Mac users deserve a better mouse

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Turns out, there are many devoted Mac users that do not like Apple’s Magic Mouse. And now that fewer people are getting one with a desktop Mac, it’s worth looking at the alternatives.
Check out the mice featured in this video!
Apple Magic Mouse: lmg.gg/uGHSf
Apple Magic Trackpad: lmg.gg/8rgXL
Logitech MX Master 3S: geni.us/GIXzE8
Logitech M720 Triathlon: geni.us/KKoE
Logitech Lift: geni.us/WBByD
Logitech M575 Ergo: geni.us/wxYHgB
Microsoft Surface Mobile Mouse: geni.us/NKZBTtt
Microsoft Ocean Plastic Mouse: geni.us/7RF6d
Purchases made through some store links may provide some compensation to Linus Media Group.
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CHAPTERS
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0:00 How people really feel
1:41 How the Labs really feels
4:44 How Jonathan feels
5:03 This changes everything...
7:28 Thanks DeleteMe!
7:57 Trapping alternatives
8:42 Logitech MX Master 3S
10:28 Microsoft's Mice
10:59 Ergonomic options
11:37 The best all-rounder

[@lachlanokeefe8020]

Your videos are great. They feel like solo-produced videos, but with the production advantages and facilities of all of LTT. Great stuff.

[@handiz25]

oh . that why i see some familiar face here

[@ChrisMiller223]

@@handiz25 bruh

[@vrishad.k]

@@handiz25...

[@alexandertron9812]

A refreshing change of pace for LMG! Honestly looking forward to see more content in this style

[@Slimecrazy234]

However they are generally anti-apple in this understated snide smug way, which makes them very unwatchable.

[@KarlRock]

I’ve been using the Magic Mouse for a year, but I really to need to change. It’s horrible for large hands and long video edit sessions. Thanks for the recommendations!

[@Boredistan]

Hello karl sahib

[@playalle1]

In general for anyone working at a computer for a long period of time, especially creative people. Invest in a graphics tablet, you’ll save your wrist later on in life

[@Jaimin088]

hemlo sir

[@vegcharli]

The mouse’s features are great! The everything else… not so much.

[@evilleader1991]

Ram ram 🎉

[@humza890]

I really like how you got the lab team involved to do detailed testing, as well as letting the lab team themselves talk about what the stats mean for the end user.

[@theshoppingexpert]

The Logi M720 is so underrated. It was the first wireless mouse i bought for myself after doing the research (back when it was called the Marathon or Triathlon or something like that) and seeing that it was basically a budget-friendly MX Master. I do use the MX Master series now but still give the 720 a spin every now and then

[@InkLyned]

tbh i dont actually hate not being able to charge and use it at the same time, its not having a scroll wheel, not having different buttons for left and right click and the terrible form factor that really kills me inside

[@TyBayles]

This is so true

[@beegman27]

i never liked not having (at least) two physical buttons

[@InkLyned]

@@beegman27 same bro

[@mura_saki]

Honestly, even if it doesn't matter if you can't charge it and use it at the same time, the very fact that every single product they have has a better position for charging is literally just evidence of making a bad design on purpose 💀

[@natalie4698]

I love not being able to use it while charging, gives me a break from work occasionally

[@NootchMurphy]

I appreciate the more narrated story teller style of your work. It is definitely not a Linus style video, and it is nice to see more unique ways of presenting the information. Thank you for your work, it's good stuff!

[@JoseAlfonsoChavez]

This.. 👌

[@MindstabThrull]

Wholeheartedly agree. It's part of why I enjoy watching Mac Address even though I've barely ever touched an Apple product. (I think the last Mac I tried doing anything with AT ALL was before they switched to Intel?) Jonathon is really good at explaining stuff without coming across like a stereotypical Mac Addict

[@miggyyusay]

I adjusting the logitech settings based on your recommendation, then I heard the mouse I was using (M720) recommended. I wholeheartedly recommend it, as it's very comfortable, is accurate, has long battery life, and has all the features and customization you'd want. Only extra tip I'd say is to install smooth scroll software like MOS to make the experience closer to scrolling on a Magic Mouse.

[@natbarmore]

The Magic Mouse has a lot of ergonomic problems, but probably the biggest is that the touch surface doesn’t work if you hand is on the mouse. You have to artificially lift your other fingers off of the top so that *_only_* a fingertip or two or three (as appropriate for the gesture) are touching. Which means _you can’t click if your hand is resting on the mouse!_ (which is where any ergonomics expert will tell you it should be) _[edit: _*_That! Right there: _**_7:06_**_ !_*_ Looking at that bizarre arched claw shape you have to contort your hand into just to use it makes my hand cramp up just looking at you! I dunno if it was conscious for you, but you’ve learned that awkward hold because the Magic Mouse doesn’t really work if you don’t.]_ (Or maybe it was that it turned every click into a “left click” and you “only” had to lift your hand for _everything else_ (right-click, scrolling, gesture navigation)-I only used one for a little while, several years ago, before realizing that I couldn’t rest my hand on the mouse and ditching it for something that wasn’t gonna give me carpal tunnel, so I might be misremembering that detail.)

