World War 2, Tucker Carlson, and a Right-Wing Critique of Daryl Cooper

[@torrasque0151]

None of the speakers are to the right of Daryl Cooper.

[@Stashley78]

Good thing or bad thing?

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

Total false advertising in the video title.

[@manofculture584]

Ah yes you must be far right to be correct

[@DukeBluedevil70]

Is it illegal to be actually right wing on this podcast? I’d love to hear an actual rebuttal to Daryl that isn’t just regime talking points and snide insinuations.

[@tuckerbugeater]

You mean the rightwingers that supported illegal wars, didn't stop abortion and mass migrations? Lol. Yeah, rightwing.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Yeah, "Boomercons' Perspective on Darryl Cooper" is a better title.

[@ianwalter62]

Well, I'd suggest you listen to Professor Ferguson, and Dr Roberts detailed factual rebuttals of every intellectually dishonest claim Copper made. You do realise that he was just repeating Nazi propaganda from 1940, don't you?

[@crtune]

There are already several decent responses on video. No, there was not a situation where Barbarossa captured so many prisoners the camp system could not cope. Provably false. No Hitler was not seeking bona fide peace effort with Britain (he was engaged in planning their invasion, while also working on weapons programs sufficient in support of that and similar efforts). No Churchill, despite actual flaws, was not worse than Hitler. Same with Mussolini or Imperial Japan. Cooper is not from the Right. He's from getting it factually WRONG. Perhaps today fewer and fewer people actually read large numbers of war history books.

[@pepepapy620]

Thought-provoking episode? Those guests speak like any centrist boomer I Know.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Yeah, this was disappointing.

[@brandur8485]

I don't have a horse in the race, but I had listened to the original Daryl Cooper interview. When these guests started making accusations, they didn't ring true because I couldn't remember Cooper saying any of things they claimed he did. So I went back and listened to the source material *again*. Sure enough, he didn't say any of the things these guests impugned, certainly never got within 100 miles of Holocaust denial, and nothing about "arrested in Austria for that" (both claims made by male guest). Seeing this level of intellectual dishonesty is par for the course on the internet, but ironic on this self-serious, "thought-provoking" podcast.

[@manofculture584]

He absolutely insinuated that it's illegal to ask questions and also that after ww2 it became illegal to be right wing. He was borderline on the "Akshually we should have left Hitler to take over Europe "

[@manofculture584]

He also passed one of the atrocities as a mere logistical error and not as a premeditated extermination exercise

[@AgentBitcoin]

It’s not worth listening to uncharitable and dishonest commentary about a podcast anyone can listen to themselves and come to their own conclusions on. These people are doing a disservice to your audience. No one needs their permission to consider different historical points of view.

[@Stashley78]

Female guest made very helpful points in her Valley Girl accent. Male guest talked a lot but didn't say much.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

42:45 Still no explanation of why mere noticing & naming is a moral crime, whether done accurately or not.

[@manofculture584]

Because the "nOtIcInG" is based on pre conceived bias and confirmation bias

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

7:45 In with the Strawman - ruining the already winding down to greater local independence British Empire to side with already proven mass killing communist criminals against humanity, rather than let said criminals & the Hitler regime exhaust themselves against each other, whilst you do actually provide humanitarian policing & resources instead, isn't making the simple argument that going to war with Hitler is wrong, it's making a different one entirely.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

& it continues...13:00 in with the 'it feels like', real strong argument there.

[@fiatnomo2874]

“They were not engaged in holocaust denial, but they wanted to make people think they were engaged in holocaust denial.” Wtf is Steve talking about? That’s so stupid I lost brain cells.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

He means he thinks they wanted him to think that.

[@fiatnomo2874]

@@MeanBeanComedy Just because you say it does not make it true. You cannot decide what someone meant to say. That would be deceptive and arguing in bad faith. But that’s exactly what Steve is doing. Don’t fall for it.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

Surely the correct guest to have on for a critique on this topic would be David Cole?

[@chrisyoung2179]

This was great, but your male guest only straw-manned

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

She did too...

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Then it wasn't great!

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

Is it a genuine failure here to understand that the beef with Churchill from the Right is that his terrible actions lost his country so much rather than gaining it anything, more than a critique of the actions themselves, or is it disingenuous?

