Mac Studio Ultra Maxed Out Virtual Instruments Session

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[@andrewrossy]

Very helpful breakdown. Thank you.

[@visualsoundworks]

Hi Barry, this was a good test overall, at the same time. I have an M1 Pro, and it can't handle my productions. There are a lot of folks out there like me who just VIs. My setup is simple but powerful. I use Superior Drummer 3, Keyscape, Omnisephere, several U-He synths as well as a bunch of Kontact libraries. It brings my M1 Pro to its knees! And this is before any audio gets tracked. I ended up having to get Vienne Ensemble Pro, and a server computer to stream my sessions over my local network. As such my Mac has no stress on the CPU. My point is. I'm running a lot fewer VIs than what you ran on your test, but because they were more powerful. It brought an M1 Mac down, REALLY bad too. I couldn't get any work done. These plugins are getting crazy powerful, but they sound unbelievable. Thanks much, David.

[@shaynestilllife]

That’s for this comment. Was trying to see if I can get by with the Mac studio Max, but think I’m going save and get the ultra. I use SD3 as well with a lot of amp sims.

[@pulsemaps]

What DAW?

[@ridinglow6732]

So in other words you’re stressing the computer out for no reason.. I’m guessing you’re the type of person to leave a bunch of stuff running live smh.. every computer has its limits, even the ultra 🤦🏾‍♂️🤦🏾‍♂️

[@ridinglow6732]

@@shaynestilllifestop listening to everyone else and do your own research

[@aipsong]

Thanks for the video - a good explanation of studio work. I will receive my Mac Studio Ultra in about a month, and will install all my software directly, not through the migration system. It may be overkill for the moment, but when the developers start beefing up the requirements for their instruments, I will be ready.

[@npinero1]

A great video. I was considering the Mac Studio Ultra but I recently bought the MacBook Pro M1 Pro after selling off my 2019 Mac Pro and this computer is a beast. I don't know if the max would give me much more but I am definitely happy with what I have for hopefully 5 years.

[@g.p616]

Best real life analysis of instances possible on You Tube. But what about mixing while keeping all these virtual instruments live?

[@armandodiaz3485]

Thanks for this demo on VI’s! Any chance you could duplicate this demo on your current version of PT and let us know in your next view how it faired in comparison to Logic? No need to give Avid any more free airtime. Keep the videos coming! TC!

[@pfaxmusic]

Totally helpful. Thank you soo much. My thing right now is memory!!!. I still have the idea of having so much memory in order to use all my virtual instruments (specially for movies and documentaries). I'm switching from my Mac Pro (trash can), to a Mac Studio, but still I'm tempted to get the 64 gig ram (It's my old thinking). Also I've heard that all my plugins and virtual instruments need to be silicon compatible? could you explain that sometime if possible. Thanks again so much. Greetings from Los Angeles.

[@1eidji652]

Impressive

[@jimmyjung6558]

I was wondering how well it handles 24/96 in a live setting. I need to run 32 channels around 5ms in&out without plugins and

[@ultrasoundconcept]

Your assessment is very correct I feel the M1 Pro is the sweet spot for anyone doing heavy Audio work.

[@BarryJohns]

That seems to be where I’m leaning at this point too.

[@buildanddestroyproductions3005]

Barry, thank you for this video. Now I have a more grounded idea of the Mac Ultra's power. I am never going to use that amount of live virtual instruments in a session but I do use dsp intensive Acustica plugins and I need raw processing power without engine overloads or the need to freeze tracks in Logic Pro.This also is a win win for Reaper users like myself who use it strictly for mixing. Even at those buffer rates not a friggin' hiccup. Again, thank you for the information. I think I will hold out for a M2 chip machine.

[@BarryJohns]

I have several videos out there demoing some Acoustic Audio Plugins on the m1, compared to UAD.

[@djsplyce]

Side note and question… your video quality and audio sounds amazing!! Could you share your camera/lense/lighting and audio setup if you wouldn’t mind? Looks and sounds incredible

[@BarryJohns]

If you go back to my channel, and see the last two videos I posted, ironically they deal with this very subject.

[@marceloviana2383]

hi Berry, 144 instances at 64 buffer size, ok but, what about sample rate? i didn't got you saying in the vídeo, that by the way i wached 2 times thank you.

[@musiccreation1198]

Fwiw, just sharing my decision. Selling all of my UA dsp gear and plugins. Moving to Logic Pro from Luna. New set up will be a Max Mac Studio (32gb ram / 1TB ssd) and a few pieces of 500 series gear, (BAE, Retro, WesAudio), for tracking. Mix bus 500 series choice...later this year. Hopefully, Audient will release an iD44 mkII interface at Namm in two weeks. My needs: never more than stereo recording, with a "lot" of virtual instruments though rarely more than 12 instances (Omnisphere, Keyscape, Trillian, Spitfire, Kontakt, Superior Drummer). I welcome feedback.

[@turtlefeet7722]

What about large sample libraries?

