Marvel Secret Lairs a Snap Buy? MTGGoldfish Podcast

[@haamgamer07]

Hi, lawyer and mtg player here! On the contract stuff, the most important and correct thing said here was that the actual terms of the contract are not known to anyone besides the contracting parties (so far). It’s not possible to reasonably determine how onerous the contract is based on how one person is characterizing it. So the conclusions one can make… are unsatisfying!

[@taylorarnold880]

I feel like Richard does not get the props he deserves as a business owner. I think he has put in a lot of work to get to where he is at, is thoughtful about the people he hires, and has a good business mind. He s someone that i could call a friend as well as a boss.

[@Bonesai31]

Pretty sure the guys doing the podcast think he's a great business owner.

[@Grisher100]

Great guy, just needs to invest in some chap stick.

[@Ragwar]

Richard is the best😎

[@alexrey4745]

He got lucky hiring and networking with good people. As a business owner, he's pretty good. As a Magic commentor... he would be better served letting his good people do their good job.

[@jeremyphillips3087]

Nice try Richard's mom.

[@fergusofdalibor4264]

I think not just the name, but the function of "shield of war and peace" matches pretty well I feel to caps shield. It gives protection, and can deal damage and sustain you. I like it

[@TheTrooper424]

It’s a non-bo with some of the cards in the deck. You don’t want protection from your own colors because you will not be able to target yourself with certain spells.

[@fergusofdalibor4264]

@@TheTrooper424 for sure it's a nonbo, but I like the card in a vacuum

[@Metroid23456]

I am so shocked that Richard, the King of not playing cards that force the table to kill you, and Crim, the guy who always has a removal spell, are riding the train to Disneyland with their takes on Storm. Its the biggest Timmy trap card I've ever seen in life.

[@nyvisalays2475]

Is it though? 4 mana must kill is fine, and if they kill it there's no reason to focus you anymore.

[@Metroid23456]

@@nyvisalays2475 it's a 4 mana must kill, that you need to either untap with it or jump through hoops to give it haste, that provides 0 value if they kill it. If it's dead, the table will just kill you so you can't recast it later. The blowout potential is absolutely devastating. For every 1 game you pop off, there is going to be 20 where someone kills it and your deck falls apart.

[@SACH13L]

"Is there any reason not to buy them?" If you like Marvel or want some of the cards sure; but as investments? have we not learnt anything?

[@jesperwinther518]

To avoid supporting UB.

[@JStack]

Not every secret lair is a guaranteed hit, but TWD, heads I win, etc are over 3x their listed price. Unique cards? Power level that holds up in the format that will no longer have things banned? Disney adults? Yeah it’s gonna (probably) be worth more than listing in a few years lol

[@scaredycat3146]

I think Storms play patterns will just be Narset with extra steps. Relegated to pupstomper tier that you can't play on most tables where she either dominates with obnoxiously long turns or gets shut down and does nothing all game.

[@gunksford]

Personally, I'm not a big fan of the Fortnite-ification of magic right now with all the universes beyond. Tbh they should all just be reprints of existing "universes within" cards with different names and art, much like how lotr balin's tomb is a reskinned ancient tomb.

[@scottcampbell9515]

This is how ALL Universe's Beyond should have been.

[@LexAnarchy]

Storm is cool but I don't understand how people are saying it's broken. You have to untap with it, cast a million spells before getting in for damage and only then do you get Storm. There are sooooo many ways to prevent this. What if you cast 10 spells pre combat and someone removes it during combat? You probably just lose right? You wasted all your resources on the Storm turn and now you don't get a payoff.

[@snowmanO07]

Extra turn spells… She’s green, cantrip hexproof stormcount +1… Literally anything cast a second time for free…

[@Sicktoid]

I guess what everyone is really saying is that "she is broken if she connects". I'm certainly not a fan of Storm. Yet another commander that makes for a very binary gaming experience. "Got removal? We can keep playing. No removal? I win".

[@ReyaadawnMTG]

I had a same thought and found a good workaround for this. Aluren + Gating creature = Infinite storm with all your mana still up and interaction available.

