lego one with my kid. Good bonding time.

[@overtheclouds2926]

Watching Arcane season 2. Love how violet is strong. But she is scared and anxious, more and more but she still strong enough to take of herself and make the hard decisions.

[@Mediados]

Vi is scared of being left alone again. She can feel how everyone around her changes because of their tragedies in life, while she wants everything to stay as it is.

[@THEONETRUEOVERLORD]

Hmmm it’s almost like well written characters are received better.

[@cynthiahembree3957]

@@THEONETRUEOVERLORD Who'd of thought

[@JeremyDeere]

The horizon lore is one of the coolest. I just got a PS5 for my birthday and forbidden west was the first game I bought. It's been a great experience so far. I'm loving it. Thankfully lots of the games i bought for my ps4 came with ps5 copies as well.

[@corvus6381]

Someone mentioning Kratos when talking about Characters with no flaws is WILD considering that not only do his games focus heavily on them (and get clearer and clearer about that as time goes on) but also did he get a whole dlc thats basically just "All the other characteras force him to therapy so maybe he stops hating himself" LMAO

[@techsoly]

A lot of the sales for Forbidden west came from the PS5 bundle that included the game btw. During and after COVID forbidden west was the ONLY bundle that was available in retailers and on playstation so that boosted a significant amount of sales for the franchise and Sony thought that was representative that people love the series when it was the only way to get a PS5 during that time. Almost all my friends have the game because if they wanted a PS5 they couldn't buy the console by itself, it HAD to be the bundle.

[@ghostlyabra9011]

I was honestly surprised to find out that it was Lego's idea to make the game and I cant blame Sony for doing it if that's the case, the tallneck lego set must've sold pretty well

[@knoxklay11]

The term Mary Sue can also be used for obvious self-inserts, but yeah this concept plus the super impossibly strong girlboss bs usually go hand-in-hand.

[@lostsheep4205]

I loved OG Horizon. I agree Forbidden west the grind system and poor script writing didn’t click. I still enjoyed FW with combat, weapons and exploration and many fun things to do but it’s not a game I’m going to do a 2nd play though. It’s a game to pickup on sale if you haven’t played it but not a FP. I’m getting Lego and their MP game as i enjoy the universe but hoping they fix up their systems and story writing

[@guccii_daddyy]

Weird because the second game felt so much better. The voice acting and the characters were improved. The combat and exploration were improved. The graphics made the game so good looking i actually stopped just too look for a few minutes. Also the music is peak. The story in both games are decent but not groundbreaking. I think people need to replay forbidden west

[@DanLuxe]

Love you man but you just don't get the upgrade/parts/drops system in Horizion. There is NO luck. You need to kill the right kind of robots that have the parts (use scan/look in the Notebook), and for certain parts you need to shot the robots in certain, well... specific parts (use scan/look in the Notebook). There is no drop/chance/luck system to it.

[@ar1sm70]

Yeah it was clear from his review that he never game the game the time of day. He kept spamming hunter bow arrows and calling the machines sponges lol... Obviously the game didn't click for him, which is fine, but his review was disingenuous at best.

[@aidenwrath1402]

They blew their storytelling load on the first game though and don’t really have anything interesting left for the IP if Forbidden West was any indication lmao

[@nicholasvaccaro4826]

Imo a horizon prequel that’s a gritty shooter based on the hopeless war against the machines would be cool and could be a darker take on war showing regular civilians fighting and dying could be like the under rated spec ops the line in showing devastation of war

[@chriscollins3225]

Then you aren't paying attention

[@hihihi1q23]

The IP definitely has tons of potential, they just need to switch to a different character like the new Ghost is doing.

[@chriscollins3225]

@hihihi1q23 nah I love aloy they need to finish her character arc in part 3

[@nicholasvaccaro4826]

@@hihihi1q23 I agree like the current world of horizon is interesting but u could do a prequel to the og war of humans vs the machines or even something more sci fi since they introduced the zeniths in forbidden west like there is 3 different styles of worlds to explore in this 1 ip current formula space sci fi stuff or traditional military shooter

[@Alucard2356]

Meanwhile, Bloodborne is just sitting right there. Free money for just making a PC port of it.

