Why The "Fam" Didn't Work in DOCTOR WHO - Series 11-13 Discussion

[@Stubagful]

I miss me nan

[@ahumanbeingfromtheearth1502]

How many dead nans do you have?

[@ftumschk]

I got chips, tho'

[@alexl3500]

The bit of your Power of the Doctor review where an image of Ryan in Patagonia saying that made me burst out laughing 😂 great review

[@pcb1175]

“We’ve both got dead parents”

[@calebfairchild1830]

What is this from? This sounds familiar.

[@frazzlesreviews5379]

The only way I can describe Chris Chibnall’s approach to writing resolutions and episode/companion endings is like when you’re little and playing Doctor Who with action figures. You’re having so much fun with the mad narrative and the location hopping that when the grown ups come in and say it’s time to put the toys away you feel really resentful and do it really quickly ‘Fine, Tegan and Ace get dropped off by Yaz’ or ‘Captain Jack meets Gwen and calls her to say bye’ or even just ‘Yaz goes home because of something to do with the Doctor regenerating’

[@SpiderBatFan]

As much as I get enjoyment from this era, I can’t help but agree with this. Also don’t forget, “this guy sacrifices himself to save everyone else”

[@ayamira8589]

@@SpiderBatFan As opposed to "the companion sacrifices herself to save everyone else"? What's the difference, really? The plotlines in Who have always been so mad and fantastical that they could only be resolved by some deus ex machina moment (typical RTD's era) or the literal sacrificing (followed by a sort-of resurrection) of companions (Moffat's era). There was never much finesse in solving the mad plotlines that New Who created, but somehow Chibnall is the first one people are mad at over this.

[@ayamira8589]

I agree that he tends to spend too much time with the exposition and then has to rush the ending so that some moments can feel cut short. But at the same time I actually loved that there wasn't always a big drama involved. People are just going home, what's so wrong about that? Do we always need the David Tennant Staring Sadly In The Middle Distance as his companions go and live their own lives? Do we always need the "she sacrifices herself" or the getting displayed or mind-wiped exits? I for one really, really appreciated this calmer approach. 🤷

[@minicle426]

​@@ayamira8589 Bias and nostalgia. 🤷‍♂️

[@lolm2corybaxter326]

I think the criticism of Moffat/Clara is a bit harsh because the "Impossible Girl" plot was only really a thing in series 7. I agree that Clara was a very weak character who was more of a plot function than anything at that point, but I think she really came into her own and was a really good character in series 8 and 9. The relationship between 11 and Clara felt like it was completely from the Doctor's perspective while the relationship between 12 and Clara was a two-way street where Clara had agency based on who she was as a character rather than just being deemed important by a sci-fi mystery.

[@marionbaggins]

People forget and hash on Moffat/Clara just for series 7, and like you said she is more than that...I wish people would also remember her Growth in Series 8 and 9!!!

[@PaulTaylor1]

I'll be honest, I never really appreciated Clara until 12 arrived.

[@FrankNFurter1000]

@@marionbaggins growth is debatable.

[@marionbaggins]

@@FrankNFurter1000 She did grow as a character...Rose didn't 9 left.

[@darlig.ulv.bakhjerne]

Idk I'd say that initial assessment of New Who companions is pretty accurate. You basically talk yourself into it, it's not just Clara, it's Rose, Donna, Amy and River Song as well, that's basically all the main New Who companions except for Martha and Bill, both of whom were one-season wonders. Most New Who companions have some prophecy / destiny thing involved, either they're 'destined to save the universe' or predetermined to become significant in the Doctor's life, which is basically just secondhand destiny, and the Chibnall era does thankfully break away from that. Though it's a shame he didn't think up of anything particularly interesting to characterise his companions with instead

[@bluehero-96]

Not really a fair assessment. Amy still would have been Eleven's companion by chance, even if the Silence hadn't gone back in time to screw with her. Bad Wolf could have been anyone, and had nothing to do with Rose becoming a companion either. The Doctor Donna thing was tacked on after Ten asked Donna on twice. However, Clara and River are only companions because Clara and others deliberately interfered with the Doctor's life.

[@kanashimi4356]

@@bluehero-96 And even River is an exception of sorts as she is not really a regular Companion.

[@ftumschk]

@@kanashimi4356 Agreed. River is a recurring guest character, not a Companion.