[@SaccoBelmonte]

I would love to try on doing the exact same tests in my 5900X using the same common plugins. Are you up for that Barry? I like the performance of the M1 but I wanna compare and see if the M1 chip is THAT good or is being hyped around.

[@DeRaNgEdOfficial]

On AMD or the Intel i9 12th gen 12900

[@BarryJohns]

Run it and let us know what you get!

[@SaccoBelmonte]

​ @Barry Johns Studio Talk Cool!! Let's try doing the exact same test Possibly common standard plugins we both own: Waves: Kramer Master Tape J37Tape RetroFI TrueVerb Saphira Electric 200 Piano ElectricGrand 80 Piano Kontakt Komplete 13 (we agree on some libs from it) Ozone 9 advanced And we can do the test in Studio One. Or we do it in different DAWs (it won't matter much they're all highly optimized) Do you wanna go for a specific sample buffer and mixer channels count? I would say let's try as many mixer channels and generators (synths, samplers) you can load without dropouts until you reach 90% CPU usage at 64 or 128 samples buffer. The only requisite is each mixer channel, or at least each 20 channels contain the same common plugins chains. Also that we load the exact same kontakt libs and synths and play the exact same notes. Say a chromatic scale from C0 to C4 repeatedly.

[@stephenalexandarmusic]

Hi thanks for the the video. It would be interesting if you add plugins to the channels. I can actually run some hundred tracks on my Mac, but when I start to add plugins the mess slowly starts. Also the Single track performance with a lot of plugins would be interesting because that’s the bottleneck of Logic. If the single core performance is not significantly better than previous versions you still end up with crackles.

[@BarryJohns]

I have many other videos demonstrating the power both the M1/Pro/Ultra already on my channel

[@marcmoulin1641]

I’d love to see this test on Pro Tools even if the Mac Studio is not yet supported.

[@BarryJohns]

I have a video demonstrating the Mac Studio ultra in pro tools, although it’s more gear towards analog, versus virtual instruments.

[@marcmoulin1641]

Yes, I am aware of your other video. Great video BTW. I am just curious to see the level of improvement the new Mac Studio could offer to Pro Tools users who use VIs.

[@kwameeyiah]

You should really test with multiple instances of plugins like Uhe Diva, and Acustica Audio plugins. Then we can have a true assessment of the mac studios power

[@BarryJohns]

I have several videos already doing that.

[@kwameeyiah]

@@BarryJohns will be eagerly looking forward to those ones. Keep giving us great content as always Sir.

[@joeydego2]

Kontakt is an extremely cpu efficient vi. What it can be is ram intensive. As stated, omnisphere would have produced smoke and fire at this track count. This is precisely the reason why DSP is still relevant. As far as audio using hardly any memory at all, with kontakt you can load those instruments into memory saving disk performance. I have drum kits in superior that are 3gb by themselves.

[@BarryJohns]

Yea I get it, I don’t own those, it was the best I could do. Hopefully so one who has those as well as the Mac Studio Ultra and share their results. Even though Kontakt is more efficient, I’m running a ton of VI’s. Off loading CPU tasks to RAM is simply a non issue and not needed on M1 Macs. I can load 10 instances if SD3 on my M1 Pro and it doesn’t use much RAM. Oh, SD3 is a VI and not audio. It’s basically a sampler. People should try to understand that GPU’s and RAM does not work the same as we are all used to. You cannot compare them.

[@tutubeos]

I’m going for the Ultra, just to be safer 😅

[@shaynestilllife]

I’m really debating between the Max and Ultra. Most of my sessions are 1 instance of Superior Drummer 3 with about 6 neural dsp amp sims, about 4-5 instrument tracks with Ana 2 or other synth pads. Using either Slate VMR or Isotope on every track, and about 16 instances of Howard Benson JST vocals which have delay and reverb built into each instance. Then the waves cla Epic which is a cpu hog. I thought when I bought the I9 it was going to be enough. I still have to freeze the hell out of everything. Never usually more than 40 tracks in total in my sessions. I don’t want to buy the Max and regret it. But spending another $2500 to get the ultra is a lot if it’s overkill. Need help on deciding.

[@BarryJohns]

For what we do, there is not enough gain in performance to justify the Ultra. You’d be ok with a Pro, but I’d go Max for the future.

[@shaynestilllife]

@@BarryJohns thanks for the help

[@charleskrueger5523]

How difficult is the transition from Mac Intel to Apple Silicon? All the plugins work?

[@BarryJohns]

Just about everything is ported over at this point. I have not had any issues in a while. Cubase/Nuendo/Protools still not Silicon Native. Other than that, all the plugins I own are native at this point.

[@charleskrueger5523]

@@BarryJohns Thank you. What would be the cost, excluding hardware, of making this changeover now, based on your setup as an example? Both in dollars and in time?

