Moondrop x Crinacle Dusk Review Canceled

[@D.E.E.P.Y.]

Yeah Sir, agreed. It's not like we don't have gazillion IEMs on the market.

[@jimfarrell4635]

A cable? A CABLE?? Good lord, what next? As Peter Venckman famously said, Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... MASS HYSTERIA!

[@Lead_Foot]

I really like how the dusk sounds but I don't think I'll buy one after my dark saber's 2 pin connector broke out of the shell the first time I tried removing the cable.

[@Hijynx87]

That’s pretty bad lol. Out of my 30 some iems I’ve only had 2 qc issues. Penon 10th anniversary had a buzzing in the left iem with certain low end vocal frequencies and my em6l nozzle sleeve came off before I got to listen to it (I just glued the thing back on and it has served me well since launch day). The penon took almost 2 months before I got a new unit in my hands, because for some reason it took a tour across mainland China and then to its destination in Hong Kong lol. USPS f’d that up. Never had a connector break on me though, that’s pretty bad.

[@proffessasvids]

I'm interested in the nova too. I love the idea of an automatically phase coherent single dynamic driver but I've always wanted to try a hybrid. Interested to see if they can actually sound fully coherent... knowing that the onboard crossovers are so basic and other drivers in the set are left open at the top end in most cases.. meaning there is overlap between the BA's in the upper region. I'm wondering if these sound congested, smeared or blurred at the top. I know proper speaker firms spend a long time tweaking their drivers to behave together in the crossover region.. especially if there is a large amount of overlap. Xx

[@NotAyFox]

When you put it that way, this QC issue is more than a little bit concerning. In the "The Headphone Show"' review the L/R discrepancy is mentioned in a way that makes it seem like this kind of thing is fine and it never occurred to me that it might actually not be, until you pointed it out with a visual aid. I'm not going to cancel my Dusk order, because I have Blessing 2 Dusk which I like a lot and according to reviews Dusk is an evolution of that, but if I notice this problem on my set, that will be very regretful.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Sadly, a lot of reviewers are either scared to make a big point about something because they want the companies to keep sending them products or, what recently happened with Erin at Erin's Audio Corner, where Eric from Tekton is threatening to sue him. Luckily I've got Daddy's deep pockets to help me with any legal funds.

[@blorg8206]

Headphone Show got that channel imbalance but they are also measuring on a 5128 with an artificial pinna, which is very difficult to get consistent measurements on. Measurements on Squig from people with 711 couplers don't show anywhere near this level of imbalance. Super Review's one is well under 1dB up to over 5kHz for example. Most of the other squigs don't have anywhere near this level of channel imbalance either. It could be QC, could be their measurements.

[@scientificaudiophile]

@@blorg8206Could be, but they mentioned the discrepancy to Moondrop who said it was within their range of variance.

[@aceofspades6667]

I was with you right up until the $300 cable part but cancelling dusk for issues .

[@Cassus123456]

I have one big and one small ear canal - i have to add or lower 3-4 db anyways. always. how is that a problem? There's a balance function in every smartphone. Also our brain is easily cabable of smooting about 2 db. 3-4 might be a bit too much though as I experience with my ears Just listen to the dusks for an hour or so and the inbalance will vanish.

[@wyw201]

Is it not to consumer interest to have higher manufacturing standards?

[@Hijynx87]

Won’t the mids end up being imbalanced if you correct it?

[@audioreviews]

Not good, but you will likely not hear that as it is too far out on both ends of the frequency spectrum.

[@Viewer13128]

looking forward to your Nova review. hope you can be a bit critical regarding the treble especially because although Sharur admits the treble can sound a bit muted i found it too much so (however I didn't try it with the Tripowin spiral foam tips that Sharur recommends).

[@jimfarrell4635]

Sharur, the least likeable child in audio.

[@scientificaudiophile]

Will do!

[@haomingli6175]

that is exactly the kind of difference that foam tips can produce, i.e., taming the treble

[@Viewer13128]

@@haomingli6175 to clarify, i said i didnt try the foam tips, so i used silicone tips

[@carlb86]

It's logarithmic, so 3db is about double perceived loudness right?

[@scientificaudiophile]

Yes

[@whatistruth_1]

No Use the sengpielaudio calculator. Human perception is different

[@ReverendDr.Thomas]

ALMOST double.

[@johnwright8814]

3dB is double the power, but 10dB is needed to appear double the loudness in the midrange, which is 10 times the power. 10 Watts appears twice as loud as 1 Watt. At low bass and high treble, though, 3dB has more impact on the perception, according to the Fletcher-Munsen curves, which bunch-up at the extremes.

[@TheNEOONE1]

Nice. Well said

[@scientificaudiophile]

🤝Thanks/

[@soulxavier]

0:36 That's the actual Moondrop Variations 😂

[@Hijynx87]

I canceled mine when my TV crapped out on me. Priorities. Also I had a Hype 4 in the mail, which is arguably the better iem for my taste.

