NEVE CONSOLE EMULATION PLUGINS .. Do they actually have that 'NEVE SOUND' ??

NEVE CONSOLE EMULATION PLUGINS .. Do they actually have that 'NEVE SOUND' ??
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SSL CONSOLE SHOOTOUT PART 1
• SSL CONSOLE EMULATION ...
LINDELL 80 CHANNEL (plugin alliance mega bundle) vs Slate digital VCC (slate digital all access pass) vs acustica audio GOLD 4 (convolution sampling).. and also the noiseash need 33102 console eq
Is Michael Brauer's mixing technique of hybrid mixing with running his analog hardware through the brainworx ssl console plugin emulation actually a way of recreating the sound of an analog console?
Or can Steven Slate's console emulation and acustica audio plugins give more or less the same of that rupert neve analog vibe when mixing in the box in your home studio 2021.
No music production tutorials or audio engineering 101 needed here just really simple .. pass your audio plugin chain through the console plugin and see how the console linear frequency response and harmonics add up and change the sound of your mix .. for the better or worse.. ill let you be the judge of whether your finished mix sounds like its been mixed and mastered in a professional recording studio.
In terms of the video dialogue / voice over microphone I am using Audio technica AT2050 (vocals) through the audient id14 audio interface.

[@PaulThird]

www.patreon.com/mixingwedesdays?fan_landing=true Remember to check out the patreon if you want to help invest in the future hardware vs digital shootouts 🤓

[@eaccin]

Hi Paul, thanks for the test! There's a bump in volume on the second half of the music that kinda makes the comparison a bit more difficult. I can pick the differences but it changes the focus of my listening a little. if I may suggest as well it would be cool if in the same example you could shorten the musical excerpt to just 1 bar and do like a quick comparison. cheers

[@photicsonar]

I was also blown away when I heard the NoiseAsh stuff recently; a good companion for my AA Arsenal ;))

[@PaulThird]

Totally.. I just wish they did more... However a little birdie told me they have more products in development right now 😉

[@JedBayes]

I still prefer Gold here! (I have a good bit of experience tracking on a 8068) Everything is just slightly more defined, owns its own space, and just sounds familiar. But the Need does have the thick part of the Neve sound. I think a both/and situation would yield very nice results. 👍🏻

[@PaulThird]

Yeah these things are completely subjective. Personal almost.

[@thisbusinessofmusic1276]

What I did to get a good console sound is I kept my old Soundcraft Spirit Auto 32 X 8 mixer ( not the plastic one ) and dedicated 24 channels of one of my MOTU 24 I/O's, to route audio out of the DAW thru the mixer and back into the DAW sort of like a Dangerous 2 Buss. Works like a charm and ( can you believe it ) it sounds just like a Soundcraft mixer. Thats one way to get authentic Console sound. I use the other 8 channels on the mixer as input channels to record into the DAW so theres 8 Soundcraft preamps with EQ, as a front end. You can pick one of these up for well under a Grand Canadian. I just leaned it against the wall out of the way.

[@aisharpproductions1351]

You're the only KZbinr that posts videos that I ALWAYS comment on! LOL I have 8-channels of 31102 Vintage Neve pres/eq at my studio. I will never sell, as they are worth a lot and will only gain value! A year ago, I did a comparison with Tim P's library vs Noise Ash's and they were very close to the hardware. VERRRY close. Tim P's Blue 1102 won in realism, from my memory, but they were neck and neck. I am still impressed by Noise Ash's attention to detail. It's definitely on par or better than the other Neve emulations.

[@rumar4u]

I have the Lindell 80 and found that you need to control the gain Input (in the top) to +5db and -5db in the output to have that "Neve" sound along with a THD of about 10 - 20

[@mrnelsonius5631]

I use the Lindell 80 on just about every project. It’s definitely quite sensitive to gain staging, and I think that’s part of why it feels so analogue to me using it haha. Still one of my favorite ITB color plugins

[@PaulThird]

I still Really like it. Was just the width in the guitars that pushed me towards the other 2

[@PaulThird]

I found the oversampling to be VERY important with the Lindell just like in the 50 channel

[@thePunkRockMix]

YES - i cant believe it! this sounds really like a neve! THANK YOU SO much! First time i had that feeling with an analog modeld pre-amp-plugin :) this is christmas für my radio-productions!!!

