Neurotypical Spouses Tire Over Time: Understanding Caregiver Burnout | Anne MacMillan

[@bluedressandsneakers1194]

Wow, this is incredibly validating. Our marriage counselor told me to ramp up my help & over communicate even more. She gave me all the homework and instructions. She let him off the hook for any and all emotional heavy lifting. I felt so angry and so alone. He refuses to get diagnosed. I went to an asd/nt marriage counselor on my own. She said that if I was going to fight for my marriage, I had to first acknowledge that I would *never* get my emotional needs met by my husband. Ever. We could change the communication a bit, but I would be the one to compensate and compromise. It’s asking so much. So so much.

[@realneurodiverse]

I would love to talk to you. Please visit neurodiversemarriage.com or realneurodiverse.com to schedule a free 30-minute call. I’m so sorry that has happened to you. Many people are telling me the same story about the ND couples’ counseling they’re getting.

[@TheThetruthmaster1]

Well women file for 80% of devorces if it wasn't his autism you'd probably find another way to be the victim. It in your nature.

[@jillatayceramics2542]

So right on the money!

[@dkb713]

i’m so exhausted. My LONG neurodiverse marriage (I stayed for the children) sucked the life out of me. If only I had known before I married him… but I was young/naïve, and he was very well masked. It eventually caught up with us and was really hard on everybody.

[@realneurodiverse]

Here's a hug. I hope you are at a place where you've found some respite.

[@MisaRedd]

Same

[@SB_McCollum]

I watched my parents go thru this except we had no idea that my mother was autistic or that I was. I did all that I could for her after they divorced, but she nearly killed me with all of her needs. For people that are technically "high functioning," the decline over time is difficult for everyone, but it's perceived completely differently by all parties involved. I'm glad to see people at ASD Level 1 being diagnosed more often now, but even late makes for some terrible regrets. "If only I had known..."

[@realneurodiverse]

Thanks for this comment. Yes, this is a very difficult situation for all involved, and often one with tragic consequences. Thanks for sharing your experience. I hope there will be more adequate support in the future. Hug.

[@bettyplayle9363]

Thank you for this. I’m a NT woman who’s married to an autistic man. We discovered what was really going on after we’d been married over 40 years!!! Yes, I’m exhausted and truly welcome your perspective. It’s taken me 4 1/2 years to properly come to terms with the new reality of my situation. I needed to hear your words so thank you again. Please keep posting.

[@marshapaisley6801]

I am in the situation… 50 years… It has only been bad for the past 8 years… God bless you and good luck..🙏💕

[@realneurodiverse]

You're welcome! I will! More is coming.

[@realneurodiverse]

Hug!

[@johnloss5844]

My wife of 40 years was diagnosed with ADHD a couple of years ago, then too, shortly after, our 29 year old son. It’s the hardest thing that’s ever happened to me. I understand that they’re both struggling with identity challenges but our communication is now so difficult and I feel so alone and anxious - in my own family. I’m about to finish a course for carers of people living with emotional dysregulation. It’s called Family Connections. I believe it’s internationally available and I strongly recommend it. Sending strength for you and your family!

[@jillatayceramics2542]

Thank you so much for this, I feel heard in a way that I really needed to hear. Plus you might add that sometimes the caregiver had a trauma based life before the marriage and have exhaustion from that too, since the ASD person doesn't seem to be able to get outside themselves to give back. Anyway, thanks again.

[@realneurodiverse]

@@jillatayceramics2542 Yes, that’s really common. I address it in my neurodiverse family systems programming available through my website. realneurodiverse.com

[@camellia8625]

This is why professional support and proper case management is required on an ongoing basis- there is next to no NHS support for so called high functioning Autistic adults here in the UK.

[@realneurodiverse]

This is one of the biggest issues and possibly impending crises of our time, and yet it gets so little recognition. Hang in there. There is more support today than there was 10 years ago. Hopefully the trend upward will continue. Hug.

[@sin9860]

Thanks for having this video, it does really told exactly how I feel , being together with a Autistic & ADHD partner. From whatever material I can find online regarding to NT-ND relationship, that are always asking NT to accommodate ND more, to adjust their communication better for ND more but... NT are also humans, we will get tired, we will get drained. We want to continue the relationship but if the ND partner couldn't do anything from.theito help themselves or help the relationship, is really hard for us. Thanks for telling out how the NT partner would feel. Really feel validated.

