Miquella the Insane | Elden Ring Shadow of the Erdree Lore

[@xdking0087]

We owe Mohg an apology, turns out he is not the Mohglester, but Mohg is the one being Miqualested

[@duperdash2317]

😂

[@SouloftheWanderer]

😂😂 "Miqualested"

[@leophoenix1452]

😂😂😂

[@jaieregilmore971]

Nah he still a bad person.

[@miriamemanueleforneris3701]

Miquel-lested

[@Sattva468]

If Miquella was really serious about ushering in an age of compassion, he would’ve brought back Leonard too

[@PlatinumAltaria]

That's actually the strongest proof that Radahn isn't himself, since he would never want that.

[@arealhumanbean3058]

Would be really funny if just like Radahn was brought back in Mohg's body, Leonard was brought back in like Varre's body

[@tripgiannini1892]

What if Torrent is Leonard? 🤯🤯🤯 jk

[@fan_of_fans]

he needs a horse omen corspe to do that, that why Radahn join him in killing the tarnish.

[@dhanyl2725]

I haven't seen this being said enough times

[@Duality2222-2]

I swear the funniest thing to come from this dlc is the fan bases complete 180 towards Mogh

[@spookzer16]

Which is shocking since people for a long while have been positing that Mohg has been charmed the whole time.

[@STOPSYPHER]

@@spookzer16 I never once heard that theory until leaks for the DLC started happening

[@thekingtm760]

@@STOPSYPHERit was definitely a fringe theory even I discounted at the time but the root of it came from the bewitching branch item description and the connection many drew between Miquella and Griffith that made people think it PRIOR to dlc announcements

[@Ralagathenovel]

@@STOPSYPHERthat theory was rampant for months if not a full a year even before the DLC💀I allways thought miquella was gay little twink, just of his descriptions and depiction, although I was kinda 50/50 on weather or not they made mogh act up the reason I didn’t believe it was true is because of I had manipulator powers the last thing I would do is organize is being pinned down a vicious lot fucked by a giant ugly stranger.

[@isaacgarcia9234]

@@STOPSYPHERIt was said even in the beginning but the Mohg memes were stronger

[@dualwieldroxas358]

Ansbach is such a well made character. Who knew the Blood Cultist would end up being the most level-headed and loyal bro in the whole game?

[@chubblord4611]

Lol

[@kacecrimson8297]

You know that explains why so much of the blood cult was obsessed with love. It didn't feel quite on brand. Until you see what bad juju the head of the cult was on

[@nebunezz_r]

Yeah... Varre death line makes more sense now.​@@kacecrimson8297

[@igipigy7135]

@@kacecrimson8297 marika dynsasty bussy got me acting unwise

[@AszkalonOfVerra]

_" _*_Oh dearest Miquella. What use should i make of your sweet Hand today ?_*_ "_ - Mohg Abridged, by Undead Hunter.

[@soulhunt3r911]

Poor Miquella, everything he did ended in failure... 1- Resurrect Godwyn, Failure. 2- Cure Malenia, Failure. 3- Create the haligtree, Failure. 4- Become a god, Failure. 💀💀💀

[@kosmorkos]

It's bc of his curse; he's forever young, he will always have a lot of potential, but will never achieve anything. He's like those child prodigies who burn out in later life

[@junebug4004]

I really wish we get the prince of death godwyn boss fight..

[@soulhunt3r911]

​@@kosmorkosyep, i think youre right. Even so, it makes me sad to see how he got rid of his body and his emotions, how he threw away everything he was to ultimately fail again...😐😅

[@CsrSnchz-wc5zo]

He is the demigod of nascency, of course everything he touched would never mature

[@fan_of_fans]

@@kosmorkos that's the best explanation of his curse I ever read.

[@samueltitone5683]

I'm kind of amazed by the number of people that seem genuinely surprised by this revelation. Miquella literally had the power to brainwash people and everyone in game was terrified of him.

[@spaghettibolognese5838]

i'm not surprised, more disappointed. it seems like such a cliche way to go i mean literally everyone said he'd go a griffith character arc. i wish he genuinely was a good guy trying to fight messmer

[@natecward8322]

Wait so does this mean that Malenia was brainwashed. I feel like nobody likes Malenia because she’s the vessel for the outer god of rot including Miquella

[@thatlittlemonstrosity]

tbh I was fully expecting a griffith-esque shift

[@TheProphet49]

I've said for years that Miquella was brainwashing and controlling those around him and I was shouted down. So glad to see this all confirmed.

[@sparxskywriter2589]

​@@spaghettibolognese5838 What a bitch of a response

[@thatlittlemonstrosity]

I knew it, from the very start I knew it. Miquella is literally Griffith 1) an egg of rebirth 2) persuasion and manipulation abilities 3) being broken and then obsessed by the first person who refused him. Then ruining everything 4) angelic androgynous look everything clicked here Miquella does not love, he makes people around him love him but his own love is within St Trina, which he disposed off. There is nothing good awaiting from Miquella’s reign, it will be a puppet show for Miquella by Miquella, a hive mind with only one mind controlling every living being

[@Nolimitsbestfriend]

worst than frenzy flame ending

[@thatlittlemonstrosity]

@@Nolimitsbestfriend exactly, though both have similarity in the fact that one person just takes away everyone’s choice

[@Nolimitsbestfriend]

@@thatlittlemonstrosity x2 exactly, id rather be dead than be a hive mind with no free will removes the purpose of existing. unfortunate the gods of er truly have no esoteric knowledge or power over the realm

[@PrimusJupiter]

​@@Nolimitsbestfriendit's like he has the Griffith manipulations but obitos cheap sellout dream of "everyone's dream"

[@thatlittlemonstrosity]

@@Nolimitsbestfriend true, some people’s problems cannot be solved with hive mind but can be solved (if rather cruelly) with ending it all. Like the whole frenzied merchants, hornless omens, trolls, misbegottens, albunarics these are in pain and will be in pain. One way or another, their despair is unsolvable

[@Masterpain33]

Radahn is a good person I think is why. They all respected him even through a festival to give him a proper death even if it meant giving up their lives.

[@geordiejones5618]

Yeah honestly this DLC made me fuck with Radahn even more. Him and Godwyn are my favorite demigods. Radahn is just as scary and skilled as Rykard and Ranni (Carians are too OP I swear), but Godwyn genuinely feels like the best ruler of them all, as evidenced by his ability to beat the dragons and show mercy. I feel for Maliketh too, he was as loyal as Blaidd and got fucked over just like Morgott, Mogh and Messmer.

[@vongolamistowl]

Well one of the reasons miquella saw in radhan a lord was because of kindness and strength so makes sense he would him to be his lord.

[@todd2.08]

According to Freyja, Radahn was war hungry and loved battle so whatever Miquella’s age of compassion is wouldn’t exactly vibe with him

[@str8apem88]

If you think about it, Radahn's the only demigod that hasn't committed any horrific crimes during the shattering (that we know of anyway).

[@realniggasan-kotoamatsukam6485]

​@@todd2.08She's probably just wrong or projecting, her and jerren have opposing views on radahn but more evidence leans towards radahn enjoying battle but fighting for a substantial cause

[@executiveunderdog4563]

"That entire family is batshit insane." Sums it up perfectly.

[@brendancoulter5761]

Radahn seemed realtively sane. Until he got driven in sane by rot, than brought back to life, than enslaved...

[@executiveunderdog4563]

​@@brendancoulter5761Yea, defends his Home, wants to impress his dad and stepdad, and even goes above and beyond to keep his horse employed. Good dude.

[@rezaganjizadeh4263]

House Lannister 2, the fantasy remix

[@kroposman2302]

Only Marika's line is insane from the start. Rennala's line is pretty stable, at least until Radagon left...

[@jaieregilmore971]

Also Miquella biggest mistake is casting out his love because compassion is ultimately form of unconditional love.

[@iamperplexed4695]

I think his biggest mistake was being gay, it didn't turn out well at all.

[@wheezehead]

@@iamperplexed4695idk his chosen consort is kicking some people's asses so hard that it's retroactively ruining their appreciation of elden ring as a whole, maybe being gay is the way to win 🤷

[@dereksout]

@@wheezeheaddon’t worry they’ll nerf him after Pride Month

[@harleystachel7225]

Everyone loves miquella, but miquella loves noone

[@jaieregilmore971]

@@harleystachel7225 he literally sacrificed his love on the cross.

[@Lordxzamasu]

Never thought we would be saying poor Mohg

[@Foogi9000]

Damn now i can't call him Jared Mohgle or Jeffery Mohgstein :(

[@Rakschas666]

​​@@Foogi9000But what if those two were never evil but got charmed/corrupted along the way? Halligtree = Hollywood

[@oopseeps7772]

@@Foogi9000 or Mohglester.

[@rushpatriot2866]

There is no "we" it's only the people that can't think for themselves and the people that can't read

[@MiloshBlack00]

Everyone thinking that Radahn had gone crazy because of the scarlet rot and it was because he heard that his half-brother wanted to recreate the Borbon house with him.

[@Morfe02]

Radahn has AIDS not scarlet rot, the whole event of Caelid is to cover that fact

[@DarkLordFromTheSecondAge]

"NO! I DONT WANT TO BE FRENCH!"

