Metal Gear's Biggest Missed Opportunity (WHY DOES NO ONE TALK ABOUT THIS???)

[@MusicConfusion99]

I still very vividly remember Metal Gear Solid: Rising. I was in High School when MGS4 came out and I was blown away by it and loved it whole heartedly. I was so excited for the next one. I would constantly check the internet for news about the next Metal Gear. I remember the announcement for Metal Gear Solid: Rising. I was really looking forward to seeing Raiden's transformation into a cyborg ninja and everything they promised in the story. I love Revengence but I still hold just a little bit of bitterness that we didnt get to see the original.

[@dragb9284]

I mean just the sound track of what we got is legendary in its own way so might be an equivalent exchange

[@TheVampragon]

Also door's still open for a prequel in the future!

[@caitlynrankin8845]

@@TheVampragon pretty sure there making a sequel

[@ARC51bowtie]

@@caitlynrankin8845 nice argument senator, why don't you back it up with a source?

[@caitlynrankin8845]

@@ARC51bowtie my source is i made it the fuck up

[@funnywes]

YES. YES. YES. i love mgr, but i'd give just about anything to get a game centered around saving sunny. a more personal, darker look into just HOW he turned out how he did in 4. i've been hoping for a video like this for some time. very well done

[@arron390]

Hey its the funny guy!

[@everyonesfavoritesejong]

Why aren't you verified?

[@eat-lc5rx]

Honestly revengeance felt like a logical progression after mgs4. War crazed world spiraling out of control. Mgs4 set up a philosophy of the PMC's. Revengeance showed the gritty reality of what that philosophy devolves into.

[@VegaFic]

The memes...

[@MrTigracho]

Just like today. Not gonna lie. The ending literally felt like the birth of a new Big Boss.

[@quarreneverett4767]

I just accept.mgs 4 was never meant to be and didnt happen

[@raheemaslam7363]

@@MrTigracho what do you mean?

[@MrTigracho]

@V Yeah. He still would get painted as a lawless Pariah by the world.

[@Clean.Eastwood]

The saddest thing is that, if it wasn't for Konami being practically dead, now would be the ideal time for a new MGS game starring Raiden, considering all the hype he's been getting on the internet.

[@BasedPeter]

This is a great thematic rundown, but I still think in many ways MGRR continues the ideas of MGS2in regards to self, identity, (Sam) narrative and self-determination (Armstrong). They try to do it to a lesser degree with Mistral and Monsoon, but I think those two fall a little flat due to ridiculously low screentime. I don't know what the hell is going on with Sundowner though lmao, dude's like Alex Jones on nanomachine steroids.

[@CrystalWings12]

Or as Max0r said, 'Jacked Bezos'.

[@ieatcheese361]

hes fuckin invincible

[@zer0stars]

In terms of MGR:R, it's Raiden slowly realizing himself through his enemies. I often see them as parallels of Raiden up to that point in time. Slowly, they are breaking away at the ideals of Raiden. For example, Mistral is also an orphan who discovered that they were good at killing so she thought of this as her calling. She didn't have an ideal but by meeting a man (Armstrong) it all changed and it allowed her to fight for an ideal. For me, this is similar to MGS2, Raiden was lost, only thinking of himself as a weapon. Through Snake, he was able to find an ideal. With Monsoon, Raiden's ideals after that whole thing about who protects the weak from the man who protects the weak was completely shattered. Through Monsoon, he regained back his Jack the Ripper persona and accepted it completely. This allowed him to acknowledge that yes, he does kill people and he needs to stop making excuses. Sundowner is Jack the Ripper in full form. If Raiden has allowed his Ripper persona to completely transform him to a psychopath who only loves war and destruction. Sundowner is one of the purest characters ever in a very very literal sense. He does not have any ideals, any motives, or any goals. The only thing he wants is death, war, destruction and his pleasure in massacring people. Each enemy in the game serves as a cautionary tale on what Raiden could have been. Even Armstrong and Sam serves as a warning with Sam being the cautionary tale of losing yourself and giving up on your ideals just because you got defeated. Meanwhile Armstrong would be Raiden if he didn't have the hardships occur to him. Armstrong considered Jack to be his worthy successor because he carved his own path even with all the things that happened to him. Armstrong, however, is someone who hasn't gone through the hardships of life.

[@CrystalWings12]

@@zer0stars This makes so much sense, ngl.

[@feister2869]

@@zer0stars don’t forget, they still have their own narratives and an intriguing past and thoughts (you could analyse the lyrics for their personality or see codec’s for these bosses past)

[@Owl_of_Books]

I personally believe that Raiden was highly underrated, and I enjoyed his story in MGS 2, because realistically speaking, Raiden is much more skilled than Snake in combat, and likely up there with Big Boss; he wasn't genetically engineered, he wasn't a clone, and he also didn't inherit his expertise from a legendary soldier, he was a child soldier who was fed meals with gun powder mixed in, just to keep him active, this is something the fanbase always overlooks, so in a way, he's entitled to complain on occasion, because he's literally been fighting his whole life, while Snake just happened to inherit his skills, and personality, hence why he's so serious and comes across as really tough... That's just a mirror of Big Boss, but Raiden really is a true legend, who became what he is in MGS 2, through pure trauma, and from being a child soldier, and trained to kill at such a young age.

