Only One Makes It! 2018 Subaru Outback vs Jeep Cherokee vs Gold Mine Hill

( www.TFLcar.com ) 2018 Subaru Outback vs Jeep Cherokee vs Gold Mine Hill: Can New AWD best old 4WD Tech?
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You Can Also Watch The Original Off-road Outback Video That Subaru Hates Here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nqPHk5KLi7mUaJI

[@minaguirguis8897]

Why didn't you buy the the more powerful 3.6R?

[@d3adk964]

@@minaguirguis8897 It sounds like it's not a limitation of power. Moreso the CVT Transmission which every new Subaru has. So i imagine they're all this way.

[@karimalameddine5092]

I suspect the button is Hill start assist. Thanks for all your videos (-:

[@d3adk964]

@toulouse666 Interesting. Well it's still an issue and Subaru needs to fix it. I agree this test is a little extreme but at the same time Subaru advertises their cars to be capable like this. Driving backroad trails, etc. My aunt drives a Crosstrek and complains about the same thing in the winter getting up her driveway with snow tires. The car bogs down without momentum. I just sent her this video lol. I can't wait to see TFLCar test this outback in the winter.

[@maxwell5428]

Subaru doesn’t want you to show the flaw in their cars

[@powder1137]

*Talks to father through walkie-talkie while simultaneously walking past him and not acknowledging his presence*

[@inTruthbyGrace]

millennials....

[@dave-ed5li]

@@inTruthbyGrace ok boomer

[@inTruthbyGrace]

@@dave-ed5li ha heem... that's *_genX'er_* to you. :)

[@martentrudeau6948]

The up and coming prince doesn't always acknowledge the king and the king doesn't always acknowledge prince either. It's a father/son thing.

[@championthewonderhorse9733]

@@inTruthbyGrace Tw@ts

[@ashes2ashes863]

Hats off to whoever kept that Jeep so mint all these years. I also never knew about the dual hood latches...pretty sweet

[@Mixwell1983]

I dont know why but i love the simplicity of those model jeeps. The one in the video is clean !

[@skyhawkpilot172]

They're the perfect size, relatively easy to work on and maintain, and the boxy look... We have two of them and are looking for a third.

[@chosento2988]

I'm jealous

[@kingpin3919]

Loved the video. Can't wait to see more videos of the Subaru when it starts snowing. Keep up the great work.

[@firstnamelastnameisallowed7943]

On the "stage two" hill when the Jeep was off camber and spinning the tires, if you ever find yourself in a similar situation you can actually set the e-brake a lil bit and ride the front brakes just enough and it will make the tires that were not spinning spin! Most of the time it does anyway. Just a tip if anyone didn't know!

[@Hebrew42Day]

That's what Toyota's ATRAC system does to simulate center diff lock.

[@cat-lw6kq]

I had a 1976 Subaru station wagon 4WD and can tell you it was one tough built car. It had a small engine but it did pretty well. Big problem was ground clearance going off road, it's more of an all around street and useful car for rough roads,

[@cdismufasa]

I like how they bought the Subaru just to shit on it lol

[@AhmadQ.81]

This is very interesting demonstration and indeed your efforts are appreciated. Great as always.

[@staticGenerator4You]

This is an honest review. I purchased the Forester with the CVT and X-Mode was very disappointing. Subaru really messed up their platform by selling the turbo forester only in CVT without a stick. They actually perform better turning X-Mode and traction control off. Older Forester XTs perform better off road than the newer J models. Get this fixed Subaru...

[@MAYHEMSCO]

You guys...are killing me. Literally no one would take those trails that way. Both vehicles could easily makes those hills.

[@thedroid4ever]

Yea it's really bad.

[@AhmadQ.81]

Now the time to consider the new 2020 XT for another round hhhhh keep up the great reviews. Thanks indeed

[@truckerdanvideos]

when u turn off traction control press and hold it for 15-30 seconds it'll turn off stability control as well and then you can spin the tires.

[@staticGenerator4You]

No shit, I didn’t know that. Will try that.

[@BruceHoult]

They do actually come with a user's manual.

[@leftyclick]

I was going to say the same thing. I think it would make all the difference.

[@randallbollinger1449]

The owners manual knows what that button does...

[@wax333]

its called hill hold lol.

[@Dankcatvacs]

@@wax333 wow my 93 Subaru has that but it's automatic I don't need a mysterious button

[@dillonh321]

@@Dankcatvacs It is still auto that button just turns it off.

[@jedironin380]

RTFM! ;)

[@ForgottenSVT]

Its hill holder. Even with automatics, they roll back on really steep hills. This engages the parking brake until you give it gas, then releases the brake so you can drive forward.

[@aarynj]

Fit some lockers to the jeep and it goes to a whole new level.

[@jabronjunklove760]

A whole nudda leb-bull!

[@Butterflylo328]

aarynj jeeps needs always some extra changes before going to the real shit is the reason Subaru is the first AWD and the 1 place 4x4 go max 35 mph when AWD go max

[@Hertacles]

You can put a torq locker on the outback and it'll go ham as well.

[@JeffDeWitt]

Set it up right and that Jeep will go pretty much anywhere any wheeled vehicle ever built will go.

[@stefanogoldoni5059]

Your videos are simply the best available on youtube!

[@wvusmc]

I'd love to find an older JEEP in that condition.

