Marshall SLASH AFD100 vs S.I.R. #39 COMPARISON

In this video I'm comparing a 2011 Marshall AFD100 to a 1977 Marshall Super Bass modded into a S.I.R. #39 by Forsberg Amplification. Two amazing amps.
Gear:
2011 Marshall AFD100
1977 Marshall Super Bass modded into #39 SIR Studios by Daniel Forsberg
2008 Gibson Les Paul R9 with a Seymour Duncan Alnico 2 Pro in the bridge.
Marshall Fullstack with 1977 Celestion T1220 G12M25 75Hz.
Welcome to the jungle. Isolated slash
• Guitar Track of Welcom...

[@staalhoofd]

When Santiago from Marshall went to the Metroamp forum to pretty much steal all the hard work that we did there for pretty much 5 years or so, the irony is that they stole it too soon. The version or schematic that they went for on the AFD100 is way off and just sounds bad. I notice from people contacting me that it frustrates them to buy the AFD100 and then not get the sound that they want. I continued down the rabbit hole for at least another year after Marshall took the schematic for the AFD100 and now have the 100% exact SIR #36 schematic (also partly thanks to Frank Levi - R.I.P.). The original schematic is far more simple than most people think. I will try to upload a video some time. Every time I play that amp it freaks me out. It's like I am listening to the album when in fact it's my amp that I am hearing.

[@myuncle2]

The irony is that the Marshall AFD100 ended up as the best tube amp ever made, an amp of its own, quite impressive.

[@staalhoofd]

@@myuncle2 I'm sure it is. But the intention was to copy the AFD tone. And at that it fails horribly.

[@Matlatil]

I have spend hours reading the nearly 700 pages ! Would love to get your final result on video

[@Alexhangman]

@@myuncle2 the irony is that the Marshall AFD100 is the worst amp i ever had and that i sold and got never regrets about it. Thank God i don't have it now. My JMP 2203 '79 with #34 and #36 mods is much better and fuller sounding amp.

[@miloshudec1686]

hey man...where is my comment...??...I made it 10 hours ago...it was long...and its not here...):...but I have #39 from Tim caswell...I dont belive frank did it...he did copy of it called #36...but it wasnt his original schema...he was wierd person little bit...why did you not try contacted Tim caswell...??...he is really nice guy and is still working...my #39 sound same like from record...(;...

[@ZigZagZimolag]

Great video as always Johan! The SIR 39 mod sounds fantastic, sounds better than the AFD 100 to my ears

[@JohanSegeborn]

Thanks ZigZag!

[@danielforsberg4018]

Thanks a lot! 😊

[@Mamo878]

That Forsberg amp is a keeper.

[@JohanSegeborn]

It is indeed! Like all Forsberg amps

[@danielforsberg4018]

Thanks a lot to both of you!! 🤗

[@pppaulie73]

The SIR 39 sounds better to my ears. I haven’t seen one video of the AFD 100 that I thought sounded good. Thanks Johan!

[@Alexhangman]

AFD100 is crap, believe me, i had it a few years ago. Now i have JMP 2203 '79 with #34 and #36 mods and it's much better and fuller sound.

[@charlesbukowski9836]

@@Alexhangman who did the mods

[@Alexhangman]

@@charlesbukowski9836 Duke amps, Germany

[@notalkguitarampplug-insrev784]

You know what? I would love to have ToneX captures of your amps… that would make your video interactive in a nice sharing fashion ❤😊

[@Nghilifa]

Marshall kind of dropped the ball on the AFD100. I got one when it was released, but I sold it and got a JVM instead. The weird thing was that they (Marshall) didn't consult either Tim Caswell or Frank Levi when they made the AFD100 which was kind of strange to me. Frank Levi sadly passed away a few years ago . Frank Levi also modded #34, which was the amp that Slash used to record the UYI albums (and any album since that basically).

[@RodneyWallaceDynamoC]

Johan always making the best guitar amp demonstrations on KZbin. Love it, great video as always. Thanks for sharing!

[@JohanSegeborn]

Thanks Rodney! I’m glad to hear that!

[@siegfriedwashburn3484]

Absolutely he is! Hope to see him a little more, but he is doing very serious work, so no pressure - we need Johan. I am a teacher, but here I am enjoying to be a student by myself!

[@danielforsberg4018]

Indeed he does!

[@isaacv9836]

I love the integrity of the experiment - the EQ matching, and faithful adherence to factual information. There's no unnecessary fluff in the video either. EXCELLENT video!