[@gerardoalvarado8425]

​@@DarkLordFromTheSecondAge💀

[@jay21597]

😂

[@WatermelonCat941]

my dumbass thought you meant the restaurant I went to in New Orleans called The Borbon House until I realized you were talking about the French one

[@deepindigo1937]

I suppose it makes sense that miquela can halt the influense of outer gods, he just needs to manipulate you harder than them.

[@phantasm9114]

I don’t think he just halts it though, it was stated that miquellas needle wasn’t finished which is why we needed to use it in placidusax’s arena , if I remember correctly. So maybe with a finished needle he could fully remove the influence.

[@designatedben4306]

Shit maybe I regret using his needle 💀

[@smileexp3269]

Miquella: So i just have to gaslight you EVEN HARDER

[@ramoraid]

I think the formless mother and the god of the crucible(omens) corrupted miquella or skewed his views on the world. Moghs blood was tainted by the crucible and formless mother and miquella was tainted by the Rot God and had a his own Divinity as st Trina growing in him, a dangerous cocktail to be frank.

[@lynackhilou4865]

​@@phantasm9114well that would pose the question of why did he use the gates of divinity , presumably it was to commune with the greater will and become a god ( just like marika did ) or possibly another outer god , so i don't think his able to stop their influence

[@someoneinasia]

the fact that miquella left st.trina (the 'love' part of his soul) is pretty showing the age of compassion he planned to achieve has no real compassion.

[@greennimbus2519]

Bruh went Full Griffith

[@videocrowsnest5251]

Another reason Radahn might not have died when Malenia went nuclear in his face is he was holding back the stars. It's easy to forget, but Radahn is a Carrian, and the fates of the Carrians were very much held in stasis by the stars being held back by Radahn. So in essence, his great rune combined with destined death missing and the stars being held in check likely all contributed to Radahn's body surviving.

[@justintolentino9222]

He was still dying though. Plan A was probably for Malenia to defeat Radahn, send Radahn through resurrection cycle, Miquella to intercept Radahn's soul at Lands of Shadow while Radahn does not have a Greater Rune to shield himself from Miquella's power, and influence Radahn to be his consort. Malenia, knowing she couldn't complete the mission, opted for the Plan B: nuke Radahn and give him slow death through scarlet rot. Us killing Radahn and Mohg actually accelerated Miquella's plan. That's why Mohg kidnapping Miquella is probably part of the plan as well. This gives the Tarnished and Miquella's followers a reason to hate Mohg and enough reason to kill Mohg.

[@jagmbaksvshsh]

@@justintolentino9222Jerren states Radahn is cursed to ever wander, and considering how long Radahn might have possibly been in that state, it's extremely unlikely.

[@conwaysquest6961]

Miquella followed in Marika's footsteps. Threw away everything that tied him down in the pursuit of godhood. Love, Fear, Humanity, all of it cast aside until only divinity remained. I do not doubt that Miquella started down his path with only the best of Intentions. He likely genuinely thought he could do better than Marika, and maybe he was right... But, as C.S. Lewis said "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive." We stop him because we saw how Marika the Eternal's Order turned out, and Miquella has given us exactly ZERO reason think he's any different from his mother.

[@Apt23-v8u]

nah i prefer Marika than the Griffith expy

[@drugs7033]

He literally discarded love (St.Trina), even a ghost called him out on that. If you’re gonna rule by compassion the one thing you shouldn’t discard is love.

[@oliversmith2129]

​@@Apt23-v8u Marika's t1ts, you must be 'ungry

[@PotaroAK47]

I would still side with Miquella if i could. And with General Radahn as consort... Ohhh boy!!!

[@Gargoyle364]

The road to Hell is oft paved with good intentions.

[@pandakun8556]

i think miquella needed radahn because he was the only demigod who was not manipulated or influenced by any outer god or even the greater will

[@isaacgarcia9234]

Nah Miquella wants Radahn for personal reasons the whole plan to resurrect Radahn it’s too complicated he is even used the Mohg body who is link to a outer God.

[@silentsorrowbane]

​@@isaacgarcia9234 i mean that point doesnt stand when you assume the influence is on the soul not the body

[@richter6699]

He's also stated multiple times to be the strongest of the demigods. And if Godfrey and Radagon are anything to go by, an Elden Lord is just a mighty warrior. Radahn also models himself entirely on both of the previous Elden Lords

[@just_cthulhu3447]

Nah, he just needed toughest meatshield

[@popeneiad7968]

@@just_cthulhu3447like other people have said, then he would have just gone for us (the Tarnished who became Elden Lord) instead who beat all of them, or even his sister Malenia would have sufficed. He specifically wanted Radahn and this is confirmed in the cutscene after you beat him

[@cgzepp]

What Malenia said to Radhan kinda suggests that the state of Caelid is Miquella's fault

[@kacecrimson8297]

100%

[@wakamoon1910]

well partly, its still mostly on malenia's choice to do it, you could argue miquella expected her to be skilled enough to kill radahn without having to unleash the rot but as we saw she wasn't strong enough.

[@thedeadmemetrain8757]

@@wakamoon1910 Tbf, we do know from interviews that she was heavily injured going into that fight. It's likely she would have been able to pull it off if she were at full strength.

[@bradyyetman1425]

@@wakamoon1910It would seem that miquella very well may have charmed melania as well, and sent her to fight rahdan in an attempt to free his soul so that he could bring him back in mohgs body as his consort. I think what melania says to rahdan “Miquella awaits thee, O’ promised consort” is further confirmation of this, as melania never wanted to leave miquella’s side to begin with?

[@kacecrimson8297]

@@wakamoon1910 imagine sending a nuclear powered tank to a fight being so sure it's core isn't gonna get damaged and nuke the battle field. I understand thst it wasn't miquellas intent. But it's his fault malenia was there at all. It is painfully obvious to miquella the dangers that his sister poses just by existing

[@novachikun]

The vibe I got from Miquella in the base game was that he was becoming a mad scientist. Aside from his innocent appearance, he is described as a genius and a visionary. He creates new and unique spells that were beyond even Radagon's and Marika's capacity, leaving them very impressed. Eventually, Miquella moved on from the Golden Order and created Unalloyed Gold, a substance with the ability to STOP THE INFLUENCE OF OTHER GODS, PERIOD. This is fucking huge. Miquella is also attempting to grow his own Haligtree by way of his own blood to try and become a god. And on top of these two things, Miquella has also been studying the Eclipse to try and find a way to bring back souls to demigods who have lost their souls, which is a reference to his desire to revive Godwyn, his beloved older brother. This shows that Miquella was terrifying not just because he is a master of charming others, but his intelligence is pretty bonkers. Miquella's settling with Radahn's power instead of following through with finding out a way to revive Godwyn was a major disappointment. But it at least shows how dangerous Miquella could be to those who do not suspect him.

[@sebastianmoscoso9404]

BRUH!!!!! now im upset. I was fine with this new lore until you said that, why couldnt they have implemented some plot device so that it was godwyn revived as his consort and not rhadan? I guess it being rhadan makes rhadan more of a tragic character with everything he suffered. But then that would work EVEN better with godwyn! He is murdered and his soul can never rest, just to finally be 'put to rest' and converted into miquellas puppet as his consort. This way we could have finally wrapped up both miquella and godwyn's fates in the only dlc we're getting. Now we'll never get a resolution to godwyn's story. Im fine with us never getting expansion stories on outer places like the baldlands, helphen, and eiochaid. But we NEEDED BOTH missing demigod's stories to be concluded.

[@foureyesisafish7968]

considering what Ranni did though, there probably wasn't a way to revive Godwyn (since his soul got annihilated), which is why Miquella turned to Radahn.

[@foureyesisafish7968]

@@sebastianmoscoso9404 ...you seem to be having the same misunderstanding most of the community is. Godwyn's soul isn't beyond rest or something to that effect. It is flat out dead. Destroyed. That's how Ranni was able to free her own soul from her body, which is also turbodead.

[@sebastianmoscoso9404]

@@foureyesisafish7968 no i understand that, that is why i said 'some plot device' miyazaki could have done an asspull and made miquella find some way to revive godwyn's soul. I guess this makes more sense as miquella couldnt access godwyn's soul. But now we'll never get a resolution to godwyn's story

[@foureyesisafish7968]

@@sebastianmoscoso9404 I honestly think that’s the point of godwyn’s story. The lack of resolution. He was the price of Ranni’s dream.

[@The_Dreaming_Hunter]

He is just like his mother, he promised an age of compassion, but in the end the road to this age was built on bodies, he caused the destruction of Caelid, brainwashed and manipulated Radahn and Mohg, tricked his sister into thinking she could be cured, and gave his allies false hope, in the end, this shows what happens if you are against his age of compassion, and how in the end, he would do anything for godhood

[@QuackersForCrackers]

1. Yes and no: Caelids destruction was because of Malenia's decision and action. Sure, Miq would also share the blame for Malenia's action but in the end Malenia made the decision and actioned upon it. 2. Mohg was an unknown and unwanted existence, shunned and thrown away at birth. As such, Mohg's action are his own and his own only. Radahn agreed to a promise, in which both does this for this; that means Miq didn't control his mind because he could have just forced him. 3. He didn't lie to Malenia, he did find a cure but it wasn't complete. Him becoming a god might have been a way for him to find a way to complete the needle. And actions made in his name doesn't mean it was actions he approved of or actions he condoned. I think he was just a person born with an affliction that he didn't want and a sister born with a worser curse. A curse that is slowly rotting her. And that's where he understood that things aren't always equal or fair, and that the world isn't a kind place. And when he looked out further, it just confirmed that the world wasn't a compassionate place. And he just wanted a better place, a better world.