[@whillb]

Horizon will NOT be the IP they want it to be. There's only one character of any consequence. No specific locations or anything like that. Fantastic game, but totally a one-off.

[@waynewayne8419]

As long as it keeps selling I doubt they’ll care.

[@JokerJK-jg1gi]

I think it could be, if they kept the robots and maybe the forest areas and remade everything else. Just reboot it to 50 years before the lord and savior Alloy descends and the "dress like a clown" trend started.

[@Pix_PT]

​@@JokerJK-jg1giyeah but what was happening in the world regarding the lore before she was born? Only if they make a spinoff in another part of the world where people are trying to explore old world ruins by themselves and find something different. Now that could be intertesting aswell

[@JokerJK-jg1gi]

@@Pix_PT You didnt get what i meant. The lore SUCKS, so drop it, go back to the simpler times of robots and nature taking over the planet and start fresh

[@ShiftNova]

I loved the first game, but I can't say the same for the second. The story could have been a hell of allot better.

[@lejenddairy]

It’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but if you’re a big sci fi nerd then it’s a great series. Horizon Forbidden West came out the same year Elden Ring and God of War Ragnarok came out as well, which is a huge reason it went under the radar.

[@abnormalnox]

Yea. There are a LOT of fans. We just keep to our community. The comments here are the main reason

[@cynthiahembree3957]

Respectfully people that are big Sci-f nerds have better options at the moment. Horizon is not a terrible game but I'm also not gonna say it's a massive one either

[@firstnamelastnamesb]

It happened to both of them- Zero Dawn released in 2017, which was an insanely loaded year, too.

[@captainamerica6545]

Its sold millions of copies. It’s objectively massively. That doesn’t mean it’s good but its reach is undeniable.

[@abnormalnox]

@captainamerica6545 like i said. There are a LOT fans. We just keep to ourselves. And yea people genuinely do not believe we exist.

[@solidkwon]

So I cannot disagree Luke’s point more about Aloy not having vulnerabilities in Forbidden West and that they did it by projecting it onto the other clone. I dont know why he ended up viewing it this way when there are clear moments in the game in which Aloy has internal struggles with her identity as a clone of Elizabeth, as someone who so many others look to as a savior but she struggles with accepting help, to the point that it leads to a serious loss of who is arguably her best friend. She comes out on top of most situations like Batman would, but no one would claim Batman has no vulnerabilities. These characters just tend to have their story arcs depend on how they present a stoic brave face against impossible odds and situations

[@336Rochelle]

YES THANK YOU FOR SAYING THIS ❤

[@PumKnH3D]

As of late, Luke has just been hating on everything Playstation. Keeps finding more ways to hate. He literally has around 20 vids just hating on Concord alone. Not saying the game doesn't deserve hate, but jeez, bro needs to chill

[@rogerlee4126]

@@PumKnH3DHatred and controversy gain views

[@sammybosak10]

​@@PumKnH3DHating on Concord gets easy views and it's fun to make criticism about the game because of the blunders from absurd budget to ridiculous character design. I am telling you Concord will be studied for years on how not to make a videogame.

[@JayzVeez]

Thank you. I doubt Luke even bothered to finish Forbidden West. I'd say its in FW that Aloy fails the most. She's outmanoeuvred multiple times and is forced to start letting people in because she realises what she's trying to do is too much for one person alone. Either he didn't finish it or he's just settled on a bad take to farm some outrage for extra views. Luke is the least credible authority on gaming after Asmongold.

[@clover4925]

Playstation when it comes to pushing Bloodborne: *abandoned corpse Playstation when pushing either boring ok-enough games or completely unwanted garbage: "TAKE MY MONEY!!"

