Oliver 1650 Clutch Job

[@BIBSTERSrepairshop]

Great video thanks for all the tips and tricks

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Thanks for watching!

[@dwightgarwood8504]

Very,very nice video! Doing the job right and with great narrative on the "whys and hows". Thank you sir.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Thank you for watching!

[@jimmybland6519]

I pulled the motor out of my ag. teacher’s 1600 around 71 or 72. I thought it was amazing how simple it was. Thanks for the memories.

[@almostmilkingbyhand58]

Preparing to do this very same thing in next few weeks. Video should hopefully help a good bit. Have been farming with two tractors down. Been told what is wrong with both of them and another needs a headgasket. This though it is a big job, removing whole engine. Feel more confident pulling and replacing clutch, pto hub and pilot bearing then dealing with cleaning and replacing heasgasket of other tractor, possibly having to machine the block Tractor belonged to my uncle. Remember using it when was a teenager. Away from the farm for few years. Helping again. Oliver 1650, Ford 8N, and International Farmall 656 Hi clear are all in need of intensive work.

[@jeffgrier8488]

Thanks for taking the time to make the video and show us all the tips and tricks!

[@Adam_Poirier]

Good morning Chris happy Sunday. I’ve been looking forward to this one, I remember over the summer all of a sudden Alan‘s tractor was out and running lol and I thought you had mentioned pulling the engine but never saw the video and here it is👍

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Good morning! I didn't record much this week, so I'm glad I had this to fall back on.

[@Adam_Poirier]

I figured that was your plan all along knowing that it’s a little slower in the winter months. This time of year is tons of shop work for myself as well so I really look forward to see what you have going on for projects. Yourself and Andy Hourigan are my two favorites to watch

[@millardhayes1884]

Boy I know Alan realizes what a good mechanic and friend you are. That feul siffel hose looks easy. We usually just use a Mississippi credit card. In gas tanks

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I've gotta ask... Mississippi credit card?

[@millardhayes1884]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Long rubber hose and a deep breath.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Lol, I've done that, that's why I really like the one I have now.

[@randyholland7532]

I can’t find that siphon hose at tractor supply? Making sure that’s where you got it?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

@@randyholland7532 , it's been a few years. I'm pretty sure it was there, could have been Blain's farm and fleet. I just did a google search for 'shaker siphon hose' and Amamzon and Napa have them, as well as several other places.

[@Pennies_on_the_dollar]

Awesome video, very informative!! I love all the videos describing the process of the repair work being done!! Thank you for bringing us along, look fwd to more!

[@peterhaan9068]

I've been told that the cooling liquid in a heat exchanger needs to run in the opposite direction than the liquid being cooled. If so it might be a good idea to check the directional flows in your heat exchanger. Reason, as explained to me, is if both liquids are running in the same direction in the heat exchanger the cooling liquid becomes heat soaked. If the liquids are running in opposite directions the liquid to be cooled is always presented with fresh cooling liquid as it travels through the heat exchanger.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I agree with what you say, but this cooler has the coolant entering and leaving from the same end. The oil enters the front port and leaves the rear port. The coolant comes in, goes down one side of the internal oil heat exchanger, goes around the back side and comes back to the front to exit. I don't think switching the direction of coolant flow on this one would change its heat exchange efficiency.

[@peterhaan9068]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris By design, idiot proof! What's the fun in that? Keep up the wonderful work. Love your channel!

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

@@peterhaan9068 , Thanks!

[@Military-Museum-LP]

Fog so very thick, light rain, 04c degrees outside. Not a day for outside projects but perfect for one of your videos. Thanks Chris.

[@robertheinkel6225]

I have done a few clutch jobs on IH tractors. Split the frame, and go for it. You just needed some special tools to support the front end and roll it away. As a kid, our 66 had a loader, and dad put in a Heavy duty clutch. It was all we could do as kids to disengage the clutch.

[@timnichols9015]

Nice to see the sunshine in an open shop door! I was in my shop yesterday with heat on, but not the same.....

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Agreed.

[@mischef18]

Enjoyed this video bro. Thanks for posting. Safe travels

[@Murphyslawfarm]

G'day Chris cool video mate

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Thanks Murphy!

