Mixing QSC KW181 and KS212C Subs In The Same System? | Phase Compatibility Test

[@DjTecniq]

Great channel. I bought the KS212c in Feb 23’ of last year. While i love it it hits the limiter at 12 o clock position or below which surprised me considering it’s a 3600 watt sub i never would have experienced this…however my KW181 which i still have has never limited out at 12 o clock or below and it’s only 1000 watts. I’m not even pushing the KS212c very hard and it seems to not have the power it claims unless mine has a fault. I just purchased an EV EKX15sp and will be doing a comparison of both. If the EV sounds good I’ll get another for a matching set and sell my KS212c.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

I don't have a ton of experience with the KS212c's, but I was also underwhelmed with their power output. You lose ~3dB of headroom or so by nature of the cardioid pattern, but the smaller 12" woofers also don't have as much max SPL capability as the 18" woofer.

[@nickbarcio]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio Thanks for this! I have been having this very same debate and nowhere local I could test the KS212C. I have loved the sounds from my KW181 for the last 10 years but wanted to get less boom in the DJ booth... welp... Guess that's not in the cards.

[@DjTecniq]

@@nickbarcio just an fyi. I have my EV EKX15 sp and that sub is terrific what i love most it has regular sub mode and cardioid while the KS212c is always in cardioid. The EV is lighter and much more portable I could curl it like a weight it’s like 50 pounds or more. It also is not as wide and long like the KS212c. I will be selling my QSC soon and getting another EKX15sp…simply an awesome sub and seems to handle bass much better as the design is boxed.

[@hugorobinson277]

@@DjTecniq thx for the input... Currently have a pair of kw122 with 2 kw181... For my type of gigs, office parties, weddings, 200 people max, they do the job for most of pop-dance music. But I recently began doing outdoors gigs, with more electro, and I feel I miss some punch. The 181 sound good from a certain distance, they give the sub-bass, but i feel the 122 have to backup for bass richness and clarity. Aaaand that's when they sometimes clip or shut down... killing the vibe.... Even got my behringer 812 at the rescue one time... So I hesitate between a 2x12'' like the 212c or a 15'' like the EKX15 or RCF 905 mk3 to help the 181s... As a complement, what would you be prompt to choose?

[@DjTecniq]

@@hugorobinson277 I’m almost 41 and I’m not getting any younger. I have my KW181 still but I’m done hauling 18” woofers around. I like having two 15’s they are more portable and hardly any strain on my back. I love bass just like any DJ in FL would but I’ll bring out my KW181 for bigger events. I love QSC but i do not like the new KS series subs they are too tall and way too wide for my liking. Can’t even fit the 212c under my booth facade cause it’s too wide and long it sticks out way too far for that very reason and the weak output it has for a 3600 watt sub (which is bs) I can’t recommend it. My EKX is shorter, not anywhere near as wide and can easily fit under my booth/facade with plenty of room still. The EKX wins and I’m sure the EKX18sp would even be better suited. If you want deeper bass get the ETX series’s but that weight alone is a deal breaker for me.

[@michaelskudutis9460]

Thanks for the info 👍 I have two single 18s 6th order band pass subs and have recently added a duel 18 front firing ported box to the setup. I am planning of placing it in the middle of the single 18's. I am going to measure and phase align, but would you suggest splitting the lows between? Also subwoofer frequency tuning? Thanks 😊

[@FreeKeenan]

How can I run an external a driverack using a pair of ks118 with a pair of qsc kw 122? They don't seem to have a way to bypass the internal crossover? And qsc seems to keep what filters and slopes they are using??

[@soundoffaithministries]

Hi Great info, I plan on using the QSC line array LA108 with the Ks212c to the side about 15ft up against a wall. Did the layout on easy focus 3 and have it work in all green at 3 octaves, but do I need to check phase alinement between subs and line array speakers?

[@intoxicode]

Going to attempt the impossible soon and try to phase match my turbosound iq18b and new QSC ls118 ....

[@djdmack2126]

Thanks for another great explanatory piece! I have a QSC KSub currently, I’m looking at getting the KS212C. My question is will it be worth keeping the KSub and using them together for larger venues? And will they sound ok together?

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

I don't have any side-by-side measurements, but from what else I've seen from QSC's product line I think they'd be phase compatible.

[@tyronethomas6536]

Thank you for the content that you provide. Really love this channel. I’m hoping that you could possibly do a video specifically regarding the issues with the QSC K.2 Series in general. These units are having major issues and it’s like QSC is just ignoring it. I personally have 2 of the K12.2 and I’ve experienced the audio drop outs that everybody else is experiencing and had to shut the unit down and turn it back. on in order to get it to play again smh brand new units

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Hey, Tyrone. I've heard others have had issues with them, but I've actually never had a K12.2 give me any problems! So I'm honestly not the subject matter expert here.

[@truestory2227]

Quick question, I have a 18” powered subwoofer that has a frequency range of 40hz to 140hz the amp built in is rated 600w RMS @ 8ohm. If I was to upgrade the driver that has the same capabilities but has a response from 30hz to 200hz and a higher sensitivity of 99db, In theory would this provide a lower response and a higher SPL???

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

That all adds up to me, although it's not common to run a subwoofer all the way up to 200Hz.

[@truestory2227]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio thank you!!! I’ll probably keep it from 30-120hz. I’m excited to replace the driver to a neodymium Subwoofer to save weight.

[@jeffsharp7362]

Great do you have any info on rcf8004s with

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

With which other sub?

[@jeffsharp7362]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio 8003 mk 2 thanks

[@jeffsharp7362]

hI mate did you find out anything ?

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

@@jeffsharp7362 Sorry for the delay! I just pulled up each of those subs GLL files and exported the data into OSM and compared the data. Long story short, they're not a "perfect match", but their phase traces do trend very similarly. They stay within +-50° of each other from 40Hz up to 125Hz, so you will get at LEAST 5dB of the total possible 6dB summation when paired together. I'd have no problem putting these subs together on a show. They're most closely phase aligned at 100Hz, then slowly drift up to 50° apart by 63Hz. I've posted a Dropbox link below that will take you two screenshots that show you the data. Hope this helps! www.dropbox.com/sh/lm5fubtiflecpxv/AAB-A1r4MskVDOIaA5_aWFeHa?dl=0

[@jeffsharp7362]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio you are amazing my friend ...love the channel and thank you very much

[@nathanlively]

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[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

You're welcome! Where did I say that :D?!?!

[@nathanlively]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio jk, “he’s killer”

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

@@nathanlively Got it : )