[@dananthony6258]

This is awesome. I loved slash so much when I was a kid. Definitely my top favorite guitar tones of all time. I worshipped him was I was 12 through my teen years.

[@JohanSegeborn]

Thanks Dan!

[@danielforsberg4018]

Thanks! Slash is still one of my favorite guitarists of all time. Since I first heard him, when I was 10 in 1991, he’s been! 🥰

[@kennyh5083]

@@JohanSegeborn Hey Johan! How about doing a vdo on the best HB for blues tones in a Les Paul? We want to know!!!

[@pleximaster1338]

I love this clip! I got my first Marshall stuff when I was 10 years old but it was Slash that really solidified my love for Marshall when I as 12-13 youngling started to listen to GunsNRoses, I was introduced to them by my bands singer in 1985-86, 1-2 year before they were hitting off big, we were listening to various bootlegs. I wish I had those tapes left now. Appetite for Destruction was not released in Sweden till 87 I think. I was only after this I discovered Marshall tone in Page, Green Clapton and the rest... But Slash tone is still my original sin... :) Hats of to Johan for the Clip and to Daniel for the Sir built.

[@danielforsberg4018]

Thanks mate!! 🤗

[@vintagetone22]

Nice upload from the king.⚘⚘🙏👍👍👍🎸👍🎸👍🎸🎸👍🔥👍🔥🔥🎸

[@JohanSegeborn]

Glad you like it!

[@jeffallen3382]

I wish more would talk about George Lynch using the S.I.R. #39 amp. At least he returned it and didn't try stealing it like Slash did...

[@stefftrim]

Thanks Johan. What a great attitude just as when Ace's tone was investigated. I used a Les Paul with P90 in the bridge, tunes to e flat. Opening riff, try: G string, B - A, palm muted with open B string (4 ringing & resonance) and D string: F# - B, B string open - D(open), A string: B/ 2 fret gives all done within the hand. 🪢 resting the soft part of/ hand edge on the saddle; it creates a "natural" muted tone and you have full control over your picking. (This is top notch geeky) 🤯 I use Marshall Haze head with 6v6 tubes, hard driven tubes, 💥 Boss GT-8 guitar effects processor 🪡🧵 4x12: 2 x 12" Pulsonic and 2 x 12" R/C. Great demonstration, Johan. When I mean great, I mean I can't help but grabbing my axe and turn it upside down 🌀🙏

[@siegfriedwashburn3484]

Hi, Johan! For me Slash was allways the absolute Gibson guy, with the perfect sound of that fuitars. I spent a lot of time to find the secret of his sound in his hits, like "Estranged". But now I think, I got the point. The problem is that I have no Gibson. I have ESP, with Duncans, but ESP is not the same. And when I got my first professional instrument, I choosed Fender Stratocaster, and said "I am ready to be jealous about people, who have Gibson, but I will go on with Fender. ". I had one more issue - I am 1.95 tall, and short scale guitars are not looking solid with my "construction". But now I have some ideas, how to make the sound more Slashy!👍 Thank you very much! Education is the best process in my life. Great video! C.U.! S.

[@JohanSegeborn]

Thanks man! See you!

[@John-mh9ty]

Just a little FYI, slash didn't have a Gibson either. He played a knockoff built by a small builder in LA. You can do it!

[@ElmoSyr]

Yesss! Can't wait for this one!

[@marvelharris9540]

Great video.. I love my AFD 100, wish Marshall still produced them.

[@eddieholmes3236]

Amazing what the EQ matching does. Thanks Johan!

[@emilrolof]

Great video as usual and Daniel is a true amp wizard, I’ve learnt a lot from the both of you. 😊 Skål!

[@danielforsberg4018]

Thanks Emil!! 🤗 I’ve learnt a lot from you as well! 😊

[@mooferoo]

I love the Appetite for Destruction tone and album mix, but holy hell this guitar tone is way too bright for me by itself.

[@John-mh9ty]

It's one of the brightest albums ever produced haha, and Slash tone sits on top of that mix. Ceriatone makes a great version of this circuit too. Instantly identifiable as the right circuit and not just another Marshall

[@dananthony6258]

A good reference for me is the intro to out to get me (song) .That open g is so dirty on afd.

[@AkiraSpectrum]

killer video! You should profile these for the NAM (Neural Amp Modeler) community!

[@dananthony6258]

Great video As usual.

[@JohanSegeborn]

Glad to hear it man!

[@manfredschwalenberg5819]

Great to see you always ! Best wishes.