[@bigun447]

Our NAPA store had a great machinist. He turned flywheels for us using his disc brake lathe. He machined adapters to fit the flywheels we took him and a couple hours later we had a nice clean flywheel that looked like new. He also did them for our competitors as well as auto and truck shops.

[@robertdaly9036]

Great video as always..... 👍👍

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Thank you!

[@loganlawrencefarms8356]

We have a 2-105 that when you push in on the clutch when it's running and not moving when you let off the clutch and your out of gear it lurches forward and when u push it back in it pulls the tractor back

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

It sounds like something is dragging in the transmission. Does it shift into gear ok?

[@loganlawrencefarms8356]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris yes it shifts just like it was new

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Sounds like the clutch is ok. I'd guess that a bushing in a gear, or maybe a thrust washer between gears is getting in rough condition and dragging. I'd change the transmission filter, and if trans lube is milky at all, change that. Milky means water is in there, and it can turn to ice crystals in the winter, which then lug the filter and starve the gears for lube oil.

[@loganlawrencefarms8356]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris OK thankyou

[@richardpeoples2887]

What did you decide caused the clutch to slip? Were the fingers out of adjustment? Was the step wrong in the flywheel? Although thin, the disc didn't look like it was wore out.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I think it was adjusted wrong. it was definitely uneven, we could see where it was doing all of the engagement on one side, the other side we could still see machining marks. The fingers were against the cover before I even loosened a bolt.

[@richardpeoples2887]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Thanks

[@emmitt00]

hello from very cold wisconsin

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

We're at 7 degrees F, probably a heat wave compared to you.

[@emmitt00]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris -19 below right now, good weather to watch oliver videos

[@dmc3742]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Wow Chris....its 3 above here in NW Missouri right now. You really are on the warm side of the state.

[@TacticalPortugee]

So have to pull the motor to do a clutch but do you need to pull the motor to pull the hi-lo ? Also do you have any video’s on rebuilding the hydraulic pump on a 1650?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Yes, motor needs to come out to get the 2 peed out. Sorry, no videos on rebuilding one of those. Usually they are worn enough I replace them with new.

[@TacticalPortugee]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Ok And do i have to split it to do the pump or can I get it out through the top cover?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

The hydraulic unit has to come off. Separate it where it meets the transmission housing, theres a pan that separates the hydraulics from the rear end. Drop that and you'll see the pump. If you have 3 point hitch, you'll probably have to pull the lift cylinder to get the pump to slide far enough back to get it out.

[@Damien80279]

Hi, Looking at a 1968, 1650.. What should I look for? What do you think of the geared starters? Thanks!

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Besides the usual checking the oil and coolant type of things, check out the drawbar cradle/support where it bolts onto the rear end. They often come loose, egging out the holes or even shearing bolts off. The broken off bolts can be a pain to get out, and finding a good cradle can be a challenge. Run it long enough for the hydraulic oil to get warmed up, then idle it as slow as it will go and try to raise a remote or the three point hitch. If they don't work at a slow speed but do when you rev the engine faster, the hydraulic pump is getting worn and might need replaced in the near future. Listen for noises in the transmission, look for looseness in the steering, try out the lights, the amp gauge should show charging when the lights are on. I haven't tried a geared starter, but I have heard nothing but good things about them. They'll spin an engine over faster, which makes a big difference in starting a diesel, especially in the cold.

[@kentscranton3098]

Good afternoon Chris! When White switched over to the 2-70, with the Waukesha diesel, did they stay with the two different size motor mount bolts? My buddy has a 2-70 and all four motor mount bolts are 1/2" Great videos! Love the old Olivers!!

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I checked the book, and it shows four half inch bolts for the 2-70. Glad I looked it up, I would have said they still used the 2 sizes. I also looked up the 1650, and the dowel bolts are still available from AGCO, part number 104258A. In case anyone needs some.

[@kentscranton3098]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Thanks! After I sent this question to you yesterday I found a 2-70 parts book (Rev 4-77) and it looks like the 104258A - 9/16" bolt is listed with a quantity of 2 if I am reading correctly. I guess maybe we should double check the frame holes to be sure. Thoughts? Just don't want to have an alignment issue and problems down the road.......