[@nacetroy]

The male guest (up to the point in the podcast I've listened) is insinuating things that Darryl never said nor could they be rationally understood that way. It seems clear that he has a cartoon-ish version of the new right (not at all helped by the many anti-Semitic trolls who follow any podcast where these questions or ideas come up - so, one has to wonder how authentic these bots, ahem, I mean real, living trolls are). Cooper never was even close to suggesting tiny mustache man was "good" or "peace-loving" - that's coming from "Steve's" imagination. However, pressing some of these issues, does unravel or abrade the larger mythos. Why did Britain try to put down Germany before/during the First World War and what strategic plays did Britain orchestrate to create an outcome that mitigated two of Britain's largest rivals? Who (including the US) funded the Bolsheviks? Who funded both Stalin and tiny mustache man? Many of the war-mongering left, "somewhat red-pilled left" and the war mongering right all mischaracterized Cooper's statements after the Tucker show aired. Who gave Cooper a platform to clarify his positions? It was the anti-war Libertarians: Scott Horton and two Mises Caucus guys, Tom Woods and Dave Smith. Most people who IMO are getting Cooper wrong are the same people who are quick to support a war from either the left or the right.

[@towardstar]

The tremendous thing Ive learned listening to Daryl coming from more offbeat corners myself is to always put yourself in the shoes of others when you are talking about history. Watching someone whose primary lesson to me has been to remember compassion, be dragged through the mud and pinned with all sorts of accusations by so many people has been eye opening. I'm finding out here he's a post moral Nietzschean eugenicist on top of everything.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Are you calling him "Steve" because you also instantly recognised his voice? 😆

[@nacetroy]

@@MeanBeanComedy No, I have no idea who he is and I don't recognize the voice as anyone familiar, but since he was anon as an image, I presume "Steve" is not his real name. Who do you think he is?

[@towardstar]

@@nacetroy You really think that will help people with a hardened heart? I would hope it does. IME they usually just call you gay if you try to show them a different way.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

38:00 The actual argument was less about the loss of the British Empire & more about the secondary effect of my Nation being a minority in our once great capital city, (with our children set to be a minority in the English schooling system within 10years, our Nation a minority in our homeland within a mere few decades & all Britons in the Isles some short years after that).

[@Maryland_Kulak]

Your little “expert” can’t even pronounce Mises.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Okay, "STEVE"... Pretty obvious who that is. I won't say it, but he's not a Protestant. That's the only hint I'll give. Terrible discussion filled with straw men and assumptions that weren't said during the intitial interview. Disappointed in all parties involved.

[@chettywapfilms1783]

All these people think they’re being so intellectual when the entire episode here proves the exact point Daryl and Tucker were making lol

[@lukecroft5676]

It would have probably been more insightful if you talked about why this is happening instead of just condemning it. Why people who are right-wing, especially younger people are questioning WW2 mythology. Could it be the current socio-political order rests upon WW2 and the Holocaust and any meaningful attempt to implement RW politics is seen as tantamount to Nazism. It should really be no surprise why younger right-wingers would seek to deconstruct that paradigm and not reify it.

[@manofculture584]

Imagine calling takes like "we should have let Hitler had his way" a serious "questioning of history"

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

​@@manofculture584 who said that exactly?

[@austinhuisinga741]

These anons aren't even trying to understand the point Daryl was trying to make. Pure straw mans. Just not a great episode

[@firebornliger]

Well, you've done a service in providing two people who's opinions aren't worth listening to.

[@ndwilliams6630]

2 mi uses in and I can tell this I hyperframatic garbage.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

Credit where it's due, all the suggestions of topics to amplify at the end are worthwhile projects.

[@teakaymania]

Hannah was awesome. I want to hear/recommend more things involving her. I know "anonymous", but YT, X, etc. profiles don't need to be personally-identifiable. Links, terms to search are welcome. Thx

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

23:55 The UK was not an imperilled active war zone but Churchill would clearly have done the moral equivalent of most of what the Nazi war regime did, (with some different targets & motives sure), had it been an equivalent position, as well as deploying mass chemical warfare on top, there was simply no need though.

[@davidkey4272]

Is it weird that when I see a Wikipedia “warning” it’s almost certainly the most informative thing about the video without even watching it

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

19:11-19:17 What more do you need to know

[@crtune]

It's not about right or left, it's about factually right or wrong. I'm just a reasonably well read history buff and I was yelling at the Cooper stuff. It was just spewing wrong stuff over and over and is simply bad historian work. I don't care what motivated it. I treat history like any pro service - it comes back right (i.e. corresponds most closely to what can be established and supported) or I'm going to get another professional on it. All this stuff about who this stuff supports, or their merit as ally is superfluous (believe me I can see merit, but that has nothing to do with maintaining and recounting history) and ought to be abjured as reasoning. I also can see why these motivations may be said to be behind this stuff - they want to break stuff and get attention, say. Still this does not constitute historian work. One normal sign of quality is CITE YOUR SOURCES. Allows responses and furtherance of the history record.

