Ranking EVERY Pokemon As A Smash Fighter! Ft. PJiggles, Introspecktive, TierZoo, EE, Dabuz... Part 1

[@MrMockRock]

Thanks for watching everyone, and a HUGE thanks to all the guests that lent a hand to what turned out to be, in retrospect, an incredibly stupid project considering I was planning to have a relaxing holiday. You can find links to all their channels below as well as timestamps for when they appear in the video. In the meantime, let me know what you thought of the list! I'll be starting work on the finale a few days after Christmas and if there are any legitimately good points raised in the comments I may take them into account. *Timestamps for Guests* Leon Massey - 0:10:12 www.youtube.com/@LeonMassey PJiggles - 0:17:58 www.youtube.com/@PJiggles WhyDo - 0:29:32 www.youtube.com/@WhyDo Big Yellow - 0:44:10 www.youtube.com/@BigYellowSilly PKBeats - 1:01:38 www.youtube.com/@Casual_PKBeats Vernias - 1:12:13 www.youtube.com/@Vernias MrDanish ButterCookie - 1:15:42 www.youtube.com/@MrDanishbuttercookie Aaronitmar - 1:28:03 www.youtube.com/@Aaronitmar Sillintor - 1:35:30 www.youtube.com/@Sillintor Heeew - 1:45:28 www.youtube.com/@Heeew EE - 1:52:15 www.youtube.com/@EEvisu Odyssey Central - 1:59:13 www.youtube.com/@Odyssey_Central Vars - 2:00:15 www.youtube.com/@VarsIII TierZoo - 2:11:58 www.youtube.com/@TierZoo Dabuz - 2:19:34 www.youtube.com/@DabuzSSB Introspecktive - 2:26:33 www.youtube.com/@IntroSpecktive Delzethin - 2:32:30 www.youtube.com/@Delzethin AndYetNoBananas - 2:33:08 www.youtube.com/@andyetnobananas FibreOpticBroadBean - 2:35:03 www.youtube.com/@Fobb Design Doc - 2:43:00 www.youtube.com/@DesignDoc AceStarThe3rd - 2:52:42 www.youtube.com/@AceStarThe3rd *Patreon:* www.patreon.com/mockrock *Second channel:* kzbin.info *Twitter:* twitter.com/MrMockRock *Twitch:* www.twitch.tv/mockrocktwitch *Teespring:* teespring.com/stores/mockrock *TimeBolt affiliate link* (excellent software I use to speed up editing on my videos, use code "MOCKROCK" for a discount): mockrock--timebolt.thrivecart.com/order-page/

[@ghostraptor1741]

Hear me out about Grovyle. Make a mystery dungeon based moveset

[@arcivist]

I've only just started this video, but this is a stacked roster of guests. I'm so excited to watch the rest.

[@woodenaiden2054]

I find it really funny that you think MockRockTalk content isn’t worthy of the main channel when it’s higher quality than 99.99999% of KZbin conteny

[@Fidumo]

I kind of wish there were timestamps for each Pokemon but… that would be a ton of time stamps

[@WhyYouWahYoo]

I saw “every” and thought it MUST be clickbait. Nope. Good God.

[@MaxMonado]

Oh my god I thought it said 'every starter' when I clicked on this, Jesus Christ Mockrock delivered

[@whatthewhatthe9117]

Well it’s not everything but it’s part 1 so the nicher mons like drampa or lapras will be coming soon

[@insomniacnerd5592]

This man can be crazy sometimes.

[@kami9143]

It's not every mon cause he purposely put some mons into tiers like they can't have a moveset (a lot he put out could) but Fish and Birds are understandable

[@oven723]

Lawd almaghty 😵

[@DjoingDalton]

Now this is the 'Pokémon smash or Pass' I've been waiting for.

[@MrMockRock]

I knew this was gonna pop up somewhere 🙃

[@DjoingDalton]

@@MrMockRock I'm serious, I've been waiting for someone to do this.

[@Glory2Snowstar]

The version we aces have truly desired

[@thisisasupersayin376]

No, cause where's the Pass part? Tell us which Pokemon belong on the Fortnite Battle Pass, MockRock

[@keksidy]

Tell us which Pokemon are capable of hitting the griddy, MockRock

[@IntroSpecktive]

Mock, your grind is insane dude thank you for letting me be a part of it. I’m sure Sakurai would completely agree with my design!

[@MrMockRock]

Fuecoco.

[@smargio]

Honestly if they did a gen 9 Trainer fuecoco was my pick for the 1st stage.

[@MajoraZ]

