New JS Framework Just Dropped (Next.js Killer??)

[@Malix_Labs]

Time to reset the counter

[@sahilaggarwal2004]

I do it everyday🗿

[@Brunoenribeiro]

Also time to create another

[@rangerboi9715]

@@Brunoenribeiro also another to-do app

[@gadgetboyplaysmc]

what is the context of this "counter"

[@sahilaggarwal2004]

@@gadgetboyplaysmc the counter represents how many days have passed since a JavaScript framework was released

[@hl7297]

7:40 video starts here

[@anthonysim563]

Thank you!

[@vasiovasio]

I Can't Believe that there are still words left in the dictionary for new JS Frameworks! 😂😂😂

[@ncpurge789]

To be fair, "TanStack" isn't in the dictionary, so even if you do run out of words to name JS Frameworks, people will still have names to make up!

[@neociber24]

There are not, "Start" was already used

[@Sindoku]

Tanner isn’t just any developer tho, he’s a basically a core developer of the react ecosystem with packages like his table, router, query, and more. He deserves our attention after all the amazing FREE software he’s given us over the years.

[@Novascrub]

we namespacing now, boys!

[@_Titanium_]

Well Waku isn't in the English dictionary 😆

[@yamyam263]

3:57: All TypeScript is really nice, not a single JS file in sight. 4:01: cli.js

[@ashishkumawat6110]

oops!

[@shecalledthefeds]

Legend has it, there is a job posting asking for 5 years experience in this framework

[@DownUpward]

Complexity is the arch-enemy of "people need to understand enough to have an opinion."

[@neociber24]

50/50 some things are just complicated and we need to accept that fact.

[@CottidaeSEA]

​@baconmanthelegend What a shitty reply. So because some things are overly complicated, your response is to go back to being cavemen if it's too complex? You're a junior dev, right?

[@KhairulHidayat]

Day 0 since JS Dev creating new library/framework

[@Sindoku]

Tanner Linsley isn’t just any JS developer. He’s behind some of the most important and powerful react libraries in existence. We should all be watching what he does closely because he’s typically doing things correctly. That is, if you care about a high quality software experience at least.

[@TerriTerriHotSauce]

JavaScript frameworks are now like Linux distros.

[@DeanRTaylor]

A js framework to build js frameworks is pure stonks.

[@wolfeygamedev1688]

Yeah ngl js was originally built to and a sprinkle of logic to HTML Now its just been hacked to death to accomplish much more then it originally was built for. And it shows.

[@metropolis10]

3:57 "all typescript not a single js file in sight" *clicks twice, sees .js file, hovers over it, hits the back button and continues on*. Had me chuckling on the timing there.

[@matheusoliveira1126]

LMAO

[@jon1867]

I saw this coming from a mile away, and I'm super glad it's happening. Messing around with TanStack router for like 45 minutes and I was immediately like: "Tanstack Router > React Router" + "Remix is react router for backend" = "Tanstack will build a remix that's better than remix"

[@Lemmy4555]

After 4 years on Svelte, reading React code to me is like reading jquery with gulp and nunjacks.

[@cobrasys]

Hear hear!

[@mattwhite9658]

11:01 with all the discussion about understanding... having a stream const defined as a promise that has a stream const defined inside of it that self referentially calls resolve(stream), feels like it is consistent that reading source code to understand stuff isn't just a burden of time but a burden of trying to decode senseless complexity.

[@tannerlinsley]

I can’t imagine you’ve never shadowed a variable before.

[@neociber24]

Pretty sure most examples of SSR on React do that

[@mattwhite9658]

In an effort to teach myself I've seen why I dislike this even more. Having the difference in functionality be determined by "var" or "let/const" makes me think again this just adds confusion.

[@tannerlinsley]

@@mattwhite9658 const is a great default for so many reasons. Don’t overthink it.

[@ryangrogan6839]

​@@mattwhite9658 It amazes me that code like this can exist in prod and its considered normal. When will people decide enough is enough?

[@benjaminhon86]

The only cure is to use a different language for the backend then we can escape this front-end doom loop

[@Cyber_Lanka]

Nice video. Btw do you plan on talking about PlanetScale?

[@SandraWantsCoke]

what happened?

[@neociber24]

He is sponsored by planetscale not sure if anymore.

[@jaimel8219]

He talked about it live. The video is probably coming soon

[@alberjumper]

What did he say? It has screwed me tbh

[@rand0mtv660]

Gonna check this out in about a year. Definitely won't jump into it too early.

[@Sindoku]

I agree with Tanner’s take on RSCs. Why should we all be beholden to doing RSCs in the way Next has done them? I’m hoping for a better way to do server components because as they are now, I’m not interested in them at all. However, I will definitely be checking out Tanner’s new framework. I’ve introduced several of his packages at work, and they have all improved the application and developer experience greatly. Who knows, maybe one day I’ll introduce this framework at work too. Time to check it out for sure though. Thanks so much for your hard work Tanner!