[@Alessandro-mg9oh]

it's a 4 mana commander meaning you'll cast it on turn 3 with a signet. You'll obviously untap with it because nobody will have a 3 mana removal in their opening hand. Storm has flying so you'll have always at least 1 person to deal combat damage. When you untap with her you'll have 5 mana which means you'll have enough mana to cast an extra turn (they all cost 5) and storm it using zero mana spells, of which there are a ton in those colors and most of them cycle so they are never dead cards. Even if you dont have an extra turn spell you can still cast any medium size spell and overvalue the board, even a single kodamas reach stormed 3 times will allow you to quickly recast Storm the next turn if they remove it. Also, you can easily give stom haste and double strike to make it even more broken

[@froggystrap1232]

You play blue and green no way you dont play 1 mana couterspell and protection. She is not going to die and she will likely have haste too

[@jcstaff1007]

8:46 Crim must be salivating at the thought of Open the Way being storm copied several times.

[@stephenbradford8524]

Laura Kinney starred in her own series and was presented as The All-New Wolverine on the cover. Noting that she was Wolverine isn’t a spoiler - it’s just reading the advert for the book Marvel wants to sell. (It’s a good book, too.)

[@thesamuraiman]

Tom Taylor does good stories

[@0nCoolDown]

Tomer taking a burn on Shield of Kaldra out of nowhere 17:05 lmao

[@sunhawk88]

I won't be made about Storm being played but you gotta win by storming off with Crackle With Power

[@AlexHamilton86]

Green loves land destruction!! Mwonvuli Acid-Moss, Winter's Grasp, Thermokarst, Acidic Slime, Reclaiming Vines etc. etc. Y'all need to play more pauper.

[@noahpatch1483]

Why are they not doing this print to demand? I’m not waiting around for hours in a queue just to not get these. I don’t buy limited stock Secret Lairs. Period. The cards and the reprints are really cool. But I’ve gotta draw the line somewhere. I will be buying the Extra Life that is print to demand.

[@yarrrthekraken]

The marvel set will be the end of my enthusiasm for magic. I’m so tired of universes beyond.

[@NaviTheMD]

Storm is gonna be the one of the most boring commanders to play against

[@alwaysplaythegame]

I truly despise secret lairs (and premium sets too). They can reprint these cards in standard just fine. Alas i wont buy secret lairs partly out of protest.

[@sglied1320]

Brewing Storm with burn spells that hit everyone or all opponents. I really like the mill idea from Crim, I may brew that as well!

[@Elyeras]

"Think of all the things you can put through Weapon X" This sentence actually convinced me to buy these. The idea of having fun with the goofiness rather than being angry about it.

[@alexkeyser7322]

Got to meet Crim at NYCC! What an awesome guy! Appreciated the chat and next time hopefully we can jam some games.

[@SoFishtry]

So glad you got that opportunity, Crim. So up your alley

[@beingbag2606]

This feels like the peak Fortnitification of magic. Surely the shark cannot be jumped any further than marvel magic cards?

[@Shimatzu95]

Dont say that! Saying any variation of "what could be worse?" always ends up causing more nonsense.

[@Pixelatedude6]

Excellent episode, lads

[@egon4564]

Even if they are reprinted in a few years the commanders should hold some value. Look at Greymond, Avacyn’s Stalwart vs Rick.

[@spike201188]

I will want to be getting the Wolverine and Iron Man SLD’s…… side note…… Crim mentioning Ms Bumbleflower infused with adamantium was the best comment to come out of this video 😂😂😂

[@JStack]

Crim is essentially a wotc employee at this point

[@DMG_MTG]

I think Richard is way off on his take on the Secret Lair. Even if wizards does bring these to a Marvel set, they won't be in the spider man set, so any sort of new printings of these SL exclusive cards won't hit for at least 3+ years. Also the continuation of this partnership can change at any moment if Disney/Marvel decides to go another direction so these could be the only time you can actually get these cards. Lot of stuff can keep these cards very expensive lol.

[@TheDestroya88]

I think even if they don’t become expensive you are nearly guaranteed to make 10-20% of Disney/marvel adults

[@MrTrozzo91]

Did richard just forget that scalper bots exists? The SL will be sold out in minutes for the resale value alone.