As a competitive Pokken player, I appreciate the clips from our events being shown here! For fun, here's how Pokken handles each Pokemon you covered: *AEGISLASH* : Pretty much works how you guys want it to in Smash! In Pokken, Aegislash has a stance switching mechanic (he can even cancel the endlag/recovery frames into the switch like your Meloetta idea!) which changes his moveset from being a close to mid range character with good pressure tools and poke options in the Sword stance; into more of a projectile based zoner with an always-active hit of armor in the Shield stance. You actually get buffs the more you "unsheathe" from Shield to Sword stance, which gives the Sword stance more damage, speed, and more just-frames and followup options. Aegislash also has a unique parry mechanic no other character has *BLASTOISE* : He's sort of hard to describe the playstyle of. He has a mix of zoning options with projectiles, ranging from typical ones, slower lingering ones and even some which fall down from above; a (slow) command grab, as well as a stance mechanic where he withdraws into his shell with armor frames and that also carries some momentum which allows him to approach while somewhat protected, and has followup options from it. He also has huge amount of health, and can even regen health by BLESSING THE RAINS OF AFRICA by doing a literal goovy Rain Dance. In short, he's sort of a defensive, tanky mid range character that can keep you at bay, lock you down and mix you up with grabs and his stance, and has armored approach options. Sadly is one of only 2ish characters in the game some people consider unviable at a high level, though he still has some top 8 placements. (the game is very well balanced) *MACHAMP* : Machamp is, predictably, a slow heavy hitter and grappling character (something to keep in mind is that in Pokken, like other traditional fighting games, has you with a limited health pool, so blocking is both more important but also more of a commitment that really limits your mobility, unlike in smash... in turn, grabs are a bigger deal too) that puts the fear of god in you as inches his way closer. He can have trouble getting close (though he does have some armored or projectile invulnerable rolls on both the ground and midair), but once he's in, he can absolutely take out half of your lifebar in a few or even just a single hit/grab. In Pokken, you switch from the 2d phase to the 3d one based on a hidden PSP meter filling up, but Machamp's command grabs can keep you in the corner instead of shifting and getting you out of pressure, and even has a move which REDUCES the PSP meter on hit rather then raising it, meaning he can keep you trapped in the corner and close to him *BLAZIKEN* : All out offense, high pressure rushdown! Has TONs of moves (Blaze Kick, Flare Blitz, Brave Bird, etc) with lasting active hitboxes that also advance him forward (and the enemy further towards the wall), many of which pierce through armor and focus attack (at least when boosted, see below), meaning he constantly puts the other player on the defensive and under pressure and can bust through the tools you usually rely on in those situations. The moment the other player panics or makes the wrong call, they get blown up for big damage. However, Blaziken struggles to deal with projectiles at a distance (which can knock him out of many of his moves) or when HE'S under pressure. Many of his specials I describe above also are only really good when powered up, which costs his own health to do. Has competitive successes, but bottom 5, maybe bottom 3 *SCEPTILE* : Pokken's token fighting game ninja! He has Leech Seed and Seed Bomb traps and floating leaf shuriken to limit the enemy's mobility and as setup tools, leaf blade is a mid range iajutsu slash that causes a hard knockdown, a Substitute log as a counter, and finally Leaf Storm is the obligatory Izuna Drop anti air command grab. His intended playstyle is him locking you down with his trap/screen control options, and as you're kept in place, he nails you with Giga drain (a long range command grab), or with Leaf Blade or normals if you try to approach. But he's also got the walk speed, the mobility tools (good dashes, a vine hang in midair, etc) to play rushdown, and can start a full combo from almost any hit anywhere on the screen. VERY versatile *SCIZOR* : An unorthodox mix of both being high-mobility, but also a reactive defensive character: His armored focus attack can land even from mid range and allows scizor to move during it's chargeup, and he has other good armored reversals and moves with lasting hitboxes that advance him fowards. At the same time, he has mobility tools like being able to cancel the recovery/endlag of a dash into another dash, as well as both a run state and a midair hover state , both of which he has mixup options out of, ranging from both command grabs to followup attacks, and more. Finally, he has a stack/resource mangement mechanic in sword dance, which he can spend to power up his specials or to shoot out as a projectile. He also has some REALLY fancy looking midair juggle combos *CROAGUNK* : The joke character. He has many moves with straight up RNG, that randomly switches between different types of projectiles, or that gives itself or the enemy different buffs and debuffs. It also has comically long midair juggle combos where it switches directions and momentum in midair, rapidly or as it slowly floats, and can also stick to walls. I wish I had more to say, but he sees so little play I don't have much experience fighting the character. Almost universally considered the worst character in the game *DECIDUEYE* : Pretty close to what you guys propose! He's a mobile mixup character that also has zoning tools! Decidueye has absolutely dizzying animations and movements, being able to both shoot up into the air, glide and hover, and bounces around from the ground to the sky and back and forth during his combos and normals (and yes, has an extra jump!). Even just the animations can are visually confusing enough to cause the other player to push the wrong buttons, but he also then has functional mixup and different followup options out of everything too. He also can pepper you from a distance with projectiles or hazards that fall from the sky, and uniquely can inflict a debuff that prevents you from calling your support/assist in *DARKRAI* : a unique trap and install/transformation character, very technical like Aegislash. Most of his moves set traps he can then activate to form different hitboxes and projectiles, and unlike most of the cast (where the 3d phase is just a buffer layer of neutral before you switch back to the 2d one) Darkrai can do full combo/juggles even in the 3d field phase using them. However, your real goal is to cause a shift back to the 2d phase by landing Dark Void specifically, which causes Darkrai enters a special Nightmare/BDR state for the duration of that 2d phase, allowing it to instantly trigger his traps traps the moment it lays them down. It also has a stack mechanic where every trap it lays gives it a resource, plus he has teleports, etc. In short, Darkrai is pretty much JP in Street Fighter 6 (even with the same dark thorns coming out of portals) just with an install mechanic too *GENGAR* : Another weird one! Tons of his moves have extended periods where he can phase through attacks with I-frames, plus a lot of cancels allowing him to transition into more intangibility, teleports, or different variations of the same move. Shadow ball can be held to linger in place as a obstacle or setup tool to try to get grabs off of, which is important since Gengar builds up meter VERY slowly, and most grabs cause instant phase shifts, giving you bonus meter. Normally, Gengar is a decent, though not a great character, but when you have full meter and enter burst as Mega Gengar, it basically may as well be an install state, since it changes a huge amount of his moveset and makes him SUPER busted, but getting more then one burst per match requires using high-meter-gain combo routes/options *GARDEVOIR* : A zoner and screen control character, though one with decent versatility. Gardevoir has a lot of projectiles like Energy Ball, Psychic, and Future Sight that linger or float around in the air as hazards, slowly move across the screen, or detonate either on a timer or manually. Gardevoir also has a stack mechanic which can be cashed out to enhance Stored Power into a screen covering damage wave. However, she isn't limited to playing keepaway, and also some advancing moves with lasting hitboxes allowing her to approach (or can approach behind/with her hazards), has decent normals for up close combat, can use her delayed projectiles as setup options to keep the enemy under pressure in the corner as she attacks, and has a wierdy high damage grab *GARCHOMP* : Sorta what you proposed! A heavy hitting rushdown and mixup character. Garchomp's main unique feature is he can enter into a running stance to allow him to quickly approach and do multiple followups out of (he also has a number of charging and advancing moves with lasting hitboxes, or like dig which can bypass projectiles), plus he has both command counter and grab tools in Stone Edge and Sand Tomb respectively, as well as hugely damaging corner combos, putting you in an awkward position of guessing what Garchomp is gonna do and risk getting grabbed, comboed into oblivion or accidentally triggering Stone Edge I wanted to speak a bit about some other Pokemon you mentioned (I actually think Falinks has lot of potential in Smash if he sort of works like Olimar, where you control the main body and can send out the others to attack or to stand in place as traps/hazards) but I'm at the character limit already! The Pokemon already in Smash like Pikachu etc will be in my comment on the Part 2 video alongside others not covered yet like Weavile etc.

[@TheXLPlays]

😦

[@cogsentient]

The "who wants the middle evolution" when talking about Grovyle of all pokemon has killed me. talking about probably the single most popular starter mid-evo like that.

[@PQRDG]

Grovyle should get bonus points for Mystery Dungeon. I have always advocated for a Grovyle and Celebi combo character in reference to the Explorers games

[@SaltyTreecko]

I'm sayin

[@azzix45]

@@PQRDG my only condition for grovyle getting in is if it's entry animation is a reference to him pushing dusknoir and he staggers through

[@thatchillasian8924]

Can't wait for the next video where you rank every real life animal based on how well they would fit into Smash Bros.

[@daamazingfireman5566]

MANTIS SHRIMP S TIER 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@Glory2Snowstar]

Bobbit worm. Just stay in the center of the stage and kindly ask your opponent to walk over you.

[@nocturn333]

Time for another tier zoo colab.

[@mintystingmoon4787]

that floppy fish tier’s gonna be huge

[@mujifans4540]

​@@daamazingfireman5566 No Barnacles clearly the true S tier

[@TaleOfTheToaster]

34:42 Grovyle, who wants the middle evolution - well, us! Call it a Pokémon Mystery Dungeon rep and throw in some references, I recognise Sceptile is probably the correct call and a Top 5 contender in general, but I’d take Grovyle in a heartbeat

[@smollmoth6376]

I was genuinely surprised when he said that because there is a not significant community that adores and prefers grovyle to sceptile.

[@DoctorFalchion]

I absolutely want Grovyle over Sceptile, and frankly if you just go full Mystery Dungeon and give it time manipulation abilities that would be even better. Huge Dusknoir fan too.