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@catlikemeteor]

I use the Lindell 80 then the brainworx 2098 EQ with mid/side to add width on the master + Townhouse compressor. Sounds fantastic.

[@edsavage6214]

Nice one again Paul, Noise Ash sounds really nice, I didn't know it either, I think I still prefer what Gold did to the low end though, Noise Ash has nice mids though :P

[@PaulThird]

I'm a guitarist so the noiseash was always gonna win for me 😜

[@edsavage6214]

@@PaulThird ahahah bloody guitarists, turn down that guitar! XD Do you hear what I mean though on the bass guitar?

[@peterbondmusic]

As someone who's used real Neve gear, and mixed extensively on a Neve VR (same family as the 88), the UAD Neve 88RS (latest version) is astoundingly good sounding, you should check that out.

[@kyleconklin1472]

I'm somewhat fascinated that while Gold seemed almost as dull as VCC, that it still seemed more realistic as far as harmonics go and frequency response, and also didn't devolve into dull mud like VCC. The Lindell 80 seemed brighter, but it didn't sound very realistic, almost like someone just threw a basic static curve with a slightly upper mid shelf. The Noise Ash though sounds really good, but I am finding I like it the most since its the brightest, however Gold overall just has more punch. As much as I love Gold (and will keep using it), the Lindell 80 and NoiseAsh are great contenders, however, the big determiner was Gold was the only one to have the proper analogue stereo image and that organic punch. The rest just seemed pretty static, and some lost intelligibility which was shocking for some advanced algos.

[@PaulThird]

I agree the stereo image is something the Acustica nails every time. It's just a shame that the noiseAsh doesn't have any tolerance options. The slate mud thing I'm unsure if it's possibly aliasing but I doubt it. Maybe just a build up of a certain frequency. There was just something in the noiseAsh that done it for me. Excitement maybe 🤔

[@kyleconklin1472]

@@PaulThird Before I got into N4, I had been using VCC (and all Slate products) for many years, and while very good at the time, I have noticed that they have some truly steep compromises when it comes to not just accuracy in modeling, but rather the limitations they have to impose in order to keep their products optimized for use across and entire mix. A lot of the compromises are in simplifying the harmonic modeling, so instead of having harmonics that are nonlinear and reflective of the hardware that isn't going to have a consistent pattern in the order or harmonics and intensity, you'll generally just see them generated from a certain fundamental frequency per model/unit, and calculated to continue infinitely, until they hit the Nyquist, and then they are low pass filtered off like everything else. So it's not so much aliasing, which is quite rare to find in modern digital modeling, but the density of harmonic content and Frequency response curves. Now I am not saying Slate VCC is unusable, or terrible, however it does result in a lot of mud and in turn a lot more work in the mix to bring back clarity and depth. The Lindell 80 with the TMT did a very good job with varying this response and having a more accurate harmonic spread and density. Gold has significantly less harmonics, but as said earlier the stereo image is more "analogue" and the harmonics, frequency response, and stereo image are all more accurate to the hardware modeled. While the NoiseAsh is also very good, listening again with fresh ears, I can definitely it is very HOT and pushed Neve sounds, lots of brightness and crispness. It truly comes down to taste, and I do plan on getting the Noise Ash strip in the future for lighter mixes on the go or potentially primarily ITB recording since it has that sizzle and excitement.

[@PaulThird]

I agree. Its all down to taste and understanding what mixes will benefit from a certain sound. Always amazes me that the big engineers knew the consoles that well that they would know which console in which studio they would use to mix. That's the kind of experience you can't buy these days

[@georginikolov1141]

@@PaulThird vcc turns anything into mood all of the consoles inside one of them was stolen from Alex b and it was actually broken samples

[@aljames7345]

Proud to support you fellow Scott.