[@DavidNikkiZane]

i find myself accidentally scrolling around webpages because of this

[@TripsThoughLife]

Good comment. I completely agree. I recently switched to the MX Master 3 from the magic mouse, and... wow, haha!

[@phlush7374]

As someone who rarely uses apple products except for work and school, I'm blown away by this channel. Johnathan horst has made such an amazingly distinct channel in the LMG sphere and I love seeing the stylistic choices grow over time

[@mattiasalegro]

I use the trackpad and I much prefer that even to other creative mice.

[@GoombruhGG]

I only like it on macbook, not on mac idk why, maybe placement

[@mattiasalegro]

@@TCharlieA Wonder if a wristpad might help. Been thinking of trying one myself. I do rotate it sometimes based on seating position just to give me a more relaxed position. It is tough after 8 hours but I often remind myself to take breaks anyway and overall it has never bothered me all that often. Ergonomics is most important though so I can understand not using it.

[@rharrison79]

I went 100% trackpad, and kind of hate mice now. Only for gaming does it really come up short.

[@SimonBauer7]

i prefer the more direct Input of a mouse to the trackpad. but glad both options are a thing

[@mattiasalegro]

@@SimonBauer7 I'm simply curious about more elaboration on direct input. I feel like the magic trackpad responds to my inputs way more than a mouse. Except for gaming situations where I'm whipping it around and needing to be precise, it's normally accurate to a T.

[@aaronfrench8322]

This is an insanely well written and produced episode and video for being about a single mouse essentially. Love it!

[@exequielmleziva4599]

Got myself the Logitech M720 a couple of years ago and I absolutely love it. The hidden thumb button can be used for navigation (mostly going thru full screen apps and mimicking the three finger up gesture by pressing the button and moving the mouse left, right or up.) Also the scroll wheel has left and right buttons too which I use them to skip or go back a song, and the two extra thumb buttons that I use for volume up and down.

[@Blizzard5050]

The cool thing about the M720 is that the included modifier side button allows you to get some of the gesture functionality back while holding it. Been using one with my Mac/work setup for a number of years now.

[@sidhunp]

i have been using the triathlon for a while with macbook. but for me the cursor moves like a drunkard. does not happen in windows systems though. do you have any suggestions?

[@ArguingMeadows]

I'm basically indifferent about the Magic Mouse, but I swear by the Magic Trackpad. Absolutely wonderful experience and worth the upgrade.

[@Skiptrac3]

If I ever converted to a Mac for General Computing, I'd probably take the Magic Trackpad as my daily driver for it.

[@Itamar_Shai]

I've been daily driving it for more than 6 months now and I can't see myself switching to something else with a Mac. The trackpad just works so good with MacOS

[@blaight87]

Thats the way. I have a wireless logitech connected if I need it but 95% of the time the trackpad is the best option.

[@icantgivecredit871]

The Magic Trackpad is better than any integrated trackpad besides Apple's own. Apple objectively makes the world's best trackpads.

[@RobotTechHead]

@@Itamar_Shai Just waiting for it to not be some shit lightning port.

[@natewillis448]

I was surprised that the M720 mouse showed up as an alternative recommendation. I like that affordable yet decent options are now being recommended instead of just the top of the line expensive options.

[@randompl]

The ocean plastic line got a chuckle out of me. Good job!

[@Neo7_]

I have a Magic Touchpad for a Mac Mini and you missed over one of the reasons why some people choose this (trackball too): lack of available space. My secondary desk does not have enough room for a traditional mouse to move around. The Touchpad and trackballs don't need to move resolving that limitation. May not be the preference of mouse I like (MX Vertical) but something that works is definitely better than nothing at all.

[@ienjoy8008s]

This is really one of my favorite sub channels of LTT, the structure of the episodes are always great and the writing for the episodes is very natural

[@TheTongo11]

Totally agree and my latest apple product was an iPhone 3GS. I still watch almost every episode.

[@ienjoy8008s]

thanks everybody who like my comment! really made my day!

[@ienjoy8008s]

@@TheTongo11 I'm a new adopter of an iPhone, everything became so blended in the smartphone sector, i was a die hard android user and then it got to the point two years ago that I just said everything is the same at this point and just gave in and adopted a 12pro max, its nice, but its just a phone at the end of the day, now i have an m1 ipad and i love it for 3d modeling cad files in shapr3d

[@TheTongo11]

@@ienjoy8008s next phone might be an iPhone, if they change to USB-C I don't want to go back to have multiple cables and/or chargers on my trips, and when my surface pro give up the top contender definitely is a MacBook Air.

[@ixionn563]

@@ienjoy8008s Yeah honestly, I feel a lot of users are getting to this same point. I've been a diehard Android fan for years, even knowing their disadvantages, they were just my favorite device to daily drive. Android devices are all such close clones of each other these days (not to mention, all trying to copy the iPhone). Android devices used to have a lot of unique features and appeal to people who enjoyed tinkering with their device to get it just right. Now they've gone away from that to the point where it feels like there's no advantage to owning one anymore. An iPhone just feels like the lesser evil at this point which is a bit sad. Because while iPhone can be heavily limited, they're well optimized, stable and just work.