[@android65mar]

Poor old Bill- should have had more time as a companion

[@marionbaggins]

Big Finish, Hopefully?!!!

[@dirrdevil]

Yeah, 1 less season of Clara and give that to Bill. I don't think we need a companion sticking around for more than seasons, and I think they need a new dynamic each season they're on: either out that companion with a new Doctor incarnation or they're in the mix with a new companion or two. Just for looking at new Who, Rose with the 9th and 10th Doctors each. The 11th Doctor with Amy for one season, then another but with Rory and River Song as well. Clara should have had less time, and got the Rose treatment: one season each with the 11th and 12th. Bring in Bill, then another with either Nardole or Missy in the mix. For the 13th, Yaz seemed under-utilized at first, so maybe cut her out of season 11, focus on Ryan and Graham. Then, add into 12, end with Ryan and Graham out, Yaz staying in. Then, it's Yaz and Dan. Something like this maybe.

[@InJeffable]

NOTE: My post contains SPOILERS for series 11 through 13 and The Power of the Doctor. Graham had some small depth to him in series 11 (as he was dealing with his grief), but he was turned into a joke in series 12. Dan had some potential, but he wasn't on the show long enough for us to really get to know him. Ryan is his dyspraxia and his family issues. There's nothing else to the character. Imagine Rory being nothing but his insecurities (early on) and his relationship with Amy. He would've been a boring character, just like Ryan is. You can certainly start a character that way, but you have to develop that character. There has to be significant growth, especially over multiple series. The only growth with Ryan was 1) he's getting better at managing his dyspraxia, and 2) his family issues have gotten better. That's great, but that's the kind of stuff that could have been covered in an episode or two. Yaz was a nothing of a character in series 11 and 12. She got a little bit of development in series 13, but it was too little too late. Chibnall tried to pass her off as this great companion with that admittedly impressive scene of her carrying the fallen Doctor back to the TARDIS in The Power of the Doctor, but it rang hollow. Despite what Dan suggested in series 13, we had never really seen that kind of closeness between Yaz and the Doctor. Compare this to series 5. Amy had been part of the show for only two episodes when we saw the closeness between her and Matt Smith's Doctor start to develop, and it continued to develop after that. With Yaz and the Doctor, the best we had was the two of them eating ice cream together that one time.

[@dracorim6370]

I find it impossible to see the companions as being 13's friends because she never opens up to them for instance Yaz doesn't know; why Flux happened, that the Timeless Child is a thing, what the Division is, etcetera. The Doctor is so secretive in this incarnation and it doesn't feel like anything is done with it, I also still find it so weird that Yaz just wanders off with literally no explanation; I thought there would be an explanation but nope the Doctor is regenerating so Yaz has to leave,

[@hotdog1214]

That line in Power of the Doctor where Yaz observes that she last saw 'Ruth' as a tour guide in Gloucester tells us that even up to the last moment she had no clue as to anything going on. I only wish that idea had been leant into a bit harder, that the Doctor was externally happy go lucky but actually holding all these secrets and that was just a superficial front - that would have added a bit more depth. I quite liked the idea of having a multiple companion Tardis team but alas it didn't quite work out, as noted, they never felt like they were friends with the Doctor, just a bunch of humans who happened to be tagging along.

[@ayamira8589]

@@hotdog1214 I mean no offense, but it was made absolutely clear that this incarnation is still holding the hurt and sadness from all her previous lifetimes inside? There were so many instances where it was shown, albeit not spoken out (although, actually, Thirteen also said it out loud) that she just can't open up, and no wonder too. In my eyes it is a testament to Chibnall and Whittaker honouring what was before them, that this incarnation didn't just give their hearts away again. I mean, seriously, the last times the Doctor fell in love or made friends they either were displaced in time or space, had to be mind-wiped, or literally died right in front of their eyes. No one with a beating heart would have been able to open up again after this. We've seen the Doctor almost break multiple times thanks to losing those he opened up to, so not letting her "fam" in meant she was protecting them just as much as she was protecting herself. And Yaz just being able to go, the two of them understanding that the Doctor needed this, is a powerful - and for once not overly dramatic - ending. I really don't understand why people are so bewildered by this and say it should have been explained more.