[@DanSmeed]

I think you're simplifying when you say that Solid inherited his skills. There's a lot of experience behind him at the points in time when we controlled him.

[@mikesmith145]

Dude, Snake was a Green Beret at one point, don’t undersell him

[@Owl_of_Books]

@@mikesmith145 Sure he was a Green Beret, but there's still some decisions he made prior to going on that Outer Heaven mission that Big Boss would've likely made as well, and who's to say that Big Boss wasn't also part of the Green Beret at some point too, hence why he was able to help develop CQC with The Boss?

[@Owl_of_Books]

@@DanSmeed That's because Snake inherited the side of Big Boss that was more sympathetic towards actually being a hero, while Liquid inherited the war monger side, but Raiden isn't a side of a coin like those two are, hence why he's underrated, due to his backstory.

[@lightlayagajoie5739]

The switch to raiden was a brilliant move storytelling-wise. Because Raiden has really a similar story arc to Snake. Deep down he is not really cool and collected and in control like his image appears but a ball of trauma just reacting and stuck in a matrix-like narrative of lies. It is only after MGS 1 that Snake becomes really free and will no longer be used as a pawn. But the tragedy he is not really able to do anything besides fighting in war. Just like raiden. We don't like raiden as fans because he isn't as cool and he whines about his sorry background story of being a helpless child. But really Snake is not much different having never been free and raised by sociopaths to be a killing machine. If it wasnt for grey fox(and naomy) snake would have been killed after mgs1. now snake is doing something similar to Raiden that makes him be able to see his relationship with his superiors so that afterwards he can be free. isnt that inspiring? Later he becomes just like grey fox a cyborg ninja isn't that cool? And a pain in de side of the people that sought to make him into a tool of war. Or is he still being used? You can't say for sure.

[@SchwaWasHere]

I just think that the original version would have been more interesting since it seems like you'd be cutting apart actual soldiers, not the Gatorade filled cyborgs we got (Then again I think Japan has something about dismemberment censorship in it's games) Also something nags at me that the capability of the engine wasn't enough to "cut everything" like they marketed. Would be interested in what they could do with the tech today. Definitely worth a look at the OG script tho

[@j0hnicide]

how could japan have dismemberment censorship when vergil tears nero's arm off in dmc 5

[@DwAboutItManFr]

What the fucka vowel, go back to your country.

[@TheOneToKeepYouWaiting]

It’s likely that they changed the enemies to cyborgs due to the hardware limitations of the Xbox 360 and PS3. Konami clearly doesn’t have a problem with gore as shown by Snake getting his eye shot out.

[@PSYMEDIC]

Not likely to happen with Konami around. Which is very unfortunate. Would still be nice if another studio would make a game like this.

[@cman8995]

As much as I loved Revegeance and its fast-paced action. It's a bit disappointing that the Rising's weighty and still-impressive physic action were shelved along with the interesting MGS4 prequel story of Raiden rescuing Sunny, especially when the storyline has been teased and foreshadowed numerous times throughout the story of MGS4.

[@pickyphysicsstudent201]

Out of the two theories you gave, I prefer the idea of Raiden augmenting himself being an optional mechanic over the use of Sunny. It's like how in Lisa the Painful & Undertale not using Joy & killing Monsters (respectively) makes your run harder but you get the good ending. Then again, you would have to rescale the whole of MGR, in both gameplay & story, around these choices. Naked Raiden wouldn't be able to standup to any of the bosses, without quick-saving every nanosecond. It's a good idea but I don't think it meshes well with MGR - an action game. Not to mention it falls into the cyberpunk trope of "Cybernetics may seem cool BUT TheY eAt AwAy aT YoUr sOUl...... aomehow." In case of Sunny; I have nothing against her but using her as a main motivation for Raiden would be cheep. It would be better for Raiden to be motivated by other interests than just saving/protecting a loved one. It's difficult to put into words but it feels like a cop-out. You can have all the complex interweb of motives but then the motive of Sunny just trumps them all and it makes things less interesting.

[@PabbyPabbles]

the good ending: "Raiden, you can't not be a cyborg right now! You know it's a Time Paradox!"

[@Mate_Antal_Zoltan]

Sunny isn't just a "loved one" Olga saved Raiden's life, so I think he owes her a favor lmao

[@chrizzel28]

Now this is certainly an interesting perspective, I had honestly forgotten about the original direction the game was going to take. I feel a similar desire to see the original script, but I will say that I think MGR is the best game we could have gotten. It remains my favourite Metal Gear for far more than just the intense gameplay. It's insane to have a game with so many small parts that can be cut out of context while still keeping the message entirely in tact, to the point where all the meme clips still point in one solid direction. The ideal would be a world where we got both games, but I think the world with MGR is far better than the world where we got MGS:R. And one thing I truly like about MGR's post-4 story is just seeing that Sunny is growing up and into her own a little. The scenes with Blade Wolf gave me a bit of hope for their world that in many ways still seems like it will never be truly free of war, because even in there those that were victimised by it get their shot at real happiness thanks to the actions of people like Snake and Raiden.

