My response to viewer’s comment

[@PaulMessner]

Win a wild camping setup www.messner.co.uk/

[@craigelliott4338]

Weeeeeeey! So, the magnetic north pole moves, which is why you have to check for declination. Ive been out sooooooo many times, used my map and NEVER EVER used magnetic declination. Bottom line is, unless you are in a featureless place for a long distance, you can just use visual features as checkpoints because you dont just walk straight. So the chances of you needing a bang on bearing are low. Dont rise to people, mate. How many hikes have you successfully completed without getting lost? Youve got nothing to prove. Keep going brother.

[@stuartmorgan9327]

Often you don’t need a compass. I’ve definitely been out when the viz has dropped and had to rely on a compass. Back in the 90’s it was about 5 degrees of variation in the UK.

[@RollrightKnights]

Declination would only matter if you were walking on a bearing for a very long distance when in reality you'd use regular points in between to take a bearing and walk to.

[@craigelliott4338]

@@RollrightKnights exactly.

[@StevenKeery]

​@@RollrightKnights: Well in foggy or misty conditions, it would matter because you would not be able to see the points you were walking to. A risk of falling into a quarry or off a cliff in the fog. Having said that, the variation is zero where I live too and the variation is printed on the maps, together with the date of the map to enable you to calculate it easily for yourself. Some compasses even have a small screw to set this variation and forget about it. Paul's map and compass work was fine for his location. I don't know why he is so bothered by someone's opinion. To me it would be water off a duck's back.

[@mazdamaniac4643]

It barely shifts over the course of a year anyway. Sure, if you had a decent compass with an adjustable declination feature, you might need to adjust it every few years, but it won't be far wrong enough to be dangerous. The guy commenting that it's dangerous is just another nitpicking armchair expert of everything with far more unsatisifed ego than common sense.

[@jimslade19721]

Bloody Messner. Followed your map reading tutorial to get to Kinder now I'm in Spain.

[@mountain_del1863]

Very good😂 made me laugh that. ATB

[@johnbennett348]

Sounds like you used to be an officer in the forces. This is why an officer with a map and a compass is dangerous 😂😂

[@leemartin2978]

Hola, enjoy 😂

[@woldtop8922]

I'm in bloody Tunisia!

[@BadgerBotherer1]

I'm in Wales. Can't get worse than that!

[@GaryB_OutandAbout]

Half way through the video, I thought, I’ll comment about the guy from ‘The Map Reading Company’, who also says, there’s no need to adjust for the tiny amount of declination at this point in time in the U.K. Then you mentioned him. His videos are also brilliant and well worth watching. Obviously at some point in the future we will again, have to adjust for it, but not yet. Keep enjoying what you do, Paul. Cheers, Gary B

[@nikob5899]

I'd love to see a collaboration with you and the Map Reading Company. 🎉😂🎉😂🎉😂🎉

[@stephendavies7881]

I don't think you did anything wrong in all honesty, the basics of map reading, it's used all the time by everyone at all times 😉 Keep it up, you have inspired me 💖

[@loghoppers]

Full time uk 🇬🇧 tent Nomads here 👋🏼 and we just use a much more simple compass. I'm ex forces and very adapt to my signals training I've had over the years too... You've done nothing wrong, for what you're doing! Keep up the good work Cully and HAPPY HOPPING 👌🏼👍🏼

[@phlweb1966]

Nice video Paul. Worth mentioning that when you are walking on a bearing, it's always more accurate to identify an object in the distance that is in line with the bearing you need to follow and walking to that. If all you do is look at the compass and keep the 'red in the shed' you can drift without realising. Walking to an object or feature eliminates that.

[@HywelOwen]

Ha ha ha, I've been hiking for 45 years and never done a magnetic correction. You carry on.

[@allanwhite4171]

The guy who said your video was "dangerous " must have known that the current deviation at that location was negligible so his comment was totally unnecessary.

[@neildavidson9908]

In the UK at the moment the declination is irrelevant, you had to add 10degrees when I started

[@angelaknisely-marpole7679]

Likewise!