[@theballplayer4261]

Personally I use the mx master ergo, it is a trackball mouse and I only use it at work, but the ergonomics are great (and adjustable with the magnetic base) and with the logi options app I can use a combo of buttons for the macOS gestures, like switching apps or desktops. Great video!

[@theflexistentialist]

I alternate between the MX Master 3s and Ergo. The Ergo is great!

[@dmug]

Glad Jonathan is on the side of light, and uses correct scrolling. The Magic Mouse has some cool feature, x axis scrolling is amazing like in fcpx but they really need to update it

[@f1shs4lmon]

As a daily magic mouse user, I totally don't mind it for daily productivity. (For my hands and how I hold it), it doesn't cause any fatigue, and I like the gesture and touch control that you get with the magic mouse (Having tried using other mouse with my mac, I found myself missing the touch gestures). I do wish it has lower latency and higher accuracy. Although the trackpad (both on the laptop and the standalone one) is nice, the mouse is still better for more precise selection and movements.

[@chidorirasenganz]

Yeah I feel that many folks just claw the mouse instead of loosely resting their hand on the mouse

[@AlexeyMonastyrenko]

​@@chidorirasenganz Yeah, looks like people cannot adjust their armchair height properly so their hands are broken.

[@chidorirasenganz]

@southpaw05 yeah anything besides left click but where’s the problem with that? It’s the natural resting behavior of the hand

[@davidg5898]

4:52 I love natural scrolling. But only on a trackpad. For macOS, I use a magic trackpad for normal day-to-day stuff but will switch to a gaming mouse for anything needing accuracy/precision.

[@aarontt]

I'm one of those trackpad people for sure. The myriad of gestures available to you make your workflow so much faster, and with a nice low-profile wrist-rest in front of it, it's far comfier than any mouse I've ever used (and that includes the Logitech MX range)

[@Abrikosmanden]

Great video and absolutely lovely presentation! And I love the fact that your Mac is color matched to yourself :)

[@JellyLancelot]

I used the Magic Mouse for years as the gestures were irreplaceable and scrolling so delicious to use. However as someone with large hands, eventually I just couldn’t use the mouse anymore. Switched to my old reliable Logitech MX Master 3 (after having a Revolution and 2 in years prior) and made the sacrifice in some gestures to a more ergonomic platform, the thumb button + swipe replacement mechanism for gestures worked, but wasn’t as good as the Magic Mouse. Loved it, but then used the G Pro wireless for my gaming rig. That made the MX feel far too heavy and (weirdly for me) less ergonomic than the G Pro wireless. So now I just use the G Pro wireless on my Mac and gaming rig, love it and I think this is now my forever mouse. Sure I’ve now lost all gestures, but as I now use Stage Manager for window management instead of Spaces, I don’t find the gestures useful anymore anyway. I’ve also disabled all forms of mouse acceleration on macOS via an OSS tool which is a must.

[@garthgoldwater5256]

you should do a series on BetterTouchTool-lets you do an absolutely absurd number of custom gestures, and works with both magic mice and third party ones (and different gestures for different devices)

[@MrsFern3y]

This video was incredibly creative. Seriously this channel is so impressive and helpful!!

[@bufelo]

Awesome video. The track pad really is that great tbh. Also I got the Triathlon after returning my MX Master and I don't feel I'm missing out especially considering the price difference.

[@camtheham13]

I haven’t done it yet but I have been tempted to do a Magic Trackpad along with a trackball mouse, I don’t like the trackpad for extended use, but the gestures apple has for it are incredibly powerful and I do miss them on my desktop setup

[@madseskildsen3915]

Make sure to look into finger trackballs as well as thumb trackballs. I prefer finger trackballs as I feel they give me better accuracy. Thumb trackballs have also been known to cause De Quervain (RSI for the thumb) with heavy use. Currently I use an Elecom deft pro as I like having a lot of buttons, though you might need a bearing swap to make it have less friction.

[@miguelguthridge]

I don't know if it works on MacOS but the Master 3S has a thumb button which you can use to program gestures - it works great for switching desktops and the like on Windows and Linux (with some setup).

[@joeyl.3007]

I actually have a Magic trackpad for my PC, had to find a driver from some random video on here, but it works wonderfully. although, I have it to the left of my keyboard because I normally use my logitech g303 shroud for mousing around. The magic trackpad mostly just gets used when there's a plate of food sitting in the mouse's space, or when I want to use it on my iPad.

[@Lotus_on_YT]

3:01 have mercy with the slack jumpscare

[@Ice-do3dh]

For anyone getting the Master 3 i would suggest getting the older Logitech Options than the Logitech Options+ due to the fact that the gestures are more responsive in the older version and the new one requires more distance to move the mouse in order to register a gesture shortcut.

[@Crokto]

i love the idea that while the machine is testing mice, antoine just stares at it until its done

[@InkLyned]

if they made the magic mouse the form of the roccat kone (i think thats what its called) or razer death adder than i would really like it but right now its just a war crime. The ONLY reason you would get it is if you do TONS of editing and need to scrub through the timeline a lot bc u can do that on the magic mouse

[@martinfpaponi]

Been using the M720 since 2016. It's an exceptional mouse that has been at my desk and backpack since the day I got it. now I'm waiting for a mx master 3s to arrive, just because the plastic on my 720 has gotten sticky. Other than that, for almost six years of heavy use, I can't be happier with this little champion. Battery life its outstanding too!