[@genericyoutubeaccount579]

If you just look at steam statistics only 1/4 of people who start Zero Dawn end up finishing it. So I don't know why you would buy Forbidden West if you can't be bothered to finish the 1st installment of a story heavy franchise. About 10% of people can't even complete the initial cutscene (probably due to their computer being too slow and old). The only problem I had with Zero Dawn and Forbidden West was that the side quests tended to have subpar voice acting, subpar animations, and subpar writing quality compared to the main quest line. This was an issue in both games. Everything else was superb. For those wondering 4 out of 5 people who buy Forbidden West never make it to the Daunt which is to say that they never finished the tutorial/introductory cutscene section of the game. And again only 1/4 end up completing the game.

[@BTRshow]

Clearly because Herman Hulst is the CEO of playstation and former co-founder of Guerrilla (makers of horizon). The issue isnt just the internal conflict/conflicting interest of Herman Hulst Green lighting 2 seperate horizon GAAS projects while cancelling Twisted metal, the last of us online, and a online spiderman game. The issue is also Herman Hulst green lit Concord, aqcuiring firewalk (saying concord will be the new star wars), fairgame$, marathon, and is Green lighting the aggressive push to forcing PSN on PC players. Herman Hulst is KILLING playstation infront of our eyes and the fact he is allowed to get away with it is ASTONISHING, as it is heartbreaking (im a playstation fan)

[@waynewayne8419]

Killing PlayStation in what way?

[@CIA_Informant_number_8629]

​@@waynewayne8419Herman is like what Don Matrick did to Xbox, except Playstation does not have Microsoft money to bounce back and recover

[@izumolee6714]

The whole PSN on PC is so blown out of proportion. The only thing that sucks about it is that there are countries that don't have access to PSN and that is where Sony is fumbling. PSN for console players is like 'whatever, we set it and forget it' since it automatically logs us into PSN every time we turn on the console. Sometimes a lot of console players even forget it exists. So this whole outrage about PSN on PC isn't any different than logging onto Steam or whatever, it's just another hoop to go through and once you set it up, it's 'whatever'. Again it only sucks for the countries who don't have PSN.

[@BTRshow]

​@waynewayne8419 I literally just went on about how he is Green lighting bad moves that's losing the company money and bias 😂 just read man

[@waynewayne8419]

@@BTRshow how is he losing the company money? Plays station had their last financial revive and year over year they made more. So again what money are they losing. And please respond with facts relating to their financial review not your opinion which is irrelevant

[@samirabdel-aziz478]

I love the series and i think its underrated. I get its bot everyone's cup of tea, but the lore, the story, and the vocal performances (minus one side mission) are all pretty fantastic. Plus Lance Reddick was outstanding as Sylens

[@Me_Caveman]

Always start a story with a flawed character. And always have them grow.

[@mrmatejator]

Luke you said that your enjoyment of Horizon Forbidden West got hurt by all the grind and same thing happened to me. But I played on PC and therefore did the good old thing of downloading trainer. I turned on nothing else but for all the materials that I got at least once to be unlimited and my enjoyment of game skyrocketed. I played through main quest when I wanted. I did side quests when I wanted and I casually hunted dinosaurs when I wanted. I would genuinely advice for other people to do the same if they got turned off by grind.

[@acewolfgang276]

I'll have to look into it. The first game was phenomenal but I can't bring myself to beat Forbidden West because of the grind.

[@Folkeregor]

Literally has the worst release dates but Horizon series are genuinely good games

[@Aidee.L]

@Folkeregor I wouldn't go far to say there "good games" Alloy is a Mary sue and the open world is mediocre at best, not even fun

[@GeorgeNoX]

For me personally, i enjoyed it because of the lore behind it, meaning the past events that led to the world we were put in, it was really interesting to me playing through it and learning more about that highly technically advanced society that existed prior to everything going to crap. But apart from that, i found the gameplay really satisfying.