[@darthsnarf]

its already sold out and it hasnt gone on sale yet

[@aldercyng7287]

I think people are fundamentally misunderstanding why Storm is so strong. Shes in green, blue and red. Red is great at getting mutlple attack steps and haste, as well cheap spells to help make storm. Blue is full of ways to protect your caracters via counterspells. Green has great things to storm off with. People say just remove it. If you have removal but only you and one more person has removal thats 2 spells and thats assuming the other person who isnt being attacked will responed. If Storm shows 2 counter spells which is anywhere from 0-4 mana for both she will than be at storm 4. Even a Lightning Bolt which is 1 mana will be 12 total damage, hell Storm could use storm on something like manamorphose and draw 5 cards and make 10 mana..... green also has mana ramp making it easier to storm off early on. I dont think shes unbeatable but i dont think people see how important her colors are.

[@stevenburton7725]

I think Storm is good for cEDH, Wolverine and Black Panther are weak, and Iron Man and Captain America are good for regular EDH. I think that if you’re looking for a Voltron commander, get Cap. If you’re looking for an Izzet artifact commander, grab Iron Man. If you hate your friends, get Storm.

[@TheDestroya88]

I think the strongest counter argument to investing in this drop as a moneymaker is that they will estimate demand correctly or there will be a bubble. I think that being the worst case I’m still set to make 10-20% return on each drop.

[@nyvisalays2475]

I think Storm isn't that obvious to use because it's a combat trigger and it's the first spell. You can't really do the usual storm route of generating mana into storming off unless you're using all instants to do so. If you play your storm enabling spells first mainphase the mana will go away by the time you trigger her. So you need non-floating mana left to storm off after attacking. Might be a bit more challenging to build than expected.

[@pyramideddie7813]

Did they end up talking about pioneer?

[@fredt1983]

Ok, Universes beyond has officially become Alchemy and should just be banned...

[@coool20]

I had no idea x23 was wolverine now. Thanks crim!

[@thesamuraiman]

She's not currently. And she hasn't been for a few years. It was 2014-2018

[@Welverin]

We know Crim's answer without hearing it first.

[@perfectemokid]

Ive never wanted a secret lair more than this one! Storm is my favorite X-Men and i want her secret lair so much. Im extremely bummed though because im expecting to have to massivley over pay to get it from scalpers

[@Beam_on_team]

Just an example on how secret lair versions of cards have an impact on the price is the "Through the Wormhole" lair, I LOVE Dani Pendergast and have a bunch of her-non MTG art on my wall, but I can't justify buying the secret lair with her art on it because less than a year after that set released the non-foil sol ring is £35+ and the foil sol ring is £50+ ... and that's not even considering the rest of the lair

[@camdenharper7244]

If you're not big into marvel and/or commander. It's a hard no

[@scottcampbell9515]

RE: Commander Committee contract "I would never sign this because WotC has billions of dollars in lawyers and I would lose." Removing the RL: "Oh WotC would lose in court." Huh? If they have billions of dollars to defend themselves legally how would they lose? Which side of the fence are we going to be on?

[@lukusridley]

Crim's enthusiasm for in-universe readings of using the marvel cards in commander is incredibly wholesome and would make a game a lot more fun, love that energy

[@thatepicwizardguy]

"Do we want ice storm" Yes Seth. Fuck your lands we're storming them into oblivion. Goodluck with all those colorless lands Richard. Goodbye to your 4 lands Crim. haha but seriously it's single target land destro at a fairly high cost and is ONLY good because of Storm. This is exactly what she's about. Stuff the deck with shit that normally you'd kinda laugh at except this time you you cry. EDIT: also yes grading is a scam lol but if you're looking to sell ever then it's worth it for expensive cards (unfortunately)

[@vc.moser.ferrier]

Ban my old mana crypt and make some super problematic heros. Ok, yes this might be the end of my love for the game.

[@egon4564]

Don't forget each one should come with a extra bonus card. Even if its a basic land that's Marvel related, it will have some value.