[@godnyx117]

Saying that MGR is your favorite Metal Gear (probably for me as well), would be the same as if you went out and said that Halo 5 is your favorite Halo game (which is for me). The difference however and what shows that Metal Gear's community is great is that you won't get hated for it while the garbage Halo's community would hate someone that would say that. Anyway, this may have been a little bit weird but I just wanted to point this out as it just instantly came into my mind!

[@CrystalWings12]

@@godnyx117 Wait, what's wrong with Halo 5, anyway?

[@godnyx117]

@@CrystalWings12 The story is bad... and that's pretty much it. The community loves to hate it however.

[@CrystalWings12]

@@godnyx117 Ah, okay. So how about the newest Halo game? Is it still bad as the fifth one? (Yeah, I kinda forgotten about that game since Halo 3)

[@godnyx117]

@@CrystalWings12 The gameplay is... ok, I guess! Worse than Halo 5 but I can still have fun even in while I'm in a huge disadvantage (TV screen, 30fps on Xbox One, wireless controller, TERRIBLE PING). I didn't played the campaign but a friend who did said that it wasn't anything interesting.

[@PhantomHaseo]

#ReleaseTheKojimaCut Yeah, I always thought the original story for Rising (Raiden's mission to rescue Olga's child and his BladeRunner mishap) was a fantastic story that could have really delved into the darker themes of soldiers including trauma, ptsd, and belief. I love Revengence, but I think Rising could have been a better tying of plot threads then MGS4 retconing aspects of MGS2 because a lot of people missed the greater narrative.

[@kingr.warrior.4906]

Well, they could use the original storyline in a MGR sequel, it still has the great gameplay with the added bonus of a storyline with a narrative far superior to the original. It would easily enter the best video game sequels in history.

[@thefearofg0ds758]

13:30 to this day I'm still wondering what the hell happened to Raiden's body. I remember a long running forum on IGN back in the day talking about it. The common belief was that his body was "falling apart" because of the white blood in his body or he was captured while rescuing Sonny and they experimented on him.

[@eriktruchinskas3747]

I think he was captured and expirememnted on

[@thefearofg0ds758]

​@Young Donald i actually liked it but felt they could have dialed it back a bit. I like "damaged" characters. They didn't have to turn his whole body cybernetic, but say he lost his arm and had it replaced with a cybernetic one. Revengence went WAY too far and that's why I never played it.

[@cman8995]

@Young Donald "mgsr made me feel like he did it to himself" it's hard to deduct that idea considering only thing that came out of MGSR was a tech demo trailer. I always thought that MGSR started off with intro-mission where Jack rescues sunny, gets experimented on and rest of the game he tries to shelter baby sunny as a cyborg like a weird Yoshi's island, considering that's the cannon of what happened.

[@bounce2urchest350]

@@thefearofg0ds758 in case you forgot, he was quite literally fully cybernetic in MGS4. it’s a regular thing in the MGS universe for cyborg ninjas to exist. take gray fox for example from MGS1. he was also a cyborg ninja. it wasn’t out of the realm and i don’t think they went overboard at all lmao.

[@thefearofg0ds758]

@@bounce2urchest350 I meant overboard as in how batshit Raiden was. His cybernetics were presented with a sense of bodyhorror in MGS4. In Revengence he was spouting oneliners etc.

[@dasuero7489]

I love the new editing and the jokes in this video, Max. Your production quality is definitely peaking positively. Keep it up!

[@paulwillplay]

This is the game I've wanted every game to be since it was unfortunately cancelled. I followed its development religiously, and I was hit with an aching sense of longing when I first learned the original script exists. I absolutely adore Revengeance, but that doesn't mean there isn't room this story as well. After all, it would be the story of his transformation into the Raiden we eventually see in Revengeance. I do think it makes sense for Raiden to gradually transition away from stealth, since his stealthy persona was the patriot-implanted persona he forsakes at the end of MGS2. Though I do think that "ninja stealth," that features sabotage and ambush could play a little more realistically than typical MGS, despite the overt sci-fi nature of the game. Even with a silencer, anyone nearby will be alerted, so it's about going extra ham on the stealth until you have to go extra ham on the action, then go dark again. "Silence, violence, silence," they say. Something that especially excited me about Rising was the seeming notion that it might begin to bridge the MGS timeline into Snatcher, and Policenauts given that Dr. Madnar is a character in both and was undoubtedly morphed into Revengeance's Doktor, and Raiden's cyborg design somewhat resembles the design of the Snatcher bioroids, as well as the white-blooded frozeners in Policenauts, who I always thought kinda seemed like a distant evolution of Snatcher technology. Thank you for making this video. I enjoyed watching it and then rambling about it afterwards

[@wearecoterminous]

found all your metal gear stuff during my metal gear resurgence (which would be a good name for a game) and i'm super glad lol. thanks for giving me something to watch while i play the millionth time!