[@hotdog1214]

@@ayamira8589 No offense taken, just sharing friendly opinions, no problem with that at all. 😁 I may be mistaken but it seems we are talking about the same thing. I've seen quite a few fans (although its bypassed others still) get the impression that Thirteen isn't a blank slate but a step forward from the previous incarnations, Diodati springs to mind as a good example of carrying the weight of losing friends and the responsibility she feels to not let it happen again. Maybe as some have picked it up it is there subtly, and that's not a bad thing of course as it brings another dimension to the Doctor. I guess all I'm saying is that I kind of wish it was more prominent that Thirteen was struggling to stick with those parting words from Twelve, trying to laugh hard and run fast but still weighed upon by the past even though she was trying to live a more joyful existence. I never really felt the closeness with her 'fam' that previous Doctor's had with their companions and if that was deliberate it would be nice to explore that further, that she is keeping them at arms length on purpose. Just as in series 11 it seemed, to me at least, that whenever she was around the fam it was all smiles and fun but away from them she was more serious, as if there were a façade just for the companions - I really like that notion that there was a duality to the Thirteenth Doctor - but I cant tell if that was wishful thinking, a deliberate writing choice or just a happy accident - so again some clarity from Chibnall as to whether that was the intention would be helpful. There are probably a few examples dotted about that might allude to the Doctor making this deliberate choice - certainly the secretive nature is at the fore - as I mentioned right on the last episode she still hasn't told Yaz the full story about Ruth or the Timeless Child so that is a good indication of that character trait but that is just one example and many people even missed that line in TPOTD; so just personally I would have preferred if it was at the forefront rather than something left for the viewer to work out as actually its a really interesting idea to explore. I do agree as well that thank goodness Yaz's departure wasn't overly dramatic, just an ice cream on top of the Tardis, sharing their last moments together.

[@ayamira8589]

@@hotdog1214 My apologies for the late reply! And thank you for explaining your view further. I think I now understand what you mean, and I can see now why in a way you would have prefered a more obvious approach. We all are different and enjoy different things after all. ☺ For me, personally, this more subtle approach was near to perfect. For me the duality was absolutely clear and telling from the interviews Chibnall gave it seems to have been very intentional indeed. While he never actually mentioned basing it all on the developments of previous eras, when it came to the character design he clearly didn't leave much to chance. And I never felt like I had to work it out either, but then again it's also what I generally prefer anyway: a more subtle approach. And Chibnall and Whittaker both went down that route after all. While David Tennant for example was exceptionally expressive with his whole body language and used large gestures for his face as well, Jodie Whittaker used mainly her eyes and much more subtle facial expression to convey what her Doctor was actually feeling. For someone like me that was brilliant and I saw each and every nuance, but I have also learned that for many viewers these things were apparently very hard to read. It is also my personal theory that this is where the "she is wooden" accusations come from that popped up in almost every comment section anywhere. Anyway. I am pretty confident saying that this duality was definitely deliberate, and it is also one of the reasons that those who adore the Thirteenth Doctor love her for because naturally it makes her just as complex as the other post-war incarnations were. As for whether it could have been explored more? As everything else I think this depends on personal preferences. Personally I don't feel like there should have been done more with it, because for me it was already there and obvious even when it was never said out loud. I also feel like we had enough drama between the Doctor and their companions since 2005 so to have Yaz kind of accept this and not have it turn into majour confrontations and Thirteen pouring her hearts out is a welcome change for me. At the same time I understand if viewers would have preferred for things to go differently for this obvious facade to be more of an issue between them, which in turn could have lead to Thirteen actually opening up to Yaz. 🙂 Once again thanks for the lovely reply. Have a great weekend!

[@Raven-Woods]