[@chriscollins3225]

You like definitely need to do actual better research Horizon Zero Dawn sold 7.6 million in 1 year Horizon Forbidden West sold 8.4 million in 1 year The sequel has outperform the original You are using lifetime sales ( 20+ million ) of the original game comparing them to the 1 year update of the sequel The sequel was said to be in the TOP 10 on PC when it launched The remaster version of Zero Dawn just released The spin off hasn't released yet and I bet you the numbers are going to astronomical on Nintendo and PlayStation Horizon Live Service is a game the community wants Horizon part 3 is a game the community wants The whole franchise has been very successful

[@StuCheeks]

The next Horizon game should follow a different protagonist in a different part of the world. Aloy's name isn't in the title like Mario's is in all the Mario games. Span the horizon to different settings and different characters. That would help the the franchise grow and they could always bring Aloy back later, whether in her own new game or in a crossover with the new characters from my hypothetical game.

[@SantianoBe]

I fucking love the Horizon franchise. Zero Dawn my favorite game of the PS4 era. Not gonna play the Lego on though. I love the mainline game. Not sure about the Monster Hunter game. But would love playing with friends. But I wish they did it like GTA does. Make a great singler player experience, with a huge map. Then open that mat to play online with friends. Alternatively you can do it the Borderlands 3 way. Would love that too. Don't see the need for a separate multiplayer game, in the style of fortnite...

[@murray821]

It’s a direct sequel so that might explain the numbers. Also they bundled it with a ps5 at some point and those keys flooded the marketplace. You could get the code for 20 dollars or something. People bought those bundles because they took everything to get a ps5

[@davidw2744]

Luke is confusing his personal dislike for the series with objective facts. The Horizon franchise has sold over 30 million units. There are only two other PS4 exclusives to outsell Zero Dawn. Sony has a strategy to promote their bestselling exclusives to enhance brand name recognition. There is nothing wrong-headed or stupid here unless you want to deny that Horizon is a huge hit.

[@Alucard2356]

Just as a comparison, when Bloodborne came out, it did comparatively as well as Horizon did in their starting weeks. Both shot over the million mark. Horizon has been pushed by Sony with a sequel and PC release and a remaster. After all that it got to 30 million sales. Bloodborne on it's own without any push from anyone has gotten to 7.5 million by 2023. In conclusion, Sony should double their money and push both games. Yes, this was not me taking away from Horizon's success, just jabbing at Sony for not taking free money with another one of their games.

[@nicolasbenavides2927]

This crap came bundled with ps4

[@FilmsByOW]

@@davidw2744 it was a sales hit but culturally has almost no impact which is what he’s saying, especially compared to other Sony titles like Ghost of Tsushima or Spiderman

[@kayc7442]

@@nicolasbenavides2927 And of course those PS4 sales bumped the sales figures 😁

[@almightygod87]

@@nicolasbenavides2927 You can say this with any PS exclusive tho. I don't see this argument with GoW, Gran Turismo, and other games

[@michaellombardi5831]

Them giving Aloy a pumpkin head and their famous yellow spray paint drive people like me away.

[@CoreyGabel]

Horizon is a Phenomenal series with a great story in my opinion. That being said, i am slightly scared for its future after the Burning Ashes DLC. I know Forbidden West was about Aloy opening up a little bit more but damn that relationship with Seyka felt EXTREMELY FORCED! Especially when Aloy has so much more chemistry with other characters within the world.

[@night_tiime]

@@CoreyGabel I agree. I worry for the final installment of the main line games because it seems like they set up the Quen or going go their homeland as the major plot point- and to me they aren’t as interesting a tribe as the Carja or Banuk

[@Arcademan09]

I have a very large friend group who primarily play on PlayStation. Only one of them actually played the first game, he still hasn't touched the sequel

[@powwowken2760]

I've been a PlayStation guy since having a PS2 as a kid and I've literally never played a Horizon game... They seem fine, I don't really have anything against them, but they just seemed like a typical Ubisoft-style open world game and never really caught me with a hook to get me interested. I also don't know anyone personally who is a big Horizon 'fan', plenty of people I know have played it, but their reactions never seem to be more than, "Oh yeah that game, it was pretty good I guess" If PlayStation thinks their 'next big thing' is another Horizon game I really don't see it going well for them.