[@erinhenry9750]

Paul u r absolutely great I didn't know all about the 3 norths thank you so much. But you shouldn't ever think you need to explain yourself to undeserving viewers 😊 ❤from Michigan

[@stevemuggleton8936]

Spot on Paul, another great video. I too watch the Map Reading Company, probably the best navigation channel on YT.

[@JohnDoe-ee6qs]

I will say one thing, to anyone out there just getting into walking in the hills, a GPS is great but they dont always work and the weather can come in fast, always carry a hard copy map and compass. Stay safe.

[@markelder38]

very well explained . I was a recruit instructor in the Army and thought your video was excellent And would be really helpful to some people 👍

[@lastone8896]

Paul don't let the trolls get under your skin obviously your doing just fine Keep the good work up

[@awayinthewilderness4319]

Glad for that comment as I was actually able to learn something by this video! Thanks!

[@AndyWragg]

Cracking response Paul. I just replaced my Dark Peak map 2 weeks ago as the previous one was starting to fall to bits. Went for the weather proof version this time. Was surprised when I checked the angle of dangle in that it's middling so no need for adjustment.

[@tonyhall395]

I’ve used maps all my life in the military Paul, we do use the mag to grid and grid to mag adjectives but only if we are planning an attack on a specific location. For normal hiking over short distance and in good featured terrain we never bothered. 😎😎 keep up the great work mate.

[@neil3589]

Very good explanation, like you say this is so not needed for the uk in general for walking those short distances. We do the compass work with sailing as over larger distances it is more important, depending on the year and amount of change to magnetic north.

[@WalkTalkBrew]

Loved this and the fact that some people felt incensed to comment. I spent 15 years in the army and we very rarely bothered with adjusting for magnetic variations. Usually, you’re walking a line of sight that is only a few hundred meters at most and in the UK and most of Europe there are always features with which you can check your bearings against. Night navigation and being in the desert presents different challenges but we’re not in that discussion. Mate, just do you and keep doing what you do. No need to explain yourself.

[@russellsprout2223]

Respect to you for your long service to Queen and Country. Thank you.

[@carriehikes]

Nice one! Put them in their place. Too many people leaving random negative comments these days. I think the last time I adjusted for magnetic deviation it was three degrees in the UK. I didn't worry too much about it then either! Once you can see your objective you're fine, it's only in the thickest mist or white out conditions where you need to follow a compass accurately.

[@karlevanson]

Well done, Paul, for defending what most will do if you know the area and the weather is fine. One small point don't use deviation, that's used on boats and aircraft to correct for the magnetic effects of the craft on different headings.

[@jonsutcliffe8508]

Passed my Mountain Leader assessment 2 weeks ago and we were told to ignore magnetic variation at the moment (UK Lake District). Though 6 years ago on training we were told to use it then. So in a few years we will need to start again in UK, but this time going the other way.

[@Gordonafloat]

Your advice is bang on and very helpful to anyone out walking..( I commented on the other post about needing another hiking buddy to walk ahead of you on the correct bearing in misty conditions.) As you say, magnetic variation the UK is not an issue because it is so insignificant. When walking with a Silva type compass most of us would be hard pushed to be within a couple of degrees of the exact bearing anyway. I have done a lot of flying which requires a much higher level of accuracy to stay on track which is why a hand held plastic compass is not the instrument of choice in the air but more than adequate when walking.

[@sshaw37]

Perfect explanation. I haven’t bothered with mag. deviation for a few years.

[@alandavis9180]

I made a comment on your previous video Paul when this topic came up asking what the magnetic declination was in that area. Someone replied it is less than a degree which is obviously hardly worth worrying about. However I have done heaps of hiking (tramping) in New Zealands South Island over the decades and in many areas it is 21-22 degrees East which is very significant. So instinctively I always check my map for the degree of declination as a matter of course. This past European summer I spent near 4 weeks hiking in Norway and the declination was 1-2 degree at most. I didn't even bother adjusting for it. I have used Silva compasses in the past but now prefer Suuntos because you can dial the declination in from your map and thus not to to keep allowing for it when taking a new bearing. One thing to remember is to get a compass balanced for your hemisphere (or otherwise one balanced for the whole planet.) I had a compass balanced for the Southern hemisphere and it wouldn't work in Scandinavia so I had to rush and buy one for the Northern hemisphere. Fortunately I noticed this before beginning my trip. Other than that Paul your little tutorial on using a compass was pretty much spot on.