[@phgamer4393]

seriously that thing looked mint

[@usmc29er44]

Agreed....Most XJ's of that vintage are rusted out

[@machintelligence]

Not in Colorado. I have an 89 that looks about as good. I bought it 6 years ago for $3200.

[@scottkinney2608]

I live in Colorado and recently purchased a 1986 Cherokee with a 2.5 inline 4 cyl. Took some extra cash to fix some problems, but, it has its original paint job! Not rusted at all. I love it!!

[@siseley1]

@@scottkinney2608 I have a 2001, and a 1996, as well as an 06 Wrangler 4 popper. Love them all for different reasons. Even my little 2.4ltr 06 could have run circles around that POS of a tin can. And my Cherokees would have just kept on going up hill!

[@Shoot2KillU]

14:37 I like how Tommy is talking into the radio as he's walking by his dad...lol

[@off-roadingexplained8417]

I love the videos you guys make you have guts and you bring the real reviews out!

[@1lynton128]

Guys, this is a great video. You are both really entertaining and it is obvious that you know and love your car stuff. You are a great pair together. And stage 3 is a genuine test. Any criticism is just the subaru fanbois and the envious. Thanks for the show.

[@redoakranch1783]

Great review guys! I do own a 2016 Outback and a tradition full size truck with a low range 4x4 system. The truck can glide over things I cant even walk up but the Subi does have some strengths. The subi is great on ice, slush, sand and slick hard pack wet clay but it cant do much once a wheel is lifted. In the owners manual is says it is not an all terrain vehicle, it is a passenger car with some off road capability, which it is, and was proved in this video. Thanks again for the review!

[@mmiller1188]

Absolutely! I have a 4x4 truck and a 4x4 Jeep - the Subaru is worlds better than them in the snow

[@satalac]

I have a 2015 Outback and a 2015 F-150 FX4. The little offroading that I've done in the Outback, it's done well. That being said, I'd much rather have my truck's low range and locking rear diff. The Outback is awesome in the wet and snow though. Honestly, Subaru never really said they made rock crawlers. They make safe cars and crossovers that will drive over what most people would ever need to drive over. I do miss my 2004 Forester XT. I had a manual and it would split power 50/50. It was surprisingly good offroad. Terrible on gas mileage though.

[@logdon17]

True, the Suby is great for people like me who live in the city and only come in contact with snow for about 5 months a year. If I needed to ever drive off a paved road consistently, I would be buying a true 4x4 vehicle.

[@trailrunnah8886]

Yup. These types are cars are awesome in the winter. My '07 XC70 is WAY better than my old Grand Cherokee on 31" Duratracs was in the snow (and those are great snow tires) on the road. Of course when the snow got to be over a foot deep the Jeep would do better, but on slush, ice, and packed snow, the Volvo is a tank in the snow. Last winter I needed to head out before the plows had been by, the snow was slightly higher than the bottom of the Volvo, and I still made it off my street.

[@thcguruv2568]

I agree I live in Atlantic Canada where we can get some pretty decent snow storms. I own a 2012 Forester and 2015 Tacoma. I like the Subaru for snow pack and ice roads. When we get blizzards 40 CM+ I take the Tacoma though as I tend to get hung up in big drifts and snow plow ridges in the Forester. Both vehicles have their roles.

[@feliciajoy9814]

I swear your videos make me wanna move to Colorado. Tourism should sponsor your videos.

[@jimmysalat7920]

No vacancy, move along!

[@mikeholmes1313]

It's awesome out here. Life is too short to not live here!

[@feliciajoy9814]

Jimmy Salat there’s always room for freedom. #activedutymilitary #america

[@Dankcatvacs]

@@feliciajoy9814 Oregon is good too

[@windoak2113]

alelx jines wyoming?

[@jwetzel7207]

You guys should test an old AWD Subaru wagon from the 80’s. We had one growing up and it was a beast on old New Mexico mountain trails. Once pulled a big Bronco out of the deep snow.

[@scoutskills]

The original "sport utility wagon" was the AMC EAGLE, which was an all wheel drive, unibody vehicle - AMC was very early out of the gate with unibodies and what they learned directly led to the AMC "XJ" Cherokee and Wagoneer. They also made a cool SX4 2-door.

[@shkotayd9749]

Ppl HATED on you guys last time yelling you didnt turn traction control off. Not much left to say now on that. The Outback just doesnt have that extra kick.

[@rktrumble]

Shkotay D turning off traction control on a Subaru CVT doesn’t stop it from doing the same thing.

[@shkotayd9749]

Thats the point - it still behaved exactly the same anyways. I was led to believe these were more spacious and could compete offroad with a cherokee trailhawk. They may be more spacious and better on gas, but no way do they come close to the same offroad capacity.

[@STR33TZK1NG]

The problem they have is that it's not a manual. The automatics pull power in situations like this when with a manual the computer sure as shit won't control that if you have all assist off. If they were to take a lifted wrx or sti up that it'd rock socks no issue. They're using the wrong vehicle.

[@TheKrisBunch]

They turned traction control off but not stability control.

[@nattijeff]

@@rktrumble X-Mode is hurting this test. X-Mode is perfect for ice, but any slippage will cause traction control to be on steroids.Try again without X-mode in scenarios like this.

