Melissa Bernstein: Achievement Anchoring & The Logic of Lying

Melissa Bernstein, author, entrepreneur, and Co-Founder of the successful toy company Melissa & Doug, breaks down her existential journey through birthing art from divergent qualities. She discusses her disassociation from dark feelings and how her imagination allowed her to channel that sense of despair into creativity. Mayim and Melissa bond over being unable to relate to mainstream culture and how perfectionism can sometimes feel like a drug. They examine the science behind overexcitabilities, reasons why we lie, and how to accept and move through rejection. Melissa opens up about how her need for control led to a severe eating disorder at the age of 11 and how she found recovery through her relationship with her now husband. After years of self-depletion, Melissa reveals how logotherapy and studying philosophy guided her through her mental health journey.
Mayim reminisces about her time hanging out with fellow misfits at Venice Beach, and ends the episode with advice for teachers on dealing with anxious students in the latest installment of Ask Mayim Anything.
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Ask Mayim Anything: www.bialikbreakdown.com/#ask-...
Listen on Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/6TgOe2p...
Listen on Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...
Sign up for Mayim Bialik's Breakdown Newsletter: www.bialikbreakdown.com​​
Find Mayim Bialik:
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Find Melissa Bernstein:
/ melissabernsteinofficial
www.melissaanddoug.com/
www.lifelines.com/shop-book
Learn more about the mental wellness community (LifeLines) Melissa is founding, including many free community workshops:
www.lifelines.com/community
/ lifelinesseekers
Theme Song Written, Produced, and Performed by Ed Robertson. Mixed by Kenny Luong.
#MayimBialik​​​ #BialikBreakdown #MelissaBernstein

[@reluctant.valentine]

Mayim, I wish your podcast had been in existence when I was young. I would've found myself and found my people a lot sooner. told my therapist about you and she got incredibly excited. you are a true blessing.

[@heidiklessard8440]

Very Important conversation. Thank you. P.S. I just love Johnathan. He brings so much to each of these conversations - his unbelievably kind and warm presence alone, (and HUMOR!!!) brings SO much value.

[@heathercade9645]

I'm just a few minutes into the podcast and I gotta say, it's not just parents who appreciate these toys. Early Childhood Educators love Melissa and Doug toys too 😊

[@dicedrice7216]

And adults!

[@mirfir]

Definitely!!

[@gingerlewis6898]

Wow !! You hit the nail on the head. I to am someone that questions why am I here, what is my purpose on this earth when I am going to die anyway. I have suffered with an eating disorder since I was in my early teens and it is still a day to day struggle, always trying to be the perfectionist. I have 2 grown children and I am 61 years old. Thank you for doing this podcast !!!

[@lifelines3813]

Thank you for sharing, Ginger! You might enjoy some of our free community events at www.lifelines.com/events

[@Samtasticlife37]

Her journey sounds like my road map... I'm currently on the discovery journey beginning at age 57... Degree in Psych when I retire... Senior drop-out after 5 Majors which never spoke to me. Thank you both!

[@cateharding]

OMG!!! I got my granddaughter a Melissa & Doug cleaning set for Christmas and I love it! The quality is so comparable to toys I grew up with. I was born in 1975, when quality over quantity was important.

[@mirfir]

They remind me of German toys!! & German kindergarten!! The best! Melissa & Doug Toys.

[@catloverKD]

I needed this one. Growing up undiagnosed with a learning/social disability, that was always the message I got too. "You have to fit into our box of "traditional" education, and excel based on our standards, and the fact that you don't means there's something wrong with you. So, grow up, and get better at fitting where you never will, or we're going to make your life miserable." I'm still in my "I didn't write for 25 years" stage after some related trauma, but this gives me hope that I can find a partner and success somewhere on my own terms. Also, even though I know she'll never see it, as a severely anxious child, the best tip I can give the teacher(s) is PATIENCE. As an adult, I know that it's disruptive and takes time away from the goal of the day, but an anxious child is miserable, and a negative reaction from you is going to make it worse. Don't call on anybody who doesn't have their hand up, don't address it in front of the class if possible, and pick your battles. Do they really need to read out loud in front of everybody, do they need to do the presentation, or are there other ways to demonstrate the learning without the extra pressure?