[@DavidDunn-breakinbadretrddad]

Wonderful share sir. Thank you for refreshing my map reading. I enjoyed map and terrain nav in the service

[@songasport]

Be careful, saying it's 61 degrees will make some folk go out in their shorts with no coat. Very dangerous in this weather!

[@StevenKeery]

Songasport : I seen some kids walking home from school today. No anorak or overcoat, just blazer and shirt. Blazer open and flapping in the wind. Hardy lot of kids, or no sense, take your pick.

[@MrJC1]

🤣🤣🤣. Yeah Paul... you are giving really bad advice saying 61 degrees mate. We need a follow up vid about this. Haha. Messing... messner-ing. :D.

[@g.w.moorman3887]

The rule is, 'You don't feel cold until the temperature drops below your age. That's why little kids can run around outdoors all day in the freezing and old geezers move to warm climates! @@StevenKeery

[@ipedros7]

61degrees... There is absolutely no chace of t-shirt . If Celcius, Im hiding in the fridge, if Fahrenheit im reaching for a light top over t-shirt. haha

[@johnoshea3349]

Did orienteering while taki g forestry classes. The minute deviation will almost always put you within acceptable visual distance of a determined waypoint. We usually allowed 30 to 40 yards as completing or closing the grid We used to use the old chains to measure distance or 66 ft. Used my compass skills to negotiate a difficult canoe route in Quebec. Without shooting a bearing on an established high point and referring to it on the topographic map, my son and i would have had a rough day. We love your videos and your use of the compass was very good. Thank you, Paul

[@PenryMMJ]

Common sense is always important. If your compass bearing seems to be sending you off the edge of a cliff, it's time to consider that you may have done something wrong. It's similar to not blindly following your car's sat-nav if it tells you to drive into the sea. 😁

[@markwood9883]

Great explanation. Originally learnt this in Scouts 40 years ago when the adjustment was 6 degrees. Map reading is all about good observation and no one element like a grid bearing should be relied upon.

[@OutdoorsmanDave]

Nice, In Auckland, New Zealand magnetic declination is ~ +20.22 deg but you’re right, better to know the basics than confuse yourself with too much detail 👏

[@BlackCrag]

You did everything right Paul. In the UK the magnetic declination is so small that it's pointless considering it. Especially over short distances like that. Put it this way, magnetic variance is ignored during mountain leader training. What does that tell you? 😁 Ignore the know-it-alls, they actually know very little. That said, it would have ruffled my feathers too 😂

[@alangauld6079]

Its worrying that MLT ignores it because mountain leaders are exactly the kind of folks who are likely to go to places where declination *is* important. If they don't get taught it they'll never know to consider it! And of course if they keep going for another 20 years they will need it even in the UK!

[@notoriousgib]

Quick tip: be mindful when taking a compass bearing next to big rocks. I know on Dartmoor the metal within the granite rocks can throw your bearing off a fair few degrees/mils.

[@andrewjohnston9115]

Mickledoor on Scafell has magnetite in the rocks and a compass is badly effected by this, always good to have a dig and find some local info.

[@RollrightKnights]

The Cuillins on Skye too

[@briancarruthers5535]

Lead hills in south Scotland does the same

[@wild_running]

Er, and your watch!

[@bonpecheur4565]

Paul is a super hero, the only rock he has to be mindful of is kryptonite 😂

[@cliffdmb1237]

Really good video and spot on. I've completed several long expeditions and hikes in the UK without adjusting for magnetic declination and it has never been the reason for getting lost. Any time we have ever got 'lost' it has been more likely the case due to a farmer changing the route of a public footpath or some other external factor. Magnetic declination is at the least of concerns when navigating in the UK.