[@PaulThird]

🤜🤛

[@DanAdlingtonOnline]

I own the LINDELL 80 CHANNEL and I like it a lot. My go to for Neve Sound is Universal Audio for their Neve 88RS. I have all of UA Neve plugins and I love the sound. I totally understand you have to have the hardware to run it that is why it wasn't featured. I know this is personal taste but Slate digital VCC and acustica audio GOLD 4 DIDN'T jump out at me as must buys.

[@PaulThird]

The VCC neve is something I'll never touch again. The noiseash I'm definitely thinking of buying now though 🤓

[@stupidusername38]

Hi Paul, could you try the Analog Obsession line of Brit plugins they are all Neve emulations

[@PaulThird]

I'll see if I can maybe fit one into the TimP neve eq video. But that won't be for a wee while yet

[@rodeointblud]

Noise Ash is a company of Turkish coders that have nothing to do with sound engineering. They just made plug-ins from pieces of code from different plugins.

[@ainnelrosirrosias3338]

What you mean? Can you elaborate. Cheers

[@mrmorpheus9707]

Understanding the diff in the technology..CONVOLUTION IS LIKE THE ACTUAL PHOTO... ALGORITHM IS LIKE THE PAINTING...OF THE PHOTO!!!

[@PaulThird]

100% 👌

[@EdwinDekker71]

Love the 80 channel 😍 edit: to me the.lows, esp the kick images the best on the 80

[@PaulThird]

🤓

[@jaimersalcido]

Great video as usual Paul! Thanks for that!

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@sixstring3639]

The Need 31102 sounds fantastic. It's a pity that the GUI matters. The Lindell looks so good so you spend more time looking at it then listen to it. So I guess I'll end up with the Lindell (and force myself to think it sounds better. ;) Great show. Thanx.

[@PaulThird]

Theres a new comparison coming next week.. 80 series console neve shootout (Lindell, need & the new blackbird plug that came out) Over a full mix.. As if it couldn't get any harder haha 😜

[@intelligenceservices]

how about doing a null test and listen to the difference with phases inverted?

[@cosmicsands4295]

Acustica bloody nail that stereo width hey! The NoiseAsh is delightful though.

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@rickdomina]

Fantastic page you have. Top shelf. Have you tried the waves NLS summing system or the Plugin Alliance BX N console across the whole mix?

[@PaulThird]

Yeah tried the NLS stuff and found it to be an aliasing mess. Wasn't for me personally

[@stupidusername38]

im listening on crappy earbuds and whilst i couldn't hear much difference in the first test when you then compared the Gold to the Noise Ash the difference was apparent. It had more body and bite to the guitars

[@PaulThird]

Yeah it's very noticeable in the guitars

[@bighousemusic628]

Noiseash need next gold my my so close to the hardware R.I.P Rupert neve thanks for these priceless treasures

[@PaulThird]

It's great to hear somebody say its close to the hardware 🤓🤓🤓

[@travisraab]

Love the video! I'm sure I'd fail a double blind test but I think i'm too old school. I know we are beyond that point, but it's more like a psychological thing. For instance, I'd rather use a cheaper tube amp than plug straight into a kemper, knowing that I'm micing up a real amp, with all it's imperfections. Of course, if it's a job, then I need to use whatever tools get the job done, whether they are analog or emulations. But these plugins aren't cheap. I worry about where my investment of this plugin will be 10 years from now, or what would the slate subscription even cost over 10 years. Will it still work? But if all you need to do is add it to your track (and not turn any knobs as you say) and affordably gives you a neve sound, can't really argue with that!

[@azamat19]

Paul you are the man. Loved the noiseash. What pre did u put on the master on the noiseash? Unfortunately only lindel, slate and gold have a bus plugin. I wish uad and noiseash had them too.

[@benjamin_hill]

Just listened to the last comparison, sounds like the NoiseAsh is pushing the mids a bit vs the others. I’d be interested to hear the Gold with a slight bump on the 500-1khz range in comparison, as it seemed to be more aligned to the eq of the source material.

[@travisraab]

good ears!