[@SaiyanScholar]

Metal Gear Rising is the True Metal Gear Solid 5.

[@GamesofFuturesPast]

I remember seeing the original trailer for MGR before they turned it into revengeance. I thought it looked really cool and always wondered why they changed it. It reminds me of the first version of RE4 and how much it changed.

[@maxturbo45]

It doesn't matter how long or why your videos take a good minute to come out, they're always gonna be amazing, keep up the great work Max 👍🏾

[@procrastinationoctopus3233]

Dude, I remember being so excited for MGS Rising and getting so freaking disappointed by Revengeance. It was a cool game, but it had very little of what I liked about MGS and the original Rising.

[@PrimeTrace]

#ReleaseTheKojimaCut I've always wondered what happened to Raiden to become a cyborg. That part of the story I don't think ever really gets told in detail

[@psychoangelmgs]

I literally was talking to my friend saying I wish I still got to play Metal Gear Solid: Rising. I love Revengeance, but I wanted to experience Raiden becoming a cyborg in that gap in canon.

[@groovysnake6664]

Max, your channel is still my favorite on YT, thanks for giving Raiden the love he deserves. I've just started replaying mgsr and love the hell out of it, but it is painful to see what could have been with those early trailers.

[@AmelpsXett]

I really wish MGSR was finished and released, because i really want to hear Raiden's thoughts on MGS US society, AI and more converstations with the said AI, since it was planned to be in a military base. What if GW was to talk to Raiden through terminals and loud speakers, like Breen did in HL2? Also i want to see a cutscene of Patriots cutting off his body, or at least sounds of it with a black screen The idea with transforming Raiden throught the course of the game is pretty cool and it narrowly avoids why Human Revolution story was a major poopoo, since its not about society but Raiden's personal issues

[@TheEpicpwnr100]

I've thought about this myself as I remember when the game was a Solid game before it went to Platinum. If they ever wanted to return to this concept, I think a cool way to handle it would be to have the first half of the game function like a standard Solid stealth game, but then either progressively or instantly have it shift to have more character action elements of rising once Raiden transitions into the cyborg. Another concept that was dropped was to have an MGS game be a prequel starring the Boss in WWII. I believe that's what the plan for PW was before they went back to snake. Part of me wants to see that, but another part makes me think there's no way it would work without botching something significant, story-wise.

[@onyxfinger7431]

I still remember MGS Rising, mainly because of the gameplay scenes we got from it. They look great ! FOr example, at 6:23 Raiden jumps onto a wall and runs on it while deflecting gekko machinegun attacks wich are actually threatening.

[@_GeneralMechanics_]

You're right, Spielberg not being in charge of the direction of the Transformers movies was another missed opportunity.

[@cosmindobre8899]

Yes I knew about the original game and honestly, I want more a sequel to Revengeance. I am more interested in seeing what happens to Raiden after the fight with Armstrong. I would love to see the original story in some shape or another, but I think if we ever get another game with Raiden, it should have the same gameplay as Revengeance. Even if we don’t know many details about the original, I don’t think it will match well with the Platinum-style Action, the gameplay should be changed to reflect that original story. Btw great video Max, keep up the good work!!!!

[@Idiotboxxx]

Biggest miss was no Peacewalker-esque Co-Op in TPP

[@dylancourville8708]

That was a thoughtful explanation of a theoretical plot for a game I will never play. To this day I can’t bring myself to care to play Rising Revengence. I like platinum games to some capacity but the over the top style takes me out of the Metal Gear world. Instead, I would have loved to see a Tensue ninja assassin type game in place of a Bayonetta style gameplay.

[@jackelstone1502]

I've been saying for years that the biggest thing the mgs series was missing was a game set between mgs 2 and 4 where we get an equal split between a prime solid and a more grounded but still hack and slash reminiscent Raiden.

[@BigBadBalrog]

As someone who never has a PS2 and missed out on MGS2 in its heyday, a modern version of MGSR would be a dream come true #ReleaseTheKojimaCut

[@PompadourSamurai]

That concept art of Raiden with a baby Sunny reminds me a bit of Lone Wolf and Cub. Shame that such an interesting situation for a game's protagonist got stranded...

[@SOLIDSNAKE.]

Lol I remember for the briefest moment I thought mgs3 was about rescuing sunny When it was first announced in a psm magazine circa 2003 ish

[@jalawa-hiska]

I would love to see the original story for this. I actually wasn't aware that it covered Raiden rescuing Sunny; I'd always wondered where that part of the story went too. #ReleaseTheKojimaCut I also think the ideas you had sound incredible honestly. The grey morality of the MG games has always been one of my favorite parts, and I had always wondered how Raiden really felt about being a cyborg. Leaving that up to the player would make our connection to him very interesting.

[@eliteninja23]

#releasethekojimacut it’s been nice to see rising finally getting the popularity it deserves, that’s all I know.

[@GrieveIV]

Wasn’t there also a version of Revengeance where it was gray fox cutting up zombies?