[@joshchristenson8286]

When the new Ford Ranger comes out, I would like to see it vs a Chevy Colorado on Gold Mine Hill.

[@JohnSmith-wx9wj]

They would both easily make it, so it wouldn't really be much of a comparison.

[@jedironin380]

Cliffhanger 2.0! :) I'm sure they will, if Ford will send them a Ranger.

[@prismatic9804]

Why not Miller Rock or T33A or Ironclads?

[@lordvader3283]

The Chevy would probably fall apart half way up.

[@tolmie1141]

That new Bronco is going to be awesome!!!

[@gsmecanica]

Is this really a CVT issue or is the awd system failing to power the wheels? Amazing video btw keep doing comparisons like this one. Thanks!!!

[@shatoyancy9102]

I’ve lived near there for 20 years. What the hell is “Gold Mine Hill?” Do you mean Gold Hill?

[@noname-JS]

Good pt

[@KirkKreifels]

This Jeep took that Subie...Outback :P

[@Jmanmadness23]

LEXUriouS Kirk 👀 i see what you did there

[@KirkKreifels]

@@Jmanmadness23 😎

[@hermanjohnson9180]

😎

[@11094DEREK]

Whats up Kirk just subscribed to you yesterday

[@KirkKreifels]

@@11094DEREK good to see you! I'll have a new video up tonight 😉

[@bextar6365]

Probably 99% of Subbie buyers would never rock climb, lets be honest.They work really well in snow, the very reason they sell very well in snow country.I bought one living in the snowless south, comfort, dependability, gas mileage, cargo capacity and price made my choice. Not, off-roading.

[@dergie7]

agreed.. fun to test and try but not a valid test. perhaps the 3.6 engine in this test

[@stephendevito7939]

They didn't get stuck on rocks. They got stuck on a dirt trail that looks just like Subaru Outback's marketing photos in which we're told it is "built to take you places you've never been". Not so much, Subaru, not so much. www.subaru.com/vehicles/outback/index.html

[@davidsauro1793]

Yeah, wtf, the Cherokee has a V6, why not use the 6 cyl Outback

[@williepie]

Subaru automatic transmissions SUCK!! If you want to buy Subaru buy a standard transmission. Mine blew at 100k fixing it costs more than the car itself.

[@davidsauro1793]

Yeah, I feel like they've become like Top Gear was (and probably still is), where there is a predetermined script or conclusion they are trying to follow, and the tests aren't objective at all

[@louishuelsman6698]

Thanks guys keep up the cool videos and the first 4wheel drive station wagon was the AMC Eagle!!!! Would be super awesome to get one of them and c what it could do cause mine would go everywhere and never got stuck!!!!! Mine was a 82..

[@benbenplein]

Hi there, thanks for your cool video. Do you think the Canadian model with the manual transmission could do better in those conditions than the CVT ?

[@ethereous]

I for one, as a huge Subaru fan, loved this video. It really demonstrates the advantages of a real 4x4 system that you can't get anywhere else, but also shows that Subaru's AWD is fully capable in plenty of moderate off-road situations. Something people don't understand is that Subaru doesn't make the claim that their cars are meant for heavy duty off-roading. Keeping that in mind, the test shows exactly what is promised, and maybe moreso. The downsides of an AWD system vs. a 4x4 system are then positives for 85% of folks when on pavement. But I do want a classic Cherokee now...

[@Y10Q]

In the manual , they carefully say ALL ROAD cars, not OFF ROAD. It would have no issues going up the hill with a high torque cvt, where the engine isn't restricted. On the base models they clearly kill the engine power by software to protect the transmission. You can hear it isn't revving past 1500rpm and at 1500rpm that base engine has as much torque as a pencil sharpener.

[@NHseacoast]

I bet the old Subaru Brat from 2-3 decades ago could make it.

[@JonathanRhodesLee]

Lots of people keep saying that Subaru doesn’t claim that their vehicles are true off roaders. What about this video, clearly endorsed by Subaru? kzbin.info/www/bejne/nKDJpGl-mKqCZrc

[@JulStar13]

This isn't "heavy duty off roading" especially here in Colorado. This video was a waste of time...He didn't want the Subie to make it up that little hill.

[@JonathanRhodesLee]

Amado Rodriguez : All very fair points. I didn’t know that the Forester was considered “much better” for off-roading than the Outback. My sense was that people claim them both to be equal. And I don’t know enough about the courses depicted in these videos to say whether one is more difficult than the other. But the rhetoric in the Forester video is clearly “Wow-this car can do nearly everything that those Jeeps can.”

[@STohme]

Nice video many thanks.

[@theinternets7516]

You've got a selc-trac transfer case. Those are rare as hell on an XJ. The full-time 4x4 can be used on pavement because it doesn't lock the center diff. That's a super nice jeep. It ought to be in a museum. I hope you take care of it.

[@dalefrancis1552]

If you apply slight break pressure while your differentials are slipping (peg legging) it will help transfer power to the tires slipping, this has helped me out many times with open diffs.

[@Bradhelton938]

I own a 4runner that I wheel a good bit. I also own a 6 speed Forester. We camp out of our Forester. In the sand, shallow slick mud, snow and ice, and loose gravel, my forester does amazingly well. They're traction system is top notch. In anything with steep climbs, deep mud, rocks, or big washes, I climb in that 4runner every time. The Subarus are built well, and will go a lot of places a Camry or Accord won't, but they're not built for the same purpose as the Cherokee.