[@ILuvThunderclan]

This is also true for partners of people with adhd. Im pretty sure its been a big factor in the ending of my last two relationships. I hate feeling like the other person feels that they need to take care of me, I try so hard to keep that from happening, but ive had no success. I just feel like a burden and that maybe im better off alone.

[@jflowers41]

I hate feeling like a burden, drain and annoying to anyone in my life. Videos like this make me feel hopeless to ever being in a relationship again and that my undiagnosed autism was a contributing factor of the destruction of my 25 year marriage. I hate feeling like my autism makes me unlovable. That’s what I feel like society is telling me. It sucks.

[@realneurodiverse]

I am sorry it is so difficult. I am thinking hard about what resources to create for autistics that will make their lives easier instead of harder.

[@realneurodiverse]

I am sorry it is so hard. Here is a hug.

[@TheThetruthmaster1]

Women initiate80 % of breakups so if it's not autism it will be so thing else. That something else is you ☝🏽

[@EshaBby444]

This is the most validating video ive come across so far for NT spouses WOW.

[@realneurodiverse]

I’m sorry that there is so little available right now. More to come!

[@TheThetruthmaster1]

Well if it wasn't his asperges you'd find sometime. You do know women leave 80 % of the time. Sorry you where so abused by a person with a mental handy cap. 🤨 .

[@Aaron-tm9ez]

Thank you for this video. My wife 65 with a epiphany and then a formal diagnosis of level 1 spectrum.non bi polar, non adhd was a relief after 14 years of marriage. Character judgement left instantly. I apologize and let her know I want to help. We are in the beginning of this challenge with knowledge but no practical way to make transitions easier or understanding she has had this in utero.she is angry and sad and disappointed. She is also glad that she knows……for now I’ve been off balance in some areas since we met. I love her and my life is better with her I feel she is tiring and masking is less important…..double edged sword. I get less considering on a range of issues. First therapy session today …… I joined a support group for my self first meet is June 20

[@realneurodiverse]

I hope things are going well and you’re getting the support you need.

[@my-rocket]

I am the ASD Spouse. We have two young adults, ASD children. When we got married, awareness of Neuro, diverse relationships was limited. A friend gave us a book titled “the silicon syndrome“. It basically described Nuro diverse couples frequently found in Silicon Valley. It has been my experience that much of the stress and strain experienced by the typical partner is from the effort of attempting to fix or correct the ASD partner. This experience matches what I have heard from other ASD’s partners. My ASD father allowed my mother free reign in her attempts to fix us. That brought a special level of hell to my childhood. When I saw my wife and trying to force our children to be more normal, I had to step in to protect them. She could not fathom an ASD person being successful while unfixed. I made enough space for them to find themselves, and become far more successful in their lives than she thought was possible. I do realize my spouse feels exhausted. So do we. I 27 years of protecting your self from being fixed is traumatic.

[@realneurodiverse]

This all makes a lot of sense. Does your wife have any resources available to support her?

[@my-rocket]

@@realneurodiverse funny you should ask. I put her through 10 years of graduate school to get her PhD in neuroscience, then supported her for 6 years of post-doc slavery. Her specialty was perfecting ways to torture lab rats to give them PTSD so other scientists could find ways to cure PTSD. It turned out the most effective treatment paled in comparison to just not causing it. Depending on your situation, you may face different challenges. If your ASD spouse has difficulty operating in the world, that’s not where my experience lies. I found that understanding each other’s love languages as essential. There’s also anxiety and stress languages you each should be aware of.

[@my-rocket]

@@realneurodiverse the challenge of emotional connection with ASD partners is hitting that 5:1 ratio of positive to negative messaging. After a lifetime of criticism, complaints, and corrections, ASD partners desperately need peace. My NT spouse could work up a load of anxiety over the non NT behavior my sons and I have. I understand that girls are told that fitting in is essential to life success. It also galls her to no end that we didn’t meet her expectations and are, by most measures of our peers, wildly successful. It it possible to work in fields where strong people skills are associated with limited technical competence AND be well compensated. Perhaps it’s an issue of him not “getting it”. As my wife’s career became more dependent upon using computers, and she didn’t “get them”, and we had a few encounters where I expressed my frustration that she didn’t just “get it”, we finally had a model for a situation where I just got something, and she was utterly baffled by what my people can do effortlessly.

[@camellia8625]

@@realneurodiversehow about some empathy for the ASD poster.

[@realneurodiverse]

@@camellia8625 Everyone needs support. It is a very tough situation. The question I asked is for the poster. It was not intended to demonstrate lack of empathy. I hope he comes back to answer. If his wife gets support for her exhaustion, things may improve for everyone. It sounds to me like she needs support understanding how to better deal with the situation, no?