[@webluke]

When I worked in an office with MAC-only computers, I was set up with a full-size Apple keyboard and a trackpad. I hated it for doing actual work. I did go through the stash of mice that were no good to the owner, and I started using the original MX Master. For work now, I daily use the MX Master 2S and have the MX Master in my travel bag. I got the 2S at the time because the 3 was the new one and cost 2-3x the price. You can get the older, still great generation of mice for cheap. I do have larger hands, and the original XBOX controller felt great in my hands. For my gaming desktop, I use the G602 for its similar form factor but a bunch of extra buttons for gaming.

[@ThankYouCityOfficial]

I work in IT and was getting recurring painful tendonitis in my right hand from non ergo mice. I switched to an Elecom Huge trackball mouse and it was such an immediate difference (I did need to 3d print a riser to angle it)

[@Vlmikhailov667]

technically ergo mice help but not a lot due to weird palm moves (when your wrist doesn't move but palm do). Trackballs help as your palm stays still and only finger moves.

[@brafya]

i just wish you could map the magicmouse gestures and tapping abilities like the zoom and mission control and spaces to another mouse, you can map some stuff but not all.

[@randoman750]

Can do this with mx master via logi options

[@AWriterWandering]

I have been using the Logitech 720 with my Mac for years. The best part is you can program the side button to emulate many of the Magic Trackpad gestures.

[@ScottLahteine]

The Magic Trackpad is alright when I'm doing casual stuff, but my daily driver for coding and Photoshopping is a random wired USB gaming mouse that fell into my possession, a "Cobra Junior" by E-Blue. It's the right size for my hand and fine for the occasional bout of Unreal Tournament.

[@SharonLougheed]

10:49 "...you can get one that's not _yet_ ocean plastic...." 👀

[@denisi1283]

The greatest advantage for ergonomics with the trackpad is that it has no resting position. Whenever you are not using it, your arm stays in comfortable, relaxed position, far from it, and comes back to the trackpad only when interacting. This reduces tremendously the stress caused on wrist, shoulders and fingers. I could never achieve this level of comfort with a mouse (I tend yo continuously hug it, never letting it go during a session), even though I pay attention a lot to my arm positioning while using it.

[@Jake_Sachs]

I've had that same Logitech trackball mouse (Ergo M575) for almost a year, and I love it! Switched from a Kensington Expert Mouse, also a trackball (which, btw, is the industry standard for recording studios). Before that I was using a magic trackpad from 2015. But my hand was never in quite the right position before the Logitech Ergo.

[@OrganistAnthony]

My favorite Apple mouse of all time is the angular ADB Mouse with the square button. That little scroll ball was a nightmare on the Mighty Mouse, although I remember being amused by the squeeze gesture.

[@drevartan4958]

Any recomendations for a wireless honeycomb right hand specific mouse that supports software mac shortcuts? Something like the Glorious Model D Wireless or the Pulsar Xlite V2, but that can be programmed for Expose and other Mac specific shortcuts. I've looked around, but haven't found anything.

[@The.JZA.]

It really is frustrating that Apple doesn’t natively support regular mice. The scrolling is terrible, the side buttons don’t work properly etc. There are good 3rd party mouse tools like Better Mouse but it’s annoying that you need to use these kinds of tools at all.

[@Gerdoch]

I like the touch options on the Magic Mouse, and own two - but I primarily use a trackball.

[@aaronfisher7159]

I love the touch gestures and the 3 finger swipe. But I refuse to buy one until they make it bigger and make it chargeable while being used

[@Mike504]

I use the MX Master 3. Absolutely love it and totally worth the money. My GF said she doesn't care about her mouse and wouldn't even notice. I swapped her 6 year old OEM Lenovo wired with a new gray Master 3 and she fell in love too. Like she was impressed by the difference.

[@walrusgumboot]

I wonder if you gave the track ball mouse a decent chance? They’re so ergonomic and once you adjust I find them quicker to use and super comfortable for extended periods. Also, they’re great if you don’t have a lot of desk space because you don’t physically move the mouse at all. I ended up buying two of the Logitech MX Ergo’s, one for home and one for office.

[@cdigames]

Hurt my hand 20 years ago, and have been using a Kensington SlimBlade since they came out, absolutely love it.

[@mpreuss2]

Me over here having 4 MX Ergos 😅 I use them all at least weekly so it’s been worth my investment. Home Home office Office Travel

[@bearxor]

MX ergo is awesome. Huge upgrade from the older M570 because of Bluetooth support.

[@stevedotwav]

​@@bearxor i was happy with the 570 until it died and I found they replaced it with the 575. Absolute garbage switches that wore out in a matter of months. First MX ergo lasted me 2 years before the switch gave out. Big fan

[@HuginMunin]

I find trackball mice incredibly fatiguing. As far as I can tell they offload some of the exertion you can do with your forearm and upper arm with moving mice directly into your your fingers, and the ones where the trackball is controlled by the thumb are extra bad. Ergonomics are very individual and I support people finding the specific solution that works for them, for me the Triathalon is a great daily driver and when I need to baby my wrists, the "vertical/sideways/handshake pose" styles are great. To each their own.