[@Staz]

well he didn't really trick her cuz his needles actually work, just not well enough

[@ethereal-2jz]

the thing that makes his character complicated for me is that he clearly had good intentions before going to the land of shadow. he tried everything and failed - and resorted to the conclusion that to make his grandiose visions true, he had to become a god. but that power doesn’t come free - and numerous sacrifices came to be. i honestly think after hearing from st. trina miquella in the end was an ambitious child that went a little too deep. he really did want to better the world but had to make a lot of sacrifices - the fact that he was willing to sacrifice himself makes it clear to me that his intentions weren’t purely selfish. a very morally questionable character, i think he’s closer to a “any means necessary for the betterment of the world” type of character like ranni

[@The_Dreaming_Hunter]

@@Staz the needles only work if you have little scarlet rot in you, malenia has a literal outer god of rot choosing her as a avatar, I don’t think anything can cure that

[@Staz]

@@The_Dreaming_Hunter well he didn't trick her, he was really trying, i mean he developed another needle too, which you can learn to stop frenzied flame influence once you took it in

[@fishnutz5196]

Justice for Mohg!!! Also Fromsoft confirmed months ago there would be no new ending for the story so that shouldnt have been expected

[@DoomUvb]

It's still disappointing though

[@rishijagtap8593]

@@DoomUvb thats ur fault then. u expected something when u shouldn't have

[@notme5205]

@@rishijagtap8593Lord forbid the man have expectations for a game he likes. Get Miyazaki’s member out your mouth

[@notme5205]

*says valid criticism of a game* “UHM YOUR HOPES ARE JUSY TOK HIGH AND FROMSOFT IS PERFECT BRO!” Is how any discussion of this dlc and it’s lore goes lmao

[@Niklas0369]

@@notme5205 you are just a stupid hater tbh

[@mrshady6941]

What in the sweet home alabama shit was going on in Miyazaki's head 💀

[@fishnutz5196]

Theres nothing sexual going on my guy keep your head out of the gutter 😂

[@1miggg]

Might be a question for George RR Martin😂

[@samueltitone5683]

100% Martin's doing. Gwyn's family was never like this. The Orphan of Kos never defiled its mother's corpse.

[@DiceRollx]

George rr martin probably, just look at his past works 😂

[@Kronosfall91]

Incestuous highborns fucking everything up for the lower class? That's George R.R. Martin, my dude

[@lllXanderlll]

I freaking knew that the whole miquella and Mohg thing wasn't all on Mohg. There's no way you're going to tell me a super seductive demigod that is constantly scheming and uses his seduction to manipulate people around him is just randomly going to be taken by Mohg. No there had to be more to the story and I'm glad they actually flesh that out in the DLC

[@illyria7756]

The withered arm made me think his body got drained by the tree so who else than the lord of blood to try to help him replenish it? Idk if Miq called for him some way when he realised his blood wasn't enough for the tree or it was always the plan, but it looked to me like Mohg was trying to help.

[@thewhitespectre]

One original idea was that Miquella's charm was a passive affect that is always active and not something he willingly does to people. This going hand in hand with his existence being both blessed and cursed (cursed to always be a kid and blessed to be an empyrean which meant he could potentially become a god) And so the obsession would be neither Miquella's nor Mohg's fault seeing as the charm does it's own thing. Idk I'm just spit balling here, the base game only mentioned one thing about Miquella bewitching people and everything else points to him being a genuinely good dude.

[@colorpg152]

@@thewhitespectre no the branch shows he could use it actively and the fact he does it to the player in a grab attack makes it clear he is willing to use that power

[@buckyhurdle4776]

Mohg is so obviously "evil" coded that I knew something had to be up

[@thewhitespectre]

@@colorpg152 That's why I said it was an *original* idea they had, not what it currently is in the new lore

[@TheSnoozeFox]

Some Fans were getting mad at us for the Griffith comparisons when it turned out to be literally almost identical

[@Kingly242]

Just wish we got a little more eclipse:/

[@nickcarroll8565]

I’m just disappointed the two fingers and three fingers didn’t join to become a big flaming god fist

[@azureascendant994]

Making Miquella like Griffith is a bit lazy, tbh.

[@ΚάσσιοςΔίο]

but he's not though, he's not. Miquella is basically Griffith but with the motivations of the egg of the perfect world

[@isaacgarcia9234]

@@ΚάσσιοςΔίοThe Miquella motivations are very similar to Griffith both want to create his own perfect world with justice to protect the weak but at willing to sacrifice anything to get it. And the obsession with Radanh is similar to the Griffith obssesion with Guts thanks God than Radahn doesn’t have a equivalent to Casca.

[@vanir7810]

in the end its only my undying hatred for Bayle that remains. CURSE YOU BAYLE!!!

[@rezaganjizadeh4263]

He is 100% an homage to Balerion the black dread from George's other work

[@nickjames2050]

No he’s not it’s literally a homage to moby dick

[@gLobbZ]

The only bad part about the final boss of the dlc is if anyone tries to find a guide online for the original they will be immediately spoiled 😂

[@silentjosh847]

I don’t think he’s insane, but rather he’s eternally a child both physically and emotional maturity. He’s incredibly intelligent and gifted, but in the end he’s a child and has a child’s petulance when he doesn’t get what he wants, along with the usual not caring about consequences that’s comes with youth. So yeah, I think he was well-intentioned and compassionate, but his story shows us that compassion without wisdom can lead to disaster.

[@ΚάσσιοςΔίο]

Miquella definitely isn't a child emotionally

[@silentsorrowbane]

That's not how that works. If your body does not age, your mind still does because your brain keeps developing etc. He might have kept the innocence and idealism of a child but he isn't childish

[@bigsleepy3211]

Miquella is a child only in appearance. He's probably centuries old

[@samuelljayy6705]

@@silentsorrowbane how do you know his brain kept growing?

[@bennify1]

well explained i dont like majority of these player bases's view of miquella down to hes evil or insane. hes much more nuanced just like every character in elden ring. a lot of them have good intention and has a air of heroism to every single of one them but they lose themselves in the process. due to the circumstance of the world or they want to achieve their goals so bad they resort to questionable ways to achieve it. it is why malenia bloomed when she has held back her scarlet rot for so long because she believed in miquella and wanted him to become god with radahn as his consort.

[@olisaer3486]

its so weird how there was no miquella ending despite how much he was hyped up and his connections to the player, the spirit bell, torrent and the intro of the dlc alluding to us going to save him, and worse yet how we had no dialouge apart from the boss fight, i mean, he is basically one of the most important characters in the whole series yet he has nearly no screen time, and he was the posterboy of the dlc ffs

[@biggreen1456]

The reason why is everything he wants opposes our tarnished’s existence (born to follow grave to become lord), literally all 6 possible endings are opposed to Miquella ruling, so there’s no way the player character should side with him unless forced, which is considered a death

[@sparxskywriter2589]

I dunno if you've been paying attention. Miquella was pretty bad news. He even asked us to kill him via St. Trina

[@SleeplessSpecter]

FromSoft 101

[@josephdellavecchia7828]

110% this

[@danielrobinson7872]

​@@sparxskywriter2589St. Trina asked us to kill him as a mercy, so he wouldn't be stuck in a miserable existance. You completely misread the situation.

[@polkalamypekopeko2969]

> local femboy confuses regional power struggle parties et al > Said femboy caused a thousand year suffering

[@TrashPanda300]

im sorry mohg on behalf of all of us

[@baraldogrant]

Not being able to relay that information to gideon and not being able to bring in the age of compassion is a huge miss. That would of added some flavor for sure.

[@geordiejones5618]

They literally said months ago they won't be adding new endings. No DLC of theirs has ever added new endings.

[@YA-kr4fr]

@@geordiejones5618 ok dude you are clearly an idiot that missed the point, they could have announced it years in advance for all i care they still missed this opportunity to expend the lore

[@LightsFuzzy]

@@geordiejones5618 They did say they were going to give the DLC different endings, and then didn't. So they say a lot of things.

[@kaanon555]

@@LightsFuzzy Wasn't that a mistranslation? I read that what was actually said was in reference to the NPCs endings

[@angel17891]

​They also advertise stuff in the dlc trailers that don't make it on launch, like Miquella's cutscene lifting his hand on the scadutree where is that? Or they even made it seem like we can ally with Miquella on the launch trailer which cannot happen

[@chrisCharDen]

Why are we not talking about how dirty he did melania damn and she lived her life for him smh

[@silentsorrowbane]

Read the description of the new Radahn Helmet. It seems like she knew, atleast a bit.

[@illyria7756]

​@@silentsorrowbanebut how much would Malenia have been mind controlled, with her brainrot and all?