[@bigcade554]

Kojima floated that as a possible sequel.

[@GrieveIV]

@@bigcade554 ah

[@RecluseBootsy]

As far as i know, it was just a concept he pitched. Nothing fleshed out.

[@stahnke_as_pho]

I could see this being a hidden nightmare sequence similar to the one in Snake Eater

[@purplesamurai5205]

I wish we got a game where Gray Fox fought Dr Clark in the early 2000s.

[@MannFace51]

What if the ever-so elusive Metal Gear movie Hideo is supposedly working on IS the would-be plot of rising? Copium, I know :/ but hear me out: Film as a medium would be perfect as we the players would see Raiden take on the world as he saw he needed to following his liberation from the Patriot AI at the end of 2. Regardless, I do agree with your take on revengence. For me it ruins the arc Raiden went through in 4 just to have him become a rather generic cyborg ninja and meme-machine along with a certain senator. I’d have loved to have seen the depths of despair, pain, and internal turmoil that crushed Raiden into the diamond he became for MGS4.

[@republicofsandles]

One could contrast Raiden protecting Sonny by continuing his existence With Huey Emmerich seriously and deliberately endangering his children as part of his self-destructive tendency. I know you like Freud, so I've some aphorisms you might like: 1. Euphemistically, the death drive is a large factor in Japanese society today. One could wonder if Kojima was trying to show the harm to others which may occur from harming one's self. 2. Euphemistically, Eros plays a small factor in Japanese society today, because birth rates are lower. One could argue that Dark Souls and the option of linking the fire or not, frames the libidinal dilemma of whether or not to procreate.

[@VioStarclad]

Personally I think the biggest missed opportunity of MGS is that we could have technically had a game about The Boss kicking ass through WW2 and in stead we got uhhh whatever happened in MGS5? Don't get me wrong the game was fun to play but despite having many hours in it the plot barely stuck with me at all.

[@LiquidSolidus9000]

I didn't really know anything about the original Rising narrative but I do remember the original showcase and announcement. There was a website with a countdown timer that would flash back and forth between images of Big Boss and Raiden, since it was announced at the same time as Peace Walker. I've still never actually played through Rising, with the recent popularity of memes I should probably get it it sometime

[@tylerramos7633]

I personally always loved Rising Revengeance and am glad it’s finally being acknowledged for how good it is.

[@himwhoisnottobenamed5427]

I know what you mean about wanting to see something as it was intended. Or could of been. I’ve always wanted to visit the universes where Eric Stoltz portrayed Marty McFly. Or where the Hallowe’en anthology idea took off. Or Will Smith as Neo.

[@dontcare3]

Makes me think of resident evil 4 and how the original version was scrapped but it still maintained a high level of interest even tho what it became was best for it.

[@kevinharris8859]

I remember the flash player lightning announcement, I was thrilled to think we were going to get two games in the MGU. The story was just a let down for both I think.

[@RoflMaiWaffel]

8:58 Raiden's real name is Dank Sinatra

[@monkeyheist]

Wow, your pitch for a story between MGS2 and 4 is fantastic!

[@markusvarusk4643]

raiden before becoming like the strongest mf in the universe was soooo underrated like he has his chad moments but he also has chracater snake is just some quiet tough guy all the time

[@The_Longest_Handle_Of_All_Time]

Yes, it is a missed opportunity, glad you're talking about this. I was so disappointed with the MGR we got, I really hoped for a continuation from MSG2 and it's themes, there's so much about MGS2 back then that needed answers and Rising was the game for it and never got. I'm just so disappointed with MGR that every time I remember how the game could be hurts my soul. But I got to play along with the crowd and praise it, don't want to be called by the younger audience a minority elitist fanboy

[@lyndaarambula8730]

Except the Mgr we got was for the better dude, it was not a disappointment at all. While Solid Rising would have been interesting, the game we got in this world is for the better and that game nailed it.

[@The_Longest_Handle_Of_All_Time]

@@lyndaarambula8730 Rising wouldn't be just interesting, it would perfectly fit into the metal gear timeline. If you say they nailed it as a hack and slash game then yes, but as a metal gear game? No. Out of all the disappointments I get from this game was them turning Raiden's childhood trauma into his superpower. He's now proud of being Jack the Ripper, great. Just great. Anyway, if MGR is your first MGS game, then I'm sorry for disrespecting it. It is just not the game we were promised a decade ago.

[@EugenePoole94]

I care not about being labeled by a younger audience. Rising being the future of Metal Gear is shallow. It's as shallow as being brought up to speed by tok tok. Remember when Ocelot in mgs 4 said that the system was "put in place to ensure that future generations never prosper"? Yeah, that's this younger audiences relationship to Revengeance. It's the result of Raiden picking up the sword again after Snake told him it wasn't necessary anymore. That's why post mgs 4 Rising doesn't work. It only works between 2 and 4. You are not alone feeling this way. People don't understand what that original trailer meant to us back then. It meant that those three missions that teased a Gray Fox metal gear in the vr missions were finally coming to fruition. Then platinum decided to make it Bayonetta: metal gear edition. Metal Gear is now just another generic action title.