I think the idea of exploring the ramifications of a Doctor being so emotionally distant from their companions is a really interesting one to explore, but S11-PotD didn’t really do that. The story came off that way because so much of the episodes were focused on the plots, and almost never with the characters and their relationships with each other. And it was completely unintentional, otherwise we would have seen the Doctor have consequences for that emotional distance. She never did, though. Yaz would have been the perfect companion to explore that with, as she was really the one most effected by that distance. Exploring how Yaz’s feelings for the Doctor complicated that dynamic could have been a really interesting thing to be integrated into it (had Thasmin not been a hastily added B-plot for 2 episodes). Instead there’s no real consequences for the Doctor having never opened up to any of the companions, other than with Ryan once - in a scene that could be considered an emotionally manipulative way to keep him traveling with her. And because of that, the audience is not really given a reason why we should feel sad when the companions left. Graham’s goodbye is about the best, which fits as he’s Chibnall’s self insert character. Ryan’s is alright, and at least built up over RotD. Dan just…leaves, but at least he says goodbye. The ice cream scene before Yaz left that felt more like it was the actors saying goodbye to the roles instead of the characters saying goodbye to each other. And then Yaz just silently leaves for no reason other than Mandip’s contract was over. Self insert Graham gets a big speech at the end, sort of mirroring the one he had in TWWFTE, but given that it was Yaz who was leaving, it should have been her having a speech, which would have paralleled the loss aspect of the original scene better. But no, she just gets like 1 line. The way Chibnall prioritized basic plot structure stuff over characters is absolutely bizarre.

[@jasonlescalleet5611]

One thing I noticed about the original Fam was that they all had something in common with the Doctor, but it was different things for each of them. Ryan thought…differently from most people. Not just the Dyspraxia, but how he was basically a big kid a lot of the time (e.g. shadow puppets in Arachnids) but could also be insightful about things you wouldn’t expect. Yaz was the the one who wanted to set things right (we see her being the work-things-out-peacefully sort of cop rather than the guns-blazing-cowboy sort). And Graham knows a thing or two because he’s seen a thing or two (he realized something was off in Witchfinders because he’d been to English-Salem and taken the witch tour, and it was nothing like what they were seeing). I don’t know if any of this was intentional, but it wasn’t a bad thing and I wish more had been done with it.

[@timecontroller8800]

The worst thing about the 13th doctor and companion dynamic was that she hardly told them anything like there meant to be friends and she doesn’t tell yaz anything in serious 13 even tho I am pretty sure she said last season no more secrets and constantly disrespects them by lying to them or causing them to become homeless and not even giving them a replacement house (justice for Dan)

[@elliotcrossan6290]

Very good video. And the fact that the "fam" barely ever resolve the plot reminds me of the fact that the Ninth Doctor only really saves the day once in the entire series he is in, and even then, only with Jabe's help. Here is who saves the day in each Series 1 episode: Ep 1: Rose Ep 2: the Doctor & Jabe Ep 3: Charles Dickens Eps 4-5: Mickey Ep 6: Rose & the Dalek Ep 7: Cathica Ep 8: Pete Eps 9-10: Nancy Ep 11: the TARDIS Eps 12-13: Rose, Mickey, Jackie & the TARDIS

[@ftumschk]

Excellent insights, although I'd disagree that they (the Fam/Dan) were "very well acted" because, for me, they were the least well acted Companions since the lowest points of Classic Era casting. Yes, we had some moving moments from Graham in (for example) "Woman Who Fell", "Rosa" and "It Takes You Away", and from Yaz in "Demons" and "Can You Hear Me", but can you imagine how much more of an emotional gut-punch we'd have got if the likes of Wilf, Rory, Donna or Bill had delivered those lines? There'd be no comparison. I'm not saying I didn't appreciate the efforts of Walsh, Gill and co, but I found their acting to be merely adequate at best. Aside from the writing, I felt that this was the most significant factor as to why the Fam didn't really work.

[@pious83]

I still think Graham should have been the sole companion to 13. Their dynamic was the most interesting of season 11. It would have been better to explore he and the Doctor, as the sole pairing.

[@hotdog1214]

Agreed, I always thought Graham and the Doctor's relationship seemed to gel better. The other two, who were for the most part interchangeably just pointing out the obvious things we could see in the scene, were just *there* and the Doctor, despite sometimes telling us they were the best humans she'd ever met, didn't seem to pay them much heed. On a few occasions they disappeared entirely and she didn't even notice! 😁😁

[@pious83]

@@hotdog1214 Ryan could literally have been replaced with a cardboard cut out for most of season 11 & 12 and you would barely have noticed...

[@maxkennedy7430]

This video has given me a really dark idea. I want someone to make edit video of The 13th Doctor being a passive aggressive psychopath and make it look like she’s kidnapped and holding Graham, Ryan & Yaz as hostages and making them go on dangerous adventures while acting all heroic. While At the same time barking orders and guilt-tripping her “fam” While the Fam try and get away from her and even have Ryan doing a video vlog calling out for help. Something like this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/kKuniYxrnJeqjrssi=8DoVIuuKPlku8Hpv “She thinks we’re her Family, and she’s made us travel the world…in A Fucking Police Box!”