[@richter6699]

​@@illyria7756There are a lot of assumptions being made as to mind control. But the name Promised Consort heavily implies that Radahn made the promise.

[@vongolamistowl]

@@illyria7756Malenia was definitely not being mind controlled. She is miquellas twin and they both care for each other. She fights for him and he tries to cure her rot.

[@vongolamistowl]

@@richter6699Exactly. In the ending cutscene, he asks radhan to promise him to become his consort. The boss name is promised consort radhan, which confirms that radhan agreed to the promise.

[@adubseven]

I think the dlc npc dialogue should have known if my tarnished had already burned the Erdtree or if my tarnished had became Elden Lord. New dialogue options or frenzy related quest if my tarnished had became The Lord of Frenzy in The Lands Between. It's an amazing game but I think a bit more linking to what we had achieved so far would be acknowledged. Nice video.

[@HeevaEgo]

Canonically, Shadow of the Erdtree takes place concurrently with the base game. It’d make no sense for major decisions made in the basegame would affect the dlc. Sure, minor changes would be cool like the Lady Maria Doll thing. But, just like Old hunters, there shouldn’t be any changes made as a result of MAJOR decisions. Canonically, Shadow of the Erdtree starts as soon as you beat Radahn. Everything afterwards is just filler to the story of the DLC. It’s why Midra is a Lord of Chaos when we meet him

[@arc5015]

People cope extraordinarily hard on this and act as if the devs saying "it won't" is like some stone carving from god. Fine it's a criticism then, just make it so it does lol.

[@mvh-]

Radahn must have been an absolute gigachad, no one ever disliked him. Miquella picked him over his sister as consort and even when he’d lost his mind jerren only wanted warriors to fight him to give him a honourable death. Makes me kinda disappointed that there aren’t a few endings to the DLC, imagine being able to free radahn from Miquellas charm, giving mohg justice too. And also being able to side with Miquella if youre playing a more morally questionable character.. There’s still a part of me wishing that someone finds a secret ending but I’m almost certain there’s only one confirmed. Sad times

[@jaahman0098]

He didn’t pick melania because she was already influenced by another outer god being the scarlet rot

[@TomBombadill85]

​@@jaahman0098mohgs body was influenced by outer gods too and miquella still used the body to be Radahns consort, so that doesn't factor into why he chose him at all.

[@straysheepinameadow]

malenia is an empyrean so she cannot be a candidate for lordship. it's the same reason miquella needed a consort to control because he is an empyrean and cannot become elden lord himself.

[@mvh-]

@@straysheepinameadow oh mad, didn’t know empyreans can’t be consort but I suppose it makes sense

[@ethereal-2jz]

thing that makes miquella gray though, is that he genuinely is kind. we see him actively trying to protect people ravaged and abused by the outer gods (soothing people inflicted by frenzy, invention of unalloyed gold to destroy the influence of outer gods and cure his sister, growing of haligtree *watered by his own blood* to act as a safe haven for those not accepted by the greater will, etc) he’s more of a tragic character than a villain imo. he went on a crash course towards becoming a god because being a caged god truly was the way to actually succeed in any of these facets. he realized that the hindrance of an outer god can only be stopped completely by another god - that a divine tree can only truly be created by a divine being. he tried everything to make a better world as a demigod - and failed in almost every way. for one with as much ambition as him, leaving it all and becoming a god was the only way. i also think he chose radahn as his consort because he was the most fit. the nature of godwyns death is unknown, and it seems his soul is entirely dead. radahn and our tarnished (who wasn’t around when miquella set his plan into motion) seem to be the only characters not directly influenced by an outer god.

[@Ralagathenovel]

6:53 Radahn uses gravity magic to shield Lenard in the ground during his AOE’s to protect him, Radahn even while belligerent held back the stars, Radahn even with a rottened brained used his weapons expertly Radahn is Awesome and Godlike, that is why miquella wanted him (to bad Radahn was loyal to golden order which was messed up and destines him to be eliminated but he’s still a cool guy)

[@jonathanprince707]

I wish they added an extra scene for that final battle where if you married Ranni and achieved the Age of Stars ending, Ranni comes down and embraces you forming a protective cloak against Miquella's charm.

[@Rhino-Prime]

Tarnished: Sorry Miqilla, I'm taken

[@videocrowsnest5251]

There could technically have been (for anyone doing a NG run) different versions for all the ending options picked: In the standard ending, the pieces of the Elden Ring the Tarnished held could have resonated and using the fractured piece of Miquella's greater rune resisted. In the Age of Duskborn ending, the dead could have come to the aid of the Tarnished to form a shield to ward off Miquella. In the Age of Order ending, Goldmask's mending rune could have activated and fought off Miquella's attempts to alter the age. In the Blessing of Despair ending the curse the Tarnished helped bring forth could have sprung forth to repel Miquella's charms seeking to taint him too. In the Lord of Frenzied Flame the outer god of frenzy could have intervened, and a mighty eruption of sheer frenzied madness would force Miquella back. But I do think there is some narrative satisfaction in our Tarnished doing it without help. But it would also have been nice to get to feel for once something intervene to assist us. Especially if we picked that path to be the one to unfold. Doubly so if there was a choice to go at it alone, or to summon an intervention prior to beginning the battle.

[@Ixxlostinabox]

Who needs a Ranni cloak when you can literally just sprint sideways

[@MeowLesty]

There's is a protection against Miquella's charm already but its kinda useless since that grab is the most Telegraphed shit ever. Radahn literally stands still for 2 seconds and Miquella goes "AAAAAAAAAAH" right before it comes out. But if you want a protection against it you gotta kill another boss.

[@YrGsoul]

this would have been better for lmaooooo

[@adityakalakuntla2715]

Everybody gangsta until Miquella pulls out infinite tsukuyomi

[@area52music]

LITERALLY what his empire was going to be. This wasnt even a subtle rip off.

[@SamBZY]

So basically Miquella is Griffith and Radahn is Guts.

[@kurenian]

Goddam berserk references. First the ds1 bone wheels and now this smh fromsoft

[@marlowemorris752]

🤔🤔🤔🤔😳

[@Apt23-v8u]

yes

[@nickcarroll8565]

Except Griffith didnt want to boink Guts. I think.

[@Apt23-v8u]

Exactly

[@Borderlines]

Miquella removed the Love in himself by discarding St. Trina. Despite spouting kindness and compassion, without Love I doubt his sincerity

[@snuff_club]

I feel like it one of things, the emptiness you feel at the end kind of is the point... In a way we were all bewitched by Miquella... And now we know the truth, and the truth is a pit of oblivion

[@yuzuki2385]

No wonder they emphasize miquella the ‘Kind’ or ‘kindly’ so much because he was never kind

[@Bjorricha]

I thought this! I got weird vibes from the very first time I spoke to Leda

[@yuzuki2385]

We have Griffith wannabe in elden ring

[@orben-amos6172]

I knew Mohg was charmed. All so BAYLE!!!!!

[@machi7074]

CURSE YOU VILE BAYLE-

[@sebastianmoscoso9404]

​@@machi7074for me it became CURSEE YOUUUUUUU, BITCHHHHHHHHHHH

[@juliuspearce]

I HEREBY VOW YOU WILL RUE THIS DAY!!

[@e.v4892]

A H A I L O F H A R P O O N S

[@bombthing]

O TERROR INCARNATE!

[@DonutSwordsman]

The sum of it is that Marika represents free will, as you do. Miquella isnt.

[@Mario-SunshineGalaxy64]

I genuinely believed Miquella wouldn’t be a Griffith clone. That despite having some ominous powers and suspicious descriptions he’d ultimately be a good and benevolent person that just wanted to help people. Not only that, I thought making him be a Griffith clone just seemed so cliché that I thought it would’ve been avoided due to how lazy of a direction it would’ve been for the character. But now after stanning Miquella for months here I am in shambles. I was even sorta prepared for him to be all like “the whole world must learn of my peaceful ways by force” but was not at all ready for “I nuked a country because my onii-chan would rather ride his horse instead of riding me”. Maybe it’s me OD’ing on copium but I feel like the reveal was random, that Mike Zucchini and FromSoft had the DLC and said “oh but we need to surprise everyone” and changed whatever they were building up with Godwyn with Radahn and made Miquella evil.

[@gi9692]

for real, i almost felt traumatized by the big reveal lol. i just wish it was anything else, like maybe Miquella manipulating our tarnished into doing everything for him and becoming his lord, just not this weird cruel incest necromancy plot. imo it adds unnecessary shock value and just makes Miquella seem insane, while i was expecting him to be a bit more nuanced. personally i’d prefer Miquella to be more like Ranni, who is a good character that has done some questionable things because they had to, instead of a villain in disguise. It could be argued that Miquella had to bewitch all those people throughout his life to achieve his goals, and it would also be cool if he lost this ability after regecting his great rune so he’d have to rely solely on the trust of our tarnished. I also think it would be a fitting conclusion to the story if Miquella went to the Land of Shadow to actually learn from Marika’s mistakes and fix them, which was implied to be his intention by the characters… but ultimately he just ended up following in Marika’s footsteps. btw, Miyazaki said in an interview that the veil would get lifted, which…didn’t happen for some reason? it was even in the gameplay trailer, as if Miquella was meant to do something good in this land. so idk, maybe the developers had this vision all along and we are just coping, but to me it feels like the story was building up to something other than what we ended up getting.