[@medicinaemdia4895]

When Melissa was her retreat it completely reminded me of a scene from Gilmore Girls in with Lorelei (Lauren Grahen) goes to a retreat in California but never managed to finish the trip.

[@Lu-qu5mv]

The same thing happened to me when I read about hipersensibility. I realized I've been shut down my whole life. Thank you for put this for everyone to listen.

[@nithingopi2011]

I couldn't resist commenting. Honestly, of all artists out there, you're one of my favorites. Lots of love. ❤

[@eacorpe88]

OMG! Yes, my family was so annoyed (raising kids like Mayim and Johnathan, no early early tech). Mine is 6 now.....but his g-ma/g-pa (dads side) went so far as to send him his own tablet at age 3. I did not give it to him. I can totally relate to the struggle.

[@mirfir]

Great for you!!!

[@tictocsick6225]

This interview has moved me incomparably. I bought her book and started reading. Not only have I always supported her business. As I have 5 children myself. After watching this I am honored to have been able to support her creations and works of love. She literally moves me to continual tears. What a gorgeous human being, there are no words to express what a truly beautiful person Melissa is.

[@luluherzog8738]

I am sooo glad logotherapy is talked about, not long enough to my selfish desire, would love a more in-depth discussion about it please ?!❣️❣️✨Victor Frankl story is underrated 🤓

[@lifelines3813]

Lulu - totally agree! We're big fans of Victor Frankly and Man's Search for Meaning at LifeLines

[@missnicolemacy]

I have been waiting for this one, I asked my library to order her book so I can read it.

[@lifelines3813]

Thank you so much for asking the library, so that others can hopefully also benefit!

[@barbarabornholdt2854]

Oh my... Melissa you are my new hero! Put words to the demon I could not name. This podcast is everything my journey has needed at the very moment it could help me most! I am one of the few you all look to help and I thank you for it!

[@ElizabethMasonSquires]

Wow. Melissa! I have never heard anyone describe how I felt as a kid so accurately! I too sought perfectionism (still do) and lied to achieve that perfection. Eating disorders really started to manifest around 12, my 20s were all about self medicating, heck even up to my 40s. And, interestingly, I am not a liar. It was a survival tool. I don't know about you, but I was diagnosed ASD/ADHD/OCD and now recognize that for me, the fact that I felt that I feel no one really knows me, that feeling of being different was an in-ate part of my being. Thank you for putting into words so eloquently what I have always felt.

[@joshf.4270]

This podcast has been helping me through so much. You and your guests always help me reflect and re-examine my life in a positive way. Thank you so much for all you do! Also I’m an elementary teacher and use Melissa & Doug toys all the time, so seeing Melissa on here was really cool!

[@feminist5641]

Thank you for introducing me to logo therapy. I have never heard of this before today's podcast and I'm crying with relief to finally have words to describe what's going with me. Thank you Mayim and Jonathan for your informative show and thank you Melissa for sharing your story.

[@sunshinecommentswoop4902]

Never thought I would relate to Melissa's childhood so much, so glad she was on the pod :')

[@PromisedJubilee]

Also, when Melissa was talking about her "Aha!" moment I bawled. This is the first time I've ever heard someone else describe what it feels like to be me. So poignant.

[@lifelines3813]

Hi Promise, we're so glad it moved you!

[@marydeschler2847]

LlllLpp!

[@marydeschler2847]

! , ', , ,,

[@marydeschler2847]

J " .

[@marydeschler2847]

@@lifelines3813 p

[@darlenedoironsadler2863]

Another great episode!! Oh my gosh what a wonderful women Melissa is! She makes me smile and I love that she has done things her way! I love what Doug wrote in her book "About the Author" such a supportive man, brought a tear to my eyes.

[@lifelines3813]

Darlene - so glad you enjoyed the episode. And thanks for calling out Doug's dedication! - Doug, Melissa & the LifeLines Team

[@maryefraim6627]

You're doing great Melissa

[@TS-kq4bg]

OMG- I love your podcast. Kudos to all these people who come on to share their story and struggles.