[@jhpa55]

Me watching this while cracking packs in TCG Shop Simulator: ONE OF US

[@KaChiKaChak]

Send Crim's SF coach the infamous Wazzler a Storm EDH deck

[@frankywise911]

On the spoiler of stories discussion, I think that it should never spoiled. Like kids being born today should have Star Wars spoiled to them because Star Wars was released 50 years ago? I think it's fair if someone like Seth doesn't care... but before spoiling I think everyone should always ask or give a warning.

[@Wolfntee]

Preach Crim. Land destruction is healthy for magic!

[@STS-qi1qy]

I think the 'perpetuity' of the clause is the issue for me. Yes it's boilerplate but usually clauses like that, non-competes, etc have like a five year span or such.

[@Goldscorpio7]

I can't wait to give goblin game storm

[@rinmathews9337]

Give Shahrazad storm. Play 4 mini games.

[@nandopaiva4848]

Just an update from what Seth said about expecting WoTC to print enough supply: Hatsune Miku 3rd drop is STILL available to this day (the JP versions) and they were not sold out in, at least 10 days, because I was watching it. So, yes, WoTC seems to have invested in predicting demand for these and I agree with Ricard, these will not sell out as fast as people are talking about. Do you think they would increase the price in 10$ just to watch secondary market capitalize it?

[@JoshWolabaugh]

Statute of limitations on federal crimes is 10 years, so I think that's a fair rule for spoilers.

[@ARescuePenguin]

I think in regards to the contract drama, this seems to me (not a lawyer) to be a pretty standard initial contract. The issue is, companies almost always put more in a contract than they actually need. NDA? Fine, that makes perfect sense, as Richard said they don't want you airing dirty laundry about how things are done there. Non-disparagement while you work with them, reasonable. But once you leave you should be able to criticize the company, just without giving the details protected by NDA. Furthermore, anyone who is a content creator, whose business revolves around MTG and related content. Do the smart business thing and hire a damn contract lawyer. Have them read through it, help you understand it, and write up a counter-contract without the parts you don't like and see if WOTC will agree to those. Just because those are the first terms does not mean that they are the only terms. And if they are, and they don't agree to your amended terms, walk away. Don't risk your business and livelihood on a bad contract, especially not without adequate compensation, which from what I understand the new RC is still a volunteer position, just like before.

[@wchenful]

I wouldn't read too much into the legality of the contract - I can almost guarantee that it is perfectly legal and enforceable. Non disparagement, non disclosure, non competes and liability waivers are pretty much standard practise for all major corporations. It is very unlikely that the clause universally covers any critique of WotC - it's much more likely to specify the types of disclosures and reputation-affecting statements that can be made regarding WotC during the term of employment.

[@Cheerwine091]

I had been hearing about Card Shop Sim, but now that I know that you can just crack packs… I may have to get it.

[@MTGGoldfishPodcast]

You have to play through a few days to get enough xp and money to hire employees, but once you get to that point they can pretty much run the store and you can order products and crack packs.

[@SSolemn]

Im not into any UB, and I hate more that they returned to the "mechanically unique" cards model.... its TWD all over again.... I would only play Storm in the Universes Within version.

[@taransnodgress5027]

Why is Gavin Duggan trying to get legal advice from Twitter?

[@adamgarcia5616]

Has Richard secretly always been the voice of reason??? After hearing his take on the contract clause, I need to reevaluate my life…

[@chriselliott5539]

Storm i think is being overrated. You want to cantrip a bunch before combat; move to combat and hit a player; then you want to cast your storm card. She'll probably need some mana storage cards or something because if you attempt to "go off" it is EXTREMELY telegraphed and she runs a removal check that if you pass you can win. Having to basically storm before combat and then attack and then trigger on your game winning spell it's quite fragile. She's only the first spell cast post combat so if you start storming post combat she does nothing. This really restricts her and tones her power down having to split your turn across main phase 1 and main phase 2 which also means you can't store mana from rituals. Yes she's in great protection colors and could push her plan through but she is not as broken as people are making her out to be. Good but not broken.

[@pistolpete7422]

I think the point they made about flashy big mana spells is the best. Extra Turns x2 for the price of 1, which only scales better if you spent 1-3 mana pre attack trigger. Not like you’re often going to grapeshot a table with a ton of copies, really getting 2 big spells at a time is enormous value.