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I looked them up on Agco's online parts books, which do appear to have some discrepancies. I'd go with your book over the online and get the bolts. Online showed them being about $7 each. The thread is 9/16 coarse, so you might be able to find the nuts locally.

[@kentscranton3098]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Perfect! Thanks so much for the help!!

[@corydriver7634]

I like that you didn’t edit out your “mistakes” it helps the average guy like me understand the importance of the -process? If that’s the right word. For instance you explained the alignment of the flywheel and your punch marks to assist in reassembly then proceeded to misalign it 180 out, shows how easy that is to do even for the pro. Thanks again. Love the Mayberry RFD ringtone BTW.

[@billyjamison9733]

Sorry if this is a repetitive question.. would this be the same process on an 1850 clutch job? My fathers 1850 wasn't used much in the early 2000's one day the clutch wouldn't disengage.. I believe when we get time we we'll tackle this project.. thank you I really enjoy your videos

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

It's pretty much the same process. The pto drive comes out a little different, but I have a video on that.

[@corysonsoucie6114]

If all the flywheel bolts go in does that mean it's clocked right? I put it back on and started them by hand. What kind of problems will I have if it's wrong?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

If you can start them all by hand you should be good to go. The main problem is if you have to do any timing, like injection pump work or setting the distributor, you're out of luck. The flywheel is balanced on its own, so being off shouldn't affect that.

[@corysonsoucie6114]

@ThatOliverGuyChris is setting the pressure plate fork height that big of a deal or can I get by without doing it

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

@@corysonsoucie6114 most everyone sends them out preset these days. I usually measure the height of them to the clutch disc just to verify they're all the same. It's not often I have to adjust them.

[@corysonsoucie6114]

@ThatOliverGuyChris I assumed it was balanced like a tire so it wouldn't matter what crank it's bolted on but swapped flywheel. That shouldn't be an issue either should it? It was my grandpa's tractor and I'm just trying to get it back together after 30 years of sitting.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

@@corysonsoucie6114 no issues there. Like you said, it's balanced separately like a tire, so you can safely rotate.

[@zachvanderpol5854]

Great video! I have a 67’ 1750 that my grandfather bought new from a dealer in northern Michigan. Still does loader work for me to this day but is getting pretty tired.

[@Ham68229]

Weren't the 17's, 18's and 19's all have the same size motor mount bolt holes? Seems like Oliver should've thought that part through a bit better but, as you said, comes down to cost. Since you have torn down this far, wouldn't it be prudent to go ahead put in all new hoses along with those belts and thermostat? This is the one of many things that Oliver did do right, they kept their design simple. Great video, cheers :)

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

We did end up putting the other hoses on while we were in there. The 17 18 and 19s used the same bolt pattern as the 1650, two 9/16 bolts and 2 half inch bolts. They didn't do that with any of the outsourced engines like the Perkins, Detroit, and so on, just the Waukesha.

[@Military-Museum-LP]

I think it’s so impressive when you state the part number. Chris do you miss the dealership?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

At times I do. The dealership was kind of a social stop for a lot of farmers. A place to catch up with someone you happened to show up at the same time as. People getting beefed because we didn't have the right parts on hand on a Sunday morning, I don't miss that.

[@Military-Museum-LP]

I can imagine at harvest and planting time the farmers were banging on your door.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I remember coming home from planting just about midnight, and there's dad and a customer digging through tool boxes on our tractors trying to find a fuse to get the customer going. You were almost always on duty.

[@johnkissack5295]

Chris Would you be so kind if you have a video of removal of injection pump from Perkins in 1850 Oliver to share?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I don't, but they are about the easiest to do. I'll try to get something filmed.

[@johnkissack5295]

Thank you so very much! I really enjoy all your videos. These Olivers are so hard to beat!