[@EugenePoole94]

@@lyndaarambula8730 Fundamentally disagree. It's awash in a sea of generic hack and slash clones.

[@arron390]

@@EugenePoole94 in your opinion lol

[@Suicynic]

Absolutely brilliant as always. Thank you.

[@garfeldi8466]

i still want the original idea with gray fox

[@vomothytigan1640]

I do think that a follow up to MGR Revengeance as a prequel to explore the unused story would be great. Not sure how to find the middle ground between the normal Metal Gear games and MGR but if that can be achieved I think it would be really awesome!

[@jackwilliam4436]

Excellent video. However, to me at least, the real biggest missed opportunity is the cruel lack of an instalment focused on The Boss. Just imagine it : Seeing how it all began, with The Joy and, leading the Cobra Unit and, most of all, accompanying The Boss, as the shapes her world view and trains Naked Snake.

[@mrscsi6472]

When you started to talk about a cyborg-ninja upgrade system, this popped into my head: Memetic Upgrade: ABSOLUTION - Psyche fully replenishes when Life passes below 30% "Pain. This is why I fight."

[@Sinraiser]

Thank you for this! I always knew and was always thinking that I was the only one with this curiosity. I always wanted to see that rescue mission and how the scenario went down and how many ppl he killed in order to save her, how Sunny found out later about her mother and grandfather, how she also meet Otacon and Snake and more. Hideo is a God with these storylines but I think the only one who interfiered was Konami as always.

[@michiganjack1337]

I still refer to it as Rising, heck I still call the PS1 the PSX and 64 as Ultra 64. 😄 Another great video Boss, looking forward to the MGSV video. I presume snacks OSP as always?

[@elvampe13]

I think this issue could have been easily solved if MGR: Revengeance had a level or two consisting of flashbacks where you play as Raiden during his mission to save Sunny from the Patriots.

[@zer0stars]

I feel like it would have broken the flow of the game especially with how bombastic the MGR: Revengeance characters are. Realistically, MGR:R is a game you can definitely finish in one sitting and most of the time, it's just travelling from cutscene to cutscene and boss fight to boss fight.

[@KojiMadarA333]

Thank you, Max Keep on keeping on 👍🏼

[@ericksanchez2496]

Always thought that concept art was great, could have been cool story. Almost like Lone Wolf and Cub/Shogun Assassin or more recently The Mandalorian.

[@Silverwolf-sr1ug]

Brilliant idea. I'd love to play the version of the game you described

[@suprtroopr1028]

I concur. Snake and big boss' story has been shown almost beginning to end, yet the series' only other playable main character has a completely untold gap in time. I think raiden's tale absolutely would make for a potentially amazing game. It's just sad we'll probably never see it...

[@Andrew-ko2ps]

I think people complained about Raiden in MGS2 because they couldn’t stand to see themselves as they were in a game. Raiden has always been the player. Kojima has been trying to tell people to go outside and stop playing war with each game he makes. It’s not even subtle. But people just can’t even see it when smacked in the face. In Rising it’s a return to form. Raiden admits why he fights. Not for some bullshit fake noble cause, but for himself. He fights because he can’t stand to see children become what he is and he kills his enemies gladly. That’s why it’s honest and refreshing

[@raheemaslam7363]

And also the enemies in rising are representing of how we glorify war like Sundowner

[@diegomedina9637]

"Were you aware of this cancelled version of Rising?" I've spent days looking at nothing until a frame of Raiden, Big Boss or the Number 5 would show up in a website back in like 2009.

[@Hau5test]

Yeah I’d love to see that story as well. It’s a nice gap a future Konami productions studio could work on

[@yusoph-kirammamaiii3872]

#ReleaseTheKojimaCut Bro thank you for outlining this subject on the original storyline for MGR... Raiden deserves to have another game may it be a sequel to Metal Gear Reveangance 2 or a prequel with this exact idea and story from Metal Gear Rising... we are all for it. Kojima needs to know that Raiden's story is not yet finished...

[@TrueCapitalist]

I did know, and was disappointed by Rising not being a thing ! It's my understanding, the reason why Raiden became a Cyborg is because the Patriots Captured him after his rescue of Sunny and they Continued the Grey Fox experiments on him before being rescued by Snake and Co. Oh wait, maybe Raiden was captured by the Patriots before Rescuing Sunny. Turned into a Cyborg, and then was able to save her afterwards 🤔 . ..

[@BioAlpha5]

i rememeber the og reveal and being blown away. shame we never got it but hey we got something else in return. Just as good im sure.

[@nezyro]

DANK SINATRA LOL

[@Alex-ip1dn]

Snake gives it the nod

[@GugureSux]

I can assure you, people have been discussing this very exact stuff since the game came out. Fans have wanted the "missing link" between MGS2 and 4 (in Raiden's perspective) for 15 years soon.