[@PaulThird]

Possibly just the difference in the consoles they modelled.. Maybe the differences between a 3060 and a 31102 🤔

[@benjamin_hill]

@@PaulThird not sure, but I think that a bump in the upper mids perhaps going into gold might give a somewhat similar result to what I was hearing in the NoiseAsh.

[@PaulThird]

I need to have a look at the noiseAsh in plugin doctor 🤓

[@marsrivers]

I love my lindell 80.

[@mrnelsonius5631]

Interesting comparing the Lindell to Gold. I LOVE the Lindell 80, but I’ve never even considered putting it on every track (like is often the case with console plugins) for most of the music I do. Because of the narrower width thing, and where the harmonic excitement seems to be centered in the mids. I almost always use it on Vocals, sometimes all the vocals. Mainly things I want centered and rich as opposed to punchy/wide/spacious. Anyway, I hadn’t consciously thought about why I use it like I do. Just went with what I liked, and this shootout brought some more explanation as to why my instincts moved me that direction

[@PaulThird]

I'm away to do a neve eq shootout soon.. Ish with the Lindell 80 (ensuring oversampling 😉) , timP, noiseash etc as I need to do another test on the lindell 80 after this haha

[@mrnelsonius5631]

@@PaulThird I’ll be here for it! Love your channel. It’s peak content for me, the shootouts and the blind tests. Feel like I’m getting some ear training with my plugin lust 😂

[@PaulThird]

Haha 😜

[@danepaulstewart8464]

New comment on an old video, but it’s still current when you consider the offerings. QUESTION: On the Need - are we sure they’re not just doing some mid-side processing that is adding the sense of width? The stereo spread function on the Brainworx plug-ins sounds very similar when used only just a wee bit.

[@100states6]

Oh that Need!!! Downloading....

[@PaulThird]

😉😉😉😉

[@100states6]

@@PaulThird, do you need any other coloring EQ than the Need?

[@PaulThird]

Not even tried the EQ yet haha 😅

[@curtisburns]

100% agree about the Slate. I went from Slate to Lindell and I'm much happier with my mixes.

[@PaulThird]

I still dont why I still pay the monthly slate subscription. Genuinely not used it for like 6-8 month 😅

[@johnisrael5183]

My best advice to EVERYONE is to mixdown first with Nebula and Acustica Audio...with some analog gear and mix and bounce each bus through the analog gear level mix the new analog mix...then decide what plugins are going to work after you have a good analog static mix......then you can just choose whatever plugins sound better on your analog mix with vocals...and thats how people like Jason X are getting great mixes in the box...because all the stems are analog that he's working with...then whatever digital plugins...or Acustica Audio or Nebula you know how to use the best will work.... Example....its starting to seem like..the Townhome bx SSL comp..is the best SSL Comp vst on a "Analog Mix" plugins act completly different on Analog Procsesed busses than they do on Digital Processed busses

[@cmopro]

NEVE Preamp sound...SKNOTE Marconi 1...it's awesome

[@PaulThird]

🤓

[@dirkchurlish4074]

there's a bass lover at noiseash. who is it?? paul, you would really appreciate airwindows dark. you need a wrapper to run it in protools but seriously. if you like what the noiseash is doing here, it's gonna be your favorite dither. and you should always be dithering to 24 bit!

[@PaulThird]

I'm actually gonna try out his console plugin very soon. I watched his YT video and sounds very interesting. He takes audio geekness to another level haha

[@dirkchurlish4074]

@@PaulThird aw console is amazing. don't think of it as a replacement for any other console plugins (aka saturators). keep those on if you like what they're doing for you. and be sure the consolebus plugin is seeing peaks between -6 dBFS and 0 dbFS. if peaks exceed 0 dBFS, you'll hear a nasty, clicky kind of clipping, and if the signal is too quiet, the 3D effect will be inaudible. best versions to try in my opinion are console6, c5raw, and console7. remember, no gain changes on the faders and no panning (except hard LCR). you must migrate soft pans and fader moves to a trim plugin preceding consolechannel to preserve the gain structure correctly. not disastrous if you break that gain structure, just won't sound quite as intended. and you must test by mixing multiple channels. single channel through consolechannel and consolebus will have virtually no effect. truly a summing emulation!

