MAMAS AND PAPAS Creeque Alley REACTION - Controversy and beautiful harmonies - First time hearing

[@Pauba1946]

This is literally the history of the mamas and papas.

[@markwilliams5606]

Down in Monterey 🌴🎶✌️

[@RobertSmith-iw2kb]

No he was just a mean drunk, although also a lyrical genius. He also wrote kocomo for the beach boys in 89.there last hit.

[@thecynic9232]

Cass was so damned talented and she died so young. Classic Mamas & Papas, thank you. ❤️🇨🇦

[@icmman7]

a hof voice no doubt so good.

[@MusiCatsKing]

People were less sensitive back then and weren't so easily offended like we are today.

[@johncheney950]

The MAMAS and the PAPAS were really different back then. Their harmonies were so tight .I'm old enough to have bought their 1st album, and I still have it.

[@ASaaaxxx]

I still have mine too

[@bobbystgeorge]

I still have mine🤩👏🏻

[@nancywest1926]

"Getting fat" was always a reference to wealth. Song turns around at the end to "Everyone's getting fat 'cept Mama Cass". Yes, also a poke at her size, but double entendre.

[@simchabaruch7023]

That's what I said, you are smart.

[@LeahAllen-h2s]

Ya because at that point she had been losing weight.

[@isidddro]

Facts 🙌🏻

[@collette9008]

Boomer here. I loved the Mamas and Papas! All their songs were great. This one is the story of where they came from to being a group. Wonderful choice! Thanks Harri 😍.

[@KathleenMcCormickLCSWMPH]

Great reaction, Harry. This song was a mainstay of my youth. Things were different then; we didn’t take things very seriously. Political correctness was not a thing. We all had issues and problems as did Mama Cass and we laughed them off. I very well think she did too. She was who she was and was revered as she was.

[@lisadc4681]

No band was ever better at harmonizing than these 4!!! Just amazing!!! The music we had back then was just so astronomical is hard to even believe sometimes, looking back!

[@TheMerryPup]

This has always been my favorite song by them. John Phillips was a brilliant songwriter and a great arranger; putting everyone’s voice in the right place so that it sounded like heaven.

[@edmundhenry5095]

My favorite "Young Girls are Coming to the Canyon" (Twelve Thirty) Love the harmonies!

[@andreafaloona4059]

Oh to have visited Laurel Canyon back in the day. I was 10 yrs too young, but my soul still lives there

[@michaeltipton5500]

Nobody else ever sounded like them.

[@sourisvoleur4854]

My absolute favorite M&P song. Everything about it is so great. Melody, harmony, the story, the poetry.

[@davebzen795]

JKC - The Mamas and Papas were exceedingly popular and Cass Elliot's vocals are simply a joy to hear again. This was a very nice submission. Harri, your review comments were spot-on.

[@howardhales6325]

This clip is from a documentary about the band, which is why you have commentary from Michelle Phillips and Barry McGuire. There's also a beautiful instrumental piece missing before the final verse that I wish they'd left in. Flute mostly, if I remember correctly. Two Canadians included in this song (Denny Doherty and Zal Yanofsky). I knew all the words to this song when I was just a little kid (although I think I got a few of them wrong), Still a favourite. Thanks for this one.

[@brianmccullough5764]

There were complicated relationships at play here, too. Cass was crazy for Denny, John and Michelle were a couple. Things were much crazier than the whole peaceful stage vibe would reveal.

[@nancywest1926]

Cass proposed to Denny, Denny and Michelle had an affair...great vocals, but a lot of crazy (strung out) times.

[@rogerbianchini2982]

@@nancywest1926 - Yea, being old enough to remember I was going to say that soap opera thing between Mamas Cass & Michelle & Denny, while Papa John is going WTF ......

[@melissagerber7231]

​@rogerbianchini2982 Daughter MacKenzie has some tea abut what 'Papa John' was really up to.😖

[@reallymysterious4520]

I have never seen a woman age more beautifully than Michelle Phillips - although Helen Mirren, Sophia Loren and Raquel Welch gave her a good run for her money

[@marybaillie8907]

This is autobiographical hit single from 1966. From their album, "Deliver", it goes through the Band's early days in the Virgin Islands up to becoming famous. Absolutely beautiful harmonies, a great melody and just groovy instruments made this a great hit with the world. Number 5 on the Billboard Pop songs, Number 1 in Canada, and Number 9 in the UK. Great reaction Harri. Thanks Harri and JKClark 👏👏 Cheers from Canada 🇨🇦

[@wild62meg47]

Great reaction, as usual, H. The line you wondered about is a play on words -- "getting fat" meant getting rich -- making money. So they were all struggling musicians and no one was "getting fat" (except Mama Cass, who was actually fat). Cass said she liked the line; it was clever, but we'll never know if it made her cringe inside. Rest in peace & power.