[@Military-Museum-LP]

Chris when you say over and under is this like an IHC T/A? Sorry for the ignorance but I’m still learning about Oliver’s.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

The over/under is a 3 speed shift on the go auxiliary transmission. I believe the TA was only 2, more like the hydra power drive unit. I've never seen the inside of a TA, so I don't know how mechanically similar they are, but the function is comparable.

[@nellsonstout7001]

That Oliver Guy - Chris Losey all I can say is you can go online and read about a lot more TAs either going out or being deleted compared to hydra powers😂

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

@@nellsonstout7001 from the for sale ads I see, there are 2 types of TA... freshly rebuilt and out.

[@briangrendzinski5411]

This brings back memories!!!! I do have a question. Back the late 80's. One of my uncle has a 1950 4x4. As he was driving in the field it just stopped moving forward. So it got haul over to my other uncle place. They were thinking of the clutch went out. So the next weekend came .I got off school and went to my uncle. Start playing around with it. So I started it up. Run good for the Jimmy. But can't move. As it was running I look at the longshaft it isn't turning . So I got tool for the shaft that we use for pulling and installing. I turned it in the plug and push in. It grinds . So I stop . Shut down engine. Than I pulled the plug and pushed the shaft in . Started it up. It moves. I like nothing wrong at all. So my question is. does the shaft turn something in the hydro transmission. Like a pump. That stops the movement of the tractor. Or is it something else.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

That's weird, the 2 speed is entirely self contained, the pump in it is driven off the countershaft inside it. The tractor should be able to move without the longshaft in, you just wouldn't have hydraulics or pto. I don't know what would happen to make the long shaft to make it drive the transmission.

[@briangrendzinski5411]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris So what turns the hydro oil pump. Input shaft or the longshaft?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

The hydraulic pump for remotes, steering, and three point hitch is turned by the long shaft. The pump inside the hydra power drive is turned by the input shaft that goes into the main clutch.

[@briangrendzinski5411]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris So the true answer is there was something wrong in the clutch. Which we never got into. About two years later both of my uncle did a repower . with a perkins engine. Thank you very much!!! For answering.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Either the main clutch or it could have been the sprag clutch in the hydra power. When they are getting ready to give up, they will grab one time, and not the next.

[@bendunkelman4853]

I think these repair videos are my favorite. Thanks a lot!! What differences were there between a 4-150 and 4-175?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

The biggest difference was the articulation joint. It was redesigned and beefed up, a much better design. They were about the same horsepower. White changed the articulated model numbers from PTO horsepower to flywheel horsepower. The 4-150 was 150 PTO horsepower, the 4-175 was 175 flywheel horsepower.

[@bendunkelman4853]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris of someone wanted to put in the time and money, do you think you could get enough torque, repowering a 4-175 with a Cummins 5.9?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

The 3208 wasn't the highest torque engine, so a 5.9 probably wouldn't be that big of a change. I think the 5.9 would be easier to fit in compared to an 8.3 Cummins, just because of the length.

[@gerhettparrish7742]

We have a 1800a. On the front under the radiator on top of the steering box there is a rubber cap held on with a spring. Would you know were to get that rubber cap.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I think there were a couple sizes depending on age. It acts as a dust cap, most guys get a cap that is the right size and put a hose clamp in place of the spring to hold it more securely. If you go to caplugs.com they have all their caps online, and it even looks like you can order a free sample.

[@paulpetusky9222]

These videos are awesome. I had a clutch go out on a 1650 diesel, I watched you informative video on replacement, one question I have is does the clutch failure have any effect on the power steering ? Or is there a separate problem?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

That should have no effect on power steering.

[@eb17816]

Informative video. I have a question. Are all of the imput shafts for hydrapower/over under the same size? We had 1750 through 2150 on the farm and I was wondering if 1650 and 1550 are different?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Yes, 1550 and 1650 are smaller. The input for a 2255 is a little longer than the 17-1955.

[@ghenry85]

So what would be different in a 1850 with a Perkins 354 as far as alignment goes?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

The Perkins used regular bolts, so there's nothing special there. With only 3 bolts, they were tight enough on their tolerances to keep it lined up without different sizes

[@ghenry85]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Got ya.