[@ellis2706]

Grovyle would be my top choice for smash

[@MrMockRock]

A few people have brought this up and I can truly say I don't get the idea of pulling from Pokemon Mystery Dungeon instead of the mainline series lol. Nice to see Grovyle support, I personally really like its design and possibly prefer it visually over Sceptile, but this is gonna be an "agree to disagree" situation

[@soulcyclone360]

​@@MrMockRockbecause Mystery Dungeon are some of the best games of the entire Pokemon franchise. Most played and most profitable? Probably not, but in terms of quality, few things come close.

[@Scienceboy0]

Even when it's not his video, OdysseyCentral finds a way to name drop Dry Bones and Mario. Absolute legend.

[@weirdguy1495]

I thought: Of course he picks the Dry Bones-esque Pokemon for this.

[@surelyyoujestin4871]

12:25 - 12:44 Yes, but consider: *A machoke echo fighter with a tiny little machop riding on it's shoulders acting as the second pair of arms*

[@MrMockRock]

I will not, but I appreciate the hustle

[@Daedalus-Inc]

Putting in a good word for Golurk here. Has decent options for both ranged and physical attacks, has the ability to fly for an up-special, and its ghostly powers are more than sufficient to cover for the other specials.

[@itsturniptime3699]

It’s literally Potemkin from Guilty Gear

[@je19493]

Pheromosa F tier is waaaay too harsh. It's known for its blazing fast movement w/ strong kicks. It has a sephiroth-like body shape in smash and could be quick with quick attacks but is an extreme lightweight. I think this is a solid S tier!

[@morphstarchangeling8024]

I feel the same way. I also think Mimikyu is way too low. Mimikyu's disguise ability could translate to it taking reduced damage up to a certain percent. It has access to moves like thunderbolt to spice up its attacks.

[@Dan-mz3we]

Pheremosa is just weird looking though

[@Deadpool-ri3rq]

I said out loud “Someone doesn’t know what Pheromosa is about” when he said that.

[@KeiranTrick]

Pheromosa is Pokémon Bayonetta, right? How could that not work out

[@unboundedquasar]

What Keiran said, it’s pretty damn good as it’s very much a speedy glass cannon being the pure opposite of buzzswole at least smash design wise, heck it’s beast boost could either boost its movement speed all together or just makes it’s attacks faster; better frame data. But then we might have another sonic on our hands where people find her annoying to fight or catch given she can’t afford to make mistakes

[@king_alloy]

I'd like to mention that Galarian Darmanitan's Zen Mode isn't actually immobile. IT GETS MORE MOBILE. It reaches a blistering base 135 Speed when it goes Zen and is even stronger. This would be close to Sephiroth's One Wing form as a comeback mechanic that increases mobility and strength at the same time. Think normal Garmanitan as around DK Speed, good but not great, and suddenly it gets into Zen Mode and functionally Acceleratles and Oomphs itself. It gains the Fire Type instead of the Psychic Type upon transformation as well, so adding a fiery touch to it's icy moves would make an awesome looking character, as it's also the only Pokemon with the Ice/Fire Typiing. That makes it A Tier to me.

[@MrMockRock]

Yeah, this is one that I just straight-up got wrong, I've seen it before but it's been a few years and I forgot how it worked, when I record part 2 I'll include a correction

[@kami9143]

The Gen 5 Slander in this video is fucking crazy.

[@10Gpixels]

I'd honestly prefer if False Swipe were a move with set knockback and 0 damage scaling, so that it could combo at any percent, could set up a kill, but also would be near impossible to kill with.

[@PenCatStudio]

So yeah, Minior really would suck as a smash fighter BUT I think it would make for a wonderful Pokeball assist summon. Like, it pops out of the ball and summons a minior shower. It would be a useful assist and a cool way to show off the next console’s graphical capabilities since it has 6 forms

[@MrMockRock]

I deliberately avoided bringing up any kind of "Pokeball Tier" or something like that because I could easily see that being a slippery slope I'd slide further and further down as the recording days went on, but yes, I actually do like that idea!

[@castform7]

​@@MrMockRockNow that you mention it, a Pokeball tier sounds like a logistical nightmare for a list like this. What is required for a Pokeball is so miniscule compared to what is needed for a fighter with them only needing one unique move, you could put 80% of the entire Pokedex in as a candidate.

[@grunkleg.2934]

7 actually for the complete Roy G. Biv

[@LimeLoaf]

​@@grunkleg.2934don't forget the shiny so 8

[@novameowww]

maybe the first minior to pop out of the pokeball, signifying that that's the pokemon you got, would come in one of 7 different colors, and you'd get an achievement for seeing all 7

[@madnessarcade7447]

The thing about sakurai is that he goes all in on a theme he likes Like incineroar in smash goes all in on the wrestling theme If grafaiai was in smash sakurai wouldn’t go the basic route you described just being a fast hitter that does little damage He would go all in on the artist theme and have every movie be paint/graffiti related

[@MakeVarahHappen]

Every time MockRock says a Pokemon would make a good echo of a pokemon that it's half to three times the size I scream silently. Isabelle had to be her own character because she was slightly taller than Villager.

[@CyberDrewan]

I think he’s using the echo term pretty loosely, as he seems to treating pre-evos the same way pichu was treated before the echo concept in its infant stage.

[@MakeVarahHappen]

@@CyberDrewan I think he underestimates the degree to which animations have to change for an even slightly smaller fighter.

[@TheRoboKitty]

So what's up with Roy and Chrom then?

[@MakeVarahHappen]

@@TheRoboKitty They're the same size.

[@ElTaitronAnim]

@@MakeVarahHappen Isabelle "had" to be her own character because she has two completely unique specials. She's effectively a semi-echo otherwise. I think you're overestimating the degree to which animations have to change for an echo/semi-echo character, even one of different size. You don't have to re-create all the animations from scratch, you're copy-pasting and then adjusting whatever bits need to be adjusted (if you absolutely HAD to keep attack hitboxes identical, then the character can lean farther or have their limbs stretch a bit, for instance). Granted, some echoes like Chrom or Dark Samus have unique animations for a handful attacks, but that's still a small minority.

[@researchinbreeder]

Grovyle is actually one of the most popular middle forms, and for several people it's ranked ABOVE Sceptile. A big part of that is being a key player in the Pokemon Mystery Dungeon games, where he's just the absolute coolest guy around. Ash also kept his as a Grovyle for an extended period in the Gen 3 anime, so it also has anime fans. Clearly the main slot goes to Sceptile, but Grovyle as a faster but weaker Echo could be neat. It still does the leaf knife gimmick using glowing leaves that grow out when needed, and the move Leaf Blade that represents it is learned as Grovyle.

[@Aidswayz]

Heeew being in this video was one of the biggest fucking surprises of the year. I am so glad to see him and also not prioritizing content creation over his own life. But man I would be lying if I didn’t say I missed him. So fucking cool you got him though!!

[@TheRoboKitty]

>joins the video >puts Klefkey in S tier >refuses to elaborate >leaves

[@Sillintor]

Glad to be part of this BIG video with many awesome creators!

[@insomniacnerd5592]

Thought about it more and I think a cool gimmick for a Pokémon Platform Fighter is that it’s team based. Every stock is a different Pokémon. I’d think that you could switch by inputting shield and special on the ground, and each Pokémon has their own percentage. Of course, there’d be a mode where it’s more traditional with multiple stocks of the same Pokémon, but I think that the team style would give it a different flair! The more I think about it, the more I want this game.