[@HarriBestReactions]

I know getting rich is another term for "getting fat"..But i dont think thats what it meant.You heard Phillips saying she wasnt gonna sing the lyric to Cass..That alone tells something.I also read she had issues with her weight and was always on a diet,thats what made me think she couldnt have been happy with that deep down.Who likes being called fat? 😁

[@brucedillinger9448]

I agree Harri. Guessing that Cass put on a brave face...as a lot of plus sized people do when confronting blatant shaming. RIP Mama Cass!

[@susieq9801]

@@HarriBestReactions - Her embarrassment and attempts at weight loss through fad diets and other weight loss attempts was what resulted in her death, not her weight. She did die or a heart attack but the stresses on her heart and body were due in part to repeated bad diet habits in an attempt to lose weight.

[@HarriBestReactions]

@@susieq9801 I never said a word about her death,so i really dont understand why this comment was directed at me.😁

[@kulcousy]

I think the premise that Cass is being abused and has no say in this is unfounded. They were juggernaut, riding the wave,. affectionate and loving as is obvious from these videos. If Cass had objected we wouldn't have heard the lyric.

[@WendyJoJohnston]

Regarding that line about Mama Cass getting fat, the final lyric redeems it a little. I have loved this song ever since I was a kid when it was initially released, way back in the Age of Dinosaurs, 1967! Love this, love everything they did, and love the reaction, Harri!

[@thecynic9232]

Yes, my sibs & I would listen to our parents albums. They were a little old to be hippies, but they sure lived the music. My parents that is, not the band. ❤️🇨🇦

[@WendyJoJohnston]

Cass Elliot had an astonishing voice. It's sad that people can't get past weight when they can overlook every other flaw.

[@susieq9801]

@@WendyJoJohnston - Sadly Cass's concern about her weight and having it repeatedly thrown in her face led her to all kinds of fad diets and such and that resulted in her premature death, not her weight.

[@Janadu]

It's known that John Phillips wasn't kind to Cass. He was against her joining the group because she was heavy. Couldn't deny that voice though. Wish she had lived longer to enjoy her solo career.

[@sylviannecoquet4702]

Doubt if the band would have been successful without Cass Eliott. My opinion of course.

[@anneje71]

Watched a KZbin video yesterday about Cass and they said she id not like the fat line in the song. She also tried hard to get away from being called Mama Cass.

[@TZ61]

This is an absolute master class in songwriting; how they got all of that information into the song without sounding contrived, and way too busy, is a complete mystery to me. Then you have the harmonies and the intricate way that they were composed; and it is just such a damn, fun song. Thanks for the upload.

[@GhostToast12]

Love The Mamas and the Papas!

[@user-ph9wt3ue7c]

Cass was the Godmother of Laurel Canyon

[@scottchapin2323]

One of my favorite M&P songs. I miss the days of great vocals and harmonies

[@brandy012173]

My whole time growing up I thought almost all of what I was hearing of the female vocals was Cass, and I couldn’t really distinguish out the voice of that delicate looking pretty skinny little white girl. I mean no one could possibly keep up with the likes of Cass Elliot’s powerhouse voice, right?? Like was she just for aesthetics? Lol. I thought I could pick every piece out of those harmonies and sing every one of them. Took me a while to figure it out BUT THAT LITTLE MICHELLE PHILLIPS was a VERY BOLD, CLEAR ALTO, which is rare for a woman. Extremely unique voice, and, Ya, she could definitely keep up. Now her voice is what I try to focus in on when I listen to them, because Cass is undeniable, and I didn’t realize how much Michelle brought to the table. Cass is one of the best musicians made though. No one could forget Cass’s voice even if they tried… and and was an excellent writer. Did you know Cass wrote the Jon Denver song “Leaving on a Jet Plane”?

[@JK_Clarke]

Great comment Brandy! Thanks so much for the context.

[@marymoreno4499]

John Denver wrote “Leaving on a Jet Plane”. He sang it with Cass on a Midnight Special show.

[@JK_Clarke]

@@marymoreno4499 Indeed, Denver wrote it in 1966 and its original title was, 'Babe I Hate To Go". (wiki)

[@pattiaustin1808]

Mostly we and they were skinny in those days, but yeah, it couldn’t have been easy to be the butt if that joke, all the while being so sublimely talented, but not as conventionally pretty as Michelle. Thank you for picking up on that, Harri. I still love this song, though. Those young’uns were living the dream that few of us ever did. I can’t fault them for that.