[@silent_stalker3687]

Have you thought of covering the Doom books? Yes Doom has a book series and it is batshit insane- I love it

[@maniacallyhappy]

Revengence was an absolute love letter to the, "Beat'em Up" genre. I remember when the game first came out and I couldn't put the game down. I beat it in 7 hours and wanted so much more. Went on to beat the absolute crap out of it, hardest difficulty, with 100% complete. I shed a tear when my PS3 died and I couldn't play it anymore.

[@Anonimo-hf3yi]

"I'm not going to say that Revengance is a big missed opportunity" Well you should, because the plot is shit

[@Schregger]

Ahhh, Rising... Now that is a game I do wish we got to see. I loved Revengence, but Rising was the game that really caught my interest. Course, once "Rules of Nature/Lock and Loaded" song and the Revengence trailer was put out, I changed my mind. *edit As for the original story idea... Ehh. I dont think MGS: Rising, with it's "Cut, EVERYTHING!" philosophy would have been workable with the idea of Raiden's own extensional identity questions. I feel a game that functions more like a traditional MGS game would be better suited, as it would allow for the idea of Raiden having the choice between accepting cybernetic upgrades, or foregoing them until the point where he is fated to gain them. Though, supposedly, the story was that Raiden rescued Sunny, but he was captured and forced into becoming a cyborg, and after that was able to save Sunny. So having a Im not sure what kinda of story MGS:R would have had, if it was trying to connect the events of MGS2 and 4, while also having the "Cut, EVERYTHING!" element... Man, I do wish we could see that story script.

[@donnyprocs]

Amen man! ive been wishing for the original rising game since i first heard about what it was originally gonna be

[@CYI3ERPUNK]

the extremely obvs edits to remove the word 'suicide' really tell you a lot about how sad/weak/immature our culture is becoming ; ppl are so fragile they cannot even hear/see a word now? ; its kinda crazy imho

[@panos3320]

Indeed i was aware of the Solid Rising Story ark. A missed opportunity for sure. They probably thought they would have their chance to make it at some other point, but Konami's shift to gambling ruined all those plans. When i think about how Raiden becoming a cyborg would have gone down, i usually imagine he would infiltrate the Patriots base, but he would be captured pretty early on. Then, there would be a harsh scene where the patriots would experiment on him, Striping him of his humanity and puting him in a cybernetic body, with a scene of his human body casually being discarded and cremated. The patriots would not have total control over him, so they would still try to manipulate him to do their bidding like in the past. The game would be about Raiden overcoming their schemes, comming to terms with his new state of being that wasn't his choice while also trying to complete his original goal, saving Sunny.

[@funwithfrank7522]

Yeeeessss thanks max

[@DBTGAMER]

I really would have liked to have seen the original metal Gear rising in some way shape or form. Good video.

[@TheActualMrLink]

1:10 that might be the first time I’ve ever heard Max say something even vaguely insulting to someone!

[@Mankey619]

MGS Rising is one game that most people have forgotten over the years,until the ArmStrong memes showed up and started reminding everyone about that game. Thanks memes for remembering us that game. It’s strange that it went from Metal Gear Solid:Rising to Metal Gear Rising. The previous one was going to be a stealth action game which takes place before MGS 4. I’d really love to see what the original game was gonna be like,if the production would’ve gotten better.

[@laseangames]

WOW!!! This was a amazing video, i’m a big fan of the Metal Gear Solid series and wow. To be honest, I would love to see how Hideo Kojima’s version of Rising would have played out. I wonder if the game were to go in the way Kojima have written the story, would the story go in the direction of Sunny being the new protagonist of the Metal Gear Solid series and would Raiden be left with the position of being the father/mentor figure for her. Also, I wonder at any point of Hideo Kojima’s version of the story, would there be a plot point in the story where Raiden is put in a position where he has to preserve his body the same way that Big Boss did in MGS 4. 👀 Again, this was a Amazing Video!!! 👍🔥

[@lincolnpascual]

I would've liked to choose what body parts I sacrificed to upgrade... i mean, they ended up sort of touching on that with MGSV, letting you choose what arm you took into the fight... it's as simplified as the mechanic could possibly get, but it's there. I can imagine going into a fight, getting my ass handed to me, and then (in a typical MGS 4th wall break) dinnertime comes over the codec and says something like "it doesn't seem like you've got the right (insert upgrade here) to match (insert enemy here)... perhaps (insert character responsible for upgrades here) has a solution that might help?" and then you'd pull up a Drebin menu or maybe go to your Mother Base analog and upgrade before redeploying into the fight... It would've been pretty cool if done right, and you'd be able to seem the upgrades in your character model as Raiden slowly becomes more and more cybernetic over the game, to you end up with the version that first appears in MGS4.

[@coletteyamazaki608]

thats pretty cool, like rougelike customization of raiden literally stripping him further from being human to sub-human. and the further we go doing the gamer mindset customization we eventually get the end culmination cutscene of "i just couldnt escape it, in the end i will always just be...Jack the Ripper"

[@1992jkwj]

raiden being the mc in mgs2 was fitting for the games theme: misinformation. it was genius

[@chrysm6842]

++ Raiden has always been my favourite character in MGS.