[@gunksford]

Jeska's will is in the same drop... I'd love to see that with storm tacked on

[@Shimatzu95]

Have you heard of instants? Casting stuff right before damage seems verry possible and you can likely afford to keep a counterspell up if needed.

[@chriselliott5539]

​@@Shimatzu95 you still lose mana between the combat steps and phases. Even if you cast a bunch in the combat phase to prep for the second main phase, you run into the issue of mana and not being able to keep it. It's got a little more of a surprise factor but still suffers the from the removal check.

[@TheWizardSojourn]

Ouch! My immersion!

[@robertcote7620]

What are the odds that they release the same cards (different art) in the 2025 marvel set release?

[@rinmathews9337]

pretty low considering the 2025 set is just Spider-Man themed.

[@Pug8]

Nobody knows they have left it ambiguous possibly intentionally.

[@dullestpenguin4151]

My guess is the commanders are in the main set, but the reskins are exclusive. I'm so torn on buying this out of fear they are in the main set

[@broodwarjc1517]

I am not buying this secret lair.

[@midnalight6419]

Me neither

[@CRIPPLINGSODIUMADDICT]

broodwarjc1517 has spoken

[@copernicusxx]

Spotted the DC fan boy

[@rgirado]

I'm buying this secret lair and sending it to @broodwarjc1517 just to spite him

[@puffhead4743]

Mtg print here I come

[@OlAgony]

I am so shocked that Darksteel plate was not used for Captain America's shield! This seems like such a huge flavor fail!!

[@jaysonking4055]

November 4th is the day before my day 😮

[@DaxRaider]

Same price as whole Warhammer decks ... Hard pass greedy wizards..

[@arturoalvarezponce9375]

I built a alian spell copy deck an I ended up with 4 copies of Tasha’s hideous laughter, it won me the game I love that card

[@ReyaadawnMTG]

I'm excited for Berserk because I run it in my DrakeDrake deck.

[@markbutterworth1428]

Im with Richard in terms of waiting for Final Fantasy, so hyped!

[@darthsnarf]

i wonder if in the future GameStop pivots into being a LGS that could be a great business move they already have brand recognition and brick and mortar locations

[@pistolpete7422]

I think the hardest part would be floor space. Imagine trying to cram a 20 player prerelease in those tiny ass stores, they barely have enough room for a couple displays and a game shelf in the back

[@whyinever6928]

Goldfish liars bar would be sick!

[@gunksford]

when are they adding storm that includes copies of spells

[@jonaingo29]

Are surviving non-disparragement clauses truly common? I've never been asked to sign one but I also work in a highly-regulated industry so I'm genuinely curious if these are commonplace im other industries. I completely understand surviving non-disclosure agreements (they gave you their secrets and you need to keep them even after you don't work there anymore). I also understand non-surviving non-disparragement clauses (you shouldn't badmouth the company while you work there). But the idea that you have to agree to never criticize the company ever for as long as you live even if you quit six months in seems outrageous to me. I would NEVER agree to this.

[@Spencer4686]

Regarding the contracts wotc works around 2 years ahead so I think a clause asking for that grace period before speaking out is acceptable. But i think this discussion just proves why content creators/public figures shouldn't be advisors for the game.

[@Theemosapiens]

I started tcg shop simulator today, 2 hours flew by

[@MTGGoldfishPodcast]

It's super addictive.

[@elijahwalker323]

I like the idea if doing some non legendary copies of storm and storming with like doppelgang

[@marsrocks247]

FF7:Rebirth is *so good* it will legitimately consume Richard for a straight month and he will emerge fully bearded.

[@ubertuna1]

I just want my magic to be magic, they created a fantastic game world rich with lore and so many great stories. Playing with Iron Mans and Jeff Goldblum just ruins all that worldbuilding and makes me feel like I'm in a fortnite lobby instead of an epic duel on the plains of Dominaria. Same deal with all these 'art treatments' that make them not even look like magic cards anymore. You know their only motivation here is the $$$. I hate it so much lol

[@darthsnarf]

its never going back now bud either accept it or find a new game. i dont like UB much either but whatever, most of the magic in universe stuff is corny as shit now anyways

[@ubertuna1]

@@darthsnarf Accept that other people want to play with these? Sure I can do that. Financially support the company that's been actively ruining my favorite game for the last 5 years? Nope, never again. Proxies + free clients all the way

[@sunfos]

sorcery tcg looks flavourful.