[@richarddaugherty8583]

Love the Mama's and the Papa's, and this song in particular. They worked really hard on the harmonies and rhythms. I was listening to I Call Your Name on day, and suddenly realized that the rhythm was a burlesque! I could totally see someone doing a bump and grind to that beat! Then I heard it in even more songs! Crazy!

[@dscotthoward7467]

Barry McGuire's Eve Of Destruction is a classic encapsulation of the feelings back then. Thanks Harri, you're the Best.

[@nancywest1926]

You gave me an earworm. One of the early protest songs, along with Sky Pilot. No, not a Barry song. 😉

[@craigaust3306]

Already done

[@mrb4749]

I'm impressed with the great video. Great song one of my favorites by them A short lived group but they made a mark in great music. Many very good songs.

[@originaldcjensen]

One of my favorite Momas and Papas songs.

[@AllenDM]

Cass never had any intention of going to Swarthmore (an elite American liberal arts college), but it was the only thing they could find that rhymed with "sophomore".

[@peterbaruxis2511]

Maybe they found sophomore to rhyme with Swathmore?

[@The5thGen]

Love this song! When I lived in The Black Hills, I met a husband and wife who played music. All of us knew this song and performed it during the Sturgis rally with no rehearsal whatsoever. It sounded great! Lol

[@alanmusicman3385]

When I first heard this as a teen I had no idea what it was about - but nonetheless I loved it. Of course subsequently you discoevred the people, the stories, the heartbreak behind it all and that gave it an even deeper appeal. Such a great track. There are a few tracks where bands sing about themselves, but not many as intimate as this one. Another self-referential track from the 1960s - it's more fun than self revelatory - is Manfred Mann's "The One in the Middle"

[@dwp1970]

A great autobiographical song if not the best.

[@missblondie2393]

I've thankfully grew up with parents who had great taste in music Mamas & Papas were a favorite Now watching as an adult to me Mama Cass had the voice the charisma and charm Perhaps perhaps there was a tad bit of jealousy

[@MisterWondrous]

I couldn't love them any more than I do. Thanks Harri.

[@cletushouse906]

You just heard an educational song. Good one.

[@djharryg]

Great commentary on this video. Thank you for making it.

[@cathy8964]

Mama Cass took all her friends on a vacation on one of the Island and they were wild!! The only thing she forgot was to pay the bill. LOL!!

[@LoisChisholm]

That is a great chunk of early 60s music history all rolled up into a fun song.

[@laurab68707]

This is my favorite Mamas and Papas song!!

[@rabrab3]

Absolutely LOVE this song and group!!

[@sergebrunet4218]

I saw John Sebastian in concert back in the 70s ! at the Forum of Montreal ! he was playing his 12 strings guitar but it s been so long i don t remember the songs ! 🤓

[@469buck]

Great song...

[@alandouglas8044]

The song that gives you the history of a group of musicians.

[@MattJoplin]

Thank you for getting it. And Cass was happy

[@LeahAllen-h2s]

They were referring to the fact that at that time Mama Cass was the only one making money. She was singing with a different group then.

[@webbtrekker534]

American Express finally called in the debt charged up on the card and they had to leave the Virgin Islands and went to LA where they got a job backing McQuin or maybe McGuire (can't remember) in exchange for $5000. and a car. The producer heard the back up and cut the lead and produced the Mamas and Papas. They ended up with a recording contract just as the group was breaking up. (This is a rough bio done from memory I can probably be corrected on all kinds of stuff)

[@peterbaruxis2511]

"Yeah, it's low rent but keeping out the heat's hard."

[@michaellockhart554]

I've seen an interview with Owen Elliot that was done by Chyna Phillips, they were childhood friends, and I seem to remember Owen stating that her mom was "okay" with it, not overjoyed by any stretch, but okay

[@randygagliano4929]

so good

[@chetstevensq]

One of my favorites, fun to call up all the references in the song. Kind of like Billy Joel's We Didn't Start the Fire or Don McLean's American Pie.

[@kianpa1]

Groovy…. ❤

[@lauralane4808]

Getting fat could be seen as a euphemism for getting rich. I have seen interviews where Cass Elliot said the lyric didn't upset her.

[@jtj909]

Duffy's good vibrations and our imaginations Can't go on indefinitely...

[@freeforever6971]

Great song!