[@carlobi]

How I wish you guys could import a Suzuki Jimny and take it up that trail.

[@yuvalbernshtein1089]

CVT does not belong in a Subaru

[@dillonh321]

Jatco AKA shatco.

[@username-sf8jv]

Exactly

[@DC-js4gk]

Just drove X-Trail with CVT abs garbage

[@SDMTB14]

That crap doesnt belong in any vehicle

[@nicholasmapes]

Manual or bust... literally, get a manual or your transmission will bust lol

[@drcastilloserulle]

I love to see that father and son share the same taste for cars and outdoors. Wish my kid someday like my own hobbies too. Keep up with the videos I love them.

[@dansimmons21]

I'm curious how it would have been between that Cherokee and the 2009-2013 subaru outback/forester which has the four speed automatic instead of the CVT but no X mode.

[@umadbrew]

The Subaru might do better than the '18, but it still isn't ever keeping up with an XJ. That 4.0L is a low end torque monster.

[@ishastamcnastyi4269]

Subaru is mad AF right now

[@ChadH17]

Especially since it could have made it up that easily but these guys can't drive worth shit.

[@Russ2244]

That button next to xmode is called Hill Hold Assist. It's so you don't roll back when transitioning foot from brake to gas. Only is active when on an incline.

[@chrisxaf1237]

an amc eagle would be closer to the outback than the xj

[@xaviermelendez2639]

AMC Eagles are super cool! It's the original crossover, well ahead of the times.

[@stevemunn7609]

Had one. wish I never sold it lol

[@soxfunny98]

@@stevemunn7609 Im a mopar guy since the 70s , the only car/vehicle i have ever owned that wasnt was the eagle. It was a VERY COOL CAR/ CROSSOVER.

[@ToymakersToolbox]

I specifically logged in to make this comment. My parents had one. Other than it being orange, it was awesome. I'd hoped to inherit it when I turned 16 but dad didn't hold on to it for me.

[@treverpfeifer2333]

I had a 1984 eagle wagon. And numerous jeeps. The Subaru isn't even in the same class of "crossover" maybe closer to the eagle with half shafts.

[@vanquish5023]

The Subaru is definitely a car.

[@FA-sr6lx]

What are u stupid it's a crossover aka suv

[@Dankcatvacs]

It's an unsubaru

[@thvtsjordy2716]

@@TFLclassics Savage 😂😂😂😂

[@mitchellclark2786]

@@MichaelArtelle Well the Outback is built on the Legacy platform, which is also the car. I'm not sure about the Forester though.

[@Truth_Spoken]

Yep it’s a station wagon with larger tires. It’s on the Subaru Legacy platform. We used Subaru Outbacks and Legacy’s for company cars for years.

[@abdulrahmanabdulla5250]

Hi good test can you please do the same test with an old Subaru :)

[@rockymountboy]

I do believe an older Subie, one without all the computer controlled stuff, would do as well or better than the Jeep.

[@abdulrahmanabdulla5250]

but may do better than new Subaru

[@thejoseandresshow]

*with an old Subaru with a torque converter automatic

[@quadracer392]

My father had a 83 Subaru GL wagon. It had selectable 4wd with hi and low range. Find one of those for your test and it will be apples to apples test.

[@trailrunnah8886]

quadracer392 those are sick! Too bad they didn't still offer something like that.

[@carlartinian]

Thanks guys, great video! Both are great vehicles. I have a Subaru Outback and love it. It's truly the best for most any "road" condition. If I ever want to climb a mountain, I would take a Jeep CJ.

[@marktodd4479]

Love your videos guys and THANKS a million. i almost bought a subaru outback as I am in the market. it is YOU guys that saved me from making that HUGE mistake!

[@keving7940]

I bought one. It is my favorite. If you go heavy off roading than yeah it's a mistake but it's a great car

[@Ninjadragon40]

For the testing you were planning on it probably would have been a good idea to get the H6 motor, and I wonder how it would have done if you didn't use the X mode and the other button, and just put it in manual mode with the traction control off to see if that would help make it climb?

[@ateixeira]

I was thinking the same thing....H6 vs. I6. Or compare to a 2.5l 4 cylinder Cherokee, same size engine. Let's remember the Cherokee is 300 plus pounds lighter!

[@oldredcoonhound2182]

Nice Cherokee, I have a 1992, with 220,000km that I picked up at a farm auction 18 months ago. The guy had it sitting in his quonset for 10 years.

[@nomercy4521]

I know this video is old and that you had a follow up video where you did get the Subaru up the hill, but during your attempts did you have it in the "manual" mode or the automatic mode? I was curious since the way CVT's have been explained to me is that they go to the RPM that gives it the best fuel mileage. I was wondering if you could use the "manual" mode to put the RPMs into a better spot to use the available power.

[@carsmatccarot56]

I wouldn't call the Cherokee a crossover. Nor the original crossover. The AMC Eagle comes to mind, first produced in 1979 for the 1980 model year

[@propylene22]

The style of the body might be different but the drive train of the eagle was basii identical to that of a jeep. It had an AMC derived straight six Spicer axles and a transfer case. Exactly like a jeep

[@generalcaeser9176]

I had one of those super ugly AMC Eagles. Sure was fun to drive but gave me far more trouble in breaking down then any of my several Cherokees ever gave me. I still love the 1996 Cherokee and the 2001 I have but as modified as they are, neither can stack up to my Lexus LX 470 (100 series Land Cruiser).