[@nataliesirota2611]

I love Melissa & Doug toys! (We have all of the Judaica toys+.) Wow, I had no idea about the amazing people behind the brand. I can hardly wait to get ! I can totally relate to the isolation of being different and trying to be "perfect" to maintain the status quo within family dysfunction. OMGoodness, I am absolutely experiencing the fruitlessness of not being able to serve my kids and leaving them and me depleated!!! Logotherapy?! I am floored. Yes! This is the blesurse! Sobbing...mic drop...thank you! Mayim & Jonathan, you are a great couple; inspiring!

[@lifelines3813]

Natalie - so glad this touched you! And we love the term 'blesurse' :) - Melissa and the LifeLines Team

[@luluherzog8738]

Thank yous again for the clarity of all types of underlying confusion soup we brew day in day out ❣️❣️❣️much love ❤️

[@mabkoch]

Thank you! Best show! Wow! An eye opener.

[@bctracy8296]

Before I retired I worked for many years at a specialty toy store that sold non-big-box toys including every M & D product available.

[@mirfir]

The best!!

[@claudiadalcanale381]

Mayim, this episode was amazing!!! Melissa is a wonderful women. I’m new in your channel and I’m just loving it. I’m from Brazil, but moving soon to Canada. Thank you for being this beautiful person who exchange so many interesting thoughts with us. I couldn’t agree more with your thoughts!!! Love watching you and Jonatan on KZbin!! Keep doing it, so people can be better!!!

[@MissSuesSkills4Success]

Great episode! I'm an Early Childhood Educator and I love Melissa and Doug toys!! We have the pizza in my classroom and it is a favorite. It was so interesting to learn more about Melissa and her life. Her book sounds amazing too. So glad I found this podcast this summer!! 👏💗

[@orland0110]

This podcast has been so inspirational for me! Thank you so much Mayim for having such a wonderful guest like Melissa!

[@SL313]

This is so what I needed today! Thank you for bringing my spirits up yet again!

[@jessicasinclair1547]

I so empathize with Melissa over the perfectionism isn't enough so you start controlling everything within you to try and have some kind of baseline of 'sanity'.

[@lifelines3813]

We so relate!

[@sandrastrobel1254]

Mayim, send it to me too please! Lol This resonates so much with me. I thoroughly enjoyed this podcast. You did a wonderful.job and she is amazing and so interesting. Loved this.

[@lifelines3813]

Thanks Sandra, glad you enjoyed it! -Melissa & the LifeLines Team

[@agentawesometastic]

I love Johnathan's story at the beginning! I got a Spider Man pinball machine that didn't need batteries for my kid at age 8; after just a couple of times playing we were already talking about getting tools to take it apart. It was dismantled into a million pieces. Probably a lot more learning with that activity than playing the game lol. I followed up with a sewing machine. Waldorf dork parent here too!

[@taniawebster5867]

Absolutely a worth listening podcast and I love this episode so much. Mayim and Jonathan make this podcast the amazing podcast it is. Loved this episode with Melissa and I can't wait till the next one.

[@M8tt100]

Wow this one was amazing, the deepness & soul searching was amazing. But also the introspection & raw honesty was what made it for me.

[@michellebustos5671]

Wow!! What an inspirational woman! To overcome what she did, build an incredible brand that is so well respected and loved by so many and do it her way! I am a Montessori mom and I absolutely know and love their brand.

[@kimbrown3752]

I related to this feeling she describes. I've never been able to name it or explain it as well. I recognized it from early childhood. Always knowing I didn't fit the mold. This book is already in my Amazon cart!!

[@tinawilson2142]

I love their toys!!!!

[@nadeen.a.5861]

Thank you so much for making this podcast. You and your guests have opened up my mind and heart to things I didn’t realize I needed to know. And made sense of things I’ve always felt. I recommend this podcast to everyone I know. I look forward to it every week.

[@catherinemakohn6141]

Great episode! Love to all

[@christine-joylovepaper3146]

LOVE Melissa & Doug!