[@ItalianJoe83]

13:37 The #ReleaseTheKojimaCut hashtag may also have some analogies with the "Metal Gear Solid V Experience" "for a S-Special reason."

[@TheLegendofGumby]

Every so often I ponder about the original Metal Gear Rising developed on the fox engine. As much as I love Revengeance, I would much rather have had Kojima helm the game and put off MGSV a few years so we could have experienced that visceral combat shown off in the original trailer. Like how he chops the support columns to crush those guys underneath and dual wields his dagger. I also think the story would have been infinitely more satisfying for the series as a whole filling in those gaps. I also remember an interview with Kojima where me mentioned his original idea for MGSV was about The Boss and the Cobra Unit during the invasion of Normandy. How fucking cool would it have been to play as The Boss using 1940’s weapons and tech and show her assembling this legendary team. Not to knock MGSV, it’s absolutely my favorite unfinished game of all time. I just wonder what might’ve been.

[@zbaksh101]

i knew of the original version of Rising but thought the interquel angle could be hard to pull off. they could do a MGR entry that did focus on that time between MGS2 and 4. call it " MGR Rebirth"...;)

[@alexsuavecitosuavecito3551]

Yes I was aware, I even remembered seeing those trailers but in the end it was in my time were i really didn’t know a lot of English, and I really wish now that at least a beta existed

[@Xarkom89]

Metal Gear’s biggest missed opportunity was Metal Gear Online (2) and its further extension to possibly being its own stand alone service. They truly had a unique online game that was later botched with the MGSV release.

[@KyKy_Kyri]

I was aware of this but I remember reading at the time, the Game was suppose to be about Raiden rescuing sunny, and then being captured by the Patriots and experimented on to continue where the grey fox experimens ended, as well as a way to punish and torture him for his actions in MGS2. this why he has the cybernetics and why at at the end of 4 he calls himself a beast. He wouldn't volunteer to being a cyborg. Hell he had an issue with his own blood being taken from him in 2, let alone his body being augmented. But This could be 2 games it could be the story I mentioned aboved then a 2nd game following Raiden and EVA rescuing BIG Boss' body from the Patriots! Overall I agree this has always been the game I wished was made

[@Timbo183404]

#ReleaseTheKojimaCut Hello Max, long time watcher, first time commenter. Yes! I do remember when it was called just "Metal Geer Rising" and announced at an X-Box press conference. You can drive yourself crazy thinking about these 'What ifs' of our favorite media. One if my personal 'What ifs" is if David Lynch would've accepted the job to direct Return of the Jedi.

[@olucaspc]

if you think about it, it kinda makes sense that we: "the player" did not had any part in the self discovery journey Raiden had after mgs2. But I still would have liked to see the original mgr

[@brunobenetti9756]

the footage they have of the trailer with Raiden on the MGS engine was seriously cool, I wish they used it for the game. Also, Raiden saved Sunny from the Patriots, we gotta know more about that dammit!

[@IndieLambda]

I always wanted to see a Metal Gear Rising 2, my ideal MGR2 would always have been exploring just how did he become who he is in MGR1 and MGS4. I love Raiden, always wanted more Raiden. I had never heavily noticed the changes from MGSR to MGRR, it's not uncomon for games to change heavily between being first shown and releasing. Especially when they take a while to make, I had never made the connection, but maybe, just maybe, I was subconsiously guided by this forgoten knowledge, to want MGR2, to explore how Raiden became who he became. Or maybe that's what I want to see simply because it's a genuinely compeling story to explore, and forgot the old trailers context fully for real.

[@guadalupefreyre5900]

Based

[@Night_Raptor_5991]

And metalpilled

[@coilung000]

yes to all questions #releasethekojimacut the best chance we (or anyone for that matter) have is for a leaked script

[@francesco3772]

I'm an old man, and an old fan of the saga, I followed Rising's development very closely back then and, like you, really hoped for that missing link between the perfect finale for the whole saga that was MGS2 and whatever the f*ck MGS4 was trying to be. Loved Revengeance at first sight, even though it glossed over pretty important parts of Raiden's life (Rose) for the sake of its narrative (at least she understands not to bother your man at work), but it clearly wasn't the Rising I was looking for, and that we'll never get.

[@WingZeroSymphonics]

#Kojima cut. Ya know whats interesting? Big Boss dreamed of a fast paced three dimensional action game with dual wielded weapons. In his vision, it was medieval/ vampire themed. In Revengence, its swordsman cyborgs and Raiden behaving Vampiric for the white blood concoction.

[@MrNighNight]

You know what? The Boss's story. Imagine a trilogy where you play with The Boss, while doing stealth missions, teaching Jack (Naked Snake) how to endure the battles ahead. Is a storytelling goldmine. The Boss is definitely one of the best characters in game's history. Since they skipped Raiden's part... We could only hope for something like that, somehow, in the future.

[@27mayanman]

Also, I would add that a Remake of MGS 1 and Metal Gears 1 and 2 from the MSX would be great too.