[@edukacja2485]

My God that Noise Ash is crazy good... But I'm curious how it'll compare to other 33102 style channel strips, that might be where the sonic differences really come from. AFAIK in AA Gold you can choose too which type of pre and eq are you using - is it either 1073 style or 33102. But in terms of width and being more 3d the Noise Ash is really a killer plugin. And the most shocking thing for me was how switching plugins was almost changing a volume balance. This actually might be the trick if you've done a mix and your client says "I need more kick, snare and bass, and less guitars" 😂 In terms of 1073 I do really prefer Lindell 80 over Gold because of that extra bit of chime. I'm really happy using it, but I've started considering how it compares to Softube British Class A - both are modelled after similar signal chain but British Class A offers mid band twice and is meant to use with Console 1... I have to figure out a way to test British Class A without having the actual Console 1 controller...

[@PaulThird]

I tried out all the channel strip pre's in the gold review I done a long time ago and couldn't really hear a real audible difference to he honest so the console sound of the gold is just kinda the sound of the gold. I was really disappointed when I tried it out as I expected some big differences but very subtle. I think the UAD would get the closest to the noiseAsh

[@edukacja2485]

@@PaulThird So if there was so little difference for you then I won’t even notice it 😂 Unfortunately all AA plugins are not working on my hackintosh system for some reason so I can’t try it myself... And UAD really can be the closest but it’s also the most expensive one... I’m curious to hear the difference is it even worth the extra money for plugin and another extra money for their outdated hardware... From what my friends told me (who actually have UAD) UAD have that warmth sound character that is hard to find anywhere else, it feels more analog, but again for extra money twice...

[@nickhyder9141]

I have Lindell and Britson. I use Studio One so wonder if their 'console shaper' crosstalk does everything these console emulations do?

[@PaulThird]

I've been told their console shaper is extremely good so I'd imagine its on par with sonimus

[@marsrivers]

Paul...have you tried the Overlouds eq84???? It sounds amazing. Love the lindell but I dont like it saturation

[@PaulThird]

I think I did and really didn't like it. Pretty sure it's in the overloud video

[@nexusobserve]

(In response to old videos sounding like an mp3, yeah there is something going on here. Maybe it's time to use soundcoud links)

[@PaulThird]

yeah you are 100% right. i think need to start having 2 sources of audio. I have a sound cloud account so I can use that just so I can ensure if the YT codec is playing up for whatever reason I'm covered :)

[@nexusobserve]

@@PaulThird would be crazy if soundcloud links could play on the YT video with annotations or something!

[@jawneetest]

can you compare the NOISE ASH to the BLUE 1102 Tim Pethrik

[@PaulThird]

Coming in the near future 🤓

[@allpdmusic]

Hey Paul... I put the Noise Ash and the Lindell side by side.on an acoustic gtr track. What I did was use the settings for the Ac Gtr preset on the NoiseAsh and mimicked those same settings the Lindel 80 and the Lindell was fatter (bassier maybe) sounding. Even after level matching. I know this video is a few months old but are you still liking the NoiseAsh?

[@PaulThird]

Problem Lindell has is that he never added a double mid band which is where the noiseAsh has the upper hand. Seems everybody is adding in an extra mid band these days with the 3 band neve stuff. I find I'm always needing it. HiQ is handy in the need as well. The problem is as awesome as the Iindell sounds its pretty limiting in comparison to other neve eq's

[@allpdmusic]

@@PaulThird my situation is this... I'm about to stop my subs to both PA and Slate and learn to use what I OWN the best I can. I'm getting tired of the plugin FOMO plus I need to save money. I have found your page very helpful as I trust what you say. I already own the Lindell but I may bujy the NoiseAsh based solely on finding good tones quickly while trying the demo and the fact you seem to love it. May I ask...Since the Lindell strip comes with the compressor and the NoiseAsh doesn't...is there a compressor that you think works well with it? I'm a big fan of the Townhouse which I also own but I'd love to hear your opinion. Thanks for your time and expertise.