[@TK-en2hq]

Interesting containment, but containment none the less.

[@bobfall]

Fine. You love the SS. We know who you would been in 1942.

[@GodsOwnPrototype]

1:07:20 What does 'for being Jews' constitute when it draws criticism, ire & attacks from the people in whose countries they reside?

[@xLeeroycranex]

I have no problem with seeing less reported aspects of WWII or making it less black-and-white.....but my problem with guys like MartyrMade, who attempt to re-visit these things, is that they view it through this prism that is no different than Project 1619 types. It's far too reductive and has a predisposition towards a predetermined narrative with "facts" and "quotes" backing it up, almost like some edgy college essay. It's nihilistic, at its core and adopts the same power principals of oppressor-oppressed and victimhood as the left. "Oh, grrr, demonizing Saddam led us to the Iraq War. Nevermind the Gulf War when Congress voted yes and UN said okay. It was all about the Petro dollar and Bankers and Zionism (Jews)! That's 100% why we invaded! Grrrr, I'm simply mad because I have psychological turmoil due to being from the working class and getting screwed over by Big Government. This is why it's all THEIR fault and I want to see them fail at EVERYTHING. And if they're doing it NOW, they must've done it back then, too!" Btw, following Cooper for years now and listening to interviews of his life, I'm just rephrasing tweets and quotes he's made. It's straight up paranoia and spitefulness in this borderline personality kind of way......which leftists often utilize, too. And then, like the leftists, they begin to retroactively apply this lens further and further back until, suddenly, you're back to 1775 and saying, "America has been EVIL since it's inception!" You're seeing this rhetoric from a lot of these guys now, where they claim America is evil and has failed it's original goal ever since Day 1 or Year 1861 or 1910....or 1939....or whatever. This is as opposed to recognizing the reality which is, as Thomas Sowell put it, that there are no solutions, only trade offs. By that, instead of trying to mitigate society so that the trades off help them, they simply take a zero sum approach which never works and only leads to extreme measures that few can meet. And as such, that is how Communism or Nazism is born. It isn't out of pure intent.

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

What does the first Iraq invasion being approved by the UN have to do with the second invasion? Iraq had invaded another country, and it was a response to that. That doesn't offer legitimacy to the second one.

[@nacetroy]

Your comment reads like some edgy college essay. I don't believe you've every followed Cooper and you're making claims that are far from reality.

[@martinjohnson5498]

I thought Steve snd Hannah’s take on the Carlson/Cooper interview was quite good, and i read some of the comments here and I wonder what planet they are on.

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

Did you, by chance, watch the Tucker interview of Cooper?

[@yanatzvetkova1761]

Great talk - keep em coming

[@ianwalter62]

The aggressive, negative comments in this thread are a sad indictment of the US education system.

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

Lmao, please. As if the standard understanding of WW2 isn't sufficiently pounded into everyone's heads from every angle of society.

[@manofculture584]

The comments here are so eager for more nazi apologism and revisionism it's hilarious 😂

[@LS-xs7sg]

If you want an excuse to be race realists again and for white peoples to act in their own interest you don’t need to deny the holocaust but rather point out that genocide is commonly a consequence of different ethnicities sharing the same state

[@manofculture584]

23:52: and also at the same time claim "there were no death camps"

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

Please share exactly where it was claimed that there were no death camps. You've used quotes.

[@ryeisenman]

Good point: at 50:00, the theory that only the anglo Europeans have moral agency. Everyone on the european continent being driven, deterministically, by childhood trauma, historical grievances. Yet, there is a grain of truth there; europe being relatively more a warring madhouse than UK. Partly its geography (UK island) and history (UK age of civil war ended centuries earlier). Perhaps steelmanning Cooper: there is some truth that the Allies desired WW2 to be centered on Eastern Europe: strategically there's a benefit to the more liberal democracies centered on UK and USA, that the Fascists and the communists are locked in a death struggle centered on eastern europe. I would argue against Cooper that this was a bad strategy or that there were any clearly better strategies. But, given the horror of eastern europe in WW2, its understandable Cooper would grope for some alternative. Churchill was basically the main allied strategist, if there was any better alternative, sure he could be blamed for not taking it. By the way, I think Ghandi voiced the opinion in WW2 that the Nazis should not be militarily opposed.

[@chrisyoung2179]

Hannah was great, what’s her twitter @?

[@torrasque0151]

n/a