[@wildcard774]

I’m actually still pretty happy with my might mouse. I enjoy having two shortcut options and an bi-directional scroll ball

[@gabethemodder778]

I’m not a Mac user, but I really love my Logitech mice. The infinite scroll found on a few of them is wonderful. I daily a g502 light speed and I love having a million buttons to add as shortcuts. I have one of them set as backspace so I can highlight and delete things in word documents without moving my hand off the mouse. The side scrolling thing(not a separate scroll wheel but side to side on the main wheel) is a bit funky, especially in photoshop. I prefer the space bar + click to move around.

[@TheTotallyRandomGuy]

I love my Logitech M720, great mouse for the price. Conforms to the hand really well, has Bluetooth, and the infinite scroll wheel is super useful. Glad to see it show up as one of the best mice, because it sure deserves it!

[@GoPotato69]

i love mines but the switch has worn out so now it often doesn't register, got a razer but man I miss the ergo design, imma try and upgrade the switch, and chop out some of the insides to make it lighter bc it sure isn't light

[@TheTotallyRandomGuy]

@@GoPotato69 I’ve had to fix mine a few times, it’s because the plastic that presses on the button wears out a little divit, it’s a really easy fix though. All you need to do is open it up by peeling up the sticker in the battery compartment and unscrew the one there, and the 2 under the front pad. Then you pull it open, unplug the ribbon connector, and usually I just fill it in with a really tiny dab of super glue, and level it out with a toothpick. And usually that does the trick for another year. I’ve had mine for some 4 years? It’s been going all this time, besides the issue of that plastic being a tiny bit soft. It is a bit heavy, but I don’t really mind. It’s the best $40 I’ve ever spent on a mouse.

[@doctorgears9358]

I highly recommend the trackball mice. You need to give it a little bit to get used to it, like a couple hours or so, but once you do it's really nice. Not having to move it around is great, especially if you put like a pad of paper and a pen next to your mouse. Or perhaps the iPad with the apple pencil. I use the trackball for work and a regular mouse for general computing / gaming. That way I'm not always repeating the exact same motions every hour of every day.

[@SUPER7X]

Love the Logitech trackball mouse shoutout. It's what I live or die by.

[@Devastator0]

Man, I continue to be impressed by Horst’s videos, they are so good! This is coming from a guy who’s only Apple product is an iPhone 10S. Keep up the great work MA team!

[@IshayuG]

Most important thing when using a mac is to immediately nuke the mouse acceleration. The curve is great for trackpads but for mice it's literally unusable for me. Which is surprisingly not that easy, I found an app called LinearMouse that does it, but this should just be an option...

[@jackg_]

Agreed, Apple's mouse acceleration is great on a trackpad but atrocious on a mouse. Is there was an app that could auto turn it on/off when a mouse is connected/disconnected? I don't often use a mouse, only for some apps and games, so it would be nice to not have to think about it when swapping to a mouse for a bit.

[@imjustsomeguy]

LinearMouse is amazing. Highly recommend it if you are a long time Windows user. Very fine movements were too sensitive to me. But with LinearMouse, I can lower the acceleration and make it feel like I’m using a mouse on a Windows computer.

[@YearsOfLeadPoisoning]

I've used a magic mouse for at least a decade. The touchpad on the top is something I won't give up.

[@tens3482]

there's a reason that didn't update the form factor with the iMac refresh, its a solid design that no other mouse can replicate.

[@pardhivvarma]

I have benn using the M720 for a year a now and I’m absolutely loving it ., I got it on a combo with the keyboard and the experience is just awesome

[@stephenpartridge686]

When I bought my 2019 iMac I tested the magic mouse to make sure it worked and promptly put it back in the box, along with the magic keyboard. I use a Logitech MarbleMan trackball in my left hand (left handed mouse user despite being right handed) and a Magic Trackpad in my right with a wireless extended Magic Keyboard. PERFECT!!!

[@michaelhubbard5013]

As a left-handed user who can't get a Left-handed Logitech MX, the Magic Mouse is fills a niche that no other mouse in theory can replicate.

[@daniel-pablo]

The fact that right click is based on touch sensitivity and won't work if you already have your index finger rested on the mouse was the deal breaker for me

[@dariuskolba]

This was my concern before buying the magic mouse, but then i started noticing that i naturally lift my index finger slightly before right clicking on any mouse

[@arindamb]

I'm using the Logitech Signature M550. Silent- apart from the side buttons, and very comfortable scrolling.

[@Rawwwad]

FYI to get the apple smooth scrolling on 3rd party mice I use a mac app called " mac mouse fix" it also bring gestures to them

[@notenoughmonkeys]

I know it's not Jonathon's thing, but the mob has spoken, long live trackpad. Mac's have *utterly* perfected these, to the point that outside of certain more specific use cases, it's a big part of the reason of why MacOS / iOS a joy to use, and mice users are kind of missing out. The magic mouse was an imperfect attempt to make everyone happy, but ultimately, a very niche product, and I'd controversially go further and say mice on the mac are a niche product despite Macs literally popularising them in the first place. I'd suggest a high performance mouse *not* trying to replace the trackpad for niche use cases (gaming on a Mac is niche sadly), otherwise, stick with the Track Pad master race!