[@LeateqOfficial]

this is a cool game i even got a platinum in forbidden west but i forgot about it in like a day after i finished it It doesn't have a single memorable quest or character I still remember almost every mission and a lot of dialogues in rdr2, years after it's release, so yeah, it is what it is

[@VongolaBoss]

I understand the criticisms for this series, but I've personally enjoyed both Horizon games. Looking forward to this upcoming lego one and to see how the Horizon online shapes out.

[@PumKnH3D]

I don't understand why Sony pushing this franchise is being frowned upon. What's wrong with them trying to have a marquee franchise? Everyone always says Sony don't support their games enough, but when they do it's a problem? Lol

[@nebeskisrb7765]

Because the game is the definition of "meh". There is barely any discussion about the game outside of videos like this and Alloy being a poster child for uglyifing of female characters. Story, gameplay, none of that gets any discussion.

[@chilihunter7392]

@@nebeskisrb7765 Okay. You do know that most people aren’t on Internet forums typing statements about Aloy’s femininity? And if the game is ‘meh’ how does that explain the sales numbers being as high as 24 million (Zero Dawn)?

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

@@nebeskisrb7765 You’re confusing the majority of games with like incels on forums who think Aloy is ugly lol.

[@Stickman0660]

​@@PumKnH3Dmy take is. The setting for horizon has a lot of potential. The story could be better. The point people are making I think isn't that it's not a good game. It's just not one of those games that pops off and captures people yanno. Yea it sold a lot but you don't see people talking about it like they do say.. Zelda games.. or souls games. Like a lot of people like franchise but you can't force people to love the franchise. A think another point if contention here is there are lots of beloved franchises Sony has and are not utilizing that people would rather see perhaps.

[@hoshi314]

remember when Sony said that they lack big IP's that can be exploited outside of video games like TLOU? yeah, they are trying to turn Horizon into that

[@sainuudotcom]

Similar to Interstellar there is a quiet bunch of people that adores the Horizon series. This is not because of its excellent combat (gameplay) or the graphics (visuals)! It’s because of the concept! In essence the story encompasses so much Sci-fi concepts it’s absolutely impossible to even list in summary.

[@sammybosak10]

Nope it's pretty much for great visuals with a vibrant open world and a combat system appealing to very casual players with pretty animations.

[@GregMatoga]

@@sammybosak10 I've played it a bit at a family house and "my ancestors" themselves noted how great the game looks. Locations were lush and beatiful enough for them to ruminate about possible vacation destinations

[@hobabo9703]

Horizon genuinely just feels like someone came up with the really cool 'primal/dinosaur but robots' idea, made a game and then realized "Wait, games have stories, don't they?" and that's what resulted in Aloy

[@TheWorldsOfGaming]

Horizon and its characters are definitely not as superficial as Luke is claiming here (and elsewhere). It's fine to not like a game and move on from it before it's over or because it's repetitive. No one is forcing you to buy/play these titles. I'm mean what EXACTLY is the problem? They made a game in 2017 with a unique sci-fi twist, a sequel 5 years later that IMHO improved almost everything except for the story, a short immersive experience for the VR niche and now a fun family game that looks great. Yeah, okay and you can buy a shinier coat of paint for the 2017 title for 10 bucks, if you want it to look as good as the 2022 sequel. There's more egregious franchise-milking everywhere in the gaming sphere...

[@bugg6597]

To build the Lego levels, they use the same digital building site that people who build castles use. The digitally build them first, tells them the part count in addition. It’s a really cool website

[@Maitredebo2]

Horizon Forbidden West is still the best looking game on ps5.

[@aligameover6138]

Nah, spider-man 2 and demon's souls and ghost of tsushima and ratchet and clank rift apart and tlou part 1, they all look better Horizon has a bluryness that i hate, exactly like how rdr2 plays on pa4&5

[@evertisakjulius2249]

Demon souls remake?