[@tbo2120]

Everybody in the comments 😂 pretending they’re navigation gurus are the same people who go for a walk with their car always visible in the carpark over their shoulder as to not to get lost on the way up 😂😂 ignore them. This video is a very simple and easy method to find your way round. Cheers!

[@apollo12329]

Outstanding Paul. You know more than anyone there are people out there looking for the minute fault to pick up and then make the whole plant aware! Cracking effort buddy.

[@furncemanjim]

Your right on top of the prime meridian, that’s why there’s little or no declination, if you have a good compass, you can tweak your compass for it.

[@mikejenson6406]

Yes, it's important people appreciate deviation exists and depends where you're walking.. Well done again Paul. I admire your patience.. Great videos

[@greenman7126]

Excellent video. I didn't see the first video, however you make important points. Over the years i have navigated trails all over the world the same way as you in varying weather conditions, and its fine. Distance is often short and if you frequently check your position and bearing its fine. I have also navigated uk costal and occasionally French costal waters and any navigater worth their salt will build in margins for error around any possible hazard. No one walks or sails in perfectly straight lines. Thats for pedants who stay at home.

[@DAoutdoors]

Hi Paul. For 99.9% of us we don’t really need to use magnetic declination. Unless you are walking in a wild featureless area over a huge distance you don’t really need to account for magnetic declination. When we are only taking a bearing to get us to a point a few hundred yards away then the chances of you being far from your destination are very small indeed. Cheers for sharing, and certainly don’t worry about the any negative comments. All the very best, Dave 😀🥾⛰🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

[@chunks1965]

Nice answer, beat me to it and well put

[@robinacjohnston]

Beat me to it as well. If walking in the UK, they can all be assumed to be the same

[@alangauld6079]

@@robinacjohnston Only at the moment. In 10 or 20 years time they will be significant again. Its not a constant.

[@peterdallyn6440]

Probably an old boy, back in 70s 80s magnetic deviation was significantly different about 8°, now it's less than 1°.

[@TFSOutdoors]

Completely agree with your views Paul. You did nothing wrong, as you said it wasn't meant to be a lesson. While I'm familiar with declination, most people don't use it or know about it. Although I do check from time to time, I have never had to use it, as its so small in he UK.

[@alastairmackay4589]

Excellent video. Explained in such a friendly and accessible manner. You’re actually a natural teacher.

[@worstuserever]

Have been enjoying The Map Reading Company videos for a while. The presenter is called Wayne and my favourite moments are his little conversational departures, for which he cricises himself and describes them as waffling. This isn't fair at all, he's always interesting and funny. Now we need you and Wayne on a collab!

[@matthewnirenberg]

What is dangerous is solely trusting the compass and declination. I was always taught, use the map, compass and your terrain. Always start at a known location that is easily located on your map, as you take bearings and move, keep comparing your terrain to your map. Sometimes people will end up on the wrong side of a ridge and mistake their location, sometimes the compass will get bumped without realising. By consistently comparing your terrain to your map as well, you're ensuring that you're on your planned route. Matching terrain helps avoid declination errors as whilst magnetic north can vary often, terrain is generally unchanged except as a result of major natural events (quakes, landslides, etc.) or human activity (housing development, highway, etc.). If however you're in a flat featureless area and traveling for huge distances, then yes declination matters however very few people are in such large featureless areas on camping trips.

[@clairewhitney5978]

Well done for putting that guy back in his box. I've been running DofE expeditions up there for years and never used magnetic declination. Taught it but also explained why it's not necessary in the UK. Keep up the good work 👍

[@alangauld6079]

It is necessary in the UK, just not now! But in 10 years it will be significant again in many parts of the UK and you need to check(but only once per year or so for a given area!).

[@nickcairns1793]

Great explanation, well done. I used to teach map reading and navigation and was even nerdy enough to at one stage own all 204 1:50000 OSGB maps. When I watched your last vid I did not even blink an eye about you not showing or talking about magnetic variation considering the distance you were travelling and that you were in the north of England. I used to get the groups I trained to go through the calculations then inwardly giggle as they tried to make the changes to the compass housing! Well done Paul.