[@jiratrello]

I feel the same way.

[@darthsnarf]

go play pre modern then

[@FSUMercerian]

The Disney+ Contract dispute is incredibly meme’d at this point. Disney wasn’t saying because they have Disney+ they are locked in to arbitration, etc. I’d suggest watching the Legal Eagle video on it because it was more that they bought tickets through Disney+ that bonded their trip to the Disney+ terms, but there was absolutely nuance that was lost in the internet clickbaiting.

[@derpyderperson2912]

Woo fish podcast let's gooooo

[@tomdoetsch8603]

The only mtg secret lair I would buy is the yugioh one. Gimme a blue eyes, exodia, and dark magician in mtg.

[@doctordistracto8390]

It's definitely not pokemon propping up PSA, it's literally every collecting hobby except for Magic and going back decades. Magic sellers like BGS because they grade extremely loosely and even eliminate some grading factors from their consideration, e.g. if a card doesn't lay flat it is structurally damaged and PSA will give it a 4, and then you can send exactly the same card to BGS and it gets an 8+ easily. Like the entire reason that no players are able to grade their own cards is because so many people's opinions on condition have been corrupted by BGS handouts. I agree CGC are pros and should be more trusted with cards. Just if you're going to collect cards you need to know PSA is king to almost everyone, and magic players trying to pawn off BGS to you are looking to rip you off.

[@lds4628]

Its already confirmed that ff set will include stuff from ff1 up to ff16 9:30

[@SithOnix]

I'm shocked people think Storm is good. It requires all of your set up in main phase 1, and needs to deal combat damage to a player. Everything is telegrapraphed perfectly

[@zenithquasar4319]

1:04:13 wait is Crim serious? Why do you need a work ps5 is it just preference or is it tied to like review copies of games or something? Not judging just genuinely curious.

[@IlCremo]

Im saving up for Final fantasy

[@dee-wreck]

Storm is busted. If people build Storm, I hope they build it for something fun and interesting like Crim's mill plan and not something super lame like Richard's "easy 2 card combo" fears.

[@brandonchristner1520]

Storm, Force of Nature x Open the Way = profit

[@alwaysplaythegame]

Grading is a scam , obviously - but what alternatives do people have with cards worth hundreds.

[@bencheevers6693]

I think wizards knows exactly what they're doing, they're making 200k of these

[@PostprandialTorpor]

Proxy brrrrrr

[@-homerow-]

Marvel Snap Buy

[@lotrloreman]

I thought this was the MTG goldfish podcast not the EDHREC podcast, that's the place for dad jokes 😂

[@durpien]

Marvel Snap, Buy?

[@gameboywolf]

Don't do it Richard, the PS5 Pro isn't worth it

[@joshuacapps6717]

“Paper magic is dead” Crim. Why do I care what crim has to say

[@Rockhug]

For me storm mean.. more combat step...

[@manuelmaura4453]

Storm Goblin Game. Everyone forfeits.

[@eegles]

Jokes on you, Seth. You already agreed to never criticize WotC when you opened your first pack, an action which constitutes acceptance of WotC's Terms of Silence.

[@heithrobinson996]

Black panther shoulda got doubling season

[@skittles1736]

storm off then cast Ice Storm and Lightning Bolt😀 on every opponent 😂

[@jamesgreenwood1703]

HYPE

[@punkypinko2965]

I was a huge Marvel comics fan/collector as a kid. Black Panther was always second string, kind of like Hawkeye. Black Panther was just another second string Avenger. They should have gone with Power Man. He was the real black super hero. Even Falcon was a better black super hero than Black Panther. MTG went with Black Panther just because he was an Avenger. So disappointing. Power Man is a much better super hero. If you're familiar with the Netflix series, Power Man is also known as Luke Cage. But the Netflix series didn't do him justice. I always considered Black Panther as a cheap imitation of Batman but instead of a billionaire what's better? A prince/king of some make believe nation.