[@markwheeler4245]

And it's on PS4 aswell which is exactly why I say graphics have hit DIMINISHING RETURNS HARD the industry needs to focus on enemies and NPC AI and physics next gen over graphics imo

[@wood1066]

@@evertisakjulius2249 People keep saying this, but I don't see it. It looks fine but nothing spectacular. HFW and Spiderman look way better.

[@waynewayne8419]

@@aligameover6138ghost of Tsushima does not look half as good as horizon lol. I was really disappointed by the graphics when I played it on my pc but horizon, that game is just the best visually impressive game I’ve ever seen. Spider-Man 2 is cool but imma wait for it to come out on pc first.

[@badasstasticusbadass4908]

The concerning thing is that, they seem to be placing ALL the eggs into one basket, and that's never a good sign. So, does that means that none of the IPs that Sony owns currently are doing good numbers right now that they are focusing everything on HZD just because it made good sells?

[@Esteban_907]

Dude Playstation is trying so hard to push horizon. It's a solid 7/10 series, best I can say about it, is that it's fine and relatively safe, you're not going to get a bad game, but nothing great either. I have no idea why sony is acting like horizon is thier console seller franchise when it's absolutely Is not. No one asked for lego horizon, and sometimes I forget a 3rd game is coming out soon. TOTK on switch blows both games out of the water despite being a 30fps game 😂

[@waynewayne8419]

Break it down for me exactly how Sony are pushing the game.

[@CIA_Informant_number_8629]

​​@@waynewayne8419disproportionate advertising and emphasis??? This is like if Nintendo spend the advertising budget on Kirby instead of Mario, you would ask. "Why the hell is Nintendo pushing Kirby?"

[@arunabhmahanta]

@@waynewayne8419 Horizon Zero Dawn Remaster, Horizon Call of the Mountain, LEGO Horizon Adventures, Netflix Horizon series, Horizon “Monster Hunter knock-off” MMO, Horizon Forbidden West sequel… need I say more? Hermen Hulst shuts down Japan Studio (as per David Jaffe’s insider source) and funnels that money towards his own studio i.e. Guerilla Games.

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

Somehow Horizon sold more than Ocarina of time sooo… 🌝

[@Thanosdidtherighthing]

@@arunabhmahanta Should they make a new Killzone instead which sold a fraction of the horizon series ?

[@duncanw5644]

Both games made a pretty good profit even though they launched on the same day as their respective year’s heavy hitters (BOTW and Elden Ring respectively). Yeah, I’d say they’re both pretty popular.

[@LinweAifhyl]

Y'all should stop saying a character is objectively bad just because you don't like them. Even more so when you don't try to understand the character. You think Aloy is a bad character because she is a Mary Sue. In what way ? Because I just looked up the same Wikipedia page and it does not match with Aloy. A Mary Sue is a young women "unrealistically capable" or "exceptionally gifted". Aloy is neither of those things. Would you say that Simone Biles is unrealistically capable ? When she trained her whole life to master her craft ? No you wouldn't. Aloy didn't start out as an amazing fighter/hunter, she spend her whole childhood training. The only "unfair" advantage she has is her focus. I'll admit people tend to love her a bit too quickly but it's often because she saved/helped them so it's not illogical or far fetched either and it's not like she does nothing to earn their admiration. Besides, when people do find her interesting instantly it's only because she's a Nora and they're known to be secluded savages or in FW when they recognise her as the savior of Meridian. Also you said she's bad because she has no flaws and then you said she's rude to her friend and she's not that nice. Well idk maybe being rude is one of her flaws ? She's also quick to anger, impulsive, socially awkward and has trust issues. And her flaws line up perfectly with her story as an outcast who has no idea who she is and where she comes from and who had no one to talk to except one old guy. She even gets called out for being rude and kinda ungrateful by her friend which prompts her to be nicer afterwards. I feel like people are always too harsh on Horizon compared to other games.