[@TheDaveRout]

I used to teach navigation as well, used to wet myself watching them try to adjust the compass

[@deanoboland]

Paul every one who follows your channel knows you are on top of your game. Keep the video’s coming buddy 👍👍👍

[@ethicalbunny]

As someone new to solo hiking this was really interesting! I’d love another video on map reading!😊⛰️

[@AlexanderBratt]

Mate, I love your videos. And I’ve used the exact same method as you have for navigation and it’s never failed me!

[@andreasweber7828]

Paul 1 : 0 Mr Knowitall You’ve just smashed your critics with knowledge

[@philipoakley5498]

I still have old maps (the mountains haven't moved) from the 1970s that had UK declinations of around 12 degrees - fun times. Anyway, it's always best to just think of it as a predetermined 'aim-off' when approaching a catching feature ;-) Other techniques are available. YKMV (your km'age may vary ;-) And that bearing you read off was actually 326 degree's but who cares. no one is moving the bezel!

[@xavierk2422]

Always best to practice a few times in an area that you know. Great video.

[@michaelcapeless3268]

Thank you, Paul. A very worthwhile instruction. I live in a place where the declination calculation is crucial.

[@jimmcgovern2571]

Thanks

[@PaulMessner]

Thank you so much for this.

[@kevinrose7275]

shout out for the Map Reading Company KZbin Channel. Is very good.

[@jackw6617]

I absolutely love this. This is a classic example of a little bit of knowledge gained years ago wrongly applied today! Nice video mate

[@bsquadronguy]

Excellent explanation Paul. As for the "experts" ; EX = a has-been, spurt is a drip under pressure. (Ok, it's better spoken but you get the point!!)

[@GearTutorials]

excellent response Paul. Backing up all your points with sound reasoning and good, well researched explanations. Personally for navigating a distance over a few hundred metres, I wouldn't do it purely from a compass bearing (even in clear visibility). I'd navigate to a distinguishable feature to keep me on track. With Kinder as an example I'd perhaps pickup the kink in a stream bed to confirm my location and then take a second bearing to the next stepping stone/feature and repeat till I've covered that straight line 700m distance. But yes, magnetic declination isn't really a factor in the Peaks

[@hemmingsadventures]

Great explanation. Don't let the pedants get to you. Magnetic variation could be important on some expeditions, but unlikely for the situation you were in. Your inspiration to get out a do something is more important.

[@celticmugwump]

This is the best explanation I have heard of how to use a map and compass so thank you 🙏🏻 I normally only use visual clues and the map but I carry a compass never really knowing how it worked other than it always points roughly north, I always check the weather conditions before I go out and if there’s a chance of fog or mist I just don’t that day 🤷🏻‍♂️ I’m more a fair weather walker and the one time I did get seriously disoriented after hundreds of walks being fine. I simply looked in the distance for signs of civilisation which in this case was a farmhouse, headed straight in that direction where I got a cup of tea a chocolate biscuit and a lift back to my car. I guess the only danger to my life was the sugar in the tea and biscuit 😂 I’m not making light of it but if you don’t have enough savvy to look out for yourself you shouldn’t be out walking, stick to watching you tube videos. Thanks again Paul for all the great stuff you put out.👍

[@alangauld6079]

I was at a presentation by a Lake District Mountain Rescue team last week. One interesting point they made was that it's safer to go out with a compass and no map than vice versa, especially if you know the basic layout of the land before hand. (But you really should bring both!) Of course you do need to know how to use it/them! They also pointed out that the most common navigation mistake is being 180 degrees off - ie using the wrong end of the needle!