[@thomasleongeorgerobertglad7560]

That would be amazing

[@yepimbatman]

There’s something very funny to me about referring to Dan as “the plasterer from Liverpool” when his profession never comes up once in the series lol

[@pcb1175]

What would’ve made Legend of the Sea Devils great is if they kidnapped him & made him do the plastering for their base

[@GIAGKenny]

Dan the man who can, with a van and a non stick pan

[@crimsondynamo615]

Nobody needs soup more than me

[@HeyJay2000]

The Live Chat was weird in this one. 😅😅 I had to watch the video twice because I kept getting distracted by the chat. One guy just kept talking about how hot some of the companions are and also Emma Watson at one point. 🤨 And the Moderator for this segment didn't notice it at all, and was removing comments that were giving criticism towards the Chibnall era. 😅😅

[@android65mar]

Turn Left was a fantastic companion story, as was World Enough and Time

[@stephenreed2093]

To be fair, the Doctor only gave Donna the lottery ticket the SECOND time he left her. The first time he just dumped her memory-wiped arse back home and left.

[@joer.g8568]

Read that as “wiped her arse and left her back home” 😂😂

[@falconeshield]

Back to the Future porch called, they want their scene back

[@SpiderBatFan]

Completely agree with all of this, really need to add something else to this. A week or so ago I saw a tweet that said 13 being closed off from her companions is an intentional character flaw and it’s unique to her Doctor, Except it really isn’t, the other day I rewatched the end of the world and in it, the doctor is closed off on who he is and where he comes from to Rose and they have an argument about it, then at the end of the episode he is honest and opens up with her. Same goes for 10 and Martha in Gridlock. There really should have been a moment like them between 13 and her companions, at least Yaz, rather than her constantly snapping at them, promising to share what’s eating her up and never actually doing so

[@ayamira8589]

Why though? The Doctor opening up again would completely ignore RTD's and Moffat's eras. Because what happened each time the Doctor opened up? The one they started to let in were either displaced in time and/or space, had to be mind-wiped, or literally died right in front of their eyes. The Doctor almost broke several times thanks to these losses, so pray tell, which reason should the Doctor have to open up again and make the same mistake over and over? 🤷

[@HudsonMedia]

For me it has to be that simply it was rushed. If they introduced the companions slowly over the course of one season or even the full 3. They could have worked better. The same way they built up to 9, Rose, Jack and Mickey being a unit by the end of Series 1. It’s a real shame cause the idea of a proper TARDIS team is a fun one.

[@Traykartheswift]

We need more companions like Nardole

[@dirrdevil]

Nardole grew on me. He always felt like a secondary companion, like a more human-ish K9. And it felt unique, as Bill was the proper companion and Nardole was just hanging around sometimes helping the Doctor out but not really in the spotlight.

[@christopherbennett5858]

Yeah, that’s really one of the biggest issues. Whilst they had some character bits, it gets blindsided by the fact that they don’t contribute much to the main story. Think what you will but at least Adric did something. Yaz might be the biggest sufferer because a lot of her stuff was so last minute and so nonexistent. For me, the true tipping point was the Mary Shelley episode which had the Doctor ranting about being on top of the pecking order and nothing changes after that. That the companions just have to follow her orders. Which, based on certain critical lenses, really makes her out to be more like one of those really sheltered performative allies who is a good friend as long as she can take all the credit and remains unopposed. That might be the reason why “the fam” moniker doesn’t fit right; it’s more like a family where the children are seen less like people and more like accessories to the parent. Compare that to a show that came out a year after 13th started called Pose; a drama with an ensemble cast about living in New York’s Ballroom Community during the 1980’s. Each of the members of the family, the House of Evangelista has their own problems, relationships and storylines but they come together as a family to help each other out and close ranks when the outside world closes in. And they are active agents in both their own stories and those of others. And which one got my relatively conservative dad tuning in every night to see whether or not the characters made it out okay?; the one about the family that vogued together and not the one where the neglect was constantly present.