[@stitchedfreedom]

@@gi9692 I swear there are some elements within the DLC and trailer both that make me seem like they scrapped the original ending and went for a more... eh idk "surprising" may be the word, so surprising ending. Like they wanted to subvert expectations. So all the puzzle pieces don't match perfectly? Or some things were added post-haste.

[@popeneiad7968]

@@Mario-SunshineGalaxy64 Micheal Zaki was never one to really subvert expectations tho, he’s a massive Berserk fanboy and tries to include it in his games whenever he can. The Miquella being Griffith thing could be seem from a mile away despite all the copers saying otherwise

[@Mario-SunshineGalaxy64]

@@popeneiad7968 Yeah, I know that now, but prior to Elden Ring I didn’t know anything about Soulsbornekiroringcore games other than them being hard so I wasn’t aware of Mike Wazowski’s MO.

[@UnalloyedRascal]

Don't listen to this video. I've been a miquella fan for a long time too and this video is full of baseless speculation. There is no evidence radahn rejected miquella. Just do frejya and ansbach's quests in game. You'll get your answers. Miquella is NOTHING like griffith.

[@NoxDeadly]

I felt Radahn’s aura the minute I started the dlc

[@Bukwheat]

My friend guessed Radahn being the last boss on the release day lol

[@Bartycrouch]

I strongly believe Miquella promised to Godwin the Golden as he was described as the best of all demigods but Ranni ruined his plans. So Radhan was a plan B and Mough just a pawn.

[@sparxskywriter2589]

Doubt it. It still says that he wanted Radahn when he was a boy

[@Bartycrouch]

@@sparxskywriter2589 and tried to cure Godwyn's body curse by all means possible once he was killed. Maybe I'm just biased as I did not like the fact the big reveal was "Radhan all along..." I was expecting much more, Queen Marika's appearance as they showed in the trailer, the gloom eyed queen, the greater will counterparts as part of the outer God's... I know a gender fluid God and a rematch with a previous boss is all we are going to get as closure, but perhaps there could be Elden Ring 2....

[@rancidavocado2166]

We got tricked godwyn was the most logical option until the dlc came out but we now know that miquella was trying to restore radanns soul.

[@indifference1015]

@@rancidavocado2166 Godwyn was never an option since he's dead dead.

[@spilq7125]

no miquella promised godwyn a "proper death", not entirely sure what it means but i dont think its the same as his plans for radahn

[@miriamemanueleforneris3701]

Justice for mohg and radhan! They were basically mind controlled by miquella: one to became a bloody monster so he could be killed and his corpse dragged into the realm of shadows only be twisted in a different form and radhan to became a zombie and killed to take his soul into the ream of Shadows. So miquella could create his Frankenstein monster consort made from mohg body and radhan soul.

[@MildsandThatYac]

Radahn yea Mohg on the other hand, fuck him.

[@jaieregilmore971]

It interesting that St trina belived Miquella making a mistake in pursuring godhood the way he did following his mother footstep but it be worse he scarficing everything that made who he is. I like theory that he plan all this to make the tarnish his consort considering torrent is miquella orignal master.

[@benjeesilv1596]

10:33 thats assuming radhan wouldn't be completely psyched to battle his idols. Asserting himself as the "lion of the battlefield" and all that.

[@yourmourningstar]

Gotta love how quickly everyone apologized to Mohg xD

[@tellurianapostle]

Literally a Griffith arc to destroy his ambitions chasing the one thing he cant have.

[@kushjindal2939]

One theory that I saw on is reddit is that radahn stooped the stars and thus his faith in order to prevent himself being made into miqelas minion I mean it worked as he became a scarlet zombie (brutal) But then we kill him and bam he becomes a lord (tragic )

[@Worldly_Pitfall3]

So the stars holding fate prevented the fate of him becoming a consort and then we unintentionally ruin that by giving him a honorable death in battle?

[@HS09884]

What if jerren IS on miquellas charm?

[@Mr.Rendo1]

@@Worldly_Pitfall3 There is no honor in being a slave puppeted by miquella

[@sebastianmoscoso9404]

Damnit!!!!! Bruh rhadan is maybe the ONLY decent demigod that had honor and actually loved his family, damn man he deserved better than to be screwed by the emperyean twins

[@silentsorrowbane]

​@@sebastianmoscoso9404 you could say the same for Rykard from what we can see tbh. But his obsession with cutting himself from fate and the Golden Order led him down to a very bad end

[@rafsandomierz5313]

What's interesting this is the tree Marika used to ascend to godhood as it is made of bodies. It's the same tree as one in the trailer.

[@teagancombest6049]

That's the "divine gate"

[@AesirUnlimited]

I personally think the fact that there’s no ending where we side with Miquella shows how far gone ane evil he really is. Our character is the only being in existence that can oppose his rule as a god. So no matter what, our tarnished is destined to oppose him whether we like it or not. Miquella would never allow a being strong enough to usurp him to exist. He’d either kill us, or charm us to take away our free will. Which to some is a fate worse than death.

[@silentsorrowbane]

How do you come to that conclusion? First he clearly isn't evil. He does evil things like scheming and charming people. But he doesn't do it out of malice, he does it because he genuinely thinks it's the best for every living being, especially the suffering ones. Second he literally says to us that if we understand him, even if we have seen just a single ounce of sin or suffering we should just step down and let them (Radahn and Miquella) change the world. So he clearly isn't out to obliterate us.

[@AesirUnlimited]

@@silentsorrowbane So someone thinking that what they’re doing is for the best is what determines whether or not they are evil? By that logic many of the worst dictators and tyrants in history weren’t actually evil. The world that Miquella would build is based on a lie. He takes people’s free will away for not agreeing with him. He’s a tyrant who uses his powers to control people’s minds. His world wouldn’t have any suffering, sure. But it also wouldn’t have any free will. He’s a narcissistic tyrant who believes that his way is the only way, and anyone that opposes him is either killed, like Redahn’s forces in Caelid. Or straight up brainwashed like Mohg, all of the Haligtree citizens, his npc followers we meet during the dlc, and even his own consort Redahn. He’s evil to the core. The ends don’t justify the means.

[@anthonybright8879]

@@silentsorrowbane doing evil things by definition makes someone evil.

[@Arcessitor]

​@@anthonybright8879 Not really, no. Not in a universe as complicated as this. There are good reasons to do otherwise bad things. A white lie is a lie. Lying is evil, it's called white because the intention is good. Obvious example from daily life. Killing people is bad, killing evil people is a necessary bad. List goes on.

[@stitchedfreedom]

@@silentsorrowbane Worth noting, however, that despite Miquella saying we should step down, he does continue fighting us, not engage in dialogue. It's almost like throwing words to the wind.

[@asap_bozzy6735]

I was more convinced that Miquella would have tried to bring back Godwyn

[@foureyesisafish7968]

thing is, he did and he failed. remember, Godwyn's soul is GONE.

[@mythzel898bet2]

​@@foureyesisafish7968man,his soul is gone yes, but the eclipse lore shows that its POSSIBLE that his soul can come back if the eclipse happen,only when the castle sol its unable to, because either radahn stopping the stars,or like the ghost said they're prayers are not enough is why Godwyn unable to have a soul again.

[@TomBombadill85]

​@@foureyesisafish7968that goes against the laws of equivalent exchange, because nothing is created or destroyed you can repurpose the death he divested into others and put it back into him, gurranq was doing something similar to this himself with the deathroot around the lands between.

[@foureyesisafish7968]

@@TomBombadill85 The law of equivalent exchange is something mostly exclusive to alchemy and I don’t think is brought up AT ALL in elden ring.

[@TomBombadill85]

@@foureyesisafish7968 there's multiple videos on KZbin pointing out the game is an allegory for alchemy, so this isn't just my own conclusion, it's collaborated by mutiple people and thematically makes sense between the events as they occurred in the story.

[@abeard1]

Whole family was fucked up

[@althyk]

I like how the tarnished just pokes Radahn's balls in the fight.

[@josephdellavecchia7828]

I was also super disappointed about no new ending or Gideon interactions. I believe radahn didn't agree to miquella and and that is the only reason why malenia was sent to subdue him.