[@RabJ123]

@@alangauld6079 the 180 degree error generally occurs when folk take a bearing. Using the edge of the compass it's essential to line up where you are to where you want to go, making sure the arrow on the baseplate of the compass (known as the 'direction of travel' arrow) corresponds with the direction you want to travel and not from your destination to starting point, which would make your resultant bearing 180 degrees incorrect. Placing the white end of the needle in the red arrow in the bezel would also put you 180 degrees out too, unless you had made the error above, when they would cancel each other out. The white end of the needle in 'the shed'' or within the red bezel arrow is used for taking a 'back bearing' to check that the direction of travel arrow points where you have come, from to confirm that you have walked accurately on the desired bearing. It's always best if you can to identify a fixed object on the line of your bearing, i.e. specific rock, and then repeat when you arrive at the rock. Alternatively in featureless ground direct a member of you group forward on the bearing, always remaining in view. Use arm signals (right, left, stop) to put them on the line of the bearing. When you indicate stop, they do not move from the spot, walk to them and repeat. Navigation is not complex but it's important to get the right tuition, building the skills and with plenty of opportunity to practice with a tutor of other competent individual. My experience is as a National Navigation Award Scheme instructor and Mountain Rescue Team Member. As for having no map. In many circumstances one without the other would probably lead to a whole world of pain. Always take a paper map, a compass, know how to use them efficiently and have back up navigation should you lose or damage them. Two is One, One is None.

[@CoherentChimp]

On short distances, the deviation isnt worth worrying about

[@jamesacourt2216]

Good explanation, tbf, if your taking barings your probably in poor visibility conditions and only going a few hundred metres before re checking. So a few degrees here and there aren't going to effect much. You'd be better aiming off rather than being exact. Keep going I love the content.

[@tomhorrill4878]

Great vid Paul. Tell you what is dangerous, keeping a compass in a cupboard for a years and then using it only to find the magnetic North has completely flipped 180°! Easily fixed of course just by walking backwards... Time for a new compass me thinks.

[@roryyoung8150]

I live in Calgary and did not know that. Interesting!

[@Radchenister]

Counting steps and assessing magnetic north, on an English hill, in good visibility, pft, jog on Shackleton. 🤣

[@michaelworrall6804]

Hi Paul … I am a RYA yachtmaster … on the water we only make a magnetic adjustment over much longer distances when navigating by compass only. These days most boaters also now use GPS for prime navigation for course setting and tracking. Over your distance with also visual references you did absolutely nothing wrong !!! 😎

[@chrisholt2474]

Great information Paul, pitched at the correct level for my understanding of map reading, thank you. 👍👍👍

[@stevemarshall6808]

Well done Paul. That post did give me a rise in the manner it was made which is why I commented back. Good to see a positive come out of it in the form of this video 👍

[@jens-kristiantofthansen9376]

9 times out of 10, the compass is more likely to be used to give a so-so bearing anyway. Here in Melbourne the declination is 11 degrees but most hiking is on trails anyway so it's not something you'll need most of the time.

[@EyUpForAdventure]

Fascinating! Thanks Paul. Early in the video I was concerned as I hadn't heard of magnetic declination calculations on my Hill and Mountain Skills course where I learned to take a bearing - then it became clear given I'm in the UK.

[@alasdairclosier8548]

Tbh they should have mentioned it, explained how to use it, and then caveat that at this time in the UK you can disregard it. Having grown up in the south in the 1980s it was an issue and you did have to consider it.

[@alangauld6079]

It's only at the moment. In a few years it will make a difference. And it varies across the country it's not a "UK thing", it varies by several degrees between east and west coasts. Thats why every map has it on and its diffeerent on each one. Unless you plan to stop hiking in the next 5 years or so your course short changed you!

[@maurice5992]

Great to watch, Paul, as always. I've never had any formal training in map-reading myself, watched plenty of videos on the internet/KZbin. However, there's nothing like getting out into the great outdoors and putting the theory into action. Thanks again for all the hard work you put into these videos. Top bloke!

[@TheDaveRout]

For all practical purposes, and especially when using a silva compass, you might as well forget the magnetic variation as the total variation even after many years is less that the error inherent in reading the bearing from the compass.