[@burningdinosaurs]

If you need a hydraul-shift to rebuild for a video, under is going out on my 1855.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Too bad you're not closer, I'd take you up on that.

[@burningdinosaurs]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris Yeah, well, thanks anyway. I appreciate it! Donno when, or if, I'll get around to it. Might try to find another unit to swap in. Might try to rebuild myself. I've never had one apart, but dad has, but that was 20+ years ago. So, might have to hit you up with questions a few times! Too cold for the next several weeks to even think about it.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

What oil do you have in it? In this cold weather, too thick of oil can keep the sprag clutch from working right. Universal can get pretty thick when you get down around zero.

[@burningdinosaurs]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris DexIII. But it was having issues when plowing this past fall. Usually fine starting from a stop in under, but down-shifting on-the-go to under it sometimes doesn't grab. Gotta hit the clutch and let it grab. I've added fluid since I bought it, and changed filter, but didn't change fluid out. Might be some who-knows-what in there from the previous owners.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

You might get lucky doing a fluid change, I've heard of guys getting the sprag to work again with fresh oil. Chances are with it acting up under load and warmed up, the sprag is getting shot. There's little metal strips called drag strips that help it to engage. They break off and it will do what you're experiencing.

[@hughperkins707]

Did you hookup the grease tube to the release bearing?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I got a non greaseable bearing. Interestingly enough, that's what was in there even though the tube was hooked up. That would have made for some hard pumping!

[@joeorsborn9794]

Where were you able to buy the thermostat at ? Appreciate your videos, helps me out a lot, thank you !

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

We got it from Maibach tractor in Creston, Ohio. Any AGCO dealer should be able to get it for you. The thermostat is 30-3056430 and the gasket is 104700A.

[@Adam_Poirier]

I guess I’m pretty lucky in Connecticut here it’s about 27 so I guess I really have the warm temperature compared to you lol

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I'm glad I'm on this side of Lake Michigan, it's 20 degrees colder on the other side.

[@billbaas1402]

I had -6 at 8:00 this morning in central Michigan

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

That will open up the sinuses!

[@Adam_Poirier]

I’ve always wanted to go someplace where it’s cold enough and you pee outside it freezes instantly. 😂

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Lol. I grew up in a house with 1 bathroom and a sister. I would complain how there was a yellow stalagmite outside the back door in the winter, because I couldn't get in the bathroom!

[@edwinhopcraft5974]

Did you have the flywheel turned?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

No, it was falt and smmoth, so we rolled with it.

[@edwinhopcraft5974]

O ok

[@Military-Museum-LP]

Chris do you call this clutch a Borg and Beck type clutch?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I would call it a 3 finger clutch with a cera-metallic button disc. Did Borg and Beck create that design?

[@Military-Museum-LP]

@@ThatOliverGuyChris. We call this type Borg/Beck over here. And that other with lots of fingers all over diaphragm type. I think there is one more but I don’t remember. Thanks for your reply Chris.

[@wilmamcdermott3065]

283 walkashaw for gas 310 walkashaw diesil

[@americasdream1265]

seeing that red fuel come out of the tank reminds me of the Indiana DOT running around trying to bust farmers for burning off road fuel in diesel pickup trucks at farm auctions. I would be a liar if I never said I didn't do that but not to beat the state out of their money it was because I was low of fuel in the field and didn't want to risk running out and then having to get the air out of the fuel system but it shows just how chicken shyt some states can be. Just something else to give farmers a hard time.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

I've done it a couple times, but it's like you say, it was that or run out of fuel.

[@IYIcIYIurray]

Hi Chris , me and my dad love your videos. He recently purchased his first Oliver. He’s owns fords, masseys, kubotas but in his words he knows nothing about Oliver’s. Is there any way I could direct message you to ask a few questions about his 1600?

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

You can email me at [e-mail]

[@galeogle]

Does all the Oliver's have the alignment chain in them.

[@ThatOliverGuyChris]

Not all of them. Earlier ones had solid coupler, larger ones had an enclosed splined coupler.

[@dougn5604]

I'd like to apply for the assistant to the assistant's position ( one below Alan). I will wear a Sparti shirt.

[@scruffy6151]

👍👍