[@Susanoo7108]

Aloy is not a people person, which was a result of her isolation. In Forbidden West she definitely does improve on how she interacts with her friends. She's give Talanah a hug, which is quite a big step for her cause I don't recall her doing that with many other people other than Rost. She's not a expressive as Beta, but she has heart. She may not show it explicitly but she does.

[@Everythingupsidedown]

She is not a great character, I think she close to a Mary Sue but not really a Mary Sue caus she struggles,fights for her beliefs etc. but she is not great. I played the game and never was invested in her character arc

[@jackbrassil5318]

i love horizon, playing through remastered rn, really good world building and a deep mystery to uncover love it all

[@TakRoYu]

underappreciated game

[@EmergencyChannel]

As a primarily PC gamer, Horizon looks like another run of the mill collect-a-thon Sony game.

[@tomgames8616]

I enjoy Horizon as a franchise, but I will agree that the amount that Horizon is being pushed it a bit much. (I don't mind that it's getting pushed, I enjoy Horizon)

[@reformed1trick739]

I liked the first one a lot, but I haven't played the 2nd or the Lego

[@jayprofound_mercenary6665]

I thought ZD and FW were fantastic games in their own right. I do think FW was a little laboured. id rather see more of this than Concord or clones of other games.

[@matthewwalker5430]

I enjoy Horizon Dawn to be honest, but it deffo has it's issues. I agree with Luke when he says that, if Sony are trying to make Horizon it's "Mario" it just hasn't earned it (and obviously has a lot to do with Hermen Hulst's influence at both Sony & Guerrilla). I saw someone mention Little Big Planet in the comments and, frankly, it's mind-blowing to me that they've not created a new LBP for PS5. You only need look at Astrobot's success to see just how great a new gen LBP could be for Sony. It's crazy that Little Big Planet 3 was the last proper instalment in the franchise and it was released just over 10 years ago now.

[@TremelJackson]

Aloy is about as flat as the earth, there's no dimension to her character whatsoever.

[@cd_first1135]

14:28 , but she does have weakness from the first to the second game. One of them is that she pushes people away due to her being an outcast for too long. It is at the sequel when she finally opens up a bit and accepts help from her companions.

[@CedarHunt]

That's not really true, though. She pushes people away but never faces any kind of consequences for that. Her friends are always understanding and patient and adore her unconditionally. She doesn't have flaws.

[@OdaNobunaga15]

I like the games and I had a lot of fun with the first one, but I don’t really think they’re that amazing, though to be fair they’re not my style of games (I prefer games like DMC, Bayonetta, Nier Automata, etc.).

[@SuperDarknut]

Whoever is selecting the Horizon game launches really needs to be slapped around. 1 came out with Breath of the Wild and 2 came out with Elden Ring

[@_wegota2319_]

God forbid a company markets a product they're proud of. My goodness the bitching about this game is weird af. It has an active and engaged fanbase who love it dearly and they want more people to love it. Very simple

[@MaidenlessScrub]

@@_wegota2319_ God forbids consumers asking about questionable decisions these corpos make.

[@andreasplosky8516]

I liked the first game very much. The second one was quite a chore to play. The enemies felt more spongy, and it began to wear me out. I stopped playing halfway through. It just was not fun anymore.

[@NameUserOf]

That's because in the 1st one on normal difficulty you could go with hunter bow from start to finish. In the 2nd they've made better distinction between armor, body and weak points so you need to use different weapons for the enemies not to feel spongy.

[@BlackNomad1]

1. It’s a new IP (relatively new) that has been well loved by critics and fans. 2. They’d be stupid not to try to capitalise on its success and make it firmly a PlayStation mascot.

[@4newestaccoun]

You werent watching the video. New IPs take off and become firmly established all the time. But you can never force it. HZD is mid, and they're trying to force it as something culturally groundbreaking

[@NothingElseMattersJM]

@@4newestaccoun Did they force the 23 million units sold and the near 90 critics score on metacritic ? 🤔

[@captainamerica6545]

Investing in a franchise that is selling well isn’t “forcing” it. It’s feeding the market. Supply and demand.