[@JohnDoe-ef4fm]

JS world is like PHP in the late 00's at the moment.

[@Lemmy4555]

what do you mean?

[@DrsHWolfenstein]

​@@Lemmy4555it is a BS claim mostly referring to the focus on server side rendering. But PHP cannot be used on the client so there is no argument.

[@JohnDoe-ef4fm]

@@Lemmy4555 New frameworks coming up every minute, too many libraries each lacking something, libraries breaking between themselves. Everybody's framework claims their standard is the best. Basically, it was very difficult to pick up a stack because of too many choices, and not knowing what will be used or maintained in the future. Things have gotten a lot better now. Great majority of people either use just Laravel or Symfony, and those frameworks have everything set up for you.

[@IvanKleshnin]

Cool. I'm really hoping to have a more SPA-oriented framework than NextJS (which is heavily focused on improving TTFB, FCP, etc. but all that does not apply, nearly as well, to consequent interactions). CMS, dashboard, admin panel developers don't gain a lot of performance benefits from server components. When you have a lot of interactivity, client-centric state management (like React-Query) is much more convenient than Server Actions and all the stuff NextJS proposes.

[@riendlyf]

Дуже гарний комент, й по ділу. 99% коментів це жарти про нові JS фреймворки )

[@ajiteshmishra]

first we had framework like react then we had meta framework like next js then we had meta meta framework like t3 and blitz now we have frameworks to build frameworks

[@sourabhsingh4515]

first of all react is a library and not framework. kahe beizzati karane aata hai bhai

[@kalempster]

Fun fact, @lubieowoce means "I like fruits" in Polish.

[@navidazimi7816]

it seems like i'm the only one who haven't made a framework for frontend, i feel left out

[@indrajitsarkar3169]

less gooo, new day, new framework

[@ELYUSEF]

yet another js framework

[@KevinVandyTech]

and that's a good thing

[@dcrebbin]

The new meta, pivoting your startup’s tech stack every time a new framework gets posted on HN

[@andrewiglinski148]

Wait a fa($ing minute... the dude that created Tanstack is named Tanner?! I hope at least he came up with a cool acronym to justify it...

[@tannerlinsley]

Nope just a nickname. You’ll get over it. 😊

[@toooes]

TanStack has been arrested and charged with murder

[@banikaritra5328]

Can you make video on the recent planetscale drama?

[@cpakken]

You should do a deeper dive in to Vinxi, which is like the building blocks to customize your own js framework using vite. Seems really cool Tanstack/router is using this but can also be used Solid etc...

[@fnfal113]

I'm speechless with js having new frameworks rather than having a sense of universality and standardization.

[@goldydog1]

Seems like this framework makes you do a ton of manual configuration (for example, hydration is not automatic). Is the idea here to put more control in devs hands?

[@Jiftoo]

A "React" framework?

[@storytimewithme2]

The most interesting framework will be the one that AI agent crews can build in easiest and first. Right now Pythagorus (GPT Copilot?) just works with express / HTML because React is still kinda complex. Once it reaches the point of understanding a framework well enough to add features and respond to QA needs, I don't see a need for another framework

[@Microphunktv-jb3kj]

the moment you sayd vinxi scared the shit out of me ... since my irl nickname from friends is vinku / vinks ; ))

[@neociber24]

I'm not a big fan of the name, I really liked "Bling" , but looks really cool. Not sure why people cry each time a new framework drop, for me is exciting having more source code to read and learn.

[@_Titanium_]

14:38 No react devtools?

[@darrenpierre9903]

anyone else amazed on the breadth of knowledge Theo has . I got a lot to learn

[@SLRModShop]

We'll never be bored again :)

[@frontend_ko]

welcome, i like tanstack

[@kirarevcrow]

Any news about remix?

[@peterszarvas94]

good old ajax or even an spa, and you good to go most of the time...

[@wlockuz4467]

If I understand it right, Vinxi is a framework to build frameworks? How did we get here?!

[@JT-mr3db]

Annnnd that does it. Time to start a wood shop.

[@wlockuz4467]

Good luck! which framework are you going to use to serve your wood shop blog?

[@JT-mr3db]

@@wlockuz4467Well I'm not an animal.. So clearly every AWS service piled on top of each other, using a single Terraform config with custom raw dawg providers for all services.

[@MrManafon]

Nah, without the server thing, its as good as dead on delivery to me now.

[@tannerlinsley]

It has server things…. 🤔

[@fuzzboi]

What kind of browser are you using?