[@insomniacnerd5592]

With this design, you can incorporate more thing like status effects. Say that they go away after a certain amount of time, or you can switch out to basically negate them with a fresh Mon. However, switching out would be telegraphed, and there is some vulnerability after a new Pokémon comes in, meaning that your opponent can capitalize if you’re too predictable for a free combo. Combine this with that one commenter’s idea of Slaking with his Truant meter. Very strong, but he can switch out when he gets stunned if you aren’t careful, but there’s a trade-off there. I like when there’s decisions and counter play to be made in fighting games, so this is just cool to me.

[@insomniacnerd5592]

Can’t stop thinking about the possibilities. This design would open up the potential for more supportive move sets. Pokémon designed to disrupt and set up hazards or statuses, then be allowed to switch to harder hitting Pokémon to capitalize. I want this game badly. It sounds fun in my mind. Probably hard to balance though.

[@captainmega6310]

That's a very inspired idea

[@TheWrathAbove]

Kinda sounds like a platform fighter take on your traditional 3v3 fighter, which tbh would be a good fit since pokemon is so focused around team comp to begin with

[@sushiroll3795]

A funny way to expand on your "upside-down form" idea for Malamar could be that, while it's in that form, it inverts the launch power of all attacks that hit it. Essentially, jabs would send it flying while smash attacks would barely push it back at all.

[@eriknelson3238]

While that would be perfect flavor, isn't that just strictly bad for Malamar?

[@sushiroll3795]

@@eriknelson3238 Yes. But it's funny.

[@illford]

​@@eriknelson3238in fairness in UMVC3 there a several moves that exist purely as punishment. Namely Ryu install which exists solely to punish mashing 😭 it is a SIGNIFICANT downgrade 9/10 times

[@knotknight514]

​@@illfordalso Wolverines "Swiss cheese" that was LITERALLY put in the game to stop players from mashing lmao

[@f9ther849]

I honestly disagree about Mimikyu: it would be interesting to implement his disguise ability into a super armour that saves you from one (or a string of) hit and after it's used it deactivates until a cooldown is over. It would also have very interesting things going on with grabs and throws like its "assistant" appearance

[@G2Quiznos025]

Not to mention its signature Z-Move from the Ultra games would translate perfectly to a Final Smash! Mind you, Mimikyu is my favorite Pokemon so I am a bit biased. He's an S+ Tier for me. 😅

[@placeadrien5566]

Check out its rivals of aether mod it's VERY good. While you're at it check out Gengar, golem, incineroar, greninja, mudkip, cofagrigus, blaziken, jirachi, and many many more

[@illford]

​@@placeadrien5566tbf Rivals gets away with weirder designs considering that game's philosophy is a lot less focussed I mean SK is just playing a shopping game in the match and Kragg just makes pillars

[@goodhelmetjunior3399]

2:07:00 Morpeko is both Electric AND Dark 100% of the time, in both forms. It’s signature Move, Aura Wheel, is what changes types.

[@itsturniptime3699]

Also in Scarlet and Violet Morpeko has an animation where it pulls a snack out of its pouch pocket and stops being hangry, so there could be a deliberate “eat snack” move to change whenever you want like Pyra and Mythra

[@roaringdino3000]

@@itsturniptime3699 how would you go back to hangry? would you make it un-eat the snack?

[@itsturniptime3699]

@@roaringdino3000 do a little animation where you let out some electricity to burn some calories

[@roaringdino3000]

@@itsturniptime3699 ooh thats interesting. is that how it normally switches in pokemon? because that seems like something they would do.

[@itsturniptime3699]

@@roaringdino3000 Morpeko just switches form every turn and SV has an animation of it pulling out a snack to revert to normal every other turn. If we wanna translate this to a Pyra Mythra mechanic it would make sense to give it both the eating animation and also a “I’m spent and now I’m hungry” animation

[@itsturniptime3699]

Referring to Conkeldurr as “Clown Ganondorf” is hilarious and weirdly accurate I’m hoping Chandelure gets a big mention since it was marked as the most popular Pokémon from the fifth generation back in 2020 by a large margin and is very popular in various games such as Pokken and Unite where Unite actually just translated its Pokken moveset into a MOBA. I also feel like Lilligant or Hisuian Lilligant should also get a mention since humanoid feminine grass Pokémon is an entire trope that spans multiple generations kind of like the early game bird and vague mammal creatures. Lilligant and Hisuian Lilligant revolve around different dances to buff them selves while Lilligant is a sort of ranged caster character with Energy Ball, Pollen Puff, Petal Dance, and Giga Drain Hisuian Lilligant is a figure skater ballerina who revolves around spin kicks, leaf blades, and raw Rushdown offence. I feel like Smash in general needs more female representation and when it comes to Pokémon I feel like we also need representatives for the humanoid shaped ones since the current roster is either animals or furries. This is also why I think Chandelure would be a great pick as the representative of Object Pokémon, another group that’s been around since the first generation and has only ever really been represented via Electrode as an assist in Smash. Escavalier is most definitely not a Beedrill clone at all, it’s a Beatle that stole Shelmet’s shell, a snail Pokémon, and is now using it as its own armour while Shelmet was forced to evolve into the bandage wrapped ninja Accelgor who is a really fast slug vigilante which I think is super interesting. I also think it’s slightly unfair how you didn’t give certain Pokémon like Rhyperior or Lickilicky a chance at all simply due to them being subjectively ugly when they have more potential than their preevolutions. Rhyperior loads stones and notably Geodude into the palms of its hands and having a sort of “pick up big rock and toss” guy like that one Rivals character (Kragg?) could be really neat. Lickilicky evolves from Lickitung after learning Rollout, so having this round ball shaped lizard bowl around the stage, jump off, and tether onto someone with their tongue for aerial kill confirms or to swing across platforms sounds really cool for a sort of wrecking ball momentum character with some grappler elements. Overall I can tell you did a lot of research into this and I think that’s super cool and I think you’re doing a good job. While there are things I and others probably disagree with it should all be in good fun and just about people discussing their favourite Pokémon and stuff!