[@g.russell4140]

The Eagle was a bucket of rust off the production line.

[@klassenkustoms9932]

I’d honestly say the first “true” crossover was like the first gen crv

[@davepeterschmidt5818]

The Jeep has a transfer case. Not a crossover. Further, the argument for them filling the same market niche is pretty weak I'd say.

[@groovymotion5706]

I see lots of comments about 2 fails from the subie: 4 pot and CVT. Ummm...and the Eclipse Cross made it up to stage 3? 🤔

[@MarcGXE95]

How about the AMC Eagle as among the first SUV's! Also when spinning a tire off camber with an open diff, use the brakes with more gas! It might help! As for the subaru it might take longer for the computer to sort things out without without fiddeling with everything else?

[@k2cyclops162]

That's actually how x mode works. The reason the tires in the air are not spinning is the x mode system is applying the brakes on those wheels allowing power to transfer to the wheel in contact with the ground. A relatively simple and cheap solution compared to adding a limited slip diff.

[@MarcGXE95]

@@k2cyclops162 Why they did not give more time to the computer to do it's work as it should not be spinning wheels?

[@keefgtp]

Not sure if anybody answered your question yet, but "that button" in the Subaru engages a parking brake-based hill start assist. It works quite well on uneven terrain. I used it a lot in a rental Outback in Wyoming - whenever you stop on uneven terrain and remain stopped for a couple seconds, the hill start assist engages the parking brake (it seemed like a four-wheel parking brake) to keep the car stationary without having to shift into park which would obviously stress the transmission. On tough terrain I would actually leave the car running and get out with the hill start assist engaged to survey my surroundings. The car just sat there with the parking brake engaged. I didn't get a good idea of how to disengage it though - sometimes it would automatically disengage when I pressed the throttle again, but I believe on steeper hills it actually requires you to hold the service brake and disengage the parking brake manually.

[@justanotherprouddad1391]

this video saved me from buying a new Subaru. i LITERALLY had planned to get one innthe next two weeks, but not after seeing this & doing some research on cvt. thx guys!

[@Romany1111]

CVT works beautifully on inclines, snow, and beach sand. Change trans oil if doing a lot of trail or sand, and it goes and goes. The guys that made this were not driving well at all.

[@dsmbilly3690]

This was the old version of X-Mode and they were intentionally putting into a situation where it wouldn't work. Subaru now has the dual mode X-Mode that works totally fine and did when you commented. They were also demanding too much torque split to be realistic from a 180hp motor to get out of those situations, the new Outback and Forester have 310hp models to avoid this exact thing.

[@justlivelovelaughfrugally]

This has taught me so much! I love them.

[@d3adk964]

Keep making these videos TFLCar. No other reviewers have tested a Subaru like this and this is real world testing. Like you said, it's a great car but the stupid CVT ruins it. This is EXACTLY why Subaru doesnt give you cars anymore. Because they dont want this info out there. Not because you scratched the car. Obviously these cars aren't as capable as Subaru claims.

[@shadowfire246]

This guy took the words right out of my mouth. Any vehicle maker that's not willing to really put their vehicle through its paces before or after production they shouldn't be putting vehicles on the market.

[@HighjakSecondary]

Reviewers... maybe not. There however are a plethora of CVT Subaru videos right here on YT doing real world trails very similar to this right next to Jeeps and other offroad vehicles. I enjoyed this video and it points out a few things very well, but videos like this showing such a small amount of obstacles should really be taken with a grain of salt. I don't think Subaru has every claimed the Outback can overcome this specific obstacle and there are of course many obstacles that Subarus wont be able to complete for a handful of reasons.

[@d3adk964]

HighjakSecondary Very well said. I’ve always loved Subaru’s for their go anywhere do anything aspect of them. But this video just confirms my fears of the new models. My aunt has a cross trek and in the winter she can’t get up her driveway even with snow tires because the traction control system bogs right down. Similar to this video. My VW with 4Motion goes right up with no issue at all (wheels spin). But no engine bogging. I really think Subaru needs to ditch the crappy CVTs they use and hopefully this bad publicity will help make them do it. (I hope this video goes viral on forums) Or at least if Subaru would offer a manual on all models. Imagine an Ascent with a manual hahahah. It’d be a monster.

[@danmantyla3315]

CVT was number 1 reason why I ruled out Outbacks and the newest Foresters from my short list (that, and no low-range). I bought a 4runner instead and I'm very impressed with it so far. I still have my XJ Cherokee but it keeps overheating even after two new head gaskets and a completely new cooling system. 256,000 miles on it

[@HighjakSecondary]

In cases where wheel spin is needed you will definitely need to turn VDC off. That's just how the Subaru system operates. I wish it was more intuitive with the newer CVTs so anyone could just get in and turn the key, but that unfortunately doesn't appear to be the case with all of the new models. VDC is always trying to find traction and if wheel spin occurs the computer is going to take the throttle away. Subaru is definitely not going to bring back the manual. They are simply outdated and don't sell. It's far more likely that Subaru would opt to improve the current CVT to make up for shortcomings which would not only retain the current MPG Subaru is getting with these, but also appease most of the market looking for autos. Subaru does have a "high torque" CVT that they use in all of the turbo cars. I'm curious how well this peforms in similar scenarios and if Subaru can put this or a similar improved model in the NAs. Even so, I think we have to ask... how well does this CVT do in the grand scheme of off-roading with a much larger set of data points? How many people actually need a Subaru to overcome this obstacle to begin with? And is it Subaru's intent that this Outback should be able to overcome this obstacle in the first place?