[@cros79]

Really fun video, and a great interview! 👏

[@SkyValleySpaceCadet]

Great demo once again. Good point was made here, it would be interesting to see what influence the preamp tubes would do to the sound, and the frequency response. In the late 70s mostly RFT tubes were used, known to be more agressive sounding. If you would be interested in doing another video on preamp tubes, I could supply you with whatever you wish, including measurement data of each tube. Siemens, RFT, Telefunken, Mullard long plate, Mullard short plate, Philips long plate, Philips short plate, Sylvania long plate, you name it I (probably) have it. I would just need them back after the demo, that's all ;-)

[@JohanSegeborn]

Thanks! Yeah that would indeed be really interesting

[@SkyValleySpaceCadet]

@@JohanSegeborn if you would be up for it, what email adress can I reach you?

[@stevencancel1727]

I've a pair of 50 Watt 4 holers from 1977, a 1987 and a 2100 lead and bass which came factory wired shared cathode, after much testing and thought I decided not to make these amps "fuzz boxes" or high gain designs, rather leave them as stock or decrease gain or bright caps so that they function best with my favorite boost pedal. My best results came with no bright caps on the lead channel and a very small bright cap on the normal channel using the my favorite boost pedal to push the stock or mellowed amp and I am able to get all the gain I need with the pedal and the stock amp, small bright cap on the normal channel jumped to bright channel I also have a 1971 Marshall Major bass head completely stock original Iron, and same no bright cap on lead channel, small bright cap on normal channel, jumped channels with favorite boost pedal, no ppmv all stock, and I get a massive amount of gain from the pedal this Major sounds like Michael R/T's or Riff Guy's modded Marshall's just by using a pedal for the boost With no ppmv I am able to use this amp in a small club volume all the way up to its 4 KT88's full power output with no stress on the amp

[@brentstewart59]

Riffguy has some killer tones and one helluva damned fine player

[@stevencancel1727]

@@brentstewart59 indeed, a fine player and a great sounding Marshall Major that he fine tuned to perfection!

[@M81_WOODLAND]

I'd say the modded amp sounds better (not to say the AFD 100 sounds bad at all). Even though the Forsberg is bright, it does have a pronounced low end compared to the AFD 100.

[@danielforsberg4018]

Thanks a lot! 😊

[@JohanSegeborn]

I agree, it has a more balanced tone, if one can talk about that at this level of gain and brightness

[@myuncle2]

@@JohanSegeborn You could change presence and treble on the AFD100.

[@danielforsberg4018]

@@myuncle2 of course you can but it doesn’t emphasize that electric sound the right way. You need all these high pass filters to achieve that.

[@myuncle2]

@@danielforsberg4018 There are other demos of AFD100 where people said it was too brigth, but the knobs are very sensitive.

[@John-mh9ty]

The SIR 39 sounds like it's got a much better transformer on it. It's got that older Marshall crushed glass high end thing the new model just doesn't have.

[@adamsmith5828]

Thanks so much for this🙏❤️💯👏👏👏👏

[@dannbrauckmann1545]

Excellent comparison! I have a question about an old Celestion. A buddy of mine just bought two Vintage Celestion G12/50 speakers, with 75Hz on the sticker, and I dated one of them to October 18, 1976. They have yellow baskets, and black backs. Are these guitar speakers, or are they for a PA or something?

[@JohanSegeborn]

Thanks! I think they’re for guitar! Would be interesting to compare those to G12M25 and G12-65

[@danielforsberg4018]

They are for guitar. I know a guy, where I live, that actually owns one. Maybe I could borrow it from him and then Johan could compare it to other Celestions.

[@GuvnaOnSpotify]

I almost feel bad asking as you do so much great work, but Johan, it would be very interesting to me personally if you compared the Slash AFD and the Satch JVM. Lots of keyboard warriors I've spoken to compare the red crunch on the JS with the AFD. Not sure how true that is, and the JS is rare enough to make it interesting for your channel IMHO.

[@JohanSegeborn]

Hi! I’ll keep it in mind. The regular 410H isn’t close to the AFD though

[@GuvnaOnSpotify]

@@JohanSegeborn I know - I've owned that one before too. Not a great amp, too compressed, although you did a good job at getting a good sound out of it. The JS is a *completely* different amp.

[@ruggie.74]

The mistake that people make with these amps is that they always have their bridge volume at 10 on the guitar. Slash does not play his amps like this. He is CONSTANTLY at 7-8 for his lead work, 3-4 for cleans, and 9-10 for solos.