[@MrDanishbuttercookie]

It’s gonna take a lot of bathroom trips for me to finish this one

[@RedBoi88]

In the Rivals of Aether workshop there are plenty of weird Pokemon that somehow still have coherent movesets, like Unown, Electrode, Cradily, and Minior

[@illford]

Rivals has a very different design philosophy tho. And by that I mean Workshop has no design philosophy anything goes there as long as someone thinks it

[@Air21Man]

I'm glad to see someone making this list, as too much of the speculation for Pokémon in Smash revolves around the same kinds of candidates when really interesting character designs exist all over Pokémon's massive roster. But... 34:41 Grovyle is one of the most consistently asked for Pokémon when it comes to Smash speculation due to its major role in the PMD: Explorers games. You even used Mystery Dungeon music in the video. How did you miss this? Smash has been long overdue for at least some Mystery Dungeon representation. While I'd be happy with some music or a stage, I don't see any reason to not have a fighter. There is an entire world of influences and mechanics to take from those Mystery Dungeon games to make for an interesting fighter. Heck, the Rivals Workshop features exactly such a moveset and it feels quite inspired. You should have tried many of Rivals of Aether's Workshop Pokémon for your research. There are some truly impressive designs that go above and beyond: Regigigas, Vileplume, Lampent, Cofagrigus, Electrode, Plusle&Minun, Mimikyu, Cradily, Gengar, Minior, Jirachi, Snom, and even Unown! I know you deliberately avoid talking about mods on the channel, but you could still use them as part of your research for figuring out how viable it is to make many of Pokémon's more untested designs work in Smash. Diglett and related company don't belong in the Comedy tier given that they are literally embedded in the ground, giving them "Advanced Little Mac syndrome". Too much of their design simply does not work with Smash as a concept given that they literally cannot jump. How does one portray them being launched into the air or offstage? How would they grab ledge? They'd low profile most attacks by default given their short stature and could crouch under the rest given that they burrow into the ground. There are just too many problems. You could make them work in a traditional fighting game with a traditional health bar, but even then they'd be the most unconventional fighter present. To put them in Smash would require so many concessions and changes that it simply would not work.

[@maximuscraig8222]

Just wanted to comment to provide a tiny boost-it’s clear the amount of effort and thought put into this and it deserves all the attention it can get! Great job

[@ailingstar8856]

I'm going to have to disagree on Grovyle because of one thing you haven't mentioned at the point I'm watching the video, and something I doubt you will mention: Sidegame Representation. Pokemon has had a good number of side series, with by far the most prominent being Pokemon Mystery Dungeon, and I'd argue that Grovyle is the most important character in any Pokemon Mystery Dungeon game that isn't the player or partner and, by extension, doesn't change what pokemon it is from playthrough to playthrough. In addition, not only is Dig an important enough part of Grovyle's moveset that it would be included in his moveset, he also could use some items from PMD, like Luminous Orbs or Gravelerocks to give him a much different playstyle from Sceptile. In short, to answer your question, it's me. I want the middle evolution.

[@MishKoz]

Honestly I would go crazy for _any_ of the oddball non-humanoid designs to be in Smash, or even a second Pokken game. I get that humanoid designs are probably way easier to animate but playing as a literal chandelier is PEAK video gaming.

[@Glory2Snowstar]

Agreed!!!! My favorites tend to be the strange ones, and I’d kill for a UB as weird as Xurkitree or Nihilego to be playable. They LOOK somewhat humanoid on first glance, but then that illusion completely shatters as you see their bizarre movements.

[@depressio117]

The more you think about scyther/scizor /kleavor, they are just a layered onion of “oh my god just put them in smash already”. Scizor is already in Pokken. Scizor and Scyther were both already in Unite. Scizor’s competitive viability is up there with the likes of Garchomp and Ferrothorn for most viable Pokémon ever. The bug/flying/rock/steel typings are all totally fresh and unique. Their bipedal, but with slightly different fist weapons attached to the elbows opens up a semi-swordie move pool. The wing thing you pointed out is a total non-issue, and is in fact one of the things that makes them amazing as echo fighters. Pit’s wings don’t have hurt boxes on them already. They’re a purely aesthetic model component that would radically change their silhouettes without changing their models, rigging or animations at all. Fun fact: they’re also the only Pokémon that have their stats redistributed instead of increased when they evolve. This has obvious implications for echo fighters changing their physics. Make scyther faster and with a higher jump. Make scizor the slowest but with good frame data and gap closer with bullet punch, and make kleavor the middle-weight, but with the heaviest-hitting moves with the worst frame data. Just huge upsides all around.

[@TheAwesomePal]

I must say a point for gligar and gliscor over other flyers is the fact it specifically glides which could make for a cool unique mechanic among Pokémon

[@matlotl]

Just have to say almost immediately from the get go, saying you "just" have to add/remove limbs or wings or whatever and as such "would be an easy echo fighter" is VASTLY underselling the amount of animation work that would need to redone for a lot of pokemon. In most cases, the whole character would have to be reanimated from scratch. Imagine trying to make an accurate representative Blastoise simply by reusing all of Squirtle's animations on Blastoise's model. It simply won't work. Now apply the reverse to Charmeleon or Charmander over Charizard's animations and you see the exact same problem. MASSIVE amounts of animation reworks would be necessary due to vastly different models and anatomy - adding or removing appendages means heavy reworking of tons of animations, because said appendages will be taken into account for various animation principles where those parts aren't the main focus (e.g. the wings on the follow-through of dodging animations, for instance). Unless a pokemon is nearly one for one the exact same body shape as an existing smash fighter pokemon, they would need at MINIMUM a hefty amount of reanimation, at which point they aren't really "simple echo fighters". EDIT - Noibat as an "easy echo" of Noivern perfectly encapsulates the issue at hand. I foresee wayyy too many pokemon added to the functional echo fighter tier being much, much harder to make echo fighters due to the aforementioned reasons.

[@EnharmonicYT]

30:10 “Evil little ledgetrap creature” is the best description of Piranha Plant I’ve ever heard in my life.

[@NivramAxuf]

Breloom is S Tier. Stretchy Limbs! He isn't the fastest or the bulkiest but he can get very quick long range jabs (Mach punch) basically Min Min length, and Bullet Seeds/Seed Bomb as ranged projectiles. His recovery doubling as a kill move would be Sky Uppercut. And he wields the devastating option of a close range Spore and Focus Punch. That's the main core but you could throw in Drain Punch/Leech Seed as well to give him recovery the enemy needs to fight through and simple attacks like Headbutt, low sweep.

[@quantwomwhale5984]

"Oh I'm sorry did you think this video was going to be objective?" Actual top tier content here

[@teddytackleson595]

I don’t wanna be that guy who writes an angry comment disagreeing with people’s opinions, so this isn’t gonna be angry. I think saying Escavalier is just a copy of beedrill isn’t quite right. They both have a sort of similar body shape, but that’s just because of the pointy arms and the kind of rounded body. Escavalier doesn’t have wings or multiple sets of arms, Beedrill doesn’t have plumage or armor, and they’re both not even insects cause Escavalier is a snail. Escavalier is a snail with knight armor and lance hands and bee drill is a winged bee with stinger hands, I feel like that differentiates them enough.

[@bodgmasterxionobst3r983]

He is stupid, that's why he thinks like that. Plus Escavalier is a perfect mon to be paired with Alder.

[@carterlazarus813]

Came for every Pokemon in smash and got shot in the heart by "Ultra Necrozma is the my least favorite design in the series"

[@bettyunicorn6132]

He has questionable opinions sometimes. Like we all do! 😊

[@Deadpool-ri3rq]

I WAS LOOKING FOR THIS COMMENT. I was so shocked that I paused the video and just sat in silence for a full minute. Then I said “THAT’S jumping the shark?! What about Arceus and Giratina?!”

[@madnessarcade7447]

@@Deadpool-ri3rqdude is clearly uneducated in Pokémon lore The lore is awesome

[@madnessarcade7447]

True

[@AceAviations2]

Considering that the Ultra Necrozma fight in the Ultra games is irredeemable trash and one of the most poorly designed bosses I've ever fought (I've fought the Bed of Chaos and Malenia BTW), I feel the same way. It doesn't matter how good the design is, that fight is so insufferable that it completely ruins the Mon.