[@benmiller3252]

I'm hoping Big Finish will do The 13th Doctor's TARDIS team justice

[@jensablefur155]

Forgive me if I go into Krytens Smug Mode but I do remember saying at the initial announcement of the three of them that three companions never worked in the 1980s with Peter Davison and it won't work now. Someone (usually Sarah Sutton, let's be honest) was stood around metaphorically rocking on their heels and whistling ('you stay in the Tardis, lol') while the other characters do their thing. It's just too busy. I don't dislike this era as much as some but this wasn't a good decision. Yaz and Ryan and Evil Dan shared the load when it came to who was the "Nyssa" of the story, so it did shift it's focus a bit rather than sidelining just one of them constantly... But it was always going to be the inevitable outcome.

[@booradley8895]

Did it work in the 60s where basically Susan's only job was to scream at the drop of a hat..literally.

[@Benji568]

I'm so glad you brought up the whole "companion bring the most important thing in universe or destiny" trope whatever you want to call it. I've been sick of it since the Clara arc. We've broken away from that with the Fam but the problem was that Chibs didn't give them enough to do and not much development from episode to episode apart from Graham. I hope we get a good arc with Ruby.

[@Natelu-Sama]

i feel like if youre gonna call amy "only important because of her scifi destiny" then you have to count dan as well- both only important because an alien was in their life by chance and the doctor helped them

[@McEdam]

I do love the 13th Doctor Companions, essentially Graham! But I do agree they never have a agency in the story!

[@android65mar]

At least she didn't drop Dan off in Scotland like 4 did with Sarah Jane

[@Tymbus]

Interesting. Hard not to agree. One problem for me was that I never really warmed to the characters, they didn't seem real even in TV series

[@ayamira8589]

I know this is all subjective, but I for one will never understand why people have such a hard time understanding what was made pretty clear on screen: the Thirteenth Doctor kept her emotional distance by choice, and also because she simply couldn't open up to her "fam" no matter how much she liked them. It was also thematised again and again first by Ryan, but then also by Yaz who obviously struggled with how the Doctor wouldn't let her in. And it's funny, because this era is so often criticised as being "too obvious" and "hitting people over the head" and yet many of the things that went on seeminly hardly anybody understood? Thirteen not letting these humans in is nothing but the logical consequence of what Moffat and RTD put the Doctor through. Because, what happened with the last humans the Doctor opened up to? They were either displaced in time and/or space, had to be memory-wiped (by the Doctor himself no less and while they begged for him not to do it!), or they outright died right in front of their eyes. Not letting the "fam" in meant protecting them as much as it meant protecting the Doctor's own hearts. The Doctor almost broke several times thanks to losing those he had let in, and the ones he did open up to usually felt compelled to save him even if it cost them their lives. So keeping them at arm's length really protected them, and I think that was made pretty clear in the show. Now, it's fair if people prefer the old overly dramatic relationships where one exit is more horrible than the last one, and where companions mostly face awful fates (until getting "immortalised" by conveniently returning immortal characters) - and for those viewers RTD is back after all. But to claim that there was no rhyme or reason to Thirteen's behaviour and that more should have been done with it? I for one don't think so at all. And, additionally, after all the "more special than special" companions - who didn't even become extraordinary through personal development but just because they met the Doctor and sacrificed themselves in one way or another for them - these wonderfully normal and human travellers were a breath of fresh air imho. 🙂

[@SSJPENGUIN]

LOVE how much 13 kept from her companions Felt as though she really did love them but no matter what she knows/feels their lives can never really be intertwined

[@andrewbrown9981]

Oje of the best things about the rtd and moffat era was the doctor lite episodes

[@booradley8895]

I thought it was refreshing that the doctor was the star of the show for a change. I loathed Clara because she did not just save the doctor by going in his time stream (and the episode did not even have a proper ending just John Hurt's appearance) Got the time lords to give him another set of regenerations. Then the doctor went to "hell" to save her dead boyfriend which I thought was just plain stupid since he has never done it for a companion. Though I do think the fam was fine for one series and perhaps not for two.

[@mayotango1317]

Remember the Rose Tyler show in the RTD era?

[@marionbaggins]

@@mayotango1317 People forget that (but I remember Rose I rewatched RTD and Rose was a lot more important then people let on about Clara) made the whole of the RTD Era (even the series she isn't in) Rose Who, (The Talisman 772 did a Brillant Essay on this called The Two Rose Tyler's exploring her descend) Clara made the Moffat Era Clara Who for a few series!!! (And Plus when Bad Wolf is Mentioned Rose is coming back, while Impossible Girl is only in Series 7B...)