[@orbitaljellyfish808]

If we had a Time Machine and went to the studio on tracking dates and analyzed the entire signal chain (before and after the mixer) there would surely be surprises. I am most curious which preamp and power tubes were in the mythical SIR amp, after seeing what a tube change did for my own. Quincy Jones had Michael Jackson sing thru a cardboard tube to get a certain EQ effect. There are all kinds of tricks at that level of the profession. Slash said in a recent vid he used an SG on My Michelle.

[@JohanSegeborn]

I think more often than not the simplest possible solution is the one they used

[@Alexhangman]

The only secret of AFD sound is mics positions and post processing.

[@orbitaljellyfish808]

@@Alexhangman is it known which tubes the amp(s) used?

[@topfloorstudio2684]

We won't ever know how they got *THE* sound on Appetite. It will remain a guitar mystery for all times. I love Johan and all his videos and all he does but he is WAAAAY off on this one but that's not an insult. The AFD tone is impossible to imitate, and/or achieve.

[@JamesMurray-j1g]

Hey johan thank you for the great video!! If you don’t mind how do I get an amp modded by Daniel forsberg

[@LeoAdlerBrum]

On Slash's guitar, there's a treble bleed in the electrical system over there in the potentiometers, they're changed too. But you have to learn the music well too, to get the sound, the footprint also influences... I found this amp too high. It lacked that serious signal compensation, I think. That together, it rips through the sound, like Slash does. There's a video here on KZbin where a guy plays like slash, and there's this marshal with the 4x12 cabinet, which will also influence that. That's the theory, I'm also researching that, but the sound, that's not it yet. Look for this video on youtube: AFD & UYI tones - Modded '78 JMP1959 Plexi/ #34/ #36(AFD) identical. Listen to the Guns N Roses deluxe box set, there's a demo version of Welcome to Jungle, on a tape, there you can listen to a demo, which I believe he uses this Marshall, you can see that when the solo of this song, the tone is that ripped voltage.

[@alecalfaras5936]

🤟😎🍻💯🔥🔥🔥

[@MrTee-hw7mp]

The only thing that might make it a bit closer would be a cab full of Vintage 30’s, preferably from the 1980’s. Personally, I like the tone of green backs better. Some g12H30 black backs might be perfect. Either way, those amps just have a growl to them that’s guttural. Fire breathing monsters!

[@Alexhangman]

The only secret of AFD sound is mics positions and post processing. There's no Vintage 30 in 1986.

[@Nghilifa]

V30s weren't on the market when AFD was recorded. Slash most likely used 80w celestions (They're called Classic Lead today) or 65w celestion speaker cabs.

[@MrTee-hw7mp]

@@Nghilifa my bad. I thought 86 was the year they were introduced.

[@amoruzz]

👍👍

[@dolerulz]

EQ matching is never really accurate though. That 10K is likely a mistake. Also, he plays with lower gain and has a lot more note clarity. Also, the room he recorded in is very different plus his studio signal change also matters a lot. Do you know what speakers he used?

[@zbaby82]

The first one sounds the best.

[@adamwatson6916]

Keep in mind the V30s slash would have been using in the 80s are not the same as the standard production V30s V30s that came stock in marshals both then and now are called Marshall vintage speakers they were originally designed for the sliver jubilee and have Marshall proprietary specs. They are 70 watta rather then 60 but they are smoother warmer and nor as spikey as the standard production. Also the the V30 of the last few years are different from the non Marshall standard versions of the 80s but apparently rhe V30s have been modified again a few months back. The Marshall branded versions would have been what Slash used and those sound different from both the 80s standard production and the newer ones.

[@jamescarpenter4777]

He didn't use Marshall vintage on afd. He used g12 80

[@Zoso7227]

Do the same speakers, but different ohm values wired the same, sound different?

[@nimitz1739]

I figured Slash used a Marshall Jubilee for appetite

[@morganjohansson7727]

Håller med det är förvånansvärt bright.. men oxå väldigt lågt i mixen. Morgan

[@sopasopasson5563]

Thanks for this nice demo of texas chainsaw marshall tones 😂

[@JohanSegeborn]

Yeah, this tone is supposed to be combined with Izzy’s warmer riffs. Your comment is a great example of why Marshall compromised and made the AFD100 rounder than the original. No greatness without risking being pathetic

[@sopasopasson5563]

Nice if it works better in a context. On it’s own, there’s no earcandy in it. No offence. Interesting though. As always. Thx.

[@JohanSegeborn]

None taken, Cheers!