[@garystreet6756]

Brilliant

[@icmman7]

great choice

[@KidRisky]

My favorite song by them because I’m a sucker for internal rhymes.

[@garymorris1856]

They had a great sound.

[@boydsprehn2140]

Creeque is a family name in the Virgin Islands (pronounced "Creaky"), and Creeque Alley is a real place, in downtown Charlotte Amalie, St. Thomas. The Mamas and the Papas had come down to the Virgin Islands, largely camping on the beach and playing in town (often in Creeque Alley) for money before recording this album and hitting the big time. There is a plaque on the wall in the Alley.

[@waynewolverton636]

I think you are Right Harri, she didn’t like it, she went along with it! I recommend checking out Mama Cass version of the Old classic Dream a little Dream of me… BEAUTIFUL!!

[@pauldover1403]

I love the Mamas and Papas, their sound was so bright and sunny, even on songs that weren't like "California Dreamin'" but the amazing thing is that they were so relatively unsuccessful. They only managed one number-one hit in the USA and none at all in the UK, which surprises nearly everyone who hears it. Most people like Mama Cass both, but she had a sad and unfulfilled life before her early death. The one I like best though is Michelle Phillips but she was sacked from the band by a letter signed by the other three although she was reinstated later in the same year. John Phillips was an excellent songwriter and arranger, but PF Sloane in his (unreliable) autobiography describes him as being a dangerous psychopath and even more disturbing allegations emerged later, But despite all that, at their best, the Mamas and Papas can lift your spirits like very few other groups. I'm glad that this was chosen.

[@lisadc4681]

Whoa, what?? Did you really just say The Mamas and the Papas were "relatively unsuccessful" band??? Omg, they were one of the biggest, most successful bands of the entire era!! Are you kidding me?? Their songs were huge hits and constantly played nonstop on radio stations everywhere for years and years and years! They were featured/sang on every imaginable TV show for music, on every show in interviews for at least 20 years or so and after their breakup! They were absolutely HUGE!! Sorry, just trying to keep it real. You had to be there at the time, but there was nothing relatively unsuccessful about this band!!

[@pauldover1403]

Don't get me wrong, I love the band but in America they had one number 1 album (If You Can Believe Your Eyes and Ears and one number 1 single (Monday, Monday). They didn't have any No. 1 hits in the UK. I couldn't believe it the first time I noticed and probably you can't either, nevertheless its true. So although we both think that they were an enormous band, really they were not.@@lisadc4681

[@Dan-sx9gl]

Mama Cass seemed like a good sport and I think people were less sensitive back then.

[@hectorsmommy1717]

Mama Cass always put on a brave face and was willing to make fun of her size but many who knew her said it really hurt her.

[@stevesm4]

I was very young when I first heard this song and thought they were singing "no one's getting fat except mama cat". Couldn't make out the names of the two guys who were "gettin' higher" but I visualised them climbing a mountain or maybe a hill. Like I say, I was very young at the time. And naïve.

[@deborahpaley21]

I grew up with the Mamas and the Papas. Try Twelve Thirty, I Saw Her Again.

[@wesmiddaugh230]

if you watch Janis Joplin Monterey Festival Cass is in the audience and her reaction is really telling. I have over 10k vinyls and all of the M & P

[@stuartreynolds6771]

As far as I know cass never commented on her audition & performance of the song but agreed to sing her lyrics about no one's getting fat except " mama cass,she was obviously reluctant at first but then agreed to it,I suppose she was quite open minded in her way

[@lynneblacketer6479]

A bit has been cut out of this version since it was a TV performance, but it's always fun to watch them.

[@colibri1]

John Phillips was said to be really cruel to Cass, frequently making snide comments about her weight, etc. Some figured he was jealous of the fact that she got the most attention in the group and had the best voice. He probably wrote that line just to hurt her.

[@HarriBestReactions]

I totally agree with you and you're the first to see things my way.I am yet to meet a woman of any era who likes being called fat.Especially in front of the whole world. Phillips said in that interview that she wasnt gonna sing those lines to her.She knew something.I think it was a cruel joke.Thats my personal take. If Cass was so happy with being called fat,why did she spend most of her life dieting and taking pills for weight loss?

[@brada1136]

Come on. I'm sure she didn't like being fat. but, let's be honest, she was fat and she knew it. She was always good natured and self-deprecating about it. I'm sure he had her consent and if not, she would've refused to sing the song.

[@HarriBestReactions]

@@brada1136 I dont know what side you are on with your comment 😁..But this will help,ask yourself this,will you for example go on Social media and call a friend you know is struggling with her weight fat? I wont.