[@Thorloar]

I grew up in that area, and I have driven several generations of Subaru’s up that trail and many tougher trails.

[@hl9009]

yeah these guys are mental

[@zockheem]

Did any of them have CVT transmissions

[@DC-js4gk]

Yeah CVT aint worth anything offroad. Like a woundup rubber band

[@charlieanddadreviewsandcha2243]

So none had cvt makes sense. But also all 4 wheel drive. And AWD vehicles seem to be getting watered down in favor of these companies saving a few dollars. So they save you still pay and you pay your hard earned money on inferior parts making up that vehicle. These big brands are starting to coast on old brand recognition and stature. It’s bs..

[@ChadH17]

These guys can't drive... They had trouble getting a 4runner through a couple inches of snow.

[@sublimeDom777]

@TheFastLaneCar Are those stock fog lights on the XJ? And more importantly where did those covers come from? I have an XJ and an MJ, and need covered lights for my Comanche roll bar

[@SS-du7tr]

That XJ is gorgeous. Thank you for doing this test, i was thinking about buying the 2019 forester which would have identical hardware to this outback. Seeing how the drivetrain cannot handle higher amounts of torque and resorts to powertrain slippage and eventual engine shutdown is unacceptable. Of course the system is trying to prevent catastrophic failure, but that just shows how weak the drive components are. I do wonder if the entire H6 drivetrain would be up to the task, but I'm 6'7" and only fit in the forester. Besides, you get a panoramic sunroof for LESS money??

[@raywilson96]

I hate the cvt. I have a 2011 outback with a manual and it with go just about anywhere I want to.

[@goodfellamoto5787]

I wanna see a crosstrec with a 6 speed go up that hill. Please make this happen Subaru and TFLCAR

[@masgreybeard4105]

Are the outbacks available in manual transmissions? I picked up a 2018 Crosstrek about 3 months ago and went through hell trying to find a manual, but they are out there and I succeeded after a few weeks of waiting and getting cars transferred. So far I've been very happy with it, thrown it around through the mud and raced through a few fields already and while it definitely needs more power, it has definitely exceeded my expectations. They told me I wouldn't get X-mode with the manual lol, but obviously the 6-position joystick in the middle of the console does a much better job. Great video! Glad I stuck it out for a manual.

[@mamalovesthebeach437]

I have a 2018 OB 3.6 and took a rural coastal dirt road for over 20 miles that were in far worse conditions than this ... it performed AMAZINGLY well. We could have used a couple more inches of clearance for less stress but we never high-centered. A true test would be a 3.6 not a 4 cylinder IMO. Next try the 3.6. I'm getting an average of 25 mpg and live in a rural coastal village on windy roads. I LOVE my Subaru

[@john-okc450]

Next time PLEASE PROVE you have turned off the traction control. My 2010 forester 5sp manual acted just like this until you push the button (which is says to do in the manual when off road) then it will climb up a brick wall. Very capable SOFT ROADER.

[@summit3030]

I had a 1982 Subaru gl it had hi and low 4wd, it was a beast, wish I still had it.

[@joeblust8101]

I'm wondering why they used X-Mode to begin with? I have the vdc on my 03' Outback VDC and when vdc is off it acts like it has open diffs like the Jeep. When turned on and in 1st (no cvt) I can kind of make up for the lack of articulation in the suspension. Did it yesterday in wet grass and it worked perfectly.

[@richardburguillos3118]

Great video. I’m crying. I have a 2018 Outback... grrr. Really wish we could choose to override some of these settings. Sure looked like you had wheel contact so why did it give up. I also have the 2.5. Wonder what the 3.6 would have done.

[@gDraxxus]

12:00 do you not have an owners manual??

[@2006gtobob]

How soon before that CVT blows itself apart? My wife and I have a 2016 and its CVT has already been an issue.

[@johnburkard3121]

I have is Subaru Impreza that is a 2012 with a hundred and thirty thousand miles on it

[@Dankcatvacs]

Oh do tell

[@jrmsvt03]

@@johnburkard3121 that's pre-cvt.

[@MrAndrewClaycomb]

My 2013 Outback with a CVT has 130,000 miles, and so far, the transmission has held up fine.