[@Mrs_Guac_and_Glock]

Ok, this was the best episode ever! I had some kind of weird epiphany at one point and felt a tremendous amount of peace come over me. Not sure where it came from, but I'm gonna run with it. Melissa, my kids love your toys, but I don't think it's as much as I (the parent) do ☺️ I have loved writing for as long as I can remember but had my soul crushed by a college professor as well. My husband has been encouraging me to write lately, and it's like this podcast was the big sign from the universe! Final note: I wanted to get the book anyway, but now I absolutely am, just to further stick it to the woman who put you down.

[@sarahfriend5357]

I so completely COMPLETELY associate to this martyrdom concept in my life.

[@lifelines3813]

Hi Sarah, so glad that concept resonated. We have to fill our own wells first! We'd invite you to keep an eye on the www.lifelines.com/events page. We're planning a series of free workshops in September on how to keep our own wells and energy reserves full

[@mirfir]

Holy moly!! Hats off to Melissa!

[@mirfir]

My whole family is different from the get-go!! Indian adoptee here! Youngest of 3 adoptees. I’ve embraced it! It works to my advantage!!

[@ally6593]

Wow- amazing interview. I love hearing from authors. As a perfectionist myself, I related to her a lot.

[@rachelgrig9985]

Yes! I was so waiting for another episode 🙏❤️

[@user-tz4zj1nb9j]

Voice so calming it helps me to sleep

[@PromisedJubilee]

MY GOSH, we are so much alike, Mayim. I didn't know any of that stuff about your childrearing style. I was the big fat weirdo in every group! 💯

[@kassidymiller3223]

Loved this episode!

[@ltbohannon3662]

I appreciate this episode so much. I am not even sure if I can put into words how I feel about it. I related to Melissa on the impulse to lie and the feelings of not being in the right place. And really why are we here. Anyway, thank you.

[@kimberlyrshan81]

Great episode!

[@Kthree1995]

Melissa's need for perfection sounds very familiar. My parent's had the same kind of meeting with my teachers, too. My mother's response was to put me in piano lessons because she figured I couldn't be perfect there. I'm not sure it worked, but it was her idea.

[@tinablake1328]

Frist off about the Toys as a grandmother I was given the request to buy M&D toys. Loved them seems like stuff I use to play with. Secondly Melissa truly inspirational chat and I be watching for my amazon order of your book.

[@Indu.......17]

I love mayim bailik ,she is soo great.i ur huge fan ❤️💜❤️💜

[@J_Kwan]

If there's anything I've learnt about kids in my life, it's that their creativity is never limited by the bounds of what adults would call "toys". My dad nail clipped his tricycle to pieces as a little and I'm sure he got a lot of entertainment from that too.

[@miriamharper4368]

I couldn't wait until the end of the episode to order the book. It sounds like it's really going to be helpful. This has been one of the best chats yet. This podcast gets better and better, and is the highlight of my week. Thank you ❤️

[@lifelines3813]

Thanks Miriam! We're so touched you ordered the book.

[@miriamharper4368]

@@lifelines3813 I've started to explore your website, too. Really inspiring. Thank you 😊

[@Z-Fan]

For us it’s the Birthday cake play set! I will keep it forever:)

[@silviabliss4853]

I loved this interview. I just ordered the book :)

[@mirfir]

🥰 the book introduction!

[@robinsiciliano9084]

Watch how selfless I can be..........ugh, I relate to that statement like a ridiculous amount.

[@mirfir]

I think we have several meanings over the course of our lives. Different stages of life = different meanings.

[@rebeccarolen]

Melissa after thought: “We should’ve turn off our ringers” We heard the crickets. Ok, I heard the crickets. Great interview. 👏👏

[@tiofliper2535]

Great video... I love your videos. 😘

[@ceciliagabbi4968]

Good episode! Thanks a lot! I have a question not really related to it, but I need to ask... Mayim, you are such an intelligent, modern and engaged woman, why do you keep using plastic when you could make other choices?

[@mirfir]

Creatives…very true!!!!

[@marisamartinezolivera]

OMG, How I like Mayim’s concept of “The New Femenine Guard”. Better than multitasking and superwoman ones! I had my kid while finishing my PhD, working part time and breast feeding him, so during months my kid was perpetually hung on my hips. I’m quite sure that in those times my fellows saw me as a reincarnation of Modigliani’s painting “Gipsy woman with kid”😂😂 And I’m sure Mayim, you must look like that too. As my husband said: The most beautiful image of a “Maternity” after Michelangelo’s crying Pietà…. And how I love Mayim calling Jonathan her lifeline!!!💜

[@somguy728]

You're a perfect example of how people rationalize their thoughts, feelings, choices and lives. It's one of the only universal human traits.