[@coder4liberty]

Number of tracks, number of plugins, number of instruments is fine but I don't see a lot of examples of how these systems do in latency and processing time for plugins. Plugins are starting to be used by musicians and live sound engineers where latency is a big issue. Those people might want to know whether putting a Mac Studio in their rack gives them better performance and less latency or if they should just put a Mac Mini in their rack and deal with it. There are efforts to run plugin code on GPUs for a reason. Not to mention how long plugins like Izotope mixing, mastering and de-noise plugins or other plugins like Melodyne which have a non-realtime processing stage take to do what they do. That might be useful info.

[@BarryJohns]

The latency is determined by the buffer. I use the plugins you mention and it’s effortless.

[@coder4liberty]

@@BarryJohns Of course but latency is created because it takes time to run the code. A faster processor is going to run the code faster. Multiple cores dedicated to running the code will run it faster provided it's designed to run on multiple cores. Which is why efforts are being made to run plugins on GPUs. Which is why I asked. Does the Max or Ultra run that code significantly faster with less latency? The buffer makes up for the processor being unable to run it fast enough. The faster the processor the lower the buffer settings you should have to use without audio issues. When running plugins live it's something important to know. Live sound consoles have DSP built in just as UAD interfaces do, with the idea that those dedicated chips can run that software fast enough that latency is minimal but you won't get the same results with a general computer unless it's just as fast.

[@TheDougSpot]

This is missing some very critical information. What sample rate are you using?

[@BarryJohns]

I have videos at 44.1 and 96, this one was 44.1

[@BarbaraKrolOfficial]

Why buffer so low? Put it to 512. Lol :D

[@BarryJohns]

It was set low to show you the max you can do. That was the whole point of the video.

[@Cap10NRGMusic]

Hey Barry - thanks for the honest look at the M1 Max vs Ultra. To be honest I use both Macs and PCs, I have flip-flopped several times (was PC, then Mac, now PC - would love to go back to Mac, but MAN the latest Intel Processor seems to be insane!!) Still thinking Mac - even though the Intel 12th gen is technically more powerful, but I just can't until the "M" processors have better support from developers - so I guess I'll just wait here haha. Anyway - really like your videos - if you ever feel like checking out my channel - I would love your feedback! Have a wicked amazing day!

[@delmixedit]

Base model is $1999 with 32GB RAM

[@delmixedit]

These are also low level VIs. Do you have Omnisphere, EastWest, or any other heavy VIs?

[@BarryJohns]

@@delmixedit no, I wish I did for testing purposes. It’s all I’ve got other than Logic Stock VI’s.

[@musiccreation1198]

@@delmixedit There's another YT video showing M1 Max / Omnisphere ... 140 instances. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jZbZdZKKephoaKc

[@Mrfpsara]

The max has more gpu over the pro, not sure that makes a difference for audio or if apple has so secret sauce gpu sauce for audio…

[@BarryJohns]

Single core is where there is very little difference between the M1 Pro/Max/Ultra, which is why the DAW performance isn’t as significant as one would expect. For apps that can take advantage of Multi-Core processing, there is a big difference between them.

[@Mrfpsara]

@@BarryJohns my understanding is that the Max/Pro share the same CPU/neural engine cores numbers and speed for audio processing, Max has double the memory bandwidth and extra GPUs....extra GPUs on the max are of no use for audio, unless I got this wrong?!

[@BarryJohns]

@@Mrfpsara that’s not exactly how it is, it is double everything. The issue is the single core processing is not much different between them, so if you are doing DAW work only, the improvement is marginal compared to what can be done with MultiCore apps, where there is a substantial difference in performance between the various M1 Processors.

[@Mrfpsara]

@@BarryJohns the ultra is double the max, true, but a max and a pro will have very similar performance when it comes to audio processing because they share the exact number of cpu cores running at the same cpu speed, I highly doubt double the performance with the max, it’s double the heat because the bus speed is double which is good to transfer massive graphic data…

[@BarryJohns]

@@Mrfpsara The more I think about this, I think you are correct.

[@derHerrMueller2]

10 Uhe Diva spuren und der ultra macht einen CPU Overload...

[@NathanielPrinceCoulter]

🤘🏾. Anybody got a beater guitar they want to get rid of? Getting desperate over here. Just want to play.

[@BarryJohns]

Where is here?

[@NathanielPrinceCoulter]

@@BarryJohns omg hey berry I’m in Flossmoor IL

[@BarryJohns]

@@NathanielPrinceCoulter email me your address, I have a guitar I can give you. [e-mail]

[@NathanielPrinceCoulter]

@@BarryJohns 🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾 just emailed.

[@FRANKRICECOLD209]

Man i hope apple dose not f us with the new mac pro because i am having a hard time spending $4000 on a computer that every thing is hard wired into it i have over 16 tb of hard drive storage for all my sample libraries in my 2012 mac pro so i would have to on top of paying $4000 another 1 to 2 thousand for a external hard drive enclosure i don't mind paying more for my dream mac pro but it cant just have all hard wired stuff if they do that with the new mac pro that's going to be bad for me i don't have a good feeling about it i think Me and Others Like me are going to get screwed Thanks For The Video