[@bretth5553]

Thank you The Fast Lane Car, this is the first time that I have watched one of your video's and the sign of a good KZbinr is one that when making a follow up video to a first video you will at some point in the follow up video not only mention the fact that this is a follow up video but also mention the fact & give the link to the first video ALL BEFORE DOING THE REVIEW AND OR GETTING TOO FAR INTO THE VIDEO! So as I said this is my first time watching one of the videos of this channel and I actually also have open the follow up video to this video that is paused at 4:48 as just before they actually do the review they informed the viewers, hey this is our 2nd video and if you go to the 1st video you can see what happens (of which the link to the original video "this one" is provided). There is nothing worse than watching a video of which then towards the end of that video they inform you that actually there was a video we did before this one cause then (for me anyway) I will find myself going to watch the 1st video, then coming back to again watch the follow up video for the 2nd time to get a proper view and understanding! That way of informing viewers is not only lazy, but it is also a cheap stab of increasing views! So again thank you to The Fast Lane Car channel for creating their videos in a correctly informative way, and I look forward to viewing more of your content! :)

[@jerkyturkey007]

I used to do quite a bit of bushwhaking in my old power wagon in my younger days and it was my experience that the only time the low range was an appropriate selection was if you were pulling something extremely heavy. Now in fairness my truck was a four speed manual, but any hill climbing i did successfully was done in four wheel high, the low range option just produced way too much torque and thus wheel spin. My old power wagon was an absolute beast for any task asked of it, especially snow plowing with the limited slip differentials front and back, durable and reliable.

[@quailman8760]

I feel like it would have been more fair if you used an Outback with the 3.6 H6 and not the 2.5. Also the gen of Outback before this one, with the 3.6H came with a 5 speed auto and not a CVT.

[@tomtalker2000]

I was saying that myself the 3.6r would have done it. Far more power and torque from that engine.

[@MrCrilliver]

Yup, Every "Lets see what the Outback can do" video uses the 2.5 Subi VS. a V-6/V-8 [Brand X]

[@MrCrilliver]

@@tomtalker2000 Indeed. The 3.6 has a larger (stronger CVT) @ 247 lb-ft. torque. The 2.5 has 174 ft -pd of torque

[@Dan-lf6bo]

The XJ is a straight six

[@quailman8760]

Dan what’s you point? I’m saying the comparison is not fair because of the engine displacement. Either use a 2.5 i4 XJ vs 2.5 i4 outback, or use 4.0 i6 XJ vs 3.6 h6 outback. Does that make sense?

[@SEngelsg]

15:44 - what is happening here is quite simple. The outback has a feature that limits throttle and prevents wheelspin which is on by default. There is a button that looks like it disables anti-skid , but what it really does is allow for wheelspin. I have a 2015 outback myself and believe me , this little obstacle is nothing. Put the CVT in first "gear" (yes , really), enable X-mode (or try without) and disable VDC (anti-skid) and it should get up that bit easily..... Traction control can't be off unless it works differently on newer Outbacks.

[@xaviermelendez2639]

Thanks Svein, this sounds like the answer. To be honest, a bit surprised the TFL guys weren't a bit more buttoned up with the comparison test. That said, the video was still entertaining.

[@martentrudeau6948]

Very interesting review, very nicely done.

[@autofanatic1]

Cool test. Question: The Honda Pilot and Honda Ridgeline made it all the way to the top. Any reason why they're not included under Stage 3 like the other vehicles? Also, you mean XC90 for Stage 3, not XC60, right?

[@ProjectAjax]

Wish you could test the manual Crosstek

[@oldbeeper]

Ask SUBARU to give them the car.

[@teddysliftworld]

Roman said that he hates the manual in the Crosstrek. I personally would much rather have the manual.

[@jedironin380]

Actually, the CVT has been shown (on the forums) to be the better choice for offroading. The CVT gives you a better (lower) gear, and the clutch on the manual just isn't up to tougher climbing situations.

[@usmc29er44]

Crosstrek has barely enough power in local driving.....Going uphill in altitude would most likely end in epic fail

[@1godgodgodgodgod]

@@jedironin380 absolutely not. The cvt cuts power.. the manual is 50 50 non stop. Only people who can't drive stick say that

[@mindofmadness5593]

I've run the '78 Cherokee Sport, '81 CJ, '94 Laredo and now 'an '07 Grand. Run them in the Texas rocks and scrub, Arizona Washboards, Florida Sugar Sand and now NC mud and Clay and never had one let me down.

[@tonehunter29]

What if you had used all terrain tires instead of the stock all season tires? Would that have helped?

[@Mojoman57]

Enjoyable video! Thanks.

[@TheDemocraticNationalCommittee]

That button you pushed hold the hill for you

[@justinmoody5218]

As a Subaru owner I have done some off roading that would make people cringe seeing done in a new car. The traction control is the problem. It’s not lack of power or the cvt. You have to remove the fuse for the VDC to actually turn traction control off. It’s the single most intrusive system on the planet. If you want to test this find something loose or slippery and attempt to spin with the traction control off, you’ll notice the light kicks on in order to prevent slippage. Everything we’re complaining about is what makes a Subaru fantastic in winter conditions. But to test the true capabilities of its awd you have to eliminate the VDC.

[@AlexN2022]

it's far from fantastic in snow. We live in New England. Our neighbors live on the same hill we do. They had an Outback, we had a Grand Cherokee. Come snow, we'd make it, and they'd not. Same road, same conditions, everybody's on whatever tired the cars were sold on.

[@randymartin9760]

Have you ever tested an Outback against a Forester? I'd like to see a comparison of the two and their off road capabilities.

[@jeremiahhill6047]

After watching this I'm so happy that my Subaru Impreza is manual. A few years back I drove down to Death Valley NP and went out to Rhyolite and decided to take the trail that goes out to Leadfield ghost town ultimately ending up in Titus Canyon. It performed beautifully and had no issues. I would often play in the Bodie Hills and out in the Alabama Hills and once again had no issues with my Subaru. I really think the issue is more about the transmission than anything else. My wife's car is an Outback with the CVT transmission and I don't think that I will take that thing out like I take my Impreza out.