[@nicolasbenavides2927]

@@NothingElseMattersJMthis piece of shit came bundled Obviously is gonna inflate the sales numbers

[@NothingElseMattersJM]

@@nicolasbenavides2927 Except the bundles came out AFTER the game had already released lol. Game sold almost 3 million within two weeks. Can’t deny the numbers .

[@ashroskell]

Yes, Bethesda makes blank slates for the player to transpose their own fantasy onto that template, which is, “fine,” if you like that sort of thing. Whereas Baldur’s Gate, Red Dead, or Cyberpunk all come with established characters who already have goals and the baggage of their own history. That’s a great point, because it goes a long way toward explaining why so many players were so disappointed by the atrocity Bethesda’s writers inflicted on players in Starfield, as I was. I didn’t have enough experience with Bethesda to expect SUCH abject vacuum of space between the ears of the lead, as well as outside of my ship’s window. And such carelessness when it comes to fleshing out the NPC characters. But games like BG3, RDR 1&2, or Cyberpunk & Phantom Liberty can kind of spoil gamers that way. You start to expect that the writing would at least be skilled and perhaps, if it’s lacking, it would only be in that it was bare bones writing, rather than nonsensical or self contradicting, with no internal logic to the universe? Such childish motivations for vital NPC’s, and that offensively, “inoffensive,” dialogue comes as a shock after you’re used to gritty, 3 dimensional, broken yet lovable lead characters, surrounded by a support cast of complex, intriguing and, “hate to love,” or, “love to hate,” characters to interact with.

[@bradbergeron1390]

I know not many people agree with me, but both Horizons I would put at a 9.2. I absolutely love both games.

[@IcicleFerret]

Every time I see the next ad, I see the monster designs and say, "oh that's cool," and then I remember Horizon is a thing.

[@kafka339]

Aloy mary sue???? -Socially awkward -she rages often -impulsive behavior -in FW she learns how to trust in her companions. I can accept Aloy isn’t a compelling character even a dull one. I strongly disagree she is a mary sue

[@marcusclark1339]

- destined for greateness by being a clone of another character - so special given to experienced hunter on a whim of the elders - trained by said experienced hunter - given basically spectre status after enemy attack cause she's special - only one that can do anything really definitely a sue by how the world revolves around her and Elizabeth as if no one else could compare while just becomes a chore

[@kafka339]

@ what? Aloy being the main character of Horizon story makes her Mary Sue. -Sylens, an antagonist with different objectives, taking gray decisions about Aloy. -FW antagonists are way stronger than Aloy power. -the focus is used for other characters than Aloy - typically sue doesn’t learn anything, Aloy learns a lot, how to take machines down, about her past, how make companions and thrust them. -she doesn’t manage well her knowledge and tribes religion. - Rost in the beginning hunt with her and he teaches how to hunt though gameplay. Aloy isn’t a sue.

[@sash9249]

It's a flagship franchise for Sony, so I don't see why they wouldn't push it. Go to any game convention and you'll see Aloys there. She's become one of the icons of Sony gaming. Decent sales, strong concept, lots of potential to grow. There's a big budget Horizon series in the works right now.

[@maesterdrew8606]

Saying the writing in Forbidden West is bad is just objectively wrong. It has to be once of the best science fiction stories in all of modern media. There’s no way you could play the entire game and argue the writing is bad.

[@lm4585]

It was boring and I did not finish it as I platinumed Zero Dawn.

[@brucepreston3927]

There are alot of good parts in Forbidden West, but I think they missed the mark on Aloy's character progression...I really enjoy both games, but I liked Aloy as a character alot more in the first game...I do think the side quests were much much better in Forbidden West though

[@sammybosak10]

People remember the first game more over the forbidden west

[@marcusclark1339]

it is bad

[@robertpayne6781]

It also released alongside Elden Ring. One of the most hyped games in recent history. Which is obviously very significant