[@reviewchan9806]

Macs had to develope good trackpad otherwise their entire ecosystem would have been utter garbage

[@notenoughmonkeys]

@@reviewchan9806 Nah, there's alot that's great about using Apple products. Most of it comes from how well they integrate together, but if I singled out MacOS, .app "files" are great, to uninstall I literally just delete them (.app is actually a hidden set of folders that contain *everything* to do with an applications install), control centre is great for multiple desktops, Spotlight is a surprisingly decent global way of launching apps / finding docs, Terminal offers an absurd amount of power under the hood, Preview is surprisingly powerful for just peeking inside a document without launching a full application, and if you're a developer, the moment you install Brew it just changes *everything*. MacOS is a great example of what iOS could be if Apple loosen their grip a little. Don't get me wrong, there's alot it could learn from other OS's, for example, Windows has way better snapping features when moving windows, windows explorer is arguably superior to finder, file copy dialogs are objectively better (the pause feature is amazing), it's way better supported, and if you're into gaming in any way/shape/form it is the *way* to play games, plus the sheer amount of backwards compatibility is still absurd. But overall, I hate to say it, but it's a very bad take to claim the only good thing about a Mac is the trackpad I'm afraid.

[@notenoughmonkeys]

How irksome, KZbin seems to be removing my responses... ah well, 3rd times a charm. So .app folders give the opportunity for self-contained apps (yes, some don't completely adhere to this), allows the .app folders to be more readily managed/moved, and also enabled pretty much the most forward thinking future proof aspect of them, universal binary support.

[@fahadahaf]

@@notenoughmonkeys I use macOS everyday, and agree with most of what you said. Except about Spotlight and Terminal, even the free version of Alfred is so much more powerful than spotlight that I'm surprised apple doesn't sponsor Alfred's development. Apple has some good command-line tools (mostly because of the Unix/BSD history), I just wish the terminal was better. I'm a software engineer as well, so I spend a lot of time in the terminal. Thankfully, I don't have to use apple's terminal, iTerm exists. In my opinion, iTerm 2 is one of the best terminal emulators around (I'd say its better than a lot of linux terminal emulators too). As for brew, I have my own gripes with it (mostly because of McQuaid); but it is miles ahead of any package manager in windows; maybe better than a few linux package managers too.

[@StolenJoker84]

I’ve not used a Mac trackpad, but I can’t imagine it being much different (functionally) than the ones on a laptop. I prefer a physical mouse to the trackpad.

[@lanerj]

I have a Magic Mouse and an M720 Triathlon, and they are both great. I've heard you can get replacement feet and a little pad that sticks to the magic mouse for better quality of life and I may try that at some point. I think the gestures are just fantastic and I really hope that some day we can get an update version with better ergonomics.

[@GrackAlaciN]

I've been using trackballs since the 90s, I even used them for FPS back in the day when you could still get a decent wired one. My setup for years has been a mix of a Trackman Marble, an Ergo M575 (or similar shaped trackball), and a gaming mouse for FPS (right now the G305). The Marble is great for use with both hands and general use. The M575 is also great for general use, more precise work, and even some types of gaming, but the disadvantage is that if you use it a lot, you can feel the strain in your thumb. At work I use a Kensington Orbit, which feels kinda like the Marble, but also has a scroll ring.

[@stevesohn5436]

This is why I use the Elecom Deft Pro Trackball Mouse. Better ergonomics, more buttons and better feel in the hand.

[@cyrilio]

The Logitech MX Master 3 is superior in so many ways. I got mine half a year ago and should've gotten it way earlier.

[@KS-wr8ub]

Been using the Magic Mouse as primary mouse for 3-4 years now and every time I try to go back to a “normal” mouse I find that I really miss the functions provided by the touch surface. Side scrolling etc. Still haven’t tried the MX Master 3S, but I’m a bit hesitant due to price. I do think it’ll fit my big hands a lot better though! I also have the Magic Trackpad and use it occasionally. Since I’ve loved MacBooks trackpads for 10+ years I thought it’ll be a no brainer to use the Magic Trackpad 2, but boy was I wrong. The ergonomic side of using it feels 100% wrong for me, especially when I’m positioning it to the right of the keyboard. My wrist gets strained in only a couple of minutes. 😅 Also I think it physically clicks way too easy. Maybe I’m seated wrong for it, but I do think that the slight slant to it also makes it worse. Anyone else had this problem and found a “solution”?

[@MsSaksalainen]

I have the mx master 3s and am in love. You can even personalize what some buttons do in each program and connect it to 3 different devices without having to remove sth. where you can also configure again if u want. To your problem I sadly can't help you because I don't own it.

[@neverlife9184]

@@MsSaksalainen How's the 3S holding up?

[@MsSaksalainen]

@@neverlife9184 it's still as amazing as day one. Works just fine if that's what you are asking. I even dropped it a few times accidentally 😅

[@e-11]

I am (still) using the Mighty Mouse Bluetooth from 2009 I think on my M1 iMac. I just love the option to scroll in every direction, especially when editing a video.