[@StCrimson667]

Personally, I actually think that there's evidence that Radahn did actually accept Miquella's pact, considering that Miquella specifically says "Our side of the vow", implying that Radahn had one side and he and Malenia had another. I could definitely see Radahn becoming disillusioned with the Golden Order because, while he looked up to his father and to Godfrey, his mother was outside of the Order and I can't imagine someone as compassionate as Radahn seeing his mother be so hurt by his father's leaving and feeling nothing. Plus, let's also not forget that Godfrey, his biggest idol, was stripped of all Grace and cast out and, again, I don't see Radahn taking that laying down. Morgott did explicitly call Radahn a traitor along with the rest of his siblings, after all! There's nothing that says that Radahn was actually a champion of the Golden Order, just that he participated in the Shattering afterwards, but, being a demi-god, was still beholden to it just like Ranni. I think that's why he had Malenia fight Radahn, so they could basically do what Ranni did, but without the sacrifice of Godwyn, using Malenia's Scarlet Rot which comes from an Outer God to circumvent the will of the Golden Order. And they used Mohg's body because Mohg is an Omen, something which is also outside the Golden Order. Mohg is really the only sacrifice that Miquella's plan requires, but Mohg, as much as I've been a Mohg defender in the past, not necessarily that great of a person, considering his followers and, you know, all the BLOOD everywhere. Plus, I doubt a demi-god's soul like Radahn's could have inhabited a normal body or even that of a normal Omen. Also, we don't know if Miquella would have actually killed Mohg, it could be that he wanted to use Mohg's blood or something to make another body for Radahn because Malenia isn't the one who killed him, none of Miquella's followers (as far as I've seen) have said that Miquella sent them to kill him, Miquella just charmed Mohg and Ansbach. WE'RE the one who kill Mohg. It could be that, since the body was already there, it just sped things up, but I haven't seen any indication that Miquella actually wanted Mohg dead. Malenia probably wouldn't have worked as a consort because she's so afflicted with Rot, she would have spread it wherever she went and I think turning her into his consort would have meant that he couldn't have freed her of her Scarlet Rot. Sure, Miquella charmed people, but I think that's honestly probably better than manipulating them and then having them killed like Ranni did. As for why a Tarnished wouldn't have worked, well, I think it all comes down to Miquella's title, Miquella the Kind. Miquella's plan is remarkably bloodless outside of Mohg's manipulation and even that could be seen as a kind of kindness, giving Mohg love for the very first time in his life and giving him something to love other than the Formless Mother which he can only wound. And even Mohg's death is kind in a way towards the Tarnished and the people of the world. The truth is that Miquella's family is basically completely and utterly responsible for the way things are and do still deserve justice for the blood on all of their hands, it wouldn't be fair to expect the people of the Lands Between who had no say in being ruled by the Golden Order to help fix the Golden Order's mistakes, it falls to Miquella's family. I think, ultimately, Miquella's desire for a world of compassion is one where life for people would be peaceful, but ultimately insubstantial, doing nothing, not really wanting anything, and then dying peacefully. Miquella wants to spare all things from suffering, even if it means making their lives ultimately meaningless. Struggles are so often what makes people grow stronger and become better as a result. Ansbach, when he falls in the battle against Radahn and Miquella, tells the Tarnished to stop them in order to create a world ruled by men and not by gods. St. Trina even says that godhood is a cage, but Miquella chooses that cage and walks into it willingly because he feels it's his job to fix everything, to become a kind and compassionate ruler for the world and create a world where no one suffers and everything flourishes, but that's a world where everything would be fundamentally less and Miquella could still very well fall into the trap that Marika did, twisting and becoming something horrible. But, Miquella is still driven to try even if it's doomed because he's so compassionate. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". Kindness can become harmful if it stops someone from dealing with reality and only works to dumb their pain, but not grow passed it. "If you love something, let it go". There's a point where kindness becomes enfeebling and sometimes the kindness has to stop for the betterment of everyone involved. Miquella wouldn't stop, he couldn't stop, because he was just so damn kind that he couldn't bare for anyone else to take on the responsibility and put themselves in the cage of godhood, but him. I think that's what the final fight of the DLC represents, a world ruled by a kind god where no one ever suffers, but no one ever tries or grows vs. a world ruled by men in their own with all of the responsibility on their shoulders. In a way, both sides are right, just from fundamentally different angles, but, ultimately, what the DLC is saying is that it's not up to the gods to fix the world they broke, it's up to man to take up the reins and do the world themselves at long last like they always should have. The gods never should have existed in the first place and the way to fix the world is to remove them and the Golden Order, to put the world back to the way it was before.

[@countlero3532]

Fantastic deduction! Your thoughts are marvellously encompassing and thorough, it all makes so much sense. Still don’t understand why so many people immediately decided that Radahn was mind-controlled all along instead of being Miquella and Malenia’s ally from the very beginning. Them working together on pawing their own path to restoration of the Land’s Between (even if the plan IS a twisted one) is such a cool concept I’m a huge fan of.

[@Scorch052]

bro stop leaving comments and start making those lore videos holy shit cooking a whole five star meal over here could not agree more and I think this will probably be one of those stories that I just cant stop thinking about for a long time

[@masterpaton2385]

Fantastic analysis! I like to think this way, though you’ve put it into words far better than I ever could have. Makes me even more disappointed how little we actually see of Miquella in the dlc, and then ultimately kill him haha one thing that is driving me crazy is all the ‘Miquella is evil, Miquella is Griffith’ rubbish I keep seeing. While at the same time people either have forgotten or don’t care, that Ranni is definitely far worse than Miquella. I’ll admit I’m a Ranni hater, but even her biggest fans must concede she’s, manipulative, selfish and a murderer. Not that that’s unique or anything, but the way her fans go on and on you’d think she’s the second coming of Jesus.

[@abanerjee8237]

why do you think malenia and radahn fought with so much casualties and other shit etc, its one thing i cant understand

[@Ozzi_G]

Thank god for something that isn’t immediately “androgynous boy evil”

[@Checkmate9moves]

Radahn actively trying not to die for all those years is the biggest argument that he turned Miquella down. Otherwise he would have kist succumbed to the rot and injuries and be with Miquella. Radahn is really the true hero of Elden Ring

[@shiftybat7318]

Surely by now you must know of Miyazaki's Berserk fandom and that Miquella is basically his Griffith, with You playing as Guts (he even gave us an identical greatsword). Griffith seems charismatic and cool at first; a true born leader and champion of the People, until his insanity starts to show and our ideals part ways.

[@HeevaEgo]

I think Martin was more influential here. Sure visually, he looks Griffith-esque (that’s Miyazaki in play), but his story lore is different. Unlike Griffith, miquella was TRULY kind and compassionate. We have evidence that Miquella’s order of unification would have directly opposed Marika’s order of division. But, everything miquella did ended in failure (his tree; curing Malenia; Reviving Godwyn; etc.). Why was it all failure? It was because he wanted to be different to Marika. Once he finds out that the only way to truly bring “salvation” is to become a God, that’s when he accepts that Marika was “right” all along. He then ventured on a journey to Godhood, taking the same steps Marika did in her journey in the Land of Shadow. Miquella acknowledges that to become a God is to lose compassion. He then abandoned the very part of him that provided love and compassion (St. Trina), because he knew that to enact his ambitious goals, he’d need to lose compassion. One does not become a God if he is human, after all. Miquella’s crosses are a genius way to explore this btw. If you have time, go back to the miquella crosses and you’ll see what I mean when I say he sacrificed all that made him “human” to enact goals that would make him into a “God”. Goals that, otherwise, would be unattainable had he remained himan Point is: Griffith was always selfish, and egotistical. Even in the end, when we kill them, Miquella still isn’t inherently “selfish” per-se. His adolescence just obscured his vision for what is needed to save people. He thought that, since everything was broken and didn’t work to save his people, he’d need to become a God. And to become a God, he’d need to lose humanity (St.Trina). He was, and IS, never inherently selfish or sadistic like Griffith. Miquella’s case is far more complex - involving the sense of self, the abandonment of personality to enact “justice” out of love. So miquella truly still “loved”, but his adolescence is symbolic of him lacking the wisdom in knowing that becoming a God truly strikes fear into normal humans

[@chillax319]

@@HeevaEgo In short the biggest failure of Miquella was leaving his love behind. This way he failed himself. Whathever he'd do as a full fledged god after that would be anything but the Age of Compassion. Miq was willing to sacrifice others as well as himself, he went too far and had to be put down by the Tarnished.

[@shaunflinn1002]

Miquella wanted ORIGINAL radahn for his consort, not the weak, rot ridden husk we fight in redmane.

[@HS09884]

I got absolutely shocked by radahn at the end of the dlc, i understood everything of the missing Lore and realized why did all happened

[@area52music]

And with all of this... we STILL dont really know why Marika shattered the ring, and where the elden beast comes in. Her master plan, us following her guidance. Its a giant mystery still....

[@jonahk7959]

Yeah, I am kinda bummed we couldn't literally step aside when he asked

[@vaguehenri802]

Anything but the ending we got would not have been appropriate for ER. The perfect quote. "I know. It’s all wrong. By rights we shouldn’t even be here. But we are. It’s like in the great stories, Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger, they were. And sometimes you didn’t want to know the end. Because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad had happened? But in the end, it’s only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come. And when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer."

[@haithem7469]

big respect for the Lotr quote

[@HahahMamaman]

This ending was the most cliche one possible. There weren’t even options. Extremely disappointing.

[@Arcessitor]

You are very myopic if you can't think of a 100 better endings than this.

[@vaguehenri802]

@@HahahMamamanThe ending makes perfect sense. Not every ending needs an unexpected twist. Miquellas story happens during the base game, not after.

[@vaguehenri802]

@@Arcessitor Not at all. I just think you don't understand the story he is telling and what the ending actually means. The ending is not Miquellas defeat. It is us becoming Elden lord. And as the lore very clearly states, there can only be 1 elden lord and god. Especially when 1 denies the embrace of the other.