[@wahid-lg1kk]

I could never use this, as I don't defile my music by running it through Android. I use a DAP with a bespoke OS designed only for audio.

[@ReverendDr.Thomas]

That's the only way to go! 😀

[@wahid-lg1kk]

@@ReverendDr.Thomas Anyone who can't tell the difference is a hobbyist. Sound is not integral to their lives.

[@ReverendDr.Thomas]

@@wahid-lg1kk, to be fair, I also use USB APP via Android but I hate it. 👿

[@suggg6044]

​@@wahid-lg1kk I have a feeling you don't know much about audio

[@wahid-lg1kk]

@@suggg6044 Hah. Been in this hobby since the mid 70s. Maybe your ears are no good.

[@ArtificialDjDAGX]

From what I've seen online, 3dB variance tends to be within Chi-Fi industry standards. That it extends up the entire stack to flagship IEMs is not fun to hear, however. Also, when comparing the cables, are you going to do your best to try to spot a difference (where hallucinating differences can happen), or are you going to give it a good old black out drunk blind test, which is clearly more blind than a double-blind test?

[@scientificaudiophile]

Definitely start sober and see if getting drunker makes a difference.

[@ArtificialDjDAGX]

@@scientificaudiophile Fantastic to hear that such scientific rigor is upheld with the testing!

[@BrandonAdams1010]

For 20 dollar iems

[@guesswork]

I don't really care for Moondrop. But, this is one unit that was likely pre-production and they talked to one person. For what might be the most anticipated release in years. It's puzzling to me why a channel in this space wouldn't want a chance to confirm or deny the findings. With all due respect if you're just going to go with what the Headphone Show says then what am I watching for?

[@scientificaudiophile]

Headphone show contacted Moondrop. Moondrop confirmed that was within their variation QC acceptance. Not a good thing.

[@mistaBorg]

idk anyone who buys a cable and expects a sound difference. if you do get the nova i would recommend cp155 eartips since they are the only thing that holds the slippery shell of the nova in my ear.

[@sidesup8286]

Best to pass on reviewing some of that stuff that doesn't perform as it should. I. got a lot of my early stereo equipment at a downtown Department Store. I bought a compact system, not seperate components in the beginning. In order for there to be any output to the speakers, you had to have headphones plugged in. Just the reverse opposite of how it's supposed to be. You had to place real thick pillows over the headphones, so it wouldn't interfere with the sound. The cord was so short too. The tape player portion of it was too fast. The pitches of those (oh so familiar) singers always sounded a partial octave higher than they should. I remember Jim Morrison one time sounding like he very well could have been a female. On a certain classical record I could always make smoke come out of the speakers tweeter, if I played it where the volume was at 3 o'clock. One time I took the grills off and I realized they were more than just smoking, they would catch on fire for quite a few seconds, and then the fire would go out. Like the flame said to itself, Nah. But it did ruin the tweeter every time it did that. It must have been a common occurence, as the department store always had extra replacement tweeters on hand. The turntable connected to the top of it; it's dust cover kept slamming down on your hand. It looked like it was up & stable and then BAM! You couldn't remove the dust cover either. I had to have my uncle remove it. He had to go to the hardware store and get some kind of special tool. My mother kept trying to put money in his hand, for what the tool cost him. But he kept telling her no, no!..... "I stole it," he finally said. Then the turntable started having wow and flutter and would skip a lot. My uncle came over again and scotch taped a nickel to the tonearm, above the cartridge. It was one problem after another. I started hating it after a while. It was the most screwed up piece of equipment I ever owned. I'm tempted to say the brand; but I won't. Not sure what the Mk.II version corrected. They later came out with a new & improved Mk.II version. About time!

[@xeruskun]

It buffles me how a $300+ IEM could have such bad channel imbalance and how it is allowed. Even a $150 IEM like Nova has an almost perfect channel matching (my unit has a 1 db imbalance in the upper treble).

[@scientificaudiophile]

Excellent point. I’m testing the Nova’s now.

[@_DeepGroove_]

But if you buy two pairs and use the two left sides, it should at least get a pinot grigio rating, no?

[@scientificaudiophile]

Very true!

[@proffessasvids]

Fair enough xx

[@kweekeongthen8470]

What is up with the inverted polarity on truthear HEXA? Does it affect the sound in a negative way? my feeling vocal is something wrong, but instrument is nice .

[@scientificaudiophile]

Never heard the hexa.

[@kweekeongthen8470]

@@scientificaudiophile can you help me to check polarity of Nova when you receive it. They said truthear Nova also inverted polarity design too..

[@Goodmanperson55]

as far as i know, it shouldn't affect much. Some say it might affect how the bass feels because the driver would be pulling air instead of pushing it. I don't know how true that is. I haven't had problems with my pair.