[@jaimersalcido]

Hey Paul, have you tried the Neve N4 AlexB Modern Flagship Console? I would be vey interested on how it compares with these plugins.

[@PaulThird]

Nah. If Alex ever wants to get in touch with me regarding trying out his libraries I will but in terms of what Ive heard from others. It's hit and miss. The best Console plugs Ive used is sonimus Britson and satson. Really cool routing options, easy to use, smooth filters and the crosstalk really opens up the mixes like any other console plugs I've tried 🤓

[@HarryCraze101]

Would have to adjust the levels/mix with with aa gold as it felt like all the side information and energy was pushed down. The dry and the Ash feel more forward and ash enhanced the energy if the track. The lindell and slate just go mushy and smeary. Honestly are any of them worth the cpu load?

[@PaulThird]

After trying out sonimus Britson (8014 console) I'd say that's the way forward as it creates the crossfeed element and overall has way more of an audible difference to my ears. Filters are superb as well and much less CPU intensive than AA and cleaner than noiseash

[@ronithhalder5277]

Hi Paul, pls do checkout and review the U-he Satin tape and the waves NLS plugins. thanks, greetings from India.

[@PaulThird]

Looked at the uhe satin a while back and wasn't really for me. Waves NLS is just a more limited version of bx TMT. No oversampling to combat the audible aliasing and has a level bump by default. I personally wouldnt have NLS anywhere near any of my mixes being honest but that's just me

[@ronithhalder5277]

@@PaulThird so if we oversample it using ddmf plugin to avoid aliasing, is it actually worth as a summing plugin.

[@PaulThird]

Can only be sampled to 96k. I can't remember if 96k was enough to remove the aliasing. Was a long time ago. Its not summing though. Its just a lot of fixed frequency responses. The main bus instance is just a modelled fixed response of all the hardware channels being summed to the stereo bus. It's a fixed response. There is no correlation to what your actually summing in the channels. They don't interact with one another. Sonimus Britson or Satson is what you are after as it has the crossfeed and grouping into the main bus instance.

[@MarvelJAM]

The bass player likes the NoiseAsh best. You lose a little glue between the kick and bass guitar, each has more defined space. Just my 2 cents. I say good on 31102

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓

[@vancozzin8998]

I have my DT 770 PRO Beyerdynamic headphones, plugged into a Scarlett interface, and I still don't hear any difference between the plugins. Would it help if I listened with the headphones plugged directly into the computer, or are my ears just completely shot?!

[@pekkamartikainen7791]

First I didn't hear any difference either until I stopped _listening_ and started to _feel_ the music. Some clips started to feel more pleasant. Interestingly I got the same order as Paul did.

[@RiverMoonRest]

How do you rate the Arturia 73 ?

[@PaulThird]

It's decent

[@johnisrael5183]

I just shot this out against bx Townhome Compressor Comp and Mojo Nebula (Fairchild Setting) together they actually beat Gold...the the townhome and Mojo mix sound more fuller, Glued and punchier at the bottom the problem with this Plugin it sounds Wide but Flat....smh......

[@kl8895]

🔥 🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@PaulThird]

🤓🤓🤓

[@michaell.8938]

The Gold did nothing for me, I own the Lindell 80, but it didn't do a lot either. I didn't like the VCC's fake low end bulk.

[@TeddyBullard]

I spent a lot of time wading through "emulations" , getting frustrated, confused, before ultimately concluding that it's *far* better to evaluate plugins on their own merit. Independent of any "analogue heritage/pedigree". I do understand why devs /companies market these plugins the way they do, and consequently, why KZbin folks incorporate these same buzzwords etc. But it is all so very silly. A Burmese cat ain't a sphinx. And vice versa. Never gonna be. And why would you want it to be lmao?

[@user-cf1od8jy1q]

What about Cerise?