[@yvonnemassey3658]

Paul, I'm not impressed by the viewers comment but I am glad you shared this video with us. Thank you. Just let Mr. (or Mrs.) smarty pants get lost without a map in the posts on your page. We won't be looking for him/her we will be posting our thanks and gratitude to you for sharing and educating. Safe journeys Paul.

[@RogerRoving]

I’m afraid declination is not the same as deviation, Paul! But you are correct that round here, in Western Europe, compass variation is pretty well zero, just now.

[@CornishColin]

One thing that has caused me some issues is those strong magnets that seems to be appearing in/on outdoor gear now - they are everywhere such as tent flaps, clothes, torches etc. they really mess up your compass - I hate those things ..

[@chaseladdersltd]

Well said Mr Messner ! Very informative video for those of us who don't manage to get out very much and need to refresh our skills. keep up the good work !

[@stuartmorgan9327]

I think of my self as a good navigator (done my ML training and teach DofE Gold). I only teach magnetic declination for gold and say that at the moment it doesn’t really matter. In the 90’s it was about 5 degrees difference. All I would say is that to walk a on bearing you should find something in the distance on the bearing and walk to that. Walking and trying to hold a compass can produce errors. It all depends on how accurate you need to be. Clear day with no major edges - no issue, dense fog striding edge - maybe a little more important. Also GPS technology means we are less reliant on map and compass. When I go walking I take three gps so have backups! Phone, Watch and my Garmin GPS. Good to have the skills though.

[@neildavidson9908]

Aiming off using a linear feature is a good plan

[@andyball9872]

Absolutely no issues with what you did on the video mate. I always round up or down depending on the variation. I’m in Western Australia so we always have a little maths to do. I spent my childhood and teenage years up in the peaks with the scouts, never had to adjust much in the UK from memory. Old mate was just out to start a battle from his keyboard! Keep on doing your stuff mate! I miss your selections of fine ales on your trips…

[@andrewjohnston9115]

It's been a very long time since I had to use a map and compass to orient myself, As a boy I worked very hard to understand how you navigate with map and compass, and its well worthwhile understanding how you do it, but probably more important is to be able to read and understand a map to orient yourself. But for days out GPS is so powerful, yes it can run out of battery, and yes you should back it up with a power pack, map and compass but really if you're on top of your game the GPS will very accurately locate you.

[@GogsDavies]

On my MRT initial assessment, they asked me to take a bearing and then asked about adjustments. Fortunately, the day before I'd read that currently all three Norths were aligned so I rattled off the posh name for this event (which I cannot remember now)

[@markperry222]

Agree, the grid magnetic angle is small, walking exactly on a line on rough terrain is not really possible, pacing distance is pretty inaccurate, and the distances are small. It is worth knowing the grid magnetic angle exists and stashing it in the memory banks, as you might find yourself hiking overseas.

[@lincolnshirehiker]

Kinder looks great at the moment, i haven't been yet this year. Its a while since i relied on a bearing, have to refresh my skills, thanks for the reminder!

[@SunSin91]

I was eating my breakfast watching this and when you read the comment I choked and laughed immediately. Hahaha. I’m a hiking instructor in Norway. 🇳🇴 we do teach magnetic north deviation, but, it’s so small here that it is a non-impact term. There are other things way more important like reading contour lines and finding those lines in the actual terrain that way you don’t need to use the compass constantly. This is how I use compass. Always know where a known hill is and can pin point the degree to the hill and find where you are on the map, called triangulation. Another thing is boating with compass the magnetic north deviation is a lot more important. Eapeciallly in the Atlantic. The further west you get the more deviation you get and you need to compensate otherwise you might end up thousands of km away. But for a 1km trek in Europe, it’s no impact whatsoever.

[@MountainsAndMore]

Great response, maybe when doing some dead reconing across the arctic/desert you would need to be Bob on and adjust for the GMA, but the distance and accuracy of that compass, and given the fact the variance is so small ... its not even worth considering!!!

[@VidsWotIMade]

Declination here (West Cork, Ireland) is currently about 2.25 degrees. Still can't really see that on a small compass, and certainly can't walk that accurately.