[@whatistruth_1]

@@kweekeongthen8470 It's correct

[@Hijynx87]

I had no idea, but as long as the connectors are plugged in the same it shouldn’t make a difference as far as I know. I guess the best way to find out is to get a cable without an earhook and try both ways.

[@carminedesanto6746]

I’ve ended my IEM’s collection growth at the Variations…and I’m good .

[@SidVirtuous]

Same. Unless the earbud market has an answer for the lack of sub bass, I'm done with in ear stuff

[@TomTom-gx1sm]

Are they more massive than the dusks or same size?

[@MichaelBruceTaos]

3DB is pushing it.. a lot

[@Cujobob]

It’s not 3db. Those were 5db windows and this didn’t even take up half of it. Obviously, you want to see consistency, but this is being overstated.

[@johnwright8814]

The blind drunk test is the one you need to weed out inferior cables. "Matched to within +/- 3dB" sounds like some kind of standard, but not the high standard worthy of the Scientific Audiophile. Love your irreverent take on the audiophile community. I try to match it in my replies, but you're the pro here.

[@scientificaudiophile]

The +/- 3 dB seems to be a standard on speakers that are attempting to stay flat from 20-20k, but frequency shouldn’t be that far off. Here’s what should be expected : squig.link/?share=Super_22_Target,Harman_Adjusted_Target,IEF_Comp_Target,Sennheiser_IE_600

[@CammyFi]

Did you see all the data the app wants to steal too

[@scientificaudiophile]

No. Why is the app asking for personal information? Do a video on it, please.

[@CammyFi]

@@scientificaudiophile I posted it to my community tab

[@realitykicksin8755]

That is so much difference that you cannot walk a straight line whilst listening to pink noise.

[@MartinitraM]

Do you walk around listening to pink noise?

[@hpwrotethis]

This is pretty typical everywhere though. Even 64audio have a bit of channel imbalance.

[@scientificaudiophile]

3 dB?

[@h_enrix_92]

I agree with you. Moondrop may be one of the pioners of Chi-fi, but their QC sucks. My Moondrop Variations (ironic name) has some build quality and driver issues, let alone the differences in the target curve across the same models. Similar issues have been widely reported with the Kato and Chu. Many obscure brands have way better QC than Moondrop.

[@bearysh]

The other thing reviewers aren’t saying is that the Moondrop app is only for Android and so the usb DAC only has the only correction, not the entire suite of them

[@juanblanco7898]

Wow, that's terrible channel matching. You can see this even on Crin's own measurements at his site too, even if not as severe.

[@soulxavier]

Cables don't make any sound difference 😅

[@ephemerisone74]

does the blessing 3's report similar issues?

[@scientificaudiophile]

According to a few measurements I’ve seen, they vary less than 2 dB.

[@Hijynx87]

I think most chifi has a chance of this. Planars probably more often.

[@reekz2017]

I had the kxxs back in the day and left driver broke after 1 month. Never bought from moondrop ever again.

[@maciejburchardt7927]

I had a moondrop dusk few years ago and also one driver broke and set ended up in a bin where it belongs. I bought TruthEar Nova at launch and I’m still happy with them. No issues.

[@AndiGomez-yu2dx]

Forget about listening to all 200 listening hours of Diane Bish's impactful organ music with such a huge variation between the two channels!

[@hartyewh1]

How many samples of this level of imbalance have been documented? Is it with the analog cable as well and not only the DSP cable? Kinda feels like an overreaction unless there's been plenty. Every brand has send duds to reviewers in the past.

[@scientificaudiophile]

The issue isn't with this one pair, it's with Moondrop stating they expect such variations.

[@hartyewh1]

@@scientificaudiophile I wonder how different that is from other manufacturers. The percentage of sets with such channel imbalance is of more interest to most than the, here admittedly questionable, warranty practices.

[@traktorpro10]

Unit variation, it happens some worse than others.

[@apothecy4011]

Still best iem below 1k by a mile and good chance for best iem below 2k imo. With DSP, it is easily engame level. 💁‍♀️

[@jorisconte9180]

What about a Check of the Fiio Flagship IEM FX15?

[@scientificaudiophile]

Unfortunately not in my review list at this time.

[@glennbradfield4789]

thank god someone had the balls to spread discourse anout the left (iem)

[@shambles3458]

Amd still that brittle shell

[@simonirvine1628]

Review a set of Atlantis Lab Speakers, now that would be worth doing seeing there are no, I say again NO English speaking reviews out there. First start with the At 13 and move up... X

[@scientificaudiophile]

I’ll send them a request to review and see if they respond positively.

[@simonirvine1628]

@@scientificaudiophile x

[@ReverendDr.Thomas]

I am not into fake (DSP) earphones, so... 🎧

[@Roddy451]

Algorithm

[@simonirvine1628]

WONKAN

[@uber_l]

3%? Or?

[@notjxmes]

:(

[@zblus]

Ew Dusk