[@maacpiash]

Arc Browser

[@fuzzboi]

@@maacpiash thanks!

[@AdolfRizzler41]

White browser

[@cobrasys]

Theo, why is it that your photo on the thumbnails of your videos always looks like you took it mid-colonoscopy?

[@Novascrub]

I want one of these metaframeworks to take serverful deployments seriously. Let me run this as middleware or a fastify plugin. Don't require me to cede control of the entry point.

[@ArpitVerma-o3y]

which browser?

[@fedordostoevskiy4209]

Tanner is a programmer, we are not. At all.

[@mburakerman]

You started publishing longer videos compared to before. You kinda resemble Prime’s videos. Do you have any plans to go back to shorter videos?

[@sire_ns]

I finally started to understand the new Nextjs 14 stuffs and now this drops.

[@adhityasanjaya3026]

what browser is theo use ?

[@darrenpierre9903]

arc

[@ys1197]

They could add RSC in the future :D

[@mr.johnson8974]

There are now 15 competing standards.

[@MichaelLazarski]

another day another framework yeahy the js/ts framework count is higher then the population of India.

[@soixantelly]

Qwik made any react based metaframework obsolete

[@owenwexler7214]

Honestly I tried to make a simple weather app with Qwik and ejected and went to HTMX with it because of how rough the DX with Qwik was at the time… and I had high hopes for Qwik. With more maturing and development and a more expansive ecosystem of tools (fetching/SWR and UI that is out of beta) and a less confusing file system (not calling every single component index.tsx) it could be great.

[@nftdestin3821]

fire vid

[@TerriTerriHotSauce]

*DJ Khaled Voice: Another One

[@Bliss..]

it was only obvious...why can you not believe it. that's how a framework starts..you fix concerns according your world-view and then you build a boilerplate to make them work together .

[@nguyencaoson3853]

man that's reply is so on point. I'm slightly annoyed with that Dan guy, not just because he created the most damned react library, but also the style of his replies. If being nice and hand wavy is the bar that facebook sets in the React team then that's sad, because that might be why React has been going downhill for a long time. RSA is the most interesting thing that comes out of React recently and no one knows how to use it.

[@monstercameron]

what's the benefit of using such a complex stack?

[@daleryanaldover6545]

to make people suffer

[@tannerlinsley]

What’s complex?

[@UwU-dx5hu]

Waaaai.this is Crazy!

[@bshelling8922]

Then tomorrow we're going to hear about another component feature in Next, then another framework after that, then Elixir, then Go. lol

[@bioburden]

Long story short; it operates the same as Next with the pages router.

[@tannerlinsley]

Not even close.

[@bioburden]

@@tannerlinsley Having listened to you on Syntax, I now understand what you mean here :)

[@hightower-yt]

aaaaaand another framework. aaaaand it's blazing fast

[@j0hannes5]

Daishi and Tanner should have a baby

[@xrexy]

Next devs trying everything in their power to not use Nuxt😮

[@HyuLilium]

To me Tanner begins things and then leaves it for the community to refine and finish things. He moves on the other shiny new things very fast.

[@tannerlinsley]

I’m an explorer, not a farmer. Does it really matter as long as the library continues to grow and get support?

[@HyuLilium]

@@tannerlinsleyYou do deserve praise and thanks for making good things open source. I just believe some things needed more refinement but I think we can happily disagree and I still respect that.

[@Ivan-wm6gm]

another framework for react. aren't we having react fatigue yet?

[@mzerone-g6m]

It is looks like liveview model on state changes

[@devxsadik]

A new Js framework in the time of AGI

[@bogdan6594]

Awesome

[@shapelessed]

Oh for fuck's sake... No, I'm done. I'm going on backend., BYE!

[@lucabaxter4002]

ENOUGH with this frameworks. People save yourself, never embrace React.

I still don't understand why we prioritise RSC and server-side rendering. What's wrong with client based rendering?

[@maharta8458]

Same, my company would never want RSC or SSR due to requiring us to have more server resources instead of using the resource of the client.

[@kizigamer6895]

Depends on the usecase of the project and userbase and client side renderering is not always good as requires more client resources which is not possible if the client pc is low end then the site would take so long to load that they would not visited the site again and you will lose the userbase so better have good user experience

[@exapsy]

my god. a "React framework"? Another one? Not even a JS framework? I imagine Frontend like a room full of developers, with two groups, the one writes "cool frameworks" and resets the "JS Framework counter" to 0, the other one is people who run around in panic. It makes me feel like JS is in early release, for 20-30 years now.