[@snip3rkodak]

The tarnished is the goat

[@moonum4567]

I wouldn't say Miquella is all bad, but him casting aside his Love, which is the thing is age of compassion needs to operate successfully, was his biggest flaw. Of course, this wasn't just a "Oh ok, don't need this". He threw away his fear and doubt, which would have normally inhibited such a decision.

[@vortexyt78]

So Miquella was in love/obessed with Radahn as someone who has ability to charm everyone gets charmed by one of the Strongest demigod because even after fighting with malenia he was holding the stars, riding Leonard and surviving a rot nuke. But still he was not able to charm him and what i think is at the end the Radahn which we fought was at 75% of the actual Radahn since there are limitations to Mohg's body which must have an impact and maybe Mohg is the reason why Radahn accepted to become Miquella's consort since Radahn is 50%Mohg

[@Murakami2077]

Saying that Radahn didn't answer Miquella's request ignores both his lines and Redmane Freyja's in the dlc, in which both state that a vow has been firmed between the two brothers. Also, using Radahn's loyalty to the Golden Order as a argument ignores Morgott's line that calls Radahn a traitor, and also the beginning cutscene where we see Morgott and Radahn fighting. Thought, you could also justify this share with the "The mad taint of the Greatrunes" also stated in the begining cutscene, in a way that Radahn's Greatrune changed him in a way to make him turn on the Golden Order. Even if we don't know Radahn was actually that loyal to the Golden Order, he doesn't use any incantations, and his admiration was to his father (a champion) and Godfrey (a legendary warrior) so he may just admire this characteristics and not exactly the Golden Order.

[@xm4339]

Also, in the end cutscene Miquella says "if WE honor our part of the vow", meaning a third party was involved, presumably Malenia. Radahn did want to become the Elden Lord, which meant he needed other gods' Great Runes. But Malenia wanted nothing to do with the Golden Order and thus the Shattering became meaningless to her. She won't fight Radahn for his Great Rune, she wants to fully support her twin in establishing a new order. But this twin wants Radahn to be his consort, who declines. Radahn wishes to be the Elden Lord. So Miquella sends his sister to fight Radahn, with a condition - should Radahn win he can take both Malenia's and Miquella's Great Rune and go forward with becoming the Elden Lord, but should he lose or die his soul would be Miquella's to claim as his lord consort upon his divine ascension. Radahn vows to this. How does Radahn's soul reach the Gateway really? Perhaps it is just the terms of the Vow being honored. For Radahn was not able to become the Elden Lord, but fell by the hand of Malenia and was executed by the Tarnished.

[@Murakami2077]

@@xm4339 yes, but in truth, it doesn't matter if Radahn formed a vow or not. Thought, the way Miquella puts it really does make it seem his vow to Radahn was actually to kill him in battle, hence "if we honour our part of the vow" (felling Radahn in the battlefield)

[@jeth2517]

I'm just glad my theory is most likely correct *Berserk spoilers* I was thinking Miquella had a "Griffith breaking down moment". After getting rejected by Radahn which has never happened to him; he devised an ill-advised plan that kind of backfired on him Everyone loves him, no one turns him down, his ego was hurt so bad that he lost his sanity and everything turned to shit

[@ll-Sidious-ll]

Poor Radahn, Mohg, and Malenia. Just a puppet for Miquella in the end...

[@ruval1433]

This sorta explains why malenia would have wanted to fight radahn. Since they were closer from a younger age, she could have convinced malenia to fight radahn if miquella had plans for radahn.

[@SuperSaddlers1990]

so after all the mystery surrounding miquella, he just wants to be a elden lord or a god at least. glad we finally have some answers but i cant say im not disappointed.

[@Sylentmana]

Shadow of the Yandere Femboy

[@Johnny3Batony]

There is nothing fem about a biological man.

[@JPypa]

"O brother, lord brother, please die a true death." I understand the Golden Epitaph refers to Godwin by name but ARE WE SURE MIQUELLA WAS???

[@keisir8984]

I think its heavily implied Radahn accepted Miquellas proposal to be his consort when he was younger, but later on in life, during the shattering he went back on that vow, thats why hes called the "promised consort" and I think freyja makes mention of a vow between radahn and the twins. I also dont think Radahn was loyal to the Golden Order since he sieged leyndell and went toe to toe with morgott, and was close to his two siblings ranni and rykard, both of which opposed the golden order. Just because his idols were loyal to the golden order wouldn't necessarily mean he himself would be. More importantly its stated that Radahn loved war, probably more than he did the golden order, so him joining his siblings in their war against the golden order would show his loyalty to his family and satisfy his desire for battle.

[@crazy13alex]

I'm more surprised that every player just accepts that Miquella charmed everyone he ever met. Yes, he has that ability. So does that mean that his wish to create a gentler world is automatically a lie? Because even the npcs who were disenchanted don't regard Miquella with disdain. They don't talk about him like he's a villainous mastermind. They see him for the naive child who is so committed to his cause. He doesn't understand how he is going about it all wrong. Did people forget that Miquella and Malenia are the *youngest* of a god lineage? Think about what that means before we even unpack their family history. The values Miquella took from his parents and siblings. My point is that I don't believe Miquella ever matured enough to comprehend why certain decisions would be questionable. Such as Malenia nuking Kaelid: Could he even consider that his new world might not correct that scar?

[@Mgauge]

Miquela's "kindness" had been so warped that it had long since become little more than an excuse for a need to dominate. He was no less of a manipulative abuser than his mother had become. His Age of "Compassion" would be an eternal brainwashed nightmare. That said, considering that we can also choose the Dung Eater's eternal suffering and the Frenzied Flame's desire to burn it all down, I could see it being an option. It's at least marginally better than either of those.

[@dadevi]

He chose Radahn because he was the one who resisted him the most because he was the most stubborn demigod(using gravity magic for a horse too small for you is already insane). I think this resistance made Miquella want Radahn even more. Kind of like a predatary guy going after a woman who rejects him several times.

[@Zuckerstange666]

A lot of it seems very speculative and based on very thin evidence. And no this is not how Fromsoftware games always are, Elden Ring simply has a lot of holes in its Lore and makes any theorrizing mostly pure speculation

[@fishyfish7158]

finally someone said it...

[@Jai_dinn]

Miqulester

[@dr.smooth4415]

I think it's interesting from a narrative perspective that you could argue Miquella was closer to achieving his plans as a demigod than he was when he was trying to ascend. The original idea behind the Haligtree in a way it would have acted as a mirror to the Erdtree as the Scadutree is. But like you pointed out in the video, something broke within him when Radhan rejected him. I think for the first time ever Radhan made him feel mortal. Never once had he been rejected but here in front of this champion who was everything he was not. Just has his mother's fear of the hornset drove her to discard her children in Mohg and Margott. So to did Miquellas fears that if one person could reject him it meant others could and would. So he sought to go further beyond a demigod, to do what his mother did, and as Marika said herself, "Hear me, Demigods. My children beloved. Make of thyselves that which ye desire. Be it a Lord. Be it a God."

[@fleetstreet11]

An option to join Miquella, and an option to be Leda's consort as Radahn is Miquella's.

[@naka3339]

I think it's a great misconception that Miquella was in love with Radahn at all. Miquella seems to be following Marika steps, its stated Miquella discarded his love and fate along with Trina (so his love/fate is Trina like Radagon/Marika ). Miquella needed Radahn as his Lord/Consort same way Marika needed Godfrey to conquer the lands between. Radahn is portrayed as someone who revered Godfrey and the golden order so he basically wanted the same as Godfrey to maintain the golden order / default ending. Promised does not mean Radahn promised to be his consort, it can have meaning of fate/destiny. As if in order to Miquella godhood to happens he needed Radahn strength.

[@LightsFuzzy]

Except in this case, we can see Miquella's memory of asking Radahn to promise to be his consort, so I think assuming that the word has a different meaning is a bit of a stretch. It's very much implied that Radahn had promised Miquella.

[@kayhaich]

I think he wanted godwyn as consort but he got killed

[@naka3339]

@@LightsFuzzy no it don't Radahn had his own agenda he tried to invade Leyndell he was not Miquella ally. Miquella send Malenia and her army to kill Radahn in order to have his soul. It was not a friendly duel between Malenia and Radahn it was a full on war and both lost alot of people.

[@LightsFuzzy]

@@naka3339 Why would Miquella refer to Radahn as his "Loyal blade" if they were not allies? A vow needed to be fulfilled before Miquella could ascend to godhood, one of which was likely that Radahn would die an honorable death in combat, and Miquella needing to reach the realm of shadow. It even said that Miquella admired Radahn, and we can even see him pleading with Radahn to be his king consort.

[@LightsFuzzy]

@@kayhaich I mean, Radahn died as well, it was merely a matter of calling his soul back. I agree that Godwyn would have been a better choice, but it's clear Miquella preferred Radahn.

[@ravendelacour1917]

The reason that Miquella was able to control Radhan now was that the Scarlet Rot had erased Radhan's mind before he was killed. If Malenia had killed Radhan initially, Miquella might not have been able to dominate his very pissed off half-brother.