[@v3rmonst3r1122]

Was hoping to see something actually difficult. But obviously the driver doesn’t have experience for this “stage 3” dirt road

[@Butchcub75]

The AMC Eagle would be the first true crossover (From an American manufacturer) built

[@thefifthhorseman8886]

Did you guys test this WITHOUT X-Mode, Traction Control, and the “mystery button” (hill holder) on? We have a 2015 outback, and I have found that, when trying to ascend up a hill, turning off these “helpful” traction controls definitely changed the performance of the car. I found this out after tying a make it up our fairly steep driveway in about 7 inches of snow. After spending about 15 minutes trying to make it up or driveway, with all the traction controls on, I decided to turn all of them off and it was a night and day difference. With the controls off I was able to ascend up our driveway without issue, okay maybe a little spinning, but I didn’t get the engine bog down that I typically saw with the any of the traction systems in place. The car was much more aggressive in its ability to drive all of the wheels, so now when I need to get up rough terrain, I always turn everything off. I am interested to see if other outback owners have noticed the same?

[@CarlosRivera-in3gm]

Great information for me to know before I buy my next car

[@renearrieta5204]

I believe you must try it on a manual transmission Subaru.

[@tomtalker2000]

Or with a 3.6r model. More power and torque with that one.

[@0xsergy]

And they need to do the locking center diff switch mod. No new parts required, just a switch to trick the front/rear balance system to lock the center diff. Without that Subaru's aren't much use offroad(and they can seriously damage equipment in the transmission with wheelspin which happens when you don't have the switch mod)

[@jeepinbanditrider]

I can just imagine what the transmission temps are doing.

[@michaeldose2041]

LOL, don't put your finger on it.

[@jackwhitcher4741]

Some of the jeeps came factory with a rear locking diff along with the 4 speed transfer case

[@papatorr3669]

It snowed 3" a couple of days ago and became unusually slippery. I'm the happy owner of a 2007 Toyota Highlander Hybrid 3.3L with 4wd and a CVT transmission. It got almost all the way up a long driveway/hill and slowed to a stop. I had the pedal floored, the traction control light was flashing, and engine making noises. When I got off the gas and pressed the brake peddle it started sliding back down the hill. I found that ABS and TC don't engage when you're going backwards. This vehicle is surprisingly quick when the engine, and the electric motor, and the 4wd all kick in... on dry or wet! But the Highlander literally cut power to the wheels when I needed it most under snowy icy conditions.

[@Dunkinblownutzz_1]

Jeep Cherokee XJ all the way. It’s a beast !!!

[@jnoe2056]

I think the world deserves to see you guys give it a go after pulling the abs fuse along with any other traction control fuses

[@KeyboardWarrior101st]

But they shouldn't have to do that in order to get it to do some simple off-roading.

[@mungewell]

I also believe that there is a 'snow mode' enabled by the traction control button... that would be worth a try/test.

[@jnoe2056]

@@KeyboardWarrior101st I think Subaru is clear that their traction controls are designed more for inclimate weather. Not for mountains and rock climbing. But disable it completely and I bet you have a completely different animal.

[@zamboni68]

What kind of handheld radios are you guys using? CB, FRS, UHF?

[@1984AP]

Love those old pre 1996 body style Cherokee's. Nice body style, gorgeous sounding big inline-6. Tons of low-end torque. So rare to see now. Oh the good ol' days.

[@SB-ir3iy]

Why an outback and not a Forester?

[@KC9UDX]

Why an XJ and not an Eagle?

[@neverstopz9045]

@@KC9UDX and Eagle Talon?

[@KC9UDX]

@@neverstopz9045 a Mitsubishi? Eeww

[@BAK3D]

Wrong eagle. He means AMC eagle. Check one out.

[@tomtalker2000]

How could the Forester be anymore capable then the Outback. Considering it's the same AWD system in both vehicles.

[@KaerKing]

I would say a 4runner vs. cherokee is more appropriate

[@scottk.8494]

Gen 2 or a Gen 3 would be good. I have a 2000 4Runner but always liked, and still do like the XJ. One of the last great Jeeps made IMO. Both the T4R and XJ hold their value well when they're in good condition.

[@hansdoward]

What makes a crossover is unibody. 4runner is a body on frame truck. I can say primary rear wheel drive is a 4x4 and primary front wheel drive is a all wheel drive, so yes, not a fair comparison.

[@DTMBUILT]

Scott K. Xjs don’t hold value at all

[@zeussinternational]

Toyota wins

[@jmg4208]

Why not an offroad battle with an outback & a ford focus wagon ? Target same market .. for groceries shopping !

[@xziang]

Very curious as to if their crosstrek would make it up the hill. Also just wonder how that transmission with all the new gizmos it has would do.

[@ChuddleBuggy]

It would be great if traction control also took cue from the extension of the suspension and used it as an input for selective braking, instead of just monitoring wheelspin. You can see how wheelspin based algorithms can be quite inefficient when the wheels in the air are allowed to spin some when they shouldn't be.

[@off-roadingexplained8417]

Yeah I think you might be right