[@strictnonconformist7369]

Currently in commercials before a movie in the theater and I'll watch this later. I've never been married, over 50, autistic/ADHD and from my POV I've had to mask all my life around everyone, or not mask and stand out or points in between while an NT has time and space away from an ND, and I'd wager never has to mask: I guess (before viewing this video) I can't say I see this as being more than NTs whining about what they thought they had and would have for life, as opposed to the truth. The thing is, masking is all about survival in the realm of NTs because of their nature of going out of their way to destroy by any means necessary everyone that doesn't conform to their irrational self-righteous demands. Am I bitter? If you had always had to watch out for it knowing no matter how hard you try to not do anything to offend someone merely by existing, and still being a target, based on a long painful history of bullying and abuse, can you honestly tell me you wouldn't feel the same? I doubt it. (Edited due to finding a couple mistakes provided by autocorrect)

[@realneurodiverse]

I am guessing I might feel the same about it if I had an autistic brain, depending on how well I could comprehend systems, maybe.

[@rhonmc2782]

But marriage deserves honesty. I understand why you mask but masking to a would-be life partner and after a couple if years taking the mask off can be a death blow to the NT. She married someone who she accepted as the type of person she wanted to spend her whole life with. But trust me, when she sees truly the ND partner emerge, I'd she's lucky they'll have a diagnosis quickly so BOTH can get help and learn to navigate their new life. The NT especially will have to realise most of the work will be needed to be done by her as the ND ofter just can't change and mindblindness, inability to emotionally connect and poor communication skills (not all Nd will have all these though) she is the only one who can navigate the ship. If unfortunately like us, we only found out at 42 yrs married, it was too late. I had already been destroyed by mental health problems caused by the NT/ND dynamics. He too now I see, suffered was lacked the ability to communicate that so withdrew in silence. We both not only suffered but literally destroyed each other physically and mentally so much so that only death not far off awaits each now we are totally cut off from each other ever talking or seeing again. It also destroyed our family. So in answer to your remark about the NT wringing and how the ND has it worse because of the masking, I ask you this: when the masking ND man marries, he KNOWS his soon to be wife all good points and flaws. He makes the choice on the truth he sees in her. However, if he masks before marriage, how fair is it that she isn't granted the same clarity of the character of her ND mate? Basically, she marries with blinkers on and one hand tied behind her back. True nd honesty are foundations of relationships but it does not exist when one is masking and hiding a lie. I totally understand why one would mask to someone they were attracted to because they want to be with them. Wouldn't it be better though to let them see and still possibly love the ND partner BEFORE marriage. Everyone has a right to freely choose rhe best fit for them. Too often, the NT is denied that basic right because she is really being deceived by the false mask. Of course it's even header when the ND man doesn't have a clue he's on the spectrum. We were robbed of a life by not having a diagnosis. It wasn't my fault nor was it his fault we ended so badly. No one's fault. Had we known life would have been so different. I believe we could have had a happy marriage as I now see so many things that hurt me were not meant like that and all the criticism he got and his inability to understand why I was hurting and sliding into mental decline hurt him because he had no idea how to help (even though I tried to show him). 4 lives literally destroyed. Us and 2 daughters. The one mistake I did make was not to have left 10 years after married (but couldn't) because had it been possible then BOTH of us and our 2 girls would have had lives worth living instead of now in old age alone, both waiting for death and never really have had a chance to really live 😢

[@masonrowell9088]

@@rhonmc2782 The only issue here is you assume the ND would even have the ability to truly understand or know you well enough to sign up for that lifetime partnership, or that he would even realize he was masking (lots of guys are going to put their best foot forward while dating). Also this, kzbin.info/www/bejne/lZKvo6yLiNhkisU

[@rhonmc2782]