[@kanashimi4356]

People Forget that the whole RTD Era has the companions arguably more focused on. Rose's time on series 1 of the show is characterised primarily by her helping 9 heal from his war trauma and then resolving the finale. Series 2 is Developing Rose and 10's Love Story and inevitable separation. Hell in Series 3 I'm pretty sure Martha Saves 10 more than the other way around and her entire relationship with 10 is all about Rose's Absence (unfortunately). Series 4 and 6 are the only Pre-Clara new series that even *arguably* focus mainly on the Doctor, and 4 gives Donna equal if not greater focus while 6 is only so in the plot-point sense of "I'm going to die but not really." On a character basis most episodes and series tend to focus more on the Companions as characters anyway or their relationship with the Doctor or some big event. The only New Series Episode I can think of where I think the Doctor as a character is really the primary focus is Heaven Sent. What I loathe is this weird mindset of Who fans to make criticisms like this and "The show is too political now." While forgetting that it is something that has been there since the start of the revival at the very least.

[@KindaKhul0205]

Bad writing is why the Fam failed. Good idea badly executed. Only Russell wrote the companions really well. Moffat over complicated Amy, River, Clara. Only Bill came across as a believable person.

[@mayotango1317]

To be honest, Amy Pond is the most realistic companion in the show.

[@NitroIndigo]

I don't like how the companions were separated from the Doctor for significant chunks of every single series 12 episode. Also, Tosin Cole sounds bored.

[@seanoneill9606]

Chibbers took Missy calling Bill and Nardole "exposition and comic relief" literally.

[@andrewbrown9981]

How did having 3 companions work with the fifth doctor

[@not_enough_space]

Nyssa has a headache. She'll be sleeping it off in the TARDIS. Adric is busy teaming up with the villain.

[@heyboi2682]

Worked even better with the first

[@TheHerman8r]

It didn't haha 5 worked better with 2 whenever he had 3 companions one was always on the sidelines or conveniently stuck in the Tardis all story used to happen to Nyssa all the time.

[@patrexianboy986]

They had multiple episodes for a story

[@peterd788]

The era failed because of the terrible writing and an appalling lead performance. From a purely technical perspective series 11 and 12 were well made but no matter how hard people try you can’t polish a turd.

[@ridensroom6957]

To me, the only fam was 11, Amy and Rory

[@marionbaggins]

They were a better Fam...And I prefer them!!!

[@BanazirGalpsi1968]

The impossible girl/girl who waited et al is not at all sexist, but is not good writing. It can have moments of good writing but it's mostly a bad concept. The fam concept is a throw back to doctors one, two, and five point two and six. The single companion is kind of restrictive. The point of a single companion is to make the doctor more of the superhero star. And in trying to correct for that, moffet overcorrected the companion and creates a Mary sue. Donna is the exception. I mostly like the ensemble idea . I don't think pushing specific agendas like LGBTQ+ for example, is good story telling either. It kind of flattens the story. I like for example the main first part of Rosa works, but the villain from the future at the end dosnt. You get the ensemble dynamic, and sort of a first doctor proper historical up to that point. Then u screw it up. But in general I think like anything on tv, it's not how many characters, it's how you write and perform them.

[@1rhpsfan]

I compare the fam to Season 19 pre "Earthshock" for some reason it seems hard to write for a four person TARDIS team.

[@marionbaggins]

The 60's are the closest who did it best...

[@Thomas_of_the_forest]

Clara stayed for 5 seasons too long 😂

[@mariaantoniou1693]

I always felt that most of Moffat eras companions were more plot devices than characters. I liked Bill and Nardole the most out of Moffat era.

[@mayotango1317]

No, The Fam are plot devices and usseles.

[@PaulTaylor1]

You're totally right about the fam. And when you bear in mind that the Doctor was effectively a proxy for Chibnall himself - the Doctor told the companions what to do, and Chibnall told the Doctor what to do - there's an argument that this era was as sexist as any other.

[@redjirachi1]

Soyjak Anti-SJWs: NOOO you can't disagree with us but still not like the fam! Soyjak SJWs: NOOO who's side are you on?! Chad Mr Tardis: *Enlightened Centrism* Chad Jreg: NOOO YOU CAN'T BE C*NTRIST!

[@MrTARDIS]

Centrism is cowardly.