[@MacroEnabled]

Funny thing is that WebAssembly will likely render JS/TS obsolete 20-30 years from now

[@exapsy]

@@MacroEnabled Exactly. This is a completely another discussion to be honest but so interesting! People have been "brainwashed" to think "Webassembly gooooood" But what most of us don't understand, is that JS is actually already so much optimized that your Webassembly most likely sucks in comparison to JS, unless very specialized for a thing JS is not good at and you know it. Which is ironic isn't it. But also to be honest, people because "WebAssembly" contains "Assembly" in it tend to think that it's very close or same to Assembly. Which is far from the truth, one is a JIT language (Just In Time compiled) the other compiles whole binaries.

[@meharjeetsingh5256]

we need a diagram for this

[@zb2747]

Another framework…

[@DavidWoodMusic]

I have given up on keeping up.

[@xdaniels13]

Great a new framework to build some apps to use my cool free tier database in planetscale.... Oh wait a sec...

[@complexity5545]

Jesus christ.... another js framework. I feel sorry for the JS crews and front-end guys. Their job position might become obsolete again. That happens every 3 months. They have to do all this bloat to render a web page; its sinister what facebook did to their followers. And to a senior guy, it really is bloat. With my experience, I've concluded that it is "busy work" for the non-principal engineers so the company can lock into a tax-bracket by adjusting expenses. LoL I used to get more stuff done with rolling my own JS library back in the 2010s faster and better on resources than any react derivative. That side of the industry is getting absolutely mauled by bulls***.

[@neociber24]

Are you ok buddy? Devs don't quit their job each time a new technologic drop

[@akay64x2]

LOL... again?

[@sohaibesohaib2914]

stop re-enenting the wheel , we don't need a new js framework , we had enough !

[@Benthetech-qn2lf]

I hate JavaScript how do I fucking stay up to date?

[@itsMrRuky]

not a single JS file in sight. Just before a JS file 🤣

[@ceopaludetto]

Everything is NextJS killer cuz NextJS is just bad

[@tears_falling]

+1

[@labhhfgz7572]

Curious to know why that is. I started developing with it some months ago and I don't have any major complains aside from pure error messages sometimes.

[@ceopaludetto]

@@labhhfgz7572 My statement was a little dramatic. But for me a good framework is a framework that have some good DX while delivers a near perfect UX, you should not sacrifice UX for DX, and for me that’s exactly what NextJS does, nowadays the framework is a completely mess of future flags, modes of compilation, modes of styling. Remix in other hand is not perfect, but by default it delivers a way better UX while keeping a respectful and more polite DX

[@labhhfgz7572]

@@ceopaludettoI see, thank you for your answer i haven't tried Remix but i will keep it mind.

[@Jdinrbfidndifofkdndjoflfndjdk]

Remix is already a nextjs killer

[@naughtiousmaximus7853]

Slander Java all you want, at least they dont invent new stuff non stop.

[@Wielorybkek]

no... no... no.

[@ericvalcik]

I don’t know man…

[@tobias3581]

A stable tanstack router with SSR and RSC would make me switch to react despite of react

[@DaviAreias]

I was trying to make something complicated in react so when looking for examples, I stumbled upon tanstack and started to read their code just to find out that they don’t use react to do the heavylifting 😂

[@brayancuenca6925]

mfs who always try new frameworks. im mfs

[@Tantewillieja]

Stop, please just stop this crap...

[@shafayet_hossain]

Too much code and boilerplate

[@MrBrandenS]

Thought the same thing. config and boilerplate up the wazoo.

[@mettle_x]

The code looks very ugly though.

[@azizsafudin]

That’s not code you touch or write. If you dig into nextjs itself, it looks like that too.

[@mettle_x]

@@azizsafudin If there's some code that I won't touch but it's ugly, it shouldn't be in my repo with my name in the commits.

[@mettle_x]

Also, if the framework code stays in my repo, it's technically not a framework. It's boilerplate.

[@tannerlinsley]

This is an early beta, of course it’s a template. I’ll package it up all nice and pretty so you don’t have to worry about your boss questioning you about why you’re using conditional types like a TS wizard.

[@mettle_x]

@@tannerlinsley Hi, Tanner. Love your work! Glad to know you're working on it. Don't mind me if I sound harsh sometimes while criticizing. Your ideas are great. Take love. 💛

[@HisokaXKuroro1]

the js ecosystem is disgusting tbh

[@TanAhmed-n4p]

nah fuck that. not going to learn it

[@LaughingRam]

YAJSF

[@bowaller6892]

I hate Next and I hope more Nuxt to React framework.As a Vue and Nuxt developer, I want to use React but Next is very bad framework for me. I dont like routes, middlewares and layout system of Next, Nuxt is cleaner winner to this. Thats why I stop using the React and prefer 100% Vue and Nuxt. (Plus: Something I like to Nuxt is modules, plugins and auto import, that a reason to have faith to a new framework with React)

[@george_davituri]

🪄

[@tejusr5525]

nice