[@felixbelanger2659]

11:27 lol that's literally the mouse I had in my hand while watching this video... It's still running strong after 7 years of daily office work, so great recommendation. I did have to unbind the hidden thumb button though because the switch became faulty after just a few years

[@willbryan8890]

I have fairly large hands, and find the magic mouse to be very ergonomic. The "sharp edge" as noted in the video is something I have never thought about. My thumb fits comfortably on the right side, while my pinkie rests well on the left. My other three fingers are free to scroll up, and down, and sideways with ease. I find it to be accurate, fast, and easy to control. And of course, the aesthetics give me a wonderful dopamine hit.

[@mrpw1402]

Maybe I’m alone but I love the Magic Mouse as a professional video editor. Never have any cramping issues and I’ve adapted to the touchpad so well it really helps with my workflow compared to a traditional mouse

[@TD_Tackitt]

I have used one daily for over 7 years. I have never had my hands feel cramped. The jesters are so nice to have! And I have not once had dpi issues (software bug🤷‍♂️?).The only down fall to the new ones imo is the underside charging. I hate the trackpads I tried but I feel they are more inaccurate and my hand does cramp using those. I also hate the force press crap, but might be because I have a MacBook without it. I guess it can all be chocked up to preferences at the end of the day just like key switches. Ones grail is another nightmare

[@SeanRosairo]

So I use a logitech G305 for pointing and then my trackpad for scrolling and editing on my left hand. Got used to it with my macbook so I got another trackpad when the laptop is connected to my monitor and keyboard desktop setup. The polling rate is pretty good on the little mouse.

[@urshurakdieohnekanal9291]

I used it for a few weeks, but my hand started to hurt, it's like shoes without cushion or an office chair without lumbar support. It looks very nice and sleek, but I exchanged it for an ergonomic mouse. And I totally missed the right click and the mouse wheel. Yes, there are programs for that for the magic mouse, but it simply isn't the same and it hampered my productivity. Nice channel

[@eruannster]

I worked at a movie production company a few years ago where everyone had a Mac of some kind. Macbooks, Mac Pros, a few iMacs… everyone swore by Apple computers, but not a single person had a Magic Mouse. It was all Logitech (usually MX Masters) or gaming mice of some variety. There was a small graveyard box of old Magic Mice in the store room because everyone had gotten hand cramps from the damn things and dumped them and bought something else. (A few people did have the external trackpad, though.)

[@djp1234]

I hate the charging port on the apple mouse, but there's no other mouse on the market with the same smooth omnidirectional scrolling. They all suck.

[@ChrisLincoln]

I use a trackball at home because I have limited space and it's helped a LOT with shoulder issues.

[@teng029]

I use both the Magic Trackpad and a Logitech MX Vertical. I'm naturally right-handed, but I trained myself to use the trackpad with my left hand. The MX Vertical is my main pointer device. This setup allows me to take advantage of the gestures that are associated with the trackpad. This also allows me to use the trackpad as the main pointer when I can't use a mouse (like when I'm holding a sandwich.. 😂).

[@jayholt]

I’ve been using one since it was released and honestly I love it. The gestures are good and the minimalism is actually quite comfortable. I’ve tried several other mouses of different shapes and sizes and I always go back. I’ve also found that the Bluetooth seems to work better with Magic Mouse than 3rd party. Most of my job revolves around client meetings and demoing and with other mouses I’ve had lag issues which I just can’t have on a client call. The Magic Mouse has never failed me. The charging is BS though.

[@crisdagato]

currently using a cheap Logitech mouse. Much better than the Magic Mouse I was given.

[@mattsnyder4754]

Man I would LOVE a v2 Magic Mouse where the “magic” swipey/scrolly bits are under the thumb like a track ball. That would be so good

[@VijaySrinivas]

Have been using the logitech M720 for little over 3 months in MacOS and can confirm its so much better for my wrist and general user experience! Chose that primarily because it had a reliable scroll wheel & bluetooth but great to know it's an all rounder!

[@Ervin-1190]

I actually love the Magic Mouse. I think you just have to get used to holding it a bit different compared to a regular mouse. What i do is to flatten my hand and let my palm rest on the desk while my fingers are flat and stretched over the mouse. Then it becomes comfortable and your fingers can move easier to do gestures. Especially if you have a app like BetterTouchTool. I’ve been using it for 10 years now and couldn’t live without it. It basically gives you the option to add more gestures to the mouse. For example: i switch between tabs with a double finger swipe to the left or right and close a tab with double finger swipe down. I also added a option do go back and forth in Finder the way it works in Safari. You can even divide the area of the mouse to 3 sections: left, mid and centre. This way you can mid click (open to new tab) in Safari. There is so much more, like gestures for the trackpad and even a window resizer like the way it worked from Windows Vista and onwards, the actual useful one, where you can drag a app to the corner to shape it and where it goes back if you move the window. Can’t believe Apple still doesn’t get this. Anyway, great mouse which gets so much better with BBT. :)

[@dedoyxp]

In the video, people do love the gesture a lot, but most can't compromise with the horrible ergonomics.

[@Ciboulon]

I love the Magic Mouse too for the gestures and the natural scrolling

[@dariuskolba]

The ergonimicsare nit horible at all. Your palm rests on the desk and you just use your fingers to control the mouse, not grab it like an apple, what the guy in the video tried to do.