[@greenbimoon]

Love your channel Paul. You showed us correctly and well the first time. But Magnetic deviation is not the same as Magnetic declination. Magnetic deviation is the error induced in a compass by local magnetic fields, like the iron in an engine on boats. Use your compass beside your car, then move away, you'll see the needle move. I'm not being negative, just educational. Keep up your great work

[@scotbotvideos]

Good video, Paul, and thanks for the expanded explanation.

[@ollieb9875]

Yeah i think all the norths aligned over Greewich last year and it's not moved far since

[@murk1e]

Failing to account for mag is (ballparking) a few degrees. 1 part in 100. Right now even less. In a kilometre that’s 10m - if visibility is good, plenty good enough (and in poor visibility, i cannot hold a compass that accurately - so will go slow to check i am not going over a cliff)

[@sassyboofle6983]

What on earth !!, you did a fine job there. Dangerous for whom . Maybe that person then themselves needs to look in other countries , maybe . You did a great explanation too . 👍

[@anthonymcdonald8444]

Well done Paul. Everyone who follows you knows you know your stuff.

[@simondickinson4236]

Great response, and video Paul. Keep up the great work.

[@Bikepacking]

I acquired orienteering skills, ie map and compass navigation, during my youth while earning my Duke of Edinburgh Awards at the Bronze, Silver, and Gold levels. Further refinement came through training in the Army Cadets, British Army, and even during my scuba diving education from advanced levels to becoming an instructor. Notably, underwater navigation involves compass use, with magnetic variations taken into account, regardless of distance-a fundamental practice. The essence of the commenter's point is the importance of accurate teaching when teaching such skills to others…Consider including a disclaimer in your videos to safeguard yourself in case someone misinterprets your advice, leading to an accident and potential legal repercussions. It's a practical precaution to protect against unintended consequences and legal issues.

[@mphgps7]

I know last year at Langton Matravers in Dorset true north, grid north and magnetic north all lined up.....Langton being 2 deg west so as far as I'm aware that is the datum for os maps....

[@MrEvilWasp]

Laughing my head off here, Paul. This video is really funny. I love the wit and unbridled sarcasm plus your huge effort not to laugh too much at your would be detractors.

[@williameddy7217]

Great Video Paul... IDK way some people love to over complicate things . You make fantastic videos that are a simple Joy. 😊 God Bless you and Jo

[@thomasmusso1147]

👍👍👍 😳 .. not factoring in 0.6° on a flat plateau .. living on the edge we are! 😁. The declination here by me in Switzerland is + 3° 14' .. which, for the direction determination / map reading that I now generally do, I ignore. That said, in past more active times, in 'featureless' dense Bushveld and such, I took the appreciably greater declination into consideration and when navigating to an intersecting feature (road, river, tree line, clearing, etc), I would deliberately 'err' to one side. On reaching the feature, it was then easier to turn left or right depending on the side of error selected and move on towards the end point. To mitigate the potential danger that you subjected us to, perhaps a mention that one should use the 'RFM Function' aka Read the Manual / Map Directions and follow the advice given therein, would have ameliorated Panic Pete's anxiety 😏. That said, a good reminder that one should consider Declination when relevant and even better, study given map beforehand. A good share, thanks .. take care ..

[@alasdairclosier8548]

Paul, I'd agree context and location important. Declination is a non factor in the UK for the next few years. Your silva compass has an accuracy of a degree, however the protractor on your compass is numbered evenly so the ability to get sub zero minute adjustments would as shown be challenging. The error factor you showed would be within acceptable limits. Important to know, but hardly dangerous when dec is nnear enough zero on Kinder atm 17 mins or so.

[@gordonbennett3393]

Well explained Paul. I've never read a map in my life and I understood all of that.And learned aswell

[@ianrunningforpudding4915]

I remember decllnation being more like 3 degrees many years ago when I did my WGL and ML training. I'm sure most people didn't see your other video as a 'lesson' , some people need to move away from the keyboard. Keep on keeping on Paul. Thanks.