[@foureyesisafish7968]

Either that or it's because of the absence of Radahn's great rune, which also resisted the rot

[@richter6699]

Nice headcanon you've got there. But the most simple explanation is that Radahn agreed to it himself. He's referred to as PROMISED Consort, and the final scene shows Miquella talking about the deal they made

[@ravendelacour1917]

@@foureyesisafish7968 Perhaps both but since Radahn's Great Rune left his body on autopilot, I am not sure it would provide resistence to Miquella's mind control. The Tarnished has at least one and likely many more Great Runes and it didn't help them resist Miquella. It was Rahdan's sheer stubbornness and likely his bloodthirsty nature that helped him resist Miquella. After all, what great wars would a great bloodthirsty warrior like Radahn have to fight in an Age of complete peace? Radahn resisted Miquella because Miquella had nothing to offer him. He doesn't want a world at peace. He wants a world at eternal war.

[@ravendelacour1917]

@@richter6699 If Radahn was willing to be Miquella's consort, he'd had just showed up and agreed. Instead Melania was dispatched to murder Radahn and steal his soul. That doesn't scream "willing bride" to me.

[@Arcessitor]

​@@richter6699 Yeah, that is the simplest explanation. It is also one that runs counter to the original story. Malenia kills Radahn despite Radahn already agreeing so that he can become mentally unwell, die, then get resurrected later on. Keep in mind, I'm not disagreeing your take is the correct take. Fromsoft just couldn't write a decent story to save their lives. This is why people are making up this elaborate cope.

[@belial1821]

Angered at Miquella

[@huealter3366]

11:29 Side with Miquella means being brainwashed by him, no other options. Basicly you wish to make the same mistake as Mohg. Mohg's fate shows that there are no equals footing when dealing with Miquella, the most fearsome demigod

[@JaguarBST]

I’m sorry Mogh 😢

[@rubenotero7100]

Miquella confirmed Sanrio girlie

[@Markadown]

A bit disappointed. I even had low expectations but was still let down after beating it. No lifting the veil. No ascending to Godhood for us (hell, make it a available if we became Elden Lord). I am learning with FromSoft games that they will give you just enough so you can explore and discover, which is great, but they also leave some things extremely vague or bland when it could have used some extra oomph. The ending with Miq memory was useless. It was info we already knew at that point. No Marika ascension to godhood or the origin of what triggered things. I dunno. Just kinda let down but outside of that, I loved the DLC. Edit: to clarify, I’m talking about cut scenes. I already know you can read every item in the game to piece it together. I have read every item I found. I’ve explored her village. Let me have my shitty powerscaling fantasy bs cgi cut scenes 😭😭

[@alecll493]

Bro when his shitty headcannon and power fantasy doesnt matter

[@AlterFoxEast]

We do actually find out about her origins, her motivations. While not blatantly stated, you find out by going to the Shaman Village. The village is bathed in gold and protected by two Tree Sentinels. That's weird don't you think, they're in the land of Shadow with the Scadutree, not the Erdtree. Unless, something of importance to Marika is in the village. Her hometown, now abandoned after her people the Numen were spirited away by the Hornfolk. Possibly out of prejudice and were forced into Jars. Her ascension to godhood was for the most part, revenge. This completely changes everything we know about how the Omen and Crucible entities were treated. They had no Grace because Marika refused them. All she wanted was to protect her home, her family. She never really wanted the Order, only to be bathed in the kindness of Gold. Like her home.

[@Anfallhund]

you play the part of one of a million of others like you in fromsoft games. your character doesnt matter in the grand scheme of things. they want you to feel small in comparison to the grandioseness of the lore of the bosses and npcs. only when you complete your goal will your character become special. oh and also we found out about the entirety of marikas back story what are you talking about?

[@Markadown]

@@Anfallhund I know all of that.

[@Markadown]

@@AlterFoxEast yes, I know.

[@BrightNexus410]

Miquela's plan was similar to Clifford DeVoe's from the Flash series: to establish control. Miquela aimed to enchant people to do his bidding, while DeVoe used satellites to influence people to act from a state of high intellect, devoid of emotion, striving for greatness without room for failure or free will. Additionally, Miquela could inhabit various bodies, such as Radahn's and possibly even Mohg's, as evidenced by encounters with numerous NPCs in the DLC. Similarly, DeVoe used his superior intellect and master throne to transfer the abilities of other metahumans to himself, advancing his own agenda. We, the Tarnished of the old order, spent our journey cleansing the Lands Between from remnants of the previous order, which ultimately led to the destruction of the Erdtree. In the Flash series, Barry had to destroy one of DeVoe's satellites, risking his life and many others in Central City. His daughter, using her time-reversal powers, saved him without his knowledge, as she came from the future. This intervention allowed the only consequence to be the unintended corruption caused by the satellite and the execution of the Reverse Flash's premeditated plan, connecting to the broader narrative of Elden Ring. In Elden Ring, Miquela, possessing Milena's body since the beginning, guided us to the point where we destroy the Erdtree in various endings, thereby corrupting the world seemingly of our own volition. However, in reality, we were enchanted, driven by the desire to uncover the story and the world's hidden secrets, ultimately seeking great power.

[@NougatNate]

to me, Miquella's plan feels very similar to Madara's from Naruto. think about it; both desire to become perfect beings, ones capable of bringing everyone together in unity, by choice or by force. both are willing to use, manipulate, and discard anyone for the sake of their goal. Madara planned a whole WAR for his plan, while Miquella has the literal power to make others follow an serve him, nevertheless both of their end goals are the same; eternal peace, through total domination

[@tossapat027]

I like DLC Story. But still hope EM will update Dialogue&Questline for this DLC. //LIKE COME ON DUDEs WE WAIT FOR A MONTH to get Diallos ,Kenneth Haight and Patches to completing after Game Release

[@stitchedfreedom]

Whatever they do I will never forgive them for cutting Kale's questline and will never be fully satisfied if it is not implemented (and it won't be)

[@chinodelfigalo9501]

I can’t forgive them for not giving us Melina as a hidden fight that we were supposed to get.

[@willthevill5500]

​@@chinodelfigalo9501dlc is not a direct sequel to events of main story though, only post radahn and post mohg but not after we become the elden lord

[@Rusty_Spy]

Zero mention of the vow between Miquella and Radahn that completely undermines this interpretation. They had a mutual agreement and Radahn promised to be his consort if Miquella upheld his end of the vow, which is all but stated to be defeating him in battle. And it only makes sense for a warrior like Radahn to want nothing more than to wage war for such high stakes. Your say he wouldn't ever agree to follow Miquella's consort because he's loyal to the GO, but remember that his idol, Godfrey's, main philosophy is that "a crown is warranted by strength". So it only makes sense that, above all else, a warrior like Radahn would live by this code and pledge himself to Miquella if he could prove he had the strength to best him in combat. If Miquella truly wanted Radahn he could've simply charmed him; your theory that Radahn was resistant to it is pure head canon and has no substantial evidence.

[@quanny4690]

it really is up to interpretation. how can we say that miquella did not charm radahn into accepting the vow? and why did radahn stop the stars, if not to prevent his fate as miquella's consort?

[@tricky9131]

I think miquella chose Radahn because Radahn wasn’t tainted/connected by/to an outer god. Godwyn was probably his first choice but after his eclipse ritual failed to restore Godwyn he moved on to Radahn. Ranni chose to ally herself and tie her fate to the stars. Rykard chose the serpent. Morgott was exiled and tainted by the crucible and Mohg chose the formless mother. Malenia was chosen by the Scarlet Rot. There’s Messmer and Melina but both had the flame of ruin sealed within themselves. The only demigod not connected to external threats to Miquella’s ambitions was Radahn.

[@TomBombadill85]

Mohgs body which is used by miquella to house radahns soul was conntected the formless mother so that theory is wrong

[@SteviaCookies]

Also there's a thing that I keep thinking about: Radahn is the character most similar to Godfrey, a warrior through and through, has his wildness and brutality, his sense of honor. We are also said that Radahn was obsessed by Godfrey and the lion theme of his armor is meant to recall Serosh. So, in addition to all you said, I think in some way his choice is a mirror of Marika's first choice, the first person she saw fit to become her consort.

[@erisofliria]

Miquella's offer to Radahn reminds me of Griffith's offer to Guts. Guts refused it, but lost in duel and had to join the Band of the Falcon. It makes sense for Radahn to ask for a combat like Guts asked, and being defeated by Malenia, be forced to become Miquella's consort.

[@nicholascole9673]

Anyone who thought this mind controlling freak was a good guy was always delusional.

[@calebgriffin4214]

I loved the lore, but I think the story itself could have used some work. Radahn seemed pretty out of left field, and I feel like we should have gotten a bit more motivation for our actions. I mean they made us kill Moore and Freya, I think we need a bit more than what we got. Miquella messing with people is bad, but we also have to consider that we ourselves killed these people, so he’s not much worse than us in that regard; plus an age of compassion doesn’t seem that bad compared to melting the world and everything in it.

[@miriamemanueleforneris3701]

Well those people tries tò Destroy US everytime they see us

[@spookzer16]

"The age of loveless compassion isn't that bad compared to nuking everything." I mean in that context I guess it's not bad.

[@tonyspizza6606]

well think like that, your trapped in your body and and just have to look at miquella and how you "love" him....sound much worse than just death for all