[@toriboy25]

My favorite M&P song

[@LeahAllen-h2s]

They meant she was the only one making money because at that time she was singing on her own and doing really well

[@shelleybleu4903]

Cass had unrequited love for Denny. And he had an affair with married michelle. Ruined their group in the end. Too bad.

[@debbiechang5781]

Love this song. Thanks JK Clark for a great request. I was also uncomfortable with that lyric about the beautiful Cass Elliot. John Philips had a reputation for being kind of an ass 🤷🏻‍♀️. Anyway, it’s a great song in spite of the meanness. Thanks Harri 🌺✌️

[@rubyleuty9417]

I think she did. She joked about her weight. She was actually enrolled at Swarthmore College but decided to stay with the band a then went on to have a successful solo career. Subheading was in love with Denny but he wasn’t into her.

[@wgdavis5353]

Hi Mr. Harri, Not sure about that lyric, but I know Cass Elliot did not like the name "Mama Cass" ♠W.G.

[@michelleortega1514]

This is about how they started.

[@elimir62]

I loved them.

[@bradsense7431]

And California Dreaming becoming a reality…

[@Grateful_Dad_54]

Thank you, Harri! ✌🏻💀

[@elaine8013]

Back then people weren't so sensitive about things. She thought it was hilarious. This song pokes fun at everyone and nobody got mad. It was a time when people had fun. Getting fat was slang for getting rich.

[@chrissimpson1183]

The secret origin of the Mammas and Papas.

[@danwasson1930]

The story of the "Great Folk Music Scare of the 1960's".

[@CarlosVazquez-k7m]

Harry Thanks Little Brother Always Cheering me up you're a Class Act I don't like Folk's that say CASS CHOKED ON A HAM SANDWICH SHE DIED BECAUSE HER BEAUTIFUL HEART GAVE OUT Harry as you could imagine she must have been in considerable pain for a while but the Trooper she said THE SHOW MUST GO ON 🙏

[@SnowEfaust]

❤❤

[@CtO-nj9uu]

This song was the blueprints for modern rap and r&b imo.

[@dagmar.6954]

The Mamas & the Papas were a great folk rock group in the 60's. I had their records. They were known for their smooth harmonies. They had lots of great hits such as "Monday, Monday", "California Dreamin'", "Dedicated To The One I Love", "Words Of Love", "Dancing In The Street", "Look Through My Window", "Safe In My Garden", "I Saw Her Again" etc. Mama Cass Elliot went solo & had a big hit with "Dream A Little Dream Of Me".

[@chrissimpson1183]

I think Cass loved that line...

[@markwilliams5606]

Lowell Canyon LA. 🤠🎵🪴

[@fan123casual8]

Laurel Canyon, no?

[@kerryknight228]

I remember telling mom that they were being mean. My mom said she knows she's fat.

[@simchabaruch7023]

So you will know...."getting fat" is slang for "getting rich".

[@timeout8928]

People were not as sensitive in the 60’s

[@warrenhughes911]

'FAT'..= back then it meant MONEY....no one in folk was cashing in..but Cass Elliot...!!! fat wallet..etc..

[@fartblossom1908]

Yes, as a kid in the 1960's, 5 to 15 years old, I can agree that back then you heard many more offensive things. If you were overweight you just might be referred to as fat within earshot. It's a social mixed bag because some things should never be said and some other things aren't said as if not saying it makes it disappear or not be the fact.

[@chrissimpson1183]

There are not many interviews wt Cass that has survived.

[@elizabethb6617]

Fat was also used as a metaphor for making money so.....

[@rebeccalipps23]

Firstly, people didn't get offended by things like today. Cass was above such silliness. Cass was quite the musical influencer of her day.

[@HarriBestReactions]

Personally i dont think its silliness to be offended by being called fat on record.The woman had issues with her weight and was always on a diet amd taking diet pills.So she obviously wasnt comfortable with it.Her bandmate Phillips as well said in this video that she wasnt gonna sing that line to her.So Phillips wasnt cool with it either. To round things up,many have said in the comment section here that they saw an interview where her daughter said she didnt like it. We have also seen people here saying the writer didnt really want Cass in the group cos of her weight. I personally think it was a very insensitive thing to do.

[@annemarinelli7303]

I read somewhere that they made fun of her unmercifully and it really bothered her, terrible! The song is wonderful though.

[@AintB2]

He knew her well enough to know that it would hurt her feelings but she would act like it didn't. John was an asshole. Still, a great line.