[@PaulThird]

I don't really like it tbh. I actually prefer the Lindell 80 over cerise

[@astralboy]

noise ash has the better grunge....others sound synthetic

[@PaulThird]

👌

[@thisscottishaspie5961]

🤓🤓🤓🤓

[@PaulThird]

Remember to check out my autism channel if you want to learn more about my life 🤓

[@tomman7729]

hello

[@tomman7729]

It would have been exciting to hear how AlexB MFC GE compares to Noise Ash, but it’s unfortunatly not possible to trial.

[@PaulThird]

I know I've heard a lot of talk about this specific alexB plugin 🤔

[@tomman7729]

Got to shoutout the Tim Petherick BLUE 1102 v2 too.

[@PaulThird]

I was gonna include Tim's neve but I know he's really busy just now but I still plan on doing some form of video shootout with it 🤓

[@thegroove2000]

NO THEY DONT. Placebo effect. The mind wants them to sound like the hardware.

[@swangonzalez4797]

To be perfectly honest it was hard telling all the files apart. There were very tiny differences. Differences still. But too small to really get excited about. All the recordings sounded muffled. Doesn't sound like a recording on a record. So where is the Neve sound? They all sounded kinda muddy. Is that the neve sound? Perhaps it's the youtube compression. But i've heard other Neve demo videos that sounded a lot better. Hardware and software. I had a similar experience with your SSL shootout. Too much of the same sound. If I bought the plugins for sure i would rave about it. Sometimes though I feel a lot of the stuff is placebo. Some of them might sound good. But who really knows what a real neve sounds like. All we have are the records to listen to. And these plugins almost always never sound like those classic recordings. I think most companies are talking us all for one big ride to la la land.

[@PaulThird]

The muddy thing overall is probably due to the fact I started this all off by taking dry stems, adding a bit of 'hardware' rack eq and compressors to simulate the Brauer thing of sticking hardware gear through a console. Additive eq, No subtractive eq or cleaning anything up. Nothing else on mixbus etc etc Just trying to simulate an analog environment. If it's a muddyish track then it should still sound muddyish through any console. If you don't hear the differences then I suppose you don't hear them. I can't change that. Could be youtube compression or just the fact that it's just a certain linear frequency and harmonic response. It's not like eq'ing and compressing through the boards. That would give more the overall sound but this is just a passing through 'console' sound so it should be still something you need to listen a little harder for. Ultimately even sticking tracks through a console should in reality still only make minor adjustments as it's just circuitry. No eq, compression or anything. Do they sound like the console.. 🤷‍♂️ Do they make the source sound different.. Yes. That to me is how I see all of this. I get a certain imprinted sound on a track by utilising this method. Whether it sounds exactly like the console is by the by. It sounds like what I think it should sound like but still all about whether you like it or not. I use blind tests to know how different that actually is. I can pick them out in blind tests and picked out dry vs ssl vs neve in the final comparison quite comfortably. The SSL was pretty hard as it's a 'clean' sound but I still understand what I'm looking for and again can pick it out. It's no fluke. I'm surprised you can only pick out minor differences as the noiseAsh to me is easy to pick out even through my car speakers. Even in the car I can pick out the dullness of the dry unprocessed track. And that's a proper blind test in the car as I can't even see the changes haha It is what it is at the end of the day. It's subjective but through my laptop speakers I could pick them out. It's not placebo or me wanting to hear a certain way. I just hear it.. But others might not and that's cool but especially via my headphones the noiseAsh stands out like a sore thumb.. But again that's just me I suppose

[@thegroove2000]

@@PaulThird They may have differences as plug ins but they do not have the same sound as the hardware. That mojo is not there. Acustica YES the rest NO.

[@PaulThird]

So are you saying the Acustica sounds more like a neve console to your ears? It's interesting as I know an engineer who uses neve consoles quite a lot and he messaged me today to tell me how shocked he was at how close the noiseAsh and acustica were to that Neve sound he is used to. Its all subjective at the end of the day. Hopefully one day I'll get to test it out for myself and see if there really is a magical sound or if its just placebo

[@thegroove2000]

@@PaulThird Yes thanks. Indeed it is very subjective. We all unfortunately dont have golden ears.