[@MoonDoggieAngel13]

I watch all the podcasts, I think I like them. I say it that way because I think I don't understand them.

[@abbiebroussard3220]

I love your podcast!! The people you have as guests are incredibly fascinating. The part I do not like, and please take this as kindly as I can say it, is that most of the products you choose to advertise are products that the middle class cannot afford. $84 dollars for lotion is insane when most of us struggle to buy nice $5, $10, or the rare $20 dollar lotion. Maybe I am the only one who is thinking this, but can you please consider advertising for companies of products that your fan base can actually afford?

[@kathrynforest4368]

you are not the only one, 50 oercent of americans are at, near or under poverty level, the life both mayiam and doug and melissa have created, , well many of us also work hard ad get noehre near that have been able to create is not what most of us have only one percent o americans, and the 20 percent below them .attain sucess and stablity $ wise..it is not the majority of us, America is built on quicksand and illusion not a firm foundation .PS we are no longer middle class

[@christinethorington3314]

My son has those toys. Wow. Totally awesome

[@mirfir]

I love wooden toys!!! The best!!

[@leticiaperez243]

I am not a hippy I don’t think but my kids only has wooden and educational toys we loved the kitchen set

[@robinkirkpatrick9090]

This reminds me of a Title of Shoe lyric “I’d rather be nine people’s favorite thing Than a hundred people’s ninth favorite thing Nine peoples favorite thing Than a hundred people’s ninth favorite thing.”

[@themcgeefamily7514]

❤💙

[@lukelott2800]

And I love you all

[@melissagayheart7716]

I'm a preschool teacher we have TONS of "Melissa and Doug" items lol

[@giftem4350]

OMG!!!

[@davidadams2395]

M & D may have started with good intentions, but their company has been rife with problems since at least 2008: Recalls of toys with toxic paint, a toxic metal in toys designed to go into the mouth, such as their harmonica. Their _"wood"_ toys are made from MDF (which contains formaldehyde) and there have been issues with flaking paint, and their toys are manufactured in China. I had thought maybe Mayim would have been aware of these problems, but she touted M & D as the single best, eco-friendly toy manufacturer ever.

[@sandieking9007]

Please consider having Mel Robbins as a guest!

[@ginnyg2003]

Noom recommended a 1,200 calorie a day diet for me. I did 2 months of Noom and I lost 35 pounds (which scared my doctor). My doctor explained that that's super unhealthy and no where near enough food. I was then so starved that I binged and binged and binged and now I'm up 70 pounds. What a mess Noom was!

[@MrCoconutcat]

Intellectually self expressive memoirs triumphantly succeed to our joyful excitement and relief like the journey for the moon landing from 1969 who would know huh I would of

[@angierecovering_clutterer2434]

You're dating yourself with the Toys R Us reference. Makes me so sad it's gone!

[@nohjuan3048]

I can't count the number of Melissa and Doug toys I have bought. Your awards come through repeat orders. No other award is necessary.

[@juliemcdonnell2232]

I have no idea how else to let you guys know this so KZbin comments it is!Alexa and Siri are REALLY bad at recognizing your name when spoken. It’s really frustrating… also kinda racist? Not your fault, but I figured you might know Bazos or Cook. Anyways. I always listen because I have a toddler. With that said, I DID NOT THINK JOHNATHAN LOOKED LIKED THAT. Canadian cutie 😜

[@4russpowell]

I felt like she kind of dodged some major questions but I guess that’s her boundary/right to privacy?