@@masonrowell9088 You are 100% correct about everything you said. For that matter, don't we all put our best foot forward initially - the version of ourselves we want to be both NT and ND. I appologise for my post. I didn't even read it again. It's not his fault his brain is wired differently, I'm just so sad neither of us knew until too late in our 70s. By that time we had destroyed each other. Him 100% avoidance and me the pursuer. He was hurt and damaged by me too because he couldn't communicate and I was mis-interpritting his silences and long periods of isolating. And he couldn't understand why I was upset and felt rejected etc etc not good enough erc etc. How tragic we were both feeling the same unloved, unwanted, seld-blame, useless about our own selves at the same time and neither of us realised that about the other. It was his 79th birthday yesterday on NY Eve and we haven't had any contact since March 7th (and won't ever again because courts have prohibited contact for 5 yrs. By then at least one of us will be dead). I write this laying in my bed unable to leave it for weeks now. Deep mourning for the most wonderful, gentle soul I could have hoped to find in life. But life was cruel. We didn't know we were differently wired. We had no-one to help us understand each other. All those missed beautiful times and such painful suffering ones. I wish I could go back even 10 years knowing what I know now and try to show him how special he was, try to help him understand it was no-ones fault that we hurt each other so. In fact, neither even knew we were hurting each other. He will never understand though. He doesn't have the intellectual capacity to grasp it (have tried telling him but failed). He'll go to his grave believing there was something wrong with him since early in his life but more-so being so flawed, he could see my pain but could do nothing to help so shoulders a lot of self blame especially since I tried to take my life twice over particularly traumatic events. Again all misunderstanding. I wish I could give him peace. Then again, he probably does have a lot now and will soon be fully at peace for he was never one to look backwards and often erased things from memory those he wished to easily. It is I that am left so broken I'm medically unable to heal (mental health destroyed). If I had a wish, I want to know if he misses me at all and the answer was yes. We did love each other but just couldn't live together not knowing about ND relationships. Our biggest mistake was to hold on for 42 years. And other people precipitated a lot of our bad times unfairly. Tears falling now, heart aching can't let go and body in physical pain laying in bed so long with so little food punishing myself with a grief that will never abate.

[@maggierestivo5256]

Thank you for saying this. As an autistic woman who realized she was autistic very late in life, this video creeped me out. It felt like an apology for any NTs who might abuse their autistic family members. (Sorry if I misunderstood, but that is how I viewed this video.)

[@Plethorality]

Nt brains can get worse over time, too.

[@realneurodiverse]

Definitely!

[@see4182]

No truer words.... It's exhausting my GD constantly trying to reassure her ASD husband she's not going to leave him. Telling him if she hasn't by now, she's not going to doesn't even work. It's like he forgets. Not even his therapist can figure out what triggers these bouts of panic. They have tried many suggested "solutions" over the last ten years, but none seem to work.

[@realneurodiverse]

[@lizardme88]

My advice is to reach out to family and friends to help. Invite them into your home to see the challenges the nt spouse is experiencing first hand. It frees the nt spouse to have a break away from the regular daily routine.😊

[@janetebonanno]

where have you been? The only advice I have found advice from ‘ND’ prospective

[@realneurodiverse]

Hello! I'm back! Sorry I have been away for so long. I've got a new website up and I'm revamping my old online course. My clients have been pestering me to get out her again for a while and I'm finally listening. Thank you for your support!

[@chrisgames6613]

What can a NT do if a high functioning autistic can not accept their situation?

[@RLCinGA]

Where does the NT wife find help and support?

[@janetebonanno]

Yes? Help us! We have no safe harbor

[@realneurodiverse]

@@janetebonanno and @Ona Journey I'm am working on creating more resources. More coming soon. For now, you can see what I have at neurodiversemarriage.com/ Yes... a safe harbor... that's necessary.

[@GoodBeets4ME]

I am ND with an NT spouse and we both have learned, long ago, that we are partners, friends and lovers and that neither of us is responsible to meet the others emotional or any other needs. We must do our own work and then meet and share and support. We practice boundries which can all change over time. We practice showing up. And we are lucky we still have the hots for each other. Finding out I was ND has been a huge relief for both of us as it answers so much and I am much kinder to myself/using less energy in shame and harsh thoughts.

[@realneurodiverse]

Wow Jennifer. This is a message that would support a lot of other autistics. You are so spot on. Thank you for writing this comment!

[@akferren1]

Leave.. plan an escape

[@TheGenbox2]

One answer - stop patronising AS folk like they are children / being the eternal martyr . If you the NT is tired, then what do you think the person with AS is - they are equally tired of you, and feeling they are the one needing the adjustments. Cultural bound expectation play more than a small part, so that two folk in the therapy chair, not just he AS person and you learning what wrong with their communication style. Cassandra Syndrome is problematic in that it often tries to fix the AS person, and not the marriage itself. Cassandra Syndrome doesn't exist - that's the nature of syndromes - they are a compound of many things, often including culture bound expectations (and thus disappointment) and you can't fix anything other than a graze with a sticking plaster applied to one person. We all can be guilty of this blinding of ourselves until the scales fall from our eyes, as the chemistry and perceived 'needs' take over; but AS isn't something that just pops up - if it surfaces cos of the inevitable duress of life's trials (sometimes self-applied), it was there at the beginning - you just didn't to see it, or think it was important.