[@kip258]

I came here for Mudkip in the thumbnail. Don't forget that if Grovyle ever appeared in Smash, the PMD community would lose their collective MINDS.

[@FierceGalactaKnight]

Man, I would have loved to see this on premier day, sad I only found this so late. I'm glad my first pick for any Pokemon to be in Smash was also the first S tier choice. I think Hoopa-U has so many options with long range jabs, teleportation, etc. that it is one of the most legitimately interesting options for a Smash Candidate. If I could suggest a few moves I think would be good for its moveset: First, I think its recovery could be Hyperspace Hole, where Hoopa teleports some distance, in one of 8 directions like most other teleports, except when Hoopa reappears instead of just popping into existence it appears from the ground up. However, when it teleports it has a grab hitbox where Hoopa will grab the feet of whomever it appears under and willd drag them back through the portal, and throw them downwards as a powerful spike. If the move whiffs, Hoopa will teleport through and go into freefall. If it connects, Hoopa will not teleport, but will be able to act again and go for another recovery. Use it offstage to spike enemies OFF STAGAE that are trying to two-frame your recovery, without being forced into freefall and being able to try to recover again. Use it onstage to spike opponents below you, and still allow you to be in a position to possibly follow up on it. Also, while not *exactly* canon, its down special could be some variation of using the Rings and teleportation which it does use in canon. It could be called Tyrannical Hole (lol) or Shadow Impact, named after attacks from the TCG. To start, press down B and then point in one of four directions, Hoopa will create a ring that will float in the air around where the move was pressed, facing *opposite* the direction inputed by the player (Imagine like the launch star item that always points *away* from the direction it was thrown, so the ring would point downward if Hoopa inputs the attack upward.) The ring will remain floating in the air as a trap for about 20-30 seconds, and Hoopa will become actionable again to do whatever it wants. When down B is pressed again, Hoopa will use a new ring to jump through and reappear through the old trap portal, tackling the opponent from potentially across the stage. If the trap ring is facing upwards, Hoopa will slash with its horns in a fierce headbutt. If the trap ring is facing left or right, Hoopa will do a powerful shoulder check. If the ring is facing downwards, Hoopa will jump feet first through the portal and perform a devastating stomp, before comedically swinging its legs as it struggles to pull itself back up through the portal again. Essentially, this allows Hoopa to control space by creating trap rings that it can then activate to create powerful, armored hitboxes which it can activate at any time from anywhere, so long as its within that 30 second spawn window. Need to extend a combo? Throw them towards the trap ring then let it rip. Need to create pressure off stage? Use a trap ring to create a massive hitbox that will easily take a stock if they recover to close to it. Need to control space? Your opponent won't want to land anywhere near a trap ring if they're going to be shoulder checked by a six-armed-demon genie. And, to top it all off, the downward stomp is, of course, another spike, so it can just steal stocks from opponents who are forced to recover low. Of course, balancing would need to be taken into consideration, but my philosophy is make it good enough to be viable first, then worry about reeling it back later. I've put a lot of thought about how Hoopa Unbound could work in Smash and considering this video is all about obscure Pokemon in Smash, I thought it was a great place to talk about some ideas that I've been holding onto. Thanks for the video, on my second listen now :)

[@morphstarchangeling8024]

One thing to remember is normal type pokemon have a crazy amount of coverage moves. So pretty much any normal type can have their moveset filled up by adding a couple elenental moves. Like Tauros gets fire blast and blizzard as examples.

[@haydenlee3293]

Honestly really impressed by just the title cards for each pokemon. Having the types change on the different colors seems like it would be difficult

[@Detrifus]

Sceptile is also said to grow trees and other plants, which could be incorporated into a moveset along with a representation of Overgrow. And the seeds on its back would be perfect for a bombadier move or two with Seed Bomb.

[@TheDisplacerBeast]

I could see blastoise as an echo of bowser. Use the water jets as a longer range lower damage fire breath.

[@BigYellowSilly]

Finally got the chance to sit down and watch this, ty for having me and it's nice to see Beedrill in the big leagues (:

[@Aidswayz]

After seeing this is the same runtime as Oppenheimer, and that the title says PART 1… I genuinely hope you’re okay after this fucking beast of an editing process

[@stormRed]

I love how Odyssey Central's was basically just "Dry Bones for smash"

[@Failsafe-Gaming]

Same

[@MasterAbeer101]

The commitment for doing this is absolutely insane. Huge respects from me and Happy Holidays MockRock!

[@RednekGamurz]

>"Who would want the middle evolution?" when placing Grovyle on the tierlist. Does he know?

[@mbot1901]

First of all I want to say that this video is seriously amazing and it's crazy how much effort must have went into putting this all together and editing so props for that! Second of all the guest segments were really cool to see, I loved hearing what they had to say and it was very enjoyable overall! Third of all, I feel like some of the pokemon wrote off in this video actually have some really cool potential movesets, obviously that's just going to happen that's just the nature of a video like this, but some interesting ones (and minor nitpicks) I wanted to point out were: For Slaking, this is just a fun concept I thought up, make Slaking a decently fast powerful heavy with great ground moves that's a bit lacking in the air, but give it an energy meter. The meter starts full and quickly depletes while moving, but standing still, walking, crouching, and shielding would build the meter, and if the meter is empty, slaking falls asleep or goes into a forced loafing around animation for a few seconds, after which the meter would refill (B tier for me, it would overlap with DK a lot I fear) Grovyle as an echo (a lot of people like it especially because of mystery dungeon, I think it's pretty alright but it does fit the role pretty well) Pheromosa, as it's actually one of the both fastest and strongest pokemon ever with a surprisingly in depth movepool of both physical and special moves so really you could make it a strong, tall, frail attacker that has a lot of good options with it's biggest weakness being weight (This is like a C tier pick for me) Electrode, because a moveset around rolling around and blowing yourself up could be pretty cool Galarian Darmanitan, because contrary to popular believe the snowman form is actually faster and more agile than the monkey form, plus the idea of a mainly ice user turning into an explosively powerful fire user is really cool to me (solid C tier) Kartana I feel should actually be probably D if not F tier considering its really really small and wouldn't really work for smash even though I would not complain if it got in, this is just personal opinion Pawmot slander is unacceptable I'm sorry it just had to be said (aside from personal bias it has a really interesting defibrillator theme going on and it could be a middling speed allrounder with a command grab that damages enemies and heals allies drawing from that revival blessing inspiration, solid B tier for me) Primarina, because not only does it have cool animations like you mentioned but sparkling aria apart from healing burns is actually a sound based move that is an explosive bubble conjured from a Primarina's singing, which could make it into a really cool set play zoner, able to make a big floating water bubble that explodes if enemies touch it, but primarina could hit it around the screen with its normals like a seal would a beach ball, and maybe even bounce off of it with the up b, this feels like an S tier to me Muk, I actually could see kinda working weirdly, especially the alolan form (I also used it in my gen 7 playthrough), where it would jump into the air as a big blob kind of like Venom in marvel vs capcom, and it could have a moveset around forming its goop into various attacks like fists, hammers, tendrils, etc, with the goal of pulling opponents in and grabbing them with its abnormally powerful grabs. It would be slow and have a bad recovery but would be really strong if it gets close to you, and have a variety of ranged moves designed to pull you into grabbing range (Low B tier) Chi-yu is funny, its a funny fish but its also a special attacking bomb that is made of lava and would just cover the screen with huge fire blasts and I can kind of imagine what it would like in smash if you allow it to float above the ground a bit or swim through the ground which it can do in canon, has some potential for sure, but yeah C tier is appropriate Emolga actually has some cool stuff pikachu doesn't, mainly it can glide cus its a flying squirrel which lends itself to some cool move ideas and a really darn good rivals of aether mod (D tier) Dudunsparce is avant-garde. No further commentary. (F tier) Having Hydreigon crawl around is a bit farfetched to me considering it has the ability levitate and its legs are literally vestigial organs, but I think you could do some hurtbox shenanigans to make it so that its hurbox still touches the ground no matter what (same goes for any levitating pokemon imo), plus the tail hangs pretty low in its idle stance so really I don't see much of an issue with that, and personally I think it's a great pick, definitely agree with you on this one Coffagreigus is also known to crawl on all four of its hands while running so again this is a big agree, works pretty well in my book Call me crazy but I kinda like Bisharp as its own thing more, it fits smash conventions better, has room for a more interesting moveset in my opinion, and doesn't have to scoot around like a chess piece (Kingambit does this ingame instead of walking and it looks really goofy imo), I think it really could be its own character As a final kind of issue of mine, I feel like your reliance on having groups of pokemon together feels kind of limiting because for one, it's not really a thing in smash, greninja and incineroar are totally fine as solitary starters, and pokemon like zapdos, tapu-koko, lugia, etc are perfectly fine being depicted as solidary characters in extended media, not to mention the fact that smash itself isn't a stranger to leaving characters like Sonic and Aegis alone without their iconic accompanying characters, so I know this is your list but in my personal opinion unless it's absolutely necessary or helps the chances of a pokemon from the group, each pokemon should be treated as an individual character because it just gives them more room to breathe, although I respect the thought behind it (like the Articuno-G idea is so good and shouldn't be ruled out because of the other two) Still this video is genuinely amazing, thank you so much for making this video it's seriously great, and I'm looking forward to part 2!