[@riccardobadalone7964]

AFD is super sensitive on the presence. You need to crank the presence to bring it to life, and then it cuts like a knife.

[@memeacademy2295]

#39 on Plexi are 1 hundred way better than AFD

[@esmeulonsouzadeoliveira3636]

Like 281 ✔ S.I.R Top .

[@lucwilson1]

Forsberg amp sounded so much better!

[@batman9592]

Mesa V30s sound good with all this?

[@Alexhangman]

No, G12M or G12H

[@TommiTM]

I've been turning afd-100 knobs about 10 years. You got too much middle here. Afd-100 sounds more like plexi at low mids.

[@adamwatson6916]

Johan I would love for you to do a comparison between the standard version of the Seymour Duncan Alnico 2 pros and the slash signature versions of the Alnico 2 pros . The slash versions are supposed based on the Alnico 2 pros MJ was winding for slash back in 1986 and 87 . Slash was essentially using s custom shop version of the Alnico 2 pros and supposed the ones MJ wound for slash were wound a little hotter like the newer slash versions . People who work at Duncan have claimed that the slash signature Alnico 2 pros are a new modified version of the Alnico 2 pro and that there is no difference between the modern standard production Alnco 2 pros and the ones wound for slash by MJ in 86 and 87 but this does not seem to be true because people have dissected A2P sets from the mid 80s and newer ones side by side and have found alot if differences materials and construction. Also Duncan let the cat out of the bag that slash signature A2ps were not a new pickup and were based on the ones custom wound for slash in 80s. I the marketing Duncan listed all of the differences between the standard production A2Ps and the slash versions and sated these changes were made to make them just like the originals from 1986 thus admitting that the standard A2Ps are not the same as the ones MJ wound for slash in 86 and 87 and the signature versions are closer to what was wound for slash in 80s . Slash did start using the regular production A2Ps eventually but the earliest sets he used in 86 and 87 are not the same . Even slash said that he noticed the newer A2Ps did not sound as good and went to Duncan and asked for them to wind him some A2Ps that sounded like the ones in his Derrig les Pau as the newer ones did not have the punch or fullness of the originals .again Duncan says in rhe marketing they made changes so that rhe slash set would be just like the ones made for Slash in the 80s Duncan latter claimed that the pickups did not change despite admitting that they did previously and tries to say the pickups did not change but rather it was changes to Gibson guitars that caused the tone to be less punchy and full bodied which could be believable accept Duncan tried to claim that the difference slash was hearing was due gibson Chamberimg their guitars which they due for some models and it makes a difference but gibson started chambering some les Paul's in the 80s and by 1996 or so were chambering standards but guitars like the les classic les paul trad and custom shop les Paul's were newer chambered accept for the occasional limited edition or custom shop modern standard les Paul's. None of that even matters because slash never used any of the chambered models. He used standards from the late 80s and all of his other gibsons were custom shop builds and they were mostly solid with a few having 9 hole weight relief which makes no difference in tone but chambeirng makes a les paul sound very different but slash did not use those. Duncan was full of BS on that one I would love to hear a comparison between the slash set a new set of regular production A2Ps and an A2P set from the mid to late 80s. It would be very interesting. Alnico 2 pros and Duncan 59s from the 80s were used in alot of boutique guitar builds and in the 80s Almost every guitar legend went to Duncan for new pickups and reminds they were the gold standard in those days

[@robertrogers7939]

The AFD was just garbage,Zero balls.I traded it for a 1959 HW when they were new and big bucks and couldn't have been happier.

[@vkuolema79]

Fuck imagine if they can get ahold of tim caswell's SIR #39

[@jamescarpenter4777]

He still mods them. You can send your amp to him.

[@vkuolema79]

@@jamescarpenter4777 That is still awesome indeed

[@Ontariosound]

Longtime subscriber and fan of your channel but the playing style is not anywhere near to Slash.

[@adamwatson6916]

I have never really cared for the AFD amp . And i don't think it sounds like AFD at all.

[@dane4453]

This sounds horrible. Sorry.

[@dezionlion]

Guns and roses sux!

[@JohanSegeborn]

They do NOT! 😂

[@danielforsberg4018]

No, they don’t! 😉

[@Cumbarz]

true!

[@M81_WOODLAND]

So does yer mum.

[@miloshudec1686]

dumb troll here...(;...

[@kkkrich]

But the thing is slash uses neither AFD100 nor SIR#39 now. His main amp is jubilee thesedays

[@Alexhangman]

This comparison isn't because Slash still use it, but because #39 was the tone of AFD.