[@realneurodiverse]

Thanks for this comment. The extreme differences in perspective about what’s going on due to the very different ways the brains function is why I suggest that the ND couple’s counseling model doesn’t work. The non-autistic partner can’t survive through continual accommodation and the autistic partner can’t survive through continual masking.

[@realneurodiverse]

Also, no one going into these relationships could have predicted the way the neurological differences would have created these dynamics. It’s important not to go into the past and blame. A better strategy, I think, is to decide what to do in the present given the reality of the incompatibility.

[@LolaB82]

It’s much more complicated than that. Many NT folks recall their partner being very attentive in the beginning and then things falling off due to the “ special interest” of the relationship becoming boring for them. Also there are many people who high in empathy because they grew up in complicated family situations where their emotional needs were not being met and so the familiar unavailability of a AS person feels familiar to them. This is definitely not a situation where any one person is to blame it’s a difficult situation for both. I find myself in that one myself. And I can say one thing for sure people entering into a relationship gotta do their own therapy and work on themselves before they consider marriage.

[@dillchives]

NT people usually like the relationships until the autistic person finally decides they're going to stop continually compromising to the NT's "needs" (demands), and actually gets the courage to ask for something for themselves (which is something autistic people are definitely not used to doing). As soon as they ask for something, the NT person declares them selfish and tries to rub in their face all of the (uncommunicated) expectations they have been saving up in their heads that the autistic partner didn't know they were supposed to be meeting. If the autistic person tries to explain their point of view, then they're called combative or defensive or impossible to work with. No matter what, NT people love to blame others when things don't go exactly how they expect.

[@Desmondbrown73]

There is no such thing as a neurotypical spouse..if someone is on the spectrum i guarantee that their spouse is as well, nervous systems /adrenaline glands Control who you choose

[@realneurodiverse]

That is a very large claim.

[@Desmondbrown73]

@@realneurodiverse Why don’t you look into it for us? I already know it’s true

[@realneurodiverse]

@@Desmondbrown73 Well…. because it is impossible for one thing like that to be 100% true for all cases in the whole world. There is much too much variety in humans and human behavior for any one thing like that to always be true. That’s why I said it was a large claim. It’s such a large claim that it has to be false. It could be possible for a large percentage of ASD people to be married to other ASD people based on your reasoning, though… just not 100%. Also, I’ve already looked into it. I did my own quantitative research on ASD and marriage. I can’t remember exactly how many couples participated in my study, but I do remember that only 3 of them were ASD-ASD couples. The vast majority were ASD-NT couples. I also had several NT-NT controls. What the numbers actually showed is that the NT people who married ASD people had, in general, a lower level of ASD traits than the general NT population.

[@Desmondbrown73]

@@realneurodiverse You just said you couldn’t prove it then you said you could prove it by typing out several paragraphs.. Who the hell are you to be giving anybody advice currently, you don’t even know what the hell you’re talking about😂 ‘normal’ people end up with normal people

[@realneurodiverse]

@@Desmondbrown73 It’s impossible for the large claim of 100% of all couples with level 1 autism in the world to be the same in one particular way. So that claim has to be false. That said, statistics and science can help us test hypotheses like yours. We don’t ever learn anything about everybody in the whole wide world when testing these hypotheses, though, because that would be impossible, like I said. But we can learn about -generalities-. In general, NT people who self-select to marry ASD people have a lower level of autism traits than the general population of NT people. That doesn’t mean all of them do, just that the difference in levels of autism traits among people who self-select to marry ASD and those who choose to marry other NTs is statistically significant. And the NTs who marry ASDs have lower levels of autism traits in general. One hypothesis worth testing might be whether or not their very low level of autism traits means they can be considered another neurodivergent population. If so, their neurodivergence wouldn’t be autism, though, because their level of autism traits is all the way on the other side of the autism trait bell curve. Some people call them “extreme neurotypicals.” I prefer the term “high-body-empathy neurodivergents,” although I am not sure what criteria, if any, are being used to decide if a brain difference is considered a “neurodivergence,” or, frankly how any hypothesis that this group of people might be considered “neurodivergent” would be testable. Someone would have had to define exactly what makes one group of people neurodivergent and another group not neurodivergent.