[@Neoxon619]

Apple is gonna have to update the mouse sooner or later to comply with EU regulations regarding USB-C, but I’m worried that they’re just gonna use the same design, but stick a USB-C port on the bottom instead of Lightning.

[@anianii]

They don't. The regulation only applies to newly released products. So as long as Apple doesn't update anything about the mouse, they can still sell it with Lightning.

[@Neoxon619]

@@anianii They’re apparently doing an updated AirPods case with USB-C, so I wouldn’t be surprised if the rest of their devices follow suit.

[@anianii]

@@Neoxon619 I'm not aware of any updated AirPods case… I'll believe it when I see it. They're probably not updating the MagSafe Battery Pack anytime soon either…

[@kornkernel2232]

Hopefully they will and make it ergonomic but keeping the gestures which is a unique thing and pros about it. It's possible to make it bit more ergonomic with gestures, Microsoft Arc mouse does this, though that one still not the most ergonomic due to nothing to grip on, but at least you can rest your palm on it.

[@ekim4926]

I’m surprised that no one talked about the weird feeling when you use it. When either right or left click like a traditional mouse, the whole surface dips down, meaning that the other finger which was resting on the mouse felt like the whole thing just crumbled.

[@hankfowler8194]

Just bought the Logitech for my Air. Looks good. Thanks for your great reviews.

[@danielbilodeau4701]

When suggesting to get a bluetooth mouse, i would suggest mentioning the extra latency compared to a wifi dongle. The bluetooth mice i've tried are unusable to my taste :)

[@2bleubird]

Yes and using Bluetooth uses much more battery. If you use the wireless dongle the battery will last for years

[@JasonLefevers]

I like the Magic Mouse 2 and I know I’m insane. And yes, it does not glide as well on mousepads and desk pads. I went through a bunch of different ones before finding one that allowed it to glide decently. The ergonomics don’t bother me. I’ve used it all day everyday for my job and never had cramping issues. The charging port on the bottom also isn’t a huge deal for me. I rarely have to charge it and when I do I either charge it after work hours or, if needed, I plug it in and within 10-15 min I have plenty of charge.

[@pyromethious]

I tried the MX Master series briefly and quickly went back to my Performance MX mouse by the same company. While I do admit that the pinky finger was left out of the design concept, I like the overall feel much better. What I think I like the most about it is that it has buttons by the thumb that don't work the same or don't exist on the Master series. Sadly, I can only get them by over paying for a new one (because they're not being made?).

[@FPVwineUK]

I've upgraded to the MX 2s, my original was stolen, from the Triathlon. The Triathlon has a scroll left and right function in the scroll wheel (allowing it 4 seperate directions) and is super helpful for video editing... Shame the MX Master 2s doesn't have that, only a thumb scroll!

[@Travisharger]

I personally love the magic mouse. I don’t mind the way it charges because you only have to charge it every month or so. My only gripe is that I wish it was slightly more ergonomical. My problem with every other mouse is that I’m a huge user of the multitouch swipe features found in the magic mouse to navigate macOS. I’m constantly using virtual desktops by swiping left and right , double tapping for Mission Control, and zooming. Every other mouse feels like a huge step backwards for me personally

[@alangregoryvitek]

Same here! Love my Magic Mouse because of the multi touch support. I have the trackpad too but don’t use it because I’m less accurate with it when I’m using a desktop. It’s fine in a pinch though.

[@Hoju3942]

What's funny is that I tried to switch from a Magic Mouse to an MX Master 3 and my hand cramped up so badly trying to use it, it was completely unintuitive, and I had to switch back to the "uncomfortable, unergonomic Magic Mouse" which to me is the far better option. I also use touch gestures all the time, and no other mouse has that. For context, I have large hands so I have to make my hand into a claw to use the Magic Mouse too, but it's far more comfortable to me than having the whole space of my palm filled with plastic. I much prefer 2-3 contact points with fingers and that's it.

[@FeelsGouda]

This sounds more like you, not being used to other form-factors. This video is less about what you as an individual thinks about the mouse, but more what objectively is more ergonomic or generally "better" with the current standards all other mice use. At the end, use what you like best, no need to change if it works for you.

[@Hoju3942]

@@FeelsGouda Exactly, it's what works best for you. I've been using the Magic Mouse for over a decade, I don't think I could go to using a full featured mouse at this point. And since luckily Apple will never do that on its own, I'm safe for life in the wrist department.

[@shiknobi2055]

Love the dedication for the mouse trap joke, wrapped up nicely

[@jefferyjones8399]

I’ve tried the MX Master but ended up going back to the Magic Trackpad. For years I only used a MacBook Air, so when I decided to buy a desktop Mac last year I found the trackpad to be the option that works best for me

[@tomasmedina]

The magic trackpad is amazing, also it is always great to know someone that also thinks that natural scrolling on a mac is the wrong way!

[@skimmilk5148]

I really like using a trackball - I have a MX Ergo at home and a M570 at work. The only downside is that my colleagues aren't as familiar with them and have trouble using them, so if we're working together, I have to pull out a mouse so we can work together. My wrists are so much happier now, though!

[@Dpata08]

Love this vice document video style

[@teknog7843]

To the editor: don’t think we didn’t notice the M720 triathlon transition. Love the little things u guys do