[@jonathanlgill]

Yeah, I agree that the amount of "trios" or sets of Pokemon being considered in the rankings is way too much for a series that almost never operates that way. An idea for an Eevee trainer having different Eeveelutions use different moves is great. Or I don't think it's outlandish to propose a Cynthia trio of Pokemon. But stuff like the Galarian bird trio, the tapus, the legendary beasts needing to be tied together? That sounds cumbersome and overdesigned.

[@madnessarcade7447]

“Legends arceus didn’t get enough recognition” What are you on about Not only did it sell well it was the first and only entry in the mainline series to be nominated at the game awards It didn’t win but it was still nominated

[@Eclipseon197]

Absol and Umbreon, two of my favorites, back to back was such a treat to end this video. So much great potential here for fun characters. Amazing video.

[@Nickdean2004]

This why we all love MockRock, shows commitment and has amazing delivery. Respect for MockRock working is butt off to make this project a real thing and amazing to watch.

[@robhousehold]

The Duskull line as a species thank you and we are honored to be in the echofighter catagory. You have the respect of our species

[@gengarisnotinsmash...]

Gengar better be ranked number 1 or I'll steal your socks. Edit: well, I can't blame MDBC for not anticipating your decision to make an S+ tier, so your socks are safe for now. But seriously, why is gengar not already a smash fighter? The concept is obvious, he's a glass cannon with lots of tricks, and if you want to bring in his pokedex entries you can also make him incredibly difficult to escape from as well (likely through the use of teleports that bring you near the opponent). He could also have the best crouch/tbag animation of all time: just have him sink halfway into the floor. He's a ghost, he can do that. Edit 2: also want to get this out, from what I understand gen 5 was meant to be a "soft reboot" of gen 1 (source: False Swipe Gaming's video on Gigalith) and as such many of the new pokemon were new takes on existing gen 1 mons. Which is why there is so much overlap, it's intentional. Edit 3: imagine Dracovish gets into smash and gets fishious rend, a move that straight up ohko's if it's the first attack landed in the match. That would be hilarious.

[@thoughtprism2963]

Shoutouts to Big Yellow and Beedrill's exclusive tier.

[@silikerYT]

34:41 grovyle could pull from pokemon mystery dungeon and imo would be infinitely cooler than anything you could do with sceptile on top of a quick grass moves, you've got all the various items from mystery dungeon, stun seeds, blast seeds, the various orbs, you could probably do something with the time gears for a final smash, etc.

[@zackswitch9656]

Thats true, but Sceptile is still cooler

[@Deadpool-ri3rq]

The further I got into this video the more clear it became that MockRock is not a Pokémon fan. The final straw was at 2:04:50 when he was STILL surprised by Emolga being a Pikachu clone when any Pokémon fan knows there’s one in every generation. I love MockRock videos but this one was just hard to sit through as a Pokémon fan.

[@omegahaxors9-11]

Scolipede is more of a lover than a fighter. I will not elaborate.

[@knotknight514]

this guy gets it

[@vossboss220]

30:18 as a pokemon mystery dungeon fan who wants grovyle as a rep for the series i say HOW DARE YOU

[@castform7]

I always liked the Pokemon in Smash. I was never mad that there were so many because Pokemon are such different creatures (most of the time) I could randomly generate 2 fully evolved Pokemon and not only would there be good chance of them having feasible ideas for a fighter but also feel very unique from each other and the roster. I used to really like thinking up some ideas for Pokemon that chould've gotten a shot if it weren't for popular priority. I definitely agree with a lot of the A and S tiers being great candidates with some having cool ideas that I never would've thought of like Conkeldurr, Vespiquen, Meloetta, Diancie and the Megas. Hell even some B tiers have fun gimmicks like Ambipom, Azumarill and Mr. Mime. The other KZbinrs suggesting Pokemon was interesting as well whether they be inventive ideas or mostly for the funny. Awesome video and I can't for part 2.

[@TheBlueWizzrobe]

This video is epic. I love the commitment so much, covering everything from the worst of the worst to the best of the best. It also lets you cover some really oddball picks like Tinkaton, which you would never consider as an option for a Smash fighter off of the top of your head, but ends up working _shockingly_ well when you sit down and think about it. This video legit made me really want Tinkaton in Smash even though it was not at all on my radar previously. Looking forward to part 2!

[@asg0r0]

0:09 "or a pseudo-legendary" disregarding the fact that there are NO psesudo-legendaries in the roster (no, Lucario is not one)

[@cjlite0210]

27:02 Either Tinkaton or Sena, we need a Little Girl Big Hammer trope character in whatever next Smash game releases

[@snobjorn1232]

Some of these should be BOSSES, like Rayquaza in brawl

[@wollins7244]

1:50:54 ok one thing I will say is that you can evolve Crabrawler really early because the elevator where you go up the mountain counts as the mountain so you can just give it a rare candy in that area and it evolves. Hopes this helps even one person in their gen 7 playthrough :)

[@madnessarcade7447]

They aren’t rehashes they are unique takes on the same species Do you know how many species of butterfly exist irl? I don’t see u calling cat Pokémon rehashes

[@Croove55]

I feel like dudunsparce earned comedy tier. "What is the evolution that's been held back for 7 generations? Drumroll please ... Dudun!!!"