[@kathrynforest4368]

seems to me there is also a distinct possibilty of CPTSD in childhood, but there also was privilege...the angst and wounds were deep and wanting the meaning of life. But few of us have a Doug and none of us live in a 29,000 square foot house, are billionaires or can afford a therapist, if one is even available. obviously money does not bring happiness but it allows one the choice to devote the tie to heal.Before creating the website they did programs, programs at colleges on promoting capitialism, entrepreneurship...Beleiving that resources are infinite in in finite world...cut off from the fact even before the pandemic 50 percent of americans are at , near or under the poverty level..Deeply knowing onesself is a privilege ,just keeping a roof over ones head or needing one, does not allow people to swim in self knowledge when they can barely keep their body going, to delve, for most people. is a luxury when you add the stres of getting enough ood, shelter, healthcare, for many affording medication and on and on...and now we are headed to cisis o scarcity and people are acting as i things can be normal (as in what normal has been for americans) taking care of her brother was treating her like an adult not a child , she had a double set of needs..Seemingly off track but his connects to where the world and America is at and really going kzbin.info/www/bejne/mGKtnYyQhqxmoqs

[@ChrisPhoenixMusic]

When conventions do not align with what is preferred it is time to change convention. If it disagrees with what is best and what it desired, it is a fantasy and should be deemed irrelevant.

[@mirfir]

I love Jonathan Cohen!! 😂😂😂🥰🥰

[@catrionacollins2593]

OK but why didn't jothan take the screwdrivers away from his son 🤔

[@debbiereuvenny6215]

I have been enjoying your podcasts for a number of months now. They usually accompany me on my morning walks. I enjoy how you relate your neuroscience expertise to some of the mental health issues you converse about. I appreciate your openness about your own journey; as well as Jonathan’s openness and experiences. However, I find it really difficult to listen to you shame Jonathan as often as you do. I truly believe that you don’t mean to do it given your history and MH struggles and I give Jonathan a lot of credit for “laughing it off” during the show, but I can only imagine how hurtful it must be for him both because of this public forum and coming from a woman he most obviously trusts. In this podcast you were particularly shaming at the end during your show summary when Jonathan tried to share his own struggles with lying to protect himself in his youth and how he has tried to be more honest with his emotions as an adult. You totally dissed him instead of applauding him. Mayim, as much as I enjoy you, and your and Jonathan’s work together, I don’t know if I can continue to listen and condone this practice. Please understand this comes from a place of compassion and not criticism. I truly wish you both well.

[@lukelott2800]

But is on record now against them

[@user-fq9un9bz8b]

Hello my very special girl mayim bialik i love your podcast programs and on jeopardy ohh my goodness you have very much impressed me with all the outfits those ladys in your side of the dressing room my beautiful girl wow whatever they help you into it doesn't matter to me just so your comfortable and happy 😊 thats all i care about but i dont want you to be cold either i love it when your warm happy and comfortable and your shoes to go along with your outfits be comfortable in that scence as well Amanda Miller Rockledge Florida

[@artandcard]

@Mayim Bialik, 4Patriots 3-month Survival Food Kits, an advertisement for revolution dooms day preppers, came before your video. I thought you might like to know.

[@marisamartinezolivera]

Not to me…🤔

[@Northstadiumhusker]

KZbin strikes again. SMH

[@simulationdisruptor6033]

Problem ?

[@mirfir]

Gee, I’m more mentally healthy than I thought!

[@begoniatabriz6828]

Melissa shows the signs of an abused child. I recognise myself in most of her symptoms.

[@mirfir]

Insightful observation.

[@mikeassad9936]

Notion notion notion

[@ximenaromanelizondo1051]

Melissa is a total enneagram Type 4

[@lukelott2800]

I told the police I was gonna cut my gift box off and they locked me up in chi with no scissors for 3 days them sent me home where all the scissors are lol because of nbc6 south florida

[@vaishnavijahagirdar3835]

Can I say something..it is awesome but toooooooo long!

[@Indu.......17]

Yea , it is nice

[@ktkupkake]

The podcasts I listen to/view are all around 1-1.5 hours long.

[@emilylowrance7930]

you can listen at your own pace though. = o )

[@juliemcdonnell2232]

I LOOOOVE it long. To each their own

[@Wheezywatches]

I love this podcast.. but as soon as I heard Noom I was out. Shocking that you would push a diet program that shields itself in “psychology habit changing.” Nonsense.

[@TribeWilloughby]

Wish Y'all would quit, make'n "Sport" of Kids, for Wages!