[@SaucyRamenBoy]

The crossover we didnt know we needed

[@DesignDoc]

Thanks so much for having us on here!

[@kookeekwisp]

Your description for Odor sleuth sounds more like pursuit than anything

[@paulnewton2284]

I'd say for the "echo Pokémon Trainer" concept that Charmander, Wartortle, and Venusaur would probably be the most logical trio in terms of being Echo Fighters, which would free up Blastoise quite nicely as a standalone fighter. Plus, Blastoise was in Pokken, where it was a heavyweight zoner with a stance change mechanic, with many of its moves allowing it to withdraw into its shell.

[@Nikowo1610]

I absolutely disagree with it, but I have to admire how brave you are to say you'd remove ultra necrozma from the franchise, that's bold to just pull out in a youtube video

[@LeaderOfDaGanonGang]

1:59:14 ODDYSEY CENTRAL AND MOCKROCK WHAT IS THIS CHRISTMAS?!

[@RiDEL_Castro]

Didn't need to do Swoobat that dirty :(

[@Kamodomon]

The Hisuian Pokemon Trainer idea sounds rad AF! I'm so on board with that.

[@michaeladames4932]

I actually have a theoretical moveset for wobbafett saved in a google doc I made years ago. The smash attacks being how they use their counter attacks. I would love to share, expand on and discuss it as well as hitmontop. Love the beyblade dancer!

[@cjlite0210]

2:17:57 I feel like a way to make Urshifu work is introduce a Fusion Strike Style Urshifu for Smash, similarly to the Fusion Strike Pokemon in the TCG, and this would allow Urshifu to use both strong singular blows and fast endless combos

[@CyberDrewan]

I feel like you could also use this as excuse to include Mustard as a trainer and just have him switch between the two Urshifus. He canonically has only one Urshifu, but it’s always the one opposite of the one you picked, so he could have either. Also, would anyone really have an issue with the strongest trainer in Galar having two Urahifus?

[@TheCaptainBlackimar]

Hearing him call Conkeldurr “Clown Ganondorf” is mad hilarious 😂😂😂

[@nathan8829]

I appreciate the commitment to only attacking Wobbuffet lmao. The only Pokemon harmed in the making of this video were the ones who consider it enrichment.

[@sunfishythesunfish1509]

Chatot is depicted as grounded fairly often (enough such that it walking and running doesn’t seem too odd), and due to its sound-based theming, it could maybe have soundwave-based Smash Attacks. The fact that it learns some wacky attacks like Twister and Heat Wave (somehow) also help it. I still don’t know if its entire moveset could just be constructed around those, and it would probably have a few dinky attacks, but I feel as though it could maybe possibly work. (Plus, it’s my favorite Pokémon, so I would personally love to see it)

[@josebuendiamartinez9944]

Hear me out. If some weather Pokemon can work, is probably Tyrannitar. Is body can still work for "Godzillesque" moveset, and the sandstorm could rather be more of Mario's Fludd but making small damage, at the cost of reducing the launch power and just working as a tool to keep distance at best. Add some rock moves like Stone Edge, some Dark moves and maybe Hyperbeam as a Smash attack...

[@rells2311]

Damn, two 2 hour videos in one day, you and schaff. Got a lot of binging to do. Also, height is a factor in echo fighter making, not clones in general obviously, but Isabelle was confirmed to be too tall for a villager echo, which is why she holds a wholly different slot, I've only seen up to charmeleon thus far, but same thing applies to any future cases.

[@christianwalters2226]

Hearing Conkeldurr being described as 'Clown Ganondorf' is the highlight of my day 😂

[@GinoDevs]

As another point towards Cofragigus, might I suggest that his running animation be the one from PokePark 2 If you've seen it, you can't unsee it

[@meadnex331]

surprised big yellow didnt talk about pincer

[@TheGrizzlo503]

Surprised there was no mention of the Regigas mod for Rivals of Aether. It works incredibly well

[@MrMockRock]

I intentionally didn't mention Rivals of Aether outside of _very_ specific circumstances because the Rivals Workshop is a totally different ballgame than Smash Ultimate, it gets a lot of design space to play with that would be too out there for Smash

[@saitinclock238]

He's so cool I love him

[@Tzerez]

I did not expect Odyssey Central to show up but god dammit I am excited

[@Wolfiyeethegranddukecerberus17]

Ultra Necrozma should totally go in a higher tier, it's a being of pure light. It could use the base Necrozma form as a shell that it could break out of after it grabs enough light orbs from the opponent (light orbs dropping whenever an opponent is hit). Also Ultra Necrozma is one of the coolest Pokemon designs. Edit: Ain't no way he just put U Necrozma in the trash tier but not Ambipom 💀

[@itsturniptime3699]

It’s a subjective thing, Ultra Necrozma looks very otherworldly and doesn’t appeal to everyone and that’s fine. Besides I feel like it should be stuck as a Final Smash with Light That Burns the Sky

[@castform7]

I think Necrozma bit itself would be a pretty cool fighter with an awesome final Smash in U Necrozma using LTBTS. Speaking of which, while I find it majestic and loved its boss battle in USUM I get the idea of it being a bit of a jumping the shark moment as in some ways with how....much it is. It's kinda the same mindet I have with Black and White Kyurem.

[@Magma-Idiot-2001]

Ultra Necrozma is more Boss/Final Smash Tier than an actual playable character. I'd work Necrozma as a fighter who Final Smash turns it into is parasitic forms (With mostly new play styles).

[@whatdoievenputhere11]

Ultra Necrozma is a love hate thing. I think Mock is on the older side so he prefers things that actually look like… Pokémon.

[@captainmega6310]

​@@whatdoievenputhere11 If that's the case, then I think he has a very limited definition of what a pokemon is

[@curtdog647]

Three hours of the best smash creator on the platform. Merry Christmas y'all.

[@CookieGal-]

There are over 1000 Pokémon. This is insane

[@Pokemonika_]

2:04:52 local man finds out about Pikachu clones for the first time

[@MrMockRock]

Not for the first time, but this _is_ the first time I've ever lined them all up like that lol

[@kirbyx2573]

Jesus almost a 3 hours video?! Its gonna be really interesting to see how some Pokemon will fair. Especialy excited for some of my favorite Pokemon like Kyurem haha! Also happy holidays! Wish you all a merry christmas!

[@ItsAMiiAMario]

I really like the idea of Hawlucha being in idea for some reason

[@firstwaddledee9182]

On the subject of Unown, there is actually this super interesting Rivals of Aether mod using it. I still agree that it’s one of the weakest choices but I just wanted people to check it out.

[@jmpiper11]

I will say, electrode is a character in rivals workshop and it's a super fun character. I think it would actually work really well

[@meta4knight]

I just like knowing your opinions on different Pokemon, especially when they are wrong ❤

[@GameJack26]

odyessey basically said dry bones for smash, what a legend